00:03:52 -!- ratxue_ is now known as ratxue 00:05:44 -!- akovalenko [~akovalenk@95.73.48.17] has quit [Quit: rcirc on GNU Emacs 24.0.92.1] 00:06:03 ISF [~ivan@201.82.138.222] has joined #lisp 00:10:20 [SLB] [~balthasar@unaffiliated/slabua] has joined #lisp 00:10:25 -!- icrazyhack [~horieyui@183.60.100.164] has quit [Quit: http://www.cnblogs.com/crazyhack] 00:15:48 leo2007 [~leo@123.123.255.114] has joined #lisp 00:17:08 -!- mishoo [~mishoo@79.112.117.181] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 00:18:27 shizniks, not even +gray15+ is the same in mcclim and climacs 00:18:31 lol 00:18:46 i hope it's not an optical ..... 00:19:39 -!- dan64 [~dan64@c-71-206-193-42.hsd1.pa.comcast.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 00:20:07 in mcclim it's slightly darker somehow... 00:22:36 dnolen [~user@cpe-98-14-92-234.nyc.res.rr.com] has joined #lisp 00:26:53 dan64 [~dan64@c-71-206-193-42.hsd1.pa.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 00:28:42 gko [~gko@114-34-168-13.HINET-IP.hinet.net] has joined #lisp 00:32:45 -!- mrSpec [~Spec@unaffiliated/mrspec] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 00:35:37 Kron_ [~Kron@69.166.23.228] has joined #lisp 00:35:51 ve [~a@vortis.xen.tardis.ed.ac.uk] has joined #lisp 00:36:30 tsuru` [~charlie@adsl-74-179-196-171.bna.bellsouth.net] has joined #lisp 00:37:44 PECCU [~peccu@ZU205111.ppp.dion.ne.jp] has joined #lisp 00:37:56 -!- Kron__ [~Kron@199.91.213.194] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 00:42:47 http://picpaste.de/pics/Bildschirmfoto1-MpL5uvsK.1326588129.png 00:43:12 ehu [~ehuels@ip118-64-212-87.adsl2.static.versatel.nl] has joined #lisp 00:43:23 -!- DataLinkDroid [~David@120.153.245.233] has quit [Quit: Bye] 00:45:38 -!- Guthur` [~user@host86-148-29-135.range86-148.btcentralplus.com] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 00:48:10 -!- ehu [~ehuels@ip118-64-212-87.adsl2.static.versatel.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 00:57:25 -!- lars_t_h [~lars_t_h@002129187223.mbb.telenor.dk] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 01:00:06 pavelludiq [~pavelludi@83.222.167.145] has joined #lisp 01:00:17 -!- Lycurgus [~juan@cpe-72-228-177-92.buffalo.res.rr.com] has quit [Quit: Exeunt IRC] 01:00:19 sykopomp [~sykopomp@gateway/tor-sasl/sykopomp] has joined #lisp 01:00:44 -!- pavelpenev [~pavelludi@83.222.167.145] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 01:01:37 -!- pavelludiq is now known as pavelpenev 01:06:35 SeanTAllen_ [u4855@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-ypvpcjuofehffhsz] has joined #lisp 01:10:04 -!- SeanTAllen_ is now known as SeanTAllen 01:11:08 adu [~ajr@pool-173-66-11-4.washdc.fios.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 01:12:44 -!- rme [~rme@50.43.137.115] has quit [Quit: rme] 01:13:16 jleija [~jleija@50.8.41.50] has joined #lisp 01:13:37 rme [~rme@50.43.137.115] has joined #lisp 01:15:08 -!- Nisstyre [~yours@c-208-90-102-250.netflash.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 01:25:24 nialo- [~nialo@64.134.52.177] has joined #lisp 01:28:55 _nix00 [~Adium@114.92.118.90] has joined #lisp 01:31:18 -!- Xilinx is now known as Virtex7 01:32:40 -!- ignas [~ignas@ctv-79-132-160-221.vinita.lt] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 01:37:34 Nisstyre [~yours@c-208-90-102-250.netflash.net] has joined #lisp 01:38:29 am0c [~am0c@124.49.51.146] has joined #lisp 01:39:16 -!- splittist [~splittist@74-104.198-178.cust.bluewin.ch] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 01:40:38 -!- gigamonk` [~user@adsl-99-24-222-110.dsl.pltn13.sbcglobal.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 01:40:48 splittist [~splittist@74-104.198-178.cust.bluewin.ch] has joined #lisp 01:44:19 -!- Virtex7 [9UCy6UjN2w@vutral.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 01:44:46 rahul [~rjain@66-234-32-156.nyc.cable.nyct.net] has joined #lisp 01:44:52 -!- leo2007 [~leo@123.123.255.114] has quit [Quit: rcirc on GNU Emacs 23.3.50.1] 01:44:53 Vutral [~ss@2a01:198:35a::1] has joined #lisp 01:45:00 Frozenlock [~user@cable-quebec-15.246.173-179.electronicbox.net] has joined #lisp 01:47:19 -!- Joreji_ [~thomas@u-0-032.vpn.RWTH-Aachen.DE] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 01:56:32 -!- phax [~phax@unaffiliated/phax] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 02:04:06 -!- Joreji [~thomas@vpn-eu1.unidsl.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 02:04:15 -!- ISF [~ivan@201.82.138.222] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 02:08:33 -!- urandom__ [~user@p548A270F.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 02:11:17 pavelludiq [~pavelludi@83.222.167.145] has joined #lisp 02:11:50 -!- pavelpenev [~pavelludi@83.222.167.145] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 02:11:53 -!- pavelludiq is now known as pavelpenev 02:13:23 rg 02:17:43 ? 02:18:44 Sorry, somehow my fingers slipped while switching buffer. 02:20:15 -!- dschoepe [~dschoepe@unaffiliated/dschoepe] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 02:20:39 oh ok 02:26:01 clarke2 [~clarke4@109.76.80.41] has joined #lisp 02:27:08 -!- mcspiff [~user@CPE78cd8ec16698-CM78cd8ec16695.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 02:27:35 -!- clarke2 [~clarke4@109.76.80.41] has quit [Client Quit] 02:28:39 -!- yoklov [~yoklov@24-177-5-183.dhcp.nwtn.ct.charter.com] has quit [Quit: computer sleeping] 02:30:16 csdserver [~csdserver@CPE-76-177-111-55.natcky.res.rr.com] has joined #lisp 02:32:37 -!- homie [~levgue@xdsl-87-79-249-252.netcologne.de] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 02:32:57 Interesting rant: http://dis.4chan.org/read/prog/1253894235 02:33:54 homie [~levgue@xdsl-87-79-249-252.netcologne.de] has joined #lisp 02:36:34 Once I learn more about Clojure (which I am unenthusiastic about), I will probably write a longer, more reasonable looking criticism of it 02:36:48 clojure ? 02:36:54 what is that ? 02:37:01 4chan? I expect a rant, but not necessarily intelligent. And lots of "Have you read SICP today" 02:37:25 "Everyone knows Scheme isn't really a Lisp either. It's a functional language" 02:37:27 snicker 02:37:38 and I positively love the fact taht my university is banned from 4chan for 'underage' 02:37:41 -!- ratxue [~chatzilla@host-89-241-166-147.as13285.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 02:39:34 dmiles_afk [~dmiles@dsl-72-19-50-021.cascadeaccess.com] has joined #lisp 02:43:54 Cosman246: the only good line from that thread... And Java is a DSL for turning XML documents into stack traces. 02:44:37 meh, the indentation in climacs is so crappy.... 02:44:55 where is tab-width set ? 02:45:31 and why do i get a 26 column indent in a form like (define-bla-blah.... ... 02:46:39 Ah, better criticism: http://www.loper-os.org/?p=42 02:46:52 dlowe: I do agree with that one 02:46:56 sorry 02:46:57 as in 02:47:13 I disagree--Scheme is a lisp 02:47:24 so I would snicker as well 02:49:37 tritchey [~tritchey@12.236.109.2] has joined #lisp 02:50:36 -!- dnolen [~user@cpe-98-14-92-234.nyc.res.rr.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 02:53:26 homie: I think if you decide to suffer through climacs, your choices are to suck it up and fix it or suck it up and endure it 02:53:40 homie: either way, complaining about it will get you exactly nothing 02:53:41 The other criticism, of course, also is made by a fan of Genera, which I didn't use 02:53:52 dlowe: I found phemlock to be possibly nicer 02:54:09 -!- dan64 [~dan64@c-71-206-193-42.hsd1.pa.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 02:54:11 but it does make the good point that Lisp should be extended in itself 02:54:26 dan64 [~dan64@c-71-206-193-42.hsd1.pa.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 02:54:48 -!- dan64 [~dan64@c-71-206-193-42.hsd1.pa.comcast.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 02:55:01 dan64 [~dan64@c-71-206-193-42.hsd1.pa.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 02:55:50 -!- dan64 [~dan64@c-71-206-193-42.hsd1.pa.comcast.net] has quit [Client Quit] 02:56:07 dan64 [~dan64@c-71-206-193-42.hsd1.pa.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 02:59:31 Well, scheme is a lisp, but you have a lot of work to put it up to the CL level before you can do anything with it. 03:00:32 pjb: it's a shame 03:00:42 the 4chan thread says that clojure can't dump an image. How do you distribute programs, class files/jars? 03:00:43 Karmaon [~john@gateway/tor-sasl/karmaon] has joined #lisp 03:01:06 Phoodus: I guess you could ask on #clojure. 03:01:26 yeah, but I'd rather not get into things there :) 03:01:36 I don't even have any evidence that clojure is "practical" except for the word "java" 03:02:03 Cosman246: well for one thing, it can't run our favorite CL libraries... 03:02:13 ql:quickload doesn't work on clojure... 03:02:20 Phoodus: you use one of the build tools to generate jars 03:03:31 Being Lisp-like, it's better than plain Java, but it's not "the future of Lisp" as some hype it 03:04:22 What's with all the []s? 03:06:25 -!- centipedefarmer [~centipede@75-170-156-239.desm.qwest.net] has quit [Quit: This computer has gone to sleep] 03:06:54 chu [~mathew.ba@CPE-124-176-63-146.lns1.dea.bigpond.net.au] has joined #lisp 03:07:45 -!- homie [~levgue@xdsl-87-79-249-252.netcologne.de] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 03:08:16 homie` 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05:11:18 pnathan [~Adium@98.145.117.147] has joined #lisp 05:15:55 Jubb [~ghost@pool-72-66-102-48.washdc.fios.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 05:24:11 -!- rme [rme@323D5415.47C9A248.699BA7A6.IP] has quit [Quit: rme] 05:24:11 -!- rme [~rme@50.43.137.115] has quit [Quit: rme] 05:27:22 leo2007 [~leo@111.194.95.218] has joined #lisp 05:29:38 chenbing [~user@60.186.240.190] has joined #lisp 05:33:09 yates [~yates@rrcs-97-79-165-138.sw.biz.rr.com] has joined #lisp 05:33:37 -!- JuniorRoy [~juniorroy@212.36.228.103] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 05:33:59 -!- realitygrill [~realitygr@c-76-112-35-247.hsd1.mi.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: realitygrill] 05:34:01 can a parameter in a function's parameter list be constrained to a specific data type ? 05:34:38 -!- wildnux [~wildnux@cpe-72-182-70-190.austin.res.rr.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 05:35:30 Cryotank2011 [~Cryotank2@c-24-17-62-152.hsd1.wa.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 05:36:06 Not directly. You can test type-of and assert tohugh 05:36:22 defmethod has constraints (as opposed to defun) 05:36:24 pnathan: you mean inside the function do the test? 05:36:29 yes 05:36:39 ah, defmethod - ok 05:37:48 -!- ASau` is now known as ASau 05:38:49 so in this sense would you call lisp a "weakly typed system"? 05:40:18 What do you mean by "weak typing"? 05:40:25 You can't add a string and a number. 05:42:36 pnathan: i don't have a formal definition - it's just a term i've heard and i presumed it to mean basically that variables don't have to be explicitly typed 05:43:05 contrast: c and c++ 05:43:21 What's the point of asking whether something fits a definition you don't know? 05:43:32 -!- ddp [~ddp@216.243.111.165] has quit [Quit: ddp] 05:43:52 DataLinkDroid [~David@123.208.101.22] has joined #lisp 05:43:58 Bike: i don't buy your legalisted implication: everything, at some point, is a matter of interpretation 05:43:59 dtw [dtw@dsl-roibrasgw1-fe84fb00-215.dhcp.inet.fi] has joined #lisp 05:44:05 legalistic 05:44:50 yates: C is IMHO less strongly typed than CL, but it depends on which "strength" you're calculating (there are at least two dimensions, which are *different* !) 05:44:59 I didn't mean to imply that. Anyway, the distinction I've heard is that static typing means variables have types at compile time, and dynamic typing means values have types at runtime; lisp is obviously more the latter. 05:45:16 -!- jleija [~jleija@50.8.41.50] has quit [Quit: leaving] 05:46:17 that's static/dynamic. Strong/Weak was different iirc 05:46:42 maybe implicity type coercion? 05:46:47 *implicit 05:46:48 I am not sure if CL wasn't a case of strongly dynamically typed language 05:47:29 if you want to know about *strong* typing, then you don't have to look past Ada... :-) 05:48:19 well, if i define a function a-function that expects a parameter to be an integer, e.g., and define another function b-function that calls a-function with a string instead, that will not be detected at compile-time, will it? 05:48:32 Ada I think had as a goal less the type system, more static analysis 05:49:04 -!- am0c [~am0c@124.49.51.146] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 05:49:23 yes, there is a spark subset that lends itself to "proofing" 05:49:44 JuniorRoy1 [~juniorroy@212.36.228.103] has joined #lisp 05:50:14 so static/dynamic refers to compile-time type checking versus run-time type checking? 05:50:28 DataLinkDroid: were you talking to me? 05:50:42 -!- dtw [dtw@dsl-roibrasgw1-fe84fb00-215.dhcp.inet.fi] has quit [Quit: Changing server] 05:50:47 yates, you are correct 05:51:00 well whoever is listening 05:51:17 what do you mean by a "spark subset"? 05:51:38 A friend of mine is trying to use vim with LISP >.> 05:51:53 "spark" is apparently the name they give to a cut down Ada standard that has some stuff taken out, like threading 05:52:18 oh - never heard of that. 05:52:50 Cosman246: i thought lisp only works when writing with emacs? :) 05:52:52 yeah, ada is a bit b&d but is probably the thing to use for avionics etc. 05:53:12 when written with 05:53:16 like you can define types, for instance that only accept integer values in the range 3 to 17 05:53:35 yeah, that's REALLY strongly typed! 05:53:47 yep 05:53:53 gotta go 05:53:54 DataLinkDroid: well, Ada is all about static analysis and really weeding out the bugs 05:53:59 yates: indeedy 05:54:07 -!- DataLinkDroid [~David@123.208.101.22] has quit [Quit: Bye] 05:54:34 in fact i wrote some elisp to write lisp... 05:55:09 (not really..) 05:56:25 i wrote some elisp to write c (and assembly), though. really. i wrote an entire "suite" of lisp functions that will auto-generate a skeleton of C and/or assembly functions for my project 05:56:36 Cool 05:56:53 yeah, it's quite helpful, but it was painful to write. 05:57:06 now i can autogenerate a skeleton in about 3 seconds... 05:58:12 by skeleton i mean 1) source, make, and include files for the function being written, 2) source and make files for a testbench to test the function, and 3) directory structure for 1) and 2) 05:58:45 -!- setmeaway2 [setmeaway3@118.45.149.247] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 06:02:15 -!- ignas [~ignas@ctv-79-132-160-221.vinita.lt] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 06:06:06 ddp [~ddp@216.243.111.165] has joined #lisp 06:06:07 -!- ddp [~ddp@216.243.111.165] has quit [Client Quit] 06:11:35 -!- hasnointentions [~hasnointe@ip72-195-135-173.ri.ri.cox.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 06:12:34 -!- Frozenlock [~user@cable-quebec-15.246.173-179.electronicbox.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 06:12:39 Frozenlock [~user@cable-quebec-15.246.173-179.electronicbox.net] has joined #lisp 06:14:27 setmeaway [setmeaway3@118.45.149.247] has joined #lisp 06:19:27 -!- situ [~quassel@223.191.93.226] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 06:21:01 situ [~quassel@223.183.183.203] has joined #lisp 06:26:20 -!- Jubb [~ghost@pool-72-66-102-48.washdc.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 06:35:04 realitygrill [~realitygr@76.226.139.212] has joined #lisp 06:35:14 -!- Frozenlock [~user@cable-quebec-15.246.173-179.electronicbox.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 06:35:15 I have converted him to EMACS 06:36:32 ratxue [~chatzilla@host-89-241-166-147.as13285.net] has joined #lisp 06:36:42 dtw [dtw@dsl-roibrasgw1-fe84fb00-215.dhcp.inet.fi] has joined #lisp 06:37:49 -!- setmeaway [setmeaway3@118.45.149.247] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 06:47:25 -!- pnathan [~Adium@98.145.117.147] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 06:47:29 setmeaway [~setmeaway@118.45.149.247] has joined #lisp 06:47:34 -!- tritchey [~tritchey@12.236.109.2] has quit [Quit: tritchey] 06:55:09 -!- Kron_ [~Kron@69.166.23.228] has quit [Quit: Kron awayyy!] 06:55:15 -!- sixpoint8 [~jaykub@ip68-12-204-131.ok.ok.cox.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 06:55:27 sixpoint8 [~jaykub@ip68-12-204-131.ok.ok.cox.net] has joined #lisp 06:58:28 ehu [~ehuels@ip118-64-212-87.adsl2.static.versatel.nl] has joined #lisp 07:00:31 -!- toekutr` [~user@50-0-51-2.dsl.static.sonic.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 07:04:25 -!- leo2007 [~leo@111.194.95.218] has quit [Quit: rcirc on GNU Emacs 23.3.50.1] 07:04:37 asvil [~filonenko@178.124.160.180] has joined #lisp 07:06:17 angavrilov [~angavrilo@217.71.235.212] has joined #lisp 07:06:56 chenbing` [~user@60.186.240.190] has joined #lisp 07:08:33 -!- Buglouse [~Buglouse@cpe-65-28-172-255.wi.res.rr.com] has quit [Quit: WeeChat 0.3.6] 07:08:50 -!- chenbing [~user@60.186.240.190] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 07:13:26 kilon [~kilon@athedsl-398717.home.otenet.gr] has joined #lisp 07:15:39 robde [~robde@p5790309D.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #lisp 07:16:02 -!- ratxue [~chatzilla@host-89-241-166-147.as13285.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 07:16:38 -!- ISF [~ivan@201.82.138.222] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 07:17:37 osa1 [~sinan@78.175.208.221] has joined #lisp 07:23:06 because SICP uses scheme, it should be called SIC? :D 07:25:11 cyrillos [~cyrill@188.134.33.130] has joined #lisp 07:25:58 araujo [~araujo@gentoo/developer/araujo] has joined #lisp 07:27:51 ratxue [~chatzilla@host-89-241-166-147.as13285.net] has joined #lisp 07:28:41 -!- ratxue [~chatzilla@host-89-241-166-147.as13285.net] has quit [Client Quit] 07:28:49 -!- xyxu [~xyxu@218.93.33.34] has left #lisp 07:29:35 -!- anonus [~anonymous@88.80.28.189] has quit [Quit: WeeChat 0.3.6] 07:29:44 ISF [~ivan@201.82.138.222] has joined #lisp 07:29:48 anonus [~anonymous@88.80.28.189] has joined #lisp 07:30:35 ehu` [~ehuels@ip118-64-212-87.adsl2.static.versatel.nl] has joined #lisp 07:30:53 -!- ehu [~ehuels@ip118-64-212-87.adsl2.static.versatel.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 07:31:50 mrSpec [~Spec@unaffiliated/mrspec] has joined #lisp 07:36:02 -!- Vutral [~ss@2a01:198:35a::1] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 07:39:20 -!- situ [~quassel@223.183.183.203] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 07:42:17 -!- csdserver [~csdserver@76.177.111.55] has quit [Quit: ZNC - http://znc.sourceforge.net] 07:42:46 gravicappa [~gravicapp@ppp91-77-162-161.pppoe.mtu-net.ru] has joined #lisp 07:42:47 csdserver [~csdserver@76.177.111.55] has joined #lisp 07:44:27 ddp [~ddp@216.243.111.165] has joined #lisp 07:44:35 -!- ddp [~ddp@216.243.111.165] has quit [Client Quit] 07:44:54 leo2007 [~leo@222.130.130.62] has joined #lisp 07:49:17 Vutral [~ss@vutral.net] has joined #lisp 07:51:20 sdemarre [~serge@91.176.72.179] has joined #lisp 07:51:31 -!- askatasuna [~askatasun@186.22.226.243] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 07:55:25 karswell [~coat@93-97-29-243.zone5.bethere.co.uk] has joined #lisp 08:03:24 -!- kooll [samson_t@sp1.kooll.info] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 08:10:56 -!- _mathrick [~mathrick@85.218.148.156] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 08:11:09 -!- mathrick [~mathrick@85.218.148.156] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 08:11:25 23:58 by skeleton i mean 1) source, make, and include files for the function being written, 2) source and make files for a testbench to test the function, and 3) directory structure for 1) and 2) 08:11:29 exit 08:11:35 -!- yates [~yates@rrcs-97-79-165-138.sw.biz.rr.com] has quit [Quit: rcirc on GNU Emacs 23.3.1] 08:15:19 cl-json converts dictionaries to alists and lists to lists, so I can somehow find a way to distinguish them, any advices? 08:16:05 -!- pinterface [~pinterfac@173-22-6-159.client.mchsi.com] has left #lisp 08:19:27 ThePawnBreak [~quassel@94.177.108.25] has joined #lisp 08:21:36 -!- Cosman246 [~cosman246@c-50-135-152-107.hsd1.wa.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 08:22:11 djancak [djancak@c-71-207-222-31.hsd1.al.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 08:22:36 kilon_alios [~kilon@ppp-94-64-191-223.home.otenet.gr] has joined #lisp 08:22:56 silver [~kingrat@178.121.37.179] has joined #lisp 08:23:17 -!- kilon [~kilon@athedsl-398717.home.otenet.gr] has quit [Ping timeout: 268 seconds] 08:24:14 nachtwandler [~nachtwand@p57AD6354.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #lisp 08:24:35 -!- nachtwandler [~nachtwand@p57AD6354.dip.t-dialin.net] has left #lisp 08:25:08 is there a way to block SBCL's "defined but not used" warnings? 08:25:36 right now I'm putting (declare (ignore ..))s everywhere 08:25:45 but it's already too painful 08:27:43 derekv [~derekv@c-71-238-24-59.hsd1.mi.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 08:28:17 mathrick [~mathrick@2.109.16.92] has joined #lisp 08:28:30 francogrex [~user@109.130.1.48] has joined #lisp 08:29:34 I rebuilt sbcl with :UD2-BREAKPOINTS but still gives "Program received signal SIGSEGV, Segmentation fault" when debugging with gdb! 08:36:48 -!- realitygrill [~realitygr@76.226.139.212] has quit [Quit: realitygrill] 08:37:03 -!- Bike [~Glossina@71-214-104-253.ptld.qwest.net] has quit [Quit: sleep] 08:37:23 osa1: you might find something in sb-ext:muffle-conditions declarations 08:37:32 Kryztof [~user@81.174.155.115] has joined #lisp 08:38:08 but really, unused variables should be quite a temporary condition as you're writing code 08:43:28 can i instead use ldb to be able to debug interaction between sbcl and a shared c library , 08:43:31 ? 08:46:19 -!- Cryotank2011 [~Cryotank2@c-24-17-62-152.hsd1.wa.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: Cryotank2011] 08:46:28  08:46:36 sorry 08:49:55 -!- derrida [~derrida-f@unaffiliated/deleuze] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 08:59:43 ghuntley_ [~ghuntley@14-200-9-232.static.tpgi.com.au] has joined #lisp 09:00:18 mishoo [~mishoo@79.112.117.181] has joined #lisp 09:01:04 -!- ghuntley [~ghuntley@14-200-9-232.static.tpgi.com.au] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 09:02:50 Cosman246 [~cosman246@c-66-235-51-122.sea.wa.customer.broadstripe.net] has joined #lisp 09:02:55 -!- mathrick [~mathrick@2.109.16.92] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 09:03:06 mathrick [~mathrick@2.105.215.48] has joined #lisp 09:03:43 -!- mathrick [~mathrick@2.105.215.48] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 09:04:07 mathrick [~mathrick@2.105.215.48] has joined #lisp 09:04:19 MoALTz [~no@178.182.30.146.nat.umts.dynamic.t-mobile.pl] has joined #lisp 09:06:08 -!- ghuntley_ [~ghuntley@14-200-9-232.static.tpgi.com.au] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 09:06:37 ghuntley [~ghuntley@14-200-9-232.static.tpgi.com.au] has joined #lisp 09:10:23 -!- ghuntley [~ghuntley@14-200-9-232.static.tpgi.com.au] has quit [Client Quit] 09:12:18 xyxu [~xyxu@218.93.33.34] has joined #lisp 09:14:29 -!- Jasko [~tjasko@12.236.109.2] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 09:15:50 -!- Phoodus [~foo@68.107.217.139] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 09:17:35 zmyrgel [~user@hoasb-ff0cdd00-22.dhcp.inet.fi] has joined #lisp 09:17:54 ASau` [~user@95-26-89-223.broadband.corbina.ru] has joined #lisp 09:18:05 -!- MoALTz [~no@178.182.30.146.nat.umts.dynamic.t-mobile.pl] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 09:20:10 okflo [~user@91-115-92-51.adsl.highway.telekom.at] has joined #lisp 09:22:17 schoppenhauer [~christoph@unaffiliated/schoppenhauer] has joined #lisp 09:22:19 -!- ASau [~user@95-27-254-164.broadband.corbina.ru] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 09:25:38 ghuntley [~ghuntley@14-200-9-232.static.tpgi.com.au] has joined #lisp 09:25:40 -!- tensorpudding [~michael@99.148.193.184] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 09:26:30 -!- francogrex [~user@109.130.1.48] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 09:28:03 Neronus: you haven't changed the name in the description on github. 09:28:16 "Shelisp is a very short [...]" 09:32:58 DataLinkDroid [~David@101.161.7.28] has joined #lisp 09:33:51 ISF_ [~ivan@201.82.138.222] has joined #lisp 09:36:21 -!- ISF [~ivan@201.82.138.222] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 09:39:38 -!- adu [~ajr@pool-173-66-11-4.washdc.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Quit: adu] 09:44:36 Jeanne-Kamikaze [~Jeanne-Ka@99.Red-88-11-28.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net] has joined #lisp 09:46:15 -!- ISF_ [~ivan@201.82.138.222] has quit [Quit: WeeChat 0.3.6] 09:46:34 Jasko [~tjasko@12.236.109.2] has joined #lisp 09:46:50 ISF [~ivan@201.82.138.222] has joined #lisp 09:53:58 jtza8 [~jtza8@196-210-142-210.dynamic.isadsl.co.za] has joined #lisp 09:56:20 mathrick_ [~mathrick@2.110.144.39] has joined #lisp 09:57:23 Davidbrcz [~david@proxysup.isae.fr] has joined #lisp 09:57:39 ISF_ec09 [~ivan@201.82.138.222] has joined #lisp 09:58:11 -!- mathrick [~mathrick@2.105.215.48] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 09:58:56 -!- ISF [~ivan@201.82.138.222] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 10:01:06 -!- kilon_alios is now known as kilon 10:02:01 -!- ISF_ec09 [~ivan@201.82.138.222] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 10:04:18 what does type declaration (simple-array (signed-byte 8) (* * * * * ...) mean? 10:04:33 -!- anonus [~anonymous@88.80.28.189] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 10:04:46 I get type conflict between that and (vector (signed-byte 8) 128) 10:05:19 is is that the compiler doesn't know how big array is going to be in the former case? 10:05:28 anonus [~anonymous@88.80.28.189] has joined #lisp 10:10:18 rahulsidhu [~rahulsidh@59.178.148.65] has joined #lisp 10:10:49 lars_t_h [~lars_t_h@002129187223.mbb.telenor.dk] has joined #lisp 10:24:19 ivan-kanis [~user@89.83.137.164] has joined #lisp 10:27:59 daimrod: Good catch, thanks. A little stupid :) 10:28:28 robde_ [~robde@p57903C3F.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #lisp 10:30:19 -!- robde [~robde@p5790309D.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 268 seconds] 10:30:37 mathrick [~mathrick@2.105.254.58] has joined #lisp 10:31:11 -!- mathrick [~mathrick@2.105.254.58] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 10:32:01 -!- mathrick_ [~mathrick@2.110.144.39] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 10:34:28 -!- benny [~benny@i577A1C3A.versanet.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 10:35:13 benny [~benny@i577A1C63.versanet.de] has joined #lisp 10:38:42 -!- gko [~gko@114-34-168-13.HINET-IP.hinet.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 10:38:44 tobben [~trekkspil@c-94-255-146-251.cust.bredband2.com] has joined #lisp 10:41:42 ISF_ec09 [~ivan@201.82.138.222] has joined #lisp 10:44:33 -!- theBlackDragon [~dragon@77.109.98.120] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 10:45:51 theBlackDragon [~dragon@77.109.98.120] has joined #lisp 10:47:14 -!- ISF_ec09 [~ivan@201.82.138.222] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 10:47:38 Athas [~athas@130.225.165.40] has joined #lisp 10:53:48 -!- kilon [~kilon@ppp-94-64-191-223.home.otenet.gr] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 10:57:09 -!- Davidbrcz [~david@proxysup.isae.fr] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 10:57:32 Davidbrcz [~david@proxysup.isae.fr] has joined #lisp 11:00:24 icrazyhack [~horieyui@124.165.209.20] has joined #lisp 11:01:21 horieyui [~horieyui@113.106.212.38] has joined #lisp 11:03:38 daniel_ [~daniel@p5082A60B.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #lisp 11:04:21 mlkith [~redmundia@mail.madito.es] has joined #lisp 11:04:52 hello. do all conditions that throw you to debugger inherit from error? 11:04:53 -!- icrazyhack [~horieyui@124.165.209.20] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 11:05:06 -!- [SLB] [~balthasar@unaffiliated/slabua] has quit [Quit: [ Close the World, Open the nExt ]] 11:05:09 -!- Davidbrcz [~david@proxysup.isae.fr] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 11:05:48 icrazyhack [~horieyui@221.192.139.108] has joined #lisp 11:05:49 -!- horieyui [~horieyui@113.106.212.38] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 11:06:09 -!- daniel__ [~daniel@p5082A2E7.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 11:06:31 mathrick_ [~mathrick@2.105.254.58] has joined #lisp 11:07:05 horieyui [~horieyui@183.60.100.162] has joined #lisp 11:08:35 cheier [~chrish@c-98-251-147-85.hsd1.tn.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 11:08:55 mlkith, you get to debugger when (invoke-debugger ...) is called. Function ERROR calls it if the condition is not handled. 11:10:13 -!- icrazyhack [~horieyui@221.192.139.108] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 11:10:35 so I could still be thrown to debugger if I have something like this? (handler-case (eval (read-from-string string)) (error (err) err)) 11:11:12 icrazyhack [~horieyui@183.60.100.166] has joined #lisp 11:11:24 -!- horieyui [~horieyui@183.60.100.162] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 11:11:47 mlkith, yes. Use "T" as the type specifier to catch all. 11:11:58 horieyui [horieyui@222.47.182.195] has joined #lisp 11:12:07 The symbol T, not string "T", of course. 11:12:17 I used to do that (actually I was catching condition), but then I'll be catching even the warnings and I only want to catch conditions that can invoke debugger 11:14:36 thought just catching error would do that. am I wrong? 11:15:08 Well, SBCL, for example, signals SB-SYS:INTERACTIVE-INTERRUPT when the process is interrupted with Ctrl+C. ERROR is not superclass of that. 11:15:24 I see 11:15:57 -!- icrazyhack [~horieyui@183.60.100.166] has quit [Ping timeout: 268 seconds] 11:16:29 robde [~robde@p579038F0.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #lisp 11:17:17 So, in SBCL you get to debugger if SB-SYS:INTERACTIVE-INTERRUPT is not handled and you press Ctrl+C. 11:17:42 -!- robde_ [~robde@p57903C3F.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 11:18:16 conventionally, things that will cause the debugger to be activated if they're not handled are instances of subclasses of serious-condition 11:18:51 (if your aim is instead to ensure that your deployed application never gets stuck in the debugger, you might choose to disable the debugger instead) 11:18:55 I am writing an irc bot that evaluates lisp expressions. I am more or less doing above, plus doing some more house keeping (like keeping track of * ** etc). is there a better way? 11:20:15 dschoepe [~dschoepe@unaffiliated/dschoepe] has joined #lisp 11:21:26 better than (handler-case (eval (read-from-string string)) .. (error/condition (err) ... )) 11:21:40 well, I hope your external sandboxing is good 11:21:51 -!- cheier [~chrish@c-98-251-147-85.hsd1.tn.comcast.net] has left #lisp 11:21:53 I don't care about security (yet). just want to get it working 11:22:42 ok. Then handling serious-condition is the "normal" way to do this 11:23:24 (the point is that not all conditions that are serious enough to mean the debugger should come in are conceptually `error's -- examples include things like signals from the outside, allocation failures, and the like) 11:24:02 yes, thanks that should work 11:25:33 one more thing. I am handling * ** *** by pushing last 3 commands to a list, and reading the sexp tree from user recursively and replacing each one with appropriate value. I do this before sending the list to eval. is that the right way to do it? 11:26:43 probably not, I am doing hairy things to get it working. for example if last command was a (list 1 2 3), I can't just replace * with it, because then I'll get this (1 2 3) <- trying to call 1 as a function 11:26:43 -!- DataLinkDroid [~David@101.161.7.28] has quit [Quit: Bye] 11:27:25 and if I replace it with (list 1 2 3), then (eq * *) won't work, and it does in the repl 11:27:33 Blkt [~user@82.84.176.4] has joined #lisp 11:28:00 ISF_ec09 [~ivan@201.82.138.222] has joined #lisp 11:28:11 -!- ISF_ec09 [~ivan@201.82.138.222] has quit [Client Quit] 11:28:36 also last value was #, I'll have that inserted in the sexp before sending it to eval, that seems odd as well and might not work everywhere 11:28:45 good day everyone 11:28:46 ISF [~ivan@201.82.138.222] has joined #lisp 11:29:22 am I making any sense, it's been a long night 11:30:28 mlkith: no, that's not how I would do it 11:30:42 how then? 11:30:57 *, ** and *** are special variables, so you can store the previous values, and bind them around the call to eval 11:31:14 oh? 11:31:28 something like (let ((* (first stored-results))) (eval user-input)) 11:31:44 that's much nicer, let me test 11:32:09 there's nothing magical about sbcl's repl, incidentally, it's just Lisp code 11:32:22 have a look at interactive-eval in src/code/toplevel.lisp 11:32:50 thanks I'll take a look 11:33:04 robde_ [~robde@p57903468.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #lisp 11:34:14 -!- okflo [~user@91-115-92-51.adsl.highway.telekom.at] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 11:34:42 -!- robde [~robde@p579038F0.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 11:37:13 ISF_ [~ivan@201.82.138.222] has joined #lisp 11:38:34 gko [~gko@114-34-168-13.HINET-IP.hinet.net] has joined #lisp 11:38:48 -!- zmyrgel [~user@hoasb-ff0cdd00-22.dhcp.inet.fi] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 11:39:26 -!- BlankVerse [~pankajm@202.3.77.219] has quit [Quit: leaving] 11:39:34 BlankVerse [~pankajm@202.3.77.219] has joined #lisp 11:40:07 -!- ISF [~ivan@201.82.138.222] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 11:40:55 -!- jtza8 [~jtza8@196-210-142-210.dynamic.isadsl.co.za] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 11:41:32 jdz [~jdz@host231-104-dynamic.9-87-r.retail.telecomitalia.it] has joined #lisp 11:41:46 -!- ASau` [~user@95-26-89-223.broadband.corbina.ru] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 11:42:18 -!- mathrick_ [~mathrick@2.105.254.58] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 11:42:38 ASau` [~user@95-26-89-223.broadband.corbina.ru] has joined #lisp 11:43:08 -!- BlankVerse [~pankajm@202.3.77.219] has quit [Client Quit] 11:43:15 BlankVerse [~pankajm@202.3.77.219] has joined #lisp 11:45:49 -!- schoppenhauer [~christoph@unaffiliated/schoppenhauer] has quit [Quit: leaving] 11:45:50 -!- BlankVerse [~pankajm@202.3.77.219] has quit [Client Quit] 11:46:47 BlankVerse [~pankajm@202.3.77.219] has joined #lisp 11:47:14 -!- ISF_ [~ivan@201.82.138.222] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 11:48:20 -!- BlankVerse [~pankajm@202.3.77.219] has quit [Client Quit] 11:49:30 one more thing, I'd like to rebind *standard-output* to my stream that sends output to irc. I was trying to do this with trivial-gray-streams but I couldn't get it working. http://paste.lisp.org/display/127059 11:50:03 ISF [~ivan@201.82.138.222] has joined #lisp 11:50:12 I don't know about trivial-gray-streams, sorry. (Looks like it's not completely trivial :) 11:50:27 if my-stream inherits from stream as well as trivial-gray-stream-mixin it works in SBCL and CCL, but not in CLISP. according to documentation though I should just inherit from trivial-gray-stream-mixin 11:50:29 -!- Beetny [~Beetny@ppp118-208-158-199.lns20.bne1.internode.on.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 11:51:00 ok no problem, maybe someone else has used it 11:51:12 guessing here: maybe the trivial mixin defines methods but isn't actually a stream class 11:56:45 yes good guess, there are fundamental-*-stream classes too 11:57:01 mlkith, why not just (let ((*standard-output* some-stream)) ...) ? 11:57:53 dtw I am trying to do that, with some-stream being a custom stream that sends a messages to irc on write 11:58:01 message* 12:04:59 -!- leo2007 [~leo@222.130.130.62] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 12:05:19 naeg [~naeg@194.208.239.170] has joined #lisp 12:06:09 Davidbrcz [~david@proxysup.isae.fr] has joined #lisp 12:07:44 jjkola [~jjkola@xdsl-83-150-83-66.nebulazone.fi] has joined #lisp 12:07:51 inheriting from fundamental-output-stream makes it work on SBCL and CCL, but not on clisp, complains about STREAM-LINE-COLUMN not being defined for my-stream class. I wish there was an example of minimal stream implementation on trivial-gray-stream's page. or if there is I can't find it 12:07:59 mlkith: I would just (send-irc-response (with-output-to-string (*standard-output*) ...)) 12:08:08 mathrick [~mathrick@2.108.154.205] has joined #lisp 12:13:25 BlankVerse [~pankajm@202.3.77.219] has joined #lisp 12:13:47 pjb delay can be annoying sometimes. I am doing this on my private irc server so I am not concerned about flooding. so if I say type (ql:quickload :system) on irc I'd have to wait for entire system to be loaded before getting any output. it works but doesn't feel like I'm typing directly in the repl 12:14:18 mlkith: ok, then you need gray streams all right. 12:15:08 Alternatively, you could fork a working image, and just read from the pipe... 12:15:34 One advantage being that the user doesn't have access to your irc client. 12:15:40 yes true 12:17:48 jsnell: ping 12:24:34 mlkith: I've been working on a virtual-file-system package to be used in a sandbox. Implements filenames, files and streams, entirely independant from the host. Files are stored in the image. 12:25:47 is it possible to make an environment for untrusted code execution in CL? 12:25:56 anonus: theorically. 12:26:14 can you explain in few words how ? 12:26:30 pjb interesting. is your code online somewhere? 12:26:36 anonus: there are several solutions. A Q&D one is to just fork a chroot jail. 12:26:48 %) 12:26:48 mlkith: it'll be soon. 12:26:53 it's not an option 12:27:12 anonus: otherwise, metalinguistically, you can control what's available to the user. 12:27:35 for example i want to forbid user to get local time 12:28:24 and certainly i don't want to invent an byte-code interpreter for it (or use some thing like lua) 12:29:05 in java for example i can make own class-loader for that environment 12:29:35 can i do something similar in cl ? 12:35:47 anonus: you can make your own package (or I haven't understand what you want) 12:36:35 -!- rahulsidhu [~rahulsidh@59.178.148.65] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 12:36:43 daimrod: and how it can forbid code to execute some buitin function like (get-time-of-day) ? 12:38:44 look, i have code that written by potential evildoer, i need to execute it with minimal harm for the system 12:38:47 -!- ivan-kanis [~user@89.83.137.164] has quit [Quit: ERC Version 5.3 (IRC client for Emacs)] 12:39:11 puchacz_ [~puchacz@87-194-5-99.bethere.co.uk] has joined #lisp 12:39:29 (we assume that there is no buffer overflows or similar bugs with break-in possibilities in sbcl) 12:40:49 anonus: don't (:use #:cl) and (:import-from #:cl ..) what you want. 12:41:21 you may also whish to disable the reader macro #. 12:41:54 but evildoer can include that line in his code, isn't he ? 12:44:17 which one ? 12:44:32 (:use #:cl) 12:44:39 nope? 12:45:11 (And any code can use package prefix like "cl:" to refer to CL symbols.) 12:45:53 In the end I think you need a custom language and a custom code parser in order to build a sandbox. 12:46:06 a custom reader maybe. 12:47:05 anonus: have a look at ibcl http://www.informatimago.com/develop/lisp/small-cl-pgms/ibcl/ 12:47:18 custom reader is too dangerous if there is no possibility to forbid calling some functions 12:47:34 You can still (:use "CL") but it will actually use another package :-) 12:48:17 hm 12:48:27 rahulsidhu [~rahulsidh@59.178.38.21] has joined #lisp 12:49:03 pjb: if i leave the eval, it include all the compiler, isn't it ? 12:49:30 and if it include the compiler evildoer can redefine it parts to generate it's own code... 12:52:22 The point of a sandbox, is to let the user generate his own code. 12:52:36 Otherwise you just have a dead application like any other. 12:53:13 add^_ [~add^_^@m212-152-0-180.cust.tele2.se] has joined #lisp 12:54:57 if it can generate it's own assembler code and do a kernel calls (for example for fork or exec) it is not a sandbox it is big wide hole 12:55:14 Can you do that with eval? 12:55:35 i can do this with eval if i can alter the compiler 12:55:39 ISF_ [~ivan@201.82.138.222] has joined #lisp 12:55:46 for example when i define custom VOP 12:56:11 Then don't provide the operator to define custom VOP! Don't be dumb! 12:57:12 I suggest running your sandbox in a virtual machine. 12:57:14 but if all the compiler is included into the image (for make eval work) user can alter its parts (redefine some its function), isn't he ? 12:57:19 in LoL there is `safe-read-from-string` which disables reader-macros and doesn't allow keyword or foreign symbol package. 12:57:31 keywords* .. symbols* 12:58:17 daimrod: you can make an foreign symbol in variable and call it with funcall 12:58:24 -!- rahulsidhu [~rahulsidh@59.178.38.21] has quit [Read error: No route to host] 12:58:29 -!- ISF [~ivan@201.82.138.222] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 12:58:48 rahulsidhu [~rahulsidh@59.178.38.21] has joined #lisp 12:58:55 Just run the user's code in a virtual machine and talk to it with a pipe. 12:59:03 The alternative is to write a compiler for it. 12:59:11 Zhivago: there is the only option ? 12:59:17 (or, I guess, to be optimistic) 12:59:28 anonus: how can you do that if the reader doesn't allow foreign symbol ? 12:59:29 s/there is/is it/ 12:59:29 It doesn't need to be a very interesting compiler. 12:59:40 anonus: how can you modify the compiler, if you don't have a POKE function? 13:00:14 rudi_ [~rudi@cm-84.208.89.228.getinternet.no] has joined #lisp 13:00:22 anonus: remember Matrix, the scene where Agent Smith asks Neo how he could talk if he doesn't have a mouth! 13:00:37 pjb: hm, i think i need rtfm-break to answer this question... 13:00:41 -!- rudi_ is now known as rudi 13:01:07 The point is that you can remove access to the mouth. 13:03:26 pnq [~nick@ACA26921.ipt.aol.com] has joined #lisp 13:05:43 -!- karswell [~coat@93-97-29-243.zone5.bethere.co.uk] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 13:05:56 -!- Davidbrcz [~david@proxysup.isae.fr] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 13:06:17 Davidbrcz [~david@proxysup.isae.fr] has joined #lisp 13:06:35 Yuuhi [benni@p5483B4D1.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #lisp 13:08:38 hakzsam [~hakzsam@aqu33-5-82-245-96-206.fbx.proxad.net] has joined #lisp 13:10:24 -!- ehu` is now known as ehu 13:16:53 mathrick_ [~mathrick@176.20.254.78] has joined #lisp 13:18:56 -!- mathrick [~mathrick@2.108.154.205] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 13:18:58 -!- Athas [~athas@130.225.165.40] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 13:20:16 schoppenhauer [~christoph@unaffiliated/schoppenhauer] has joined #lisp 13:21:19 Jovlang [~user@cm-84.209.27.113.getinternet.no] has joined #lisp 13:22:35 Joreji [~thomas@u-0-025.vpn.RWTH-Aachen.DE] has joined #lisp 13:28:21 -!- Joreji [~thomas@u-0-025.vpn.RWTH-Aachen.DE] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 13:29:13 Joreji [~thomas@u-0-025.vpn.RWTH-Aachen.DE] has joined #lisp 13:31:36 what is hotkey of `eval-defun` in slime? 13:32:28 C-h w eval-defun RET => "nowhere" 13:33:00 But C-M-x is slime-eval-defun 13:33:05 C-c C-e or C-j somtimes 13:33:28 C-M-x. but I usually use C-c-c which is slime-compile-defun (it can give you additional compile warnings etc). 13:33:29 ah slime, not emacs... 13:34:07 -!- jjkola [~jjkola@xdsl-83-150-83-66.nebulazone.fi] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 13:34:22 -!- Joreji [~thomas@u-0-025.vpn.RWTH-Aachen.DE] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 13:34:26 mlkith: thanks C-c-c works. C-M-x doesn't work for me though 13:35:25 Joreji [~thomas@u-0-025.vpn.RWTH-Aachen.DE] has joined #lisp 13:40:29 I don't know why, M-x slime-eval-defun works? 13:40:42 I just always use C-c-c perseonally 13:43:42 -!- mlkith [~redmundia@mail.madito.es] has quit [Quit: Chateando desde http://webchat.redmundial.org] 13:43:48 -!- lars_t_h [~lars_t_h@002129187223.mbb.telenor.dk] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 13:44:23 nialo- [~nialo@64.134.150.0] has joined #lisp 13:44:54 kennyd_ [~kennyd@93-138-36-125.adsl.net.t-com.hr] has joined #lisp 13:44:55 -!- kennyd [~kennyd@93-138-136-31.adsl.net.t-com.hr] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 13:46:04 Guthur [~user@host86-148-29-135.range86-148.btcentralplus.com] has joined #lisp 13:50:24 LiamH [~healy@pool-74-96-10-77.washdc.east.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 13:51:08 fe[nl]ix: are you there? 13:51:11 -!- mathrick_ [~mathrick@176.20.254.78] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 13:52:56 -!- add^_ [~add^_^@m212-152-0-180.cust.tele2.se] has quit [Quit: add^_] 13:53:15 Summoning spirits? 13:54:16 francogrex [~user@109.130.1.48] has joined #lisp 13:54:57 it was worth to give it a try 13:55:25 I built sbcl with ud2-breakpoints feature but still get seg. error when trying to run it from within gdb 13:56:40 what I want is to put a breakpoint on a shraed C library that iscalled from lisp usinf cffi; since I am unable to use gdb, can this be done using sbcl's ldb ? 13:57:55 -!- dschoepe [~dschoepe@unaffiliated/dschoepe] has left #lisp 13:59:35 rme [~rme@50.43.137.115] has joined #lisp 14:02:17 -!- PECCU [~peccu@ZU205111.ppp.dion.ne.jp] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 14:03:24 how do I get the symbol identifying a function from a function object? 14:04:09 smybol-funciton ? 14:04:24 -function* 14:04:46 no 14:04:53 that requires a symbol, I have a function 14:05:04 Blkt, you can't 14:05:17 really? 14:05:35 maybe I can use slot-value... 14:05:42 But if you know a bunch of symbols and a function object you can compare with EQL 14:05:44 but that's horrible 14:05:54 I see 14:05:54 function might not even be represented by a symbol, consider lambda. 14:06:06 -!- Davidbrcz [~david@proxysup.isae.fr] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 14:06:30 Davidbrcz [~david@proxysup.isae.fr] has joined #lisp 14:06:56 Blkt: http://paste.lisp.org/display/123441 14:07:17 thanks pjb 14:09:06 and many simbols might have the same function as the symbol-function 14:09:39 did anyone get closure webbroser to run ? 14:10:02 i couldn't 14:11:34 there was a :pathname (merge-pathname "src/glisp/") (make-pathname :blah nil :blah nil :default *true-name*) or something like that which failed always.. 14:12:30 and a symbol cl-byte-string or so not found in the glisp package which was exported from the package but never defined anywhere..... 14:12:45 it was imported from :glisp-html package which does not exist..... 14:12:58 lol 14:13:03 oh man.... 14:14:23 and i don't now why it requires gsharp anyway..... 14:14:51 having pulled in gsharp breaks sdl somehow... 14:17:29 PECCU [~peccu@ZU207129.ppp.dion.ne.jp] has joined #lisp 14:17:41 mathrick [~mathrick@176.20.191.106] has joined #lisp 14:26:48 -!- mathrick [~mathrick@176.20.191.106] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 14:27:01 hang [~hang@112.152.81.14] has joined #lisp 14:32:14 vantage|home [~vantage@d5152EDDB.static.telenet.be] has joined #lisp 14:35:54 koollman [samson_t@sp1.kooll.info] has joined #lisp 14:38:16 Why can't we annotate old pastes? 14:38:45 tiglog [~topeak@117.79.232.228] has joined #lisp 14:39:43 Blkt: http://paste.lisp.org/display/127074 14:39:50 -!- tiglog [~topeak@117.79.232.228] has quit [Max SendQ exceeded] 14:40:32 tiglog [~topeak@220.181.151.8] has joined #lisp 14:40:58 :D 14:41:32 pjb what is returning names? 14:41:34 let? 14:41:42 dolist 14:42:38 right missed that one 14:49:11 tsuru`` [~charlie@adsl-98-87-44-212.bna.bellsouth.net] has joined #lisp 14:49:23 -!- pchrist [~spirit@gentoo/developer/pchrist] has quit [Quit: leaving] 14:49:44 -!- tsuru` [~charlie@adsl-74-179-196-171.bna.bellsouth.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 14:49:55 pchrist [~spirit@gentoo/developer/pchrist] has joined #lisp 14:50:48 -!- nialo- [~nialo@64.134.150.0] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 14:51:17 leo2007 [~leo@123.123.248.199] has joined #lisp 14:52:22 Blkt: http://paste.lisp.org/display/127074#1 now with support for (setf x). 14:52:33 ddp [~ddp@anon-136-174.relakks.com] has joined #lisp 14:53:07 mathrick [~mathrick@2.109.96.205] has joined #lisp 14:56:24 SurlyFrog [~Adium@66-219-12-202.ip.gvtel.com] has joined #lisp 14:56:36 -!- SurlyFrog [~Adium@66-219-12-202.ip.gvtel.com] has quit [Client Quit] 14:57:19 attila_lendvai [~attila_le@87.247.39.68] has joined #lisp 14:57:33 -!- attila_lendvai [~attila_le@87.247.39.68] has quit [Changing host] 14:57:33 attila_lendvai [~attila_le@unaffiliated/attila-lendvai/x-3126965] has joined #lisp 14:58:53 Kron_ [~Kron@69.166.23.228] has joined #lisp 15:00:56 -!- hang [~hang@112.152.81.14] has quit [Quit: leaving] 15:00:57 -!- attila_lendvai [~attila_le@unaffiliated/attila-lendvai/x-3126965] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 15:01:17 sbcl, gdb , ldb anyone? 15:01:36 _schulte_ [~eschulte@c-174-56-1-147.hsd1.nm.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 15:02:18 attila_lendvai [~attila_le@87.247.39.68] has joined #lisp 15:02:18 -!- attila_lendvai [~attila_le@87.247.39.68] has quit [Changing host] 15:02:18 attila_lendvai [~attila_le@unaffiliated/attila-lendvai/x-3126965] has joined #lisp 15:02:41 nialo- [~nialo@64.134.150.0] has joined #lisp 15:03:35 vantage|2 [~vantage@109.131.0.30] has joined #lisp 15:04:32 -!- prip [~foo@host60-196-dynamic.17-79-r.retail.telecomitalia.it] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 15:04:35 -!- cyrillos [~cyrill@188.134.33.130] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 15:05:44 -!- vantage|home [~vantage@d5152EDDB.static.telenet.be] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 15:06:16 -!- Davidbrcz [~david@proxysup.isae.fr] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 15:06:39 Davidbrcz [~david@proxysup.isae.fr] has joined #lisp 15:06:58 prip [~foo@host60-196-dynamic.17-79-r.retail.telecomitalia.it] has joined #lisp 15:07:11 -!- centipedefarmer [~centipede@75-170-156-239.desm.qwest.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 15:08:13 hasnointentions [~hasnointe@ip72-195-135-173.ri.ri.cox.net] has joined #lisp 15:08:27 vantage|3 [~vantage@d5152EDDB.static.telenet.be] has joined #lisp 15:09:32 -!- chu [~mathew.ba@CPE-124-176-63-146.lns1.dea.bigpond.net.au] has quit [Quit: ERC Version 5.3 (IRC client for Emacs)] 15:10:39 hang [~hang@112.152.81.14] has joined #lisp 15:12:01 -!- vantage|2 [~vantage@109.131.0.30] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 15:12:22 ApeShot [~user@rrcs-24-106-184-123.se.biz.rr.com] has joined #lisp 15:12:55 I've noticed backquote and unquote seem to be handled different on different Common Lisps. 15:13:19 eg: (defvar *comma* (car (car (cdr (cadr (car (cdr '(a `(b ,a))))))))) 15:13:31 Will evaluate to the system symbol for UNQUOTE 15:13:35 on Franz Lisp 15:13:39 But in SBCL it is an error 15:13:48 Seems like backquote/unquote is resolved at read time 15:14:02 It's implementation specified, unfortunately. 15:14:21 Avoid exposing the guts of a backquote. 15:14:26 That is pretty weak 15:14:38 That's the standard, unfortunately. 15:14:43 Oh well 15:14:45 Good to know 15:15:01 Thanks 15:15:44 -!- Nisstyre [~yours@c-208-90-102-250.netflash.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 15:16:37 sharad [~sharad@117.192.241.203] has joined #lisp 15:16:52 cyrillos [~cyrill@swsoft-msk-nat.sw.ru] has joined #lisp 15:21:17 -!- rme [~rme@50.43.137.115] has quit [Quit: rme] 15:21:34 -!- hang [~hang@112.152.81.14] has quit [Quit: leaving] 15:22:35 -!- fantazo [~fantazo@85-127-156-169.dynamic.xdsl-line.inode.at] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 15:23:06 -!- hakzsam [~hakzsam@aqu33-5-82-245-96-206.fbx.proxad.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 15:23:44 -!- xyxu [~xyxu@218.93.33.34] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 15:25:55 Irfan_A [~irfan_afi@180.246.183.235] has joined #lisp 15:26:50 -!- puchacz_ [~puchacz@87-194-5-99.bethere.co.uk] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 15:26:53 -!- mathrick [~mathrick@2.109.96.205] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 15:26:55 -!- billstclair [~billstcla@unaffiliated/billstclair] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 15:28:34 hakzsam [~hakzsam@aqu33-5-82-245-96-206.fbx.proxad.net] has joined #lisp 15:30:31 Ralith: The current HEAD of CL-LLVM is working well for you with 2.9, right? If so, I'm going to branch it, then start modifying master for 3.0. 15:30:33 -!- ISF_ [~ivan@201.82.138.222] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 15:30:53 Nisstyre [~yours@c-208-90-102-250.netflash.net] has joined #lisp 15:33:38 -!- Kryztof [~user@81.174.155.115] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 15:34:07 hang [~hang@112.152.81.14] has joined #lisp 15:38:34 -!- rudi [~rudi@cm-84.208.89.228.getinternet.no] has quit [Quit: Textual IRC Client: http://www.textualapp.com/] 15:41:14 -!- gko [~gko@114-34-168-13.HINET-IP.hinet.net] has quit [] 15:44:53 mathrick [~mathrick@2.110.15.14] has joined #lisp 15:45:20 nachtwandler [~nachtwand@p57AD693E.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #lisp 15:45:28 -!- homie` [~levgue@xdsl-78-35-180-48.netcologne.de] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 15:45:37 billstclair [~billstcla@unaffiliated/billstclair] has joined #lisp 15:46:43 -!- mathrick [~mathrick@2.110.15.14] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 15:46:47 homie` [~levgue@xdsl-78-35-176-85.netcologne.de] has joined #lisp 15:47:21 n1tn4tsn0k [~moo@188.19.232.117] has joined #lisp 15:47:24 -!- Nisstyre [~yours@c-208-90-102-250.netflash.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 15:47:59 mathrick [~mathrick@2.110.15.14] has joined #lisp 15:48:37 -!- mathrick [~mathrick@2.110.15.14] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 15:49:15 -!- sdemarre [~serge@91.176.72.179] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 15:49:43 mathrick [~mathrick@2.110.15.14] has joined #lisp 15:49:44 -!- nialo- [~nialo@64.134.150.0] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 15:51:13 ivan-kanis [~user@89.83.137.164] has joined #lisp 15:52:00 ApeShot: nothing prevents you to define your own reader macro for #\` 15:52:11 -!- nachtwandler [~nachtwand@p57AD693E.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 15:53:04 -!- osa1 [~sinan@78.175.208.221] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 15:54:08 nachtwandler [~nachtwand@p57AD693E.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #lisp 15:55:48 askatasuna [~askatasun@186.22.226.243] has joined #lisp 15:59:55 -!- pnq [~nick@ACA26921.ipt.aol.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 16:02:19 Nisstyre [~yours@c-208-90-102-250.netflash.net] has joined #lisp 16:04:16 -!- mathrick [~mathrick@2.110.15.14] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 16:04:39 -!- francogrex [~user@109.130.1.48] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 16:04:56 mathrick [~mathrick@2.110.15.14] has joined #lisp 16:06:26 -!- Davidbrcz [~david@proxysup.isae.fr] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 16:06:48 Davidbrcz [~david@proxysup.isae.fr] has joined #lisp 16:08:28 pnq [~nick@ACA26A9F.ipt.aol.com] has joined #lisp 16:14:08 am0c [~am0c@124.49.51.146] has joined #lisp 16:16:32 tritchey [~tritchey@12.236.109.2] has joined #lisp 16:16:35 -!- _nix00 [~Adium@114.92.118.90] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 16:17:17 dandellion_yello [~dandellio@87.247.38.128] has joined #lisp 16:17:32 Hello, I am not sure this channel is appropriate or not, but I will try. I am going over SCIP and the chapter about streams. How is this ( http://paste.opensuse.org/45103466 ) supposed to create "fair" pairs. You know, it is the problem where you want to traverse 2d table without repetition. The book claims the code above is legit. But the results it produces are skewed. 16:18:30 -!- Jovlang [~user@cm-84.209.27.113.getinternet.no] has left #lisp 16:20:48 zmyrgel [~user@hoasb-ff0cdd00-22.dhcp.inet.fi] has joined #lisp 16:21:17 -!- zmyrgel [~user@hoasb-ff0cdd00-22.dhcp.inet.fi] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 16:25:23 -!- attila_lendvai [~attila_le@unaffiliated/attila-lendvai/x-3126965] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 16:25:52 -!- Irfan_A [~irfan_afi@180.246.183.235] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 16:27:17 dandellion_yello: try #scheme 16:27:37 Irfan_A [~irfan_afi@180.246.183.235] has joined #lisp 16:27:56 chromaticwt [~user@71-32-106-187.albq.qwest.net] has joined #lisp 16:30:27 -!- Davidbrcz [~david@proxysup.isae.fr] has quit [Ping timeout: 268 seconds] 16:31:45 puchacz [~puchacz@87-194-5-99.bethere.co.uk] has joined #lisp 16:33:13 hi, I have (defun a (&key x y).....) (defun b (&key x y z) (let ((a-result (a :x x :y y)) do-something-with-a-result....) 16:33:43 can I somehow say funcall a with the same keywords? 16:33:49 sacho [~sacho@46.10.23.69] has joined #lisp 16:33:52 to get a-result? 16:37:38 centipedefarmer [~centipede@71-34-161-120.desm.qwest.net] has joined #lisp 16:38:08 hi 16:38:09 Athas [~athas@130.225.165.40] has joined #lisp 16:39:14 puchacz, what does "get a-result" mean? 16:39:38 dtw: (let ((a-result (a :x x :y y)) 16:40:06 but dont worry, I probably cannot use any syntactic sugar here 16:40:18 Well, that a-result is only inside that LET form. 16:40:23 mstevens [~mstevens@fsf/member/pdpc.active.mstevens] has joined #lisp 16:40:26 nw 16:40:44 yoklov [~yoklov@24-177-5-183.dhcp.nwtn.ct.charter.com] has joined #lisp 16:40:45 I did not want to specify keyword arguments for a 16:45:08 attila_lendvai [~attila_le@87.247.39.68] has joined #lisp 16:45:08 -!- attila_lendvai [~attila_le@87.247.39.68] has quit [Changing host] 16:45:08 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[5e36ede3@gateway/web/freenode/ip.94.54.237.227] has joined #lisp 19:14:55 Joreji [~thomas@vpn-eu2.unidsl.de] has joined #lisp 19:15:40 hi, which web framework would you recommend, i mean is there any which is more or less powerful, well documented & maintained? 19:16:06 kenanb: i'd use my own :) but there are many many available 19:16:11 restas seems to be getting some attention lately 19:16:20 many lispers seem to roll their own 19:16:29 -!- mathrick [~mathrick@176.20.50.100] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 19:16:31 madnificent: which one is your own 19:16:46 clayworks is mine, but i don't think anyone else uses it :) 19:17:00 there is documentation about it somewhere though, i think 19:17:02 give me a second 19:18:55 -!- csdserver [~csdserver@76.177.111.55] has quit [Changing host] 19:18:55 csdserver [~csdserver@unaffiliated/csddesk] has joined #lisp 19:20:21 kenanb: http://factory.knowified.com/blogs/clayworks-tutorials start with 5 end with 1 :) 19:21:57 -!- ramus [~ramus@c-50-132-91-53.hsd1.wa.comcast.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 19:22:14 kenanb: aside from that, gigamonkey is working on whistle, which will likely become something nice as well. 19:23:32 thanks madnificent, looking at both, and i'll look for restas as well 19:24:10 kenanb: feel free to ask questions about clayworks if/when you're trying to use it 19:24:41 is a web framework really needed most of the times or do people mostly just use hunchentoot etc directly without a layer 19:24:48 kenanb: also, there are many many others! you should hear more people about it than just me. 19:25:05 francogrex [~user@109.130.1.48] has joined #lisp 19:25:12 kenanb: a web framework generally consists of a bunch of libraries thrown together into a cohesive system 19:25:47 IMHO, these days a web framework does less and less 19:25:48 kenanb: it may be smarter to look at whistle/toot instead of hunchentoot though. it seems the show is moving from the latter to the former two. 19:25:54 ad many parts are irrevelant in Lisp 19:27:06 BlankVerse [~pankajm@202.3.77.219] has joined #lisp 19:27:12 kenanb: you know what, if you're going to try clayworks, give me shout first. i'll see if we can't make the installation simpler than what it's now. the blog still describes the use of clbuild and that's not exactly the way i want it now. 19:28:17 robde [~robde@p579035BE.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #lisp 19:28:22 -!- robde_ [~robde@p5790301F.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 19:28:34 sacho_ [~sacho@46.10.23.69] has joined #lisp 19:29:25 -!- RomyEatsDrupal [~stickycak@cpe-69-203-115-155.nyc.res.rr.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 19:29:45 ok, i feel like skimming docs of some alternatives before picking one but i will definitely ask you about it if i decide to try clayworks 19:30:12 ysph [~user@nmd.sbx09544.opelial.wayport.net] has joined #lisp 19:31:04 -!- sacho [~sacho@46.10.23.69] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 19:31:25 also: ask around, others will want to use something i don't want to sue 19:31:28 s/sue/use/ 19:31:32 hi, i'm attempting to ql:quickload :split-sequence, error is failed to find the TRUENAME of /home/ysph/.sbcl/systems/split-sequence.lisp, any ideas? i've got the latest client afaik 19:31:41 RomyEatsDrupal [~stickycak@cpe-69-203-115-155.nyc.res.rr.com] has joined #lisp 19:32:38 -!- realitygrill [~realitygr@adsl-76-226-139-212.dsl.sfldmi.sbcglobal.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 19:32:57 realitygrill [~realitygr@adsl-76-226-139-212.dsl.sfldmi.sbcglobal.net] has joined #lisp 19:33:18 -!- Joreji [~thomas@vpn-eu2.unidsl.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 19:36:13 -!- jjkola [~jjkola@xdsl-83-150-83-66.nebulazone.fi] has quit [Quit: Lähdössä] 19:37:18 -!- kilon [~kilon@ppp-94-64-188-255.home.otenet.gr] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 19:37:22 ysph: where is your quicklisp installation? 19:37:43 rudi_ [~rudi@cm-84.208.89.228.getinternet.no] has joined #lisp 19:37:55 ysph: is it in ~/quicklisp/ ? 19:38:12 whoops_ [u549@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-ewswyztbzmzmgbci] has joined #lisp 19:38:13 -!- rudi_ is now known as rudi 19:38:42 madnificent: yes 19:38:47 ramus [~ramus@c-50-132-91-53.hsd1.wa.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 19:38:52 -!- kenanb [5e36ede3@gateway/web/freenode/ip.94.54.237.227] has quit [Quit: Page closed] 19:39:18 ysph: what does (ql:where-is-system :split-sequence) return? 19:40:07 ysph: and after what Vivitron` asked, we'll likely want to know if you've set your asdf:*load-path* to something odd 19:40:40 -!- realitygrill [~realitygr@adsl-76-226-139-212.dsl.sfldmi.sbcglobal.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 19:40:59 realitygrill [~realitygr@adsl-76-226-139-212.dsl.sfldmi.sbcglobal.net] has joined #lisp 19:41:05 -!- moah [~gnu@dslb-092-073-069-205.pools.arcor-ip.net] has left #lisp 19:41:11 ysph: make that asdf:*central-registry* (sorry) 19:41:45 #P"/home/ysph/.sbcl/systems/", *central-registry*: (#P"/home/ysph/quicklisp/quicklisp/") 19:42:00 first is output of where-is-system 19:42:48 kilon [~kilon@ppp-94-64-179-174.home.otenet.gr] has joined #lisp 19:42:53 incidentally, when i manually copied v1.0 split-sequence.lisp to .sbcl/systems, it loads without complaint, but perhaps not what should be expected 19:43:08 -!- francogrex [~user@109.130.1.48] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 19:43:19 airolson [~airolson@CPE00222d55a738-CM00222d55a735.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com] has joined #lisp 19:43:56 LiamH [~healy@pool-74-96-10-77.washdc.east.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 19:44:08 realitygrill_ [~realitygr@adsl-76-226-139-212.dsl.sfldmi.sbcglobal.net] has joined #lisp 19:44:14 -!- realitygrill [~realitygr@adsl-76-226-139-212.dsl.sfldmi.sbcglobal.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 19:44:15 -!- realitygrill_ is now known as realitygrill 19:45:40 odd, why does it try to get it from .sbcl/systems ? 19:45:43 if there was no interference from other mechanisms you would expect where-is-system to return something like "~/quicklisp/dists/quicklisp/software/split-sequence-$date" 19:46:15 maybe something in .sbclrc? 19:46:22 yoklov [~yoklov@24-177-5-183.dhcp.nwtn.ct.charter.com] has joined #lisp 19:46:25 mathrick [~mathrick@176.20.50.100] has joined #lisp 19:47:04 I haven't seen the exact behavior you are seeing, but ql will load from places where asdf points it rather than the ql directory, if asdf thinks it knows where a system is 19:47:11 -!- schoppenhauer [~christoph@unaffiliated/schoppenhauer] has quit [Quit: leaving] 19:48:02 -!- mathrick [~mathrick@176.20.50.100] has left #lisp 19:48:11 so should i uninstall through asdf and reinstall from quicklisp? 19:48:58 did you have split-sequence installed in the .sbcl/... when you started your lisp? if so removing that installation and restarting lisp might fix it 19:49:53 that's probably it 19:49:58 also this:(asdf::default-source-registry) 19:49:58 (:SOURCE-REGISTRY (:DIRECTORY #P"/home/ysph/.sbcl/systems/") 19:49:58 (:DIRECTORY #P"/home/ysph/") (:DIRECTORY NIL) (:TREE NIL) (:DIRECTORY NIL) 19:50:01 (:TREE NIL) (:DIRECTORY #P"/usr/share/common-lisp/systems/") 19:50:04 (:TREE #P"/usr/share/common-lisp/source/") (:DIRECTORY NIL) (:TREE NIL) 19:50:07 :INHERIT-CONFIGURATION) 19:51:12 that user/share/common-lisp/systems might be suspect if the restart doesn't fix it 19:51:14 toekutr [~user@50-0-51-2.dsl.static.sonic.net] has joined #lisp 19:52:53 madnificent: do you have a hello world intro without the lisp-newbie details? makes it a bit wordy... 19:53:17 for clayworks i mean 19:53:21 Vivitron`: okay, thanks for your help 19:53:33 osa1 [~sinan@31.140.6.22] has joined #lisp 19:53:55 ysph: np, good luck 19:54:46 Joreji [~thomas@vpn-eu1.unidsl.de] has joined #lisp 19:54:50 -!- Joreji [~thomas@vpn-eu1.unidsl.de] has quit [Client Quit] 19:55:22 -!- Karmaon [~john@gateway/tor-sasl/karmaon] has quit [Quit: WeeChat 0.3.5] 19:59:39 -!- ramkrsna [~ramkrsna@unaffiliated/ramkrsna] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 20:05:45 -!- realitygrill [~realitygr@adsl-76-226-139-212.dsl.sfldmi.sbcglobal.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 20:05:58 realitygrill [~realitygr@adsl-76-226-139-212.dsl.sfldmi.sbcglobal.net] has joined #lisp 20:08:40 pnq [~nick@AC816CC8.ipt.aol.com] has joined #lisp 20:10:55 Davidbrcz [~david@proxysup.isae.fr] has joined #lisp 20:13:50 -!- xan_ [~xan@80.174.78.231.dyn.user.ono.com] has quit [Quit: Lost terminal] 20:13:51 -!- realitygrill [~realitygr@adsl-76-226-139-212.dsl.sfldmi.sbcglobal.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 20:14:04 realitygrill [~realitygr@adsl-76-226-139-212.dsl.sfldmi.sbcglobal.net] has joined #lisp 20:15:58 eMBee: sorry, never got to it, but if you want i can build one 20:16:14 eMBee: at the time i only had people that didn't know lisp available to read it, i guess. 20:16:22 robde_ [~robde@p57903DCC.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #lisp 20:16:36 xan_ [~xan@80.174.78.231.dyn.user.ono.com] has joined #lisp 20:16:49 -!- ysph [~user@nmd.sbx09544.opelial.wayport.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 20:17:12 pjb- [~t@81.202.16.46.dyn.user.ono.com] has joined #lisp 20:17:13 eMBee: in the meanwhile, blogworks may give you some insights 20:17:45 eMBee: github.com/madnificent/blogworks 20:17:58 -!- robde [~robde@p579035BE.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 20:19:07 -!- whoops_ [u549@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-ewswyztbzmzmgbci] has quit [] 20:21:54 whoops_ [u549@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-wafbbuxsnijoxkdv] has joined #lisp 20:23:04 -!- whoops_ is now known as whoops 20:23:06 madnificent: don't worry, it's ok, i was just a bit surprised... 20:24:07 -!- pjb- [~t@81.202.16.46.dyn.user.ono.com] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 20:26:07 pjb- [~t@81.202.16.46.dyn.user.ono.com] has joined #lisp 20:27:07 -!- realitygrill [~realitygr@adsl-76-226-139-212.dsl.sfldmi.sbcglobal.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 20:27:30 realitygrill [~realitygr@adsl-76-226-139-212.dsl.sfldmi.sbcglobal.net] has joined #lisp 20:27:32 one question: how does clayworks hook into hunchentoot (or vice versa) in the hello world example you set up the index, and then just start hunchentoot. how does hunchentoot know what to call for an incoming request? is there a default handler or something? 20:28:02 -!- xan_ [~xan@80.174.78.231.dyn.user.ono.com] has quit [Quit: Lost terminal] 20:29:58 eMBee: clayworks registers a handler and starts routing from there on. see the call to set-routing-table in pages.lisp 20:30:00 sixpoint8 [~jaykub@ip68-12-204-131.ok.ok.cox.net] has joined #lisp 20:33:19 kaol [kaol@piperka.net] has joined #lisp 20:34:18 -!- kaol [kaol@piperka.net] has left #lisp 20:36:58 -!- Yuuhi [benni@p5483B4D1.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Quit: ERC Version 5.3 (IRC client for Emacs)] 20:44:14 mathrick_ [~mathrick@0x55816132.terminal.tdcmobil.dk] has joined #lisp 20:44:40 ah, cl-aymore/routing.lisp ties it together... 20:46:55 well, that's enough for some bedtime reading. thanks and good night 20:48:26 -!- yoklov [~yoklov@24-177-5-183.dhcp.nwtn.ct.charter.com] has quit [Quit: computer sleeping] 20:49:15 -!- robde_ [~robde@p57903DCC.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 20:49:39 Frozenlock [~user@cable-quebec-15.246.173-179.electronicbox.net] has joined #lisp 20:50:31 I'm stuck with an error when trying to load climacs: @293>: there is no character with name "DELETE" 20:50:41 Is there a simple solution for this? 20:51:17 does anyone know a yaml parser for cl? 20:52:34 -!- naeg [~naeg@194.208.239.170] has quit [Quit: WeeChat 0.3.6] 20:54:30 yoklov [~yoklov@24-177-5-183.dhcp.nwtn.ct.charter.com] has joined #lisp 20:54:35 -!- sdemarre [~serge@91.176.72.179] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 20:55:14 -!- Buglouse [~Buglouse@cpe-65-28-172-255.wi.res.rr.com] has quit [Quit: WeeChat 0.3.6] 21:01:43 -!- ThePawnBreak [~quassel@94.177.108.25] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 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[~david@proxysup.isae.fr] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 22:10:59 thekilon [~kilon@ppp-94-64-179-174.home.otenet.gr] has joined #lisp 22:11:13 Davidbrcz [~david@proxysup.isae.fr] has joined #lisp 22:11:24 -!- thekilon [~kilon@ppp-94-64-179-174.home.otenet.gr] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 22:12:38 galdor [galdor@def92-10-88-162-192-107.fbx.proxad.net] has joined #lisp 22:13:18 -!- kilon [~kilon@ppp-94-64-179-174.home.otenet.gr] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 22:15:45 to use dbus:system-server-addresses, what should i do differently from using session-server-addresses? following the notify example, i get "No more mechanisms to try." with the system bus, but the session bus works fine 22:18:16 -!- pnq [~nick@AC816CC8.ipt.aol.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 268 seconds] 22:18:58 -!- realitygrill [~realitygr@adsl-76-226-139-212.dsl.sfldmi.sbcglobal.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 22:19:09 realitygrill [~realitygr@adsl-76-226-139-212.dsl.sfldmi.sbcglobal.net] has joined #lisp 22:21:57 -!- rudi [~rudi@cm-84.208.89.228.getinternet.no] has quit [Quit: Textual IRC Client: http://www.textualapp.com/] 22:25:14 ltriant [~ltriant@lithium.mailguard.com.au] has joined #lisp 22:26:33 phax [~phax@cpc14-haye17-2-0-cust110.haye.cable.virginmedia.com] has joined #lisp 22:26:33 -!- phax [~phax@cpc14-haye17-2-0-cust110.haye.cable.virginmedia.com] has quit [Changing host] 22:26:33 phax [~phax@unaffiliated/phax] has joined #lisp 22:27:41 Harag [~phil@dsl-243-0-18.telkomadsl.co.za] has joined #lisp 22:28:28 -!- mensch [~mensch@c-174-62-210-182.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: leaving] 22:30:37 pnq [~nick@AC814311.ipt.aol.com] has joined #lisp 22:32:07 chu [~mathew.ba@CPE-124-176-63-146.lns1.dea.bigpond.net.au] has joined #lisp 22:32:56 -!- mathrick_ [~mathrick@0x55816132.terminal.tdcmobil.dk] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 22:33:53 -!- brendyn [~brendyn@123-2-73-61.static.dsl.dodo.com.au] has 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vantage|home [~vantage@d5152EDDB.static.telenet.be] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 22:48:13 djuber [~djuber@c-76-16-60-176.hsd1.il.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 22:49:08 -!- lnostdal_ [~lnostdal@224.Red-88-23-183.staticIP.rima-tde.net] has quit [Read error: No route to host] 22:49:08 lnostdal__ [~lnostdal@224.Red-88-23-183.staticIP.rima-tde.net] has joined #lisp 22:54:38 -!- cyrillos [~cyrill@swsoft-msk-nat.sw.ru] has quit [Ping timeout: 268 seconds] 22:57:50 zmv [~zmv@186.204.151.21] has joined #lisp 22:59:41 Buglouse [~Buglouse@cpe-65-28-172-255.wi.res.rr.com] has joined #lisp 22:59:44 mathrick [~mathrick@2.108.229.240] has joined #lisp 23:01:48 How does defmethod know that the next argument is a specialized-lambda-list and not another qualifier? 23:02:34 mathrick_ [~mathrick@2.108.229.240] has joined #lisp 23:02:59 Karmaon [~john@gateway/tor-sasl/karmaon] has joined #lisp 23:03:52 e.g. look at the next-to-last examaple on define-method-combination clhs page. 23:04:41 -!- orangejuice [~orangejui@66.96.251.117] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 23:05:28 orangejuice [~orangejui@66.96.251.117] has joined #lisp 23:06:01 -!- mathrick [~mathrick@2.108.229.240] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 23:06:15 -!- fiveop [~fiveop@dslb-178-002-115-194.pools.arcor-ip.net] has quit [Quit: humhum] 23:06:19 hi, can I undefine class like I can fmakunbound a function? 23:06:48 another defclass does not work, because I change metaclass 23:07:10 -!- jdz [~jdz@host231-104-dynamic.9-87-r.retail.telecomitalia.it] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 23:08:04 -!- mathrick_ [~mathrick@2.108.229.240] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 23:08:42 mathrick [~mathrick@2.106.41.82] has joined #lisp 23:09:19 Looks like it's a bad time to ask questions. :) 23:10:43 nw, I restarted lisp 23:11:26 -!- realitygrill [~realitygr@adsl-76-226-139-212.dsl.sfldmi.sbcglobal.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 23:11:40 realitygrill [~realitygr@adsl-76-226-139-212.dsl.sfldmi.sbcglobal.net] has joined #lisp 23:14:39 -!- toekutr [~user@50-0-51-2.dsl.static.sonic.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 23:18:21 puchacz: you can unintern the class name. 23:18:41 Joreji [~thomas@u-0-018.vpn.RWTH-Aachen.DE] has joined #lisp 23:19:02 naryl: What predicate could differenciate ((self my-class)) from :add ? 23:19:10 naryl: read clhs defmethod 23:19:11 -!- Jeanne-Kamikaze [~Jeanne-Ka@99.Red-88-11-28.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net] has quit [Quit: Did you hear that ?] 23:19:42 -!- Kenjin [~josesanto@2.80.225.246] has quit [Quit: Computer has gone to sleep] 23:20:20 -!- davazp [~user@89.100.226.133] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 23:20:34 pjb: thx 23:21:12 gouslar [~gouslar@217-12-67-3.sibtele.com] has joined #lisp 23:21:35 pjb: But what if I try to make my method-combination get a list of lists as a qualifier? 23:22:10 naryl: you cannot. 23:22:18 naryl: why didn't you read clhs defmethod? 23:22:35 It's written explicitely: method-qualifier::= non-list 23:22:35 23:22:39 list is an object too. clhs cays that each qualifier is an object. 23:22:41 puchacz: you probably want to remove stale methods (ppl hit that pretty often) 23:22:41 So you cannot use a list as method-qualifier. 23:22:54 clhs says that each qualifier is NOT a list! 23:22:59 -_- 23:23:04 pjb: ok, thanks. 23:23:07 puchacz: easiest way is in REPL put #'generic-function-name, then inspect it, and there will be "remove" button next to each method 23:23:39 maxm-: well, stale methods uninterned classes shouldn't be too big a problem. That can wait the next restart. 23:23:52 McMAGIC-1Copy [~McMAGIC--@gateway/tor-sasl/mcmagic--copy] has joined #lisp 23:24:04 -!- McMAGIC--Copy [~McMAGIC--@gateway/tor-sasl/mcmagic--copy] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 23:25:02 well I used to hit this pretty often when refactoring, until I learned the above trick Ie somehow its un-intuitive that when you edit the method qualifiers, then re-evaluate the defmethod, the old one is still there 23:25:20 naryl: this is often the case that we have some kind of ad-hoc parsing based on the type of the parsed objects like that. It still beats syntax. 23:27:13 np 23:27:21 overwhelmed.... 23:29:18 I need a method-combination which allows registering e.g. a few :around methods like (defmethod st-cost 'no-fine-manipulators :around (...)...). Was doing some research on method-combinations and got puzzled with this. :) 23:29:37 That is I don't actually need a list there. 23:30:09 -!- pnq [~nick@AC814311.ipt.aol.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 23:31:29 What is ubuntu package sbcl-fasl-loader-78 ? 23:31:34 What is it for? 23:31:57 pnq [~nick@ACA21107.ipt.aol.com] has joined #lisp 23:33:29 I'm a newcomer 23:34:36 -!- ddp [~ddp@anon-136-174.relakks.com] has quit [Quit: ddp] 23:34:55 gouslar: I recommend avoiding ubuntu packages. At most install SBCL from it, for everything else you have Quicklisp 23:35:32 -!- centipedefarmer [~centipede@71-34-161-120.desm.qwest.net] has quit [Quit: This computer has gone to sleep] 23:35:53 p_l|brage, has Quicklisp ported to MS Windows? Does it have multithreading on all platforms? 23:35:59 xyxu [~xyxu@218.93.33.34] has joined #lisp 23:36:00 +been 23:36:20 Quicklisp is a package manager. http://quicklisp.org 23:36:28 ddp [~ddp@216.243.111.165] has joined #lisp 23:36:38 It's not an implementation. And it should work on Windows. 23:36:53 centipedefarmer [~centipede@71-34-161-120.desm.qwest.net] has joined #lisp 23:37:47 gouslar: you load quicklisp into your implementation, then use it to download libraries :) 23:38:03 -!- JuniorRoy1 [~juniorroy@212.36.228.103] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 23:39:05 -!- ddp [~ddp@216.243.111.165] has quit [Client Quit] 23:39:08 -!- Kron_ [~Kron@69.166.23.228] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 23:40:07 Fine. 23:40:18 mathrick_ [~mathrick@2.105.206.50] has joined #lisp 23:42:34 clarke2 [~clarke4@109.78.99.113] has joined #lisp 23:43:34 -!- mathrick [~mathrick@2.106.41.82] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 23:43:42 sellout: I'm actually running it with the 3.0 library without any bugs yet, though I've only put it to light use so far 23:43:51 -!- clarke2 [~clarke4@109.78.99.113] has quit [Client Quit] 23:45:50 -!- phax [~phax@unaffiliated/phax] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 23:47:29 naryl: if you don't need a list there, why do you put one? 23:47:36 'no-fine-manipulators is a list!!! 23:48:00 What does QUOTE mean as a method qualifier anyways? 23:52:44 Athas [~athas@130.225.165.40] has joined #lisp 23:55:18 -!- lusory [~bart@bb115-66-195-54.singnet.com.sg] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 23:56:42 -!- mathrick_ [~mathrick@2.105.206.50] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 23:57:03 -!- LiamH [~healy@pool-74-96-10-77.washdc.east.verizon.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 23:57:26 mathrick_ [~mathrick@2.105.206.50] has joined #lisp 23:57:33 LiamH [~healy@pool-74-96-10-77.washdc.east.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 23:57:44 -!- airolson [~airolson@CPE00222d55a738-CM00222d55a735.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com] has quit [] 23:57:49 -!- LiamH [~healy@pool-74-96-10-77.washdc.east.verizon.net] has quit [Client Quit]