00:02:10 -!- blackwolf [~blackwolf@ool-43568cfa.dyn.optonline.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 00:02:24 kloeri [~kloeri@freenode/staff/exherbo.kloeri] has joined #lisp 00:02:26 kleppari_ [~spa@bitbucket.is] has joined #lisp 00:04:26 -!- kleppari [~spa@bitbucket.is] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 00:05:19 oconnore [~Eric@c-66-31-125-56.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 00:05:47 -!- leo2007 [~leo@123.123.252.233] has quit [Quit: rcirc on GNU Emacs 23.3.50.1] 00:07:29 -!- setmeaway2 [setmeaway3@118.45.149.199] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 00:07:52 setmeaway2 [setmeaway3@118.45.149.199] has joined #lisp 00:10:34 -!- Guthur [~user@212.183.128.43] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 00:12:35 didi: i use different things depending on what info i need. lately i use stp. 00:15:08 Guthur [~user@212.183.128.43] has joined #lisp 00:15:11 -!- pnq [~nick@AC82DCDB.ipt.aol.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 00:18:23 -!- Euthy [~euthy@unaffiliated/euthydemus] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 00:18:58 Euthy [~euthy@unaffiliated/euthydemus] has joined #lisp 00:19:45 elderK [~k@pdpc/supporter/active/elderk] has joined #lisp 00:20:31 Ello 00:20:42 Any chance there's someone in here who knows much about lisp implementation? 00:20:56 At least, in regards to the macro expansion phase, how the system handles reader macros for example. 00:21:01 elderK: Common Lisp, probably. 00:21:41 It's all handy. 00:21:51 I'm building a scheme compiler but I'd like to bring over the reader macro coolness :) 00:21:56 thing that gets me, you see, 00:22:06 elderK: reader macros are pretty straightforward. the system has a table that maps each character to what it should do when that character is seen. 00:22:26 -!- Sysop_fb [~bleh@108-66-160-34.lightspeed.spfdmo.sbcglobal.net] has quit [] 00:22:27 is that there's a lexer to translate the input characters into stuff the interpreter or whatever can use to parse. Then it has to understand the parse then evaluate. 00:22:44 but, if we can redefine what happens, what a symbol represents (a character) while we're reading, 00:22:52 then we have to be able to alter what we do, how the parser parses it, no? 00:22:55 No lexer in CL, the reader is given the stream and constructs objects. 00:23:02 xyxu [~xyxu@58.41.14.46] has joined #lisp 00:23:13 it still has to understand what the characters are, a way to parse strings and the like? 00:23:18 ie, to understand that ( is open list. 00:23:23 loderunner [~loderunne@adsl-074-229-197-048.sip.mco.bellsouth.net] has joined #lisp 00:23:33 elderK: No. There's a table that says "map ( to the start-reading-a-list function" 00:23:43 elderK: same with ", or a digit, etc 00:23:45 alrighty, cool. 00:24:03 in the case of adding new macros, reader macros, 00:24:12 I figured you'd read in the definition for the new reader function, 00:24:20 evaluate it (create the new function, etc, snap it into the table) 00:24:26 then use that new code you generated and linked into the table, 00:24:34 to read instances where that macro occurs in the sourcE? 00:25:06 with common lisp, adding to that table is just like calling a function. it's only slightly more abstract than setting an entry in a hash table. 00:25:38 would you mind elaborating on that a little? 00:25:40 not even "just like". it *is* calling a function: (set-macro-character char function) 00:25:42 and thanks, btw, for helping me out here. 00:25:48 aye 00:25:52 then when the reader sees char next, it calls function. 00:26:02 but for the machine to use that function you add, would that function not have to be compiled? 00:26:06 or would it just interpret it? 00:26:20 elderK: it doesn't matter much in CL. it could be either. 00:26:30 "the machine" is the reader. 00:26:45 the reader is a normal function like any other. 00:26:59 aye 00:27:08 something like SBCL would compile, right? 00:27:15 even CLISP would probably compile to bytecode then execute 00:27:16 yes, usually. 00:27:35 As for just mapping into a table, 00:27:39 like ( -> read-list-function 00:28:01 that function would use the reader too 00:28:03 recursively like 00:28:09 so it could read digits, strings, etc, right? 00:28:10 yes. 00:28:26 like a thousand little sublexers :P 00:28:30 we get a digit 00:28:44 read all digits we encounter until we hit something else, and detrmine whether it's now an identifier 00:28:49 or it's some float number or fixnum 00:28:50 ro something 00:28:52 elderK: the reader reads a form entirely before evaluating it (exceptions for things like #.) 00:28:55 then one that would handle strings, right? 00:29:21 elderK: yes. the CL spec *does* talk about the interpretation of tokens as either numbers or symbols. 00:29:31 *Xach* checks the index 00:29:52 see http://l1sp.org/cl/2 00:29:55 -!- Guthur [~user@212.183.128.43] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 00:30:16 aye 00:30:28 the papers I've read at least, on the Orbitz compiler and such, 00:30:38 describe in a vague way "table based compilers" for lisp, 00:30:46 which make me think of say, DFAs and such being used for the input handling 00:31:07 compiling is defined on objects, not on the character syntax. 00:31:09 but in a sense, the "macro table" is just a switch table anyhow. 00:31:12 aye 00:31:13 the reader's job is to create the objects. 00:31:16 aye 00:31:40 -!- Euthy [~euthy@unaffiliated/euthydemus] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 00:32:10 -!- duomo [~duomo@cpe-69-204-169-245.nycap.res.rr.com] has quit [Quit: Linkinus - http://linkinus.com] 00:32:30 it's just, 00:32:34 say reading a number 00:32:39 +1234.12e-4 00:32:40 say 00:32:54 that's easily read by a regular expression or soem kind of DFA 00:33:01 knowing when to accept and suchlike. 00:33:02 -!- nepnux is now known as wildnux 00:33:25 ? 00:35:08 https://github.com/sbcl/sbcl/blob/805f1dda16b90116e3eacc8dba62c34f30ed0838/src/code/reader.lisp#L907 00:35:30 that's how SBCL does it. 00:35:34 Jasko3 [~tjasko@209.74.44.225] has joined #lisp 00:37:16 njw222 [~njw222@ool-44c70a5c.dyn.optonline.net] has joined #lisp 00:38:33 -!- Jasko [~tjasko@c-174-59-204-245.hsd1.pa.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 00:39:37 thank you 00:42:26 Euthy [~euthy@unaffiliated/euthydemus] has joined #lisp 00:47:49 -!- airolson [~airolson@CPE00222d55a738-CM00222d55a735.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com] has quit [] 00:50:55 -!- Euthy [~euthy@unaffiliated/euthydemus] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 00:51:27 Xach: in zs3's xml-binding thingy, do you really intend to create the binder every time the binder function is called? I'd think you want to create the binder once and return a closure calling it when passed a source 00:52:17 -!- njw222 [~njw222@ool-44c70a5c.dyn.optonline.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 00:53:03 adeht: I don't remember, I'll review. 00:53:20 njw222 [~njw222@ool-44c70a5c.dyn.optonline.net] has joined #lisp 00:54:31 adeht: which binder function is called? 00:55:07 adeht: anyway, the intend is to compile the matcher in advance. 00:55:12 intent, rather. 00:55:35 -!- njw222 [~njw222@ool-44c70a5c.dyn.optonline.net] has quit [Client Quit] 00:55:40 Xach: in make-binder you have a (let ((binder ...)) ...).. you might want to pull the first binding in that let out of the lambda 00:55:51 njw222 [~njw222@ool-44c70a5c.dyn.optonline.net] has joined #lisp 00:56:34 thanks, will do. 00:56:47 -!- njw222 [~njw222@ool-44c70a5c.dyn.optonline.net] has quit [Client Quit] 00:57:06 njw222 [~njw222@ool-44c70a5c.dyn.optonline.net] has joined #lisp 01:00:10 -!- Amyn [~abennama@m328eth.crans.org] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 01:01:30 __class__ [~class@99-105-56-217.lightspeed.sntcca.sbcglobal.net] has joined #lisp 01:03:16 dnolen [~davidnole@cpe-98-14-92-234.nyc.res.rr.com] has joined #lisp 01:04:01 -!- manuel_ [~manuel_@p57921A69.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Quit: manuel_] 01:05:44 replore [~replore@203.152.213.161.static.zoot.jp] has joined #lisp 01:11:49 Euthy [~euthy@unaffiliated/euthydemus] has joined #lisp 01:11:54 tsanhwa [~user@2001:da8:8001:240:222:68ff:fe14:6de] has joined #lisp 01:13:02 adeht: How'd you notice it? Just browsing? Or did it cause a problem? 01:13:09 -!- vjacob [~vjacob@78-105-184-157.zone3.bethere.co.uk] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 01:13:29 adeht: for me, everything AWS is so network-bound I don't know if I'd see it from performance... 01:17:41 neoesque [~neoesque@210.59.147.232] has joined #lisp 01:20:06 Xach: just browsing 01:20:24 -!- triliyn [~desmond@76-206-56-151.lightspeed.irvnca.sbcglobal.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 01:21:19 triliyn [~desmond@76-206-56-151.lightspeed.irvnca.sbcglobal.net] has joined #lisp 01:21:53 -!- Euthy [~euthy@unaffiliated/euthydemus] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 01:22:13 ricky_ [~ricky@8.10.7.194] has joined #lisp 01:23:26 -!- Yuuhi` [benni@p5483AF76.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Quit: ERC Version 5.3 (IRC client for Emacs)] 01:24:25 -!- ricky_ [~ricky@8.10.7.194] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 01:24:33 -!- wildnux [~wildnux@pool-71-96-211-239.dfw.dsl-w.verizon.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 01:26:50 Joreji [~thomas@vpn-ho1.unidsl.de] has joined #lisp 01:27:14 -!- Joreji [~thomas@vpn-ho1.unidsl.de] has quit [Client Quit] 01:27:47 Joreji [~thomas@vpn-ho1.unidsl.de] has joined #lisp 01:27:48 Euthy [~euthy@unaffiliated/euthydemus] has joined #lisp 01:29:01 -!- eMBee [~eMBee@foresight/developer/pike/programmer] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 01:30:00 *Xach* wishes he had more time to add new S3 features to ZS3 01:31:08 hba [~hba@189.229.191.31] has joined #lisp 01:32:19 eMBee [~eMBee@foresight/developer/pike/programmer] has joined #lisp 01:32:19 -!- dnolen [~davidnole@cpe-98-14-92-234.nyc.res.rr.com] has quit [Quit: dnolen] 01:32:28 -!- Joreji [~thomas@vpn-ho1.unidsl.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 01:34:09 -!- Euthy [~euthy@unaffiliated/euthydemus] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 01:37:58 Xach: hehe.. I don't even deal with S3.. but I like to read Lisp code. the xml-binding code is interesting and may be useful outside of zs3 context.. reminded me of your date parsing code somewhere (Naggum archive code?) 01:38:13 -!- ISF_ [~ivan@187.106.48.51] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 01:38:13 -!- ISF [~ivan@187.106.48.51] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 01:39:01 heh 01:40:16 the naggum archive processing was a case of analyzing the data to write the least amount of code that would process the data...fun, fortunately didn't have to be general 01:40:42 *Xach* must revisit and make sure it works ok for kmp and rpw 01:40:59 Xach: I've seen it done in a lot of other contexts (but similar circumstances wrt preprocessing costs) 01:41:28 pkhuong: it? 01:43:54 -!- otakutomo [~otakutomo@KD027083117212.ppp-bb.dion.ne.jp] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 01:44:08 otakutomo [~otakutomo@KD027083117212.ppp-bb.dion.ne.jp] has joined #lisp 01:45:43 the bitvector indices thing. 01:45:55 oh wait, date parsing. 01:46:30 yeah. i took every date header in the archive and found something like 20 different styles that had to be parsed. 01:46:54 dispatched on pattern length, i think - would break on ambiguity, but there didn't turn out to be any. 01:50:30 waveman_ [~tim@124.170.43.134] has joined #lisp 01:53:16 totzeit [~kirkwood@c-24-17-10-251.hsd1.wa.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 01:53:27 -!- rtoym [~chatzilla@c-67-180-54-112.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 01:55:18 Euthy [~euthy@unaffiliated/euthydemus] has joined #lisp 01:59:30 This Lisp thing is too awesome. 01:59:40 -!- wanderingelf [4817e03d@gateway/web/freenode/ip.72.23.224.61] has quit [Quit: Page closed] 02:00:16 rtoym [~chatzilla@c-67-180-54-112.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 02:01:28 -!- otakutomo [~otakutomo@KD027083117212.ppp-bb.dion.ne.jp] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 02:01:38 otakutomo [~otakutomo@KD027083117212.ppp-bb.dion.ne.jp] has joined #lisp 02:02:07 -!- Euthy [~euthy@unaffiliated/euthydemus] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 02:05:41 -!- Phoodus [~foo@ip72-223-116-248.ph.ph.cox.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 02:09:25 -!- __main__ [~main@adsl-99-173-15-158.dsl.pltn13.sbcglobal.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 02:09:58 -!- kennyd [~kennyd@93-138-56-182.adsl.net.t-com.hr] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 02:10:30 __main__ [~main@adsl-99-173-15-158.dsl.pltn13.sbcglobal.net] has joined #lisp 02:10:34 -!- venk [~user@r49-2-6-166.cpe.vividwireless.net.au] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 02:14:07 dnolen [~davidnole@cpe-98-14-92-234.nyc.res.rr.com] has joined #lisp 02:15:02 kennyd [~kennyd@93-138-56-182.adsl.net.t-com.hr] has joined #lisp 02:17:01 -!- foocraft [foocraft@ibawizard.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 02:17:39 Euthy [~euthy@unaffiliated/euthydemus] has joined #lisp 02:17:47 foocraft [foocraft@ibawizard.net] has joined #lisp 02:22:18 -!- easyE [YxGwlchrx3@panix2.panix.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 02:22:49 The language ceases to be a constraint on your programming. No more excuses. 02:23:01 -!- Euthy [~euthy@unaffiliated/euthydemus] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 02:23:29 -!- dnolen [~davidnole@cpe-98-14-92-234.nyc.res.rr.com] has quit [Quit: dnolen] 02:26:29 -!- bzzbzz [~franco@modemcable240.34-83-70.mc.videotron.ca] has quit [Quit: leaving] 02:27:03 -!- totzeit [~kirkwood@c-24-17-10-251.hsd1.wa.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 02:27:33 -!- rtoym [~chatzilla@c-67-180-54-112.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 02:32:26 alkoma [~alkoma@c-67-160-207-86.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 02:32:26 -!- pnathan [~Adium@76.178.165.160] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 02:33:00 -!- alkoma [~alkoma@c-67-160-207-86.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has quit [Client Quit] 02:34:15 rtoym [~chatzilla@c-67-180-54-112.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 02:35:07 pnathan [~Adium@76.178.165.160] has joined #lisp 02:37:20 Hey folks. Is there a slime command for running asdf:test-op? 02:40:51 jleija [~jleija@50.8.10.126] has joined #lisp 02:41:17 -!- jleija [~jleija@50.8.10.126] has quit [Client Quit] 02:41:24 jleija [~jleija@50.8.10.126] has joined #lisp 02:41:38 slime-repl-test-system, got it. 02:43:38 am0c [~am0c@112.149.169.23] has joined #lisp 02:46:36 -!- ramus [~ramus@c-50-132-91-53.hsd1.wa.comcast.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 02:47:11 superflit_ [~superflit@71-208-200-190.hlrn.qwest.net] has joined #lisp 02:47:48 -!- superflit [~superflit@71-208-200-190.hlrn.qwest.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 02:47:48 -!- superflit_ is now known as superflit 02:57:36 ramus [~ramus@c-50-132-91-53.hsd1.wa.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 03:01:48 -!- Vutral [~ss@vutral.net] has quit [Quit: Life is too short] 03:02:41 -!- mjonsson [~mjonsson@38.109.95.133] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 03:04:36 -!- el-maxo [~max@p5DE8D57F.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 03:06:09 el-maxo [~max@p5DE8D31D.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #lisp 03:10:11 Vutral [~ss@vutral.net] has joined #lisp 03:10:18 -!- pnathan [~Adium@76.178.165.160] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 03:10:25 pnathan [~Adium@76.178.165.160] has joined #lisp 03:11:21 -!- gaidal_ [~gaidal@59.41.115.14] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 03:11:49 -!- Amadiro [~Amadiro@ti0021a380-dhcp3462.bb.online.no] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 03:12:04 -!- Vutral [~ss@vutral.net] has quit [Max SendQ exceeded] 03:12:19 gaidal_ [~gaidal@59.41.115.14] has joined #lisp 03:12:21 -!- gffa [~gffa@unaffiliated/gffa] has quit [Quit: sleep] 03:13:50 Vutral [~ss@vutral.net] has joined #lisp 03:17:03 -!- coyo [kvirc@unaffiliated/bandu] has quit [Quit: I need my meds... >.<] 03:19:05 Euthy [~euthy@unaffiliated/euthydemus] has joined #lisp 03:20:16 -!- elderK [~k@pdpc/supporter/active/elderk] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 03:28:31 -!- Euthy [~euthy@unaffiliated/euthydemus] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 03:28:56 katesmith_ [~katesmith@75-138-199-162.static.snfr.nc.charter.com] has joined #lisp 03:28:56 -!- katesmith_ [~katesmith@75-138-199-162.static.snfr.nc.charter.com] has quit [Changing host] 03:28:56 katesmith_ [~katesmith@unaffiliated/costume] has joined #lisp 03:29:50 -!- katesmith_ [~katesmith@unaffiliated/costume] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 03:35:36 -!- jleija [~jleija@50.8.10.126] has quit [Quit: leaving] 03:40:02 Spion_ [~spion@unaffiliated/spion] has joined #lisp 03:42:02 Kron [~Kron@69.166.23.18] has joined #lisp 03:42:28 -!- Kron is now known as Guest60903 03:43:31 -!- Spion [~spion@unaffiliated/spion] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 03:43:31 -!- Kron__ [~Kron@69.166.23.18] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 03:44:32 Euthy [~euthy@unaffiliated/euthydemus] has joined #lisp 03:46:13 -!- froggey [~froggey@unaffiliated/froggey] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 03:47:20 Dear slime hackers, is there a way to grab the system that defined the current *package* with elisp? 03:47:25 -!- jsnell [~jsnell@ash.snellman.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 03:47:29 jsnell [~jsnell@ash.snellman.net] has joined #lisp 03:47:31 symbol, path, anything really. :) 03:47:51 -!- didi [~user@unaffiliated/didi/x-1022147] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 03:49:49 -!- insomniaSalt [~milan@unaffiliated/iammilan] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 03:51:13 -!- jaminja [~jaminja@unaffiliated/jaminja] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 03:51:26 insomniaSalt [~milan@port-92-204-42-143.dynamic.qsc.de] has joined #lisp 03:51:26 -!- insomniaSalt [~milan@port-92-204-42-143.dynamic.qsc.de] has quit [Changing host] 03:51:26 insomniaSalt [~milan@unaffiliated/iammilan] has joined #lisp 03:52:20 -!- Euthy [~euthy@unaffiliated/euthydemus] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 03:52:39 redline6561: get a source file where it's defined with (swank:find-definition-for-thing *package*), then apply some heuristic/guesswork to get to the system definition 03:53:26 akovalenko: That'll do. Thanks. Also, thanks for all your work on W32. I don't use it but I'm really happy to see SBCL support improve there. :) 03:53:34 ramkrsna [ramkrsna@unaffiliated/ramkrsna] has joined #lisp 04:00:11 -!- jjkola [~jjkola@xdsl-83-150-83-66.nebulazone.fi] has left #lisp 04:01:31 doritos [~joshua@c-76-118-155-244.hsd1.ct.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 04:01:42 Phoodus [~foo@68.107.217.139] has joined #lisp 04:03:42 daniel___ [~daniel@p5082AFC0.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #lisp 04:04:12 -!- Guest60903 [~Kron@69.166.23.18] has quit [Quit: Kron awayyy!] 04:05:10 -!- daniel__1 [~daniel@p5B326614.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 04:07:10 ZabaQ [~john.conn@135.114-84-212.staticip.namesco.net] has joined #lisp 04:09:20 bishun [~bishun@unaffiliated/bishun] has joined #lisp 04:12:20 -!- ZabaQ [~john.conn@135.114-84-212.staticip.namesco.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 04:18:32 insomnia1alt [~milan@port-92-204-4-155.dynamic.qsc.de] has joined #lisp 04:18:32 -!- insomnia1alt [~milan@port-92-204-4-155.dynamic.qsc.de] has quit [Changing host] 04:18:32 insomnia1alt [~milan@unaffiliated/iammilan] has joined #lisp 04:19:48 -!- oconnore [~Eric@c-66-31-125-56.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 04:21:33 -!- insomniaSalt [~milan@unaffiliated/iammilan] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 04:21:33 -!- insomnia1alt is now known as insomniaSalt 04:23:20 spradnyesh [~pradyus@nat/yahoo/x-pjriurwnwsyhaknu] has joined #lisp 04:24:43 jaminja [~jaminja@unaffiliated/jaminja] has joined #lisp 04:27:51 iandalton [~user@184.167.150.33] has joined #lisp 04:28:12 Euthy [~euthy@unaffiliated/euthydemus] has joined #lisp 04:30:29 kushal [kdas@fedora/kushal] has joined #lisp 04:32:09 cfy [~cfy@122.228.131.84] has joined #lisp 04:32:09 -!- cfy [~cfy@122.228.131.84] has quit [Changing host] 04:32:09 cfy [~cfy@unaffiliated/chenfengyuan] has joined #lisp 04:34:35 benkard [~benkard@mnch-5d854042.pool.mediaWays.net] has joined #lisp 04:36:07 Good morning 04:36:10 -!- Euthy [~euthy@unaffiliated/euthydemus] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 04:37:45 -!- tsanhwa [~user@2001:da8:8001:240:222:68ff:fe14:6de] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 04:39:12 -!- ikki [~ikki@189.247.194.192] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 04:41:49 -!- eMBee [~eMBee@foresight/developer/pike/programmer] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 04:45:58 eMBee [~eMBee@foresight/developer/pike/programmer] has joined #lisp 04:47:50 -!- benkard [~benkard@mnch-5d854042.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit [Quit: benkard] 04:50:23 froggey [~froggey@unaffiliated/froggey] has joined #lisp 04:53:49 -!- otakutomo [~otakutomo@KD027083117212.ppp-bb.dion.ne.jp] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 04:54:23 otakutomo [~otakutomo@KD027083117212.ppp-bb.dion.ne.jp] has joined #lisp 04:56:36 -!- iandalton [~user@184.167.150.33] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 04:58:11 tsanhwa [~user@2001:da8:8001:240:222:68ff:fe14:6de] has joined #lisp 05:06:48 Euthy [~euthy@unaffiliated/euthydemus] has joined #lisp 05:09:02 -!- xyxu [~xyxu@58.41.14.46] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 05:09:35 -!- cfy [~cfy@unaffiliated/chenfengyuan] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 05:09:59 slime hackers, Any idea why this code might be exploding? http://paste.lisp.org/display/125350 05:12:25 redline6561: probably either a system or a package lacks absolute pathname 05:12:41 Hmm... 05:13:05 xyxu [~xyxu@58.41.14.46] has joined #lisp 05:13:11 I know the system containing the package at the repl has an absolute path because I inspected the system object. 05:13:41 redline6561: that internal slot-value is not always what you expect -- iirc, it's supposed to be filled on demand sometimes 05:13:47 akovalenko: If I run (swank::find-current-system) at the REPL, the code works fine. If I run it via slime-eval it fails as shown. That's what is confusing me. 05:13:58 Interesting... 05:15:45 -!- Euthy [~euthy@unaffiliated/euthydemus] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 05:18:24 -!- wishbone4 [~user@c-76-126-212-192.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 05:18:47 redline6561: you'd better take hash-table values of asdf::*defined-systems* directly (that's what swank-asdf does, anyway), to avoid name lookup for each system name (list-asdf-systems returns names) 05:19:27 akovalenko: From a performance perspective you mean? 05:19:42 redline6561: from a workingness perspective as well, I suppose. 05:20:04 -!- redline6561 [~redline65@li69-162.members.linode.com] has left #lisp 05:20:10 redline6561 [~redline65@li69-162.members.linode.com] has joined #lisp 05:20:44 redline6561: From a correctness perspective as well. E.g. on my system your code doesn't work because there is a bogus name "TEST-OP", somehow listed among the systems but not available. 05:21:18 simplechat [~simplecha@unaffiliated/simplechat] has joined #lisp 05:21:44 I'll give that a shot. Special casing things and avoiding absolute-pathname didn't quite fix it, just for the record. Thanks pkhuong, akovalenko. 05:23:17 redline6561: ASDF:SYSTEM-SOURCE-DIRECTORY seems to be what you need instead of absolute-pathname 05:23:26 Agreed. 05:23:46 That's what the current version is using. Still failing. Looking into *defined-systems* 05:24:09 mcsontos [mcsontos@nat/redhat/x-hqxheknhzpeouyej] has joined #lisp 05:26:36 Are there some Lisp style guidelines somewhere around the net? I have to write up some style guidelines for my coworkers and I'm looking for some ideas. :) 05:27:49 -!- MasseR [~masse@dyn68-323.yok.fi] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 05:28:34 MasseR [~masse@dyn68-323.yok.fi] has joined #lisp 05:28:47 -!- triliyn [~desmond@76-206-56-151.lightspeed.irvnca.sbcglobal.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 05:29:44 redline6561: probably you have a wrong package within slime-eval 05:30:28 redline6561: iirc, *package* is always set to swank-io-package for slime-eval requests 05:30:53 Davidbrcz [~david@proxysup.isae.fr] has joined #lisp 05:31:29 -!- Vutral [~ss@vutral.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 05:31:46 akovalenko: Ah! That's definitely the problem. 05:33:43 redline6561: (slime-current-package) in emacs seems to be the solution 05:34:00 akovalenko: Did that fix it for you? I'm still experiencing the issue sadly... 05:34:12 -!- X-Scale [email@sgi-ultra64.broker.freenet6.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 05:34:24 And *package* in the cl/swank patch should be fine. it's just the elisp that needs changing, right? 05:36:17 (slime-eval `(cl:let ((cl:*package* (cl:find-package ,(slime-current-package))))(swank::find-current-system))) 05:36:59 Oh wow. Okay. That's not what I was doing. 05:37:21 redline6561: and you'll need asdf:system-name (?) 05:37:22 -!- Davidbrcz [~david@proxysup.isae.fr] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 05:37:36 redline6561: or the result won't be read by emacs successfully 05:38:41 slash_ [~unknown@p54A8FFF2.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #lisp 05:38:43 system-name isn't a function but I think I'm with you. :) 05:39:18 -!- akovalenko [~anton@95.73.126.214] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 05:39:59 -!- bishun [~bishun@unaffiliated/bishun] has left #lisp 05:40:40 -!- kushal [kdas@fedora/kushal] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 05:43:21 akovalenko [~anton@95.73.126.214] has joined #lisp 05:43:32 kleppari [~spa@bitbucket.is] has joined #lisp 05:43:51 Well it's way past my bedtime. Thanks again for your help. 05:43:55 -!- redline6561 is now known as redline6561_nop 05:44:22 kushal [kdas@fedora/kushal] has joined #lisp 05:45:26 wildnux [~wildnux@68-191-210-216.dhcp.dntn.tx.charter.com] has joined #lisp 05:45:42 -!- kleppari_ [~spa@bitbucket.is] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 05:46:31 MUILTFN [~MLINTH@adsl-98-80-224-150.mcn.bellsouth.net] has joined #lisp 05:47:01 -!- ehu [~ehuels@ip118-64-212-87.adsl2.static.versatel.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 05:52:47 sdemarre [~serge@91.176.45.15] has joined #lisp 05:55:29 -!- Bike [~Glossina@71-214-96-235.ptld.qwest.net] has quit [Quit: sleep.] 06:00:30 Salamander_ [~Salamande@ppp121-45-147-91.lns10.adl6.internode.on.net] has joined #lisp 06:01:58 -!- H4ns [5b3d582c@gateway/web/freenode/ip.91.61.88.44] has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 06:03:27 -!- Salamander [~Salamande@ppp118-210-161-239.lns20.adl6.internode.on.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 06:07:48 -!- spradnyesh [~pradyus@nat/yahoo/x-pjriurwnwsyhaknu] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 06:08:13 spradnyesh [~pradyus@nat/yahoo/x-amgaxwlvqdhrxeek] has joined #lisp 06:08:25 -!- wildnux [~wildnux@68-191-210-216.dhcp.dntn.tx.charter.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 06:15:51 gravicappa [~gravicapp@ppp91-77-214-63.pppoe.mtu-net.ru] has joined #lisp 06:15:51 H4ns [5ddba948@gateway/web/freenode/ip.93.219.169.72] has joined #lisp 06:19:01 cyrillos [~cyrill@188.134.33.194] has joined #lisp 06:19:16 ei 06:19:23 anyone awoken?? 06:19:36 nope 06:19:49 k, got a question to ax 06:19:59 -!- neoesque [~neoesque@210.59.147.232] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 06:20:31 would lisp be suitable language for tablet/smartphone development?? 06:20:51 Amyn [~abennama@m328eth.crans.org] has joined #lisp 06:20:56 dontbehero: not particularily, no. 06:21:01 -!- bege [~bege@S0106001d7e5132b0.ed.shawcable.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 06:21:02 I am talking about NATIVE lisp not some crappy bidings fer java. 06:21:09 ok, why not? 06:21:13 bege [~bege@S0106001d7e5132b0.ed.shawcable.net] has joined #lisp 06:21:28 I am just wondering what are the limitations. 06:21:30 dontbehero: because the platforms basically dictate which language is best for developing on them, in terms of the apis provided. 06:21:54 dontbehero: i.e. on android, java is the language of choice, on ios, objective c is the standard language. 06:21:56 io$ picks some html5/css/javascript I believe, android is hardcore java all the way. 06:22:15 hiroshi [~hiroshi@i114-182-154-40.s41.a008.ap.plala.or.jp] has joined #lisp 06:22:29 H4ns: ah, ok I was talking with a suitable kernel of course. 06:22:51 dontbehero: i could imagine a lisp phone, but i have trouble imagining the path to one. 06:23:22 well, linux kernel > lisp + some graphical toolkit. 06:24:25 what I am trying to get at it is whether lisp has some inherent limitation that makes it un-suitable or is merely that there hasn't been interest in making a platform. 06:24:44 dontbehero: no, there are no inherent limitations. it is just that no platform supports lisp. 06:24:56 interesting 06:25:53 what would be the steps for creating such a platform? 06:26:28 Euthy [~euthy@unaffiliated/euthydemus] has joined #lisp 06:26:39 dontbehero: define requirements, get funding, hire team, develop, iterate, release. 06:27:07 dunno why industry picked java but from a performance point of view, isn't it too higher level language for limited resources devices? 06:27:22 http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=42339 06:27:54 H4ns: mm.. just the technical steps, in terms of software 06:28:22 dontbehero: *blank stare* 06:28:49 -!- slash_ [~unknown@p54A8FFF2.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 06:30:30 "get funding, hire team, develop, iterate, release." <-- that's not technical 06:30:59 dontbehero: take your favorite open-source CL and port it to the platform you want <- th 06:31:14 ...that's technical, even if vague :) 06:31:23 creating a platform is much more than having a compiler that runs 06:31:45 and besides, clozure cl already runs on arm4l, so that problem can be considered solved. 06:31:53 -!- otakutomo [~otakutomo@KD027083117212.ppp-bb.dion.ne.jp] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 06:32:31 interesting 06:32:47 akovalenko: thanks for the link 06:32:59 -!- Euthy [~euthy@unaffiliated/euthydemus] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 06:33:14 dontbehero: creating a platform is a huge undertaking, and the technical problems are muchg smaller than the economical, organizational and social issues. it does not make much sense to me to discuss technical things in isolation. 06:34:02 -!- hiroshi [~hiroshi@i114-182-154-40.s41.a008.ap.plala.or.jp] has quit [Quit: rcirc on GNU Emacs 22.3.1] 06:34:44 mrSpec [~Spec@unaffiliated/mrspec] has joined #lisp 06:35:52 -!- pnathan [~Adium@76.178.165.160] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 06:36:25 kiuma [~kiuma@85-18-55-37.ip.fastwebnet.it] has joined #lisp 06:37:03 wildnux [~wildnux@68-191-210-216.dhcp.dntn.tx.charter.com] has joined #lisp 06:37:08 who would be interested in swank+sbcl-related questions here? Or should I send that to the mailing list? 06:37:25 -!- eMBee [~eMBee@foresight/developer/pike/programmer] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 06:37:41 _pw_ [~user@123.112.71.43] has joined #lisp 06:38:43 -!- cesarbp [~cbolano@189.247.126.160] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 06:38:54 the API part would be to make hooks (whatever is called) for things such as volume, rotation, gyro, input, etc?? 06:39:18 todun_ [~todun@seas807.wireless-pennnet.upenn.edu] has joined #lisp 06:39:58 flip214: many such questions get answered here, and they're definitely on topic, so asking won't hurt 06:41:32 eMBee [~eMBee@foresight/developer/pike/programmer] has joined #lisp 06:41:34 fine ... 06:41:44 I saw that sldb-break-at-start wasn't implemented for SBCL, so I did my own ... http://paste.lisp.org/display/125351 06:41:47 dontbehero: after you have a working FFI in our lisp, device operations are usually no rocket science -- you just do it. 06:41:51 fairly easy, only two lines. 06:42:07 but when I want to look at the arguments via inspect-in-frame I get an error ... 06:42:34 so -- 1) can somebody take sldb-break-at-start into swank, and 2) can somebody fix the inspector? 06:43:41 Guthur [~user@212.183.128.43] has joined #lisp 06:44:03 xan_ [~xan@183.Red-81-32-69.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net] has joined #lisp 06:44:07 -!- DaDaDosPrompt [~DaDaDosPr@184.99.13.214] has quit [Quit: DaDaDosPrompt] 06:44:21 todun__ [~todun@mobile-198-228-194-073.mycingular.net] has joined #lisp 06:47:00 ih3250 [~user@i114-182-154-40.s41.a008.ap.plala.or.jp] has joined #lisp 06:47:28 -!- ih3250 [~user@i114-182-154-40.s41.a008.ap.plala.or.jp] has left #lisp 06:47:40 -!- todun_ [~todun@seas807.wireless-pennnet.upenn.edu] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 06:50:50 -!- wildnux [~wildnux@68-191-210-216.dhcp.dntn.tx.charter.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 06:51:01 mvilleneuve [~mvilleneu@LLagny-156-36-4-214.w80-14.abo.wanadoo.fr] has joined #lisp 06:52:51 good morning 06:56:12 -!- todun__ [~todun@mobile-198-228-194-073.mycingular.net] has quit [Quit: Colloquy for iPhone - http://colloquy.mobi] 06:57:32 nipra [~nipra@14.98.160.215] has joined #lisp 06:57:46 -!- AntiSpamMeta [~MetaBot@unaffiliated/afterdeath/bot/antispambot] has quit [Excess Flood] 06:57:50 -!- Guthur [~user@212.183.128.43] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 06:59:01 -!- foocraft [foocraft@ibawizard.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 06:59:40 AntiSpamMeta [~MetaBot@unaffiliated/afterdeath/bot/antispambot] has joined #lisp 06:59:58 foocraft [foocraft@ibawizard.net] has joined #lisp 07:02:28 akovalenko: sorry for asking this but, what's FFI?? 07:02:39 -!- am0c [~am0c@112.149.169.23] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 07:04:16 dontbehero: foreign function interface (each non-toy Common Lisp provides some way to call external C functions, and that's what you normally use for low-level system calls) 07:04:47 thanks 07:04:48 SegFaultAX [~SegFaultA@c-98-248-241-85.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 07:04:59 -!- katesmith [~katesmith@unaffiliated/costume] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 07:05:29 katesmith [~katesmith@unaffiliated/costume] has joined #lisp 07:08:33 -!- SegFaultAX [~SegFaultA@c-98-248-241-85.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has quit [Client Quit] 07:08:56 jdz [~jdz@193.206.22.97] has joined #lisp 07:09:49 -!- eMBee [~eMBee@foresight/developer/pike/programmer] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 07:10:40 jtza8 [~jtza8@41.56.51.30] has joined #lisp 07:10:48 Harag [~Harag@iburst-41-213-69-158.iburst.co.za] has joined #lisp 07:10:50 eMBee [~eMBee@foresight/developer/pike/programmer] has joined #lisp 07:11:55 -!- Amyn [~abennama@m328eth.crans.org] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 07:14:37 -!- kushal [kdas@fedora/kushal] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 07:15:01 kushal [kdas@nat/redhat/x-typrvvrjioafqzwf] has joined #lisp 07:15:01 -!- eMBee [~eMBee@foresight/developer/pike/programmer] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 07:15:02 -!- arbscht [~arbscht@fsf/member/arbscht] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 07:15:13 -!- kushal [kdas@nat/redhat/x-typrvvrjioafqzwf] has quit [Changing host] 07:15:13 kushal [kdas@fedora/kushal] has joined #lisp 07:15:46 gensym [~user@dslb-088-071-149-049.pools.arcor-ip.net] has joined #lisp 07:18:25 eMBee [~eMBee@foresight/developer/pike/programmer] has joined #lisp 07:19:31 -!- nipra [~nipra@14.98.160.215] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 07:19:43 benkard [~benkard@002608dc9535.dfn.mwn.de] has joined #lisp 07:19:46 -!- abeaumont [~abeaumont@90.165.165.246] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 07:20:30 Blkt [~user@89-96-199-46.ip13.fastwebnet.it] has joined #lisp 07:20:39 naryl [~weechat@213.170.70.141] has joined #lisp 07:22:37 -!- eMBee [~eMBee@foresight/developer/pike/programmer] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 07:23:01 -!- Patzy_ [~something@bro29-1-82-245-180-56.fbx.proxad.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 07:23:12 Patzy [~something@bro29-1-82-245-180-56.fbx.proxad.net] has joined #lisp 07:23:17 good morning everyone 07:23:36 eMBee [~eMBee@foresight/developer/pike/programmer] has joined #lisp 07:26:48 insomnia1alt [~milan@port-92-204-54-182.dynamic.qsc.de] has joined #lisp 07:26:48 -!- insomnia1alt [~milan@port-92-204-54-182.dynamic.qsc.de] has quit [Changing host] 07:26:48 insomnia1alt [~milan@unaffiliated/iammilan] has joined #lisp 07:27:37 abeaumont [~abeaumont@90.165.165.246] has joined #lisp 07:27:43 -!- jaminja [~jaminja@unaffiliated/jaminja] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 07:29:18 -!- realitygrill [~realitygr@adsl-76-226-97-62.dsl.sfldmi.sbcglobal.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 07:30:06 -!- insomniaSalt [~milan@unaffiliated/iammilan] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 07:30:06 -!- insomnia1alt is now known as insomniaSalt 07:32:13 -!- eMBee [~eMBee@foresight/developer/pike/programmer] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 07:32:50 eMBee [~eMBee@foresight/developer/pike/programmer] has joined #lisp 07:34:19 Java was sold as device independent. As was C more or less. And COBOL. The never-ending dream. 07:34:46 FORTRAN was sold as device independent 07:35:24 -!- benkard [~benkard@002608dc9535.dfn.mwn.de] has quit [Quit: benkard] 07:36:20 what do you mean by device independent? as long as the compiler is ported to a specific arch there's no problem. 07:36:47 dontbehero: and the programmer doesn't rely on architecture details 07:37:07 no need to bend over backwards trying to make an universal language fit all platforms. 07:37:33 yeah, that's idiotic if you really want *all platforms* 07:38:04 because that also includes Harvard microcontrollers with 128 B RAM and the 8086 07:38:06 there's a point of having different arches. Thus I don't see the point of making a arch-agnostic language. 07:39:51 the fact that an arcitecture like ia32 survives over much better architectures kinda counters that point 07:40:12 the point of having an arch agnostic language is that people are lazy 07:40:39 many arches are similar enough that a language can (and should) easily run in each of them 07:41:03 -!- zenlunatic [~justin@c-68-48-40-231.hsd1.md.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 07:41:04 x86, ARM, MIPS, PPC, SPARC 07:41:17 CELL 07:41:32 there are always some troll-arches you're not going to run on 07:41:51 uh? 07:41:59 AVR is a good example 07:42:01 The key to understanding this is that languages define virtual machines. 07:42:14 C defines the C Abstract Machine, for example. 07:42:18 Beetny [~Beetny@ppp118-208-40-132.lns20.bne1.internode.on.net] has joined #lisp 07:42:23 Zhivago: Machine Model sounds more appropriate 07:42:36 That's the machine that conforming C programs run in. 07:42:41 No. I mean machine. 07:43:12 It's a virtual machine that's realized by the compiler upon some substrate. 07:43:27 *dontbehero* pictures an AVR cpu with a troll face 07:43:33 In C's case, there are lots of holes for Implementation Defined behaviour, and undefined behaviour, etc. 07:43:53 It's fundamentally no different from python's case or CL's case or ... 07:44:23 (Although those have a lot less undefined behaviour) 07:44:35 interesting, never though about higher level languge being a virtual machine. 07:44:51 conforming ANSI C runs on pretty much all platforms 07:44:52 "higher level" is a meaningless term of propaganda. 07:45:02 This applies to all languages, including assembly. 07:45:03 dontbehero: it's like "message passing" 07:45:35 dontbehero: just rob a term of its meaning and pretend it's cool to use it in a different context 07:45:36 Zhivago: what's 'implementation defined behaviour' and 'undefined behaviour'? And what sort of holes? 07:45:45 dontbehero: *i++ = i++; 07:46:00 the result of that is undefined by the standard 07:46:03 It's where the language doesn't specify what happens when you do something. 07:46:10 So an implementation can do whatever it likes. 07:46:21 With implementation defined behaviour it generally needs to be documented. 07:46:23 ah a fork 07:46:41 I don't see what this has to do with forks. 07:46:45 to prevent situations where the required behaviour would be very awkward to implement 07:47:13 It's generally to make optimization easier, yeah. 07:47:37 It can be quite subtle in C -- e.g., f(i + v[i++]) 07:47:51 no 07:48:27 It can also be quite subtle in CL -- in many cases it is produced by violating constraints imposed by compile-file, etc. 07:48:47 Or things like modifying literal structures. 07:49:30 i don't see much of a point in defining a meaning for obvious trollcode 07:49:54 aiju: this is what you were talking about? --> http://stackoverflow.com/questions/24853/what-is-the-difference-between-i-and-i 07:50:16 no 07:50:18 not really 07:50:35 if you're not familiar with i++, a simpler example is foobar(putc('a'), putc('b')) 07:50:42 A lot of this code is not obvious. 07:50:43 it can output either ab or ba 07:50:46 depending on the implementation 07:51:03 ok 07:51:17 -!- gravicappa [~gravicapp@ppp91-77-214-63.pppoe.mtu-net.ru] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 07:51:29 That issue also applies to scheme. :) 07:51:42 (The order of evaluation of arguments is not specified) 07:52:03 aiju: well some guy is saying exactly that in the comments " Some compilers will display: 100;100 07:52:06 while others will display: 100;101 07:52:06 " 07:52:13 nha [~prefect@imamac13.epfl.ch] has joined #lisp 07:52:26 Zhivago: in lisp defined order of evaluation seems more useful to me 07:52:50 dontbehero: ah well then 07:52:58 dontbehero: it affects everything with sideeffects 07:53:13 Go for one just avoided most expressions with sideeffects 07:53:13 I think I get it. 07:53:15 dont: What is the actual print statement? 07:53:30 i++ and assignments are statements, not expressions, in Go 07:55:59 dontbehero: how things are arranged in memory is also undefined 07:56:08 Go has statements? -_- 07:56:18 texas [~texas@212.99.78.123] has joined #lisp 07:56:20 some very old code assumes that if you do "int a, b;" a and b will be at consecutive memory locations 07:56:27 Hello 07:56:35 naryl: sure 07:58:38 alkoma [~alkoma@c-67-160-207-86.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 07:58:44 e-user [e-user@nat/nokia/x-rteeecxflzdaauiu] has joined #lisp 07:59:45 -!- alkoma [~alkoma@c-67-160-207-86.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has quit [Client Quit] 08:04:29 nostoi [~nostoi@48.Red-79-151-255.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net] has joined #lisp 08:10:32 arbscht [~arbscht@fsf/member/arbscht] has joined #lisp 08:30:39 otakutomo [~otakutomo@KD027083117212.ppp-bb.dion.ne.jp] has joined #lisp 08:30:47 -!- nostoi [~nostoi@48.Red-79-151-255.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net] has quit [Quit: Verlassend] 08:32:47 ccorn [~ccorn@84-53-64-50.adsl.unet.nl] has joined #lisp 08:40:35 -!- jtza8 [~jtza8@41.56.51.30] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 08:42:08 jaminja [~jaminja@85.17.232.145] has joined #lisp 08:42:08 -!- jaminja [~jaminja@85.17.232.145] has quit [Changing host] 08:42:08 jaminja [~jaminja@unaffiliated/jaminja] has joined #lisp 08:46:12 c_arenz [arenz@nat/ibm/x-mxkrqmbcnjsezbei] has joined #lisp 08:49:55 Amyn [~abennama@64.208.49.45] has joined #lisp 08:50:45 jtza8 [~jtza8@41.56.51.30] has joined #lisp 08:52:10 newcup [newcup@peruna.fi] has joined #lisp 08:54:00 -!- texas [~texas@212.99.78.123] has quit [Quit: Quitte] 08:54:44 hypno [~hypno@impulse2.gothiaso.com] has joined #lisp 08:59:58 -!- jaminja [~jaminja@unaffiliated/jaminja] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 09:01:43 spacefrogg [~spacefrog@unaffiliated/spacefrogg] has joined #lisp 09:02:51 -!- doritos [~joshua@c-76-118-155-244.hsd1.ct.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 09:03:01 -!- jrockway [~jrockway@2600:3c00::f03c:91ff:fe93:50b0] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 09:03:48 jrockway [~jrockway@2600:3c00::f03c:91ff:fe93:50b0] has joined #lisp 09:04:58 It really is quite hard to produce architecture independent code even if the language is nominally architecture independent. Have a look at the GNU 'configure' utility to see the full horror. 09:06:36 It's trivial. 09:06:47 The hard part is where you don't want your code to be architecture independent. 09:07:05 -!- H4ns [5ddba948@gateway/web/freenode/ip.93.219.169.72] has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 09:07:25 All you'd need to do to make it architecture independent is to just run your code inside a VM for a particular architecture -- e.g., an x86 emulator. 09:07:42 waveman_: GNU configure just plain sucks 09:07:51 no discussion 09:08:15 This has costs that people don't like, so they compromise by trying to make their quasi-architecture dependent in order to exploit local architectuural features. 09:08:39 and configure is not mostly about architecture anyway 09:08:40 That's what makes it complex -- trying to eat your cake and have it, too. 09:08:56 it's about operating systems 09:08:59 A fair bit of configure is about things like the range of types, and so on. 09:09:06 no 09:09:10 that's the job of stdint.h 09:09:22 The OS is part of the architecture that the program runs in. 09:09:30 That's only for things like standard integers. 09:09:47 There are plenty of other types, such as off_t ... 09:10:17 it's somewhat ironic but the OS is the hardest part in portability 09:10:47 Why? Modern OSes provide virtual machines for your programs to run in. 09:10:57 no, portability *between* OSes 09:11:11 and that's true of virtually all OSes 09:11:16 even OS/360 did that 09:11:18 So, it's fairly natural to me that some of the largest portability issues will involve differences in those VMs. 09:11:35 And by these VMs, I mean processes. 09:12:27 a good OS can make the difference between architectures very small 09:13:18 Yeah, such as byte orders and ... 09:13:25 am0c [~am0c@112.149.169.23] has joined #lisp 09:14:11 no, it can keep the OS interface consistent, independent of the architecture 09:14:37 byte order is only an issue when you make it one 09:14:42 what people don't want because they want to exploit architectural features 09:14:54 by writing byte order dependent code 09:15:01 sure 09:15:39 So, the OS can keep the OS interface consistent, independent of the architecture, thus making the difference between architectures very small? 09:16:09 Zhivago: sounds trivial, lol, but not every OS does that 09:16:25 Sounds confused and deranged, but as you wish. 09:19:34 it's much easier to write code which runs both on x86 Linux and on ARM Linux than writing code which runs both on x86 Linux and x86 Windows 09:21:19 Soulman [~knute@175.80-202-238.nextgentel.com] has joined #lisp 09:21:29 (unless you want to crosscompile, why is that so fucking hard on Linux?) 09:21:41 -!- hlavaty [~user@91-65-217-112-dynip.superkabel.de] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 09:21:48 the netbsd world has large portions of its code to be MI. it's pretty nice to plug in a typical PC NIC in that old sparc of yours and have it working out of the box... 09:22:11 -!- c_arenz [arenz@nat/ibm/x-mxkrqmbcnjsezbei] has quit [Quit: Ex-Chat] 09:23:54 -!- ramkrsna [ramkrsna@unaffiliated/ramkrsna] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 09:24:43 chturne [~charles@nas20-196.york.ac.uk] has joined #lisp 09:25:23 aiju: the problem is, that most of the time, when designing an OS, there is no best decision how to solve a problem. there is just a decision. and two people eventually come to two different decisions. so the resulting OS are incompatible 09:25:24 -!- am0c [~am0c@112.149.169.23] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 09:25:57 c_arenz [arenz@nat/ibm/x-mkfvdqqyxgbdlwcq] has joined #lisp 09:26:06 spacefrogg: yes 09:26:18 am0c [~am0c@112.149.169.23] has joined #lisp 09:27:06 -!- kushal [kdas@fedora/kushal] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 09:34:24 Euthy [~euthy@unaffiliated/euthydemus] has joined #lisp 09:36:41 gienah [~mwright@ppp121-44-44-207.lns20.syd6.internode.on.net] has joined #lisp 09:36:52 mstevens [~mstevens@fsf/member/pdpc.active.mstevens] has joined #lisp 09:37:04 ramkrsna [ramkrsna@unaffiliated/ramkrsna] has joined #lisp 09:39:21 hi 09:39:36 kushal [kdas@nat/redhat/x-vurflyckrqlyrxin] has joined #lisp 09:39:36 -!- kushal [kdas@nat/redhat/x-vurflyckrqlyrxin] has quit [Changing host] 09:39:36 kushal [kdas@fedora/kushal] has joined #lisp 09:40:01 is there some simple way to convert html to text with closure-html ? 09:40:10 -!- am0c [~am0c@112.149.169.23] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 09:40:39 -!- kushal [kdas@fedora/kushal] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 09:46:38 -!- Euthy [~euthy@unaffiliated/euthydemus] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 09:46:52 -!- dontbehero is now known as skorpia 09:48:57 Athas [~athas@130.225.165.40] has joined #lisp 09:51:27 gravicappa [~gravicapp@80.90.116.82] has joined #lisp 09:52:11 H4ns [4ffc8409@gateway/web/freenode/ip.79.252.132.9] has joined #lisp 09:52:28 -!- xyxu [~xyxu@58.41.14.46] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 09:57:49 Euthy [~euthy@unaffiliated/euthydemus] has joined #lisp 10:02:23 -!- akovalenko [~anton@95.73.126.214] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 10:03:59 -!- Euthy [~euthy@unaffiliated/euthydemus] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 10:04:42 Euthy [~euthy@unaffiliated/euthydemus] has joined #lisp 10:10:55 -!- Euthy [~euthy@unaffiliated/euthydemus] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 10:12:36 akovalenko [~anton@95.72.103.209] has joined #lisp 10:16:06 manuel_ [~manuel_@p57921A69.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #lisp 10:18:13 -!- chturne [~charles@nas20-196.york.ac.uk] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 10:22:42 hlavaty [~user@91-65-217-112-dynip.superkabel.de] has joined #lisp 10:29:38 -!- sykopomp [~sykopomp@gateway/tor-sasl/sykopomp] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 10:30:34 sykopomp [~sykopomp@gateway/tor-sasl/sykopomp] has joined #lisp 10:32:40 realitygrill [~realitygr@adsl-76-226-97-62.dsl.sfldmi.sbcglobal.net] has joined #lisp 10:32:55 chturne [~charles@nas20-196.york.ac.uk] has joined #lisp 10:48:03 Macro [5f53543c@gateway/web/freenode/ip.95.83.84.60] has joined #lisp 10:48:27 (hello *world*) 10:49:01 -!- juniorroy [~dima@212.36.228.103] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 10:52:55 kovolvo [~user@p4FDAD130.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #lisp 10:54:31 anyon 10:54:41 *WORLD* is unbound. 10:54:49 ISF [~ivan@187.106.48.51] has joined #lisp 10:54:57 anyone for swank in sbcl? http://paste.lisp.org/display/125351 10:55:17 I saw that sldb-break-at-start wasn't implemented for SBCL, so I did my own. but when I want to look at the arguments via inspect-in-frame I get an error ... 10:56:38 flip214: couldn't reproduce that error right away. For this specific question, mailing list or launchpad bug tracker seems more appropriate indeed. 11:00:12 I remember when IBM brought out the PS/2 computer. With a new "standard" keyboard, different from every keyboard that had ever existed previously. 11:00:24 -!- ISF [~ivan@187.106.48.51] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 11:01:08 -!- oudeis [~oudeis@bzq-79-177-201-46.red.bezeqint.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 11:01:14 waveman_: as far as i remember, the ps/2 keyboard layout was a mixture between the dec vt220 and the traditional ibm pc layouts. 11:01:43 xyxu [~xyxu@222.68.166.159] has joined #lisp 11:02:03 juniorroy [~dima@212.36.228.103] has joined #lisp 11:02:23 the PS/2 layout is the same as the AT layout, says wikipedia 11:02:55 -!- juniorroy [~dima@212.36.228.103] has left #lisp 11:03:20 yes, but the AT was ten years later IIRC 11:03:37 no 11:03:46 the AT came before the PS/2 11:03:52 oh, yes. the mf2 keyboard layout was introduced with the at, not the ps/2 11:04:16 waveman_: eat that. 11:04:45 -!- replore [~replore@203.152.213.161.static.zoot.jp] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 11:05:15 -!- tsanhwa [~user@2001:da8:8001:240:222:68ff:fe14:6de] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 11:05:24 -!- chturne [~charles@nas20-196.york.ac.uk] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 11:07:07 Davidbrcz [~david@proxysup.isae.fr] has joined #lisp 11:07:12 Euthy [~euthy@unaffiliated/euthydemus] has joined #lisp 11:08:57 -!- MUILTFN [~MLINTH@adsl-98-80-224-150.mcn.bellsouth.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 11:09:08 -!- Athas [~athas@130.225.165.40] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 11:10:09 -!- xyxu [~xyxu@222.68.166.159] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 11:11:36 -!- realitygrill [~realitygr@adsl-76-226-97-62.dsl.sfldmi.sbcglobal.net] has quit [Quit: realitygrill] 11:16:26 ehu [~ehuels@109.38.61.172] has joined #lisp 11:18:28 wormphle1m [~wormphleg@c-50-131-44-231.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 11:18:35 BlankVerse [~pankajm@103.246.106.35] has joined #lisp 11:18:45 -!- Euthy [~euthy@unaffiliated/euthydemus] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 11:18:48 realitygrill [~realitygr@adsl-76-226-97-62.dsl.sfldmi.sbcglobal.net] has joined #lisp 11:19:43 -!- wormphlegm [~wormphleg@c-50-131-44-231.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 11:20:05 -!- ramkrsna [ramkrsna@unaffiliated/ramkrsna] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 11:21:13 benkard [~benkard@002608dc9535.dfn.mwn.de] has joined #lisp 11:21:18 pjb_ [~pjb@81.202.16.46.dyn.user.ono.com] has joined #lisp 11:21:25 -!- newcup [newcup@peruna.fi] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 11:23:24 I stand corrected. It was different from the standard AT keyboard which had 84 keys but there was an enhanced layout AT keyboard which I had never seen at that time. 11:24:52 newcup [newcup@peruna.fi] has joined #lisp 11:25:51 hakzsam [~hakzsam@aqu33-5-82-245-96-206.fbx.proxad.net] has joined #lisp 11:28:50 It was extremely different from the original AT keyboard layout, which annoyed my muscle memory. Every laptop I use seems to have a different layout. 11:30:30 jaminja [~jaminja@85.17.232.145] has joined #lisp 11:30:30 -!- jaminja [~jaminja@85.17.232.145] has quit [Changing host] 11:30:30 jaminja [~jaminja@unaffiliated/jaminja] has joined #lisp 11:32:42 ramkrsna [ramkrsna@nat/redhat/x-tswawjjdywxnogvp] has joined #lisp 11:32:42 -!- ramkrsna [ramkrsna@nat/redhat/x-tswawjjdywxnogvp] has quit [Changing host] 11:32:42 ramkrsna [ramkrsna@unaffiliated/ramkrsna] has joined #lisp 11:33:11 -!- pjb_ [~pjb@81.202.16.46.dyn.user.ono.com] has quit [Quit: from my iPad] 11:33:27 -!- nowhere_man [~pierre@AStrasbourg-551-1-38-34.w92-148.abo.wanadoo.fr] has quit [Quit: Konversation terminated!] 11:33:54 Yuuhi [benni@p54839A71.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #lisp 11:33:55 nowhere_man [~pierre@AStrasbourg-551-1-38-34.w92-148.abo.wanadoo.fr] has joined #lisp 11:34:13 -!- spradnyesh [~pradyus@nat/yahoo/x-amgaxwlvqdhrxeek] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 11:34:23 francogrex [franco@grex.cyberspace.org] has joined #lisp 11:34:36 Euthy [~euthy@unaffiliated/euthydemus] has joined #lisp 11:35:38 I find it a little funny (in the sense of weird, not in the sense of humorously hilarious), that remove-duplicates removes all but the last occurence of the duplicate? Why doesn't keep the first occurrence instead of the last one? 11:36:05 -!- mrSpec [~Spec@unaffiliated/mrspec] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 11:36:09 wbooze [~levgue@xdsl-78-35-142-55.netcologne.de] has joined #lisp 11:36:17 homie [~levgue@xdsl-78-35-142-55.netcologne.de] has joined #lisp 11:36:24 francogrex: it's not specified _which_ is kept, IIRC 11:37:18 flip214: my god, even worse 11:37:46 and even if it were, it shouldn't matter if they really were duplicates 11:38:00 spacefrogg: it does matter 11:38:20 then they're not duplicates, are they? 11:38:26 than you want something different and misunderstand the 'duplicates' 11:38:39 no 11:38:46 think of :key ? 11:38:55 yes? 11:39:02 -!- kiuma [~kiuma@85-18-55-37.ip.fastwebnet.it] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 11:39:03 francogrex: think of the function name and what it means :) 11:39:32 that is, of course you can *observe* the distinction, but your code shouldn't depend on it 11:39:34 maybe you want 'remove-subsequent-occurrences' 11:40:31 maybe, but remove-duplicates should give a chance to chose which one is being removed, especially if it is operating on ties 11:41:14 francogrex: you are about 20 years too late to make that point, if it is one 11:41:21 francogrex: unfortunately it's too late to restandardize. Fortunately it's trivial to write a new function that does what you want instead. 11:41:24 francogrex: the spec is clear. if you need something else, write it. 11:41:30 -!- Euthy [~euthy@unaffiliated/euthydemus] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 11:42:49 ok: (remove-duplicates '(("test" 3) ("test" 5) ("value" 7) ("value" 8) ("test" 4)) :test 'equal :key #'car) as an example 11:43:28 -!- benkard [~benkard@002608dc9535.dfn.mwn.de] has quit [Quit: benkard] 11:43:42 pjb_ [~pjb@81.202.16.46.dyn.user.ono.com] has joined #lisp 11:44:01 looks good. you imply that the cdr's are equivalent 11:44:09 francogrex: think "what it means", not "what it does". If they are really "duplicates", then your code shouldn't depend on which is kept. 11:44:22 -!- kovolvo [~user@p4FDAD130.dip.t-dialin.net] has left #lisp 11:44:28 francogrex: leave the :key away, then you'll keep your conses ;) 11:44:42 waveman_ mostly the keys are at the same places. just write a new xmodmap to map all your keyboards the same. 11:45:19 mrSpec [~Spec@unaffiliated/mrspec] has joined #lisp 11:46:14 Enrico` [Enrico@79.114.123.89] has joined #lisp 11:46:51 akovalenko: that's rubbish, we operates by action not intentions 11:46:55 -!- Enrico` [Enrico@79.114.123.89] has quit [Client Quit] 11:47:14 what it does is important 11:47:15 francogrex: actions express your intention 11:48:19 francogrex: why don't you read the spec? 11:48:34 It's futile to allow keys in duplicates in this manner if you have no control over this: (remove-duplicates '(("test" 3) ("test" 5) ("value" 7) ("value" 8) ("test" 4)) :test 'equal) 11:48:35 francogrex: it actually specifies the very behavior and offers a mode that seems to be what you want. 11:48:42 francogrex: what it does because of the specification _is_ important, what it does by accident _is not_. You have to think of its meanining to distinguish these two cases. 11:49:28 H4ns: ok I will look up the option. thanks 11:50:12 -!- Davidbrcz [~david@proxysup.isae.fr] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 11:51:17 francogrex: BTW, my docs say «The elements of sequence are compared pairwise, and if any two match, then the one occurring earlier in the sequence is discarded (but if the :from-end argument is true, then the one later in the sequence is discarded).» 11:52:40 xwolf- [~xwolf-@76.73.16.26] has joined #lisp 11:52:42 hello 11:53:41 xwolf-: The variable HELLO is unbound. 11:53:52 I am trying to zero out C structure. is this how it's done? I'm getting unexpected crashes so maybe i'm doing something wrong (loop for i below (foreign-type-size type) do (setf (mem-aref ptr :char i) 0)) 11:53:56 Macro :) 11:54:42 -!- ski_ [~slj@c83-254-21-112.bredband.comhem.se] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 11:55:11 xwolf-: looks correct (I normally use :uint8, but otherwise it's the same, and there should be no difference). 11:55:58 -!- pjb_ [~pjb@81.202.16.46.dyn.user.ono.com] has quit [Quit: from my iPad] 11:56:39 thanks 11:56:42 ski_ [~slj@c83-254-21-112.bredband.comhem.se] has joined #lisp 12:00:19 -!- c_arenz [arenz@nat/ibm/x-mkfvdqqyxgbdlwcq] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 12:01:31 airolson [~airolson@CPE00222d55a738-CM00222d55a735.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com] has joined #lisp 12:01:55 Euthy [~euthy@unaffiliated/euthydemus] has joined #lisp 12:02:36 xyxu [~xyxu@222.68.166.159] has joined #lisp 12:03:45 -!- realitygrill [~realitygr@adsl-76-226-97-62.dsl.sfldmi.sbcglobal.net] has quit [Quit: realitygrill] 12:03:58 benkard [~benkard@002608dc9535.dfn.mwn.de] has joined #lisp 12:05:11 kushal [kdas@nat/redhat/x-ojtahurrfsbzihgu] has joined #lisp 12:05:13 -!- kushal [kdas@nat/redhat/x-ojtahurrfsbzihgu] has quit [Changing host] 12:05:13 kushal [kdas@fedora/kushal] has joined #lisp 12:05:30 realitygrill [~realitygr@adsl-76-226-97-62.dsl.sfldmi.sbcglobal.net] has joined #lisp 12:07:45 -!- Euthy [~euthy@unaffiliated/euthydemus] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 12:09:03 flip214: indeed, my bad, I should have read better. so by default it IS the first and then that could be altered... so finally remove-duplicates still rules 12:10:17 xwolf-: :char is probably wrong 12:10:31 xwolf-: in sbcl default char is unicode,( forgot ifi ts 16 or 32) 12:10:34 so it takes 2 bytes 12:10:58 actually on the 2nd throught its :char not 'char, so maybe cffi :char is same as C one 12:11:25 just use :uint8 as suggested so you can be sure you changing one byte.. 12:14:37 -!- varjag [~eugene@122.62-97-226.bkkb.no] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 12:16:11 c_arenz [arenz@nat/ibm/x-fesdayltaqjtkhne] has joined #lisp 12:17:34 Jasko [~tjasko@c-174-59-204-245.hsd1.pa.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 12:18:30 maxm- thanks, didnt' know :char could be 2 on SBCL, I"ll have to check because I'm using that all over the code 12:19:32 -!- kushal [kdas@fedora/kushal] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 12:19:38 -!- realitygrill [~realitygr@adsl-76-226-97-62.dsl.sfldmi.sbcglobal.net] has quit [Quit: realitygrill] 12:19:52 -!- Jasko3 [~tjasko@209.74.44.225] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 12:20:00 pjb_ [~pjb@81.202.16.46.dyn.user.ono.com] has joined #lisp 12:20:07 BountyX [~erhan@adsl-76-241-64-48.dsl.bcvloh.sbcglobal.net] has joined #lisp 12:20:22 maxm-: (sb-alien:alien-size sb-alien:char) => 8 ;; on unicode build 12:20:40 (SBCL's alien-size defaults to bits) 12:21:29 -!- benkard [~benkard@002608dc9535.dfn.mwn.de] has quit [Quit: benkard] 12:21:47 -!- Beetny [~Beetny@ppp118-208-40-132.lns20.bne1.internode.on.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 12:22:04 actually, both :char in CFFI and CHAR in alien FFI refer to C's char, which is always one byte (though not necessary 8 bits) 12:23:07 xwolf-: can you share more of your code, so we'll take a look on memory allocation and the like? 12:23:43 yes, let me trim the code down a bit first though 12:24:27 btw how does one even debug FFI code in slime? 12:25:52 helpful things on ffi stuff... a) Do (sb-ext:gc) often, as that would shuffle memory around and uncover mem corruption that much quicker 12:26:22 b) lots of logging 12:26:27 after we know which function crashes, there is no more help from SLIME: we just concentrate on reading the code till we see what's wrong :) 12:26:38 actaully (sb-ext:gc :full t) not just (gc) 12:27:12 c) Have *inferier-lisp* buffer open in another window 12:27:30 you will often see "GC invariant blah blah" warning from (gc), way before SBCL is actually hosed... 12:27:54 dwim [~dwim@213.Red-79-154-73.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net] has joined #lisp 12:28:00 this will help to bisect as to which part of your code screw up memory 12:29:00 -!- sanjoyd [~sanjoyd@unaffiliated/sanjoyd] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 12:29:54 -!- pjb_ [~pjb@81.202.16.46.dyn.user.ono.com] has quit [Quit: from my iPad] 12:31:01 maxm-: As both malloc heap and alien stack are separate from GC'ed heap, GC is usually unrelated to crashes in FFI (except cffi:with-pointer-to-vector-data, of course) 12:31:17 akovalenko: no, but if you give bad pointers etc to C code 12:31:39 it would reference a bad pointer and write to SBCL heap 12:31:49 screwing up object headers and stuff 12:32:33 maxm-: with CFFI, you normally don't pass pointers to SBCL heap at all (be it valid pointers or stale pointers). CFFI:WITH-POINTER-TO-VECTOR-DATA is the only exception 12:33:16 Euthy [~euthy@unaffiliated/euthydemus] has joined #lisp 12:33:16 ljos [~mozzyb@login1.uib.no] has joined #lisp 12:35:35 -!- c_arenz [arenz@nat/ibm/x-fesdayltaqjtkhne] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 12:38:07 not exactly what i'm describing, guess either I'm full of shit or not explaining it correctly.. The scenario I'm talking about is struct foo {something *p1, something *p2, something *p3}; void do_stuff(foo *data)... If you pass bad pointer to do_stuff(), and it does something like (data->p1.member = 1234), what happens in reality is that it takes value at address you gave it (which if bad pointer contains garbage, and likely some 12:38:07 addresses pointing to SBCL areas) 12:38:14 then it takes that pointer and writes to it 12:39:12 if C code does not do any validation, the next time you will uncover the problem is when GC is run.. 12:39:39 Wouldn't it be much simplier to just write that in Lisp instead of C? 12:39:48 maxm-: that's indeed possible, but not likely -- when some absolutely random garbage happens to be a heap pointer to an actually used SBCL heap memory 12:40:19 happened a lot to me for some reason, donno why 12:41:05 -!- anonus [~anonymous@88.80.28.189] has quit [Quit: WeeChat 0.3.5] 12:41:40 anonus [~anonymous@88.80.28.189] has joined #lisp 12:42:21 anyway xwolf- was asking for suggestions, mine was to do (sb-ext:gc :full t), and watch *inferior-lisp* for warnings.. Don't think it will hurt, and it helped me with debugging ffi related code, your mileage may vary 12:42:49 McRibbit [~user@zaza7.ida.liu.se] has joined #lisp 12:44:01 gavinharper [~gavinharp@dyn3-82-128-191-12.psoas.suomi.net] has joined #lisp 12:44:27 -!- hlavaty [~user@91-65-217-112-dynip.superkabel.de] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 12:44:45 hlavaty [~user@91-65-217-112-dynip.superkabel.de] has joined #lisp 12:44:58 -!- skorpia [~proba@cpe-67-244-127-222.nyc.res.rr.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 12:45:04 ngz [~user@201.144.80.79.rev.sfr.net] has joined #lisp 12:47:03 -!- xyxu [~xyxu@222.68.166.159] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 12:48:03 -!- airolson [~airolson@CPE00222d55a738-CM00222d55a735.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com] has quit [] 12:48:44 benkard [~benkard@2001:4ca0:0:f208:e46e:a074:5d7:35ba] has joined #lisp 12:49:01 -!- Euthy [~euthy@unaffiliated/euthydemus] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 12:49:10 -!- benkard [~benkard@2001:4ca0:0:f208:e46e:a074:5d7:35ba] has quit [Client Quit] 12:51:03 -!- ramkrsna [ramkrsna@unaffiliated/ramkrsna] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 12:51:12 Soulman1 [~knute@175.80-202-238.nextgentel.com] has joined #lisp 12:52:12 skorpia [~proba@cpe-67-244-127-222.nyc.res.rr.com] has joined #lisp 12:53:05 kushal [kdas@nat/redhat/x-gxwstoaftohedgbc] has joined #lisp 12:53:05 -!- kushal [kdas@nat/redhat/x-gxwstoaftohedgbc] has quit [Changing host] 12:53:05 kushal [kdas@fedora/kushal] has joined #lisp 12:53:30 -!- Soulman [~knute@175.80-202-238.nextgentel.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 12:54:41 Euthy [~euthy@unaffiliated/euthydemus] has joined #lisp 12:55:17 -!- xwolf- [~xwolf-@76.73.16.26] has quit [Quit: CGI:IRC (Ping timeout)] 13:01:22 xyxu [~xyxu@222.68.162.177] has joined #lisp 13:02:32 -!- Harag [~Harag@iburst-41-213-69-158.iburst.co.za] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 13:03:01 -!- Euthy [~euthy@unaffiliated/euthydemus] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 13:06:22 c_arenz [arenz@nat/ibm/x-cxouebcmvyoqzluz] has joined #lisp 13:06:38 -!- BountyX is now known as pspace 13:08:49 ramusara [~ramusara@220.156.210.236.user.e-catv.ne.jp] has joined #lisp 13:09:01 Euthy [~euthy@unaffiliated/euthydemus] has joined #lisp 13:09:39 -!- dwim [~dwim@213.Red-79-154-73.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net] has quit [Quit: dwim] 13:09:49 -!- pspace [~erhan@adsl-76-241-64-48.dsl.bcvloh.sbcglobal.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 13:10:12 pspace [~andrew@adsl-76-241-64-48.dsl.bcvloh.sbcglobal.net] has joined #lisp 13:11:35 -!- TrystamWrk is now known as TristamWrk 13:14:53 MoALTz [~no@host-92-18-16-12.as13285.net] has joined #lisp 13:14:55 -!- Euthy [~euthy@unaffiliated/euthydemus] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 13:18:19 pnq [~nick@AC820FD8.ipt.aol.com] has joined #lisp 13:20:57 Euthy [~euthy@unaffiliated/euthydemus] has joined #lisp 13:21:10 BrandLeeJones [~BrandLeeJ@chello062178064156.22.11.vie.surfer.at] has joined #lisp 13:21:23 -!- BrandLeeJones [~BrandLeeJ@chello062178064156.22.11.vie.surfer.at] has quit [Client Quit] 13:23:01 -!- francogrex [franco@grex.cyberspace.org] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 13:25:22 LiamH [~none@pdp8.nrl.navy.mil] has joined #lisp 13:30:34 -!- Euthy [~euthy@unaffiliated/euthydemus] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 13:31:16 Euthy [~euthy@unaffiliated/euthydemus] has joined #lisp 13:35:41 hi guys 13:36:05 I want to write a recursive function which solves Pascal's triangle, does anyone have an idea ? 13:36:27 rmarianski [~rmariansk@mail.marianski.com] has joined #lisp 13:36:31 -!- gavinharper [~gavinharp@dyn3-82-128-191-12.psoas.suomi.net] has quit [] 13:37:03 swilde [~wilde@aktaia.intevation.org] has joined #lisp 13:37:40 hakzsam: recursion + memoization 13:37:44 i have got this problem here http://pastie.org/2711547 13:38:07 cfy [~cfy@122.228.131.76] has joined #lisp 13:38:07 -!- cfy [~cfy@122.228.131.76] has quit [Changing host] 13:38:07 cfy [~cfy@unaffiliated/chenfengyuan] has joined #lisp 13:38:11 pascal's is old get onto eulers.... 13:38:12 lol 13:39:38 -!- Euthy [~euthy@unaffiliated/euthydemus] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 13:39:44 akovalenko, so, I already have a function which returns the next line like (pascal-next-line '(1)) => (1 1) 13:39:52 I think I must use (append) or something like this 13:40:29 wbooze: looks like McCLIM wants a different version of CLX 13:40:33 and i get the error of undefined function whether i enable the external clx or not 13:40:45 -!- redline6561_nop is now known as redline6561 13:40:57 and i also tried the cmucl version without the internal clx version, the same error 13:41:01 -!- Brendan_T [~brendan@46.105.251.111] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 13:41:16 so one of the scripts must be buggy.... 13:41:39 -!- H4ns [4ffc8409@gateway/web/freenode/ip.79.252.132.9] has quit [] 13:41:40 wbooze: what scripts? 13:41:53 it tells me that xlib::open-x-stream is in the script dependent.lisp in the clx tree or so 13:41:54 wbooze: in CLX 0.7.4, open-x-stream is in dependent.lisp. Try to find it there (maybe it's undefined for CMU?) 13:42:08 no that's it 13:42:14 it is defined there with +CMU 13:42:29 i just don't know why it does not take effect 13:42:54 wbooze: what does (apropos "OPEN-X-STREAM") tell you? 13:43:03 wbooze: or (describe 'xlib::open-x-stream)? 13:43:03 nothing 13:43:06 Load CLX separately and try (describe 'xlib::open-x-stream) ;; is it defined?. Then load CLIM in the same REPL session. 13:43:31 (find-symbol 'open-x-stream :xlib) tells me it is internal in xlib 13:43:48 it is not defined i tell you 13:43:56 at least that is what it is telling me 13:43:57 -!- gienah [~mwright@ppp121-44-44-207.lns20.syd6.internode.on.net] has quit [Quit: leaving] 13:44:06 it is there, but somehow not defined 13:44:19 wbooze: did you load CLX, or just relied on CLIM dependencies to pull it in? 13:44:39 i loaded clx, with quicklisp too 13:44:41 -!- mcsontos [mcsontos@nat/redhat/x-hqxheknhzpeouyej] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 13:44:43 it does not matter 13:44:53 wbooze: Why are you using cmucl? 13:45:10 i even tried to delete the clx tree of cmucl and put the clx from quicklisp there. and compile..... 13:45:15 did not work out either 13:45:25 Xach: from time to time i'm using cmucl 13:45:32 Xach: it all works with sbcl 13:45:36 -!- xan_ [~xan@183.Red-81-32-69.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net] has quit [Quit: leaving] 13:45:40 Xach: i just wonder why it fails with cmucl 13:45:43 Guest48392 [email@sgi-ultra64.broker.freenet6.net] has joined #lisp 13:45:59 -!- Guest48392 [email@sgi-ultra64.broker.freenet6.net] has quit [Client Quit] 13:46:05 wbooze: does randomly moving stuff around usually help you understand a problem and the correct way to fix it? 13:46:32 i got an illegal function call error when moving the quicklisp clx there and trying compile.... 13:46:36 leo2007 [~leo@123.114.47.164] has joined #lisp 13:47:03 wbooze: Why do you use it from time to time? 13:47:03 maybe it is an ffi error ? 13:47:13 Xach: why not ? 13:47:20 wbooze: i wish your doctor tried to help you with a similar approach (let's try poking this here and see what happens!) 13:48:14 wbooze: hard to build, less active maintenance, smaller community, harder to get support, follow-on affects of shrinking community like less compatibility-testing with cmucl 13:48:29 wbooze: I can think of reasons to use it, too. What's yours? 13:48:32 X-Scale [email@sgi-ultra64.broker.freenet6.net] has joined #lisp 13:48:40 in SLIME, what is the practical difference between C-c C-c and C-M-x when used inside a defun body? the former compiles the function, the latter evaluates it. but evaluating it ends up compiling it too, no? 13:48:57 -!- hlavaty [~user@91-65-217-112-dynip.superkabel.de] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 13:49:03 kennyd: Not necessarily. Some implementations distinguish. 13:49:12 -!- kpreid [~kpreid@128.153.212.250] has quit [Quit: Offline] 13:49:15 hlavaty [~user@91-65-217-112-dynip.superkabel.de] has joined #lisp 13:49:19 kennyd: like cmucl! 13:49:34 what would C-M-x do there? 13:49:40 Xach: do you mean it's embedded C thing ? 13:49:51 interpret it? 13:50:05 kennyd: it would define a new interpreted function. 13:50:14 wbooze: What embedded C thing? 13:50:14 Euthy [~euthy@unaffiliated/euthydemus] has joined #lisp 13:50:22 ok thanks 13:50:39 Xach: forget it..... 13:52:56 hard to build ? 13:52:58 lol 13:53:20 well community gettin smaller is an issue maybe.... 13:54:13 well the building procedure is not all that hard i mean.... 13:54:23 one could even write a script for it..... 13:55:33 loke [~elias@bb115-66-85-121.singnet.com.sg] has joined #lisp 13:55:37 -!- pspace [~andrew@adsl-76-241-64-48.dsl.bcvloh.sbcglobal.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 13:55:53 once you have the source tree, using src/tools/blablah.sh target-dir is not all hard, and the scripts are just a few in order..... 13:56:44 4 or 5 steps and you have your own cmucl.tar.gz files ready to unpack to the /usr dir 13:57:25 -!- Euthy [~euthy@unaffiliated/euthydemus] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 13:57:25 and then it's all about getting your problems fixed by #lisp 13:57:32 easy as that! 13:57:35 lol 13:57:46 -!- pnq [~nick@AC820FD8.ipt.aol.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 13:58:18 ja, that's the part which is heavy, lisp! 13:58:29 wbooze: Still wondering why you use CMUCL sometimes. 13:58:41 jawohl! 13:58:57 drdo [~drdo@85.207.54.77.rev.vodafone.pt] has joined #lisp 13:59:09 oh man, Xach i use clisp and ecl sometimes too, even when ecl sometimes is not even able to get build on my system somehow.... 13:59:30 doctor doctor, it hurts when i do this! 13:59:52 kpreid [~kpreid@128.153.178.144] has joined #lisp 13:59:53 and clisp goes bonkers with ffi more than not often i think..... 14:00:08 wbooze: Is there no actual reason? 14:00:24 I have a problem here http://paste.lisp.org/display/125358, (triangle) doesn't return the *good* result, do you have any ideas, please? 14:00:45 hmm, no not really, apart from maybe getting onto the sources of each to compare someday ? 14:01:20 wbooze: That is a fine reason. 14:01:35 hakzsam: what is the problm? 14:01:44 implementation details and strategies..... 14:01:55 hmm, yes, but i'm not there yet.... 14:02:19 pnq [~nick@AC820FD8.ipt.aol.com] has joined #lisp 14:02:33 _pixel [~pixel@dsl21-20.pool.bitel.net] has joined #lisp 14:02:34 jdz, (triangle 2) returns ((1 2 1)) instead of ((1) (1 1) (1 2 1)) 14:02:38 so i ran into some strange sbcl/slime behavoiur yesterday that i was wondering if someone might be able to explain to me, or tell me its a bug 14:02:44 antgreen [~user@bas3-toronto06-2925097843.dsl.bell.ca] has joined #lisp 14:03:06 i was running some lisp code using the --script behaviour of sbcl, starting a swank server at the start of the code 14:03:16 when i ran the code directly, it didn't work 14:03:27 kruhft: "directly"? 14:03:35 but when i did a slime-connect to the server and loaded the function that wasn't working it started working 14:03:43 directly by running the script 14:03:44 hakzsam: why do you think it does that? 14:03:47 hakzsam: append has a single argument. 14:03:48 hakzsam: (defun triangle* (n) (loop for i from 0 to n append (triangle i))) 14:03:49 kruhft: what didn't work? 14:04:01 ISF [~ivan@187.106.48.51] has joined #lisp 14:04:18 hakzsam: I mean, your call to append has a single argument. Therefore the result list will have a single argument. Nothing surprizing here. 14:04:27 i can't really say, one thing was that it had print statements that weren't being called when i ran it as a script but started working after loading the function with slime 14:04:43 plus the actual code wasn't doing what it was supposed to do until I loaded it from slime 14:04:56 kruhft: how do you know they weren't being called? 14:05:19 because i didn't load anything else other than the single function that wasn't working 14:05:29 pjb, mmh... ok 14:05:32 using M-C-x 14:05:34 -!- xyxu [~xyxu@222.68.162.177] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 14:05:47 kruhft: I mean: How did you know there was a problem? 14:06:01 kruhft: What were the symptoms? What did you see when you decided "I need to try something else to get this working" 14:06:15 because i would modify the code in the function (to add debugging prints), re-run the script and the prints would never be shown 14:06:19 dlowe [~dlowe@50-77-31-237-static.hfc.comcastbusiness.net] has joined #lisp 14:06:34 kruhft: Could it be a matter of input buffering? 14:06:38 then through trial and error i would slime-connect and i tried loading the function and blam, it started working 14:06:40 output buffering, i mean. 14:07:07 i don't think so because the function didn't do what it was supposed to be doing, which was push an element on a list 14:07:37 kruhft: What does the script look like? 14:08:11 not too long, about 2 pages, with some functions and variables at the top and a loop at the bottom 14:08:26 i mean, could you paste it? 14:08:30 oh...haha 14:08:33 no, not right now 14:08:38 it's at home and i'm at work 14:09:07 sorry 14:09:28 i was starting to think that there might be something strange about the --script option to sbcl 14:09:35 but i haven't had any problems with it before 14:11:07 --script does set up a different kind of environment than plain sbcl. it doesn't load init files, for example. 14:14:23 well it was very odd and frustrating behaviour 14:14:53 and what about this failure ? http://pastie.org/2711721 14:15:20 realitygrill [~realitygr@adsl-76-226-97-62.dsl.sfldmi.sbcglobal.net] has joined #lisp 14:15:43 wbooze: sounds like you have unbalanced delimiters in the file, e.g. ( without ) or a stray " 14:16:12 wbooze: since READ-LIST is on your stack, my money is on an unclosed ( 14:16:24 oh ok, thank you 14:17:19 Xach: I have a small issue with your last tip. For most users, dropping into a debugger to select a restart is not an acceptable interface. 14:18:18 Though it's great for the lisper sysadmin who just needs to get a bunch of stuff done 14:19:22 dlowe: I would change "for most users" to "in most contexts where you want to change control flow" 14:19:42 xyxu [~xyxu@222.68.154.81] has joined #lisp 14:19:43 -!- hyoyoung [~morris@210.117.152.122] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 14:19:44 This is an example of how to use interactive restarts in a particular context, not a reason to use it exclusively or predominantly. 14:19:47 cesarbp [~cbolano@189.247.126.160] has joined #lisp 14:19:56 I did say a small issue 14:20:29 ok, it works fine now, however is this possible to improve/factorize the following code http://paste.lisp.org/display/125360 ? 14:21:00 dlowe: Do you think it needs a disclaimer or more contextualizing? 14:22:00 No. I'm not even sure why I mentioned it 14:22:11 pjb, Is this better to use push+loop instead of recursion in my example ? 14:23:37 well the debugger is ok, in the background or so..... 14:23:49 dlowe: Well, thanks for mentioning it. I use CL more and more for sysadmin-type tasks, so this kind of thing saves me some hassle. 14:24:08 -!- jaminja [~jaminja@unaffiliated/jaminja] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 14:24:57 realitygrill_ [~realitygr@adsl-76-226-108-251.dsl.sfldmi.sbcglobal.net] has joined #lisp 14:24:57 Like during "update all Quicklisp-tracked repos", sometimes I want to bail out if there's an obvious big problem and sometimes I want to just skip one-off problems. 14:25:14 jaminja [~jaminja@85.17.232.145] has joined #lisp 14:25:14 -!- jaminja [~jaminja@85.17.232.145] has quit [Changing host] 14:25:14 jaminja [~jaminja@unaffiliated/jaminja] has joined #lisp 14:25:24 Most of the time I want to skip one-offs and it's easy enough to add (with-skipping ...) to automatically invoke the right restart. 14:25:51 -!- realitygrill [~realitygr@adsl-76-226-97-62.dsl.sfldmi.sbcglobal.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 14:25:52 -!- realitygrill_ is now known as realitygrill 14:25:56 Hooray for the condition system and interactive restarts! 14:26:32 yeah, the condition system is one of the golden parts of CL that hasn't been touched by anything else 14:27:01 milanj [~milanj_@109-93-193-219.dynamic.isp.telekom.rs] has joined #lisp 14:29:06 -!- realitygrill [~realitygr@adsl-76-226-108-251.dsl.sfldmi.sbcglobal.net] has quit [Client Quit] 14:31:37 pnathan [~Adium@76.178.165.160] has joined #lisp 14:33:10 -!- lundis [~lundis@dyn56-31.yok.fi] has quit [Quit: Fear not, I will return] 14:33:16 -!- BlankVerse [~pankajm@103.246.106.35] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 14:33:41 Euthy [~euthy@unaffiliated/euthydemus] has joined #lisp 14:35:45 -!- cfy [~cfy@unaffiliated/chenfengyuan] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 14:36:17 Bike [~Glossina@69.166.35.233] has joined #lisp 14:37:08 *JuanDaugherty* realizes I had given it short schrift due to it (Ch. 29) being marked with a changebar in my ancient edition of CLtL as a new and untried thing. 14:37:36 -!- xyxu [~xyxu@222.68.154.81] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 14:38:49 dl [~download@chpcwl01.hpc.unm.edu] has joined #lisp 14:41:12 -!- Euthy [~euthy@unaffiliated/euthydemus] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 14:43:55 :cmucl is now in *features*! 14:44:00 heh 14:44:12 maybe that's why ? 14:44:31 #+CMU does that match :cmucl ? 14:44:40 wbooze: No. 14:44:47 ahah 14:45:30 in my cmucl, :cmu is also in *features*. 14:45:43 oh 14:45:47 so it should match 14:46:58 Euthy [~euthy@unaffiliated/euthydemus] has joined #lisp 14:53:01 -!- Euthy [~euthy@unaffiliated/euthydemus] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 14:53:29 xyxu [~xyxu@222.68.155.238] has joined #lisp 14:53:47 -!- kpreid [~kpreid@128.153.178.144] has quit [Quit: Offline] 14:54:09 -!- sonnym1 [~sonny@rrcs-184-74-137-69.nys.biz.rr.com] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 14:54:35 -!- nha [~prefect@imamac13.epfl.ch] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 14:57:51 Athas [~athas@130.225.165.40] has joined #lisp 14:58:43 -!- pnq [~nick@AC820FD8.ipt.aol.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 14:58:53 -!- MoALTz [~no@host-92-18-16-12.as13285.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 14:59:50 kpreid [~kpreid@128.153.178.144] has joined #lisp 15:02:01 -!- skorpia [~proba@cpe-67-244-127-222.nyc.res.rr.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 15:02:43 skorpia [~proba@cpe-67-244-127-222.nyc.res.rr.com] has joined #lisp 15:06:20 -!- araujo [~araujo@gentoo/developer/araujo] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 15:08:20 Euthy [~euthy@unaffiliated/euthydemus] has joined #lisp 15:08:26 qqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqqw2qwwwwwwwwwddsdsxggggggggggggggggg 15:08:26 ' 15:08:48 ups, sorry 15:09:00 -!- skorpia [~proba@cpe-67-244-127-222.nyc.res.rr.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 15:09:20 Davidbrcz [~david@proxysup.isae.fr] has joined #lisp 15:10:02 blackwolf [~blackwolf@ool-43568cfa.dyn.optonline.net] has joined #lisp 15:11:52 does anyone have an idea for writing a function which does something like this : (my-function '(a a a b b c a) => (3 2 1 1) (.ie it counts the number of occurence and returns a list) ? 15:12:03 araujo [~araujo@gentoo/developer/araujo] has joined #lisp 15:12:48 some CS professor might have an idea 15:14:23 (defun my-function (list) (when (equal list '(a a a b b c a)) (list 3 2 1 1))) 15:14:36 hakzsam: that should do what you ask 15:14:42 skorpia [~proba@cpe-67-244-127-222.nyc.res.rr.com] has joined #lisp 15:14:46 it fulfills the test case, at least 15:15:09 -!- McRibbit [~user@zaza7.ida.liu.se] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 15:15:26 -!- c_arenz [arenz@nat/ibm/x-cxouebcmvyoqzluz] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 15:15:29 is find-symbol case sensitive ? 15:15:34 wbooze: yes 15:15:56 (find-symbol "open-x-stream" :xlib) gets me nil nil, while the upcase version shows me it's internal in xlib 15:15:58 oh ok 15:16:03 -!- aiju [~aiju@unaffiliated/aiju] has left #lisp 15:16:25 wbooze: common lisp symbols are always case sensitive 15:17:26 -!- Euthy [~euthy@unaffiliated/euthydemus] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 15:17:36 ternal in xlib 15:17:45 oops 15:18:19 Euthy [~euthy@unaffiliated/euthydemus] has joined #lisp 15:19:16 -!- ccorn [~ccorn@84-53-64-50.adsl.unet.nl] has quit [Quit: ccorn] 15:19:24 dlowe, thanks but your function is not *generic*... 15:22:03 hakzsam: (defgeneric my-function (list) (:method ((list t)) (when (equal list '(a a a b b c a)) (list 3 2 1 1)))) 15:22:20 jdz: I was totally going to do that 15:22:41 dlowe: aww, sorry i spoiled it for you. 15:23:19 nyef [~nyef@c-174-63-105-188.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 15:23:22 jdz: the important thing is that it was done 15:23:30 Hello all. 15:26:44 -!- Euthy [~euthy@unaffiliated/euthydemus] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 15:29:43 -!- _pixel [~pixel@dsl21-20.pool.bitel.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 15:30:24 wbooze: symbol *names* are case sensitive. the lisp reader, however, upcases symbol names by default, e.g. (symbol-name (with-standard-io-syntax (read-from-string "a-symbol"))) => "A-SYMBOL" 15:30:25 wbooze: best way to work around this is something like (find-symbol (string '#:a-symbol)) 15:31:35 where you write a-symbol just about the same way you'd write if you could rely on the :xlib package to be loaded at compile-time 15:32:40 Euthy [~euthy@unaffiliated/euthydemus] has joined #lisp 15:37:03 (describe xlib::open-x-frame) just tells me it's an internal symbol in the xlib package.... 15:37:14 -!- mvilleneuve [~mvilleneu@LLagny-156-36-4-214.w80-14.abo.wanadoo.fr] has quit [Quit: Lost terminal] 15:37:38 wbooze: you can't even copy/paste properly... 15:37:44 ... I definitely don't remember any open-x-frame symbol in xlib. 15:38:32 ikki [~ikki@201.155.92.12] has joined #lisp 15:38:46 Then again, it's not like I actually memorized all of the (rather horrifying) guts of CLX. 15:38:49 wbooze: and when you do paste properly, you will learn that just using the xlib::open-x-frame will bring it into existence 15:39:11 Spion [~spion@unaffiliated/spion] has joined #lisp 15:39:22 ? 15:39:31 ... unless the xlib package is locked. Is there any reason not to lock the xlib package? 15:40:00 nyef: nikodemus speculated what might happen if you locked all new packages after loading. 15:40:20 it certainly was an eye-opener for alexandria 15:40:46 ... Is there a way to specify that a package should be locked on creation via defpackage/ 15:40:47 ? 15:41:06 I don't think so. I think an asdf method might suffice. 15:41:12 Or just using an instrumented asdf. 15:41:27 nyef: yep (:lock t) 15:41:30 -!- Spion_ [~spion@unaffiliated/spion] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 15:41:45 Ooh. I'm going to have to try adding that to all of my defpackages. 15:42:06 I'm fairly sure I don't do anything that would run into trouble, but it'd be nice to know for sure. 15:42:21 _pixel [~pixel@dsl17-46.pool.bitel.net] has joined #lisp 15:42:25 wildnux [~wildnux@237.170.pengaton.net] has joined #lisp 15:43:21 jdz, dlowe, I'm sorry but actually, I want to write the inverse of this function http://paste.lisp.org/display/125364 15:43:32 I mean (compress) 15:43:50 do you have any ideas ? 15:44:57 hakzsam: can you properly state the problem (what you want to do) in english? 15:45:16 hakzsam: mapcan might be helpful there! 15:45:22 sonnym [~sonny@rrcs-72-43-20-246.nys.biz.rr.com] has joined #lisp 15:45:31 *Xach* does not use mapcan as often as he wishes 15:45:43 benkard [~benkard@141.84.69.67] has joined #lisp 15:45:46 Kron [~Kron@129-97-120-44.uwaterloo.ca] has joined #lisp 15:45:56 nha [~prefect@5-74.104-92.cust.bluewin.ch] has joined #lisp 15:45:58 (map 'list (lambda (x) (cons x 1)) input) ? 15:46:02 pick up that mapcan 15:46:13 -!- Kron is now known as Guest38536 15:46:28 -!- Euthy [~euthy@unaffiliated/euthydemus] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 15:47:02 Euthy [~euthy@unaffiliated/euthydemus] has joined #lisp 15:47:56 jdz, I want to write something like this http://paste.lisp.org/display/125366 15:49:25 that's not really trivial for a newcomer :] 15:49:25 hakzsam: http://groups.google.com/group/comp.lang.lisp/search?group=comp.lang.lisp&q=compress+graham&qt_g=Search+this+group might have some ideas. 15:49:30 comp.lang.lisp, january 2011ff 15:49:49 -!- prip [~foo@host233-122-dynamic.53-79-r.retail.telecomitalia.it] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 15:50:00 hakzsam: spelling out what it is you want to do will get you more than halfway there actually 15:50:09 hakzsam: that is all i can do for you now, sorry 15:50:12 eudoxia [~eudoxia@r190-135-70-66.dialup.adsl.anteldata.net.uy] has joined #lisp 15:50:12 -!- jdz [~jdz@193.206.22.97] has quit [Quit: Byebye.] 15:52:25 -!- Odin- [~sbkhh@adsl-2-92.du.snerpa.is] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 15:53:07 -!- eudoxia [~eudoxia@r190-135-70-66.dialup.adsl.anteldata.net.uy] has left #lisp 15:55:25 -!- Euthy [~euthy@unaffiliated/euthydemus] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 15:57:28 H4ns [5b3d5bfa@gateway/web/freenode/ip.91.61.91.250] has joined #lisp 15:58:13 -!- em [~em@unaffiliated/emma] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 15:59:09 em [~em@unaffiliated/emma] has joined #lisp 15:59:13 dboswell [dpb@SDF.ORG] has joined #lisp 15:59:48 prip [~foo@host233-122-dynamic.53-79-r.retail.telecomitalia.it] has joined #lisp 16:00:41 katesmith_ [~katesmith@unaffiliated/costume] has joined #lisp 16:00:48 hakzsam: are you using punch cards? 16:00:59 Punch cards are expensive. 16:01:14 I'd understand if you're using punch card that you want to pack as much as you can on a single line... 16:01:26 -!- wildnux [~wildnux@237.170.pengaton.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 16:02:26 no, I'm not using punch cards :) 16:02:31 Maybe he has one of those 4-line 80-column screens that are popular on portable computers... from radio shack in the '80s. 16:03:42 hakzsam: then don't write "(if (null list) list" on the same line. Write two lines, "(if (null list)" and " list". 16:03:48 dto [~dto@pool-96-252-89-130.bstnma.fios.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 16:03:55 hakzsam: otherwise, we could take your else form for the then form... 16:04:12 pjb: when using punch cards, you need to remember to put one with )))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))) at the end of the stack, if you're feeding it to Lisp :) 16:04:19 Yep. 16:04:35 it's funny yet practical :D 16:04:50 -!- em [~em@unaffiliated/emma] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 16:05:01 em [~em@unaffiliated/emma] has joined #lisp 16:05:05 -!- gravicappa [~gravicapp@80.90.116.82] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 16:05:29 -!- Bike [~Glossina@69.166.35.233] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 16:05:36 I'm sorry but I think I never wrote "(if (null list) list" on the same line... 16:05:41 waltwhite [~waltwhite@168-170-33-178.dsl.ovh.net] has joined #lisp 16:05:42 -!- katesmith_ [~katesmith@unaffiliated/costume] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 16:06:24 Euthy [~euthy@unaffiliated/euthydemus] has joined #lisp 16:06:32 hakzsam: have a look at your paste. 16:07:49 ok xlib::open-x-stream is not a function just a symbol in package :xlib, so why did it not get defined ? 16:07:58 Bike [~Glossina@69.166.35.233] has joined #lisp 16:08:04 pjb, do you mean this paste http://paste.lisp.org/display/125364 ? 16:08:16 gffa [~gffa@unaffiliated/gffa] has joined #lisp 16:08:27 wbooze: Because... you created it yourself? 16:08:31 no 16:08:34 def. not 16:09:04 -!- Davidbrcz [~david@proxysup.isae.fr] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 16:09:06 it's a function defined in the dependent.lisp file of clx 16:09:26 wbooze: you realize that just typing in xlib::open-x-stream into the reader will create the symbol 16:09:28 Yeah, I see it now. 16:09:31 but somehow it does not get into the xlib package of cmucl after compiling, the function i mean, the symbol is there.... 16:09:35 Davidbrcz [~david@proxysup.isae.fr] has joined #lisp 16:09:49 It's in my running SBCL image. 16:09:58 -!- em [~em@unaffiliated/emma] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 16:10:27 jewel [~jewel@196-215-114-21.dynamic.isadsl.co.za] has joined #lisp 16:10:32 ok, so i could have created the symbol myself, but well, what prevents the definition to get into xlib package in case of cmucl, cause it's defined in the xlib package in clx 16:10:51 and for sbcl there's no problem.... 16:10:54 it's just there.... 16:11:07 em [~em@unaffiliated/emma] has joined #lisp 16:11:29 I'd say it's probably called from somewhere. 16:11:30 wait, that's a good idea, i check it in sbcl too 16:11:38 -!- Euthy [~euthy@unaffiliated/euthydemus] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 16:11:41 Oh, it's implemented for SBCL. 16:11:59 See if you can figure out what's going on. It's somewhat amusing. 16:12:03 -!- kpreid [~kpreid@128.153.178.144] has quit [Quit: Offline] 16:12:19 antifuchs [~foobar@care.boinkor.net] has joined #lisp 16:12:24 no i read on cmucl, that the mit-magic-cookie something was not implemented in cmucl and that there maybe problems connecting the clx to the X server.... 16:12:34 pjb_ [~pjb@81.202.16.46.dyn.user.ono.com] has joined #lisp 16:12:42 but i don't know if it would be that error message i got, getting printed..... 16:12:48 ... how did this ever work on cmucl? 16:13:09 Seriously, open-display (in display.lisp) calls open-x-stream. 16:16:15 -!- em [~em@unaffiliated/emma] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 16:17:19 naeg [~naeg@194.208.239.170] has joined #lisp 16:17:31 em [~em@unaffiliated/emma] has joined #lisp 16:17:35 -!- Amyn [~abennama@64.208.49.45] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 16:17:45 Euthy [~euthy@unaffiliated/euthydemus] has joined #lisp 16:17:45 so it should not be internal in xlib then ? 16:17:49 Amadiro [~Amadiro@1x-193-157-202-229.uio.no] has joined #lisp 16:17:57 xlib:open-x-stream ? instead of xlib::open-x-stream ? 16:20:09 -!- e-user [e-user@nat/nokia/x-rteeecxflzdaauiu] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 16:20:17 nyef: wbooze started with the paste at http://pastie.org/2711547 and assured us that (in the source file) "it is defined there with +CMU", but it's somehow doesn't get defined. Dunno where he's got his CLX (current quicklispable 0.7.4 doesn't define open-x-stream on CMU, as I can see) 16:20:25 -!- ISF [~ivan@187.106.48.51] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 16:21:34 -!- xyxu [~xyxu@222.68.155.238] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 16:22:11 akovalenko: current clx is only written mostly for sbcl! 16:22:37 -!- em [~em@unaffiliated/emma] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 16:22:42 akovalenko: the clx from cmucl's source is more general, adapted to different running lisps 16:22:50 Qworkescence [~quad@unaffiliated/quadrescence] has joined #lisp 16:23:22 wishbone4 [~user@167.216.131.126] has joined #lisp 16:23:33 wbooze: um, current clx is forked off portable clx, and should definitely not be sbcl-only 16:23:38 -!- gaidal_ [~gaidal@59.41.115.14] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 16:23:59 (allegro uses it too, AFAICT) 16:24:19 the problem is, i now just did a (describe 'xlib::open-x-stream) in sbcl, and xlib::open-x-stream is a symbol in :xlib and open-x-stream has a lamda-list and a derived type definition for a function.... 16:24:36 em [~em@unaffiliated/emma] has joined #lisp 16:25:08 hmmm, ok left is only some read-macro magic happening then ? or some pcl derivation and ffi stuff ? 16:25:46 wbooze: If you check dependent.lisp, you should find several versions of open-x-stream protected by various reader conditionals. 16:25:53 yes 16:26:06 and +CMU is another definition which should work 16:26:13 None of which are used when :CMU is on the feature list. 16:26:23 -!- Blkt [~user@89-96-199-46.ip13.fastwebnet.it] has quit [Quit: going home] 16:26:27 what does +CMU mean ? 16:26:35 when :cmu is on the feature list ? 16:26:47 or that it is absent ? 16:27:15 i think that it is present, not absent 16:27:37 so when it is the case that :cmu is on the *features* thing, then do read the definition of ....blah 16:29:01 or rather when :cmu is found on the feature list, then allow the definition of the following function to propagate into the repl/currentpackage/runtime whatever.... 16:29:03 -!- wishbone4 [~user@167.216.131.126] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 16:29:04 -!- em [~em@unaffiliated/emma] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 16:29:16 not ? 16:29:30 -!- Euthy [~euthy@unaffiliated/euthydemus] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 16:29:39 em [~em@unaffiliated/emma] has joined #lisp 16:29:45 ok when the function was just broke, then it still would get into the runtime 16:29:55 but since it does not get into the runtime, something else is borked.... 16:30:13 -!- ehu [~ehuels@109.38.61.172] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 16:30:25 or ? 16:33:35 There is no #+cmu version of the function. 16:33:50 ISF [~ivan@187.106.48.51] has joined #lisp 16:34:12 not in the clx of quicklisp, but cmu comes with it's own clx, and the dependent.lisp contains a #+cmu version of it in there 16:34:23 -!- |3b| [foobar@cpe-72-179-19-4.austin.res.rr.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 16:35:20 -!- _3b [foobar@cpe-72-179-19-4.austin.res.rr.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 16:35:32 -!- em [~em@unaffiliated/emma] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 16:35:56 -!- mstevens [~mstevens@fsf/member/pdpc.active.mstevens] has quit [Quit: leaving] 16:35:56 em [~em@unaffiliated/emma] has joined #lisp 16:36:37 oh man i wished i could search a regex with find or so 16:36:40 _3b [foobar@cpe-72-179-19-4.austin.res.rr.com] has joined #lisp 16:36:51 here's what I get after (require :clx) in CMUCL 20b snapshot (where precompiled CLX is included): OPEN-X-STREAM is an internal symbol in the XLIB package. 16:36:51 Function: # 16:36:51 16:36:51 16:37:00 SegFaultAX [~mkbernard@173.228.45.162] has joined #lisp 16:37:03 |3b| [foobar@cpe-72-179-19-4.austin.res.rr.com] has joined #lisp 16:37:10 it's obviously defined. 16:38:13 akovalenko: Are you pulling the CMUCL CLX or the one in quicklisp? 16:38:18 wbooze: try (require :clx) before quicklisp is loaded 16:38:25 oh 16:38:57 nyef: CMUCL one (and I didn't load quicklisp at all now) 16:39:33 Mmm. You'd expect that the CMUCL people might fix minor problems like not being able to connect to any X server at all before release, wouldn't you? 16:40:00 gravicappa [~gravicapp@ppp91-77-184-203.pppoe.mtu-net.ru] has joined #lisp 16:40:06 Euthy [~euthy@vaxjo7.69.cust.blixtvik.net] has joined #lisp 16:40:12 -!- Euthy [~euthy@vaxjo7.69.cust.blixtvik.net] has quit [Changing host] 16:40:12 Euthy [~euthy@unaffiliated/euthydemus] has joined #lisp 16:40:36 nyef: open-default-display works for me as well 16:41:39 akovalenko: Well, yes. It would, wouldn't it? 16:41:45 nyef: I suspect that wbooze accidentally got Quicklisp's CLX even when CMUCL one was supposed to be used 16:41:46 -!- em [~em@unaffiliated/emma] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 16:42:14 I suspect that I should find what changes the CMUCL people (rtoy?) made and apply them upstream. 16:42:22 em [~em@unaffiliated/emma] has joined #lisp 16:42:38 wishbone4 [~user@167.216.131.126] has joined #lisp 16:43:41 erm, i edited my init file to not load clx of quicklisp at all 16:43:52 and even erased all cache files and slime files.... 16:45:09 and compiled my cmucl with clx feature, so and it lists it as loaded when it starts with noinit, since clx is builtin then.... 16:45:11 wbooze: DESCRIBE of some known CLX function should tell you the source path it was compiled from. 16:47:15 -!- Euthy [~euthy@unaffiliated/euthydemus] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 16:47:17 -!- em [~em@unaffiliated/emma] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 16:47:28 -!- katesmith [~katesmith@unaffiliated/costume] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 16:48:51 require :clx before quicklisp is loaded is one approach i think....wait i'm loading mcclim now 16:49:00 i'll see if the listener starts 16:49:09 em [~em@unaffiliated/emma] has joined #lisp 16:49:40 -!- swilde [~wilde@aktaia.intevation.org] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 16:52:45 -!- dlowe [~dlowe@50-77-31-237-static.hfc.comcastbusiness.net] has quit [Quit: *poof*] 16:52:46 katesmith [~katesmith@75-138-199-162.static.snfr.nc.charter.com] has joined #lisp 16:52:46 -!- katesmith [~katesmith@75-138-199-162.static.snfr.nc.charter.com] has quit [Changing host] 16:52:46 katesmith [~katesmith@unaffiliated/costume] has joined #lisp 16:53:01 -!- H4ns [5b3d5bfa@gateway/web/freenode/ip.91.61.91.250] has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 16:54:43 -!- em [~em@unaffiliated/emma] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 16:54:48 kpreid [~kpreid@128.153.212.194] has joined #lisp 16:54:50 wahahaha, ok got it 16:54:54 hilarious 16:55:01 it starts 16:55:07 oh man 16:55:12 em [~em@user-0ccem0s.cable.mindspring.com] has joined #lisp 16:55:13 -!- em [~em@user-0ccem0s.cable.mindspring.com] has quit [Changing host] 16:55:13 em [~em@unaffiliated/emma] has joined #lisp 16:57:12 wbooze: be aware that ASDF hooks into REQUIRE (and Quicklisp, in turn, hooks into ASDF). That's why I advised to (require :CLX) *before* Quicklisp is loaded. 16:57:55 fmeyer [~fmeyer@201.87.5.80.user.ajato.com.br] has joined #lisp 16:58:01 so require is at the same time asdf, and quicklisp is both asdf and require 16:59:52 so what is this warning: startup-code version (6) different from core version (4), you may lose big ? 17:00:15 -!- em [~em@unaffiliated/emma] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 17:00:21 REQUIRE is the same as ASDF:LOAD-SYSTEM (on those implementations where ASDF knows how to extend REQUIRE). And quicklisp extends asdf by adding a new item to ASDF:*SYSTEM-DEFINITION-SEARCH-FUNCTIONS*, so after quicklisp is loaded, (asdf:load-system) will examine QL directories (though not download anything).. 17:00:35 -!- pjb_ [~pjb@81.202.16.46.dyn.user.ono.com] has quit [Quit: from my iPad] 17:01:34 wbooze: On CMUCL? Sounds like a newer runtime and an older core image. 17:01:50 em [~em@unaffiliated/emma] has joined #lisp 17:01:55 sanjoyd [~sanjoyd@unaffiliated/sanjoyd] has joined #lisp 17:01:57 wbooze: SBCL would actually refuse to load the core under such circumstances. 17:02:32 Of course, it could be something else entirely. 17:02:57 Euthy [~euthy@unaffiliated/euthydemus] has joined #lisp 17:03:34 erm how comes ? i mean i got the source and compiled from there, with everything removed from the build before rm'ed /usr/lib/cmucl and /usr/bin/lisp and .cache and .slime in my $HOME 17:04:27 -!- dto [~dto@pool-96-252-89-130.bstnma.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 17:04:29 and obviously multi processing is not working properly with clim-listener in cmucl 17:05:14 hi 17:05:18 when i start it as an own process, the listener is unresponsive and in the cmucl repl i see only gc messages, not even a prompt, tho when i type something it is responsive, and the prompt reappears 17:05:33 so :new-process t is a no-go 17:06:07 doritos [~joshua@c-76-118-155-244.hsd1.ct.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 17:06:15 -!- fmeyer [~fmeyer@201.87.5.80.user.ajato.com.br] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 17:06:20 BlankVerse [~pankajm@202.3.77.219] has joined #lisp 17:06:21 wbooze: Please get support elsewhere for your aimless dicking around. 17:06:36 Private messages, perhaps. 17:07:02 oconnore [~Eric@75-150-66-254-NewEngland.hfc.comcastbusiness.net] has joined #lisp 17:07:05 i have put mp as a feature in the cmucl build and even put a #+:mp (unless mp::*initial-process* 17:07:06 (mp::startup-idle-and-top-level-loops)) in my init file 17:07:27 -!- nyef [~nyef@c-174-63-105-188.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 17:07:32 -!- em [~em@unaffiliated/emma] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 17:07:34 zenlunatic [~justin@c-68-48-40-231.hsd1.md.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 17:07:46 wbooze: Enough. 17:07:47 FreeArtMan [~FreeArtMa@93.177.213.54] has joined #lisp 17:08:27 pspace [~andrew@csu-137-148-246-169.csuohio.edu] has joined #lisp 17:09:14 -!- Davidbrcz [~david@proxysup.isae.fr] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 17:09:41 Davidbrcz [~david@proxysup.isae.fr] has joined #lisp 17:09:56 -!- Macro [5f53543c@gateway/web/freenode/ip.95.83.84.60] has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 17:14:34 -!- antoszka [~antoszka@unaffiliated/antoszka] has quit [Quit: +++ killed by SIGSEGV +++] 17:16:33 pause! 17:16:42 break!n!peace! 17:16:57 BountyX [~andrew@69.54.63.114] has joined #lisp 17:17:12 Odin- [~sbkhh@adsl-2-92.du.snerpa.is] has joined #lisp 17:17:14 -!- pspace [~andrew@csu-137-148-246-169.csuohio.edu] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 17:17:45 -!- BountyX [~andrew@69.54.63.114] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 17:18:54 brain seems to have shut down. what's a simple way to convert a sequence of ASCII character codes into a string? (e.g. #(97 98 99) => "abc") 17:19:07 nyef [~nyef@c-174-63-105-188.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 17:19:20 em [~em@unaffiliated/emma] has joined #lisp 17:19:20 (map 'string 'ascii-to-char #(97 98 99)) 17:19:30 blackwolf: this will work, usually: (map 'string 'code-char sequence) 17:19:43 -!- Euthy [~euthy@unaffiliated/euthydemus] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 17:19:48 -!- bege [~bege@S0106001d7e5132b0.ed.shawcable.net] has quit [Quit: leaving] 17:19:50 it's not specified to, but it probably will. 17:20:04 Xach: pjb probably has com.informatimago***ascii-to-char for EBCDIC lisps :) 17:20:14 blackwolf: I mean: (map 'string 'COM.INFORMATIMAGO.COMMON-LISP.CESARUM.ASCII:CODE-ASCII #(97 98 99)) 17:20:14 lbc [~quassel@1908ds1-aboes.0.fullrate.dk] has joined #lisp 17:20:25 pjb/Xach: yeah, that's what I wanted. knew there was an easier way than multiple coerce calls. thx 17:20:29 Euthy [~euthy@unaffiliated/euthydemus] has joined #lisp 17:20:58 I had some project or other that did a compile-time assertion that ascii was really in effect. I don't do that lately, maybe I should... 17:21:03 -!- Guest38536 [~Kron@129-97-120-44.uwaterloo.ca] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 17:21:57 -!- JuanDaugherty [~Ren@cpe-72-228-177-92.buffalo.res.rr.com] has quit [Quit: Exeunt IRC] 17:22:18 JuanDaugherty [~Ren@cpe-72-228-177-92.buffalo.res.rr.com] has joined #lisp 17:22:28 -!- Davidbrcz [~david@proxysup.isae.fr] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 17:23:23 -!- dl [~download@chpcwl01.hpc.unm.edu] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 17:23:34 dl [~download@chpcwl01.hpc.unm.edu] has joined #lisp 17:23:58 -!- BlankVerse [~pankajm@202.3.77.219] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 17:24:55 -!- em [~em@unaffiliated/emma] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 17:26:18 -!- turnipseed [~cms@c-98-246-47-184.hsd1.or.comcast.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 17:30:31 mcsontos [~mcsontos@hotspot8.rywasoft.net] has joined #lisp 17:31:17 prxq [~mommer@mnhm-5f75c035.pool.mediaWays.net] has joined #lisp 17:32:20 -!- simplechat [~simplecha@unaffiliated/simplechat] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 17:34:05 -!- Euthy [~euthy@unaffiliated/euthydemus] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 17:34:54 Euthy [~euthy@unaffiliated/euthydemus] has joined #lisp 17:36:37 Xach: Full 7-bit ASCII, including control characters? 17:36:46 em_ [~em@user-0ccem0s.cable.mindspring.com] has joined #lisp 17:37:16 nyef: Not that thorough. 17:38:00 antoszka [~antoszka@unaffiliated/antoszka] has joined #lisp 17:38:17 Ah. 17:41:36 -!- Euthy [~euthy@unaffiliated/euthydemus] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 17:42:10 hi 17:42:11 Euthy [~euthy@unaffiliated/euthydemus] has joined #lisp 17:42:23 Kron [~Kron@129-97-120-44.uwaterloo.ca] has joined #lisp 17:42:38 -!- em_ [~em@user-0ccem0s.cable.mindspring.com] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 17:42:49 -!- Kron is now known as Guest33063 17:43:20 em_ [~em@user-0ccem0s.cable.mindspring.com] has joined #lisp 17:43:42 -!- Xach [~xach@pdpc/supporter/professional/xach] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 17:44:41 -!- gravicappa [~gravicapp@ppp91-77-184-203.pppoe.mtu-net.ru] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 17:45:16 dlowe [dlowe@nat/google/x-bjzpmsblsqnawzzv] has joined #lisp 17:46:34 Xach [~xach@pdpc/supporter/professional/xach] has joined #lisp 17:47:26 -!- katesmith [~katesmith@unaffiliated/costume] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 17:47:48 katesmith [~katesmith@75-138-199-162.static.snfr.nc.charter.com] has joined #lisp 17:47:48 -!- katesmith [~katesmith@75-138-199-162.static.snfr.nc.charter.com] has quit [Changing host] 17:47:48 katesmith [~katesmith@unaffiliated/costume] has joined #lisp 17:48:19 Ralith: did you solve your problem with the inline cfunc? 17:48:25 nope 17:48:28 -!- em_ [~em@user-0ccem0s.cable.mindspring.com] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 17:48:32 postponed it until inlining matters 17:48:37 which may never occur 17:48:51 em_ [~em@user-0ccem0s.cable.mindspring.com] has joined #lisp 17:49:18 -!- skorpia [~proba@cpe-67-244-127-222.nyc.res.rr.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 17:49:27 -!- ISF [~ivan@187.106.48.51] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 17:49:57 Ralith: I remember that I did something similar at some point. I just created a symbol with the name of the func in || notation, like internal::|F_this_and_that|. That should work here too as these are full symbols and won't collide with anything 17:50:27 prxq: you know that's just a regular symbol, right? :/ 17:50:32 misses the point of using an uninterned one. 17:51:01 Ralith: oh, i thought you wanted to use an uninterned one 17:51:13 I do. 17:51:15 that's not uninterned. 17:51:30 sure, but why do you want to do that? 17:52:16 what? 17:52:22 why would I want to do what? 17:52:40 use uninterned symbols 17:53:23 to ensure that it's impossible for another function to accidentally reference the c binding 17:54:01 well, the whatever_internal::|c_name| does that too, which was my point. 17:54:12 -!- em_ [~em@user-0ccem0s.cable.mindspring.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 17:55:09 -!- pchrist [~spirit@gentoo/developer/pchrist] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 17:56:31 skorpia [~proba@cpe-67-244-127-222.nyc.res.rr.com] has joined #lisp 17:56:52 (defun pjb-fun () (whatever_internal::|c_name|)) 17:57:09 (defun whatever_internal::|c_name| () (pjb-fun)) 17:57:13 -!- scharan [~scharan@169.235.25.47] has quit [Quit: WeeChat 0.3.4] 17:57:26 BlankVerse [~pankajm@103.246.106.35] has joined #lisp 17:57:33 pjb: sure, and unexported symbols don't achieve anything either. 17:58:10 I'm fine with a convention that you can only violate intentionally. 17:58:19 -!- Odin- [~sbkhh@adsl-2-92.du.snerpa.is] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 17:58:26 Davidbrcz [~david@proxysup.isae.fr] has joined #lisp 18:00:02 Odin- [~sbkhh@adsl-2-92.du.snerpa.is] has joined #lisp 18:00:41 -!- oconnore [~Eric@75-150-66-254-NewEngland.hfc.comcastbusiness.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 18:00:58 oconnore [~Eric@75-150-66-254-NewEngland.hfc.comcastbusiness.net] has joined #lisp 18:01:41 -!- peterhil` [~peterhil@GGYYKMCDXIII.gprs.sl-laajakaista.fi] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 18:01:49 -!- Euthy [~euthy@unaffiliated/euthydemus] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 18:02:37 Euthy [~euthy@unaffiliated/euthydemus] has joined #lisp 18:05:40 you could use whatever_internal::|OMG DON'T CALL THIS!! c_func| :-) 18:05:45 em_ [~em@user-0ccem0s.cable.mindspring.com] has joined #lisp 18:06:07 :P 18:06:43 -!- SegFaultAX [~mkbernard@173.228.45.162] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 18:07:48 pchrist [~spirit@gentoo/developer/pchrist] has joined #lisp 18:08:51 prxq: (unsafePerform ... ) ;-) 18:10:04 ISF [~ivan@187.106.48.51] has joined #lisp 18:10:12 p_l: slightly more stylish 18:10:27 fmeyer [~fmeyer@201.87.5.80.user.ajato.com.br] has joined #lisp 18:10:54 -!- em_ [~em@user-0ccem0s.cable.mindspring.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 18:11:11 -!- spacefrogg [~spacefrog@unaffiliated/spacefrogg] has quit [Quit: spacefrogg] 18:11:13 zimb0 [~zimb0@41.221.159.85] has joined #lisp 18:12:02 peterhil` [~peterhil@GYMMMDLI.gprs.sl-laajakaista.fi] has joined #lisp 18:13:53 -!- Odin- [~sbkhh@adsl-2-92.du.snerpa.is] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 18:14:51 SegFaultAX [~mkbernard@173.228.45.162] has joined #lisp 18:15:40 -!- nowhere_man [~pierre@AStrasbourg-551-1-38-34.w92-148.abo.wanadoo.fr] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 18:15:40 nowhereman [~pierre@AStrasbourg-551-1-67-253.w92-141.abo.wanadoo.fr] has joined #lisp 18:16:45 -!- wbooze [~levgue@xdsl-78-35-142-55.netcologne.de] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 18:16:45 -!- homie [~levgue@xdsl-78-35-142-55.netcologne.de] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 18:16:57 em_ [~em@user-0ccem0s.cable.mindspring.com] has joined #lisp 18:18:25 -!- Amadiro [~Amadiro@1x-193-157-202-229.uio.no] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 18:18:25 -!- zimb0 [~zimb0@41.221.159.85] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 18:19:48 -!- BlankVerse [~pankajm@103.246.106.35] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 18:20:09 gigamonkey [~user@adsl-99-17-204-30.dsl.pltn13.sbcglobal.net] has joined #lisp 18:20:26 Yo sellout. 18:20:31 gigamonkey: Yo. 18:20:38 Thanks for your comment. 18:20:45 You doing NaNoWriMo this year. ;-) 18:21:01 gigamonkey: Nah, I'm doing just bought a house and having a baby ;) 18:21:15 -!- Guest33063 [~Kron@129-97-120-44.uwaterloo.ca] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 18:21:31 (There's always some excuse close at hand) 18:21:34 Oh yeah, congrats. 18:21:37 How old's the baby? 18:21:50 homie [~levgue@xdsl-78-35-142-55.netcologne.de] has joined #lisp 18:22:09 -!- em_ [~em@user-0ccem0s.cable.mindspring.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 18:22:15 gigamonkey: No old yet. Not due until Feb. But it means lots of renovations, etc. in the near future so that it's all done by then. 18:22:39 Much easier to hack Lisp with babies around. 18:22:56 Or was it without? I can't remember. Not enough sleep. 18:23:05 *antoszka* got a second one enroute. 18:23:25 antoszka: doubling your lisp productivity, no doubt! 18:23:44 Xach: Heh, well at least I'll focus more on things I can do at home (like coding) rather than climbing/skiing without feeling that "I should be outside" feeling. 18:23:46 In the «acting out» department, certainly :) 18:24:18 wbooze` [~levgue@xdsl-78-35-132-118.netcologne.de] has joined #lisp 18:24:33 homie` [~levgue@xdsl-78-35-132-118.netcologne.de] has joined #lisp 18:24:43 But the baby should be good for hypergravity training ;) 18:25:27 kephas [~pierre@AStrasbourg-551-1-101-53.w90-13.abo.wanadoo.fr] has joined #lisp 18:25:35 -!- nowhereman [~pierre@AStrasbourg-551-1-67-253.w92-141.abo.wanadoo.fr] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 18:25:42 -!- wbooze` [~levgue@xdsl-78-35-132-118.netcologne.de] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 18:25:57 benny` [~benny@i577A3F74.versanet.de] has joined #lisp 18:26:00 -!- homie` [~levgue@xdsl-78-35-132-118.netcologne.de] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 18:26:20 -!- benny [~benny@i577A3321.versanet.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 18:26:22 -!- benny` is now known as benny 18:26:27 sellout: I thought the same thing, but it's really astonishing how much time they can suck up 18:27:07 sellout: yeah, they make good medicine balls too 18:27:07 Yeah, I can't say for sure whether it's the baby or wife though, as one followed the other pretty closely :D 18:27:26 -!- homie [~levgue@xdsl-78-35-142-55.netcologne.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 18:27:57 em_ [~em@user-0ccem0s.cable.mindspring.com] has joined #lisp 18:28:19 psilord [~psilord@76.201.144.59] has joined #lisp 18:28:27 -!- psilord [~psilord@76.201.144.59] has left #lisp 18:28:45 homie [~levgue@xdsl-78-35-132-118.netcologne.de] has joined #lisp 18:28:58 wbooze [~levgue@xdsl-78-35-132-118.netcologne.de] has joined #lisp 18:32:36 sellout: february babies are the best 18:32:45 (speaking from experience - I am one (-;) 18:32:53 -!- em_ [~em@user-0ccem0s.cable.mindspring.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 18:33:29 antifuchs: I dunno  both of my brothers were Febs, and I seem to recall them being a PITA ;) 18:33:51 -!- SegFaultAX [~mkbernard@173.228.45.162] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 18:34:02 likewise, my two brothers were born in Feb. :D 18:34:07 em_ [~em@user-0ccem0s.cable.mindspring.com] has joined #lisp 18:34:12 My dad is a Feb (14th, btw). Very talented :) 18:34:15 ehm, uhm, eheh 18:34:36 sellout: your bday doesnt happen to be in November, eh 18:35:04 felideon: Nope, May. 18:35:16 :P 18:35:31 *sellout* tries to bring this back on topic  birthday problem implementation in CL? 18:36:44 -!- dboswell [dpb@SDF.ORG] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 18:37:10 gravicappa [~gravicapp@80.90.116.82] has joined #lisp 18:37:33 kids often lisp at some point... 18:38:25 -!- loderunner [~loderunne@adsl-074-229-197-048.sip.mco.bellsouth.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 18:39:11 -!- em_ [~em@user-0ccem0s.cable.mindspring.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 18:43:01 -!- leo2007 [~leo@123.114.47.164] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 18:46:15 em_ [~em@user-0ccem0s.cable.mindspring.com] has joined #lisp 18:46:44 barryfm [~barryfm@fl-71-2-131-32.dhcp.embarqhsd.net] has joined #lisp 18:48:31 schaueho [~schaueho@dslb-088-066-023-232.pools.arcor-ip.net] has joined #lisp 18:50:16 ehu [~erik@ip118-64-212-87.adsl2.static.versatel.nl] has joined #lisp 18:50:20 -!- kpreid [~kpreid@128.153.212.194] has quit [Quit: Offline] 18:51:12 -!- em_ [~em@user-0ccem0s.cable.mindspring.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 18:51:39 mstevens [~mstevens@fsf/member/pdpc.active.mstevens] has joined #lisp 18:52:10 em_ [~em@user-0ccem0s.cable.mindspring.com] has joined #lisp 18:52:11 -!- ehu [~erik@ip118-64-212-87.adsl2.static.versatel.nl] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 18:52:31 -!- skorpia [~proba@cpe-67-244-127-222.nyc.res.rr.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 18:52:32 ehu [~erik@ip118-64-212-87.adsl2.static.versatel.nl] has joined #lisp 18:53:07 -!- mindCrime [~chatzilla@rrcs-70-62-112-146.midsouth.biz.rr.com] has quit [Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.87-rdmsoft [XULRunner 1.9.0.15/2009101909]] 18:53:25 turnipseed [~cms@c-98-246-47-184.hsd1.or.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 18:53:47 skorpia [~proba@cpe-67-244-127-222.nyc.res.rr.com] has joined #lisp 18:54:01 -!- tritchey [~tritchey@c-68-51-88-12.hsd1.in.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: tritchey] 18:54:12 tritchey [~tritchey@c-68-51-88-12.hsd1.in.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 18:55:23 -!- schaueho [~schaueho@dslb-088-066-023-232.pools.arcor-ip.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 18:56:43 Odin- [~sbkhh@adsl-2-92.du.snerpa.is] has joined #lisp 18:57:30 -!- em_ [~em@user-0ccem0s.cable.mindspring.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 18:58:10 -!- Davidbrcz [~david@proxysup.isae.fr] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 18:58:24 kpreid [~kpreid@128.153.178.144] has joined #lisp 18:58:35 Davidbrcz [~david@proxysup.isae.fr] has joined #lisp 18:58:46 -!- Oddity [~Oddity@unaffiliated/oddity] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 18:59:01 -!- Bike [~Glossina@69.166.35.233] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 18:59:13 em_ [~em@user-0ccem0s.cable.mindspring.com] has joined #lisp 19:00:12 SegFaultAX [~mkbernard@173.228.45.162] has joined #lisp 19:00:43 Bike [~Glossina@69.166.35.233] has joined #lisp 19:03:45 -!- em_ [~em@user-0ccem0s.cable.mindspring.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 19:07:18 ehu` [~ehuels@ip118-64-212-87.adsl2.static.versatel.nl] has joined #lisp 19:08:13 schaueho [~schaueho@dslb-088-066-039-135.pools.arcor-ip.net] has joined #lisp 19:13:10 -!- hba [~hba@189.229.191.31] has quit [Quit: leaving] 19:13:54 -!- cesarbp [~cbolano@189.247.126.160] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 19:14:35 -!- doritos [~joshua@c-76-118-155-244.hsd1.ct.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 19:14:53 Joreji [~thomas@vpn-ho1.unidsl.de] has joined #lisp 19:15:12 em_ [~em@user-0ccem0s.cable.mindspring.com] has joined #lisp 19:15:56 -!- schaueho [~schaueho@dslb-088-066-039-135.pools.arcor-ip.net] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 19:16:10 -!- jtza8 [~jtza8@41.56.51.30] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 19:18:55 -!- fmeyer [~fmeyer@201.87.5.80.user.ajato.com.br] has quit [Quit: leaving] 19:20:13 -!- em_ [~em@user-0ccem0s.cable.mindspring.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 19:20:17 -!- naeg [~naeg@194.208.239.170] has quit [Quit: WeeChat 0.3.5] 19:20:43 -!- mcsontos [~mcsontos@hotspot8.rywasoft.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 19:21:06 -!- Ralith [~ralith@S010600221561996a.vc.shawcable.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 19:21:38 em_ [~em@user-0ccem0s.cable.mindspring.com] has joined #lisp 19:26:56 -!- em_ [~em@user-0ccem0s.cable.mindspring.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 19:27:02 scharan [~scharan@169.235.25.47] has joined #lisp 19:30:47 -!- katesmith [~katesmith@unaffiliated/costume] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 19:31:06 schaueho [~schaueho@dslb-088-066-059-035.pools.arcor-ip.net] has joined #lisp 19:31:21 katesmith [~katesmith@unaffiliated/costume] has joined #lisp 19:31:52 -!- scharan [~scharan@169.235.25.47] has quit [Client Quit] 19:33:20 em_ [~em@user-0ccem0s.cable.mindspring.com] has joined #lisp 19:33:51 scharan [~scharan@169.235.25.47] has joined #lisp 19:38:13 -!- em_ [~em@user-0ccem0s.cable.mindspring.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 19:38:53 -!- turnipseed [~cms@c-98-246-47-184.hsd1.or.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 19:40:08 Kron [~Kron@69.166.23.18] has joined #lisp 19:40:17 -!- Kron is now known as Kron_ 19:40:40 hramat [5448cf5f@gateway/web/freenode/ip.84.72.207.95] has joined #lisp 19:42:08 -!- hramat [5448cf5f@gateway/web/freenode/ip.84.72.207.95] has left #lisp 19:42:10 manuel__ [~manuel_@pD9FDE790.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #lisp 19:42:15 Joreji_ [~thomas@74-112.eduroam.RWTH-Aachen.DE] has joined #lisp 19:42:16 Joreji__ [~thomas@74-112.eduroam.RWTH-Aachen.DE] has joined #lisp 19:43:30 turnipseed [~cms@c-98-246-47-184.hsd1.or.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 19:44:26 -!- manuel_ [~manuel_@p57921A69.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 19:44:26 -!- manuel__ is now known as manuel_ 19:46:13 -!- kpreid [~kpreid@128.153.178.144] has quit [Quit: Offline] 19:46:46 -!- mrSpec [~Spec@unaffiliated/mrspec] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 19:47:27 -!- nyef [~nyef@c-174-63-105-188.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 19:47:36 -!- nha [~prefect@5-74.104-92.cust.bluewin.ch] has quit [Quit: Locally, closed forms are exact, therefore, symplectic vector elds are also called locally hamiltonian vector elds. If M is simply connected, then every locally hamiltonian vector eld is hamiltonian.] 19:47:36 mrSpec [~Spec@unaffiliated/mrspec] has joined #lisp 19:48:31 nyef [~nyef@c-174-63-105-188.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 19:50:36 em_ [~em@user-0ccem0s.cable.mindspring.com] has joined #lisp 19:50:37 wildnux [~wildnux@router-sun-nat-i.pilsfree.net] has joined #lisp 19:51:40 -!- barryfm [~barryfm@fl-71-2-131-32.dhcp.embarqhsd.net] has left #lisp 19:52:47 loderunner [~loderunne@adsl-074-229-197-048.sip.mco.bellsouth.net] has joined #lisp 19:54:07 -!- schaueho [~schaueho@dslb-088-066-059-035.pools.arcor-ip.net] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 19:55:27 -!- nyef [~nyef@c-174-63-105-188.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 19:55:27 -!- jewel [~jewel@196-215-114-21.dynamic.isadsl.co.za] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 19:56:14 -!- em_ [~em@user-0ccem0s.cable.mindspring.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 19:56:21 -!- Xof [~crhodes@158.223.51.79] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 19:56:29 drdo` [~drdo@85.207.54.77.rev.vodafone.pt] has joined #lisp 19:57:03 -!- loderunner [~loderunne@adsl-074-229-197-048.sip.mco.bellsouth.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 19:57:46 francogrex [~user@109.130.111.65] has joined #lisp 19:57:49 -!- gensym [~user@dslb-088-071-149-049.pools.arcor-ip.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 19:58:20 -!- Davidbrcz [~david@proxysup.isae.fr] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 19:58:37 Xof [~crhodes@158.223.51.79] has joined #lisp 19:58:48 Davidbrcz [~david@proxysup.isae.fr] has joined #lisp 19:59:06 -!- drdo [~drdo@85.207.54.77.rev.vodafone.pt] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 20:00:16 Amyn [~abennama@m328eth.crans.org] has joined #lisp 20:01:39 nyef [~nyef@c-174-63-105-188.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 20:01:51 -!- kennyd [~kennyd@93-138-56-182.adsl.net.t-com.hr] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 20:01:54 em_ [~em@user-0ccem0s.cable.mindspring.com] has joined #lisp 20:03:21 kpreid [~kpreid@128.153.212.85] has joined #lisp 20:04:23 -!- pnathan [~Adium@76.178.165.160] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 20:06:04 -!- benkard [~benkard@141.84.69.67] has quit [Quit: benkard] 20:07:11 doritos [~joshua@c-76-118-155-244.hsd1.ct.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 20:08:47 -!- otakutomo [~otakutomo@KD027083117212.ppp-bb.dion.ne.jp] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 20:09:19 kennyd [~kennyd@93-138-56-182.adsl.net.t-com.hr] has joined #lisp 20:10:41 -!- waveman_ [~tim@124.170.43.134] has quit [Quit: leaving] 20:10:51 waveman [~tim@124.170.43.134] has joined #lisp 20:11:16 gabnet [~gabnet@226.23.67.86.rev.sfr.net] has joined #lisp 20:17:55 -!- FreeArtMan [~FreeArtMa@93.177.213.54] has quit [Quit: under the bit stream] 20:20:31 -!- Bike [~Glossina@69.166.35.233] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 20:21:35 -!- wildnux [~wildnux@router-sun-nat-i.pilsfree.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 20:22:29 marsell [~marsell@120.20.41.98] has joined #lisp 20:23:21 Bike [~Glossina@69.166.35.233] has joined #lisp 20:25:54 ISF_ [~ivan@187.106.48.51] has joined #lisp 20:28:31 -!- abeaumont [~abeaumont@90.165.165.246] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 20:29:35 abeaumont [~abeaumont@90.165.165.246] has joined #lisp 20:30:38 does anyone can explain to me why (member '(1 2) '((1 1) (1 2) (2 1))) returns NIL ? 20:31:08 Because (not (eql '(1 2) '(1 2))) 20:31:14 Check clhs member and clhs eql. 20:31:28 ok, thanks 20:32:01 Ralith [~ralith@d142-058-095-159.wireless.sfu.ca] has joined #lisp 20:32:04 Also, if you compile it, the compiler could coallesce the two identical literals, so it could return non-NIL. 20:32:38 if you compile it in a compilation unit, eg. a file. 20:33:16 ok 20:33:30 where can I see the source code of member ? 20:33:59 You should read http://www.nhplace.com/kent/PS/EQUAL.html 20:34:15 hakzsam: there's no need to read A source of member, it's all explained in clhs member. 20:34:43 hakzsam: otherwise, type (member M-. in a slime buffer. 20:35:27 hakzsam: the source code may be less enlightening than you expect due to compiler plumbing 20:36:08 Somelauw [~Somelauw@unaffiliated/somelauw] has joined #lisp 20:36:15 that said, there is somewhere a common-lisp in common-lisp. I keep forgetting the name. 20:36:23 sacla? 20:36:28 sacla. 20:36:45 thanks for your explanations :) 20:36:45 Is this command correct? I want to remap my superkey. (run-shell-command "xmodmap -e 'keycode 133 = F30' &") 20:36:47 Don't know how complete it is. 20:36:56 many common-lisp are in common-lisp, just with plumbing 20:37:00 And then there's beach's lisp implementation project... 20:37:20 t 20:37:29 The source code for CAR in SBCL is nice. 20:37:44 (defun car (x) (car x)), more or less. 20:38:54 there's also SICL, I think they already implemented MEMBER. 20:40:27 nyef: the source for the assembler definition is even nicer ;) 20:42:30 In SBCL? I dunno about that, there's some truly nasty-looking magic surrounding the SLOT VOPs. 20:42:35 ah ok, eql always returns NIL for lists except for '(), so I guess that eql is used in member :) 20:42:59 Amadiro [~Amadiro@ti0021a380-dhcp3462.bb.online.no] has joined #lisp 20:43:01 hakzsam: Umm... No, eql doesn't always return NIL for lists. 20:43:10 mmh? 20:43:24 xan_ [~xan@183.Red-81-32-69.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net] has joined #lisp 20:43:27 (eql #1=(1 2 3) #1#) => T 20:43:29 do you have an example ? 20:43:40 hakzsam: you should read a good book 20:43:52 like practical common lisp by peter seibel 20:43:54 (eql '#1=(1 2 3) '#1#). 20:44:00 mmh... I'm sorry but I don't know this syntax for lists 20:44:10 -!- Somelauw [~Somelauw@unaffiliated/somelauw] has quit [Quit: WeeChat 0.3.2] 20:44:24 (let ((a (list 1 2 3))) (eql a a)) 20:44:52 pkhuong: Good point, forgot about quoting it. 20:45:09 mathrick [~mathrick@85.218.138.27] has joined #lisp 20:45:21 ska` [~user@ppp-110-168-209-192.revip5.asianet.co.th] has joined #lisp 20:45:35 -!- ngz [~user@201.144.80.79.rev.sfr.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 20:45:53 hakzsam: or "a gentle introduction to symbolic computation" 20:45:59 prxq, yes, I will read this book anyway but currently I only read some parts of the hyperspec 20:47:01 hakzsam: lisp distinguishes between different levels of equality 20:47:10 tient ?, il ne t'as pas conseillé celui d'irène durand :) 20:48:07 -!- em_ [~em@user-0ccem0s.cable.mindspring.com] has quit [Quit: As a wild ass in the desert go I forth to my work] 20:48:27 emma_ [~em@unaffiliated/emma] has joined #lisp 20:48:49 waltwhite: english please. FWIW, LiSP isn't an introductory text. 20:48:50 wrong channel i'm sorry 20:50:47 pkhuong: Is that just odd capitalisation, or a specific reference I'm not getting? 20:51:17 Odin-: "Lisp in Small Pieces" 20:51:27 Ah. Thank you. 20:51:57 waltwhite: what you said doesn't make sense even in french 20:52:03 -!- emma_ is now known as emma 20:52:16 -!- emma is now known as EMMA 20:52:28 -!- EMMA is now known as emma 20:52:41 bgs100 [~nitrogen@unaffiliated/bgs100] has joined #lisp 20:53:09 -!- mrSpec [~Spec@unaffiliated/mrspec] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 20:53:34 mrSpec [~Spec@unaffiliated/mrspec] has joined #lisp 20:54:40 -!- dlowe [dlowe@nat/google/x-bjzpmsblsqnawzzv] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 20:55:14 -!- emma is now known as em 20:55:30 -!- Athas [~athas@130.225.165.40] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 20:57:02 Athas [~athas@130.225.165.40] has joined #lisp 20:57:14 -!- gabnet [~gabnet@226.23.67.86.rev.sfr.net] has quit [Quit: Quitte] 20:57:19 -!- Joreji__ [~thomas@74-112.eduroam.RWTH-Aachen.DE] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 20:57:19 -!- Joreji_ [~thomas@74-112.eduroam.RWTH-Aachen.DE] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 20:58:30 -!- Davidbrcz [~david@proxysup.isae.fr] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 20:58:38 Oddity [~Oddity@unaffiliated/oddity] has joined #lisp 20:58:55 Davidbrcz [~david@proxysup.isae.fr] has joined #lisp 20:59:19 dlowe [dlowe@nat/google/x-ovwlvbmckkeessla] has joined #lisp 21:00:30 -!- Amadiro [~Amadiro@ti0021a380-dhcp3462.bb.online.no] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 21:02:23 Guthur [~user@212.183.128.43] has joined #lisp 21:02:58 smug is pretty awesome. just wrote a printf format string parser in half an hour 21:03:21 are you talking about drewc's thingy? 21:03:24 yeah 21:03:29 I'm partial to cl-yacc myself 21:03:38 I've not had a chance to look at it yet 21:04:24 dlowe: do you want to show an example ? 21:04:33 there's also nikodemus's esrap which is pretty cool 21:04:46 Amadiro [~Amadiro@ti0021a380-dhcp3462.bb.online.no] has joined #lisp 21:05:15 mjonsson [~mjonsson@38.109.95.133] has joined #lisp 21:05:28 http://paste.lisp.org/display/125369 21:06:15 "test %'.34lid %%" => (#\t #\e #\s #\t #\ (:SIGNED-DECIMAL (:GROUPED) NIL 34 :LONG-SIZE) #\d #\space #\%) 21:06:42 too sexy 21:06:53 (not printf, mind you) 21:07:15 -!- Joreji [~thomas@vpn-ho1.unidsl.de] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 21:07:29 interesting 21:08:39 otakutomo [~otakutomo@KD027083117212.ppp-bb.dion.ne.jp] has joined #lisp 21:09:16 why both #\ and #\space? 21:10:02 yay, fixed my memory leak problem at work 21:10:06 of course wouldn 21:10:15 oops, wouldn't have the problem if we used lisp... 21:10:36 but i did write my memory log analysis tools in lisp, so it did help 21:11:46 Ralith: because I post-edited one and not the other 21:11:56 kruhft: huh? I get memory leaks all the time in lisp 21:12:09 dlowe: not these kind 21:12:26 in a sufficiently complex app, it can sometimes be hard to stop out all the references to a piece of data 21:12:42 and then it gets tenured :( 21:12:47 haha 21:13:15 -!- gravicappa [~gravicapp@80.90.116.82] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 21:13:20 hm 21:13:22 i'm working with a library that has comments like "allocate this here and somebody will delete it later" 21:13:33 it would be a useful debugger feature to expose a list of references to a location 21:13:52 too many lines to know by heart so i wrote a memory logger 21:13:59 kruhft: the other side of that is a comment that says "remove all references to this. Hopefully I got them all." 21:14:23 true enough 21:14:45 -!- tsuru```` [~charlie@adsl-74-179-196-112.bna.bellsouth.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 21:14:53 skeptomai [~cb@ip65-47-31-86.z31-47-65.customer.algx.net] has joined #lisp 21:14:58 and then on a multi-person team, some bastard will add a reference and then forget to remove it 21:15:14 gc gone wrong 21:15:27 i mean the tenure part 21:15:28 damned if you gc, damned if do you manual allocation 21:15:37 anyway. I hope I've convinced everyone that lisp will solve all your problems 21:15:38 s0ber_ [~s0ber@111-240-175-9.dynamic.hinet.net] has joined #lisp 21:15:50 there's mark & sweep, for when real time does not matter that much 21:15:50 of course the library i'm using has it's own gc as well making tracking down actual leaks really fun 21:15:50 *nyef* is looking at a report that says there's a 16-byte memory leak somewhere in his app... but it's apparently something to do with a work-queue thread starting up... 21:16:36 Joreji [~thomas@74-112.eduroam.RWTH-Aachen.DE] has joined #lisp 21:16:38 well my app is sitting at 24% steady after 100000 calls, so i'm pretty sure i got the leaks for now 21:17:00 yeah, a predicate that would return T if you were holding the last live reference to a piece of data would be great 21:17:11 prxq: regions (: 21:17:18 kruhft: oh yeah, and you should be using valgrind 21:17:27 dlowe: You mean... checking the refcount on an object for unity? 21:17:31 dlowe: valgrind doesn't work on this app 21:17:37 kruhft: too bad 21:17:43 dlowe: tried it already, including modifying it to see if i could get it to work 21:17:57 dlowe: tried electric fence too...didn't work 21:18:04 "I understood the Church-Turing thesis intuitively when I was five years old, which is pretty unusual." --Bram Cohen 21:18:05 or at least couldn't get through the library initialization 21:18:15 -!- s0ber [~s0ber@111-240-168-54.dynamic.hinet.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 21:18:26 -!- s0ber_ is now known as s0ber 21:18:27 nyef: yeah. If you're using it for testing, it shouldn't matter if you have to wait a couple of seconds in a non-refcounting environment 21:18:56 or minutes. or even hours, depending on how bad the bug is 21:19:33 Hours is a bit much. 21:21:09 I've had memory leaks that I would have gladly let the machine run all night looking for references 21:21:19 -!- dlowe [dlowe@nat/google/x-ovwlvbmckkeessla] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 21:22:31 I've been finding that I'd rather find leaks via static analysis. 21:22:38 -!- kennyd [~kennyd@93-138-56-182.adsl.net.t-com.hr] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 21:23:00 The problem being that if you still get a leak it means that you need to know how it happened so that you can fix the problem with your static analyzer. 21:23:03 -!- rmarianski [~rmariansk@mail.marianski.com] has quit [Quit: leaving] 21:24:09 i would think that doing static analysis for memory leaks would be an intractable problem 21:24:19 kennyd [~kennyd@93-138-72-254.adsl.net.t-com.hr] has joined #lisp 21:24:20 looking at the C++ code that I've been working with lately 21:24:44 Your first mistake was to use C++. 21:24:51 not my choice, it's my job 21:24:59 kruhft: intractable if considered to its extremes. You may obtain useful results nonetheless 21:25:37 -!- Ralith [~ralith@d142-058-095-159.wireless.sfu.ca] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 21:25:39 my memory logger wrapped new/delete and dumped every pointer passed and returned with a stack trace where the allocation was called 21:26:01 then the analyzer would remove the matching new/deletes and print a report of what was left over 21:26:23 made the program run like a pig though 21:26:28 -!- Davidbrcz [~david@proxysup.isae.fr] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 21:29:13 heap debuggers like tcmalloc's offer that sort of thing. 21:29:19 -!- ehu` [~ehuels@ip118-64-212-87.adsl2.static.versatel.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 21:29:19 -!- sdemarre [~serge@91.176.45.15] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 21:29:23 -!- tic [~tic@c83-249-198-162.bredband.comhem.se] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 21:30:01 -!- francogrex [~user@109.130.111.65] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 21:30:09 pkhuong: everything i tried (valgrind, electric fence) wouldn't work with the size of our program so i just gave up and wrote my own 21:30:48 it's given me enough information to track down everything so far and all i have to do to enable it is define MEMLOG in my main.cpp so it's not very obtrusive 21:32:01 -!- prxq [~mommer@mnhm-5f75c035.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 21:33:18 -!- bgs100 [~nitrogen@unaffiliated/bgs100] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 21:34:57 gravicappa [~gravicapp@ppp91-77-184-203.pppoe.mtu-net.ru] has joined #lisp 21:35:32 -!- sonnym [~sonny@rrcs-72-43-20-246.nys.biz.rr.com] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 21:37:44 -!- cyrillos [~cyrill@188.134.33.194] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 21:38:11 -!- waltwhite [~waltwhite@168-170-33-178.dsl.ovh.net] has left #lisp 21:39:24 -!- Guthur [~user@212.183.128.43] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 21:43:08 -!- milanj [~milanj_@109-93-193-219.dynamic.isp.telekom.rs] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 21:44:00 -!- Athas [~athas@130.225.165.40] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 21:46:23 Guthur [~user@212.183.128.43] has joined #lisp 21:51:13 -!- gravicappa [~gravicapp@ppp91-77-184-203.pppoe.mtu-net.ru] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 21:54:54 -!- LiamH [~none@pdp8.nrl.navy.mil] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 21:57:26 msxx [~redmundia@84.122.73.141.dyn.user.ono.com] has joined #lisp 22:04:34 -!- cmatei [~cmatei@95.76.22.68] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 22:08:24 -!- Amadiro [~Amadiro@ti0021a380-dhcp3462.bb.online.no] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 22:08:31 -!- ramusara [~ramusara@220.156.210.236.user.e-catv.ne.jp] has quit [Quit: Leaving...] 22:11:38 -!- Soulman1 [~knute@175.80-202-238.nextgentel.com] has left #lisp 22:16:53 urandom__ [~user@p548A3FF0.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #lisp 22:18:11 fisxoj [~fisxoj@cpe-69-201-186-74.nyc.res.rr.com] has joined #lisp 22:20:06 cmatei [~cmatei@95.76.22.68] has joined #lisp 22:20:51 -!- mstevens [~mstevens@fsf/member/pdpc.active.mstevens] has quit [Quit: leaving] 22:21:03 -!- dl [~download@chpcwl01.hpc.unm.edu] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 22:21:26 -!- Guthur [~user@212.183.128.43] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 22:23:30 -!- mrSpec [~Spec@unaffiliated/mrspec] has quit [Quit: mrSpec] 22:23:33 Guthur [~user@212.183.128.43] has joined #lisp 22:28:32 -!- fe[nl]ix [~quassel@pdpc/supporter/professional/fenlix] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 22:28:40 fe[nl]ix [~quassel@pdpc/supporter/professional/fenlix] has joined #lisp 22:32:22 sonnym [~sonny@rrcs-184-74-137-69.nys.biz.rr.com] has joined #lisp 22:33:44 Ralith [~ralith@S010600221561996a.vc.shawcable.net] has joined #lisp 22:35:30 -!- Guthur [~user@212.183.128.43] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 22:35:45 -!- dRbiG [drbig@unhallowed.pl] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 22:37:57 -!- Bike [~Glossina@69.166.35.233] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 22:37:59 I want to write anything that is written to *standard-output* and *standard-error* and such to a file. Right now I just opened a file and set *standard-output* to that file stream. The problem is that the stream may not reliably close and the file is not inspectable while the program is running. 22:38:07 Can someone point me in a better direction? :) 22:39:50 Bike [~Glossina@69.166.35.235] has joined #lisp 22:42:23 Qworkescence: (with-open-stream (file (apply 'open ...)) (let ((*standard-output* file) (*error-output* file)) ...)) 22:42:41 with-open-file works as well, as long as the args to open the file are fixed 22:42:51 (at least the amount of args) 22:45:17 -!- hakzsam [~hakzsam@aqu33-5-82-245-96-206.fbx.proxad.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 22:45:32 ... mind the "abort" behavior of w-o-f. 22:45:34 Qworkescence: what do you mean with reliably close and not inspectable? 22:45:55 abort behavior? 22:45:58 ... and adjust the stream buffering mode as required. 22:46:00 dto [~dto@pool-96-252-89-130.bstnma.fios.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 22:46:34 msxx: If you do an NLX across the contour of a W-O-F, it may (will?) delete the file. 22:46:39 -!- killerboy [~mateusz@users69.kollegienet.dk] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 22:47:16 nyef: hmm! i've never noticed that and i always wondered why w-o-s doesn't have an abort key arg. nide! 22:47:20 s/nide/nice 22:47:22 acelent, While a program is running, the file should be able to be viewed. The program may unexpectedly quit. In that case, any data written to the file should be visible. 22:48:21 Qworkescence: Use OPEN, and set the stream buffering to always flush immediately (might be an implementation-dependent control). 22:48:42 nyef: what buffering mode? 22:49:05 Qworkescence: Or, even better, redirect the streams when you start your instance in the first place. 22:49:27 nyef, that is what I'm doing. Upon application start, everything gets redirected 22:50:01 acelent: Ever seen the setvbuf(3) man page? 22:50:13 Qworkescence: SBCL? 22:50:45 nyef, LispWorks 5.1 22:50:52 Ah. Can't help you there. 22:51:03 For SBCL, I'd have said to look for FD-STREAM-BUFFERING or similar. 22:51:11 Perhaps the lispworks manual could be of use? 22:51:20 I'll take a look 22:51:33 You want a non-exclusive access to the file, and either no buffering or line buffering. 22:52:35 drdo`` [~drdo@85.207.54.77.rev.vodafone.pt] has joined #lisp 22:54:01 nyef: oh ok, i was wondering if it was ansi cl 22:54:24 -!- _pixel [~pixel@dsl17-46.pool.bitel.net] has quit [Quit: Lost terminal] 22:54:52 acelent: My disclaimer "might be an implementation-dependent control" suggested that buffering control might well not be part of the standard. 22:54:57 -!- drdo` [~drdo@85.207.54.77.rev.vodafone.pt] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 22:59:59 airolson [~airolson@CPE00222d55a738-CM00222d55a735.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com] has joined #lisp 23:02:32 xyxu [~xyxu@222.68.152.61] has joined #lisp 23:05:35 -!- ska` [~user@ppp-110-168-209-192.revip5.asianet.co.th] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 23:08:59 -!- dto [~dto@pool-96-252-89-130.bstnma.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 23:09:01 -!- oconnore [~Eric@75-150-66-254-NewEngland.hfc.comcastbusiness.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 23:09:19 Or better yet, write conforming code and use FINISH-OUTPUT 23:09:22 cesarbp [~cbolano@189.247.126.160] has joined #lisp 23:10:04 even better, finnish-output! 23:13:12 -!- drdo`` is now known as drdo 23:16:50 realitygrill [~realitygr@adsl-76-232-155-167.dsl.sfldmi.sbcglobal.net] has joined #lisp 23:16:52 dnolen [~davidnole@pool-68-161-121-160.ny325.east.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 23:18:00 antifuchs: That reminds me of the European race that nobody won... because everybody stopped at the Finnish line. 23:19:40 *Xach* heard it as some variation of "and you've reached the last Lapp" 23:22:39 I've just installed quicklisp-slime-helper, and I'm getting this error: Versions differ: 2011-10-13 (slime) vs. 2011-06-18 (swank). Continue? (y or n) 23:22:50 should I just remove my prior slime installation? 23:23:35 my wife is a finn 23:23:45 i think i've heard all of the jokes 23:23:57 Xach: Ooh. That's a new one by me. 23:24:11 -!- karswell [~mjc@93-97-29-243.zone5.bethere.co.uk] has quit [Excess Flood] 23:24:36 the one nice thing is people don't know if her name is male or female 23:24:41 so i can do impersonations 23:24:58 That sure must improve the situation. 23:24:59 (people in canada who are not finnish that is) 23:25:05 Anyway, time I got going for the evening. 23:25:08 -!- nyef [~nyef@c-174-63-105-188.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: G'night all.] 23:25:25 karswell [~mjc@93-97-29-243.zone5.bethere.co.uk] has joined #lisp 23:25:54 msxx: not a bad idea 23:26:20 msxx: that seems quite odd to me, though - quicklisp-slime-helper's slime version is something around 2011-09-28 23:27:25 msxx: so it seems like you might have three slimes in play 23:27:39 oh? heh 23:29:28 *Xach* should push out a client update tonight 23:30:51 Kron [~Kron@69.166.23.18] has joined #lisp 23:31:17 -!- Kron is now known as Guest24849 23:32:53 -!- Kron_ [~Kron@69.166.23.18] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 23:33:02 (ql:system-apropos "slime") gives me: # 23:34:01 am I using outdated quicklisp or? 23:38:55 -!- dnolen [~davidnole@pool-68-161-121-160.ny325.east.verizon.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 23:39:02 -!- Qworkescence [~quad@unaffiliated/quadrescence] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 23:39:20 -!- xyxu [~xyxu@222.68.152.61] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 23:39:53 dnolen [~davidnole@pool-68-161-64-240.ny325.east.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 23:41:15 -!- vhost- [~vhost@unaffiliated/vhost-] has quit [Quit: WeeChat 0.3.5] 23:41:41 -!- katesmith [~katesmith@unaffiliated/costume] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 23:42:23 katesmith [~katesmith@75-138-199-162.static.snfr.nc.charter.com] has joined #lisp 23:42:23 -!- katesmith [~katesmith@75-138-199-162.static.snfr.nc.charter.com] has quit [Changing host] 23:42:23 katesmith [~katesmith@unaffiliated/costume] has joined #lisp 23:42:47 -!- turnipseed [~cms@c-98-246-47-184.hsd1.or.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 23:49:45 oconnore [~Eric@c-66-31-125-56.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 23:49:55 -!- superflit [~superflit@71-208-200-190.hlrn.qwest.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 23:52:04 turnipseed [~cms@c-98-246-47-184.hsd1.or.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 23:52:20 -!- urandom__ [~user@p548A3FF0.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]