00:00:07 That's just silly. We should be wearing red. Or in the case of ARGB, saran wrap. 00:00:51 borkman: garments use CMYK, so it should be black, IMHO... :P 00:01:02 Touche. 00:01:09 (eventually, the last colour in Pantone or similar set) 00:01:20 s/eventually/or/ 00:03:02 replore [~replore@203.152.213.161.static.zoot.jp] has joined #lisp 00:03:36 -!- sprayzor [~user@213.37.73.151.dyn.user.ono.com] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 00:04:14 -!- jpop [~jpop@31.216.200.69] has quit [Quit: Colloquy for iPhone - http://colloquy.mobi] 00:05:34 ISF [~ivan@201.82.134.98] has joined #lisp 00:12:00 And even if it wasn't forbidden to define a print-object method on predefined standard classes, it would be inefficient, since WRITE, and therefore the various PRINT- functions don't have to use PRINT-OBJECT on those objects. 00:12:32 (you have to keep that in mind if you define eg. a :before or :after print-object on T). 00:12:45 guther [~guther@gateway/shell/bshellz.net/x-mfjpkytggyocxbpi] has joined #lisp 00:16:01 Gmind [~nevermind@113.190.180.34] has joined #lisp 00:20:41 -!- ikki [~ikki@201.155.92.12] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 00:24:43 xyxu [~xyxu@58.41.14.46] has joined #lisp 00:29:48 -!- fmeyer [~fmeyer@189.102.183.3] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 00:31:14 -!- coyo [kvirc@unaffiliated/bandu] has quit [Quit: I need my meds... >.<] 00:31:27 coyo [kvirc@pool-71-164-173-28.dllstx.fios.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 00:31:27 -!- coyo [kvirc@pool-71-164-173-28.dllstx.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Changing host] 00:31:27 coyo [kvirc@unaffiliated/bandu] has joined #lisp 00:34:02 -!- jtza8 [~jtza8@41.56.29.229] has quit [Quit: leaving] 00:36:10 SpringheeledJake [~Spring-he@47.sub-75-251-198.myvzw.com] has joined #lisp 00:36:53 -!- manuel_ [~manuel_@pD9FDED53.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 00:37:03 manuel_ [~manuel_@pD9FDED53.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #lisp 00:39:21 -!- TeMPOraL [~user@cpc1-oxfd18-2-0-cust444.4-3.cable.virginmedia.com] has quit [Quit: In Schroedinger we trust, or not.] 00:40:20 -!- dto [~dto@pool-96-252-89-130.bstnma.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 00:43:18 -!- Bike [~Glossina@69.166.35.235] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 00:43:30 dto [~dto@pool-96-252-89-130.bstnma.fios.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 00:43:39 hi. 00:43:55 when using (loop for x across some-vector 00:44:04 does it go through the whole vector, or just up to the fill-pointer? 00:45:25 -!- SpringheeledJake [~Spring-he@47.sub-75-251-198.myvzw.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 00:47:03 SpringheeledJake [~Spring-he@55.sub-75-204-196.myvzw.com] has joined #lisp 00:47:55 qsun [~Quan@eth123.nsw.adsl.internode.on.net] has joined #lisp 00:50:53 -!- ISF [~ivan@201.82.134.98] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 00:52:01 -!- manuel_ [~manuel_@pD9FDED53.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Quit: manuel_] 00:54:00 dto: That should take 10 seconds to test. 00:54:33 yes, sorry i should have come back and said "never mind" on the channel :) 00:54:53 -!- blackwolf [~blackwolf@ool-43568cfa.dyn.optonline.net] has quit [Quit: ERC Version 5.3 (IRC client for Emacs)] 00:56:07 zhanglearn [~chatzilla@219.133.62.89] has joined #lisp 00:57:46 gaidal [~gaidal@58.62.106.58] has joined #lisp 00:57:58 -!- Kenjin [~josesanto@bl21-70-53.dsl.telepac.pt] has quit [Quit: Computer has gone to sleep] 01:04:20 ISF [~ivan@201.82.134.98] has joined #lisp 01:07:50 altsrid [~altsrid@S010678ca39ff0146.vn.shawcable.net] has joined #lisp 01:07:52 -!- altsrid [~altsrid@S010678ca39ff0146.vn.shawcable.net] has quit [Client Quit] 01:08:25 altsrid [~altsrid@S010678ca39ff0146.vn.shawcable.net] has joined #lisp 01:08:25 -!- altsrid [~altsrid@S010678ca39ff0146.vn.shawcable.net] has quit [Client Quit] 01:08:34 altsrid [~altsrid@S010678ca39ff0146.vn.shawcable.net] has joined #lisp 01:10:03 Mococa [~Mococa@187.114.169.142] has joined #lisp 01:10:15 dto: till the fill-pointer. 01:10:37 Notice that LENGTH returns the fill-pointer too if there's one. 01:11:44 ``Erik_ [Here@c-69-140-109-104.hsd1.md.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 01:11:46 -!- lonstein [lonstein@ohno.mrbill.net] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 01:11:51 lonstein [lonstein@ohno.mrbill.net] has joined #lisp 01:11:52 -!- ``Erik [Here@c-69-140-109-104.hsd1.md.comcast.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 01:22:11 H4ns` [~user@p4FFC8202.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #lisp 01:22:32 -!- nicdev_ [~user@static-72-74-85-37.bstnma.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 01:22:32 nicdev_` [~user@static-72-74-85-37.bstnma.fios.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 01:25:53 -!- H4ns [~user@p4FFC8202.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 01:29:02 -!- SucklinPig is now known as MeanWeen 01:29:36 -!- dto [~dto@pool-96-252-89-130.bstnma.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 01:29:51 -!- SegFaultAX [~mkbernard@173.228.45.162] has quit [Quit: leaving] 01:36:19 H4ns`` [~user@p4FFC9257.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #lisp 01:40:06 -!- H4ns` [~user@p4FFC8202.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 01:41:04 -!- zhanglearn [~chatzilla@219.133.62.89] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 01:43:54 CrEddy [~coak@wrongplanet/CrazyEddy] has joined #lisp 01:54:03 -!- dfox [~dfox@2001:470:9d8f:0:4261:86ff:fe8e:8446] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 01:58:03 dfox [~dfox@2001:470:9d8f:0:4261:86ff:fe8e:8446] has joined #lisp 01:59:28 -!- lolsuper_ [~super_@unaffiliated/lolsuper-/x-9881387] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 02:00:30 Anyone know off the top of their head how postmodern interprets 'nil'? 02:00:43 -!- altsrid [~altsrid@S010678ca39ff0146.vn.shawcable.net] has quit [Quit: Computer has gone to sleep.] 02:01:28 -!- urandom__ [~user@p548A36C4.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 02:05:11 topeak [~topeak@123.114.123.1] has joined #lisp 02:05:57 X-Scale [email@89.181.105.101] has joined #lisp 02:07:30 -!- bgs100 [~ian@unaffiliated/bgs100] has quit [Quit: 1873] 02:11:30 pnq [~nick@ACA251B2.ipt.aol.com] has joined #lisp 02:13:08 tritchey [~tritchey@c-98-213-213-26.hsd1.in.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 02:25:15 -!- marsell [~marsell@120.18.172.39] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 02:30:48 -!- antgreen [~user@bas3-toronto06-1177889949.dsl.bell.ca] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 02:35:35 altsrid [~altsrid@S010678ca39ff0146.vn.shawcable.net] has joined #lisp 02:45:38 can we do inline asm in CL ? 02:47:01 -!- em [~em@unaffiliated/emma] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 02:47:57 -!- rme [rme@625AFA0B.92D39A3A.699BA7A6.IP] has quit [Quit: rme] 02:47:57 -!- rme [~rme@50.43.128.22] has quit [Quit: rme] 02:50:19 em [~em@unaffiliated/emma] has joined #lisp 02:55:46 Gmind: yes, but it's implementation dependant. 02:56:10 for example , on Clozure CL, how ? 02:56:28 -!- dfox [~dfox@2001:470:9d8f:0:4261:86ff:fe8e:8446] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 02:56:29 I don't know the details. I'd check how it's done in the sources of ccl. 02:59:14 -!- kennyd [~kennyd@93-136-255-183.adsl.net.t-com.hr] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 02:59:29 *|3b|* wouldn't say 'yes', unless you want to invoke the turing tarpit 03:00:17 <|3b|> sbcl doesn't really allow "inline asm" for example, instead you put the asm in VOPs 03:00:46 LiamH [~healy@pool-108-18-161-45.washdc.east.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 03:01:21 I don't know if I saw that somewhere 03:03:01 frhodes [~frhodes@168-103-96-233.albq.qwest.net] has joined #lisp 03:03:07 -!- gffa [~gffa@unaffiliated/gffa] has quit [Quit: sleep] 03:03:17 -!- frhodes [~frhodes@168-103-96-233.albq.qwest.net] has quit [Client Quit] 03:04:32 Spring-heeled [~Spring-he@43.sub-75-204-126.myvzw.com] has joined #lisp 03:07:25 -!- SpringheeledJake [~Spring-he@55.sub-75-204-196.myvzw.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 03:08:09 -!- Spring-heeled [~Spring-he@43.sub-75-204-126.myvzw.com] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 03:08:25 <|3b|> ccl has at least defx86lapfunction and similar, not sure if it does actual 'inline' asm or not 03:09:43 -!- pnq [~nick@ACA251B2.ipt.aol.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 03:21:17 spradnyesh [~pradyus@nat/yahoo/x-xogjefgkqsobwnws] has joined #lisp 03:29:17 daniel__ [~daniel@p5082A51F.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #lisp 03:31:07 -!- daniel [~daniel@p5B3266F1.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 03:36:08 zhanglearn [~chatzilla@219.133.62.89] has joined #lisp 03:36:35 Lone_Wanderer [~Dan@209-6-38-124.c3-0.smr-ubr1.sbo-smr.ma.cable.rcn.com] has joined #lisp 03:36:55 cataska [~cataska@210.64.6.233] has joined #lisp 03:37:48 mindCrime_ [~chatzilla@cpe-076-182-089-009.nc.res.rr.com] has joined #lisp 03:38:58 -!- LiamH [~healy@pool-108-18-161-45.washdc.east.verizon.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 03:42:10 gcentauri [~gcentauri@76-85-193-191.cable.inebraska.com] has joined #lisp 03:42:59 any recommendations between the choice of trying to work through "Practical Common Lisp" or SICP? 03:44:06 Either one would be well worth the effort. PAIP is Lisp, though, where SICP is scheme. 03:44:41 oh, sorry PCL, not PAIP 03:45:06 PCL is a good book, too. It's a very good intro to Common Lisp. 03:45:16 right. PCL seems to try and make reference to scheme at certain points to show differences 03:45:37 i've done a bit with scheme, but am intrigued by CL now 03:45:58 PCL is great for learning Lisp. SICP is awesome for learning about programming. 03:46:18 Bike [~Glossina@71-214-100-161.ptld.qwest.net] has joined #lisp 03:46:50 hm... tempted to just do both at the same time 03:47:13 -!- rtoym [~chatzilla@c-67-180-54-112.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 03:47:27 PCL seems like it would get me programming things in Lisp quickly, whereas SICP is more theoretical. 03:47:48 I think that is correct. 03:49:17 any insight into what problems might come up jumping between Common Lisp and Scheme? 03:49:53 Vivitron [~user@pool-108-7-56-243.bstnma.fios.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 03:50:02 mostly it's the namespace business that seems to trip people up. 03:50:10 Lisp-1 vs. Lisp-2? Don't count on tail-recursion (Lispers don't write recursive stuff as much as Schemers) 03:51:54 -!- coyo [kvirc@unaffiliated/bandu] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 03:53:58 dnolen [~davidnole@cpe-98-14-92-234.nyc.res.rr.com] has joined #lisp 03:54:31 gko [~gko@110-27-32-186.adsl.fetnet.net] has joined #lisp 03:54:41 cool. well thanks for the tips. i think i'm going to dive into PCL for now, i think its more important to write code than to get the theory at this point 03:54:55 good luck! 03:56:06 rtoym [~chatzilla@c-67-180-54-112.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 03:56:33 -!- Sysop_fb [~bleh@108-66-160-34.lightspeed.spfdmo.sbcglobal.net] has quit [] 03:58:43 -!- sanjoyd [~sanjoyd@unaffiliated/sanjoyd] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 04:00:14 thanks! 04:13:32 elfrosch [~Brnt@p5485744E.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #lisp 04:14:55 dto [~dto@pool-96-252-89-130.bstnma.fios.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 04:15:44 -!- sykopomp [~sykopomp@gateway/tor-sasl/sykopomp] has quit [Ping 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seconds] 05:12:48 orivej [~orivej@wi105.fi.pu.ru] has joined #lisp 05:22:07 gravicappa [~gravicapp@ppp91-77-167-230.pppoe.mtu-net.ru] has joined #lisp 05:23:07 Davidbrcz [~david@proxysup.isae.fr] has joined #lisp 05:28:16 .go 05:28:37 sigh :D 05:29:40 -!- Lone_Wanderer [~Dan@209-6-38-124.c3-0.smr-ubr1.sbo-smr.ma.cable.rcn.com] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 05:32:01 -!- spradnyesh [~pradyus@nat/yahoo/x-xogjefgkqsobwnws] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 05:33:22 Mococa [~Mococa@187.114.169.142] has joined #lisp 05:34:33 -!- Davidbrcz [~david@proxysup.isae.fr] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 05:35:10 wolfpython [~wolf@117.89.168.218] has joined #lisp 05:36:27 spradnyesh [~pradyus@nat/yahoo/x-idebiumtayemgzxx] has joined #lisp 05:36:41 -!- Mococa [~Mococa@187.114.169.142] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 05:37:57 sdemarre [~serge@91.176.80.217] has joined #lisp 05:39:30 -!- kushal [kdas@fedora/kushal] has quit [Excess Flood] 05:39:55 -!- zhanglearn 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[~mvilleneu@LLagny-156-36-4-214.w80-14.abo.wanadoo.fr] has joined #lisp 06:30:54 good morning 06:31:02 -!- Kryztof [~user@81.174.155.115] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 06:32:18 -!- dnolen [~davidnole@cpe-98-14-92-234.nyc.res.rr.com] has quit [Quit: dnolen] 06:34:51 -!- ramkrsna [ramkrsna@unaffiliated/ramkrsna] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 06:35:30 -!- zomgbie [~jesus@85-127-211-218.dynamic.xdsl-line.inode.at] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 06:37:23 -!- killerboy [~mateusz@wireless.its.sdu.dk] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 06:37:57 killerboy [~mateusz@wireless.its.sdu.dk] has joined #lisp 06:40:18 -!- dmiles_afk [~dmiles@dsl-216-155-213-190.cascadeaccess.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 06:40:19 -!- gaidal [~gaidal@113.119.25.10] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 06:40:43 gaidal [~gaidal@113.119.25.10] has joined #lisp 06:43:04 waaaaargh__ [~waaaaargh@agsb-5d87f4ae.pool.mediaWays.net] has joined #lisp 06:45:24 -!- Athas 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seconds] 07:01:11 -!- elfrosch [~Brnt@p578b57e4.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 07:01:46 jdz [~jdz@193.206.22.97] has joined #lisp 07:04:09 frhodes [~frhodes@168-103-96-233.albq.qwest.net] has joined #lisp 07:06:28 varjag [~eugene@122.62-97-226.bkkb.no] has joined #lisp 07:10:55 -!- zhanglearn [~chatzilla@219.133.62.89] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 07:10:56 -!- gaidal [~gaidal@113.119.25.10] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 07:10:58 Follow-up for yesterdays character vs. (unsigned-byte 8) ... here's a test I did. http://paste.lisp.org/display/124635 07:11:04 zhanglearn [~chatzilla@219.133.62.89] has joined #lisp 07:11:28 gaidal [~gaidal@113.119.25.10] has joined #lisp 07:19:30 kiuma [~kiuma@85-18-55-37.ip.fastwebnet.it] has joined #lisp 07:22:18 -!- Kryztof [~user@81.174.155.115] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 07:22:26 Beetny [~Beetny@ppp118-208-154-7.lns20.bne1.internode.on.net] has joined #lisp 07:23:59 spacefrogg [~spacefrog@unaffiliated/spacefrogg] has joined #lisp 07:24:19 aerique [310225@xs8.xs4all.nl] has joined #lisp 07:26:51 zomgbie [~jesus@213.162.68.107] has joined #lisp 07:27:28 elfrosch [~Brnt@p578b57e4.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #lisp 07:28:39 -!- jdz [~jdz@193.206.22.97] has quit [Quit: Byebye.] 07:32:37 -!- zomgbie [~jesus@213.162.68.107] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 07:32:50 Athas [~athas@shop3.diku.dk] has joined #lisp 07:35:18 -!- MeanWeen [~KAPITAL@cpe-174-099-078-185.nc.res.rr.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 07:35:35 <|3b|> hmm, guess sbcl+slime still doesn't like encoding errors very much :( 07:35:40 jdz [~jdz@193.206.22.97] has joined #lisp 07:36:05 -!- ltriant [~ltriant@lithium.mailguard.com.au] has quit [Quit: Computer has gone to sleep] 07:38:31 jtza8 [~jtza8@41.56.29.229] has joined #lisp 07:38:38 -!- insomniaSalt [~milan@unaffiliated/iammilan] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 07:39:45 did slime just crash? If so I've also seen that with ECL when messing with unusual strings (i.e. vectors holding a mix of characters and nil and trying to print it), ECL would remain up but slime would crash 07:39:59 insomniaSalt [~milan@port-92-204-94-92.dynamic.qsc.de] has joined #lisp 07:39:59 -!- insomniaSalt [~milan@port-92-204-94-92.dynamic.qsc.de] has quit [Changing host] 07:39:59 insomniaSalt [~milan@unaffiliated/iammilan] has joined #lisp 07:40:30 <|3b|> not exactly, just kills connection when sbcl can't print the error about not being able to print stuff due to not being able to encode it 07:41:00 Kajtek [~nope@nat4-230.ghnet.pl] has joined #lisp 07:41:01 well the connection being suddenly lost is what I interpreted as a slime crash 07:41:01 <|3b|> at least it let me reconnect 07:41:04 perhaps wrongly 07:41:13 reconnecting always worked and the old image persisted 07:41:25 <|3b|> could be something similar 07:41:59 like if swank survived but slime died 07:42:22 (the emacs lisp part) 07:42:36 it even could be due to emacs but I have no idea, honestly 07:42:58 *|3b|* wonders if it is a bug that babel accepts code points for utf16 surrogates when decoding utf8 07:43:48 hmm maybe it can optionally import utf16 within utf8, like some implementations will import latin-1 chars 07:44:03 I would have to check the code to really know 07:44:22 <|3b|> more likely it just doesn't notice :p 07:44:57 some decoders may even import invalid utf-8 octets as-is as utf-16 surrogates in a particular range, so that they may be decoded back as-is 07:45:06 orivej [~orivej@host-34-146-66-217.spbmts.ru] has joined #lisp 07:45:13 s/may be decoded/may be encoded/ 07:45:14 <|3b|> right, it has something like that it calls utf8b 07:45:26 right utf8b would do that 07:45:36 nha [~prefect@imamac13.epfl.ch] has joined #lisp 07:45:59 <|3b|> i want an error when it sees a correctly encoded code point corresponding to a utf16 surrogate 07:46:15 ZabaQ [~john.conn@135.114-84-212.staticip.namesco.net] has joined #lisp 07:46:29 <|3b|> (in addition to errors about invalid encodings of any code point, etc) 07:47:13 |3b|: why do you feed it with broken streams? 07:47:31 <|3b|> to verify it rejects them as per the spec i'm implementing 07:48:07 hm. so its slime in the intermediate that breaks? 07:48:12 funny 07:48:32 replor___ [~replore@203.152.213.161.static.zoot.jp] has joined #lisp 07:48:32 <|3b|> no, breakage 1 is that babel fails to reject the invalid code point 07:48:44 -!- replore [~replore@203.152.213.161.static.zoot.jp] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 07:49:16 <|3b|> then sbcl correctly refuses to encode it as utf8, then fails to print an error about the encoding failure (since the error has the same unencodable string), which breaks the connection 07:50:14 <|3b|> flexi-streams seems to catch it, guess i'll just use that for now... 07:54:24 marsell [~marsell@120.20.15.61] has joined #lisp 07:57:23 <|3b|> yay, 2 more test pass 07:58:17 blandest [~blandest@85.204.33.242] has joined #lisp 07:58:21 Joreji [~thomas@vpn-ei1.unidsl.de] has joined #lisp 08:00:13 -!- zhanglearn [~chatzilla@219.133.62.89] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 08:00:33 -!- elfrosch [~Brnt@p578b57e4.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 08:03:16 *|3b|* seems to need to use some different array types somewhere though, spending a big chunk of time in REPLACE when iolib decides it doesn't like the arrays i pass it 08:03:48 easyE [h3kmu7cCdT@panix2.panix.com] has joined #lisp 08:05:41 -!- _a` [a@c-24-4-196-90.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 08:06:49 peterhil [~peterhil@gw.maxisat.fi] has joined #lisp 08:08:23 -!- Salamander_ [~Salamande@ppp118-210-106-119.lns20.adl2.internode.on.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 08:09:45 -!- peterhil [~peterhil@gw.maxisat.fi] has quit [Read error: No route to host] 08:11:36 <|3b|> all tests more-or-less pass, wonder if i should bother with the -or-less ones 08:11:43 -!- blandest [~blandest@85.204.33.242] has quit [Quit: Reconnecting] 08:11:47 blandest [~blandest@85.204.33.242] has joined #lisp 08:12:53 _a` [a@c-24-4-196-90.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 08:13:24 ahinki [~chatzilla@212.99.10.150] has joined #lisp 08:17:54 -!- jdz [~jdz@193.206.22.97] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 08:20:22 -!- esden [~esden@repl.esden.net] has quit [Excess Flood] 08:20:53 Salamander_ [~Salamande@ppp118-210-3-140.lns20.adl2.internode.on.net] has joined #lisp 08:21:49 sbcl install seems to fail saying "can't open output/prefix.def" any ideas on that? 08:21:56 this is the latest from sbcl.org on linux 08:22:56 esden [~esden@repl.esden.net] has joined #lisp 08:24:12 -!- alvis [~alvis@tx-71-2-122-27.dhcp.embarqhsd.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 08:25:17 peterhil [~peterhil@gw.maxisat.fi] has joined #lisp 08:26:39 ah, the standard download link is for the /source/. that was apparently not the expected behaviour for me (and the new lisper in front of me :)) 08:26:40 -!- gaidal [~gaidal@113.119.25.10] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 08:26:53 Amyn [~abennama@64.208.49.21] has joined #lisp 08:28:37 -!- marsell [~marsell@120.20.15.61] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 08:29:36 jdz [~jdz@193.206.22.97] has joined #lisp 08:31:39 -!- orivej [~orivej@host-34-146-66-217.spbmts.ru] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 08:36:05 -!- gravicappa [~gravicapp@ppp91-77-167-230.pppoe.mtu-net.ru] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 08:37:34 mcsontos [mcsontos@nat/redhat/x-atqsbvgagvrheunn] has joined #lisp 08:39:34 c_arenz [~arenz@nat/ibm/x-civguwyuocfmvamp] has joined #lisp 08:41:13 -!- benny [~benny@i577A3DB2.versanet.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 08:41:43 alvis [~alvis@tx-71-2-122-27.dhcp.embarqhsd.net] has joined #lisp 08:43:29 gaidal [~gaidal@113.119.25.10] has joined #lisp 08:44:32 kennyd [~kennyd@93-136-72-37.adsl.net.t-com.hr] has joined #lisp 08:45:59 zhanglearn [~chatzilla@219.133.62.89] has joined #lisp 08:55:40 orivej [~orivej@host-116-146-66-217.spbmts.ru] has joined #lisp 08:56:23 leo2007 [~leo@114.247.10.72] has joined #lisp 08:56:24 -!- gaidal [~gaidal@113.119.25.10] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 08:56:38 -!- Salamander_ is now known as Salamander 08:56:51 gaidal [~gaidal@113.119.25.10] has joined #lisp 09:00:35 marsell [~marsell@120.18.101.131] has joined #lisp 09:04:14 -!- jdz [~jdz@193.206.22.97] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 09:06:09 -!- c_arenz [~arenz@nat/ibm/x-civguwyuocfmvamp] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 09:06:10 -!- alvis [~alvis@tx-71-2-122-27.dhcp.embarqhsd.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 09:09:03 -!- orivej [~orivej@host-116-146-66-217.spbmts.ru] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 09:10:49 -!- Quadrescence [~quadbook@unaffiliated/quadrescence] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 09:12:04 gravicappa [~gravicapp@ppp91-77-191-227.pppoe.mtu-net.ru] has joined #lisp 09:12:39 orivej [~orivej@host-71-146-66-217.spbmts.ru] has joined #lisp 09:17:01 jdz [~jdz@193.206.22.97] has joined #lisp 09:19:27 Kenjin [~josesanto@bl21-70-53.dsl.telepac.pt] has joined #lisp 09:20:55 |3b|: REPLACE what ? 09:22:28 <|3b|> fe[nl]ix: not sure exactly yet, best guess is the coerce from non-simple array to simple-array (in %send-to) 09:22:44 serichsen [~user@hmbg-5f762510.pool.mediaWays.net] has joined #lisp 09:23:01 -!- topeak [~topeak@123.114.123.1] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 09:23:24 _3b: yeah, try to always use simple-arrays 09:23:47 alvis [~alvis@tx-71-2-122-27.dhcp.embarqhsd.net] has joined #lisp 09:24:27 <|3b|> seems odd that it is so slow compared to my completely unoptimized XOR pass over the same amount of data though 09:24:28 -!- gaidal [~gaidal@113.119.25.10] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 09:24:49 <|3b|> though i guess that is in-place, so different cache effects 09:30:06 c_arenz [~arenz@nat/ibm/x-cfrxpgksrbtacnab] has joined #lisp 09:30:36 Hello! 09:30:52 -!- replor___ [~replore@203.152.213.161.static.zoot.jp] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 09:32:01 -!- neoesque [~neoesque@210.59.147.232] has quit [Quit: Bye!] 09:35:45 -!- leo2007 [~leo@114.247.10.72] has quit [Quit: rcirc on GNU Emacs 23.3.50.1] 09:36:50 topeak [~topeak@123.114.130.86] has joined #lisp 09:37:36 -!- Quetzalcoatl_ [~Administr@cpe-75-186-5-185.cinci.res.rr.com] has quit [*.net *.split] 09:37:37 -!- Posterdati [~tapioca@host140-230-dynamic.6-87-r.retail.telecomitalia.it] has quit [*.net *.split] 09:37:37 -!- ve [~a@vortis.xen.tardis.ed.ac.uk] has quit [*.net *.split] 09:37:37 -!- rotty [~rotty@78.41.115.190] has quit [*.net *.split] 09:37:37 -!- __mal [~mal@www.wimmekes.net] has quit [*.net *.split] 09:37:37 -!- Inode [~inode@time.uk.chromedpork.net] has quit [*.net *.split] 09:37:38 -!- joshe [~joshe@opal.elsasser.org] has quit [*.net *.split] 09:37:38 -!- lusory [~bart@bb219-74-102-119.singnet.com.sg] has quit [*.net *.split] 09:37:38 -!- billitch [~billitch@bastille.ma3.tv] has quit [*.net *.split] 09:37:38 -!- |3b| [foobar@cpe-72-179-19-4.austin.res.rr.com] has quit [*.net *.split] 09:37:38 -!- C-Keen [cckeen@pestilenz.org] has quit [*.net *.split] 09:37:38 -!- shachaf [~shachaf@204.109.63.130] has quit [*.net *.split] 09:37:38 -!- mikejs [~mike@ec2-50-16-185-74.compute-1.amazonaws.com] has quit [*.net *.split] 09:38:35 -!- manuel_ [~manuel_@pD9FDED53.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Quit: manuel_] 09:38:58 Quetzalcoatl_ [~Administr@cpe-75-186-5-185.cinci.res.rr.com] has joined #lisp 09:38:59 Posterdati [~tapioca@host140-230-dynamic.6-87-r.retail.telecomitalia.it] has joined #lisp 09:38:59 ve [~a@vortis.xen.tardis.ed.ac.uk] has joined #lisp 09:38:59 rotty [~rotty@78.41.115.190] has joined #lisp 09:38:59 Inode [~inode@time.uk.chromedpork.net] has joined #lisp 09:38:59 __mal [~mal@www.wimmekes.net] has joined #lisp 09:38:59 joshe [~joshe@opal.elsasser.org] has joined #lisp 09:38:59 lusory [~bart@bb219-74-102-119.singnet.com.sg] has joined #lisp 09:38:59 billitch [~billitch@bastille.ma3.tv] has joined #lisp 09:38:59 |3b| [foobar@cpe-72-179-19-4.austin.res.rr.com] has joined #lisp 09:38:59 C-Keen [cckeen@pestilenz.org] has joined #lisp 09:38:59 shachaf [~shachaf@204.109.63.130] has joined #lisp 09:38:59 mikejs [~mike@ec2-50-16-185-74.compute-1.amazonaws.com] has joined #lisp 09:39:00 -!- AntiSpamMeta [~MetaBot@unaffiliated/afterdeath/bot/antispambot] has quit [Excess Flood] 09:40:35 gaidal [~gaidal@113.119.25.10] has joined #lisp 09:41:03 AntiSpamMeta [~MetaBot@unaffiliated/afterdeath/bot/antispambot] has joined #lisp 09:43:01 -!- killerboy [~mateusz@wireless.its.sdu.dk] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 09:43:53 After installing sbcl+emacs+slime on a new system, I don't get that sbcl window in emacs when starting slime locally or with slime-connect. Not sure where the code is supposed to go. I'm using the same .emacs file. Does anyone know how I might get the old behavior back? 09:44:33 <|3b|> "sbcl window" ? 09:44:40 <|3b|> you mean the repl? 09:44:47 yes the repl 09:45:02 <|3b|> was the other machine using a very old slime? 09:45:12 I just vaguely remember C-x b:ing a lot to something called sbcl-something-repl-something 09:45:13 Running into some problems with sbcl in constructing large (10^7) arrays. Should this be a problem? Is there a resource for figuring out how sbcl deals with large ammounts of data? 09:45:14 <|3b|> may need to load the repl contrib in slime-setup 09:45:29 not very old, it was the one in debian sid 09:45:34 but this one is a bit newer 09:45:38 -!- c_arenz [~arenz@nat/ibm/x-cfrxpgksrbtacnab] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 09:46:19 <|3b|> easyE: large arrays work here, sure you didn't try to print them to slime or something? 09:46:58 That's sort of what I was thining was happening. 09:46:59 <|3b|> 10^7 doesn't sound that large for that matter 09:47:03 -!- Kenjin [~josesanto@bl21-70-53.dsl.telepac.pt] has quit [Quit: Computer has gone to sleep] 09:47:28 <|3b|> try setting *print-length* and/or *print-array* 09:47:29 So, I should expect 10^9 not to be a problem as well? 09:47:37 |3b|: right. 09:48:34 *|3b|* wouldn't expect problems until you get to a reasonable fraction of your available ram 09:48:56 <|3b|> (where reasonable is probably under 50%, since the GC might need to make a copy) 09:49:17 Do really mean RAM, or VM? 09:49:34 i.e. does sbcl stry to keep everything in main memor? 09:49:45 <|3b|> well, if you really want to swap, it will... 09:50:08 <|3b|> SBCL by default allocated 8GB of address space on x8664, so that would be a limit too 09:50:57 |3b|: adding slime-repl did it, thanks! 09:51:06 <|3b|> 10^9 might be a problem on 32 bit, since array indices are fixnums 09:51:11 Would that be true for "exotic" x64 platforms like solaris? 09:51:23 <|3b|> gaidal: might also try slime-fancy, since slime has lots of nice features that aren't loaded by default 09:51:53 <|3b|> the default address space allocation? not sure, i guess that could be platform specific 09:53:14 Is there an API to introspect such things in a running sbcl, or is this mostly a build -time knobs interface? 09:54:01 <|3b|> there is a command-line option (--dynamic-space-size or something like that), don't remember if you can see it from inside the image without effort or not though 09:55:16 I had success using hte (hex editor that understands symbol tables) on the sbcl binary, to tweak the dynamic-space default 09:55:17 -!- gaidal [~gaidal@113.119.25.10] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 09:55:33 gaidal [~gaidal@113.119.25.10] has joined #lisp 09:55:51 Are sbcl specials per thread? 09:56:20 If I DEFPARAMETER a large array defintion will I overrun the per-thread stack? 09:56:21 <|3b|> if you bind them inside the thread 09:57:11 |3b|: alright will check out what it does 09:57:16 <|3b|> defparameter would set the global value, and the array would be on the heap either way 09:57:27 killerboy [~mateusz@wireless.its.sdu.dk] has joined #lisp 09:59:22 -!- xyxu [~xyxu@58.41.14.46] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 10:00:50 -!- sanjoyd [~sanjoyd@unaffiliated/sanjoyd] has left #lisp 10:02:04 sanjoyd [~sanjoyd@unaffiliated/sanjoyd] has joined #lisp 10:02:08 -!- EyesIsServer [~eyes@unaffiliated/eyesismine] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 10:02:39 *|3b|* supposes array element type would also matter when deciding how big arrays are reasonable, factor of 64 between memory usage of a bit-array and untyped array 10:03:05 |3b|: absolutely. 10:04:28 -!- Joreji [~thomas@vpn-ei1.unidsl.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 10:05:18 Kenjin [~josesanto@193.136.207.199] has joined #lisp 10:07:01 -!- frhodes [~frhodes@168-103-96-233.albq.qwest.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 10:08:41 -!- ramkrsna [ramkrsna@unaffiliated/ramkrsna] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 10:08:42 <|3b|> looks like x8664 uses same settings everywhere but openbsd 10:10:00 -!- zhanglearn [~chatzilla@219.133.62.89] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 10:13:54 -!- orivej [~orivej@host-71-146-66-217.spbmts.ru] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 10:14:44 swilde [~wilde@aktaia.intevation.org] has joined #lisp 10:15:15 lnostdal_ [~lnostdal@ti0030a380-dhcp0111.bb.online.no] has joined #lisp 10:16:29 *|3b|* wonders if i should just do my own utf8 encoding/decoding :p 10:18:36 replore_ [~replore@g1-223-25-188-251.bmobile.ne.jp] has joined #lisp 10:21:01 -!- Kenjin [~josesanto@193.136.207.199] has quit [Quit: Computer has gone to sleep] 10:21:10 ramkrsna [ramkrsna@unaffiliated/ramkrsna] has joined #lisp 10:22:22 -!- waaaaargh__ [~waaaaargh@agsb-5d87f4ae.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit [Quit: WTF? leaving!] 10:22:33 Kenjin [~josesanto@193.136.207.199] has joined #lisp 10:22:41 -!- Kenjin [~josesanto@193.136.207.199] has quit [Client Quit] 10:28:46 eyes_ [~eyes@unaffiliated/eyesismine] has joined #lisp 10:30:52 markskilbeck [~mark@unaffiliated/markskilbeck] has joined #lisp 10:31:08 -!- replore_ [~replore@g1-223-25-188-251.bmobile.ne.jp] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 10:32:23 -!- markskilbeck [~mark@unaffiliated/markskilbeck] has quit [Client Quit] 10:33:38 -!- blandest [~blandest@85.204.33.242] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 10:35:04 blandest [~blandest@85.204.33.242] has joined #lisp 10:36:04 fiveop [~fiveop@dslb-094-218-044-172.pools.arcor-ip.net] has joined #lisp 10:36:07 markskilbeck [~mark@unaffiliated/markskilbeck] has joined #lisp 10:36:40 is there a mirror of lispm.dyndns.org? 10:40:56 btw, what happened to it? 10:41:12 -!- spradnyesh [~pradyus@nat/yahoo/x-idebiumtayemgzxx] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 10:41:54 Kenjin [~josesanto@193.136.207.199] has joined #lisp 10:43:04 -!- Kenjin [~josesanto@193.136.207.199] has quit [Client Quit] 10:44:26 Maybe it's hibernating. 10:44:33 He is still quite active on stack overflow. 10:47:27 spradnyesh [~pradyus@nat/yahoo/x-awsbscajisnuvdre] has joined #lisp 10:49:25 Xach, serichsen: I tested base-character vs. (unsigned-byte 8) ... but I think I'm doing something wrong: http://paste.lisp.org/display/124635 10:50:45 flip214: I missed the context. What is the overall project? 10:57:59 -!- mcsontos [mcsontos@nat/redhat/x-atqsbvgagvrheunn] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 11:00:02 -!- daniel__ [~daniel@p5082A51F.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 11:00:05 daniel___ [~daniel@p5082A51F.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #lisp 11:01:30 this was the performance micro-optimization I asked about ... re cl-ppcre and (unsigned-byte 8) etc. 11:01:34 mcsontos [mcsontos@nat/redhat/x-qzychgphckesyrhe] has joined #lisp 11:01:56 I tried loading a few MB of data, and this test seems to indicate a performance difference 11:02:02 xyxu [~xyxu@222.68.163.137] has joined #lisp 11:02:24 (not even cl-ppcre yet, only read-sequence - converting bytes to characters seems to be slow "enough" to show) 11:02:38 No, what's the overall project? 11:03:04 -!- blandest [~blandest@85.204.33.242] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 11:08:27 Joreji [~thomas@83-013.eduroam.RWTH-Aachen.DE] has joined #lisp 11:08:37 reading some data, parsing via regex, printing data out 11:09:29 What's the regex look like? 11:09:37 Printing it out to what? 11:10:24 -!- spradnyesh [~pradyus@nat/yahoo/x-awsbscajisnuvdre] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 11:11:08 -!- djinni` [~djinni`@li125-242.members.linode.com] has quit [Quit: ERC Version 5.3 (IRC client for Emacs)] 11:11:31 spradnyesh [~pradyus@nat/yahoo/x-nrsslhckbdvwwfaa] has joined #lisp 11:11:36 Kenjin [~josesanto@193.136.207.199] has joined #lisp 11:11:37 never mind the regex now ... there's a nice speed difference when reading the data in to base-char vs. (unsigned-byte 8), and I'd like to know what I'm doing wrong 11:12:02 Ok, sorry, not something of interest to me. 11:12:05 the base-char type has in sbcl +sb-unicode only the range 0 .. 127, so the "higher" characters give an error 11:12:17 ok 11:12:18 -!- gaidal [~gaidal@113.119.25.10] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 11:12:19 djinni` [~djinni`@li125-242.members.linode.com] has joined #lisp 11:12:52 -!- killerboy [~mateusz@wireless.its.sdu.dk] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 11:16:11 -!- _8david` [~user@91-65-217-112-dynip.superkabel.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 11:16:14 Nice, I've gotten an e-mail on which my first reaction was: spam. Then I looked again and thought it was genuine and now I'm not sure anymore. It's about translation a (Lisp) blog post of mine to Romanian. Anyone else ever get these? 11:16:34 *translating 11:19:46 aerique: I do, sometimes. 11:19:52 -!- cyrillos [~cyrill@188.134.33.130] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 11:21:04 -!- xyxu [~xyxu@222.68.163.137] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 11:22:32 -!- Kenjin [~josesanto@193.136.207.199] has quit [Quit: Computer has gone to sleep] 11:23:34 xyxu [~xyxu@222.68.163.137] has joined #lisp 11:24:34 Kenjin [~josesanto@193.136.207.199] has joined #lisp 11:24:38 -!- kennyd [~kennyd@93-136-72-37.adsl.net.t-com.hr] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 11:25:44 -!- ramkrsna [ramkrsna@unaffiliated/ramkrsna] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 11:26:06 Xach: have there ever been mails where'd you doubt whether they were genuine? 11:26:15 Not yet. 11:26:20 -!- spradnyesh [~pradyus@nat/yahoo/x-nrsslhckbdvwwfaa] has left #lisp 11:26:39 Xach: mind if I forward you mine? 11:27:07 Not at all 11:28:31 venk [~user@r49-2-6-166.cpe.vividwireless.net.au] has joined #lisp 11:28:40 gaidal [~gaidal@113.119.25.10] has joined #lisp 11:28:59 -!- Kajtek [~nope@nat4-230.ghnet.pl] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 11:29:04 -!- marsell [~marsell@120.18.101.131] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 11:30:45 Kryztof [~user@158.223.59.95] has joined #lisp 11:31:08 Kajtek [~nope@nat4-230.ghnet.pl] has joined #lisp 11:32:33 cyrillos [~cyrill@188.134.33.130] has joined #lisp 11:36:45 -!- venk [~user@r49-2-6-166.cpe.vividwireless.net.au] has quit [Quit: ERC Version 5.3 (IRC client for Emacs)] 11:38:14 Xach: thanks for your thoughts, was a first time for me :) 11:38:33 The ones I've gotten all seemed legit. 11:39:41 naeg [~naeg@194.208.239.170] has joined #lisp 11:41:05 -!- Kenjin [~josesanto@193.136.207.199] has quit [Quit: Computer has gone to sleep] 11:41:53 -!- setmeaway [~setmeaway@119.201.52.182] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 11:42:49 ramkrsna [ramkrsna@nat/redhat/x-spgjvnpodbgihjwu] has joined #lisp 11:42:49 -!- ramkrsna [ramkrsna@nat/redhat/x-spgjvnpodbgihjwu] has quit [Changing host] 11:42:49 ramkrsna [ramkrsna@unaffiliated/ramkrsna] has joined #lisp 11:44:04 c_arenz [~arenz@nat/ibm/x-kdwejgvltufwemsc] has joined #lisp 11:46:36 littlebobby [~bob@unaffiliated/littlebobby] has joined #lisp 11:46:46 setmeaway [stemearay@119.201.52.182] has joined #lisp 11:50:42 -!- esden [~esden@repl.esden.net] has quit [Excess Flood] 11:51:50 -!- topeak [~topeak@123.114.130.86] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 11:52:27 esden [~esden@repl.esden.net] has joined #lisp 11:52:55 blandest [~blandest@85.204.33.242] has joined #lisp 11:54:54 Kenjin [~josesanto@193.136.207.199] has joined #lisp 11:59:52 hlavaty [~user@91-65-217-112-dynip.superkabel.de] has joined #lisp 12:00:50 -!- mcsontos [mcsontos@nat/redhat/x-qzychgphckesyrhe] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 12:07:06 -!- Beetny [~Beetny@ppp118-208-154-7.lns20.bne1.internode.on.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 12:13:27 mcsontos [~mcsontos@nat/redhat-us/x-prfeckxiwxglpinj] has joined #lisp 12:14:11 -!- mishoo [~mishoo@79.112.115.118] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 12:14:20 mishoo [~mishoo@79.112.115.118] has joined #lisp 12:16:55 -!- zmyrgel [~user@193.64.112.22] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 12:17:21 zmyrgel [~user@193.64.112.22] has joined #lisp 12:17:27 -!- Amyn [~abennama@64.208.49.21] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 12:17:39 Amyn [~abennama@64.208.49.45] has joined #lisp 12:20:25 sykopomp [~sykopomp@gateway/tor-sasl/sykopomp] has joined #lisp 12:23:39 -!- ``Erik_ is now known as ``Erik 12:29:38 -!- Kenjin [~josesanto@193.136.207.199] has quit [Quit: Computer has gone to sleep] 12:29:39 -!- gaidal [~gaidal@113.119.25.10] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 12:30:15 gaidal [~gaidal@113.119.25.10] has joined #lisp 12:30:31 antgreen [~user@bas3-toronto06-1176449492.dsl.bell.ca] has joined #lisp 12:31:24 -!- Obfuscate [~keii@ip98-176-16-175.sd.sd.cox.net] has quit [Quit: WeeChat 0.3.5] 12:32:14 Obfuscate [~keii@ip98-176-16-175.sd.sd.cox.net] has joined #lisp 12:33:42 Shaftoe_ [~memet@88.242.29.174] has joined #lisp 12:34:03 Anyone have any idea how one submits patches to CLSQL? 12:34:36 I can't find any instructions anywhere on the site, and I'm not sure personally emailing Kevin R. is proper etiquette. 12:35:12 http://lists.b9.com/mailman/listinfo/clsql-devel 12:36:40 francogrex [franco@grex.cyberspace.org] has joined #lisp 12:36:52 ok thanks. I'm already on the list. I'll interact with that. 12:36:59 dnolen [~davidnole@cpe-98-14-92-234.nyc.res.rr.com] has joined #lisp 12:37:19 -!- Obfuscate [~keii@ip98-176-16-175.sd.sd.cox.net] has quit [Quit: WeeChat 0.3.5] 12:37:50 Obfuscate [~keii@ip98-176-16-175.sd.sd.cox.net] has joined #lisp 12:38:27 didi [~user@unaffiliated/didi/x-1022147] has joined #lisp 12:38:34 Younder [~john@238.202.34.95.customer.cdi.no] has joined #lisp 12:39:35 Is there a random function that returns an integer inside an interval? Like (random 30 50) => 42 12:40:12 didi: there is no function to do that because you can use simple maths to make cl:random do that for you 12:40:17 -!- H4ns`` is now known as H4ns 12:40:49 H4ns: I see. 12:41:24 didi: no do a (+ (random 20) 30) 12:42:01 Younder: Thanks. 12:45:57 didi, sorry that is 30-59. You need 21 (fench-post problem) 12:46:57 Younder: :) 12:47:16 -!- ramkrsna [ramkrsna@unaffiliated/ramkrsna] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 12:50:00 or, perhaps, even 30-49 .... ;) 12:50:40 -!- zmyrgel [~user@193.64.112.22] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 12:50:56 flip214, no shit... 12:51:03 syrinx__ [~syrinx_@unaffiliated/syrinx-/x-4255893] has joined #lisp 12:51:35 -!- syrinx_ [~syrinx_@unaffiliated/syrinx-/x-4255893] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 12:54:09 -!- syrinx__ is now known as syrinx_ 12:54:34 *Younder* beats himself in the head with a dead flounder 12:55:52 *phadthai* uses a timer and notifies Younder that it's allright to stop after 5 minutes 12:55:54 -!- gaidal [~gaidal@113.119.25.10] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 12:56:22 gaidal [~gaidal@113.119.25.10] has joined #lisp 12:57:10 venk [~user@r49-2-6-166.cpe.vividwireless.net.au] has joined #lisp 12:58:59 Yuuhi [benni@p54839A1D.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #lisp 12:59:00 -!- gaidal [~gaidal@113.119.25.10] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 12:59:24 gaidal [~gaidal@113.119.25.10] has joined #lisp 13:01:26 -!- Shaftoe_ [~memet@88.242.29.174] has quit [Quit: Shaftoe_] 13:05:55 Kenjin [~josesanto@193.136.206.28] has joined #lisp 13:06:43 -!- djinni` [~djinni`@li125-242.members.linode.com] has quit [Quit: ERC Version 5.3 (IRC client for Emacs)] 13:06:45 -!- mindCrime_ [~chatzilla@cpe-076-182-089-009.nc.res.rr.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 13:07:38 djinni` [~djinni`@li125-242.members.linode.com] has joined #lisp 13:11:45 serichsen: com.informatimago.common-lisp.cesarum.array:copy-array copies arrays as you want (without even having to pass keyword arguments). 13:11:59 oudeis [~oudeis@46-116-174-252.bb.netvision.net.il] has joined #lisp 13:13:54 -!- nicdev_` is now known as nicdev_ 13:13:55 -!- gaidal [~gaidal@113.119.25.10] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 13:14:32 gaidal [~gaidal@113.119.25.10] has joined #lisp 13:15:28 -!- oudeis [~oudeis@46-116-174-252.bb.netvision.net.il] has quit [Client Quit] 13:15:43 pjb: Thanks! 13:15:48 urandom__ [~user@p548A5C9A.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #lisp 13:15:58 Amyn1 [~abennama@62.23.212.45] has joined #lisp 13:16:59 pjb: That doesn't mean that alexandria couldn't do it right, too, though. :) 13:18:30 -!- Amyn [~abennama@64.208.49.45] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 13:19:05 -!- francogrex [franco@grex.cyberspace.org] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 13:19:31 rmarianski [~rmariansk@mail.marianski.com] has joined #lisp 13:20:29 If someone has a bit of time, is there some way to read latin-1 (or something else non-converted) from a stream? http://paste.lisp.org/display/124635 shows some time difference for (unsigned-byte 8) vs. character 13:20:48 flip214: non-converted? 13:21:00 hmm have you specified :external-format for your stream? 13:21:33 ah yes I see it there 13:23:15 in utf16 it is just the lower byte 13:23:29 Xach: I'd like to get the bytes in an array, and then use cl-ppcre. cl-ppcre (currently) doesn't do bytes, only characters, but reading characters is _slow_ compared to binary reading 13:23:34 dwim [~dwim@210.Red-79-146-127.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net] has joined #lisp 13:23:46 Younder: still double memory usage, so half of the data to fit into RAM 13:23:49 You already know my suggestion on the topic. 13:23:50 the first 256 characters of unicode are iso-latin-1 13:24:22 flip214, so strip it off as you read it 13:24:28 pjb: I'm browsing http://informatimago.com/develop/lisp/index.html and the links to the individual packages are broken. 13:24:29 Xach: yes, I took a look ... I think I could change cl-ppcre, but it would take at least a week 13:25:40 -!- mcsontos [~mcsontos@nat/redhat-us/x-prfeckxiwxglpinj] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 13:26:46 killerboy [~mateusz@users69.kollegienet.dk] has joined #lisp 13:28:14 -!- tsuru [~charlie@50.9.237.217] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 13:33:05 -!- mrSpec [~Spec@unaffiliated/mrspec] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 13:34:42 gffa [~gffa@unaffiliated/gffa] has joined #lisp 13:34:50 -!- gaidal [~gaidal@113.119.25.10] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 13:37:17 serichsen: for the sources, you now may browse: https://gitorious.org/com-informatimago/ 13:37:34 serichsen: otherwise, indeed, Alexandria could also do the right thing. 13:38:38 flip214: I'm still really curious about what the regular expresssions look like. 13:39:16 *Younder* is reading Unix network programming (again this time V3) 13:41:12 Although 'Advanced programming in the Unix environment' is good and is you want just one book.. This is the one! 13:41:27 Younder: Wrong channel. 13:41:54 Xach, sorry.. Thought I was in #c 13:42:35 Daev [~KAPITAL@nom27150d.nomadic.ncsu.edu] has joined #lisp 13:42:46 Well, we have iolib and usockets. 13:43:07 Nevertheless a bit of Nix background can't hurt. 13:43:57 rme [~rme@50.43.128.22] has joined #lisp 13:45:06 tsuru` [~user@c-68-53-57-241.hsd1.tn.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 13:45:57 Amadiro [~Amadiro@ti0021a380-dhcp3462.bb.online.no] has joined #lisp 13:46:27 -!- gko [~gko@110-27-32-186.adsl.fetnet.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 13:47:20 I have noticed there are no books on network programming in Lisp. 13:47:25 -!- nicdev_ [~user@static-72-74-85-37.bstnma.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 13:48:23 Younder: that is because you can't program network applications "in lisp" 13:49:05 Younder: there might be a book on usocket or iolib in the future, or maybe about acl sockets. i have my doubts, though. 13:51:23 H4ns, The modem pool at telenor (the largst telecom Norway) war written in Lisp. (You can!) 13:51:48 Younder: i certainly know that, but it is not really "network programming in lisp" 13:51:56 Younder: it's implementation-specific. There is one book that speaks about network programming in CL with usocket, IIRC. 13:52:15 it's not finished and not released, and I don't know if the usocket chapter is out 13:53:06 is that the ORA book that got cancelled when the author fell ill? 13:53:09 People who use Lisp usually know enough not to get lost in searching for docs 13:53:19 Fade: I think it's more among the lines of "suspended" 13:54:06 dlowe [~dlowe@c-66-30-116-162.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 13:54:33 -!- markskilbeck [~mark@unaffiliated/markskilbeck] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 13:55:45 CL has a lot of abandon ware though. So I find a good knowlege og the Linux core interface helps. 13:56:29 Younder: if what you want to do is linux network programming, then knowing linux network programming is good, regardless of the programming language used. 13:56:58 H4ns, exactly 13:57:00 Younder: but if you know something about linux network programming and approach windows with that knowledge, you'll likely be suprised and have to read up on windows. 13:58:07 H4ns, Not much. aio_ .. functions for asynchronous IO are different though 13:59:20 Younder: that's only because WinSocks emulates BSD interface. There are native windows networking functions that are more like VMS' 13:59:44 Jasko [~tjasko@c-174-59-204-245.hsd1.pa.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 14:01:15 -!- rmarianski is now known as rmar|away 14:02:29 ramusara [~ramusara@220.156.210.236.user.e-catv.ne.jp] has joined #lisp 14:04:18 lichtblau [~user@91-65-217-112-dynip.superkabel.de] has joined #lisp 14:07:46 realitygrill [~realitygr@76.226.123.139] has joined #lisp 14:09:35 altsrid [~altsrid@S010678ca39ff0146.vn.shawcable.net] has joined #lisp 14:12:36 -!- Daev [~KAPITAL@nom27150d.nomadic.ncsu.edu] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 14:14:36 sellout [~Adium@c-98-245-160-186.hsd1.co.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 14:16:36 Daev [~KAPITAL@nom27150d.nomadic.ncsu.edu] has joined #lisp 14:19:40 oudeis [~oudeis@bzq-218-0-98.cablep.bezeqint.net] has joined #lisp 14:19:47 pnq [~nick@AC81CAFD.ipt.aol.com] has joined #lisp 14:20:02 realitygrill_ [~realitygr@adsl-76-226-123-139.dsl.sfldmi.sbcglobal.net] has joined #lisp 14:20:09 -!- realitygrill [~realitygr@76.226.123.139] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 14:20:09 -!- realitygrill_ is now known as realitygrill 14:21:33 markskilbeck [~mark@unaffiliated/markskilbeck] has joined #lisp 14:26:33 FreeArtMan [~FreeArtMa@93.177.213.54] has joined #lisp 14:30:34 -!- naeg [~naeg@194.208.239.170] has quit [Quit: WeeChat 0.3.5] 14:35:43 -!- trebor_dki [~user@mail.dki.tu-darmstadt.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 14:35:52 -!- realitygrill [~realitygr@adsl-76-226-123-139.dsl.sfldmi.sbcglobal.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 14:38:43 kennyd [~kennyd@93-136-72-37.adsl.net.t-com.hr] has joined #lisp 14:39:21 -!- FreeArtMan [~FreeArtMa@93.177.213.54] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 14:40:25 realitygrill [~realitygr@adsl-76-226-118-122.dsl.sfldmi.sbcglobal.net] has joined #lisp 14:40:49 -!- antgreen [~user@bas3-toronto06-1176449492.dsl.bell.ca] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 14:43:01 rvirding [~chatzilla@c-3c90e255.56-4-64736c14.cust.bredbandsbolaget.se] has joined #lisp 14:44:01 antgreen [~user@bas3-toronto06-1176449492.dsl.bell.ca] has joined #lisp 14:44:12 FreeArtMan [~FreeArtMa@93.177.213.54] has joined #lisp 14:47:13 -!- pnq [~nick@AC81CAFD.ipt.aol.com] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 14:48:07 -!- aerique [310225@xs8.xs4all.nl] has quit [Quit: ...] 14:49:02 benny` [~benny@i577A7C66.versanet.de] has joined #lisp 14:49:23 ahinki_ [~chatzilla@212.99.10.150] has joined #lisp 14:50:58 -!- FreeArtMan [~FreeArtMa@93.177.213.54] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 14:51:09 FreeArtMan [~FreeArtMa@93.177.213.54] has joined #lisp 14:51:32 -!- ahinki [~chatzilla@212.99.10.150] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 14:51:44 -!- ahinki_ is now known as ahinki 14:52:07 -!- varjag [~eugene@122.62-97-226.bkkb.no] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 14:52:39 -!- benny` is now known as benny 14:52:40 -!- dnolen [~davidnole@cpe-98-14-92-234.nyc.res.rr.com] has quit [Quit: dnolen] 14:57:46 -!- realitygrill [~realitygr@adsl-76-226-118-122.dsl.sfldmi.sbcglobal.net] has quit [Quit: realitygrill] 14:59:23 ahinki_ [~chatzilla@212.99.10.150] has joined #lisp 15:00:06 nicdev_ [~user@static-72-74-85-37.bstnma.fios.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 15:01:30 -!- ahinki [~chatzilla@212.99.10.150] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 15:02:11 ahinki [~chatzilla@212.99.10.150] has joined #lisp 15:02:51 -!- Kenjin [~josesanto@193.136.206.28] has quit [Quit: Computer has gone to sleep] 15:03:51 -!- sellout [~Adium@c-98-245-160-186.hsd1.co.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 15:06:06 -!- ahinki_ [~chatzilla@212.99.10.150] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 15:07:16 Kenjin [~josesanto@193.136.206.28] has joined #lisp 15:07:20 milanj [~milanj_@109-93-129-148.dynamic.isp.telekom.rs] has joined #lisp 15:08:21 coyo [kvirc@pool-71-164-173-28.dllstx.fios.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 15:08:21 -!- coyo [kvirc@pool-71-164-173-28.dllstx.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Changing host] 15:08:21 coyo [kvirc@unaffiliated/bandu] has joined #lisp 15:09:48 realitygrill [~realitygr@thewall.novi.lib.mi.us] has joined #lisp 15:10:35 -!- ahinki [~chatzilla@212.99.10.150] has quit [Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.87 [Firefox 7.0/20110824172139]] 15:10:48 sellout [~Adium@c-98-245-162-253.hsd1.co.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 15:11:06 dl [~user@chpcwl01.hpc.unm.edu] has joined #lisp 15:12:00 mindCrime_ [~chatzilla@rrcs-70-62-112-146.midsouth.biz.rr.com] has joined #lisp 15:16:08 pcavs [~Adium@63.139.127.6] has joined #lisp 15:17:39 gko [~gko@220-135-201-90.HINET-IP.hinet.net] has joined #lisp 15:20:10 -!- FreeArtMan [~FreeArtMa@93.177.213.54] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 15:22:11 -!- rvirding [~chatzilla@c-3c90e255.56-4-64736c14.cust.bredbandsbolaget.se] has left #lisp 15:22:57 -!- kushal [kdas@fedora/kushal] has quit [Excess Flood] 15:23:02 -!- rmar|away is now known as rmarianski 15:23:09 H4ns: wow, what book are you talking about ? 15:23:30 kushal [kdas@fedora/kushal] has joined #lisp 15:23:55 naeg [~naeg@194.208.239.170] has joined #lisp 15:28:23 orivej [~orivej@host-67-146-66-217.spbmts.ru] has joined #lisp 15:28:26 -!- jdz [~jdz@193.206.22.97] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 15:28:56 -!- kushal [kdas@fedora/kushal] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 15:29:07 -!- altsrid [~altsrid@S010678ca39ff0146.vn.shawcable.net] has quit [Quit: Computer has gone to sleep.] 15:30:34 kushal [kdas@fedora/kushal] has joined #lisp 15:30:47 -!- oudeis [~oudeis@bzq-218-0-98.cablep.bezeqint.net] has quit [Quit: This computer has gone to sleep] 15:33:10 -!- orivej [~orivej@host-67-146-66-217.spbmts.ru] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 15:34:13 francogrex [franco@grex.cyberspace.org] has joined #lisp 15:34:56 silenius [~silenius@p4FFC99E6.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #lisp 15:35:06 -!- coyo [kvirc@unaffiliated/bandu] has quit [Quit: I need my meds... >.<] 15:39:17 mcsontos [~mcsontos@hotspot8.rywasoft.net] has joined #lisp 15:41:21 -!- attila_lendvai [~attila_le@unaffiliated/attila-lendvai/x-3126965] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 15:41:56 does anyone but me use slime simple-completions? 15:42:14 -!- setmeaway [stemearay@119.201.52.182] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 15:42:22 tsuru`` [~user@c-68-53-57-241.hsd1.tn.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 15:42:24 setmeaway [~setmeaway@119.201.52.182] has joined #lisp 15:43:40 -!- spacefrogg [~spacefrog@unaffiliated/spacefrogg] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 15:44:05 -!- tsuru` [~user@c-68-53-57-241.hsd1.tn.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 15:44:17 -!- kpreid [~kpreid@128.153.212.174] has quit [Quit: Quitting] 15:45:25 -!- blandest [~blandest@85.204.33.242] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 15:45:47 fe[nl]ix: this is the book I was referring to: http://lisp-book.org/ 15:46:47 seangrove [~user@c-71-202-126-17.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 15:47:07 tsuru``` [~user@c-68-53-57-241.hsd1.tn.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 15:47:16 nicdev_` [~user@static-72-74-85-37.bstnma.fios.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 15:47:19 Kryztof: only until i discovered fuzzy 15:47:53 -!- xyxu [~xyxu@222.68.163.137] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 15:48:00 Fade: I see 15:48:04 -!- nicdev_ [~user@static-72-74-85-37.bstnma.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 15:48:30 sprayzor [~user@213.37.73.151.dyn.user.ono.com] has joined #lisp 15:48:35 -!- tsuru`` [~user@c-68-53-57-241.hsd1.tn.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 15:48:47 is it a good book? 15:49:18 well, it is unfinished, so it is very uneven. 15:49:54 Kryztof, me also, dont know why but with fuzzy i need to press M two times in situation where there is only one match 15:50:14 and the author chose to use some of the commercial lisp immplementations and things like allegrograph to illustrate persistence, which I think was questionable. 15:50:35 but there's a chapter on slime 15:50:54 ok 15:51:01 I'm baffled by the "complete but not unique" message I get 15:51:26 Kryztof: the symbol exists, but its name is also a prefix of another symbol? 15:51:30 if I open up a fresh slime repl in cl-user and type t a TAB, it tells me "complete, but not unique" -- but "ta" is blatantly not unique 15:51:54 -!- nicdev_` is now known as nicdev_ 15:51:58 pkhuong: that is what I would expect, but that is not what the code is doing nor the actual situation, unless I am misdriving 15:52:09 clearly not the situation. 15:52:21 tsuru```` [~user@c-68-53-57-241.hsd1.tn.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 15:52:31 I mean '"ta" is blatantly not complete' 15:54:05 -!- tsuru``` [~user@c-68-53-57-241.hsd1.tn.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 15:54:51 oudeis [~oudeis@93-172-91-141.bb.netvision.net.il] has joined #lisp 15:55:17 -!- ocharles [u411@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-nfraehwaomwqreza] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 15:55:26 ok, me hacks in the obvious conditional 15:56:21 -!- fmu___ [u89@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-tojgupibowhysbrr] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 15:56:39 Bike [~Glossina@69.166.35.238] has joined #lisp 15:57:10 works with my test case! 15:58:16 Is it common to define a FOO-USER? I find it sometimes inside FOO packages. 15:59:09 -!- tsuru```` [~user@c-68-53-57-241.hsd1.tn.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 15:59:14 LiamH [~none@pdp8.nrl.navy.mil] has joined #lisp 16:00:26 I tend to do it for testing in development. 16:01:03 -!- Bike [~Glossina@69.166.35.238] has quit [Client Quit] 16:01:10 Bike [~Glossina@69.166.35.238] has joined #lisp 16:01:48 Fade: Is it better than just (in-package foo)? 16:02:03 Fade: hrm good idea 16:02:21 I like it because then my package namespace isn't poluted with chaff from the repl. 16:02:35 SpringheeledJake [~Spring-he@75-138-73-64.dhcp.gwnt.ga.charter.com] has joined #lisp 16:03:02 Fade: Nice. 16:03:25 i rarely use the repl anymore as much as a scratch buffer, but that doesn't stop pollution .. though i haven't actually had a problem with it 16:03:45 I find it tends to trip up my autocompleter 16:03:49 -!- Kryztof [~user@158.223.59.95] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 16:03:49 with symbol-typos. 16:03:59 fmu___ [u89@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-xbwntupucdghosmq] has joined #lisp 16:04:06 oGMo: :-o I *love* the REPL. 16:04:19 I guess if you're a super accurate typist, then it's a non-issue, but defining a user package is a neat way to sidestep. 16:04:29 -!- fmu___ [u89@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-xbwntupucdghosmq] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 16:04:57 It's one of the killing features for me. 16:05:34 I use slime-scratch a lot, too, but it definitely hasn't obviated the use of the repl. 16:06:22 didi: with slime-eval-defun (which evaluates any toplevel form afaict), i just type into scratch .. don't lose/retype code or have to navigate history 16:06:35 plus, pressing C-M-x has a satisfying trigger-pull feel 16:06:50 fmu___ [u89@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-adgcoeqbkpobiftd] has joined #lisp 16:07:08 *|3b|* uses comments as a repl :p 16:07:19 comments? 16:07:27 oGMo: I use that too. I guess with slime there isn't a so clear distinction, but I love typing crap at the REPL. 16:07:36 <|3b|> combined with one or more of C-M-x, C-x C-e, etc 16:08:23 ah yeah .. i usually don't bother with comments for quick one-offs 16:08:23 *|3b|* should probably be making unit tests out of most of that stuff though :/ 16:08:54 drdo` [~drdo@91.205.108.93.rev.vodafone.pt] has joined #lisp 16:09:04 <|3b|> yeah, usually doesn't actually get commented until i want to recompile the whole file and it starts breaking things :p 16:09:20 didi: unlike other languages, it's easy to evaluate code in place, so yeah 16:09:42 |3b|: heh 16:10:09 btw... anyone interested in taking over writing Lisp outside the box? apparently there's a possibility 16:11:05 -!- drdo [~drdo@91.205.108.93.rev.vodafone.pt] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 16:11:11 ocharles [u411@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-loinxrnbubjwdehh] has joined #lisp 16:11:29 p_l|backup: Is that Nick Levine's "emu" book? 16:11:32 yes 16:11:57 supposedly ORA is still open to publishing a CL book 16:12:01 altsrid [~altsrid@remote.activestate.com] has joined #lisp 16:13:01 -!- venk [~user@r49-2-6-166.cpe.vividwireless.net.au] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 16:13:47 -!- didi [~user@unaffiliated/didi/x-1022147] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 16:13:52 didi [~user@unaffiliated/didi/x-1022147] has joined #lisp 16:14:15 -!- francogrex [franco@grex.cyberspace.org] has quit [Quit: ERC Version 5.2 (IRC client for Emacs)] 16:16:33 pchrist [~spirit@gentoo/developer/pchrist] has joined #lisp 16:16:58 -!- Modius [~Modius@cpe-70-123-140-183.austin.res.rr.com] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 16:17:24
p_l|backup: really? Got any info on the ORA CL book? (I thought Lisp was a dead language ;) 16:20:31 we're all zombies. 16:20:39 ramkrsna [~ramkrsna@unaffiliated/ramkrsna] has joined #lisp 16:21:07
Fade: so am I, but maybe after some coffee... ;) 16:21:39 dl: nick levine was working on it, had to stop 16:22:23 wbooze [~levgue@xdsl-78-35-132-41.netcologne.de] has joined #lisp 16:22:29 homie [~levgue@xdsl-78-35-132-41.netcologne.de] has joined #lisp 16:23:22 kpreid [~kpreid@128.153.181.1] has joined #lisp 16:23:38 -!- Joreji [~thomas@83-013.eduroam.RWTH-Aachen.DE] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 16:24:02 What is the best reason to stick with Common Lisp rather than, say Clojure? 16:24:48 I mean like the #1 killer feature 16:25:23 samebchase: no jvm 16:25:26 with CL you aren't locked into a run-time produced by a fickle company. you have options. 16:25:36 galdor: yeah! 16:25:37 samebchase: why not use both? 16:25:50 Xach: you use both? 16:26:09 samebchase: Nope. But I don't think it's a situation where you have to pick a winner. 16:26:17
Xach: I heard about Nick's book. I guess I mis-read p_l|backup's message to be saying there was *still* a book /in the works/ 16:26:30 samebchase: I use Common Lisp because I know it well and can solve my problems quickly with it. 16:26:40 if you need the jvm, you can still use abcl 16:26:47 samebchase: You aren't required to have a single tool in your toolbox, though. 16:26:54
Xach: Do you have any pointers to good presentations (either youtube or just slides) on Quicklisp? 16:26:57 dl: I think that's the same book. 16:27:08 samebchase: recent steps taken by Oracle in their lawsuit against Google are... dangerous towards anything using Java 16:27:20 dl: I don't have any good presentations on Quicklisp, sorry. I do have an older screencast on youtube, I'll get the link. 16:27:25
I'm tring to put together a quick talk for ABQ Lisp/Scheme on using Quicklisp 16:27:37 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=11wYPAy9qNw is part 1 16:27:39 dl: it's more that ORA is willing to publish one despite Nick's troubles 16:27:42 p_l|backup: I'm scared of anything to do with java 16:27:46
I'm going to be doing a little evangelism for you :) 16:28:02 http://www.quicklisp.org/beta/screencast.gif is also a screencast I made 16:28:38
Xach: THANK YOU(!!!) so much for the links! 16:28:43 no problem 16:29:03 dl: i put up slides of my boston lisp meeting lightning talk, though since it's a lightning talk the slides aren't all that standalone 16:29:23
Any thoughts on integrating ASDF-install into QL? I'm thinking as a fallback plan when a package is not in the distribution. 16:29:31 dl: https://github.com/quicklisp/boston-lisp-meeting 16:29:40 dl: asdf-install is available in QL already. 16:29:48 dl: I do not anticipate doing any automatic fallback, though. 16:30:00
oh, ok. 16:30:06 *dl* needs to RTFM :) 16:30:16 galdor: I don't want to have to use the jvm ;-) 16:31:02 HG` [~HG@p5DC051A6.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #lisp 16:31:13 I see that lnostdal recently switched symbolic-web to clojure. 16:31:18
Xach: I'm impressed with how QL integrates into the "real world" by using ASDF under-the-hood 16:31:24 samebchase: so, have a reason against current clojure mainline. There's also a CLR variant 16:31:54 dl: thanks. those boston lisp meeting slides are better than i remember, for what it's worth... 16:32:09 *Xach* must prepare his talk for the European CL Meeting in October, too 16:32:35
... That way, I add my source dirs to asdf:*central-registry*, the quickload them (and I get the benefit of any packages I depend on that I've not yet installed get installed for me!) 16:33:24
Xach: Thanks so much for all the pointers! We're short a talk this month and I've been meaning to tell folks about QL (because its teh awesome!) 16:33:44
Xach: What are you talking about at the Euro CL meeting? 16:33:53 Quicklisp 16:33:54 jikanter [~Adium@66.146.192.56] has joined #lisp 16:34:02
sweet! :) 16:34:27 *dl* is so glad someone finally made such a project :) 16:34:29 Has anyone there at this point NOT heard of Quicklisp? 16:34:55 We'll see! 16:35:00 -!- lnostdal_ [~lnostdal@ti0030a380-dhcp0111.bb.online.no] has quit [Quit: bbl.] 16:35:03 -!- dlowe [~dlowe@c-66-30-116-162.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: *poof*] 16:35:16
dlowe: you'd be surprised! 16:36:10
We've got some older Lispers in the ABQ group (one guy did a lot of Lisp 2 and a couple of other custom Lisp dialects back in the 70's & 80's) 16:36:49
... and some newer ones too (that we /will/ convince to put down the PERL *forever* ;) ... 16:43:26 dmiles_afk [~dmiles@dsl-72-19-48-155.cascadeaccess.com] has joined #lisp 16:44:04 -!- Bike [~Glossina@69.166.35.238] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 16:44:18 Bike [~Glossina@69.166.35.238] has joined #lisp 16:45:37 mcstar [~mcstar@adsl-89-135-195-78.monradsl.monornet.hu] has joined #lisp 16:47:03 -!- kiuma [~kiuma@85-18-55-37.ip.fastwebnet.it] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 16:47:34 Joreji [~thomas@vpn-ei1.unidsl.de] has joined #lisp 16:47:49 -!- oudeis [~oudeis@93-172-91-141.bb.netvision.net.il] has quit [Quit: This computer has gone to sleep] 16:47:54 rins [~rins@c-76-24-27-138.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 16:48:59 dbushenko [~dim@93.125.19.189] has joined #lisp 16:49:49 -!- alvis [~alvis@tx-71-2-122-27.dhcp.embarqhsd.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 16:49:56 dl: what impresses me isn't that someone made quicklisp; there have been many aborted attempts before with varying degrees of success. The impressive thing is how quickly it has caught on, which is probably at least partly because of how well it works (thanks Xach) 16:51:56 ISF [~ivan@201.82.134.98] has joined #lisp 16:52:29 -!- mvilleneuve [~mvilleneu@LLagny-156-36-4-214.w80-14.abo.wanadoo.fr] has quit [Quit: Lost terminal] 16:53:34
jasom: here here! 16:57:35 -!- Amyn1 [~abennama@62.23.212.45] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 16:57:50 -!- dbushenko [~dim@93.125.19.189] has left #lisp 16:58:23 dbushenko [~dim@93.125.19.189] has joined #lisp 16:59:41 it's good to know that function still sometimes trumps politics. 16:59:46 HG`` [~HG@p5DC051CB.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #lisp 16:59:51 jasom: it's because it's the first one that reached the level of "it just works" 17:01:04 I've said it before, but if it wasn't for QL, I wouldn't have really started _using_ Lisp. I've known Lisp for, well, at least 15 years, probably more, but it wasn't until QL that I actually started doing any real development using it. 17:01:21 A good deal of that is because he puts a lot of effort in testing, debugging, updating, to make sure everything works, on each release. To my knowledge, none of the other approaches ever did that. 17:01:36 LiamH: nope .. big fail of asdf-install 17:02:04 I.e. it "just" works because Xach does a _lot_ of work, on an ongoing basis 17:02:17 -!- HG` [~HG@p5DC051A6.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 17:02:36 -!- Kenjin [~josesanto@193.136.206.28] has quit [Quit: Computer has gone to sleep] 17:02:38 *didi* hugs Xach 17:02:42 alvis [~alvis@tx-71-2-122-27.dhcp.embarqhsd.net] has joined #lisp 17:02:47 -!- SpringheeledJake [~Spring-he@75-138-73-64.dhcp.gwnt.ga.charter.com] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 17:02:50 it's true, Xach puts in a lot of effort - effort that we (at least I) who tried to solve this problem before thought would be unnecessary given the right technical solution (: 17:03:01 -!- c_arenz [~arenz@nat/ibm/x-kdwejgvltufwemsc] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 17:03:05 LiamH: yeah, I know that. A package manager always needs work to keep everything running smoothly. It doesn't matter if the packages are Lisp, Perl, TeX, DEB or RPM. 17:04:44 p_l|backup: Does ORA want to have someone complete L-o-t-b, or does it want someone to write a new book, or will it take either? 17:04:54 loke: indeed; the technology is fine, but it is secondary 17:06:27 Thanks, y'all! 17:06:32 -!- ZabaQ [~john.conn@135.114-84-212.staticip.namesco.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 17:06:39 Xach: Thank you 17:06:54 oudeis [~oudeis@bzq-84-111-74-75.red.bezeqint.net] has joined #lisp 17:06:57 It's not *that* much effort for the ongoing releases. Mostly a matter of running a few commands once a day, and maybe following up with bug reports. Things aren't too hairy yet. They will probably get hairier. 17:07:02 hear hear 17:07:04 And I need to write more programs. 17:07:34 *Xach* just added com.google.base, google's version of My Favorite Little Utility Library 17:07:49 *Xach* eyes reb 17:07:52 what is it? 17:07:52 -!- esden [~esden@repl.esden.net] has quit [Excess Flood] 17:08:11 https://github.com/brown/base/blob/master/package.lisp 17:08:17 ZabaQ [~john.conn@135.114-84-212.staticip.namesco.net] has joined #lisp 17:08:53 Xach: do you know if anyone has made a Google gdata API for Lisp? 17:09:12 Wait... Google writes Lisp? 17:09:13 loke: I do not know of one. I would love it if someone made one, and it was really nice. 17:09:17 LiamH: googlers write lisp 17:09:26 especially those ITA googlers! 17:09:29 esden [~esden@repl.esden.net] has joined #lisp 17:09:32 ";;;; Copyright 2011 Google Inc. All Rights Reserved" 17:09:33 Mmm 17:09:59 I thought it was python and java until the end of time. 17:12:16 Xach: I might write something for gdata, but it would be awesomer if Google did it 17:12:34 serichsen: no idea 17:12:43 It's always awesomer when someone else writes the code you need, if they do a great job... 17:12:47 loke: And C 17:12:53 s/loke/LiamH/ 17:12:55 peterhil` [~peterhil@YGMDCCCXXIV.gprs.sl-laajakaista.fi] has joined #lisp 17:12:55 hum. github just threw a "502 Bad Gateway" nginx/1.0.4 error on me. 17:13:33 naryl: ++. 17:13:50 also, objective C and whatever platform-specific stuff they need to make things work on mobile devices 17:13:51 SegFaultAX [~mkbernard@173.228.45.162] has joined #lisp 17:14:12 github is definitely down. 17:15:40 it was not me 17:15:49 -!- realitygrill [~realitygr@thewall.novi.lib.mi.us] has quit [Quit: realitygrill] 17:15:59 markskil1eck [~mark@host217-43-219-207.range217-43.btcentralplus.com] has joined #lisp 17:16:01 not even their landing page is returning at this point. 17:16:25 WFM 17:16:57 it's back 17:18:00 -!- markskilbeck [~mark@unaffiliated/markskilbeck] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 17:18:56 dlowe [dlowe@nat/google/x-kikcrpbisbjqdiqy] has joined #lisp 17:19:21 Bike1 [~Glossina@69.166.35.238] has joined #lisp 17:20:28 -!- Bike1 [~Glossina@69.166.35.238] has quit [Client Quit] 17:20:41 Bike1 [~Glossina@69.166.35.238] has joined #lisp 17:22:16 -!- Bike [~Glossina@69.166.35.238] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 17:22:37 Qworkescence [~quad@unaffiliated/quadrescence] has joined #lisp 17:26:39 -!- Bike1 [~Glossina@69.166.35.238] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 17:27:27 -!- gko [~gko@220-135-201-90.HINET-IP.hinet.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 17:29:21 rdd [~user@c83-250-153-128.bredband.comhem.se] has joined #lisp 17:33:16 Bike [~Glossina@69.166.35.235] has joined #lisp 17:35:06 lnostdal_ [~lnostdal@ti0030a380-dhcp2618.bb.online.no] has joined #lisp 17:36:15 -!- sprayzor [~user@213.37.73.151.dyn.user.ono.com] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 17:40:40 -!- ramusara [~ramusara@220.156.210.236.user.e-catv.ne.jp] has quit [Quit: Leaving...] 17:42:03 Davidbrcz [~david@proxysup.isae.fr] has joined #lisp 17:43:25 zomgbie [~jesus@h081217131002.dyn.cm.kabsi.at] has joined #lisp 17:43:48 -!- swilde [~wilde@aktaia.intevation.org] has quit [Quit: ERC Version 5.3 (IRC client for Emacs)] 17:44:20 orivej [~orivej@host-110-146-66-217.spbmts.ru] has joined #lisp 17:46:09 elfrosch [~Brnt@p578b57e4.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #lisp 17:46:52 fgump [~fgump__@openvpn-124-140.inf.ed.ac.uk] has joined #lisp 17:47:12 wccoder [~wccoder@S01060026f3c6bad7.no.shawcable.net] has joined #lisp 17:48:07 gigamonkey [~user@adsl-99-24-216-201.dsl.pltn13.sbcglobal.net] has joined #lisp 17:48:55 -!- zomgbie [~jesus@h081217131002.dyn.cm.kabsi.at] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 17:49:11 -!- araujo [~araujo@gentoo/developer/araujo] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 17:50:45 mrSpec [~Spec@unaffiliated/mrspec] has joined #lisp 17:51:01 -!- peterhil` [~peterhil@YGMDCCCXXIV.gprs.sl-laajakaista.fi] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 17:54:49 -!- Athas [~athas@shop3.diku.dk] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 17:57:40 -!- elfrosch [~Brnt@p578b57e4.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 17:58:25 -!- mcsontos [~mcsontos@hotspot8.rywasoft.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 17:59:28 peterhil` [~peterhil@GZYCMLXXII.gprs.sl-laajakaista.fi] has joined #lisp 18:00:28 -!- nha [~prefect@imamac13.epfl.ch] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 18:01:21 -!- eyes_ is now known as EyesIsServer 18:06:04 -!- Bike [~Glossina@69.166.35.235] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 18:06:26 -!- dwim [~dwim@210.Red-79-146-127.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net] has quit [Quit: dwim] 18:10:40 -!- Daev [~KAPITAL@nom27150d.nomadic.ncsu.edu] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 18:12:57 -!- rdd [~user@c83-250-153-128.bredband.comhem.se] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 18:15:12 Fade, yes, SBCL's GC and some parts of the run-time made me nervous .. :( Clojure isn't "perfect" or anything either, but, yeah.. i/we signed a 5 year contract on a project today; it'll be built on Clojure (and perhaps some Scala) and PostgreSQL 18:15:15 -!- fgump [~fgump__@openvpn-124-140.inf.ed.ac.uk] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 18:15:25 Daev [~KAPITAL@nom27150d.nomadic.ncsu.edu] has joined #lisp 18:15:43 *Xach* played "taps" when removing symbolicweb from quicklisp 18:16:14 I was sorry to see the change, as I still prefer common lisp, but a commercial venture like that is certainly reason to refocus. 18:16:39 sbcl's GC? 18:16:49 although I think I would have argued for more discussion and perhaps work on the elements that made you nervous. 18:17:02 -!- sellout [~Adium@c-98-245-162-253.hsd1.co.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 18:17:35 lnostdal: could have used abcl if you liked common lisp better 18:18:03 -!- littlebobby [~bob@unaffiliated/littlebobby] has quit [Quit: Ex-Chat] 18:20:32 the gc of sbcl could be enhanced with another crowd funding operation 18:20:43 It's a bit stronger than that you can just take a delete-package after you out and end up with a clean slate 18:20:44 there is some amazing stuff in this area in GHC for example 18:20:54 yeah, i saw the funding after i switched .. that'd be great 18:21:22 ..i don't know GC internals, but it seems like a huuge project 18:21:45 -!- Tristam [~Tristam@cpe-72-226-124-205.nycap.res.rr.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 18:22:34 lnostdal, keep you cool. In 6 months you will have the keys to the castle 18:23:30 -!- sanjoyd [~sanjoyd@unaffiliated/sanjoyd] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 18:24:51 If you are into garbage collection be sure not to miss Richard Jones and Rafael Lins "Garbage collection". 18:25:54 ehu [~ehuels@ip118-64-212-87.adsl2.static.versatel.nl] has joined #lisp 18:25:55 realitygrill [~realitygr@adsl-76-234-130-139.dsl.sfldmi.sbcglobal.net] has joined #lisp 18:25:56 yeah, that's the one with the new edition recently? 18:25:58 Jones has an updated GC book out now (or out shortly). 18:26:04 yeahyeah 18:26:11 Kenjin [~josesanto@bl21-70-53.dsl.telepac.pt] has joined #lisp 18:26:46 i wonder if LarKC's GC system (which is java) is better than Allegro common lisp 18:27:29 would ACL's GC be as much troubles as sbcl's? 18:28:16 dmiles_afk, or lispworks.. MP doesn't help 18:28:35 don't know, dmiles_afk .. i need tools to figure out what's "holding on to" objects; "why isn't this freed?" .. the JVM has that, and i think a precise GC is a prerequisite for it (but not sure about that) 18:29:00 lnostdal, it is 18:29:26 does abcl use the JVM's GC? 18:30:25 i would think so .. it'd be kind of weird if it didn't? 18:30:27 df: yes.. but there is not a real contract between the program and ABCL on GC 18:30:44 lnostdal, There are models that don't have it and they too a describes like the precise garage collector. In a nutshell if you don't move memory you don't need such a precise record 18:31:05 df: if you define 'foo and #'foo.. in lisp how do you ever free it? 18:31:23 -!- dbushenko [~dim@93.125.19.189] has quit [Quit: Ex-Chat] 18:32:39 well #'foo might be based on AllowClassUnloading 18:33:02 dmiles_afk: free what? the symbol-value and symbol-function of foo? 18:33:12 hello, is there a utility for program flow like the "for" utility by which one can iterate symbolically ? 18:33:27 df: yes.. 'foo in ABCL though should i guess collect on unintern 18:33:32 wbooze: clhs loop 18:33:39 wbooze, loop? 18:33:59 for i:1 thru n i wanted express in maxima actually..... 18:34:07 is this about limitations of the JVM? I don't really know much about it 18:34:29 the symbol-function might be harder and depends on the JVM 18:34:30 how would i achieve that the n does not have to be a number ? 18:34:39 wbooze, http://www.gigamonkeys.com/book/loop-for-black-belts.html 18:35:01 hmmm, ok thank you 18:35:04 i'll have a look 18:35:05 wbooze: you can easily iterate with tagbody 18:35:27 do, dolist, dotimes, loop, tagbody 18:35:41 yvdriess [~Beef@83.101.33.139] has joined #lisp 18:35:42 df: yes.. the JVM limitations i gues class unloading has seemed to often be unreliable 18:35:42 i only saw for if while and do in maxima.... 18:35:51 don't know if they have loop too 18:36:06 maxma uses common lisp, so it must have loop 18:36:06 If it's a complete common-lisp, it has loop 18:36:16 maxima is not CL 18:36:17 mcstar, then again you can use assembly and jump. tagbody and go is best used for designing loop constructs 18:36:27 but then wouldn't clojure have similar problems? 18:36:29 Younder: i meant it as a half-joke 18:36:36 mcstar: only half? 18:36:40 the JVM at least provides a bertter troublestooting more than other things 18:36:44 only half 18:36:45 clojure is a different lisp-like languages 18:36:55 abcl is common-lisp, I think 18:36:57 oGMo: you can access all of CL from maxima 18:36:59 df: ah i was thinking yes.. clojure even less control! 18:36:59 as far as i know 18:37:26 theres different naming conventions for maxima/cl variables, thats all 18:37:27 mcstar: true but i'm not sure the integration between the two and he and/or she seems to be confused 18:37:32 Armed Bear Common Lisp 18:37:40 marsell [~marsell@120.20.92.19] has joined #lisp 18:38:03 df: less control i mean less .. programmtic gc contracts .. its all "let the JVM figure it out" 18:38:28 wbooze: you better ask on a maxima channel though, strict maxima is not lisp 18:38:29 I would think you can use FMAKUNBOUND, MAKUNBOUND, UNINTERN 18:38:40 -!- orivej [~orivej@host-110-146-66-217.spbmts.ru] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 18:38:44 ok thank you all 18:39:03 yeah, I think I get what you mean 18:39:24 I should read up on how abcl/clojure are actually implemented 18:39:27 yeah i think we need actual tests in LarKC and ABCL to be sure we already doing the right things for FMAKUNBOUND, MAKUNBOUND, UNINTERN, DELTE-PACKAGE etc 18:39:29 dmiles_afk: indeed; symbols get collected after unintern or delete-package 18:40:39 ehu: might want to test after a symbols function is undefined if the documetnation for that symbol goes away and everything 18:40:50 -!- yvdriess [~Beef@83.101.33.139] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 18:41:23 ehu: nopt saying it needs work but going to probly need a regression test every once in a while to make sure it stays in good shape 18:41:45 -!- Davidbrcz [~david@proxysup.isae.fr] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 18:41:50 it should: the documentation is held in a weak hash table 18:41:53 i know that one documation thing you turned to a weeakhashmap :) 18:42:06 hehe. right. 18:42:40 the fasl autoloader for examlpe migfht hold things in ram 18:43:24 true. but blake did extensive testing deleting packages and reloading fasls. 18:44:02 we release the specials, the function classes, symbols, etc. 18:44:11 but try me :-) 18:44:33 write a function with docs and reload the package say 1M times. 18:44:48 fasl containing a package 18:44:58 ehu: weak hash table = cache? 18:45:15 Younder: not for the documentation. 18:45:39 Younder: for the documentation it's the only value. 18:45:51 however, the documentation will be released as soon as the function object is released 18:45:59 because the function object is used as the key. 18:47:17 it was tested stored in the function objecvt itself and otherwise.. it turned out sparese enought to be best stored external 18:47:27 sparse^ 18:47:47 ehu: Yeah right you could not very well use the name right. So you use it addr 18:48:05 (best stored external = in that map) 18:49:26 Younder: lambdas can have documentation. can't refer to those by name :-) 18:49:27 ehu: yeah.. sometime be fun to come up with serveral more tests 18:50:24 ehu: your test there yes is a good idea.. and making ABCL compile some randomly generated files 18:50:44 ehu: Yes I got that 18:54:06 rdd [~rdd@c83-250-153-128.bredband.comhem.se] has joined #lisp 18:55:18 frhodes [~frhodes@168-103-96-233.albq.qwest.net] has joined #lisp 18:58:40 dstatyvka [ejabberd@pepelaz.jabber.od.ua] has joined #lisp 18:59:05 -!- seangrove [~user@c-71-202-126-17.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 18:59:35 Davidbrcz [~david@proxysup.isae.fr] has joined #lisp 18:59:50 bingo! I wondered why there wasn't a trivial-run-program library.. 19:00:09 its the run-shell-command in ASDF! 19:00:25 there is a trivial-something-or-other for that, though. 19:01:20 -!- Jasko [~tjasko@c-174-59-204-245.hsd1.pa.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 19:01:53 trivial-shell 19:04:56 naryl, That is meant to be run from the command line, not emacs 19:07:05 say you use vim for editing and break out into a shell 19:07:14 -!- ramkrsna [~ramkrsna@unaffiliated/ramkrsna] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 19:08:11 -!- gigamonkey [~user@adsl-99-24-216-201.dsl.pltn13.sbcglobal.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 19:09:37 Amyn [~abennama@cac94-2-87-91-21-215.dsl.sta.abo.bbox.fr] has joined #lisp 19:10:13 -!- realitygrill [~realitygr@adsl-76-234-130-139.dsl.sfldmi.sbcglobal.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 19:14:02 -!- Natch [~natch@178.73.216.99] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 19:16:07 Jasko [~tjasko@c-174-59-204-245.hsd1.pa.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 19:21:05 -!- benny [~benny@i577A7C66.versanet.de] has quit [Quit: rcirc on GNU Emacs 23.3.1] 19:22:51 pjb: have you been able to load pseudoscheme in a recent sbcl? 19:24:09 oconnore [~Eric@c-66-31-125-56.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 19:25:44 benny [~benny@i577A38AE.versanet.de] has joined #lisp 19:27:19 Let me try. 19:27:29 -!- ISF [~ivan@201.82.134.98] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 19:28:20 Oops, indeed, there's a package lock on CL:REALP :-? 19:28:51 Athas [~athas@130.225.165.40] has joined #lisp 19:29:06 That's strange. 19:30:10 I ran into trouble much earlier than that, but I'm not sure where to find the best or most recent version of pseudoscheme. Where do you get it? 19:30:17 -!- Daev [~KAPITAL@nom27150d.nomadic.ncsu.edu] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 19:30:45 I got it a few years ago, always use that same old version :-) 19:30:59 From CMU AI Lab repo, IIRC. 19:30:59 -!- Joreji [~thomas@vpn-ei1.unidsl.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 19:31:40 algal [~anonymous@78-86-30-77.zone2.bethere.co.uk] has joined #lisp 19:32:31 pjb, well pretty printing is still in it's original version. Optimization for single values etc never happened 19:32:57 Of course, nobody touched it for years, still version 2.11 IIRC. 19:33:05 and ALL Lisp's use it 19:33:05 pjb: 2.13 is the latest 19:33:32 Perhaps I should upgrade... 19:33:54 pjb: please take it over and make it asdf-loadable. 19:34:20 I could do that, but don't expect it before Christmas. 19:34:39 is anybody else surprised that there has never been a scheme implementation called "Ponzi"? 19:34:43 -!- pcavs [~Adium@63.139.127.6] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 19:34:45 pcavs1 [~Adium@63.139.127.6] has joined #lisp 19:35:07 -!- pcavs1 is now known as pcavs 19:35:08 Fade: you're right. that is an omission. 19:35:11 There's already Racket, Ponzi will come soon. 19:35:21 Fade: there was one! 19:35:28 oh-ho! 19:35:41 It collapsed. 19:35:47 *Fade* laughs 19:35:54 badoomp-boomp. 19:35:55 What the H*** are you talking about? 19:36:03 I set it up, but Xach knocked it down. ;) 19:36:09 Younder: google for "Ponzi scheme". 19:36:22 sanjoyd [~sanjoyd@unaffiliated/sanjoyd] has joined #lisp 19:36:22 araujo [~araujo@gentoo/developer/araujo] has joined #lisp 19:36:55 pjb, rotfl 19:38:43 quick question: is there any (quicklisp-installable) package that will print cons cell structures to the terminal, as cons diagrams? or as trees? (I'm ideally hoping for something analogous to http://reference.wolfram.com/mathematica/ref/TreeForm.html ) 19:39:06 yes 19:39:19 COM.INFORMATIMAGO.COMMON-LISP.PICTURE.CONS-TO-ASCII:PRINT-CONSES and COM.INFORMATIMAGO.COMMON-LISP.PICTURE.CONS-TO-ASCII:DRAW-LIST 19:39:29 (ql:quickload :COM.INFORMATIMAGO.COMMON-LISP.PICTURE) 19:39:38 great. 19:39:49 -!- naeg [~naeg@194.208.239.170] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 19:40:03 all caps. old school. 19:40:13 pjb, you spoil all the fun 19:40:16 result of (apropos "print-conses") etc. 19:40:34 You don't think I type those package names all the time, do you? 19:41:34 pjb: You do. 19:41:35 algal, pjb is a bit old school. except he isn't 19:41:38 pjb: On IRC! 19:41:38 algal: sdraw.lisp 19:42:14 wow. COM.INFORMATIMAGO.COMMON-LISP.PICTURE pulls in 38 dependencies. it's like entering an alternate universes. 19:43:15 very cool. 19:43:31 pjb is perhaps the most brilliant coder we have here after edi 19:43:33 The dark side of Quicklisp's ease of use! 19:43:48 Younder: You're forgetting Xach, he's way ahead. 19:44:06 no we have issues 19:44:21 That sounds like the royal we. 19:44:44 Ok I have issues 19:44:47 p_l|backup: is straw on quicklisp with a different name? 19:46:34 I don't think there's an sdraw in quicklisp, but I could be mistaken. 19:47:12 but, reluctantly, yes Xach also 19:47:31 -!- frhodes [~frhodes@168-103-96-233.albq.qwest.net] has quit [Quit: leaving] 19:47:38 I love quicklisp 19:48:17 -!- alanpearce [~alan@home.alanpearce.co.uk] has quit [Quit: alanpearce] 19:49:18 -!- aoh [~aki@adsl-99-115.netplaza.fi] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 19:49:51 superjudge [~superjudg@c83-250-198-227.bredband.comhem.se] has joined #lisp 19:50:00 prxq [~mommer@mnhm-590c131e.pool.mediaWays.net] has joined #lisp 19:50:50 pjb: draw-list is just what I was looking for. Thanks! 19:51:35 frhodes [~frhodes@168-103-96-233.albq.qwest.net] has joined #lisp 19:51:51 _schulte_ [~eschulte@c-174-56-1-147.hsd1.nm.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 19:52:13 <_schulte_> hey, anyone know how to access the arguments supplied to a sbcl #! shell script? 19:52:44 _schulte_: I suspect it's the same as a non-shell script. sb-ext:*posix-argv* 19:53:27 naeg [~naeg@194.208.239.170] has joined #lisp 19:53:51 dgdg 19:53:53 <_schulte_> Xach: yup, that's it, thanks 19:56:40 -!- silenius [~silenius@p4FFC99E6.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 19:59:21 -!- Davidbrcz [~david@proxysup.isae.fr] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 19:59:48 Davidbrcz [~david@proxysup.isae.fr] has joined #lisp 20:00:43 gabnet [~user@249.195.197.77.rev.sfr.net] has joined #lisp 20:02:06 -!- oudeis [~oudeis@bzq-84-111-74-75.red.bezeqint.net] has quit [Quit: This computer has gone to sleep] 20:02:21 rbuck_ [~rbuck@66-189-68-77.dhcp.oxfr.ma.charter.com] has joined #lisp 20:04:14 algal: be careful, it doesn't deal with shared structures, just duplicating them in the drawing, and not at all with circular structures. 20:04:41 Joreji [~thomas@vpn-ei1.unidsl.de] has joined #lisp 20:05:02 slyrus [~chatzilla@173-228-44-88.dsl.static.sonic.net] has joined #lisp 20:05:22 -!- gabnet [~user@249.195.197.77.rev.sfr.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 20:05:48 gabnet [~user@249.195.197.77.rev.sfr.net] has joined #lisp 20:07:26 pjb: k. 20:09:04 -!- gabnet [~user@249.195.197.77.rev.sfr.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 20:09:45 gabnet [~user@249.195.197.77.rev.sfr.net] has joined #lisp 20:09:50 ZabaQ1 [~john.conn@135.114-84-212.staticip.namesco.net] has joined #lisp 20:10:30 -!- Joreji [~thomas@vpn-ei1.unidsl.de] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 20:10:44 oudeis [~oudeis@bzq-79-183-218-10.red.bezeqint.net] has joined #lisp 20:10:44 Daev [~KAPITAL@cpe-174-099-078-185.nc.res.rr.com] has joined #lisp 20:10:59 -!- gabnet [~user@249.195.197.77.rev.sfr.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 20:11:19 gabnet [~gabnet@249.195.197.77.rev.sfr.net] has joined #lisp 20:12:11 -!- ZabaQ [~john.conn@135.114-84-212.staticip.namesco.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 20:13:08 -!- ZabaQ1 [~john.conn@135.114-84-212.staticip.namesco.net] has quit [Client Quit] 20:13:10 alanpearce [~alan@home.alanpearce.co.uk] has joined #lisp 20:15:37 Bike [~Glossina@69.166.35.235] has joined #lisp 20:16:49 -!- Athas [~athas@130.225.165.40] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 20:17:21 Joreji [~thomas@vpn-ei1.unidsl.de] has joined #lisp 20:18:42 does anyone happen to have already written a huchentoot backend for UCW? 20:20:00 bgs100 [~ian@unaffiliated/bgs100] has joined #lisp 20:23:16 nej 20:24:39 -!- rdd [~rdd@c83-250-153-128.bredband.comhem.se] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 20:25:22 fe[nl]ix: Regarding forking multithreaded programs ... 20:25:34 Natch [~natch@178.73.217.104] has joined #lisp 20:26:30 realitygrill [~realitygr@adsl-76-226-109-139.dsl.sfldmi.sbcglobal.net] has joined #lisp 20:26:56 I told milanj it's dangerous because you never know what locks the libraries in your program are holding at the time of the fork. 20:29:41 -!- _schulte_ [~eschulte@c-174-56-1-147.hsd1.nm.comcast.net] has left #lisp 20:29:44 that shouldn't be an issue if your program is lock-free. 20:29:52 You'd need a way to reset all the locks... 20:30:33 pjb: if that's safe, then you don't need locks. 20:30:49 In the child process. 20:31:00 same. 20:31:01 It should be safe there, since the threads are not duplicated. 20:31:13 -!- gabnet [~gabnet@249.195.197.77.rev.sfr.net] has quit [Quit: Quitte] 20:31:24 any critical section is still half-executed. 20:31:48 In this parallel universe, but not in the original one. 20:31:49 -!- MoALTz [~no@host-92-8-231-141.as43234.net] has quit [Quit: router] 20:32:00 And they were half executed in the original one. 20:32:30 the original one will continue executing the critical sections, and let them handle unlocking 20:32:53 your solution will expose inconsistent state (otherwise, why were there locks in the first place) in the child. 20:32:54 Yes. The questions is whether libraries needs to reset some state. 20:33:10 So, no, it's not safe to reset all the locks. 20:33:31 pjb: afterall zombies exist because parents won't acknowledge their children’s death 20:34:01 Younder: it's a hard think to ask of any parent. 20:34:06 thing 20:34:35 pjb, especially a process 20:34:53 All they have to do is wait for it :p 20:35:05 -!- rbuck_ [~rbuck@66-189-68-77.dhcp.oxfr.ma.charter.com] has quit [Quit: rbuck gone away...] 20:35:18 or die themselves 20:35:19 reb: You can never guarantee that your program is lock free because C library routines may hold locks. 20:35:36 That was for pkhuong, not me .... 20:35:53 reb: don't call these routines. 20:36:15 or, make sure not to call them around the call to fork. 20:36:43 Sure, but you don't know in advance which functions hold locks. 20:36:51 MoALTz [~no@host-92-8-224-68.as43234.net] has joined #lisp 20:37:03 Does getenv() take a lock? 20:37:20 don't call it. 20:37:45 pkhuong: You have to make sure no thread in any code running in your program calls a toxic function. 20:37:45 or, again, don't call it concurrently with the call to fork. 20:37:54 gaidal [~gaidal@113.119.25.10] has joined #lisp 20:37:58 reb: yes, you do. 20:38:36 then again, you must do that when writing signal handlers as well, and that's never stopped people from writing them in SBCL. 20:38:41 ... not impossible, just hard, especially if you don't have the source code. 20:39:28 Well, it's generally understood that signal handlers can't do much more than set a variable to indicate they have been called. 20:39:52 Sysop_fb [~bleh@108-66-160-34.lightspeed.spfdmo.sbcglobal.net] has joined #lisp 20:40:26 remember you have core specific memory and use that as mush as possible 20:40:46 -!- homie [~levgue@xdsl-78-35-132-41.netcologne.de] has quit [Quit: ERC Version 5.3 (IRC client for Emacs)] 20:40:49 -!- wbooze [~levgue@xdsl-78-35-132-41.netcologne.de] has quit [Quit: ERC Version 5.3 (IRC client for Emacs)] 20:41:23 Has anyone written code that allows local package nicknames? 20:41:23 -!- Daev is now known as MeanWeen 20:41:25 -!- jikanter [~Adium@66.146.192.56] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 20:42:37 yes rob 20:42:38 you'd need to write a new reader, I think 20:42:48 In package bob I want to refer to symbols of com.foobar.util using the "util:" prefix, while in package alice the code uses "util:" to refer to alice-util. 20:42:54 yes rob Garret 20:43:27 search for hierarchical package names. 20:43:46 pjb: that doesn't really help 20:44:08 Seach for lexical packages 20:44:10 Is a new reader necessary or is it sufficient to install "util" as a nickname at the beginning of a source file, then uninstall it at the end? 20:44:18 IIRC Franz has a portable library for them. 20:44:38 -!- naeg [~naeg@194.208.239.170] has quit [Quit: WeeChat 0.3.5] 20:44:55 named-readtables 20:45:01 -!- ehu [~ehuels@ip118-64-212-87.adsl2.static.versatel.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 20:45:06 oh, no, wait. relative package names 20:45:45 named readtables are portable, but relative package names need a custom reader, I believe 20:45:54 I don't need relative package names. 20:46:52 you could do the installation/uninstallation thing, I guess 20:47:12 that would be relative to the source file, not the package though. 20:47:19 I don't need hierarchical packages, just the ability for code to choose what nickname it uses to reference symbols in other packages. 20:47:28 http://groups.google.com/group/comp.lang.lisp/browse_thread/thread/18cc7a823112559c/e86335fb4cc6c367 20:47:37 antifuchs: yes 20:47:47 waaaaargh [~waaaaargh@agsb-5d87f4ae.pool.mediaWays.net] has joined #lisp 20:48:20 one of my favourite Garret mails that might be enlightening 20:49:26 -!- superjudge [~superjudg@c83-250-198-227.bredband.comhem.se] has quit [Quit: superjudge] 20:50:11 You said Rob, twice. 20:50:49 reb: you could use: com.informatimago.common-lisp.cesarum.package:add-nickname 20:50:58 rdd [~rdd@c83-250-153-128.bredband.comhem.se] has joined #lisp 20:51:07 but the problem is that the nickname you want to use might already be used for another package... 20:51:14 Hence the hierarchical package names. 20:53:02 -!- drdo` is now known as drdo 20:53:50 anvandare [~anvandare@78-23-215-56.access.telenet.be] has joined #lisp 20:54:16 lolsuper_ [~super_@pool-173-65-194-148.tampfl.fios.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 20:54:16 -!- lolsuper_ [~super_@pool-173-65-194-148.tampfl.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Changing host] 20:54:16 lolsuper_ [~super_@unaffiliated/lolsuper-/x-9881387] has joined #lisp 20:54:18 pjb: that's still not local package names 20:54:35 -!- MeanWeen [~KAPITAL@cpe-174-099-078-185.nc.res.rr.com] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 20:54:52 dlowe: yes. You add a hierarchical nickname, and use only the last component. 20:55:09 MeanWeen [~KAPITAL@cpe-174-099-078-185.nc.res.rr.com] has joined #lisp 20:56:32 pjb: I guess I'm willing to edit the library code I use to get rid of nicknames I don't like. 20:57:02 ... or maybe that's not necessary if nicknames are just temporarily installed, then removed. 20:57:09 (in my own code, that is) 20:58:42 I'd rather be able to have a package nickname which is only active when *package* is set to one of my own packages. 20:59:08 Well, it's rather a *readtable* problem... 20:59:20 *readtable* a-z, yeah 20:59:31 -!- Davidbrcz [~david@proxysup.isae.fr] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 21:00:03 Davidbrcz [~david@proxysup.isae.fr] has joined #lisp 21:00:54 -!- dl [~user@chpcwl01.hpc.unm.edu] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 21:00:55 -!- gaidal [~gaidal@113.119.25.10] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 21:01:11 *felideon* wonders if http://www.google.com/flights/ is powered by ITA/QPX 21:01:19 felideon: yup 21:01:23 attila_lendvai [~attila_le@catv-80-98-25-142.catv.broadband.hu] has joined #lisp 21:01:23 -!- attila_lendvai [~attila_le@catv-80-98-25-142.catv.broadband.hu] has quit [Changing host] 21:01:23 attila_lendvai [~attila_le@unaffiliated/attila-lendvai/x-3126965] has joined #lisp 21:01:23 gaidal [~gaidal@113.119.25.10] has joined #lisp 21:01:37 interesting how international is not supported yet. 21:02:00 felideon: international flights are much more difficult to compute quickly 21:02:01 -!- gaidal [~gaidal@113.119.25.10] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 21:02:18 gaidal [~gaidal@113.119.25.10] has joined #lisp 21:02:37 dlowe: that must be it! 21:03:11 -!- mindCrime_ [~chatzilla@rrcs-70-62-112-146.midsouth.biz.rr.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 21:03:16 prxq: ? 21:03:48 that must be the reason, no doubt. 21:04:09 rarely do I see such certainty when unaccompanied by sarcasm 21:04:28 but international airline taxes are an effing nightmare 21:04:44 dlowe: so it's quick enough for Kayak et al but not for Google's standards? 21:05:01 (no sarcasm, just curious) 21:05:24 felideon: it just went public hours ago. I'm sure it's going through a capacity ramp-up phase 21:05:43 -!- rdd [~rdd@c83-250-153-128.bredband.comhem.se] has quit [] 21:05:48 oh gotcha. :) 21:06:31 *dlowe* is speculating. The QPX team is downstairs. 21:08:10 dto [~dto@pool-96-252-89-130.bstnma.fios.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 21:10:03 -!- sdemarre [~serge@91.176.80.217] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 21:10:04 Xach: Can I /q you? 21:11:22 -!- prxq [~mommer@mnhm-590c131e.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 21:17:35 -!- kpreid [~kpreid@128.153.181.1] has quit [Quit: Offline] 21:17:35 -!- gaidal [~gaidal@113.119.25.10] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 21:18:00 gaidal [~gaidal@113.119.25.10] has joined #lisp 21:23:01 -!- mcstar [~mcstar@adsl-89-135-195-78.monradsl.monornet.hu] has quit [Quit: WeeChat 0.3.5] 21:24:16 -!- algal [~anonymous@78-86-30-77.zone2.bethere.co.uk] has quit [Quit: algal] 21:25:06 -!- MeanWeen [~KAPITAL@cpe-174-099-078-185.nc.res.rr.com] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 21:25:34 MeanWeen [~KAPITAL@cpe-174-099-078-185.nc.res.rr.com] has joined #lisp 21:26:45 -!- Davidbrcz [~david@proxysup.isae.fr] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 21:26:57 -!- dlowe [dlowe@nat/google/x-kikcrpbisbjqdiqy] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 21:28:40 I...I don't know 21:28:43 Try it and see 21:29:19 it looks like you're asleep. 21:29:22 kpreid [~kpreid@128.153.212.226] has joined #lisp 21:29:53 -!- frhodes [~frhodes@168-103-96-233.albq.qwest.net] has quit [Quit: leaving] 21:29:59 frhodes [~frhodes@168-103-96-233.albq.qwest.net] has joined #lisp 21:30:23 -!- frhodes [~frhodes@168-103-96-233.albq.qwest.net] has quit [Client Quit] 21:30:49 frhodes [~frhodes@168-103-96-233.albq.qwest.net] has joined #lisp 21:31:02 -!- frhodes [~frhodes@168-103-96-233.albq.qwest.net] has quit [Client Quit] 21:31:40 frhodes [~frhodes@168-103-96-233.albq.qwest.net] has joined #lisp 21:32:37 -!- oconnore [~Eric@c-66-31-125-56.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 21:33:20 -!- gaidal [~gaidal@113.119.25.10] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 21:33:23 -!- lolsuper_ [~super_@unaffiliated/lolsuper-/x-9881387] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 21:34:29 lolsuper_ 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has joined #lisp 22:10:36 -!- milanj [~milanj_@109-93-129-148.dynamic.isp.telekom.rs] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 22:10:45 fmeyer [~fmeyer@189.102.183.3] has joined #lisp 22:16:57 -!- frhodes [~frhodes@168-103-96-233.albq.qwest.net] has quit [Quit: leaving] 22:17:26 frhodes [~frhodes@168-103-96-233.albq.qwest.net] has joined #lisp 22:20:20 sellout [~Adium@c-98-245-162-253.hsd1.co.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 22:20:46 -!- sellout is now known as Guest21538 22:21:23 reb: package-local-nicknames and cl-package-aliases 22:21:28 reb: however, i haven't used either (yet) 22:21:36 -!- Guest21538 is now known as sellout- 22:22:33 -!- Joreji [~thomas@vpn-ei1.unidsl.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 22:23:41 -!- fiveop [~fiveop@dslb-094-218-044-172.pools.arcor-ip.net] has quit [Quit: humhum] 22:25:19 -!- killerboy [~mateusz@users69.kollegienet.dk] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 22:31:34 -!- attila_lendvai [~attila_le@unaffiliated/attila-lendvai/x-3126965] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 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[~chatzilla@static-50-52-147-222.drhm.nc.frontiernet.net] has joined #lisp 23:15:17 Bike [~Glossina@69.166.35.237] has joined #lisp 23:16:25 anvandare [~anvandare@78-23-213-11.access.telenet.be] has joined #lisp 23:24:32 Mococa [~Mococa@189.115.252.217.dynamic.adsl.gvt.net.br] has joined #lisp 23:24:50 topeak [~topeak@118.186.129.184] has joined #lisp 23:25:47 realitygrill_ [~realitygr@76.226.237.156] has joined #lisp 23:27:07 -!- realitygrill [~realitygr@adsl-76-226-109-139.dsl.sfldmi.sbcglobal.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 23:27:08 -!- realitygrill_ is now known as realitygrill 23:28:37 jleija [~jleija@50.8.10.126] has joined #lisp 23:31:45 dto [~dto@pool-96-252-89-130.bstnma.fios.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 23:32:10 Hi, I'm stumped by this "deleting unreachable code", there are a bunch of functions in my file that raise this warning: http://paste.lisp.org/display/124650 23:32:23 can anyone offer a hint as to what might be wrong? 23:32:26 i'll link to the file 23:32:57 https://github.com/dto/blocky/blob/master/quadtree.lisp 23:34:28 why does it think bounding-box is unreachable? (if indeed i am reading the error right) 23:34:43 -!- jleija [~jleija@50.8.10.126] has quit [Quit: leaving] 23:34:49 jleija [~jleija@50.8.10.126] has joined #lisp 23:36:11 dto: valid-bounding-box always returns nil 23:36:21 ahhhhhhhhhhhh 23:36:22 it's not a predicate, yet you use it as such 23:36:33 hee hee 23:36:34 that's a dumb cut and paste mistake. 23:36:57 i was going to leave the two assertions as is, then i realized what i wanted to do was make it a predicate and assert that in several places 23:37:01 but i forgot to make it a predicate. 23:37:14 (describe 'valid-bounding-box) helps 23:37:23 showing the derived type 23:37:30 (FUNCTION (T) (VALUES NULL &OPTIONAL)) 23:37:36 ahhh 23:37:38 cool. 23:38:09 yeah i'm implementing quadtrees for my collision detection. 23:38:30 sort of similar to the display trees used by the engine itself. 23:40:31 -!- LiamH [~none@pdp8.nrl.navy.mil] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 23:41:03 -!- Qworkescence [~quad@unaffiliated/quadrescence] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 23:41:50 gcentaur1 [~gcentauri@76-85-193-191.cable.inebraska.com] has joined #lisp 23:45:01 -!- gcentauri [~gcentauri@76-85-193-191.cable.inebraska.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 23:45:20 -!- dto [~dto@pool-96-252-89-130.bstnma.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 23:49:49 juniorroy [~juniorroy@212.36.228.103] has joined #lisp 23:51:13 -!- jcazevedo [~jcazevedo@bl6-10-84.dsl.telepac.pt] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 23:54:07 -!- altsrid [~altsrid@remote.activestate.com] has quit [Quit: Computer has gone to sleep.] 23:57:35 Vivitron [~user@pool-108-7-56-243.bstnma.fios.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 23:59:24 Quadrescence [~quadbook@unaffiliated/quadrescence] has joined #lisp 23:59:57 -!- redline6561 is now known as bsbutler_ack