00:00:42 just forgot they are not evaluated. 00:01:37 mathrick [~mathrick@85.218.148.156] has joined #lisp 00:02:24 Yes. This is an important property of sexps, you need to track what is evaluated and when and what is not. Just like you would track types. 00:02:37 And don't be tricked by the reader macros! 00:02:55 mathrick__ [~mathrick@85.218.148.156] has joined #lisp 00:03:03 :) 00:04:20 ignas [~ignas@ctv-79-132-160-221.vinita.lt] has joined #lisp 00:06:03 -!- Blkt [~user@82.84.176.4] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 00:06:09 -!- xyxu [~xyxu@218.93.33.34] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 00:06:53 -!- mathrick_ [~mathrick@2.105.206.50] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 00:08:05 karswell [~coat@93-97-29-243.zone5.bethere.co.uk] has joined #lisp 00:08:22 -!- steevy [~steevy@91-67-42-157-dynip.superkabel.de] has quit [Quit: quit?] 00:09:01 -!- mrSpec [~Spec@unaffiliated/mrspec] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 00:09:26 mhi^ [~mhi@dslb-178-000-114-217.pools.arcor-ip.net] has joined #lisp 00:12:07 -!- mhi^ [~mhi@dslb-178-000-114-217.pools.arcor-ip.net] has quit [Quit: Lost terminal] 00:13:14 -!- Guthur [~user@212.183.128.186] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 00:17:34 -!- 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rmj [~rmj@li338-185.members.linode.com] has joined #lisp 02:08:04 -!- pjb- [~t@81.202.16.46.dyn.user.ono.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 02:08:22 Shaftoe [~Moe111@modemcable037.54-22-96.mc.videotron.ca] has joined #lisp 02:08:29 hi all. 02:08:52 any recommendations on exposing a soap api over hunchentoot? 02:08:59 "don't" 02:09:04 hah. 02:09:15 I'm not asking to expose actual function calls. 02:09:16 Shaftoe: depends what kind 02:09:32 I need to integrate with a third party app that can only communicate via soap 02:09:35 you can definitely hack something rather fast 02:09:41 so I need to expose a couple of soap api entry points. 02:10:18 p_l: my initial thought was to just use my favorite template library (html-template) and just make a response template and then parse the post data 02:10:21 Shaftoe: you already have HTTP server involved somewhere in your application? 02:10:27 have you tried cl-soap or something? 02:10:32 yeah, the application is the webserver 02:10:41 I glanced at cl-soap. not sure it's what I need. 02:10:43 stassats: I think cl-soap does client only 02:10:50 yah 02:11:03 Shaftoe: it might be useful for digesting SOAP messages, though 02:11:07 and it says essentially does exactly the above where you have to manually construct the soap enveloppe 02:11:44 I don't think it was hard to deconstruct HTTP transport in SOAP. I think it was one or two extra headers 02:11:48 p_l: yeah, I believe that's the next phases of cl-soap. From their page: "Define WSDL in Lisp (and autogenerate it)." , "Implement server side SOAP (document model)." 02:12:07 so I'll just manual my way through it then. 02:12:09 not a problem 02:12:52 aight. time to delve into soap specification 02:16:35 famous last words 02:19:31 -!- pjb [~t@81.202.16.46.dyn.user.ono.com] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 02:27:48 -!- homie [~levgue@xdsl-78-35-176-85.netcologne.de] has quit [Quit: ERC Version 5.3 (IRC client for Emacs)] 02:28:44 -!- Vivitron` [~user@pool-173-48-170-228.bstnma.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 02:33:30 nialo- [~nialo@64.134.150.0] has joined #lisp 02:33:34 =) 02:33:42 tears... many many tears. 02:34:41 heh 02:35:48 I was lucky, I had this nice fat book that guided through SOAP 1.1 (and I think bits of 1.2) from its origins as XML-RPC to multi-stage authentication, data security, and complex workflows :P 02:41:28 jleija [~jleija@50.8.10.126] has joined #lisp 02:43:04 -!- yroeht 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timeout: 252 seconds] 04:48:55 -!- ThePawnBreak [~quassel@94.177.108.25] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 04:55:51 mcsontos [~mcsontos@hotspot8.rywasoft.net] has joined #lisp 05:02:34 vigil [~vigil@adsl-074-229-197-048.sip.mco.bellsouth.net] has joined #lisp 05:10:01 -!- macrobat [~geggamojj@h-17-133.a328.priv.bahnhof.se] has quit [Quit: macrobat] 05:10:36 does CL support nested structs? Or do I have to use CLOS... 05:19:36 vigil: neither does support nesting in the definition. 05:20:29 H4ns: What about a struct being a member variable of an object? 05:20:47 There's no builtin support for has-a relationships ? 05:21:00 -!- teggi [148b9232@gateway/web/freenode/ip.20.139.146.50] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 05:21:23 vigil: slots can be set to other objects (as can structure members) 05:21:48 vigil: what exactly do you mean by "builtin support for has-a relationships"? 05:21:49 vigil: you can assign any object to a slot. 05:22:44 so how do you access a member of a struct that's a member of another struct? 05:23:04 vigil: you nest the accessors 05:23:28 Unless I'm badly confused: (accessor-2 object (accessor-1 object)) 05:23:45 dtw [dtw@pdpc/supporter/active/dtw] has joined #lisp 05:23:56 Other languages might call those "getters" 05:24:05 (but they are more than simple getters) 05:24:15 (struct1-struct2-field1 struct1-instance) ? 05:25:05 pnathan: ok, hadn't seen that nested syntax yet 05:26:24 pnathan: but that's CLOS then I take it? So there's no way to do it with structs? 05:27:58 the only way I've seen to access a struct's field is (struct_type-field struct-instance), not clear if/how that would generalized to a struct that had other member structs 05:28:41 (struct2-accessor (struct1-struct2 data)) 05:28:55 defstruct creates accessors. 05:28:57 http://www.cs.cmu.edu/Groups/AI/html/cltl/clm/node169.html#SECTION002310000000000000000 05:29:44 you will find many questions answered there 05:29:52 Phoodus [~foo@ip72-223-116-248.ph.ph.cox.net] has joined #lisp 05:30:12 p_l|brage: ah, that kinda makes sense 05:30:58 -!- Kron_ [~Kron@199.91.215.42] has quit [Quit: Kron awayyy!] 05:33:37 -!- DataLinkDroid [~David@120.154.56.147] has quit [Quit: Bye] 06:01:24 -!- mathrick__ [~mathrick@85.218.148.156] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 06:01:42 mathrick__ [~mathrick@85.218.148.156] has joined #lisp 06:03:17 -!- mathrick__ [~mathrick@85.218.148.156] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 06:03:18 -!- 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07:30:43 anyone that can help with rcl? 07:31:27 sanjoyd [~sanjoyd@unaffiliated/sanjoyd] has joined #lisp 07:32:34 mvilleneuve [~mvilleneu@LLagny-156-36-4-214.w80-14.abo.wanadoo.fr] has joined #lisp 07:32:35 -!- Frozenlock [~user@cable-quebec-15.246.173-179.electronicbox.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 07:32:52 good morning 07:32:57 cyrillos [~cyrill@swsoft-msk-nat.sw.ru] has joined #lisp 07:34:25 r_takaishi [~r_takaish@www5072u.sakura.ne.jp] has joined #lisp 07:34:53 gravicappa [~gravicapp@ppp91-77-169-123.pppoe.mtu-net.ru] has joined #lisp 07:35:10 -!- pnathan [~Adium@98.145.117.147] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 07:35:22 -!- vigil [~vigil@adsl-074-229-197-048.sip.mco.bellsouth.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 07:37:55 -!- sdemarre [~serge@91.176.94.14] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 07:38:45 mishoo [~mishoo@79.112.117.181] has joined #lisp 07:40:01 -!- tritchey [~tritchey@12.236.109.2] has quit [Quit: tritchey] 07:41:40 -!- Beetny 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quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 08:45:09 -!- chromaticwt [~user@71-32-106-187.albq.qwest.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 08:51:51 ivan-kanis [~user@nantes.visionobjects.com] has joined #lisp 08:54:45 -!- gniourf_gniourf [~Gniourf@vil69-1-82-67-51-185.fbx.proxad.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 08:54:59 kilon [~user@178.59.17.196] has joined #lisp 08:57:10 good morning everyone 08:57:51 ahinki [~chatzilla@212.99.10.150] has joined #lisp 08:59:43 good morning Blkt 08:59:46 -!- kilon [~user@178.59.17.196] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 08:59:56 kilon [~thekilon@178.59.17.196] has joined #lisp 09:03:52 -!- Frozenlo` [~user@cable-quebec-15.246.173-179.electronicbox.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 09:03:56 Frozenlo` [~user@cable-quebec-15.246.173-179.electronicbox.net] has joined #lisp 09:05:24 Jeanne-Kamikaze [~Jeanne-Ka@99.Red-88-11-28.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net] has joined #lisp 09:11:10 attila_lendvai1 [~attila_le@87.247.60.142] has 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[~coat@93-97-29-243.zone5.bethere.co.uk] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 10:16:13 karswell [~coat@93-97-29-243.zone5.bethere.co.uk] has joined #lisp 10:18:13 -!- Ralith [~ralith@216.162.199.202] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 10:25:28 -!- Guest11803 [email@sgi-ultra64.broker.freenet6.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 10:25:31 *Neronus* ist getting used to clfswm 10:26:28 osa1 [~sinan@78.189.172.153] has joined #lisp 10:27:32 any alexandria devs here? 10:28:22 -!- Karmaon [~john@gateway/tor-sasl/karmaon] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 10:32:49 attila_lendvai: ping 10:32:58 -!- neoesque [~neoesque@210.59.147.232] has quit [Quit: Bye!] 10:33:07 jjkola_work: hey 10:33:50 does alexandria work with :invert read-table case? 10:33:58 -!- benny [~benny@i577A1C63.versanet.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 10:34:07 no idea 10:35:05 -!- leo2007 [~leo@119.255.41.67] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 10:35:33 I tried loading babel with quicklisp and it was failing when trying to check for the type positive-fixnum 10:36:42 I have :invert readtable case in use 10:37:09 I don't know anyone else who does that, so you're on your own fixing anything related to that 10:37:11 Ralith [~ralith@216.162.199.202] has joined #lisp 10:37:23 oh, ok 10:40:13 -!- tensorpudding [~michael@99.148.193.184] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 10:40:31 Neronus: was that is or isn't? :) 10:43:25 -!- nitro_idiot [~nitro_idi@122x221x184x68.ap122.ftth.ucom.ne.jp] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 10:44:55 -!- Joreji [~thomas@u-0-025.vpn.RWTH-Aachen.DE] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 10:45:44 -!- karswell [~coat@93-97-29-243.zone5.bethere.co.uk] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 10:45:56 theos [~theos@unaffiliated/theos] has joined #lisp 10:47:03 -!- mathrick__ [~mathrick@85.218.148.156] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 10:47:18 mathrick__ [~mathrick@85.218.148.156] has joined #lisp 10:49:16 madnificent: Mh, I'm German. It's an "is" :) 10:50:41 -!- theos [~theos@unaffiliated/theos] has left #lisp 10:51:22 leo2007 [~leo@119.255.41.67] has joined #lisp 10:53:06 -!- teggi [148b9232@gateway/web/freenode/ip.20.139.146.50] has quit [Quit: Page closed] 10:54:00 -!- kwmiebach [~kwmiebach@xdsl-87-79-52-41.netcologne.de] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 10:55:24 hang [~hang@112.152.81.14] has joined #lisp 10:56:06 -!- gko [~gko@27.243.228.9] has quit [] 10:58:41 anyone that can help with rcl? 11:03:38 vantage|work [~chatzilla@d5152EDDB.static.telenet.be] has joined #lisp 11:03:55 Neronus: that makes it \o/ i guess :) 11:06:02 daniel_ [~daniel@p50829E8A.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #lisp 11:06:40 attila_lendvai: I was able to fix it, I just needed to convert those '#:negative-~A (etc.) to '#:negative-~a so that the case was inverted as it should have 11:07:38 -!- daniel__ [~daniel@p5082A60B.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 11:07:55 if you want I can send a patch against latest git version 11:09:08 jjkola_work: ? ~A and ~a should be the same, afaik 11:10:11 yes, but the problem was that with '#:positive--~A the end result was positive-FIXNUM (ie. mixed case) 11:10:35 ignas [~ignas@office.pov.lt] has joined #lisp 11:10:53 mstevens [~mstevens@fsf/member/pdpc.active.mstevens] has joined #lisp 11:10:53 -!- mstevens [~mstevens@fsf/member/pdpc.active.mstevens] has quit [Client Quit] 11:11:15 hakzsam [~hakzsam@aqu33-5-82-245-96-206.fbx.proxad.net] has joined #lisp 11:11:31 because positive-~A is mixed case so :invert kept it as is but the fixnum parameter was inverted to FIXNUM so problems ensued 11:15:00 jjkola_work: weird. you can send a patch, which may even get applied... but why do you use mixed case? 11:16:25 schoppenhauer [~christoph@unaffiliated/schoppenhauer] has joined #lisp 11:16:41 I had to parse xml files with mixed case and I was using xmlisp so to make things work I switched to mixed case 11:18:28 where should I send the patch? 11:19:55 -!- Athas [~athas@130.225.165.40] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 11:21:37 -!- zhangkaizhao [~zhangkaiz@219.136.28.40] has quit [Quit: ] 11:22:46 asvil` [~filonenko@178.124.160.180] has joined #lisp 11:23:50 -!- asvil [~filonenko@178.124.160.180] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 11:23:52 newcup [newcup@peruna.fi] has joined #lisp 11:31:30 Davidbrcz [~david@proxysup.isae.fr] has joined #lisp 11:33:00 mstevens [~mstevens@fsf/member/pdpc.active.mstevens] has joined #lisp 11:34:24 -!- Jeanne-Kamikaze [~Jeanne-Ka@99.Red-88-11-28.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 11:35:23 kenanb [5e36ede3@gateway/web/freenode/ip.94.54.237.227] has joined #lisp 11:37:15 hi, i asked this before but channel was not so active, which web frameworks are suggested for lisp web development 11:37:17 splittist [d417faa6@gateway/web/freenode/ip.212.23.250.166] has joined #lisp 11:37:21 morning 11:37:47 -!- drl [~lat@110.139.229.172] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 11:38:02 steevy [~steevy@91-67-42-157-dynip.superkabel.de] has joined #lisp 11:38:29 kenanb: we don't suggest frameworks. there are web servers, there are libraries to help generate HTML, the rest you can mix and match as you like. 11:39:59 -!- leo2007 [~leo@119.255.41.67] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 11:41:11 -!- McMAGIC-1Copy [~McMAGIC--@gateway/tor-sasl/mcmagic--copy] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 11:41:13 -!- Davidbrcz [~david@proxysup.isae.fr] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 11:41:16 kenanb restas/hunchentoot/cl-closure-templates 11:41:56 example: http://restas.lisper.ru/en/ 11:42:37 jdz asvil` thanks 11:42:59 asvil`: i was just looking at restas, it seems cool, and well maintained 11:44:30 -!- spradnyesh [~pradyus@nat/yahoo/x-gseonncrjzijirji] has left #lisp 11:44:49 McMAGIC--Copy [~McMAGIC--@gateway/tor-sasl/mcmagic--copy] has joined #lisp 11:45:04 yes, there are several commercial projects based on this stack. 11:47:59 Jeanne-Kamikaze [~Jeanne-Ka@99.Red-88-11-28.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net] has joined #lisp 11:49:30 drl [~lat@110.139.229.172] has joined #lisp 11:53:48 dnjaramba [~dnjaramba@41.72.193.86] has joined #lisp 11:58:35 -!- ahinki [~chatzilla@212.99.10.150] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 11:58:43 ahinki_ [~chatzilla@212.99.10.150] has joined #lisp 11:58:48 -!- ahinki_ is now known as ahinki 12:01:36 -!- jtza8 [~jtza8@196-210-142-210.dynamic.isadsl.co.za] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 12:05:15 w1lm [~w1lm@188.24.107.198] has joined #lisp 12:13:10 does anybody know if I can use ssh to get git repositories from common-lisp.net? 12:14:58 I'm behind a proxy which allows http and https traffic but I managed to connect to github with the help of corksrcew 12:15:18 but I don't know how I can do the same with common-lisp.net 12:16:00 brendyn [~brendyn@123-2-73-61.static.dsl.dodo.com.au] has joined #lisp 12:16:41 ugh, browser is acting funny, I have to restart it... 12:16:53 -!- jjkola_work [c064748e@gateway/web/freenode/ip.192.100.116.142] has quit [Quit: Page closed] 12:17:34 -!- kushal [~kdas@fedora/kushal] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 12:19:12 jjkola_work [c064748e@gateway/web/freenode/ip.192.100.116.142] has joined #lisp 12:19:16 back 12:23:42 sacho [~sacho@92-247-208-87.spectrumnet.bg] has joined #lisp 12:28:20 splittist_ [d417faa6@gateway/web/freenode/ip.212.23.250.166] has joined #lisp 12:28:37 Davidbrcz [~david@proxysup.isae.fr] has joined #lisp 12:29:28 at last I was able to clone alexandria 12:30:20 -!- splittist [d417faa6@gateway/web/freenode/ip.212.23.250.166] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 12:30:20 fyi, if you need http git access to common-lisp.net then the fetch url can be found through gitweb interface 12:30:42 had to do quite much digging to find that information... 12:34:39 jtza8 [~jtza8@196-210-142-210.dynamic.isadsl.co.za] has joined #lisp 12:37:53 leo2007 [~leo@123.114.39.127] has joined #lisp 12:46:38 -!- rmathews [~roshan@59.92.56.91] has left #lisp 12:49:04 dtw [dtw@pdpc/supporter/active/dtw] has joined #lisp 12:49:24 rmathews [~roshan@59.92.56.91] has joined #lisp 12:52:29 attila_lendvai: where should I send the patch and in what format (unified or git)? 12:59:17 qadmin [~qadmin@221.149.118.35] has joined #lisp 13:00:08 -!- Beetny [~Beetny@ppp118-208-176-99.lns20.bne4.internode.on.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 13:00:44 Yuuhi [benni@p5483AE48.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #lisp 13:03:28 ThePawnBreak [~quassel@94.177.108.25] has joined #lisp 13:05:56 -!- erjag [~eugene@122.62-97-226.bkkb.no] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 13:08:41 -!- The_third_man [~The_third@ram94-12-78-234-200-168.fbx.proxad.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 13:11:33 -!- pspace [~andrew@adsl-76-241-64-126.dsl.bcvloh.sbcglobal.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 13:13:23 tried loading cxml-stp and now I have to fix also cxml to work with :invert readtable case... 13:13:52 meta-coder [~meta@unaffiliated/meta-coder] has joined #lisp 13:14:39 -!- w1lm [~w1lm@188.24.107.198] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 13:20:37 -!- gffa_ is now known as gffa 13:24:35 -!- hugoduncan is now known as hugod 13:27:21 -!- Guest4875 is now known as xristos 13:28:23 -!- Davidbrcz [~david@proxysup.isae.fr] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 13:28:44 Davidbrcz [~david@proxysup.isae.fr] has joined #lisp 13:29:13 group 13:30:49 karswell [~coat@93-97-29-243.zone5.bethere.co.uk] has joined #lisp 13:31:33 http://paste.factorcode.org/paste?id=2446 13:31:46 i got this error on (ql:quickload :cl-twitter) 13:31:48 any idea? 13:32:21 this :invert case looks like newer ending battle, now I got cxml to load but then xpath started barfing 13:32:29 jjkola_work: you could use https://github.com/mcna/cxml as starting point, but i'd recommend that you just dpn't mess mit readtable-case 13:32:33 jjkola_work: it is just painful 13:33:33 does quicklisp use that one, do you know? 13:33:44 jjkola_work: it does not 13:33:45 LiamH [~healy@pool-74-96-10-77.washdc.east.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 13:34:03 ok 13:34:23 -!- meta-coder [~meta@unaffiliated/meta-coder] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 13:34:27 jjkola_work: the mcna organization on github has several libraries fixed for unusual readtable-case, but i have now given up on this 13:34:40 jjkola_work: it is a lot of trouble with little, if any, benefit 13:36:41 meta-coder [~meta@unaffiliated/meta-coder] has joined #lisp 13:37:47 ah, the problem was non-ascii chars in library authors name 13:37:55 i simply changed that characters and i am good to go 13:38:04 -!- Blkt [~user@89-96-199-46.ip13.fastwebnet.it] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 13:38:23 gko [~gko@114-34-168-13.HINET-IP.hinet.net] has joined #lisp 13:38:29 Joreji [~thomas@u-0-021.vpn.RWTH-Aachen.DE] has joined #lisp 13:38:30 -!- karswell [~coat@93-97-29-243.zone5.bethere.co.uk] has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 13:42:09 -!- mstevens [~mstevens@fsf/member/pdpc.active.mstevens] has quit [Quit: leaving] 13:42:13 -!- Odin- [~sbkhh@214-106-22-46.fiber.hringdu.is] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 13:42:55 kennyd [~kennyd@93-139-55-46.adsl.net.t-com.hr] has joined #lisp 13:44:35 -!- kennyd_ [~kennyd@93-138-36-125.adsl.net.t-com.hr] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 13:44:43 superbeer- [~superbeer@ec2-46-51-179-218.eu-west-1.compute.amazonaws.com] has joined #lisp 13:45:10 -!- mrSpec [~Spec@unaffiliated/mrspec] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 13:45:11 twopi [~tristan@lvps176-28-16-172.dedicated.hosteurope.de] has joined #lisp 13:45:48 tobben [~trekkspil@c-94-255-146-251.cust.bredband2.com] has joined #lisp 13:47:21 -!- tobben [~trekkspil@c-94-255-146-251.cust.bredband2.com] has left #lisp 13:49:53 karswell [~coat@93-97-29-243.zone5.bethere.co.uk] has joined #lisp 13:50:04 -!- xyxu [~xyxu@222.68.162.17] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 13:50:11 -!- jtza8 [~jtza8@196-210-142-210.dynamic.isadsl.co.za] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 13:50:53 Blkt [~user@89-96-199-46.ip13.fastwebnet.it] has joined #lisp 13:51:06 jtza8 [~jtza8@196-210-142-210.dynamic.isadsl.co.za] has joined #lisp 13:52:06 -!- qadmin [~qadmin@221.149.118.35] has left #lisp 13:52:41 is anyone here uses slimv ? 13:53:04 anonus: yes ... any questions? 13:53:46 i have a problem with completion 13:54:30 when i just open a file when a (for example) type (def and press tab it bring up a menu with completions and "(def" is still on screen 13:55:07 but when i start a REPL with ,c and try to complete when i press it brings similar menu but erases the "def" 13:55:12 pspace [~andrew@adsl-76-241-64-126.dsl.bcvloh.sbcglobal.net] has joined #lisp 13:55:55 SurlyFrog [~Adium@c-24-118-228-15.hsd1.mn.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 13:56:16 hmmm, works for me 13:56:19 kennab: you can use something like this to setup encoding of sources: 13:56:19 (setf SB-IMPL::*DEFAULT-EXTERNAL-FORMAT* :utf-8) 13:56:20 what version are you using? 13:56:21 there are right completions for "def" in menu 13:56:49 freshest from vim.org 13:56:53 which lisp do you use, win, mac, or linux? 13:57:04 0.9.3 13:57:06 linux 13:57:17 is that cmucl? 13:57:40 works for me with sbcl ... but I don't think that is has much to do with the lisp below anyway 13:58:02 SBCL 1.0.54 vim 7.3.393 Linux native 3.1.5-gentoo #1 SMP Mon Dec 19 23:02:04 MSK 2011 x86_64 Intel(R) Pentium(R) Dual CPU E2200 @ 2.20GHz GenuineIntel GNU/Linux 13:58:21 hmmm, ok 13:58:25 maybe i broke something with my .vimrc ? 13:58:53 not impossible, but unlikely 13:59:07 to repeat: (def in a source file works, but not in the REPL? 13:59:20 nope 13:59:50 Ralith: Just saw. That's great. Thanks. 13:59:51 (def in source works, but AFTER i start repl it not working both in REPL and in source 14:00:23 ah, here's an idea: either use ":let g:slimv_simple_compl=1" or install the swank:fuzzy-completion 14:00:57 is fuzzy-completion shipped with slimv ? 14:01:36 -!- drwho [~drwho@c-68-81-125-196.hsd1.pa.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: Lost terminal] 14:01:38 urandom__ [~user@ip-176-199-8-17.unitymediagroup.de] has joined #lisp 14:01:40 thanks! ":let g:slimv_simple_compl=1" helped 14:01:58 but anyway, what features this option disables ? 14:03:30 centipedefarmer [~centipede@71-34-161-120.desm.qwest.net] has joined #lisp 14:03:31 -!- pspace [~andrew@adsl-76-241-64-126.dsl.bcvloh.sbcglobal.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 14:03:33 -!- cyrillos [~cyrill@swsoft-msk-nat.sw.ru] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 14:03:37 -!- jtza8 [~jtza8@196-210-142-210.dynamic.isadsl.co.za] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 14:04:18 Athas [~athas@130.225.165.40] has joined #lisp 14:04:40 jtza8 [~jtza8@196-210-142-210.dynamic.isadsl.co.za] has joined #lisp 14:04:54 nialo- [~nialo@64.134.26.168] has joined #lisp 14:05:31 xyxu [~xyxu@222.68.154.132] has joined #lisp 14:06:11 this option disables loading of fuzzy completion ... 14:06:21 should be a contrib in your swank 14:06:23 -!- easy-iPad [~easyipad@213.47.71.36] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 14:06:29 I'd try to get it working, I like it 14:07:08 The_third_man [~The_third@ram94-12-78-234-200-168.fbx.proxad.net] has joined #lisp 14:08:26 it like when you type 'vlf' and it complete it to 'very-long-function' ? 14:10:30 i think i could live without it, for first time :) 14:11:33 -!- eno [~eno@nslu2-linux/eno] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 14:11:51 yes, that's fuzzy completion ... try to get it working. 14:13:11 eno [~eno@nslu2-linux/eno] has joined #lisp 14:14:12 okay 14:16:13 -!- pnq [~nick@ACA21107.ipt.aol.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 14:16:38 -!- aoh [~aki@adsl-99-115.netplaza.fi] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 14:16:49 rme [~rme@50.43.137.115] has joined #lisp 14:17:05 bubo [~bubo@93-82-17-118.adsl.highway.telekom.at] has joined #lisp 14:18:19 aoh [~aki@adsl-99-115.netplaza.fi] has joined #lisp 14:18:34 cyrillos [~cyrill@188.134.33.130] has joined #lisp 14:18:58 how to trigger the fuzy complention 14:19:37 install swank:fuzzy-completion? 14:20:07 chenbing: load the swank part, and tell your editor to use it ... vim or emacs? 14:20:20 emacs. 14:20:25 -!- Davidbrcz [~david@proxysup.isae.fr] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 14:20:27 H4ns: you are right, at least for cxml it seems to be better to just use the default read table case as it seems to be quite hard to get it to work with :invert case 14:24:19 -!- jtza8 [~jtza8@196-210-142-210.dynamic.isadsl.co.za] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 14:25:26 jtza8 [~jtza8@196-210-142-210.dynamic.isadsl.co.za] has joined #lisp 14:27:02 -!- _nix001 [~Adium@116.228.89.171] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 14:30:22 -!- steevy [~steevy@91-67-42-157-dynip.superkabel.de] has quit [Quit: quit?] 14:32:28 -!- horieyui [horieyui@222.47.182.195] has quit [Quit: http://www.cnblogs.com/crazyhack] 14:32:32 -!- dnjaramba [~dnjaramba@41.72.193.86] has quit [] 14:32:52 chenbing: sorry, cannot really help you there ... but someone else here might 14:34:37 chenbing: iirc there is something like autocomplete-slime which works with autocomplete. 14:34:41 chenbing (setq slime-complete-symbol-function 'slime-fuzzy-complete-symbol) 14:35:08 OliverUv_ [~gandhi@h-91-26.a163.priv.bahnhof.se] has joined #lisp 14:35:21 -!- OliverUv_ [~gandhi@h-91-26.a163.priv.bahnhof.se] has quit [Client Quit] 14:35:41 fuzzy-completion rocks, but it takes getting used to it 14:40:11 -!- Joreji [~thomas@u-0-021.vpn.RWTH-Aachen.DE] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 14:40:38 Question about macros. Assuming I have a plist defined as a constant in my source code, and I write a macro that does a getf on the plist based on the parameter passed to it. The macro does all of the lookups and returns the values when the code is compiled, correct? Essentially, saving the lookup during runtime. 14:42:05 -!- chu [~mathew.ba@CPE-124-176-63-146.lns1.dea.bigpond.net.au] has quit [Quit: ERC Version 5.3 (IRC client for Emacs)] 14:42:44 -!- xyxu [~xyxu@222.68.154.132] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 14:42:46 The compiler should hit the macro, and run the code therein. If said code is a (getf +my-plist+ parameter). The compiler should go ahead and run the (getf), and the result of the macro is the value taken from the plist. 14:43:11 (BTW), this seems to be working properly, I just want to make sure I'm understanding everything. 14:43:35 yes look up will be done at compile time, assuming you actually did (defmacro macro () (getf ...)) and not (defmacro macro () `(getf ..)) 14:43:55 kennyd: thanks, that's what I did. 14:43:58 mrky [~mrky@76.73.16.26] has joined #lisp 14:45:01 hello. not sure if it's topical but if you are using paredit mode in lisp buffers do you use it in the slime repl as well? 14:46:08 msponge [~msponge@30-7-244.wireless.csail.mit.edu] has joined #lisp 14:46:10 and if you do, how do you avoid sending "(when)" to lisp proc when starting to type when block 14:50:37 -!- dcguru_ [~chatzilla@66.129.60.130] has quit [Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.87 [Firefox 3.6.13/20101209123813]] 14:51:18 dcguru [~chatzilla@66.129.60.130] has joined #lisp 14:52:05 -!- jtza8 [~jtza8@196-210-142-210.dynamic.isadsl.co.za] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 14:52:32 Odin- [~sbkhh@214-106-22-46.fiber.hringdu.is] has joined #lisp 14:53:04 mrky: good question. I've never been brave enough to turn paredit on in the repl, but I curse every time my parens get out of sync, or I need to barf or slurp (: 14:54:03 I want give it a try but don't like inconsistency between the buffer and the repl 14:54:06 why not use M-x slime-scratch ? 14:54:44 -!- mcsontos [mcsontos@nat/redhat/x-irqmxefauolwkptd] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 14:54:48 I could I guess, I'm just used to typing small code directly to the repl 14:54:50 slime-scratch is far more useful .. no going through history line-by-line, and you can save it 14:54:52 pnq [~nick@AC811CA0.ipt.aol.com] has joined #lisp 14:55:17 that said i just started using a ~/.scratch.d/ with scratch files by topic 14:55:57 .oO(~/.scratch.d/head ~/.scratch.d/foot ~/.scratch.d/bottom ...) 14:57:10 splittist_: turning paredit on in the repl isn't perfect either, but i prefer it over the alternative. it takes a while to get used to it. 14:57:10 -!- kenanb [5e36ede3@gateway/web/freenode/ip.94.54.237.227] has quit [Quit: Page closed] 14:57:57 handy tip, if you have ( or ) bound to complex commands but they get out of sync: C-q (quoted-insert) can be used to "just stick a parenthesis in here already" 14:58:00 xyxu [~xyxu@222.68.154.132] has joined #lisp 14:58:58 H4ns: just out of curiosity, did you send the changes you did (in regards of readtable case) to upstream? 14:59:41 pnathan [~Adium@98.145.117.147] has joined #lisp 15:00:33 jjkola_work: git format-patch and to alexandria-devel at the famous common-lisp dot net site 15:00:38 jjkola_work: some of them, but as i said, i have up at some point because i don't have the time to talk to so many maintainers and also keep fixing stuff that has been "broken" by people who decide not to mess their environment in the first place. 15:01:28 i _gave_ up 15:01:45 attila_lendvai: sent the patch a few moments ago 15:02:01 H4ns: ok 15:04:00 -!- meta-coder [~meta@unaffiliated/meta-coder] has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 15:04:16 thank you. I have seen this technique in slime video. sometimes it's useful 15:05:47 H4ns: would you mind if I did try to get some of the patches to upstream? 15:05:49 meta-coder [~meta@unaffiliated/meta-coder] has joined #lisp 15:06:02 jjkola_work: i don't care :) 15:06:17 McRibbit [~user@zaza11.ida.liu.se] has joined #lisp 15:06:32 -!- nialo- [~nialo@64.134.26.168] has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 15:06:53 mstevens [~mstevens@fsf/member/pdpc.active.mstevens] has joined #lisp 15:08:08 pjb [~t@81.202.16.46.dyn.user.ono.com] has joined #lisp 15:08:34 -!- pjb is now known as Guest57520 15:08:34 -!- Koven is now known as Kovensky 15:09:23 -!- Guest57520 is now known as pjb 15:09:32 -!- xyxu [~xyxu@222.68.154.132] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 15:13:33 -!- hakzsam [~hakzsam@aqu33-5-82-245-96-206.fbx.proxad.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 15:14:28 -!- bubo [~bubo@93-82-17-118.adsl.highway.telekom.at] has quit [Quit: leaving] 15:15:56 hakzsam [~hakzsam@aqu33-5-82-245-96-206.fbx.proxad.net] has joined #lisp 15:19:24 trebor_dki [~user@mail.dki.tu-darmstadt.de] has joined #lisp 15:19:25 _schulte_ [~eschulte@c-174-56-1-147.hsd1.nm.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 15:22:14 -!- meta-coder [~meta@unaffiliated/meta-coder] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 15:24:50 meta-coder [~meta@unaffiliated/meta-coder] has joined #lisp 15:26:01 RomyEatsDrupal [~stickycak@cpe-66-108-59-110.nyc.res.rr.com] has joined #lisp 15:29:17 -!- mstevens [~mstevens@fsf/member/pdpc.active.mstevens] has quit [Quit: leaving] 15:32:12 naeg [~naeg@194.208.239.170] has joined #lisp 15:32:37 sacho_ [~sacho@92-247-246-203.spectrumnet.bg] has joined #lisp 15:34:09 dnjaramba [~dnjaramba@41.72.193.86] has joined #lisp 15:35:33 -!- splittist_ is now known as splittist 15:35:59 -!- sacho [~sacho@92-247-208-87.spectrumnet.bg] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 15:36:25 -!- lacedaemon is now known as fe[nl]ix 15:40:38 -!- naeg [~naeg@194.208.239.170] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 15:41:05 ThomasH [~user@pdpc/supporter/professional/thomash] has joined #lisp 15:41:12 Greetings lispers 15:41:20 -!- SurlyFrog [~Adium@c-24-118-228-15.hsd1.mn.comcast.net] has left #lisp 15:43:02 bombshelter13b [~bombshelt@76-10-149-209.dsl.teksavvy.com] has joined #lisp 15:44:44 -!- EarlGray [~mitra@despairing-occident.volia.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 15:45:24 -!- zenlunatic [~justin@c-68-48-40-231.hsd1.md.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 15:47:02 hi ThomasH 15:48:04 -!- tempire [~tempire@pool-72-91-241-135.tampfl.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 15:49:00 Hey LiamH 15:49:00 tempire [~tempire@pool-72-91-241-135.tampfl.fios.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 15:49:43 -!- ahinki [~chatzilla@212.99.10.150] has quit [Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.88 [Firefox 10.0/20120111092507]] 15:51:03 -!- ASau`` is now known as ASau 15:51:16 -!- kilon [~thekilon@178.59.17.196] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 15:51:32 benny [~benny@i577A106C.versanet.de] has joined #lisp 15:51:43 Kron_ [~Kron@199.91.215.42] has joined #lisp 15:52:08 -!- RomyEatsDrupal [~stickycak@cpe-66-108-59-110.nyc.res.rr.com] has quit [Quit: RomyEatsDrupal] 15:52:12 -!- pnathan [~Adium@98.145.117.147] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 15:53:05 -!- trebor_dki [~user@mail.dki.tu-darmstadt.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 15:54:02 naeg [~naeg@194.208.239.170] has joined #lisp 15:54:21 Does anybody know, what will be with cliki.net? I want to publish some library. 15:54:45 asvil`: Just create the page 15:56:18 But there is cliki2, and some time cliki1 was down. 15:56:37 -!- ramkrsna [ramkrsna@unaffiliated/ramkrsna] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 15:57:01 hugoduncan [~user@70.24.182.175] has joined #lisp 15:57:43 Davidbrcz [~david@proxysup.isae.fr] has joined #lisp 15:57:59 asvil`: Ah, well, I don't know what the time-frame is for the switch, but I think your best bet is just to add the page now, assume that it will be automagickally converted when CLiki is updated, and add it again if it isn't. 15:58:34 -!- hugod [~user@bas1-montreal08-1279564107.dsl.bell.ca] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 15:59:00 asvil`: The upgrade is a volunteer effort, so there is little point in working around a time-table. Assume it won't get done until it is actually done, then worry about the new version. 15:59:38 I thought github was the new cliki. 16:00:16 Hah, yeah. Github: All your projectz belongz to us. 16:01:25 -!- hugoduncan [~user@70.24.182.175] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 16:01:31 hugod [~user@bas1-montreal08-1279585065.dsl.bell.ca] has joined #lisp 16:02:37 ThomasH: projectz *are* belongz to us! 16:03:11 I wish DEFMETHOD didn't create a default generic method. I would rather it signal an error or at least warn. 16:03:12 mrSpec [~Spec@unaffiliated/mrspec] has joined #lisp 16:03:24 -!- am0c [~am0c@124.49.51.146] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 16:03:37 ThomasH: ok, I agree with you about github, but it is really convenient. 16:03:38 make something that does? 16:04:06 madnificent: Heh, thanks for the correction. 16:04:18 asvil`: Indeed 16:04:18 LoL 16:04:39 is there something really wrong with github? am i missing something? 16:04:43 bsamograd [~user@184.71.240.90] has joined #lisp 16:05:06 -!- McRibbit [~user@zaza11.ida.liu.se] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 16:05:11 madnificent: it uses git? 16:05:24 -!- osa1 [~sinan@78.189.172.153] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 16:05:32 nothing wrong with github unless, presumably, you don't like git 16:05:44 No, I'm not criticizing github at all, I like it as well. It's just that everything seems to be migrating to it and I have an innate suspicion of something that dominates a market. 16:05:46 *madnificent* likes git 16:05:51 milanj [~milanj_@109-93-200-141.dynamic.isp.telekom.rs] has joined #lisp 16:06:06 ThomasH: you can use gitorious! 16:06:22 not really 16:06:23 i found gitorious hard to navigate 16:06:24 ThomasH: github has fast wiki engine (but simple) and fast static html hosting. I just run (atdoc:generate), git push and there is my site with library documentation. 16:06:28 ThomasH: luckily git keeps us distributed, but yeah. i catch your drift. i run a local git server for similar reasons 16:06:33 the good thing about git is that everybody has their own copy of repositories 16:07:12 But the worst thing is "Fork me" conception, on my sight. 16:07:20 asvil`: not at all 16:07:28 -!- rudi [~rudi@1x-193.157.226.15.uio.no] has quit [Quit: Textual IRC Client: http://www.textualapp.com/] 16:07:39 it makes the patch and submit process painless and trivial for everyone involved 16:08:12 every git repository checkout is a fork anyway 16:08:13 gitorious has the same feature without marketing slogan. 16:08:35 which one is a marketing slogan? 16:08:53 there's a slogan? 16:09:39 jdz,oGMo: I think, that "Fork me" is positioned like slogan. 16:09:40 carbocalm [~user@38.99.165.166] has joined #lisp 16:09:58 -!- attila_lendvai [~attila_le@unaffiliated/attila-lendvai/x-3126965] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 16:10:03 paranoia 16:10:22 where is the "fork me" text? 16:10:59 -!- pnq [~nick@AC811CA0.ipt.aol.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 16:11:31 pnq [~nick@AC81156C.ipt.aol.com] has joined #lisp 16:13:09 oGMo, no. But I just compare gitorious and github, projects with the same goals. Instead of "fork me", github could use something like "Let's do it together" 16:13:18 ... 16:13:34 "..babe" 16:13:48 "... in bed" 16:14:06 In Emacs : -) 16:14:35 Basic decisions in subtext; always fraught with danger. 16:14:39 *BAsing even 16:14:57 jdz: also, yes, the text is "Fork", there is no "fork me" 16:15:15 asvil`: i think it has that. you can assign multiple people to the same project and you can see at which point various forks have forked (and you used to be able to check whether the changes should apply without merge conflicts, but i couldn't find it last time around). 16:15:17 (aforementioned turn of conversation likely a primary reason) 16:15:56 -!- pnq [~nick@AC81156C.ipt.aol.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 16:16:04 pnq [~nick@AC81E371.ipt.aol.com] has joined #lisp 16:16:33 chromaticwt [~user@71-32-106-187.albq.qwest.net] has joined #lisp 16:16:37 asvil`: the language is "fork" because it's a well-defined, well-accepted, and concise term for the process. language befuddlement is far worse than the (actually nonexistant) slogan 16:17:09 zenlunatic [~justin@c-68-48-40-231.hsd1.md.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 16:17:46 Jasko [~tjasko@108.60.121.114] has joined #lisp 16:17:48 oGMo: Although, I have to say that I am frequently explaining to people that modern forking is not the divisive act that forking used to be. 16:18:03 incf sellout 16:18:24 due to the simpler merging schemes, the intent of a fork has changed 16:18:31 -!- gko [~gko@114-34-168-13.HINET-IP.hinet.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 16:19:01 attila_lendvai [~attila_le@87.247.60.142] has joined #lisp 16:19:01 -!- attila_lendvai [~attila_le@87.247.60.142] has quit [Changing host] 16:19:01 attila_lendvai [~attila_le@unaffiliated/attila-lendvai/x-3126965] has joined #lisp 16:19:25 sellout: true but in the context of distributed versioning systems it has a different context .. language certainly evolves, but that's different than arbitrarily different terminology 16:19:37 hugoduncan [~user@bas1-montreal08-1279585155.dsl.bell.ca] has joined #lisp 16:19:55 it may have similar problems granted but introducing a _third_ term is probably not the way to fix it 16:20:09 oGMo, ok, I am wrong when think that, fork is division of project 16:20:30 oGMo: Oh, I agree  and forking is pretty much the same activity, it's just that the tools for dealing with it have improved, and it no longer implies irreconcilable differences. 16:20:46 oGMo: it's hard to contribute without forking. 16:20:47 sellout: definitely 16:21:04 asvil`: that was for you. 16:21:22 -!- mvilleneuve [~mvilleneu@LLagny-156-36-4-214.w80-14.abo.wanadoo.fr] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 16:21:38 pkhuong: quite especially like sellout said with the improved tools for merging 16:21:42 ah 16:21:46 mvilleneuve [~mvilleneu@LLagny-156-36-4-214.w80-14.abo.wanadoo.fr] has joined #lisp 16:22:19 (and like i said, you technically can't check out a repository without forking it, so it's moot) 16:22:39 -!- hugod [~user@bas1-montreal08-1279585065.dsl.bell.ca] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 16:22:43 oGMo: you can check a project out without the history. 16:23:59 -!- schoppenhauer [~christoph@unaffiliated/schoppenhauer] has quit [Quit: leaving] 16:24:24 And what reason to use this words? I am no need to know, how git clone some project. Gitorious does not tell me about that. 16:24:44 asvil`: that's how the idiom goes. 16:25:29 -!- twopi [~tristan@lvps176-28-16-172.dedicated.hosteurope.de] has quit [Quit: leaving] 16:26:09 pkhuong: can't you still commit and merge? 16:26:35 -!- hugoduncan is now known as hugod 16:26:57 JuniorRoy [~juniorroy@212.36.228.103] has joined #lisp 16:27:03 oGMo: I wouldn't call it a fork if it doesn't have history. 16:27:46 well, that comes down to your definition then 16:28:02 -!- attila_lendvai [~attila_le@unaffiliated/attila-lendvai/x-3126965] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 16:28:14 at this point, a tarball is a fork as well 16:29:10 a fork is when development diverges; if the changes get incorporated back into the original (source) repo, it's no longer a fork 16:29:22 or whatever 16:30:45 RomyEatsDrupal [~stickycak@cpe-66-108-59-110.nyc.res.rr.com] has joined #lisp 16:30:47 I think it was Tim Daly who had interesting theories on that topic. Basically, even with intent to merge, and even when the branch is in the main repo, if it survives long enough to acquire an identity, then it already comes with most of the problem associated with old-time forks. 16:31:44 even without splitting the user base, the feeling of code ownership grows quickly, and, even with planning, merges become messy. 16:32:32 rebase! 16:32:47 or rather, rebase often! 16:33:17 -!- lnostdal__ [~lnostdal@224.Red-88-23-183.staticIP.rima-tde.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 16:33:54 lnostdal__ [~lnostdal@34.Red-88-17-98.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net] has joined #lisp 16:34:38 jdz: that doesn't help address the issue that related but mostly/partly independent features will creep in the fork, for instance. 16:34:42 pspace [~andrew@adsl-76-241-64-126.dsl.bcvloh.sbcglobal.net] has joined #lisp 16:37:16 -!- carbocalm [~user@38.99.165.166] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 16:38:25 -!- whoops [u549@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-wafbbuxsnijoxkdv] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 16:38:27 -!- SeanTAllen [u4855@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-ypvpcjuofehffhsz] has quit [Write error: Connection reset by peer] 16:38:36 whoops [u549@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-ncqxnihaambutbif] has joined #lisp 16:38:50 EarlGray [~mitra@despairing-occident.volia.net] has joined #lisp 16:39:23 -!- superbeer- [~superbeer@ec2-46-51-179-218.eu-west-1.compute.amazonaws.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 16:39:43 pkhuong: yeah, it takes some discipline to avoid that 16:42:29 -!- pspace [~andrew@adsl-76-241-64-126.dsl.bcvloh.sbcglobal.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 16:43:15 -!- vantage|work [~chatzilla@d5152EDDB.static.telenet.be] has quit [Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.88 [Firefox 9.0.1/20111220165912]] 16:44:01 pkhuong: hadn't thought of it that way 16:48:30 pspace [~andrew@76.241.64.126] has joined #lisp 16:48:38 mlkith [~redmundia@mail.madito.es] has joined #lisp 16:48:44 hello 16:51:09 -!- kpreid [~kpreid@128.153.212.76] has quit [Quit: Offline] 16:52:11 SeanTAllen [u4855@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-cypuwfxbfyekxhnf] has joined #lisp 16:52:19 having weird problem. windows executable created with CCL crashes when I load swank system 16:52:23 http://paste.lisp.org/display/127087 16:52:33 pkhuong: wait, next week I release an AI that will detect creeping features to be added as a hook to git repositories. 16:53:14 -!- pspace [~andrew@76.241.64.126] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 16:53:37 I run it like this: ccl --load make-executable.lisp 16:54:04 -!- jdz [~jdz@193.206.22.97] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 16:54:09 gigamonkey [~user@adsl-99-179-45-189.dsl.pltn13.sbcglobal.net] has joined #lisp 16:54:21 bhaskara [~user@gw.willowgarage.com] has joined #lisp 16:54:41 swank itself works fine if I don't create executable 16:54:55 -!- BlankVerse [~pankajm@202.3.77.219] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 16:57:32 -!- Davidbrcz [~david@proxysup.isae.fr] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 16:57:38 -!- lnostdal__ [~lnostdal@34.Red-88-17-98.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 16:57:56 Davidbrcz [~david@proxysup.isae.fr] has joined #lisp 16:58:30 the guys in #ccl might be a better target for your question 16:58:56 yes thanks, I asked there just now, forgot there was a channel specific to ccl 16:59:52 kpreid [~kpreid@128.153.181.166] has joined #lisp 17:00:04 -!- kpreid [~kpreid@128.153.181.166] has quit [Client Quit] 17:00:39 rudi [~rudi@cm-84.208.92.196.getinternet.no] has joined #lisp 17:01:09 -!- dtw [dtw@pdpc/supporter/active/dtw] has quit [Quit: +++ATH0] 17:02:35 ramkrsna [~ramkrsna@unaffiliated/ramkrsna] has joined #lisp 17:03:24 kilon [~kilon@athedsl-384707.home.otenet.gr] has joined #lisp 17:03:51 homie [~levgue@xdsl-78-35-145-196.netcologne.de] has joined #lisp 17:04:58 -!- kilon [~kilon@athedsl-384707.home.otenet.gr] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 17:06:07 silver_ [~kingrat@178.121.134.139] has 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[~user@89-96-199-46.ip13.fastwebnet.it] has quit [Quit: ERC Version 5.3 (IRC client for Emacs)] 17:23:54 meta-coder [~meta@unaffiliated/meta-coder] has joined #lisp 17:25:41 -!- anonchik [~anonymous@88.80.28.189] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 17:26:28 anonus [~anonymous@88.80.28.189] has joined #lisp 17:26:41 -!- anonus [~anonymous@88.80.28.189] has quit [Client Quit] 17:27:06 anonus [~anonymous@88.80.28.189] has joined #lisp 17:27:59 -!- mrSpec [~Spec@unaffiliated/mrspec] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 17:32:36 upgrading to CCL 1.7 fixed the problem if anyone cares. 17:35:40 jewel [~jewel@196-215-117-46.dynamic.isadsl.co.za] has joined #lisp 17:37:11 -!- SeanTAllen [u4855@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-cypuwfxbfyekxhnf] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 17:37:22 -!- whoops [u549@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-ncqxnihaambutbif] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 17:37:59 -!- sacho_ [~sacho@46.10.23.69] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 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joined #lisp 17:47:23 vantage|home [~vantage@109.131.145.252] has joined #lisp 17:49:25 pspace [~andrew@adsl-75-10-128-53.dsl.bcvloh.sbcglobal.net] has joined #lisp 17:49:53 -!- dnjaramba_ [~dnjaramba@41.72.193.86] has quit [Excess Flood] 17:50:18 -!- sacho_ [~sacho@46.10.23.69] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 17:50:33 dnjaramba [~dnjaramba@41.72.193.86] has joined #lisp 17:51:31 Guthur` [~user@212.183.128.35] has joined #lisp 17:52:39 -!- Guthur [~user@212.183.128.35] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 17:53:33 sdemarre [~serge@91.176.94.14] has joined #lisp 17:53:58 jdz [~jdz@host206-110-dynamic.14-87-r.retail.telecomitalia.it] has joined #lisp 17:54:38 cool 17:55:17 robde [~robde@pC19F7A19.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #lisp 17:55:20 -!- ivan-kanis [~user@nantes.visionobjects.com] has quit [Quit: ERC Version 5.3 (IRC client for Emacs)] 17:55:34 -!- ehu [~ehuels@109.33.125.246] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 17:55:59 -!- c_arenz [arenz@nat/ibm/x-ronmmwmomnrlvzie] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 17:56:43 toekutr [~user@50-0-51-2.dsl.static.sonic.net] has joined #lisp 17:57:42 -!- Davidbrcz [~david@proxysup.isae.fr] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 17:58:03 SeanTAllen [u4855@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-evbsnlstzvgynqmz] has joined #lisp 17:58:05 Davidbrcz [~david@proxysup.isae.fr] has joined #lisp 18:00:07 -!- theBlackDragon [~dragon@77.109.98.120] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 18:02:06 theBlackDragon [~dragon@213.219.155.10.adsl.dyn.edpnet.net] has joined #lisp 18:04:48 i cant recall what is that standard function's name that prompts user with a question and then reads a single line? 18:05:04 -!- pspace [~andrew@adsl-75-10-128-53.dsl.bcvloh.sbcglobal.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 18:05:44 yes-or-no-p ? 18:05:48 yes-or-no-p 18:05:52 yes thanks 18:05:53 kilon_alios [~kilon@athedsl-402997.home.otenet.gr] has joined #lisp 18:05:57 yes 18:08:02 mrSpec [~Spec@unaffiliated/mrspec] has joined #lisp 18:08:41 -!- kilon [~kilon@ppp-94-64-191-175.home.otenet.gr] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 18:09:17 -!- hakzsam [~hakzsam@aqu33-5-82-245-96-206.fbx.proxad.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 18:10:01 gigamonkey: t! 18:13:27 antifuchs: you still at Franz? 18:13:46 gigamonkey: Nope  you should be his replacement! 18:14:26 sellout: maybe I should hear *why* he's no longer at Franz before I sign up for that. ;-) 18:14:26 gigamonkey: not as an employee, no. I saw the tweet about your job situation! 18:14:31 ahahaha 18:14:42 I got an offer from stripe that was too good to refuse (-: 18:14:51 antifuchs: actually I was mostly wondering if you were still there just because some of your tweets seemed to indicate you were elsewhere. 18:15:12 yeah, I am (: 18:15:48 Happy crowning-of-augustus-day! 18:16:00 Are they in the Bay Area too? 18:16:09 yeah, just moved to SF! 18:16:45 And commuting down to Palo Alto? (Or are they in SF despite their contact page?) 18:17:04 ah, we were in palo alto until friday, the office moved to sf now (-: 18:17:07 2nd and minna (: 18:17:14 gigamonkey: 2.5 days a week? 18:17:26 antifuchs: you hiring? ;-) 18:17:27 would be sweet if jobs could be like that 18:17:42 ...and still pay 18:17:46 Guthur`: yeah, well, my wife and I split days watching our kids. 18:18:00 She's got a gig like that. Now I need to find one. 18:18:05 gigamonkey: we are (: 18:18:30 -!- bombshelter13b [~bombshelt@76-10-149-209.dsl.teksavvy.com] has quit [Quit: If only your veins were filled with oil, the world would rush to your rescue!] 18:18:41 -!- pjb` [~t@81.202.16.46.dyn.user.ono.com] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 18:18:41 -!- pjb [~t@81.202.16.46.dyn.user.ono.com] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 18:18:43 ears are perking up! 18:18:47 (all around the office) (: 18:18:59 pjb [~t@81.202.16.46.dyn.user.ono.com] has joined #lisp 18:19:26 -!- pjb is now known as Guest43323 18:19:54 That'd be a lot of lisp talent at a non-lisp company ;) 18:20:06 A Lisp 5th column. 18:20:32 gigamonkey: Have you considered in-home child-care? That way you can work but are still pretty much in the loop. I've done that for the past few years. 18:21:13 Speaking of the Real World... 18:21:13 ThomasH: not really. Mostly because our lives were set up so we could do it ourselves. 18:21:55 *eMBee* agrees. if life work gets to busy, in-home childcare would be nice 18:22:26 And now we've only got a few more years to go before the youngest starts school ... 18:22:28 s/life// 18:22:41 -!- Davidbrcz [~david@proxysup.isae.fr] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 18:22:55 gigamonkey: Yeah, that's ideal. 18:23:17 ThomasH: how much do you pay for the childcare? 18:23:42 eMBee: just a minute, phone. 18:24:30 ThomasH: part of it for us was until last year we thought we were going to homeschool. So we were basically doing that. 18:24:33 -!- LiamH [~healy@pool-74-96-10-77.washdc.east.verizon.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 18:25:34 -!- RomyEatsDrupal [~stickycak@cpe-66-108-59-110.nyc.res.rr.com] has quit [Quit: RomyEatsDrupal] 18:26:07 -!- sdemarre [~serge@91.176.94.14] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 18:27:47 Buglouse [~Buglouse@cpe-65-28-172-255.wi.res.rr.com] has joined #lisp 18:28:07 -!- jtza8 [~jtza8@196-210-142-210.dynamic.isadsl.co.za] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 18:28:16 osa1 [~sinan@31.140.30.140] has joined #lisp 18:28:39 gigamonkey: you changed your mind on homeschooling? 18:28:50 whoops [u549@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-ckrvzcygdrjcjomp] has joined #lisp 18:29:04 eMBee: well, basically we figured out that our older kid really wanted to be in school. 18:29:23 In theory we could still homeschool her or her younger sister later. 18:29:28 ah, yes, i can understand that :-) 18:30:10 We were planning to unschool and the first principle of unschooling is to follow the child's lead. So arguably, we're still doing that. 18:30:13 eMBee: Okay, payscale is complicated because I have 3 kids plus 1 cousin and they're in and out all day. It's $10/hr base plus additional per kid per hour. Hey, I code in lisp, you didn't expect it to be simple, right? 18:30:22 lol 18:30:24 -!- tidux [~jon@c-24-61-183-110.hsd1.nh.comcast.net] has left #lisp 18:31:31 nachtwandler [~nachtwand@p57AD7EFD.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #lisp 18:32:44 -!- Guest43323 is now known as pjb 18:32:55 *eMBee* nods at gigamonkey 18:33:07 ThomasH: heh 18:33:11 gigamonkey: I had some exposure to "unschooling" in high school, took independent study math 9-12. The biggest downside is that you don't have the necessary study skills for college. 18:33:54 nobody does. 18:34:21 *eMBee* agrees 18:34:36 college is so 20th century. It's all badges and achievements now. Oh, and unemployment (: 18:34:48 -!- SeanTAllen [u4855@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-evbsnlstzvgynqmz] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 18:34:57 -!- whoops [u549@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-ckrvzcygdrjcjomp] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 18:35:48 gigamonkey: Upside, I developed into a decent autodidact and problem-solver. 18:37:04 leoncamel [~user@KD175129170046.ppp-bb.dion.ne.jp] has joined #lisp 18:37:22 *eMBee* didn't do unschooling, but flunked math in highschool and avoided it at the university, with the same results as ThomasH 18:37:33 -!- splittist [d417faa6@gateway/web/freenode/ip.212.23.250.166] has quit [Quit: Leaves in shame] 18:37:59 I did something else 18:41:28 :-) 18:41:46 jjkola_mobile [429a77b9@gateway/web/freenode/ip.66.154.119.185] has joined #lisp 18:42:22 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Transition_School_and_Early_Entrance_Program 18:42:56 ThomasH: can you give an estimate for your monthly budget compared to alternatives? is it expensive or affordable? 18:43:01 -!- hang [~hang@112.152.81.14] has left #lisp 18:44:03 robde_ [~robde@p57902E4D.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #lisp 18:45:37 -!- robde [~robde@pC19F7A19.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 18:45:46 eMBee: Last OT post for me: expensive, but it was worth it to me so that I could balance maintaining my professional skills with being around for the kids. 18:46:23 -!- jjkola_mobile [429a77b9@gateway/web/freenode/ip.66.154.119.185] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 18:47:34 *eMBee* is wondering because here in asia hiring someone is common (in middle and upper class) but in europe it is rare... 18:47:53 add^_ [~add^_^@m212-152-0-180.cust.tele2.se] has joined #lisp 18:48:11 -!- kilon_alios is now known as kilon 18:50:55 whoops [u549@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-zsvsssasdxnclcpm] has joined #lisp 18:50:55 *eMBee* nods at ThomasH, thanks 18:53:33 -!- add^_ [~add^_^@m212-152-0-180.cust.tele2.se] has quit [Quit: add^_] 18:54:17 SeanTAllen [u4855@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-wxomxqmgidfjscjw] has joined #lisp 18:55:43 -!- dnjaramba [~dnjaramba@41.72.193.86] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 18:56:07 dnjaramba [~dnjaramba@41.72.193.86] has joined #lisp 18:57:45 davlap [~davlap@107-0-204-137-ip-static.hfc.comcastbusiness.net] has joined #lisp 18:58:30 robde [~robde@p5790382C.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #lisp 19:00:07 -!- robde_ [~robde@p57902E4D.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 19:01:56 pnq [~nick@172.162.145.172] has joined #lisp 19:03:26 RomyEatsDrupal [~stickycak@64.134.64.42] has joined #lisp 19:03:28 icrazyhack [~horieyui@183.60.100.166] has joined #lisp 19:04:16 Hexstream [~hexstream@modemcable075.97-200-24.mc.videotron.ca] has joined #lisp 19:04:31 SurlyFrog [~Adium@c-24-118-228-15.hsd1.mn.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 19:04:32 -!- mtd [~martin@chop.xades.com] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 19:04:47 -!- cmbntr [~cmbntr@slice.loopback.ch] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 19:05:38 -!- ignas [~ignas@office.pov.lt] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 19:05:57 HG` [~HG@dsbg-4d0a39a6.pool.mediaWays.net] has joined #lisp 19:06:54 Anyone knows of an implementation-defined or user-define declaration identifier that defines more than one "extra" argument? By "extra" I mean that of all the standard declaration identifiers, only the TYPE and FTYPE declaration identifiers define one "extra" argument (the type), all other standard ones have zero. 19:07:00 user-defined* 19:07:24 cmbntr [~cmbntr@slice.loopback.ch] has joined #lisp 19:08:13 mtd [~martin@chop.xades.com] has joined #lisp 19:08:56 If you are defining a macro, and you want to be able to pass a list of REST parameters. Is there a way to cycle through the list in the macro? I was trying a ,(dolist (var body) ) but that didn't seem to be working.. 19:09:05 -!- dnjaramba [~dnjaramba@41.72.193.86] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 19:09:29 -!- rudi [~rudi@cm-84.208.92.196.getinternet.no] has quit [Quit: Computer has gone to sleep.] 19:09:39 dnjaramba_ [~dnjaramba@41.72.193.86] has joined #lisp 19:09:45 I'm making a declarations processing library (take 2) and for simplicity I'm thinking of only supporting one "extra" argument directly in part of the API to simplify code, and there's a way to access all extra arguments via a special variable but I'm thinking of mostly encouraging people to just expect one "extra" argument, unless it's more prevalent than I thought... 19:09:49 Is there a good list of implementation-defined declaration identifiers somewhere? 19:10:01 SurlyFrog: it is possible, but you'll still have to return something from your processing (which dolist often does not do) 19:10:11 SurlyFrog: you'll normally use mapcar instead of dolist. 19:10:29 H4ns: thanks :-) I'll do that 19:10:49 -!- Axioplase_ [~Axioplase@fortigate.kb.ecei.tohoku.ac.jp] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 19:13:40 -!- dnjaramba_ [~dnjaramba@41.72.193.86] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 19:13:46 Axioplase_ [~Axioplase@fortigate.kb.ecei.tohoku.ac.jp] has joined #lisp 19:14:32 H4ns: that worked out perfectly. Thank you very much! 19:15:36 robde_ [~robde@p57903D4C.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #lisp 19:16:11 tritchey [~tritchey@108.60.121.114] has joined #lisp 19:16:15 dnjaramba [~dnjaramba@41.72.193.86] has joined #lisp 19:16:24 -!- robde [~robde@p5790382C.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 19:16:38 Davidbrcz [~david@proxysup.isae.fr] has joined #lisp 19:18:45 SurlyFrog do get it why it worked? mapcar returns a list, and list returned by a macro was fed to the compiler 19:19:23 -!- dnjaramba [~dnjaramba@41.72.193.86] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 19:20:28 Hexstream: (declaim (declaration my-very-own-declaration)) 19:21:00 pjb: Doesn't seem to answer my question. Ah, btw I treat that as a "binding". 19:21:35 The my-very-own-declaration part, specifically. 19:21:41 ehu [~ehuels@ip118-64-212-87.adsl2.static.versatel.nl] has joined #lisp 19:22:29 Hexstream: my point is that beside "implementation defined" declarations, you may have user defined declarations. 19:22:46 Oh yeah, and is there usually a way to get a list of all such declared declarations in implementations? It seems this information is necessary to reliably distinguish between (foo bar baz) being a FOO declaration or a (type foo bar baz) declaration. 19:22:46 Hexstream: like anything else in lisp, their semantics only depends on the processors you feed them to. 19:23:15 Hexstream: you have a list of types. 19:23:23 -!- RomyEatsDrupal [~stickycak@64.134.64.42] has quit [Quit: RomyEatsDrupal] 19:23:28 pjb: How?... 19:23:48 declaration identifier n. one of the symbols declaration, dynamic-extent, ftype, function, ignore, inline, notinline, optimize, special, or type; or a symbol which is the name of a type; or a symbol which has been declared to be a declaration identifier by using a declaration declaration. 19:23:48 19:24:07 (Please no "iterate over all symbols and check (subtypep my-symbol my-symbol)" bullshit...) 19:24:08 More exactly, you can get from clhs the list of symbols which are the name of a type. 19:24:20 You must also collect the deftype forms... 19:24:20 pjb: What about user-defined types?... 19:24:27 Well, exactly. 19:24:41 Hexstream: this wouldn't work, in some implementation, every symbol is the name of a type, even if not defined. 19:25:06 Yeah, that's annoying. 19:25:10 dnjaramba [~dnjaramba@41.72.193.86] has joined #lisp 19:25:12 IMO, (declare (type var)) is wacky. 19:25:24 pjb: I agree very very much so. 19:25:27 IMO, (declare ( )) is wacky. I mean. 19:25:37 What do you want to do with declarations? 19:25:54 Usually, declaration processors just ignore the declarations they don't know. 19:25:56 Solve the problem of easily processing them once and for all. 19:26:49 My first take at it was way too ambitious and solved complicated non-problems. Now I'm going for something much simpler and more practical. 19:27:08 Again, each processor has its own rules for processing declarations... You cannot hope to be processing them once and for all. 19:27:31 I think I can do a pretty nice 80% job. 19:29:00 The best you can do is to read the manuals of each implementation to collect the implementation specific declarations. 19:30:40 robde [~robde@p57903415.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #lisp 19:31:29 That would be good, but something even better is if each implementation just provided a MAP-DECLARED-DECLARATIONS function or equivalent, and then we could have a trivial-declared-declarations that could reliably tell what's a declaration and what's a type (assuming something treated as a declaration identifier that's not a declared one denotes a type). 19:31:49 -!- robde_ [~robde@p57903D4C.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 19:32:07 Of if we had a precise way to know if a symbol has been declared as a type. 19:32:27 The only thing you can do is to shadow deftype and define a similar macro doing the bookkeeping. 19:32:40 Perhaps also for declaim declaration. 19:32:45 -!- ddp [~ddp@216.243.111.165] has quit [Quit: ddp] 19:32:48 Right, or both. But I think it would be possibly simpler for implementations overall to expose all declared declarations than all declared types. :) 19:33:09 I don't like those kinds of solutions. 19:33:20 I'm not sure implementations have to declare their own declarations. 19:33:27 It seems like a lot of overhead in the long run, at least. 19:33:28 ddp [~ddp@216.243.111.165] has joined #lisp 19:33:59 They could fill a declaration table without going thru cl:declaim or cl:proclaim. 19:34:42 It's trivial to add a separate mechanism to maintain a list of declared declarations... 19:34:51 Same for types. 19:35:20 Now, do you want to use shadow/defmacro once for all, or do you want to maintain a patch for a dozen of implementations? 19:35:30 JuanDaugherty [~Ren@cpe-72-228-177-92.buffalo.res.rr.com] has joined #lisp 19:35:31 Qworkescence [~quad@unaffiliated/quadrescence] has joined #lisp 19:35:40 Write a CDR first ;-) 19:35:42 But there are way, way more types than declared declaration identifiers, typically. (ignoring that a type is a declaration identifier). 19:36:21 In any case, the compiler has to keep track of the types. Basically the mechanisms for both are already here. What we lack is an API to access them. 19:36:29 Hence the CDR. 19:36:30 The problem with shadowing is that it's typically not composable. 19:36:35 Ye.s 19:36:51 I have a problem with sbcl,ql,and hunchentoot. It works fine on one system but on another it continually snags on bordeaux-threads. Anyone run into this? 19:37:11 JuanDaugherty: perhaps you have there a sbcl without thread support? 19:37:23 -!- dnjaramba [~dnjaramba@41.72.193.86] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 19:37:42 dnjaramba [~dnjaramba@41.72.193.86] has joined #lisp 19:37:47 -!- SurlyFrog [~Adium@c-24-118-228-15.hsd1.mn.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 19:38:52 -!- ddp [~ddp@216.243.111.165] has quit [Quit: ddp] 19:39:11 pjb, thx, possibly. I made sure it was same version of sbcl, and dropped and rebuilt ql's dirs, but I didn't do the same for sbcl. 19:39:20 I think it would be much more useful to have an implementation first (even if partial only), rather than a CDR first. (Added to my backlog. At that pace I'll finish the year with an even bigger backlog, again). 19:39:36 ddp [~ddp@216.243.111.165] has joined #lisp 19:39:47 -!- syrinx_ [~syrinx_@unaffiliated/syrinx-/x-4255893] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 19:40:06 Hexstream: well, as I said, the mechanisms must already be there in all implementations. So writing the patch for all of them along with the CDR shouldn't be too big a job. 19:40:13 patches. 19:40:20 saint_cypher [~rjspotter@208.178.63.106] has joined #lisp 19:41:54 syrinx_ [~syrinx_@unaffiliated/syrinx-/x-4255893] has joined #lisp 19:42:32 -!- naeg [~naeg@194.208.239.170] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 19:43:21 Depends for whom. ;P I don't really have time to spend a few months getting acquainted with the internals of all implementations. I think I'll start doing some asking around on mailing lists when appropriate. As I start doing some more ambitious things it seems I'm bound to run into "open issues" that I can't pragmatically tackle alone. (there go my lone-wolf plans.) 19:43:31 bjonnh [~bjonnh@147.210.71.83] has joined #lisp 19:43:41 -!- ddp [~ddp@216.243.111.165] has quit [Client Quit] 19:44:12 holycow [~holycow@host-64-151-208-2.bchsia.in2net.net] has joined #lisp 19:45:28 RomyEatsDrupal [~stickycak@64.134.64.42] has joined #lisp 19:46:07 still having problems with running swank server in stand alone executable. it seems that swank:create-server doesn't like to be called from saved image. if I do it normally it works. http://paste.lisp.org/display/127092 19:46:53 -!- tritchey [~tritchey@108.60.121.114] has quit [Quit: tritchey] 19:47:18 IIRC, there's a page in the slime manual explaining how to launch swank directly. 19:47:21 -!- davlap [~davlap@107-0-204-137-ip-static.hfc.comcastbusiness.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 19:47:26 Otherwise, be assured it's possible. 19:47:55 Kcaaq [~Kcaaq@82-171-145-108.ip.telfort.nl] has joined #lisp 19:48:33 -!- Kcaaq [~Kcaaq@82-171-145-108.ip.telfort.nl] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 19:49:24 Ah, and another problem with shadowing: To make that work reliably in this situation, I'd have to go around and try to twist everyone's arm so they'd use my definition, so that the declaration declarations are properly captured... That sounds like an infinite, unrealistic amount of pain and frustration for everyone involved. As a Ruby fanatic would say: "It won't scale!" 19:49:32 -!- HG` [~HG@dsbg-4d0a39a6.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit [Quit: HG`] 19:50:04 It's hard to do yes. But it's possible. But you're right, in the limit, you have to re-implement the whole CL. 19:50:05 phax [~phax@cpc14-haye17-2-0-cust110.haye.cable.virginmedia.com] has joined #lisp 19:50:05 -!- phax [~phax@cpc14-haye17-2-0-cust110.haye.cable.virginmedia.com] has quit [Changing host] 19:50:05 phax [~phax@unaffiliated/phax] has joined #lisp 19:50:55 Hexstream: have a look at ibcl to see how you can shadow defpackage to force the use of your package with shadowed definitions instead of CL. 19:50:56 It's ridiculous to go with "possible" solutions when there are much better ones available... Anyway. 19:51:24 Hexstream: the reasonable alternative is to patch each implementation. or have them patched: write the CDR. 19:51:33 fiveop [~fiveop@dslb-178-002-115-194.pools.arcor-ip.net] has joined #lisp 19:52:34 ddp [~ddp@216.243.111.165] has joined #lisp 19:52:43 -!- phax [~phax@unaffiliated/phax] has quit [Client Quit] 19:53:39 I'm thinking of making a "progressive enhancement" API that lets you ask if something is a declared declaration (or a type), and as a baseline it returns T and T for known CL declarations and types and returns NIL and NIL for unknown ones, and with implementation support you can reliably get T and T or NIL and NIL. (similar to SUBTYPEP) 19:54:25 I'm not sure the double value complication is worth it. 19:54:39 dstatyvka [ejabberd@pepelaz.jabber.od.ua] has joined #lisp 19:54:43 This way, users could start using the library in the hope that support will get better over time, and implementors would be more interesting in supporting a library that already has users... 19:54:45 tensorpudding [~michael@99.148.193.184] has joined #lisp 19:54:51 Either the implementation has seen a deftype or a proclaim declaration or it has not. 19:55:48 RazWelles [~RazWelles@c-76-108-49-181.hsd1.fl.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 19:55:49 -!- JuanDaugherty [~Ren@cpe-72-228-177-92.buffalo.res.rr.com] has quit [Quit: Exeunt IRC] 19:55:55 But reliably ascertaining whether it did or did not necessarily requires implementation support + a patch to the library to enable it. 19:55:58 naeg [~naeg@194.208.239.170] has joined #lisp 19:56:07 SurlyFrog [~Adium@c-24-118-228-15.hsd1.mn.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 19:56:09 Is there really any important difference in choosing SBCL or Clojure for AI research for a beginner? 19:56:11 As I said, implementations already track the info. 19:56:15 I think the 2 values route would be a good compromise. 19:56:17 You only need an API exporting it. 19:56:23 I'm trying to decide which book to start reading, Joy of Clojure or Practical Common Lisp 19:56:31 -!- robde [~robde@p57903415.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 19:56:37 RazWelles: CL has a lot of libraries. Clojure has Java. 19:56:50 -!- cyrillos [~cyrill@188.134.33.130] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 19:56:50 pjb, RazWelles: ABCL has both 19:57:00 (java and cl libraries) 19:57:02 -!- tensorpudding [~michael@99.148.193.184] has quit [*.net *.split] 19:57:02 -!- RomyEatsDrupal [~stickycak@64.134.64.42] has quit [*.net *.split] 19:57:02 -!- JuniorRoy [~juniorroy@212.36.228.103] has quit [*.net *.split] 19:57:02 -!- asvil` [~filonenko@178.124.160.180] has quit [*.net *.split] 19:57:02 -!- Kovensky [kovensky@abraxo.bluebottle.net.au] has quit [*.net *.split] 19:57:02 -!- dan64 [~dan64@c-71-206-193-42.hsd1.pa.comcast.net] has quit [*.net *.split] 19:57:02 -!- setmeaway [~setmeaway@118.45.149.247] has quit [*.net *.split] 19:57:02 -!- howeyc [~howeyc@2607:f2f8:a958::2] has quit [*.net *.split] 19:57:03 -!- arbscht [~arbscht@fsf/member/arbscht] has quit [*.net *.split] 19:57:03 -!- zbigniew [~zb@3e8.org] has quit [*.net *.split] 19:57:03 -!- johs [~johs@hawk.netfonds.no] has quit [*.net *.split] 19:57:03 -!- pok [~pok@tarrant.klingenberg.no] has quit [*.net *.split] 19:57:03 -!- jsnell [~jsnell@ash.snellman.net] has quit [*.net *.split] 19:57:03 -!- vhost- [~vhost@unaffiliated/vhost-] has quit [*.net *.split] 19:57:03 -!- gkeith_lt [georgekeit@nat/google/x-dpleomtxbcbzbzof] has quit [*.net *.split] 19:57:03 -!- Praise [~Fat@unaffiliated/praise] has quit [*.net *.split] 19:57:03 -!- kloeri [~kloeri@freenode/staff/exherbo.kloeri] has quit [*.net *.split] 19:57:03 -!- ecraven [~nex@www.nexoid.at] has quit [*.net *.split] 19:57:03 -!- eli [~eli@winooski.ccs.neu.edu] has quit [*.net *.split] 19:57:04 Yep. 19:57:07 jsnell [~jsnell@ash.snellman.net] has joined #lisp 19:57:07 Kovensky [kovensky@abraxo.bluebottle.net.au] has joined #lisp 19:57:10 pjb: That's exactly what I'm saying, too. the point is making an API that provides a baseline on every implementation, and can easily be upgraded to full support. 19:57:11 pok [~pok@tarrant.klingenberg.no] has joined #lisp 19:57:12 johs [~johs@hawk.netfonds.no] has joined #lisp 19:57:15 asvil` [~filonenko@178.124.160.180] has joined #lisp 19:57:15 gkeith_lt [georgekeit@nat/google/x-pzzjcxvbzudynowj] has joined #lisp 19:57:18 zbigniew [~zb@3e8.org] has joined #lisp 19:57:19 -!- SurlyFrog [~Adium@c-24-118-228-15.hsd1.mn.comcast.net] has left #lisp 19:57:22 kloeri [~kloeri@freenode/staff/exherbo.kloeri] has joined #lisp 19:57:22 pjb, ABCL? 19:57:24 JuniorRoy [~juniorroy@212.36.228.103] has joined #lisp 19:57:25 tensorpudding [~michael@99.148.193.184] has joined #lisp 19:57:26 dan64 [~dan64@c-71-206-193-42.hsd1.pa.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 19:57:27 arbscht [~arbscht@60-234-133-173.bitstream.orcon.net.nz] has joined #lisp 19:57:31 setmeaway [stemearay@118.45.149.247] has joined #lisp 19:57:33 -!- arbscht [~arbscht@60-234-133-173.bitstream.orcon.net.nz] has quit [Changing host] 19:57:33 arbscht [~arbscht@fsf/member/arbscht] has joined #lisp 19:57:36 RazWelles: http://abcl.org/ 19:57:38 RazWelles: Yes. Common Lisp has several implementations. 19:57:48 RazWelles: Clojure only has Rich Hickey... 19:57:53 vhost- [~vhost@unaffiliated/vhost-] has joined #lisp 19:57:59 Or the little Mickey, as I call him ;-) 19:58:05 He's an implementation of clojure? 19:58:08 Little Mickey? 19:58:13 :-) 19:58:15 Praise [~Fat@unaffiliated/praise] has joined #lisp 19:58:30 Hexstream: he's the defining implementation of clojure :-) 19:58:54 Ah, I always thought he's defining the implementation of clojure. 19:58:59 robde [~robde@pC19F7B4D.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #lisp 19:59:00 gniourf_gniourf [~Gniourf@2a01:e35:2433:3b90:222:41ff:fe23:8d8e] has joined #lisp 19:59:00 -!- AntiSpamMeta [~MetaBot@AntiSpamMeta/.] has quit [Excess Flood] 19:59:47 sdemarre [~serge@91.176.94.14] has joined #lisp 19:59:50 -!- SpitfireWP [~spitfire@wikipedia/spitfire] has quit [Quit: It's getting dark, too dark to see] 20:00:10 steevy [~steevy@91-67-42-157-dynip.superkabel.de] has joined #lisp 20:00:53 AntiSpamMeta [~MetaBot@AntiSpamMeta/.] has joined #lisp 20:01:08 -!- jjkola_work [c064748e@gateway/web/freenode/ip.192.100.116.142] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 20:02:08 howeyc [~howeyc@2607:f2f8:a958::2] has joined #lisp 20:02:26 -!- gz [Clozure@clozure-123267BA.c3-0.smr-ubr1.sbo-smr.ma.cable.rcn.com] has quit [Quit: gz] 20:02:32 robde_ [~robde@p57903854.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #lisp 20:04:11 -!- robde [~robde@pC19F7B4D.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 20:07:39 -!- pnq [~nick@172.162.145.172] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 20:08:12 does LOOP have a keyword like :collect but to concatenate strings? 20:08:20 eli [~eli@winooski.ccs.neu.edu] has joined #lisp 20:08:28 osa1: no. 20:08:29 or do I have to (apply #'concatenate 'string ...) 20:08:33 osa1: (with-output-to-string (out) (loop do (princ stuff out))) 20:08:51 pjb: great, thanks 20:09:16 osa1: If with-output-to-string is not asymptotically O(n), complain to your vendor :-) 20:09:28 -!- ramkrsna [~ramkrsna@unaffiliated/ramkrsna] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 20:09:42 pjb: my vendor is SBCL 20:10:15 Bike [~Glossina@71-214-104-253.ptld.qwest.net] has joined #lisp 20:11:08 -!- leoncamel [~user@KD175129170046.ppp-bb.dion.ne.jp] has quit [Quit: Asta la vista] 20:11:09 ysph [~user@adsl-065-013-204-170.sip.mgm.bellsouth.net] has joined #lisp 20:11:10 ImTheBitch [Apples@ultra30.tptp.cc] has joined #lisp 20:11:54 cyrillos [~cyrill@swsoft-msk-nat.sw.ru] has joined #lisp 20:12:36 -!- ThePawnBreak [~quassel@94.177.108.25] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 20:12:55 osa1: SBCL is an implementation, not a vendor. 20:13:17 LiamH [~healy@pool-74-96-10-77.washdc.east.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 20:16:02 ehu: really? then what did pjb mean by "vendor" while talking about common lisp? 20:16:15 -!- Guthur` [~user@212.183.128.35] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 20:16:28 -!- Davidbrcz [~david@proxysup.isae.fr] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 20:16:29 Franz, LispWorks, Steel Bank Studio 20:16:37 osa1: free implementations have maintainers and distributors. Those can be called "vendors" :-) 20:16:49 Davidbrcz [~david@proxysup.isae.fr] has joined #lisp 20:19:23 I need to mapcar over the keys of an alist. Is there a function to generate a list of keys from an alist? 20:19:36 Cosman246: yes, in alexandria. 20:19:51 Or you can just write: (mapcar 'car alist) 20:19:53 (mapcar #'first my-alist) 20:19:59 Guthur [~user@212.183.128.35] has joined #lisp 20:20:45 My platonic ideal would be (map '(alist :keys) 'list my-alist). ;P 20:21:46 You can write (map 'list (alist :keys) my-alist) with (defun alist (what) (ecase what (:keys (function car)) (:values (function cdr)))) 20:22:08 oconnore [~eric@38.111.17.245] has joined #lisp 20:22:24 -!- jewel [~jewel@196-215-117-46.dynamic.isadsl.co.za] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 20:22:31 Hexstream: So, write a function that returns a function (map (alist-keys) my-alist) 20:23:26 Ugh, sorry, that's not quite what I meant, see pjb. 20:24:09 pjb: That traverses the list twice. ;P 20:24:14 No. 20:24:18 Meant (mapcar (alist-keys) my-alist) 20:24:26 Ah, sorry, misread. 20:25:13 homie` [~levgue@xdsl-84-44-178-126.netcologne.de] has joined #lisp 20:25:31 I don't know why, but I don't like it. Perhaps because my new map concept is the end-all be-all of mapping functions. ;P 20:26:01 I don't like the "write tons and tons of one-off adapter functions" "solution". 20:26:04 kaol [kaol@piperka.net] has joined #lisp 20:26:18 Thanks 20:26:19 Hexstream: think of it as DSL. 20:26:32 (map 'list (alist :keys) my-alist) is quite cool. 20:26:47 I'll go with that, thanks! 20:27:13 And I don't like the "write tons and tons of one-off-adapter-returning-functions" approach much better. 20:27:31 -!- homie [~levgue@xdsl-78-35-145-196.netcologne.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 20:27:31 (I'm putting this in a mapcar, which is in a dolist) 20:27:47 Hexstream: What do you mean by that? 20:27:58 (the dolist is in a loop) 20:28:02 (which is in a defun) 20:28:07 -!- mathrick__ [~mathrick@85.218.148.156] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 20:28:15 Cosman246: which is in a package 20:28:18 which is in a program 20:28:21 mathrick__ [~mathrick@85.218.148.156] has joined #lisp 20:28:24 which is in your computer 20:28:26 which is in your room 20:28:28 which is in your house 20:28:31 which is in your town 20:28:32 which is in your country 20:28:36 which is in your continent 20:28:37 which is in your planet 20:28:40 which is in your solar system 20:28:43 which is in your galaxy 20:28:43 Which is in your flooded IRC channel. 20:28:45 -!- homie` [~levgue@xdsl-84-44-178-126.netcologne.de] has quit [Client Quit] 20:28:46 which is in your universe! 20:29:09 which is in metaphysics 20:29:16 A friend asked me about a pure OO language to learn. I said lisp. 20:29:25 kaol: good answer. 20:29:31 Yeah 20:29:35 Smalltalk works too, but CLOS is funnier. 20:29:44 pjb: beat me to it 20:29:46 the first rule of computer programming: the answer is lisp 20:29:54 kaol: CL is multiparadigm, I wouldn't call it "pure OO". Though it has one of the best, or the best, OO systems on the planet... 20:30:01 -!- Bike [~Glossina@71-214-104-253.ptld.qwest.net] has quit [Quit: leaving] 20:30:10 The second rule is: no one looks for the answer 20:30:17 Hexstream: yes, but any lisp value has a class, just like in Smalltalk. 20:30:29 pjb: type, not class 20:30:31 class. 20:30:40 madnificent: nice rule 20:30:54 madnificent: both. 20:31:14 Right, but it's easy to make a system where every value has a class, doesn't necessarily mean it's a good system in all aspects... Though Java managed to screw that up, hehe. 20:31:25 no, i seem to recall all major implementations allowing to use types as classes, but ECL for instance does not. i thought ECL didn't do it yet because it actually wasn't in the standard. 20:31:25 -!- bjonnh [~bjonnh@147.210.71.83] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 20:32:01 but i've only read it in a log of a version. i don't know what part of the spec should imply that they both have a class and a type 20:32:06 madnificent: What? Not all types are classes, though all classes have an associated type... 20:32:10 -!- tensorpudding [~michael@99.148.193.184] has quit [Quit: tensorpudding] 20:32:24 Hexstream: yes, that's what i believe is correct 20:32:26 madnificent: but that can not be true, or I could dispatch a method on any type 20:32:35 madnificent: Basically the class and type systems are independent, but pretty well integrated. 20:32:38 which I've been told and found to be not true 20:32:39 phax [~phax@cpc14-haye17-2-0-cust110.haye.cable.virginmedia.com] has joined #lisp 20:32:39 -!- phax [~phax@cpc14-haye17-2-0-cust110.haye.cable.virginmedia.com] has quit [Changing host] 20:32:39 phax [~phax@unaffiliated/phax] has joined #lisp 20:32:50 homie [~levgue@xdsl-84-44-178-126.netcologne.de] has joined #lisp 20:33:09 Hexstream: but they aren't integrated as per standard, apparently 20:33:13 at least, that's what i'm trying to say 20:33:32 madnificent: They are integrated in many ways, but there's not a 1 for 1 mapping. 20:33:58 madnificent: clhs 4.3.7 20:33:58 SpitfireWP [spitfire@wikipedia/spitfire] has joined #lisp 20:34:05 Hexstream: you're not allowed to use a type as a class specifier in a method definition, that's what the ECL log said 20:34:14 *madnificent* reads clhs 4.3.7 and hopes it tells me otherwise 20:34:28 it wont 20:34:34 Dispatching is done on classes (and EQLity), not types, that's specified by the standard. 20:34:44 -!- brendyn [~brendyn@123-2-73-61.static.dsl.dodo.com.au] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 20:35:38 guther: right. a class specifier is also a type specifier, but not the other way around. 20:35:41 if class is a type specifier, then i could declaim instances to be of type my-class (given that i've defined my-class) 20:35:45 guther: that's still integrated. 20:35:49 ecraven [~nex@www.nexoid.at] has joined #lisp 20:36:14 ehu: and from what i understand the major implementations allow it the other way around as well 20:36:16 madnificent: every class name is also a type name. 20:36:23 very cool 20:36:35 i didn't know the spec said it could be in that way 4.3.7 ftw 20:36:36 The converse is not true. 20:36:50 SurlyFrog [~Adium@c-24-118-228-15.hsd1.mn.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 20:37:31 every *proper* class name is a type specifier. 20:38:01 i find it a bit sad that we can't finalize classes as to indicate that the compiler can cut out the method lookups 20:38:41 newb question, there's *standard-output*, *standard-input*, what about standard error? 20:38:44 You might even be able to "accidentally" dispatch on what seems to be a type... For instance, the standard specifies FIXNUM to be a type, not a system class, however on SBCL FIXNUM happens to be a system class, so you can dispatch on it, but you shouldn't since it's not portable. 20:38:53 mrky: *error-output* 20:39:00 thanks 20:39:24 See also: *trace-output* *terminal-io* *query-io* and *debug-io* 20:39:33 oh :) 20:39:39 Hexstream: you can dispatch on any system-class (if it's in 4.3.7: i'm still reading 20:40:02 That's what I've been saying. 20:40:20 If you are calling a macro from within another macro, is there a way to get macroexpand (in emacs/slime) to show you the complete expansion? I've got macros foo and bar, and I'm trying (macroexpand '(foo p1 (bar p2 p3))). 20:40:30 However something can be a system-class in your specific implementation yet being defined as a mere type in the standard. 20:41:06 tensorpudding [~michael@99.148.193.184] has joined #lisp 20:41:10 SurlyFrog: there are functions to expand forms. #+clisp ext:expand-form #+swank swank:macroexpand-all etc. 20:41:15 SurlyFrog: MACROEXPAND just repeatedly MACROEXPAND-1's until the returned form is not a macro form. It doesn't recurse. 20:41:38 Hexstream: it works only on the toplevel form. 20:41:45 Hexstream: fun read 20:41:49 got it. I'll try the macoexpand-all 20:42:13 pjb: That's what I said. 20:42:35 implicitely yes. 20:42:46 Hexstream: i think it's built-in-class that you want 20:42:46 What? That's specifically what I said, explicitly. 20:43:00 SurlyFrog: you can go in and manually expand macros in the expansion, there is probably a better way though 20:43:13 Guthur, thanks 20:43:48 madnificent: Yeah, well, "System Class" is what the spec says at the top of the page. For instance, "System Class INTEGER". 20:44:20 fantazo [~fantazo@85-127-156-169.dynamic.xdsl-line.inode.at] has joined #lisp 20:44:44 why have we lost all our bots in here, such as minion and specbot 20:45:00 Because we need to construct additional pylons. 20:45:10 To motivate lisper to write more bots. 20:45:23 rpg [~rpg@216.243.156.16.real-time.com] has joined #lisp 20:45:33 Guthur: we are not an ai language and we will prove it by not letting lisp support our questions! 20:45:35 lisp isn't a good language for AI 20:46:33 What is? 20:46:40 neurons? 20:46:49 i believe fantazo is trolling 20:46:55 Lisp is the best tool to make the best tool for any job, so if Lisp is not good for AI, then nothing is. 20:47:22 pjb: That's for I. 20:47:24 reverse psychology lisp marketing, 'we don't do AI here' 20:47:33 holycow, that's right it was time for this. :-D 20:47:35 Joreji [~thomas@u-0-041.vpn.RWTH-Aachen.DE] has joined #lisp 20:47:53 ehe :) 20:51:09 We don't know what is the best for AI, so we just use Lisp and find out from there 20:51:10 *fantazo* also loves it to put nails on a racing track 20:51:27 madnificent: Hehe, after reading clhs 1.4.4.14 (nice obscure section, that) it seems that "System Class" was indeed more appropriate than "built-in-class" for the kinds of things I was saying (though I shouldn't have said "system-class") 20:52:13 -!- robde_ [~robde@p57903854.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Quit: Bye.] 20:52:57 what are really erlang processes? somebody told me they are just different than normal processes, but act like one. so green threads / bordeux threads / lightweight threads? I mean they are all the same... 20:53:12 Erland processes are really off-topic. 20:53:13 pnq [~nick@ACA269E2.ipt.aol.com] has joined #lisp 20:53:20 Erlang* 20:53:27 brendyn [~brendyn@123-2-73-61.static.dsl.dodo.com.au] has joined #lisp 20:54:13 ranting about erlang in #lisp is a blasphemic act. I see what you did there ... 20:54:16 fantazo: they're user-space threads 20:54:36 with their own heap & tunable limitations 20:54:51 I'm sure #erlang knows more. 20:55:31 stickycake [~stickycak@64.134.64.42] has joined #lisp 20:55:32 RomyEatsDrupal [~stickycak@64.134.64.42] has joined #lisp 20:55:57 SurlyFrog: you can macroexpand and macroexpand-1 in SLIME with C-c M-m and C-c C-m 20:56:04 http://www.lisp.se/emacs-cl/ is cool 20:56:13 at least as an idea 20:56:15 daimrod: thanks 20:57:32 Cosman246: maybe most of the links seems dead. 20:57:32 Cosman246: found today a collision, there's a class named class with a precedence-list slot which makes an accessor named class-precedence-list which collides with eieio. 20:57:36 -maybe 20:58:01 pjb: what is this relevant for? 20:58:28 Cosman246: for emacs-cl. 20:58:41 Cosman246: don't you load eieio (or cedet) systematically in your emacs? 20:59:06 Cosman246: now that emacs-24 has lexical binding, it should add packages... 20:59:31 Or just switch to CL, already! o_o 20:59:39 I'm going to stop using CEDET now 20:59:46 Hexstream: I do use CL! 21:00:01 Emacs would do well to imitate you, then! 21:00:30 Let's all switch to Hemlock. 21:00:33 Hexstream: care to elaborate as to why? I'm opening 1.4.4.14 now, but it generally takes a while to find the key sentence 21:00:50 bjonnh [~bjonnh@2a01:e35:2420:ea0:21e:64ff:fe84:8986] has joined #lisp 21:00:53 madnificient: "System Class"? 21:01:58 Hexstream: hmm, that doesn't imply that all built-in classes must be system classes 21:02:32 No, it implies that no system class needs to be a built-in-class... 21:03:34 I wonder if Emacs Lisp will eventually go the same way as Spice Lisp 21:03:36 i'm too tired for this, i'm going to mix things up. i'm going to assume you're right and will try to not scatter the image that's currently in my head. must check later 21:03:55 bombshelter13b [~bombshelt@76-10-149-209.dsl.teksavvy.com] has joined #lisp 21:04:00 Cosman246: what way did Spice Lisp go? 21:04:06 It became CMUCL 21:04:26 Well, theorically it should go guile. 21:04:37 -!- bombshelter13b is now known as katrinam13 21:04:45 -!- katrinam13 [~bombshelt@76-10-149-209.dsl.teksavvy.com] has quit [Client Quit] 21:05:09 I'd prefer it to go Spice Lisp 21:05:41 katrinam13 [~bombshelt@76-10-149-209.dsl.teksavvy.com] has joined #lisp 21:07:27 Is there an easy way to tell SBCL's run-program to run the program in a particular directory? 21:07:50 You should call chdir(2). 21:07:52 rpg: Just pass the PWD environment variable 21:07:59 -!- RomyEatsDrupal [~stickycak@64.134.64.42] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 21:07:59 -!- stickycake [~stickycak@64.134.64.42] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 21:08:42 SB-POSIX:CHDIR more exactly. 21:08:59 pjb: not thread-safe, though, right? 21:09:02 -!- katrinam13 [~bombshelt@76-10-149-209.dsl.teksavvy.com] has left #lisp 21:09:13 ehu: you're forking an external program. 21:09:33 I wonder how long a complete rewrite of the "webtool" I'm working in ruby would take in lisp. 21:09:43 dlowe: (stupid question, I am sure) if I want to give an environment variable, it seems like I clobber the whole environment. It's not obvious how to use :environment to just add a single binding. 21:09:44 fantazo: try it, then 21:10:07 *ehu* wonders whta fantazo brings to the discussion 21:10:07 rpg: anyways, environment variables won't change the working directory. 21:10:18 rpg: actually, I'm wrong. Use chdir 21:10:35 rpg: but you'd have to just get the current environment, copy it, change it, pass it 21:10:54 ehu, I'm bringing my ultimate wisdom to the discussion ;-) 21:10:55 dlowe: Got it. thanks. 21:11:00 EmmanuelOga [~emmanuel@190.244.15.195] has joined #lisp 21:11:01 pjb: Thanks! 21:15:04 -!- Ralith [~ralith@216.162.199.202] has quit [Quit: Lost terminal] 21:15:10 tritchey [~tritchey@108.60.121.114] has joined #lisp 21:16:38 -!- Davidbrcz [~david@proxysup.isae.fr] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 21:17:00 Davidbrcz [~david@proxysup.isae.fr] has joined #lisp 21:17:12 Ralith [~ralith@216.162.199.202] has joined #lisp 21:19:40 -!- ered [~ered@108-201-125-162.lightspeed.tukrga.sbcglobal.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 21:20:34 -!- seangrove [~user@c-71-202-126-17.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 21:22:36 RomyEatsDrupal [~stickycak@64.134.64.42] has joined #lisp 21:22:44 -!- nachtwandler [~nachtwand@p57AD7EFD.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Quit: leaving] 21:23:58 stickycake [~stickycak@64.134.64.42] has joined #lisp 21:24:26 ered [~ered@108-201-125-162.lightspeed.tukrga.sbcglobal.net] has joined #lisp 21:25:31 -!- Jeanne-Kamikaze [~Jeanne-Ka@99.Red-88-11-28.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net] has quit [Quit: Did you hear that ?] 21:27:37 -!- lars_t_h [~lars_t_h@002128125195.mbb.telenor.dk] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 21:31:46 Composition, composition, composition. Why was I using inheritance? Faulty thinking. It's always scary to factor old code. 21:33:41 You can see how much you've learned :) 21:35:03 -!- RomyEatsDrupal [~stickycak@64.134.64.42] has quit [Quit: RomyEatsDrupal] 21:35:03 -!- stickycake [~stickycak@64.134.64.42] has quit [Quit: stickycake] 21:35:34 I usually just cringe at my ignorance. 21:35:43 -!- Vutral [~ss@vutral.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 21:41:47 stickycake [~stickycak@64.134.64.42] has joined #lisp 21:43:11 -!- stickycake [~stickycak@64.134.64.42] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 21:43:21 -!- osa1 [~sinan@31.140.30.140] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 21:43:22 stickycake [~stickycak@64.134.64.42] has joined #lisp 21:43:28 RomyEatsDrupal_ [~stickycak@64.134.64.42] has joined #lisp 21:43:42 -!- RomyEatsDrupal_ is now known as RomyEatsDrupal 21:45:34 ltriant [~ltriant@lithium.mailguard.com.au] has joined #lisp 21:47:31 -!- gravicappa [~gravicapp@ppp91-77-169-123.pppoe.mtu-net.ru] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 21:47:58 -!- phax [~phax@unaffiliated/phax] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 21:48:41 Vutral [~ss@vutral.net] has joined #lisp 21:50:17 -!- stickycake [~stickycak@64.134.64.42] has quit [Quit: stickycake] 21:50:19 -!- RomyEatsDrupal [~stickycak@64.134.64.42] has quit [Quit: RomyEatsDrupal] 21:52:54 -!- EmmanuelOga [~emmanuel@190.244.15.195] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 21:54:16 hugoduncan [~user@bas1-montreal08-1279584440.dsl.bell.ca] has joined #lisp 21:54:35 -!- realitygrill [~realitygr@76.226.139.212] has quit [Quit: realitygrill] 21:56:18 -!- hugod [~user@bas1-montreal08-1279585155.dsl.bell.ca] has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 21:56:37 -!- mcsontos [~mcsontos@hotspot8.rywasoft.net] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 21:57:46 -!- hugoduncan is now known as hugod 22:01:15 Shaftoe_ [~Moe111@modemcable037.54-22-96.mc.videotron.ca] has joined #lisp 22:01:22 -!- asvil` [~filonenko@178.124.160.180] has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 22:01:48 JuanDaugherty [~Ren@cpe-72-228-177-92.buffalo.res.rr.com] has joined #lisp 22:02:03 Damnmacros are fricken useful! I know that is probably a completely inane thing to say in this channelbut I just had to say it. I mean, I understood them before, but I've never really written a real one until this afternoon. Holy crapI'm in total awe as to what has just happened to my code... :-) 22:02:24 -!- Shaftoe [~Moe111@modemcable037.54-22-96.mc.videotron.ca] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 22:02:36 SurlyFrog: Congratulations! The next level is knowing when not to write a macro. ;) 22:02:48 :-) 22:02:50 FTR, my earlier problem apparently has something in the linux distro as root cause, not lisp. When I tried on another RH derivative it worked like on the other. The failing distro is debian. 22:02:54 SurlyFrog: are you sure it couldn't just be written as a function? ;D 22:04:33 believe me, I thought about it. That's how I had it originally coded up in Python. But I had either all of these crappy, special purpose functions that basically did almost the same thingor I was passing around big string templates and interpolating into them. Now I can add an arbitrary number of predicates and objects into a prolog query of a graph database due to a 5-line macro and my life is heavenly. 22:04:36 sykopomp: I think there's an inherent phase of overusing macros before you can use them only when appropriate. I also think it's better to fall into this trap repeatedly as quickly as possible such that you can get over it as fast as possible. Basically. 22:05:05 Hexstream: well, yes. 22:05:34 SurlyFrog: sounds like a job for functions, imo 22:06:28 sykopomp: why do you say that? 22:06:39 As a random tip, I found that getting to know and appreciate usage of multiple values more made some apparent macro use-cases go back into the "let's just write a function" realm. 22:07:24 SurlyFrog: I have a feeling. 22:07:32 Well, multiple values and higher-order functions. 22:07:32 -!- naeg [~naeg@194.208.239.170] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 22:07:55 ... 22:08:49 DataLinkDroid [~David@1.153.144.63] has joined #lisp 22:09:30 -!- vantage|home [~vantage@109.131.145.252] has quit [Quit: Ik ga weg] 22:09:44 I'll put something up on pastelisp and you guys can throw rocks at it.... 22:10:11 then again, when you have a macro already, macros have the bad habit of being the only way to extend behavior :\ 22:10:40 you write one macro, and it all goes downhill from there, I tell ya. 22:11:04 -!- sdemarre [~serge@91.176.94.14] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 22:12:54 -!- erg_ is now known as erg 22:13:07 Yes, it's better to implement most things in the realm of (generic-)functions and (multiple-)values, then implement a thin layer of macro syntactic sugar on top if deemed necessary/convenient. 22:14:04 I really don't like thick HTML macros that try to compile everything down to turing-complete CL directly... 22:14:51 good thing we have that handy non-Turing Complete CL implementation hanging around. 22:16:01 It's easy to make very restricted subsets of CL that aren't turing-complete... I did that for HTML and CSS back in the day, haven't gotten around to cleaning that up yet... 22:16:42 Okay, I submitted at paste. Maybe I've missed an easy way to skip doing the macro and just use functions. 22:16:48 -!- Davidbrcz [~david@proxysup.isae.fr] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 22:17:04 -!- kilon [~kilon@athedsl-402997.home.otenet.gr] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 22:17:23 Does the paste show up? 22:17:25 ah yeah. 22:17:39 I just looked it up on the site. 22:17:48 What I was doing is creating objects representing the HTML and CSS, and within the HTML I had "first-class" representations of conditionals (IF) and restricted loops (DOLIST), along with variables... and I had a thin macro layer on top to make it very easy to instantiate these objects. The code to generate the HTML was turing-complete, but the dynamic HTML representation was not... 22:19:09 And I had an optimizer and closure compiler to make it fast, and the code was easily searchable and processable... It's a really nice approach, and it blew my mind that I could do this compiler stuff this early, back when I was a CL newb... :) (Now back to work...) 22:19:35 SurlyFrog: This is one of those cases where macros may actually be the only way to go, unless there's also a functional interface exposed. 22:20:17 or it also depends on how select gets evaluated. 22:21:36 sykopomp: There is a set of functions to get directly at the triple store, so I could do it like that, but the select macro does a couple of other nice things behind the scenes for me. For example, it converts the internal representation of the data into the strings my code wants to use, things like that.. 22:22:40 yeah 22:22:54 gigamonkey: So, some unpushed thing holding up the monkeylibs? 22:23:01 -!- naryl [~weechat@188.134.95.93] has quit [Quit: WeeChat 0.3.6] 22:23:32 naryl [~weechat@188.134.95.93] has joined #lisp 22:23:38 sykopomp: do you still have a gut feeling that I should be doing this another way? (I'm still a CL newbie, so I'm interested) 22:24:43 is this correct: (flex:string-to-octets "\r\n" :external-format :ascii) => #(114 110) 22:24:45 SurlyFrog: No, I have a gut feeling someone else should have been doing it another way. :D 22:25:04 :-) 22:25:06 Guthur: yes, those are the codes for "r" and "n" 22:25:07 Guthur: "\r\n" is equivalent to "rn" 22:25:08 my expectation was #(13 10) 22:25:23 Guthur: i suggest creating it directly then. 22:25:29 SurlyFrog: and I might be rusty, but the macro itself looks good. 22:25:42 SurlyFrog: calling it FOO is suspect, though! ;) 22:25:44 Guthur: \ does not mean in CL strings what it means in C strings 22:25:50 :-) 22:25:56 dnolen [~user@cpe-98-14-92-234.nyc.res.rr.com] has joined #lisp 22:26:04 Xach: ah ok, crumbs 22:26:46 Xach: cheers 22:26:51 Guthur: But you can make it mean the same as in C: http://paste.lisp.org/display/69905 22:27:14 -!- jdz [~jdz@host206-110-dynamic.14-87-r.retail.telecomitalia.it] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 22:27:25 okflo [~okflo@91-115-93-39.adsl.highway.telekom.at] has joined #lisp 22:28:31 Yes, you can overcomplicate your life by solving trivial non-problems with simple solutions instead of just shifting your mind a tiny bit. But go ahead, all progress depends on the unreasonable man. ;P 22:29:38 Depends on the situation. If you already have tons of C strings, it's easier to use the reader macro. 22:32:40 "instead of just shifting your mind a tiny bit"  when I was reading the CLOS chapter in Practical Common Lisp, I took a break and went to walk my dogs. As I was walking them, it occurred to me how much crufty mental constructs go into other OO languages versus what is really happening in the computer. I kept coming back to the line "the enemy's gate is down" from Ender's Game and how flipping your headspace around just a bit can mak 22:33:14 SurlyFrog: Cut off at "can mak" for me. 22:33:15 buffer overflow :) 22:33:26 -!- okflo [~okflo@91-115-93-39.adsl.highway.telekom.at] has quit [Quit: leaving] 22:33:28 e things much better. 22:33:28 4:33 22:33:41 -!- mlkith [~redmundia@mail.madito.es] has quit [Quit: Chateando desde http://webchat.redmundial.org (Ping timeout)] 22:33:57 Guthur: http://weitz.de/cl-interpol/ gives you those sorts of string facilities, and a bit more. 22:34:48 littlebot [~littlebot@212.183.128.35] has joined #lisp 22:34:53 -!- kennyd [~kennyd@93-139-55-46.adsl.net.t-com.hr] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 22:34:57 ah ha 22:35:04 there is littlebot 22:35:18 he wont stay long though 22:35:20 -!- littlebot [~littlebot@212.183.128.35] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 22:35:31 there he goes 22:35:42 -!- Kenjin [~josesanto@bl19-225-246.dsl.telepac.pt] has quit [Quit: Computer has gone to sleep] 22:35:42 -!- mrky [~mrky@76.73.16.26] has quit [Quit: CGI:IRC (Ping timeout)] 22:35:52 Guthur: You're making an IRC bot? What will it do? 22:35:57 sykopomp: cheers 22:36:25 Hexstream: not sure, just felt challenged by the discuss of bots earlier 22:36:49 never made one before, should be interesting 22:37:16 -!- JuanDaugherty [~Ren@cpe-72-228-177-92.buffalo.res.rr.com] has quit [Quit: Exeunt IRC] 22:38:45 He would have joined earlier if I had of realised /r/n was actually "rn" 22:39:12 leo2007 [~leo@222.130.129.13] has joined #lisp 22:39:32 I have limited experience of raw sockets as well, they can be a pain in the butt 22:39:37 -!- tritchey [~tritchey@108.60.121.114] has quit [Quit: tritchey] 22:40:41 Guthur: "/r/n" is "rn" only in ZetaLisp, not in Common Lisp. 22:40:53 Are you writing your bot in ZetaLisp? 22:41:21 -!- toekutr [~user@50-0-51-2.dsl.static.sonic.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 22:41:57 pjb: well flexi-streams produces and octet array with the equivalent of rn 22:42:28 and per the comments a moment ago by Hexstream and Xach this is normal 22:42:32 Guthur: Can't you see the difference between "/r/n" and "\r\n"? 22:42:48 ah oops 22:42:52 Guthur: if you're dislexic, try hexadecimal. 22:42:56 sorry, I always mix up 22:43:22 pjb: umm, might help 22:43:41 am0c [~am0c@124.49.51.146] has joined #lisp 22:44:15 hehe, it is dyslexic 22:45:24 lysdexia 22:45:41 -!- homie [~levgue@xdsl-84-44-178-126.netcologne.de] has quit [Quit: ERC Version 5.3 (IRC client for Emacs)] 22:49:11 Frozenlock [~user@cable-quebec-15.246.173-179.electronicbox.net] has joined #lisp 22:50:10 Xach: you asked about monkeylib? 22:50:57 As far as I know everything is up to date on github. 22:51:09 Is there something that doesn't load properly for you? 22:52:14 chu [~mathew.ba@CPE-124-176-63-146.lns1.dea.bigpond.net.au] has joined #lisp 22:53:35 -!- cyrillos [~cyrill@swsoft-msk-nat.sw.ru] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 22:55:48 Is there a way to do an (if p ) inside a macro, "p" being a parameter to the macro? I've done ,(if p but that always seems to execute the "then" clause. 22:56:26 SurlyFrog: when do you want to evaluate p? When do you want to evaluate the if? 22:56:32 macroexpansion time or run time? 22:56:42 um, macroexpansion time 22:56:58 Then just (if p ...) 22:57:13 (defmacro m (p) (if p `(some code) `(some other code))) 22:57:29 lemme try 22:57:45 -!- msponge [~msponge@30-7-244.wireless.csail.mit.edu] has quit [Quit: msponge] 22:58:03 Yeah, that doesn't work. It's inside a larger back-quoted list. 22:58:10 SurlyFrog: lisppaste 22:58:19 sellout! 22:58:20 hi 22:58:28 Ralith: ahoj :) 22:58:33 get my message earlier? 22:58:33 (defmacro m (p) `(some ,(if p `code `other-code))) 22:58:46 Ralith: re: using current version on 3.0? 22:58:49 yeah 22:59:02 can p be an optional parameter? 22:59:02 I've been going ahead with it on the basis that I'll fix bugs when I hit them 22:59:03 -!- fiveop [~fiveop@dslb-178-002-115-194.pools.arcor-ip.net] has quit [Quit: humhum] 22:59:10 Ralith: Yep, and I responded, but I guess you didn't see ;) I won't branch then until there's some need. 22:59:11 ` = backquote , = unquote 22:59:16 kk 22:59:25 SurlyFrog: ````,,,,foo 22:59:27 yeah, had to reset my client, lost some backlog 23:00:16 sellout: I expect there are *some* API changes, but they would seem to be few 23:00:18 http://paste.lisp.org/+2Q2I 23:01:01 sounds good. 23:01:42 SurlyFrog: there's a common pattern for macros that have both arguments and a &body 23:02:08 okay. 23:02:18 do tell 23:02:19 SurlyFrog: http://paste.lisp.org/display/127098#1 23:03:03 (foobar (my-type "title") ...body...) 23:04:55 sykopomp: thanks! I really appreciate it. 23:05:41 :) 23:07:13 -!- naryl [~weechat@188.134.95.93] has quit [Quit: WeeChat 0.3.6] 23:07:29 naryl [~weechat@188.134.95.93] has joined #lisp 23:07:33 -!- pnq [~nick@ACA269E2.ipt.aol.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 23:08:00 hugoduncan [~user@bas1-montreal08-1279584440.dsl.bell.ca] has joined #lisp 23:08:11 homie [~levgue@xdsl-84-44-178-126.netcologne.de] has joined #lisp 23:08:13 -!- ehu [~ehuels@ip118-64-212-87.adsl2.static.versatel.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 23:08:50 -!- ThomasH [~user@pdpc/supporter/professional/thomash] has left #lisp 23:09:52 -!- hugoduncan [~user@bas1-montreal08-1279584440.dsl.bell.ca] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 23:11:01 -!- milanj [~milanj_@109-93-200-141.dynamic.isp.telekom.rs] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 23:11:23 -!- hugod [~user@bas1-montreal08-1279584440.dsl.bell.ca] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 23:13:43 -!- zmv [~zmv@186.204.151.21] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 23:14:03 tessier [~treed@mail.copilotco.com] has joined #lisp 23:17:58 -!- fantazo [~fantazo@85-127-156-169.dynamic.xdsl-line.inode.at] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 23:18:31 -!- steevy [~steevy@91-67-42-157-dynip.superkabel.de] has quit [Quit: quit?] 23:18:31 -!- zenlunatic [~justin@c-68-48-40-231.hsd1.md.comcast.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 23:22:16 pnq [~nick@AC81B51F.ipt.aol.com] has joined #lisp 23:24:21 how does one pass the flags to iolib.sockets:receive-from 23:24:39 -!- silver_ [~kingrat@178.121.134.139] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 23:24:48 -!- Athas [~athas@130.225.165.40] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 23:24:50 I tried :flags :wait-all, but it says "The value :WAIT-ALL is not of type (SIGNED-BYTE 32)." 23:25:49 I would have assumed that :wait-all should get convert somewhere, and the docs imply that I should be passing the keyword symbol 23:27:58 realitygrill [~realitygr@adsl-76-226-139-212.dsl.sfldmi.sbcglobal.net] has joined #lisp 23:28:09 pavelpenev [~pavelludi@83.222.167.145] has joined #lisp 23:28:29 -!- mishoo_ [~mishoo@79.112.117.181] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 23:28:49 X-Scale [email@sgi-ultra64.broker.freenet6.net] has joined #lisp 23:35:59 zenlunatic [~justin@c-68-48-40-231.hsd1.md.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 23:36:22 -!- tensorpudding [~michael@99.148.193.184] has quit [Quit: tensorpudding] 23:39:42 tensorpudding [~michael@99.148.193.184] has joined #lisp 23:40:24 -!- bjonnh [~bjonnh@2a01:e35:2420:ea0:21e:64ff:fe84:8986] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 23:41:26 -!- urandom__ [~user@ip-176-199-8-17.unitymediagroup.de] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 23:43:22 -!- pavelpenev [~pavelludi@83.222.167.145] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 23:44:23 tritchey [~tritchey@108.60.121.114] has joined #lisp 23:45:39 pavelpenev [~pavelludi@83.222.167.145] has joined #lisp 23:45:40 -!- Hexstream [~hexstream@modemcable075.97-200-24.mc.videotron.ca] has left #lisp 23:47:47 carbocalm [~user@38.99.165.166] has joined #lisp 23:47:59 bx 23:50:38 Kenjin [~josesanto@bl19-225-246.dsl.telepac.pt] has joined #lisp 23:51:07 ratxue [~chatzilla@host-89-241-166-147.as13285.net] has joined #lisp 23:52:21 -!- lonstein_ is now known as lonstein 23:53:52 gigamonkey: i did 23:54:44 -!- Kenjin [~josesanto@bl19-225-246.dsl.telepac.pt] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 23:54:48 gigamonkey: http://paste.lisp.org/display/127099 23:55:21 Do you know which library you were loading when you ran into that? 23:59:42 Anyway, com.gigamonkeys.foo is deprecated and I think I've removed references to it from my own code. 23:59:48 Maybe I missed some. 23:59:58 Or is something else in Quicklisp actually using my code?