00:01:57 ikki [~ikki@189.247.6.122] has joined #lisp 00:05:54 Is (nreverse nil) legal? 00:07:45 Sounds legal. 00:09:08 it would return nil 00:09:41 For nreverse, sequence might be destroyed and re-used to produce the result.  also sprach HyperSpec. 00:09:57 -!- Yuuhi [benni@p5483D9A9.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Quit: ERC Version 5.3 (IRC client for Emacs)] 00:10:27 Yeah, that's what I'm wondering about, since you can't modify nil. 00:10:39 -!- Daev [~KAPITAL@cpe-174-097-129-008.nc.res.rr.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 00:10:44 does anyone know how much traffic the Common Lisp Cookbook gets? has it been useful for people? :o 00:10:51 Bike: That's why it says might, probably. 00:10:52 and also, how do you contribute to it? heh 00:10:59 homie` [~levgue@xdsl-78-35-133-65.netcologne.de] has joined #lisp 00:11:29 wbooze` [~levgue@xdsl-78-35-133-65.netcologne.de] has joined #lisp 00:11:38 optikalmouse: I often google out useful answers to my CL queries from the Cookbook. 00:11:53 optikalmouse: Hope to be able to contribute at some undefined point in the future. 00:13:04 -!- homie [~levgue@xdsl-78-35-142-162.netcologne.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 00:13:13 -!- wbooze [~levgue@xdsl-78-35-142-162.netcologne.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 00:16:31 Bike: nil means non-existing sequence in this case, so it's an edge case that is an instant return from subroutine 00:16:59 Okay. Just being kind of paranoid about implementation leeway, I guess. 00:21:17 Astrology [~chris@122.237.0.53] has joined #lisp 00:24:09 -!- fmeyer [~fmeyer@187.38.98.102] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 00:26:25 leo2007 [~leo@58.22.113.134] has joined #lisp 00:27:02 xyxu [~xyxu@58.41.14.46] has joined #lisp 00:28:55 zomgbie [~jesus@85-127-217-153.dynamic.xdsl-line.inode.at] has joined #lisp 00:30:43 octavo [~octavo@186.22.74.95] has joined #lisp 00:31:55 anyone awake who use lispworks? :) 00:33:51 billstcalir [~billstcla@p-69-195-50-14.dsl1.rtr.chat.fpma.frpt.net] has joined #lisp 00:36:28 -!- Vivitron [~user@pool-108-7-56-243.bstnma.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Quit: ERC Version 5.3 (IRC client for Emacs)] 00:36:59 Vivitron [~user@pool-108-7-56-243.bstnma.fios.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 00:37:03 -!- billstclair [~billstcla@unaffiliated/billstclair] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 00:39:17 Sa[i]nT [~sabayonus@65.34.48.187] has joined #lisp 00:39:37 pnq [~nick@ACA2AC74.ipt.aol.com] has joined #lisp 00:43:56 jfleming [~jfleming@eth59-167-133-99.static.internode.on.net] has joined #lisp 00:51:04 -!- TeMPOraL [~user@cpc12-oxfd18-2-0-cust64.4-3.cable.virginmedia.com] has quit [Quit: goodnight everyone] 00:58:52 seems no 00:59:01 ´t 00:59:07 -!- gffa [~gffa@unaffiliated/gffa] has quit [Quit: sleep] 00:59:55 -!- urandom__ [~user@p548A5FA8.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 01:00:32 Hexstream [~hexstream@modemcable075.97-200-24.mc.videotron.ca] has joined #lisp 01:01:04 Uh? "non-existing" sequence? NIL would be an empty list, that seems like a sequence that exists to me... 01:01:14 fmeyer [~fmeyer@187.38.98.102] has joined #lisp 01:03:28 -!- Sa[i]nT [~sabayonus@65.34.48.187] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 01:04:14 _8david: digging around in that comms dump you suggested I make; even wireshark can tell that the packets are malformed 01:05:09 -!- sellout [~Adium@c-98-245-161-7.hsd1.co.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 01:07:22 octavo: hi 01:09:36 Axioplase [~Axioplase@fortigate.kb.ecei.tohoku.ac.jp] has joined #lisp 01:11:08 cfy [~cfy@125.123.18.108] has joined #lisp 01:11:09 -!- cfy [~cfy@125.123.18.108] has quit [Changing host] 01:11:09 cfy [~cfy@unaffiliated/chenfengyuan] has joined #lisp 01:11:35 -!- pavelludiq [~pavelludi@87.246.58.193] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 01:11:44 Hexstream: it's synonymous in this case 01:11:59 I disagree. 01:12:11 #() is a sequence that "doesn't exist" too?... 01:14:39 I'd rather say that nil is considered an empty list, but unlike #() it's just nil. But I suspect your interpretation might be correct 01:14:44 neoesque [~neoesque@210.59.147.232] has joined #lisp 01:16:00 p_l|backup: I don't understand what "but unlike #() it's just nil" means, especially the "just" nil part. 01:16:54 Hexstream: #() contains more than just the nil sentinel 01:17:07 #() exists solely to be the empty vector. nil does not exist solely to be the empty list. nil is an object with several purposes 01:17:07 nil and #() are semantically indistinguishable as sequences. 01:19:31 kpreid: Actually, there's nothing preventing #() from having several purposes. I could write code that interprets it as some kind of special sentinel value while in some particular context(s). 01:20:06 sure, but they are not multiple purposes baked into the language's type system; that's what makes nil odd, from a programming language design perspective 01:20:23 gko [~gko@211.21.137.140] has joined #lisp 01:20:24 In fact, #() already has lots of meanings. It's an empty sequence, an array of 1 dimension and 0 elements, a vector... 01:21:41 Though, NIL is probably the single value with the most heavily overloaded semantics in multiple contexts, yeah. 01:22:48 -!- symbole [~user@50-56-28-56.static.cloud-ips.com] has quit [Disconnected by services] 01:24:55 -!- redline6561_nom is now known as redline6561 01:27:12 -!- Kajtek [~nope@nat4-230.ghnet.pl] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 01:35:38 -!- pnq [~nick@ACA2AC74.ipt.aol.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 01:37:55 hm 01:42:18 _root_ [~Scalable@li252-14.members.linode.com] has joined #lisp 01:43:32 hexstream, p_l.. do u use lispworks? 01:43:44 octavo: SBCL ftw! 01:43:59 hexstream: hehe :) 01:48:10 I need to know how i have to do, to write a simple function which updates a list of opengl interfaces. these interfaces take some time to be updated, so i need a background process. I want this process in very low priority so i can continue using the environment. I thought about mp:process-send, i mean, make a funcion which when dequeued refreshes every interface and queues again (to be processed 01:48:10 when possible but whitout molesting interface usage). 01:51:13 -!- bgs100 [~ian@unaffiliated/bgs100] has quit [Quit: "You left me standing here, a long, long time ago..." 1997] 01:52:52 -!- zmv [~daniel@c95334de.virtua.com.br] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 01:55:01 -!- Hexstream [~hexstream@modemcable075.97-200-24.mc.videotron.ca] has left #lisp 01:55:15 holycow [~new@poco208-2.fredcanhelp.com] has joined #lisp 02:04:30 okay, what the fuck. 02:04:36 I'm trying to debug postmodern 02:04:45 and I've gotten to the bit of code that calculates message length 02:04:54 wrapping it in (print ...) makes it work. 02:04:57 removing the print makes it break again. 02:05:05 what could possible cause this. 02:05:24 -!- ravster [~user@184.175.28.107] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 02:06:25 -!- benkard [~mulk@mnch-d9bdd6c2.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit [Quit: benkard] 02:08:25 Ralith: unknown coercion somewhere? 02:09:23 zmv [~daniel@c95334de.virtua.com.br] has joined #lisp 02:09:38 -!- _root_ [~Scalable@li252-14.members.linode.com] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 02:09:52 octavo: I'd go with one thread doing UI loop, and dequeing changes pushed to it (using a thread-safe queue, of course) 02:09:59 MeanWeen [~KAPITAL@cpe-174-099-078-185.nc.res.rr.com] has joined #lisp 02:09:59 p_l|backup: hm? 02:10:59 _root_ [~Scalable@li252-14.members.linode.com] has joined #lisp 02:11:01 p_l|backup: one thread? you mean, one process? i'm using lispworks 5.1.. is it the same? 02:11:13 dlowe [~dlowe@c-66-30-116-162.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 02:11:21 octavo: use some function to wait on input from user with a timeout to pace the UI thread, too 02:11:43 octavo: was it 5.1 or 6.0 that had fully preemptible threading? 02:12:13 -!- _root_ [~Scalable@li252-14.members.linode.com] has quit [Max SendQ exceeded] 02:12:17 i just know about the concept of mp:process and mp:simple-process.. :).. so it should be 6.0 02:12:22 lemme see 02:13:37 -!- Jasko3 [~tjasko@c-174-59-204-245.hsd1.pa.comcast.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 02:13:48 trying to make some code example to upload on my page 02:14:02 Jasko3 [~tjasko@c-174-59-204-245.hsd1.pa.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 02:14:07 _root_ [~Scalable@li252-14.members.linode.com] has joined #lisp 02:16:04 unfortunately, I can't help you much, my lispworks use was rather explorative (and focused on 6.0) 02:16:34 what I described is the standard way to do it everywhere, but not specific enough ^^; 02:19:52 what´s the best mail list for lispworks? 02:21:33 -!- zmv [~daniel@c95334de.virtua.com.br] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 02:27:55 wow 02:27:58 CCL segfaulted. 02:29:09 SucklinPig [~KAPITAL@cpe-174-099-078-185.nc.res.rr.com] has joined #lisp 02:29:23 and slime is broken. 02:29:24 this is impressive. 02:30:41 -!- leo2007 [~leo@58.22.113.134] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 02:33:04 -!- MeanWeen [~KAPITAL@cpe-174-099-078-185.nc.res.rr.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 02:33:32 Ralith: are you sure the computer isn't to blame? 02:33:55 pkhuong: slime wasn't actually broken, turns out, just laggy. 02:37:50 Vivitron` [~user@pool-108-7-56-243.bstnma.fios.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 02:39:19 -!- Vivitron [~user@pool-108-7-56-243.bstnma.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 02:40:00 -!- Bike [~Glossina@71-38-159-63.ptld.qwest.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 02:41:56 bayildi [~when@97-114-4-66.roch.qwest.net] has joined #lisp 02:42:07 is the D programming language used much anymore? 02:42:50 altsrid [~altsrid@S010678ca39ff0146.vn.shawcable.net] has joined #lisp 02:43:28 bayildi: was it ever used much? 02:43:39 -!- ivan4th [~ivan4th@83.149.9.188] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 02:43:40 i dunno 02:43:45 i'm doing a project for school 02:43:52 it wasn't. 02:43:54 in single-letter programming languages 02:44:10 and polling different places on who uses the anymore 02:44:32 i thought i'd come to #lisp because you're all pretty old and were around when this stuff was more prevalant i guess 02:44:40 ... 02:44:46 shoot me, I knew it will happen 02:44:51 i got kicked out of #c for asking about A and B already :( 02:44:58 they said i was troling, but i swear i'm not 02:45:10 bayildi: D is very much new and active. 02:45:23 -!- Vivitron` [~user@pool-108-7-56-243.bstnma.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 02:45:24 ok, do you use it yourself? where do D users reside 02:45:41 bayildi: there was no A, B was afaik simplified variant of BCPL 02:47:50 -!- phax [~phax@unaffiliated/phax] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 02:48:47 bayildi: around digitalmars.com, I suppose. 02:49:47 -!- bayildi [~when@97-114-4-66.roch.qwest.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 02:50:01 -!- Kenjin [~josesanto@bl5-138-98.dsl.telepac.pt] has quit [Quit: Computer has gone to sleep] 02:50:59 -!- setmeaway [~setmeaway@183.106.96.61] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 02:53:29 Good morning everyone! 02:53:58 Bike [~Glossina@71-38-155-92.ptld.qwest.net] has joined #lisp 02:55:46 Good morning, beach! 02:56:30 yates [~yates@nc-71-54-141-32.dhcp.embarqhsd.net] has joined #lisp 02:58:13 in slime, how do i get the documentation on a function? 03:00:37 -!- pat [~pat@c-71-60-133-203.hsd1.pa.comcast.net] has left #lisp 03:01:06 C-c C-d 03:03:12 cataska [~cataska@210.64.6.233] has joined #lisp 03:05:28 pjb: thank you, but that doesn't work. jlf gave me C-c C-d C-h to list possible ways 03:05:38 jlf/#emacs 03:06:24 -!- yates [~yates@nc-71-54-141-32.dhcp.embarqhsd.net] has quit [Quit: rcirc on GNU Emacs 23.2.1] 03:07:35 Strange, it worked the first time, but not anymore... 03:11:47 Mococa [~Mococa@177.16.255.118] has joined #lisp 03:14:59 daniel__1 [~daniel@p50829356.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #lisp 03:16:08 -!- mrSpec [~Spec@unaffiliated/mrspec] has quit [Quit: mrSpec] 03:16:45 -!- daniel__ [~daniel@p5082BAAE.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 03:17:30 I wish Paul Graham hadn't gotten people excited about html generation, which is imo such a waste of time compared to nice templating systems like jinja2/django's templating engine in python 03:17:47 every time I look at a lisp web development tool it seems like it's actually 90% an html generation tool 03:18:43 -!- chp [~chp@ool-18b83194.dyn.optonline.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 03:19:37 paroneayea: there are also various web server and web app frameworks written in CL. 03:19:59 http://www.cliki.net/admin/search?words=web 03:20:09 -!- Mococa [~Mococa@177.16.255.118] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 03:22:17 http://clacklisp.org/ looks interesting 03:22:37 might be because I like wsgi though ;) 03:24:06 paroneayea: there's html-template, for a start. It does a nice job of at least moving the HTML generation out of the main codebase. 03:24:38 Is there a way to have an inhereted slot not have a writer for instances of a child class when it does for instances of the superclass? 03:24:52 jfleming: hm 03:25:30 (defmethod (setf writer) (nv (self subclass)) (error "No Writer for it!")) 03:26:18 pjb: I do feel a bit bad that I am so complain-y! 03:26:34 my usage of stumpwm has reinvigorated my interest in using common lisp because I love the language 03:27:03 I do feel like there's often a spattering of unmaintained libraries for something I want to do though 03:27:36 zoey0 [~Zoey0@184.154.163.218] has joined #lisp 03:27:44 paroneayea: that's you're lucky day, then! You can choose one of the unmaintained library and start maintain it yourself. 03:27:48 paroneayea: there's a reason for that. However, the reason in many cases is that CL is surprisingly resistant to bit-rot. 03:28:28 pjb: trying to get http://mediagoblin.org/ launched is keeping me too busy to maintain other projects right now :) 03:28:41 (and (damp place) (bump him) (rump drink)) ; a reflection on p 03:29:12 jfleming: hm, curious what your thoughts on resistance to bit-rot are 03:30:43 "imo such a waste of time compared to nice templating systems like jinja2/django's templating engine in python" ... let them make one better all in lisp 03:30:44 :) 03:31:24 -!- _root_ [~Scalable@li252-14.members.linode.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 03:31:27 octavo: I would actually love to see that, and maybe some day in the glorious future or an alternate reality that's something I'd like to start :) 03:31:34 Of course, the problem might be in templating engines in the first place. 03:31:43 hahaha 03:32:04 paroneayea: resistance is higher than in many other languages for the simple reason that CL is about as mature as it's going to get. As long as the code relies on behaviour defined in the spec, it just doesn't go out of date. 03:32:29 jfleming: assuming it's linking to things that also won't go out of date that is :) 03:32:41 C libraries and etc I mean 03:32:45 but interesting point 03:33:42 Of course, that doesn't mean there *aren't* libraries whose development was abandoned once they did what the author needed. The infamous "80% done" trap. 03:35:08 frhodes [~frhodes@75-173-66-9.albq.qwest.net] has joined #lisp 03:35:53 Mococa [~Mococa@177.16.255.118] has joined #lisp 03:36:20 -!- xyxu [~xyxu@58.41.14.46] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 03:38:48 -!- redline6561 is now known as redline6561_sigt 03:38:52 -!- redline6561_sigt is now known as redline6561_slee 03:39:15 spradnyesh [~pradyus@nat/yahoo/x-cqarzoptmlshneqn] has joined #lisp 03:39:59 Spion [~spion@unaffiliated/spion] has joined #lisp 03:41:34 gravicappa [~gravicapp@ppp91-77-214-227.pppoe.mtu-net.ru] has joined #lisp 03:43:41 -!- Phoodus [~foo@ip72-223-116-248.ph.ph.cox.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 03:44:06 -!- Spion_ [~spion@unaffiliated/spion] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 03:46:59 -!- zoey0 [~Zoey0@184.154.163.218] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 03:49:07 leo2007 [~leo@114.247.10.75] has joined #lisp 03:49:23 xyxu [~xyxu@58.41.14.46] has joined #lisp 03:49:32 bayildi [~when@97-114-4-66.roch.qwest.net] has joined #lisp 03:52:20 nicdev [~nicdev@209-6-50-99.c3-0.smr-ubr1.sbo-smr.ma.cable.rcn.com] has joined #lisp 03:53:54 -!- dshep [~dss@li90-50.members.linode.com] has left #lisp 04:02:39 -!- ikki [~ikki@189.247.6.122] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 04:09:43 -!- realitygrill [~realitygr@76.226.222.183] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 04:09:51 octavo- [~octo@186.22.74.95] has joined #lisp 04:10:17 -!- octavo [~octavo@186.22.74.95] has quit [] 04:13:44 realitygrill [~realitygr@76.226.223.180] has joined #lisp 04:17:25 -!- altsrid [~altsrid@S010678ca39ff0146.vn.shawcable.net] has quit [Quit: Computer has gone to sleep.] 04:17:39 -!- Odin- [~sbkhh@adsl-2-92.du.snerpa.is] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 04:19:59 realitygrill_ [~realitygr@76.226.215.176] has joined #lisp 04:20:09 -!- realitygrill [~realitygr@76.226.223.180] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 04:20:09 -!- realitygrill_ is now known as realitygrill 04:21:36 Vivitron [~user@pool-108-7-56-243.bstnma.fios.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 04:23:04 -!- frhodes [~frhodes@75-173-66-9.albq.qwest.net] has quit [Quit: leaving] 04:26:54 -!- araujo [~araujo@gentoo/developer/araujo] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 04:41:33 Athas [~athas@130.225.165.40] has joined #lisp 04:47:20 Zulu [~Zulu@c-174-58-204-235.hsd1.fl.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 04:49:00 -!- bayildi [~when@97-114-4-66.roch.qwest.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 04:49:00 -!- leo2007 [~leo@114.247.10.75] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 04:50:55 Welp. This is my first time using IRC and thus also obviously my first time on this channel... Hello everyone! 04:51:54 hey Zulu, welcome! 04:52:44 Hello! That was also a test to see if my client was working properly, since there was no activity in the room. Glad to see it is working fine! 04:54:09 kushal [~kdas@fedora/kushal] has joined #lisp 04:54:54 bayildi [~when@97-114-4-66.roch.qwest.net] has joined #lisp 04:55:08 So is it typically this quiet or did I simply join at an odd time? 04:55:33 People are probably just sleeping 04:55:45 Did you have a question or something? 04:56:25 Ah no.. I suppose I didn't have much of a reason to log in other than not having much else to do 04:56:43 That's the best reason to join 04:57:10 Haha. I think so 05:02:23 -!- cheier [~amedueces@c-76-107-19-58.hsd1.ms.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: ERC Version 5.3 (IRC client for Emacs)] 05:04:20 -!- bayildi [~when@97-114-4-66.roch.qwest.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 05:08:44 Zulu: it's usually quiet around this time; like Iceland_jack, I put it down to the timezone thing. 05:09:18 -!- HG` [~HG@p5DC04EBF.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Quit: HG`] 05:11:09 -!- gko [~gko@211.21.137.140] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 05:11:57 I see. Well, as much as I hate to contribute further to the silence: I should be going. I hope to see you all some other time. Be safe! 05:12:57 julz [~julz@76.73.16.26] has joined #lisp 05:13:21 -!- Zulu [~Zulu@c-174-58-204-235.hsd1.fl.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: ~ Trillian Astra - www.trillian.im ~] 05:14:12 cyrillos [~cyrill@188.134.33.130] has joined #lisp 05:17:33 . 05:18:05 bayildi [~when@97-114-48-224.roch.qwest.net] has joined #lisp 05:21:41 not so quiet 05:21:44 this still dont works ;) 05:22:02 doesnt 05:24:18 oudeis [~oudeis@bzq-79-181-214-224.red.bezeqint.net] has joined #lisp 05:24:25 mcsontos [~mcsontos@nat/redhat/x-ottrszlkteaajjek] has joined #lisp 05:24:53 http://paste.lisp.org/display/124334 <- can someone explain what is going on here? I'm using multiple inheritance, inheriting from two classes that have same slot name. 05:25:18 why am I getting foo's name? because I inherited from it first? 05:26:02 julz: yes. 05:26:16 what if I need both? 05:26:59 you can't. Slots are named by symbols. You can't have two slots with the same name. 05:27:35 You might be interested in packages. That's how we manage namespaces in common lisp. 05:28:03 i know about packages. 05:28:32 -!- Vivitron [~user@pool-108-7-56-243.bstnma.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 05:28:40 so packages would solve this? if I inherit from two third party classes, each one in it's own package 05:28:49 -!- Jasko3 [~tjasko@c-174-59-204-245.hsd1.pa.comcast.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 05:29:17 Jasko3 [~tjasko@c-174-59-204-245.hsd1.pa.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 05:29:24 dralston [~dralston@S0106687f74a12729.va.shawcable.net] has joined #lisp 05:30:44 julz: if they're not the same slot, they shouldn't have the same name. It's exactly the same situation with generic functions. 05:31:01 I enjoy Zulu's wonderful turn of phrase; [...] I hate to contribute further to the silence 05:32:09 -!- Amyn [~abennama@cac94-2-87-91-21-215.dsl.sta.abo.bbox.fr] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 05:34:36 are they the same slot if they two classes defined in two different packages use it? 05:36:01 -!- dralston is now known as vociferous 05:36:17 -!- vociferous is now known as sodel 05:37:37 ah they aren't 05:37:55 _root_ [~Scalable@li252-14.members.linode.com] has joined #lisp 05:38:02 pavelludiq [~pavelludi@87.246.58.193] has joined #lisp 05:38:48 -!- sodel [~dralston@S0106687f74a12729.va.shawcable.net] has quit [Quit: leaving] 05:40:19 -!- ASau [~user@93-80-104-193.broadband.corbina.ru] has quit [Quit: off] 05:42:26 sodel [~dralston@S0106687f74a12729.va.shawcable.net] has joined #lisp 05:43:14 -!- dnolen [~davidnole@cpe-98-14-92-234.nyc.res.rr.com] has quit [Quit: dnolen] 05:44:19 -!- _root_ [~Scalable@li252-14.members.linode.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 05:45:10 what was that function that prints details about objects, if it's a class prints all the slots values, etc 05:46:08 DESCRIBE? 05:47:18 that's it thanks 05:47:55 mishoo_ [~mishoo@79.112.115.118] has joined #lisp 05:53:01 -!- zomgbie [~jesus@85-127-217-153.dynamic.xdsl-line.inode.at] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 05:53:30 -!- dabd [~dabd@a79-169-214-13.cpe.netcabo.pt] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 05:53:43 araujo [~araujo@gentoo/developer/araujo] has joined #lisp 05:56:08 ramkrsna [~ramkrsna@nat/redhat/x-bvwzibrwnssratab] has joined #lisp 05:56:08 -!- ramkrsna [~ramkrsna@nat/redhat/x-bvwzibrwnssratab] has quit [Changing host] 05:56:08 ramkrsna [~ramkrsna@unaffiliated/ramkrsna] has joined #lisp 05:57:55 -!- Deesl [~bsdboy@unaffiliated/deesl] has quit [Quit: Bye!] 05:58:16 Deesl [~bsdboy@unaffiliated/deesl] has joined #lisp 06:08:04 manuel_ [~manuel@pD9FDD263.dip.t-dialin.net] has 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hajovonta [jnre@usloft1077.serverloft.de] has joined #lisp 06:22:18 Jasko [~tjasko@c-174-59-204-245.hsd1.pa.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 06:22:22 good morning everybody 06:24:17 -!- Jasko3 [~tjasko@c-174-59-204-245.hsd1.pa.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 06:26:58 leo2007 [~leo@114.247.10.75] has joined #lisp 06:28:10 jewel_ [~jewel@196-215-88-11.dynamic.isadsl.co.za] has joined #lisp 06:30:12 -!- ISF [~ivan@201.82.131.254] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 06:31:06 -!- Joreji [~thomas@64-073.eduroam.RWTH-Aachen.DE] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 06:32:12 Mococa [~Mococa@177.16.255.118] has joined #lisp 06:36:07 -!- dstatyvka [ejabberd@pepelaz.jabber.od.ua] has left #lisp 06:36:52 -!- Amadiro [~Amadiro@ti0021a380-dhcp3462.bb.online.no] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 06:37:16 -!- simplechat [~simplecha@unaffiliated/simplechat] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 06:37:18 frhodes [~frhodes@75-173-66-9.albq.qwest.net] has 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[~mvilleneu@LLagny-156-36-4-214.w80-14.abo.wanadoo.fr] has joined #lisp 06:58:11 -!- ramus [~ramus@c-76-28-156-218.hsd1.wa.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 07:01:43 jdijk [jdijk@ftth-212-84-159-210.solcon.nl] has joined #lisp 07:02:20 _jdijk [jdijk@ftth-212-84-159-210.solcon.nl] has joined #lisp 07:03:08 -!- jdijk [jdijk@ftth-212-84-159-210.solcon.nl] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 07:03:21 -!- _jdijk [jdijk@ftth-212-84-159-210.solcon.nl] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 07:04:51 -!- jewel_ [~jewel@196-215-88-11.dynamic.isadsl.co.za] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 07:06:41 -!- ramus_ [~ramus@c-50-132-91-53.hsd1.wa.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: Reconnecting] 07:06:45 ramus [~ramus@c-50-132-91-53.hsd1.wa.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 07:07:14 TeMPOraL [~user@cpc12-oxfd18-2-0-cust64.4-3.cable.virginmedia.com] has joined #lisp 07:07:39 neoesque [~neoesque@210.59.147.232] has joined #lisp 07:09:34 Joreji [~thomas@64-073.eduroam.RWTH-Aachen.DE] has joined #lisp 07:11:06 Athas [~athas@shop3.diku.dk] has joined #lisp 07:11:44 Amyn [~abennama@64.208.49.45] has joined #lisp 07:12:21 darn. hefner's flac metadata stuff seems to just be ffi wrappers. 07:13:02 Astrology [~chris@122.237.0.53] has joined #lisp 07:13:42 -!- manuel_ [~manuel@pD9FDD263.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 07:13:58 manuel_ [~manuel@pD9FDD263.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #lisp 07:17:14 manuel__ [~manuel@pD9FDD263.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #lisp 07:17:15 dacoda [~user@gate.cdc.informatik.tu-darmstadt.de] has joined #lisp 07:17:15 -!- manuel_ [~manuel@pD9FDD263.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 07:17:15 -!- manuel__ is now known as manuel_ 07:18:14 -!- manuel_ [~manuel@pD9FDD263.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 07:19:29 -!- ngz [~user@171.203.70.86.rev.sfr.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 07:21:11 -!- optikalmouse [~user@bas1-toronto07-1176122586.dsl.bell.ca] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 07:22:34 paprika [~paprika@FL1-122-131-59-22.hrs.mesh.ad.jp] has joined #lisp 07:26:44 manuel_ [~manuel@pD9FDD263.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #lisp 07:32:03 lanthan_afh [~ze@p50992b91.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #lisp 07:32:52 -!- ltriant [~ltriant@lithium.mailguard.com.au] has quit [Quit: Computer has gone to sleep] 07:32:58 trebor_dki [~user@mail.dki.tu-darmstadt.de] has joined #lisp 07:33:34 -!- sdemarre [~serge@91.176.86.170] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 07:34:22 sdemarre [~serge@91.176.86.170] has joined #lisp 07:37:00 -!- DGASAU [~user@91.218.144.129] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 07:37:02 misoczki [~misoczki@2001:660:3013:3:222:19ff:fe24:d155] has joined #lisp 07:39:42 slyrus: yes, I'm afraid so. I'd love to convert it to native CL code, but I've NFI when I'm likely to find the time. 07:45:12 spacefrogg [~spacefrog@unaffiliated/spacefrogg] has joined #lisp 07:47:26 DGASAU [~user@91.218.144.129] has joined #lisp 07:50:41 mishoo__ [~mishoo@79.112.115.118] has joined #lisp 07:51:03 -!- mishoo_ [~mishoo@79.112.115.118] has quit [Read error: No route to host] 07:51:22 simplechat [~simplecha@123-243-79-139.static.tpgi.com.au] has joined #lisp 07:51:22 -!- simplechat [~simplecha@123-243-79-139.static.tpgi.com.au] has quit [Changing host] 07:51:22 simplechat [~simplecha@unaffiliated/simplechat] has joined #lisp 07:53:42 -!- bayildi [~when@97-114-48-224.roch.qwest.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 07:55:52 Beetny [~Beetny@ppp118-208-154-7.lns20.bne1.internode.on.net] has joined #lisp 08:00:19 -!- Joreji [~thomas@64-073.eduroam.RWTH-Aachen.DE] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 08:02:20 e-user [~e-user@nat/nokia/x-xidzuavkkzawblbf] has joined #lisp 08:03:17 -!- Harag [~Harag@dsl-242-247-181.telkomadsl.co.za] has left #lisp 08:03:53 -!- Astrology [~chris@122.237.0.53] has quit [Quit: WeeChat 0.3.4] 08:06:55 Astrology [~chris@122.237.0.53] has joined #lisp 08:09:06 hi, has anyone here bothered trying out clojure? what reasons or use cases might exist that one should stick to common lisp instead, besides ugly loop/recur constructs in lack of TCO in the JVM? 08:10:16 Joreji [~thomas@64-073.eduroam.RWTH-Aachen.DE] has joined #lisp 08:12:30 clojure is an implementation not a standard. Common lisp is a standard not an implementation. To use clojure you need THE clojure. To use common lisp you can (apart from its glitches) take any common lisp implementation. 08:12:45 varjag [~eugene@122.62-97-226.bkkb.no] has joined #lisp 08:13:13 e-user: It's rare that you'd need explicit recursions 08:13:24 Does postmodern support foreign keys? 08:13:29 -!- Mococa [~Mococa@177.16.255.118] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 08:13:46 spacefrogg: that i am aware of. i'm also aware that, however, fundamental things are missing in the standard which are only present in subsets of implementations; for native timer support e.g., it seems like only SBCL provides such 08:14:25 jdz [~jdz@193.206.22.97] has joined #lisp 08:14:39 lony [~lony@hoas-fe3ddd00-245.dhcp.inet.fi] has joined #lisp 08:14:55 -!- DGASAU [~user@91.218.144.129] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 08:15:00 MasseR: I really like - as a matter of personal preference - a recursive coding style as per On Lisp, so it's less a matter of actual requirement :) 08:15:16 sure. but as you have to pick the clojure implementation and look if it fits your needs, you have to pick a common lisp implementation and look if it fits your needs either 08:16:15 To make it short, there is no clojure standard and thus nothing can be missing from that. 08:16:16 Mococa [~Mococa@177.16.255.118] has joined #lisp 08:17:23 -!- carlocci [~carlocci@rps662.ovh.net] has quit [Changing host] 08:17:23 carlocci [~carlocci@unaffiliated/carlocci] has joined #lisp 08:17:28 spacefrogg: That's correct; i'm still unsure whether to jump on the Clojure train however. STM and immutability seem to be promising but the different paren/bracket mash looks intimidating and I'm unsure whether Clojure lacks in terms of metaprogramming, at least in comparison to CL. 08:17:45 -!- Astrology [~chris@122.237.0.53] has quit [Quit: WeeChat 0.3.4] 08:17:59 Do you use metaprogramming a lot? 08:18:04 good morning 08:18:05 Astrology [~chris@122.237.0.53] has joined #lisp 08:18:23 DGASAU [~user@91.218.144.129] has joined #lisp 08:18:57 -!- manuel_ [~manuel@pD9FDD263.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Quit: manuel_] 08:21:54 spacefrogg: Yes. But it depends on what you really mean by "a lot": DSLs are my favorite way of solving problems of high order. 08:22:06 As in, writing DSLs myself. 08:22:38 -!- Joreji [~thomas@64-073.eduroam.RWTH-Aachen.DE] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 08:24:50 -!- Astrology [~chris@122.237.0.53] has quit [Quit: WeeChat 0.3.4] 08:29:11 fmeyer_ [~fmeyer@187.38.98.102] has joined #lisp 08:29:39 -!- fmeyer [~fmeyer@187.38.98.102] has quit [Quit: leaving] 08:29:49 -!- fmeyer_ [~fmeyer@187.38.98.102] has quit [Client Quit] 08:30:11 fmeyer [~fmeyer@187.38.98.102] has joined #lisp 08:32:21 slash_ [~unknown@p54A8DED6.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #lisp 08:35:41 -!- spradnyesh [~pradyus@nat/yahoo/x-cqarzoptmlshneqn] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 08:36:04 -!- benny [~benny@i577A7962.versanet.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 08:39:10 -!- Mococa [~Mococa@177.16.255.118] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 08:41:47 -!- fmeyer [~fmeyer@187.38.98.102] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 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#lisp 09:54:55 e-user, i've concluded for my own needs that clojure and common lisp are sufficiently different that comparing them would be unfair 09:55:10 -!- neoesque [~neoesque@210.59.147.232] has quit [Quit: Bye!] 09:55:46 attila_lendvai [~attila_le@adsl-89-135-203-31.monradsl.monornet.hu] has joined #lisp 09:55:46 -!- attila_lendvai [~attila_le@adsl-89-135-203-31.monradsl.monornet.hu] has quit [Changing host] 09:55:46 attila_lendvai [~attila_le@unaffiliated/attila-lendvai/x-3126965] has joined #lisp 09:55:53 e-user, also, there are libraries for persistent data structures, stms, futures and lazynes, and adding reader macros for data structures is easy enough that i miss little from clojure 09:56:18 e-user, its mostly a matter of taste for me 09:58:15 e-user, as for recursion, i consider its use when i don't have a recursive problem(liike walking a tree) to be unnecessary 09:58:28 Also, parallel mapping, and the like, but that comes with futures, anyway 09:59:05 manuel_ [~manuel_@pD9FDD263.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #lisp 09:59:19 -!- manuel_ [~manuel_@pD9FDD263.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Client Quit] 10:00:34 Astrology [~chris@122.237.37.192] has joined #lisp 10:00:35 -!- H4ns``` is now known as H4ns 10:01:05 -!- xyxu [~xyxu@58.41.14.46] has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 10:01:53 kiuma [~kiuma@85-18-55-37.ip.fastwebnet.it] has joined #lisp 10:03:55 anyone know of a CL implementation of bcrypt? 10:07:28 Ralith, I've found this: http://www.letsyouandhimfight.com/2010/07/14/cl-bcrypt-a-first-attempt/ 10:07:42 yeah, saw that too; that's a CFFI binding 10:08:59 I have an external program that I need to run and if it terminates correctly after n seconds then get it output, otherwise just kill it. I run (sb-ext:run-program) with :wait '() and :output :stream, but the process keeps "running" status until I get something from stream 10:09:11 I wonder if that behaviou is caused by the program or by sbcl 10:09:47 Yerp. 10:09:49 freiksenet: paste? 10:10:06 freiksenet: what do you mean by 'keeps "running" status'? 10:11:14 process object has status :running 10:11:19 instead of status :exited 10:11:39 if I have :wait t then it exits fine 10:11:42 freiksenet: what program, which signal? perhaps that signal is ignored ... 10:12:13 freiksenet: what about the operating system process? 10:12:23 H4ns: aha, let me try that. 10:12:43 -!- gravicappa [~gravicapp@80.90.116.82] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 10:12:53 H4ns: still there too 10:12:56 perhaps it's still a zombie, and so lisp sees it as active 10:13:22 it's just that it seems that it doesn't close until I read from it's output, which is weird 10:13:25 How about (process-wait [sb-ext] process &optional check-for-stopped) 10:13:43 freiksenet: in what status? 10:13:59 what do you mean by "close"? it should terminate if you kill it, but might hang around as a zombie until reaped by sbcl 10:14:12 flip214: that is what :wait t does, and that doesn't work cause I need to kill it if it doesn't finish after n seconds 10:14:32 freiksenet: yes, I meant to do process-wait after the process-kill 10:14:41 then it should get reaped, IIUC 10:15:06 flip214: no, you misunderstood. kill works fine. it just doesn't exit itself, even though it should 10:15:27 freiksenet: did you say that it _does_ exit when you read from the pipe? 10:15:43 H4ns: yes 10:15:46 freiksenet: also, what is the state of the process after you've killed it (as seen by ps) 10:15:51 S 10:16:02 freiksenet: what program, which signal? 10:16:22 perhaps it only exits on SIGPIPE after you close its STDOUT 10:16:27 freiksenet: then i'd say it did not receive the signal. 10:16:37 freiksenet: S interruptible sleep (waiting for an event to complete) 10:16:54 interesting. 10:17:20 [12:11] freiksenet: what program, which signal? perhaps that signal is ignored ... 10:17:20 flip214: final step is iconv 10:17:37 freiksenet: you're working with a pipe and killed the first process in the pipe. 10:17:42 so it's a shell command, with multiple commands piped together? 10:17:44 it's a bash script with does cat | iconv | our own C++ program | iconv 10:17:55 why the first cat, BTW? 10:18:04 flip214: read from file 10:19:06 try setsid before the shell, and :process-group in the process-kill? 10:19:11 freiksenet: and the status of the bash process is S after you've sent the signal? 10:20:05 still ... which signal, and which processes survive? perhaps one of the parts doesn't see the EOF on STDIN and so won't cause later parts to exit ... 10:20:42 no, you mistunderstood what is not working. it kills fine 10:20:59 it's just that behaviour that I expected was - print out all the output and quite 10:21:01 quit 10:21:03 freiksenet: you said that your subprocess is in S state after you've killed it. 10:21:10 and it does - print out all the output and wait till I read for it 10:21:13 or till I kill it 10:21:32 so I can't tell if it hangs as it always appear to be running to me 10:21:44 if I do same with, say, ls it exists gracefully 10:22:01 ehu [~ehuels@109.32.131.21] has joined #lisp 10:22:06 freiksenet: you lost me. 10:22:11 ok. 10:22:23 I need ot run external program that hangs dead sometimes 10:22:31 without showing in any way that it is dead 10:22:46 so I run it with sb-ext:run-program and poll if it's alive every second for n seconds 10:22:53 then if it's still running I Kill it and signal error 10:22:53 freiksenet: if you use normal pipes, the buffers will be limited to 4 or 64kB. If there's more data, the child process will hang until the pipe gets writeable again. 10:22:58 might this be the problem? 10:23:09 freiksenet: ah, and you use the sbcl process state to determine whether it is dead? 10:23:19 H4ns: whether it exited, yes 10:23:20 -!- frhodes [~frhodes@75-173-66-9.albq.qwest.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 10:23:24 so I can safely read it's output and proceed 10:23:27 but it never exits 10:24:26 freiksenet: and what you observe is that even though the process is no longer running, the sbcl process state says it is? 10:24:29 Do you get more than 64KB of data output? 10:24:46 flip214: I doubt 10:25:01 flip214: though I can't say for sure 10:25:04 gravicappa [~gravicapp@80.90.116.82] has joined #lisp 10:25:08 freiksenet: if you want to really check whether the os process is running, send it a signal 0. 10:25:31 pavelludiq: Thank you very much for the differentiated answer! Unfortunately, I'm even less decided now :/ 10:26:07 H4ns: what should I get? 10:26:28 freiksenet: if the process exists, the kill will exit w/o an error, otherwise it will signal an error. 10:26:59 s/exit/return/ 10:27:10 aha 10:27:13 now it actually seems to work 10:27:39 as it stops being running after 2 and switches to signaled 10:28:10 freiksenet: frankly, i'd put all that stuff into the shell script rather than trying to deal with the hanging program from the outside. 10:28:34 maybe I should 10:28:36 do that too 10:30:56 Joreji [~thomas@64-073.eduroam.RWTH-Aachen.DE] has joined #lisp 10:31:03 H4ns: thanks a lot! 10:31:12 freiksenet: yw 10:31:28 so, why does it just sleep unless I send a 0 signal to it? 10:31:49 <_8david> kill is a nice trick to check whether a process ID is valid, but in this case, you're the parent process; you don't need that trick. 10:31:52 freiksenet: signal 0 does not do anything to the process, it just checks whether it exists. 10:32:21 it's strange, cause it seems to make sbcl update the process state 10:32:28 so it still always returns true 10:32:37 but sbcl "sees" that it exited 10:32:53 but without kill 0, it doesn't 10:35:50 mrSpec [~Spec@unaffiliated/mrspec] has joined #lisp 10:40:20 <_8david> freiksenet: you will need to post a self-contained test case in order to get definitive help 10:44:14 -!- oudeis [~oudeis@bzq-79-181-214-224.red.bezeqint.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 10:44:32 oudeis [~oudeis@2.54.254.4] has joined #lisp 10:45:36 xyxu [~xyxu@222.68.167.143] has joined #lisp 10:53:06 Amadiro [~Amadiro@1x-193-157-195-16.uio.no] has joined #lisp 10:55:15 -!- ngz [~user@171.203.70.86.rev.sfr.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 10:55:55 TeMPOraL` [~user@cpc12-oxfd18-2-0-cust64.4-3.cable.virginmedia.com] has joined #lisp 10:58:04 -!- TeMPOraL [~user@cpc12-oxfd18-2-0-cust64.4-3.cable.virginmedia.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 11:00:05 bayildi [~when@97-114-4-83.roch.qwest.net] has joined #lisp 11:01:24 -!- TeMPOraL` [~user@cpc12-oxfd18-2-0-cust64.4-3.cable.virginmedia.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 11:06:07 Yuuhi [benni@p5483CC73.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #lisp 11:09:19 -!- Amadiro [~Amadiro@1x-193-157-195-16.uio.no] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 11:09:44 -!- peterhil` [~peterhil@gw.maxisat.fi] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 11:11:06 peterhil` [~peterhil@gw.maxisat.fi] has joined #lisp 11:13:57 -!- DGASAU [~user@91.218.144.129] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 11:16:17 -!- Athas [~athas@shop3.diku.dk] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 11:16:49 Amadiro [~Amadiro@1x-193-157-195-16.uio.no] has joined #lisp 11:17:35 -!- JuanDaugherty [~juan@cpe-72-228-177-92.buffalo.res.rr.com] has quit [Read error: No route to host] 11:20:51 lnostdal_ [~lnostdal@ti0030a380-dhcp0111.bb.online.no] has joined #lisp 11:21:06 -!- varjag [~eugene@122.62-97-226.bkkb.no] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 11:23:01 espadrine` [~thaddee_t@LNeuilly-152-22-27-243.w193-251.abo.wanadoo.fr] has joined #lisp 11:24:06 TeMPOraL [~user@cpc12-oxfd18-2-0-cust64.4-3.cable.virginmedia.com] has joined #lisp 11:24:33 DGASAU [~user@91.218.144.129] has joined #lisp 11:25:15 What does #1=(programmable . #1#) mean, or do? 11:26:12 espadrine`: http://www.lispworks.com/documentation/HyperSpec/Body/v_pr_cir.htm 11:27:04 -!- otwieracz [~gonet9@v6.gen2.org] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 11:27:59 otwieracz [~gonet9@v6.gen2.org] has joined #lisp 11:29:43 -!- oudeis [~oudeis@2.54.254.4] has quit [Quit: This computer has gone to sleep] 11:30:09 -!- Beetny [~Beetny@ppp118-208-154-7.lns20.bne1.internode.on.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 11:32:52 juniorroy [~juniorroy@212.36.228.103] has joined #lisp 11:33:22 H4ns: Is it supposed to run fine? CLisp doesn't run it. It hits a stack overflow with #1='(programmable . #1#) 11:33:40 espadrine`: it is not a program that you can run. 11:33:48 espadrine`: it is kind of a joke. 11:34:57 I think I remember having run it through sbcl, and got something like (programmable (programmable (programmable ...))) printed out indefinitely. Was this a dream? 11:35:27 espadrine`: no. it still is not a program, it is a recursive data structure. 11:35:52 espadrine`: try to understand what *print-circle* does. 11:37:34 H4ns: Ok, what I meant is, does the Reader accept this syntax? How should it read it? 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-!- TeMPOraL [~user@cpc12-oxfd18-2-0-cust64.4-3.cable.virginmedia.com] has quit [Quit: reboot] 13:07:25 -!- billstcalir is now known as billstclair 13:07:30 -!- billstclair [~billstcla@p-69-195-50-14.dsl1.rtr.chat.fpma.frpt.net] has quit [Changing host] 13:07:30 billstclair [~billstcla@unaffiliated/billstclair] has joined #lisp 13:07:47 -!- ramkrsna [~ramkrsna@unaffiliated/ramkrsna] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 13:11:41 ChibaPet [~mason@74.203.221.34] has joined #lisp 13:12:13 Good morning and happy Monday, ye glorious lisps. 13:13:48 -!- kpreid [~kpreid@128.153.212.222] has quit [Quit: Quitting] 13:14:20 ngz [~user@171.203.70.86.rev.sfr.net] has joined #lisp 13:14:59 -!- seangrove [~user@c-24-6-209-98.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 13:17:30 mathrick [~mathrick@85.218.136.127] has joined #lisp 13:19:24 zmv [~daniel@c95334de.virtua.com.br] has joined #lisp 13:19:31 seangrove [~user@c-24-6-209-98.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 13:19:49 t 13:22:22 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[~tjasko@209.74.44.225] has joined #lisp 13:38:36 tsuru [~user@c-68-53-57-241.hsd1.tn.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 13:39:21 -!- Jasko [~tjasko@c-174-59-204-245.hsd1.pa.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 13:40:22 altsrid [~altsrid@S010678ca39ff0146.vn.shawcable.net] has joined #lisp 13:42:23 EClaesson [~EClaesson@c-0f89e555.013-19-6c6b7013.cust.bredbandsbolaget.se] has joined #lisp 13:43:47 *trebor_dki* is excited, got an offer for an unlimited (in sense of time) contract - the lisp application did a great help for that! ;) 13:44:00 ivan4th [~ivan4th@smtp.igrade.ru] has joined #lisp 13:44:05 trebor_dki: congrats 13:44:05 congrats, trebor_dki! 13:44:12 what lisp application? 13:44:23 Congratulations. Is the contract Lisp-oriented? 13:44:35 felideon: 3d-image analysis 13:44:44 -!- kpreid [~kpreid@128.153.212.222] has quit [Quit: Offline] 13:45:01 ChibaPet: i do lisp >> 50% of my time here ;) 13:45:03 trebor_dki: congratulations! 13:45:05 -!- OODavo [~david@ppp121-44-234-212.lns20.syd7.internode.on.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 13:45:30 -!- mrSpec [~Spec@unaffiliated/mrspec] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 13:45:59 Excellent. :) 13:49:09 -!- Joreji [~thomas@64-073.eduroam.RWTH-Aachen.DE] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 13:49:52 Joreji [~thomas@64-073.eduroam.RWTH-Aachen.DE] has joined #lisp 13:50:44 OODavo [~david@ppp121-44-234-212.lns20.syd7.internode.on.net] has joined #lisp 13:51:54 TeMPOraL [~user@cpc12-oxfd18-2-0-cust64.4-3.cable.virginmedia.com] has joined #lisp 13:55:26 congrats :) 13:55:42 superflit_ [~superflit@71-33-184-33.hlrn.qwest.net] has joined #lisp 13:57:42 -!- superflit [~superflit@71-33-189-74.hlrn.qwest.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 13:57:42 -!- superflit_ is now known as superflit 13:58:01 kpreid [~kpreid@128.153.178.203] has joined #lisp 14:02:58 mrSpec [~Spec@unaffiliated/mrspec] has joined #lisp 14:05:50 dcrawford [~dcrawford@ita4fw1.itasoftware.com] has joined #lisp 14:06:16 rmarianski [~rmariansk@mail.marianski.com] has joined #lisp 14:06:48 -!- dabd [~dabd@switch.inesc-id.pt] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 14:07:36 dl [~user@chpcwl01.hpc.unm.edu] has joined #lisp 14:08:20 -!- xan_ [~xan@227-236.62-188.cust.bluewin.ch] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 14:08:51 -!- Joreji [~thomas@64-073.eduroam.RWTH-Aachen.DE] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 14:09:29 spradnyesh [~pradyus@117.192.43.69] has joined #lisp 14:09:40 -!- ngz [~user@171.203.70.86.rev.sfr.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 14:11:21 Joreji [~thomas@64-073.eduroam.RWTH-Aachen.DE] has joined #lisp 14:13:50 -!- spradnyesh [~pradyus@117.192.43.69] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 14:16:17 milanj [~milanj_@93-86-22-71.dynamic.isp.telekom.rs] has joined #lisp 14:16:40 joast [~rick@76.178.178.72] has joined #lisp 14:17:35 -!- sellout [~Adium@c-98-245-161-7.hsd1.co.comcast.net] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 14:18:29 oconnore [~Eric@c-66-31-125-56.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 14:18:34 -!- oconnore [~Eric@c-66-31-125-56.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has left #lisp 14:19:50 -!- trebor_dki [~user@mail.dki.tu-darmstadt.de] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 14:26:07 -!- gravicappa [~gravicapp@80.90.116.82] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 14:26:21 ZabaQ [~john.conn@135.114-84-212.staticip.namesco.net] has joined #lisp 14:26:38 -!- manuel_ [~manuel@pD9FDD263.dip.t-dialin.net] has left #lisp 14:28:26 spradnyesh [~pradyus@nat/yahoo/x-rwlarekuqzlgluew] has joined #lisp 14:28:57 Mococa [~Mococa@177.16.255.118] has joined #lisp 14:29:52 -!- oudeis_ [~oudeis@89-139-10-213.bb.netvision.net.il] has quit [Quit: This computer has gone to sleep] 14:30:25 -!- dnolen [~davidnole@cpe-98-14-92-234.nyc.res.rr.com] has quit [Quit: dnolen] 14:31:58 -!- ZabaQ [~john.conn@135.114-84-212.staticip.namesco.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 14:33:22 -!- SucklinPig [~KAPITAL@cpe-174-099-078-185.nc.res.rr.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 14:34:26 -!- mcsontos [~mcsontos@nat/redhat/x-ottrszlkteaajjek] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 14:35:28 juniorroy [~juniorroy@212.36.228.103] has joined #lisp 14:35:37 -!- spacefrogg [~spacefrog@unaffiliated/spacefrogg] has quit [Quit: spacefrogg] 14:36:19 -!- hajovonta [jnre@usloft1077.serverloft.de] has quit [] 14:36:49 -!- Mococa [~Mococa@177.16.255.118] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 14:39:59 -!- pnq [~nick@AC81F452.ipt.aol.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 14:41:03 pnq [~nick@AC81F452.ipt.aol.com] has joined #lisp 14:42:46 kwertii [~kwertii@ResNet-33-19.resnet.ucsb.edu] has joined #lisp 14:43:06 Bike1 [~Glossina@69.166.35.233] has joined #lisp 14:45:45 gemelen [~shelta@shpd-92-101-144-119.vologda.ru] has joined #lisp 14:46:20 SucklinPig [~KAPITAL@cpe-174-099-078-185.nc.res.rr.com] has joined #lisp 14:46:21 -!- simplechat [~simplecha@unaffiliated/simplechat] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 14:50:13 -!- altsrid [~altsrid@S010678ca39ff0146.vn.shawcable.net] has quit [Quit: Computer has gone to sleep.] 14:51:01 -!- kpreid [~kpreid@128.153.178.203] has quit [Quit: Offline] 14:52:33 Mococa [~Mococa@177.16.255.118] has joined #lisp 14:55:37 puchacz [~puchacz@87-194-5-99.bethere.co.uk] has joined #lisp 14:55:47 xan_ [~xan@227-236.62-188.cust.bluewin.ch] has joined #lisp 14:56:21 kushal [~kdas@114.143.167.103] has joined #lisp 14:56:21 -!- kushal [~kdas@114.143.167.103] has quit [Changing host] 14:56:21 kushal [~kdas@fedora/kushal] has joined #lisp 14:56:44 hi, what's the current way of using postgres? I tried clsql installed by quicklisp, then (clsql-sys:connect ...) and (clsql-user:query ....) which results in Error POSTGRESQL-FATAL-ERROR / Received garbled message from backend 14:57:24 clsql-postgresql-socket to be specific 14:57:40 -!- scode [~scode@hyperion.scode.org] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 14:57:44 puchacz: I am pretty sure that bug is fixed upstream 14:57:55 utf-8 strikes again? 14:58:10 huh? 14:58:30 no someone made a minor change to the protocol and it wrote an extra null byte somewhere... I fixed it, but probably hasnt filtered into quicklisp quite yet 14:58:44 got a patch? 14:58:44 http://marijnhaverbeke.nl/postmodern/ is pretty good for postgresql 14:59:14 I would stick to clsql, as I used it before 14:59:24 *maxm* is guessing above problem is due to socket to communicate with positfix having wrong output format set 14:59:29 ah 14:59:37 puchacz: git://git.b9.com/clsql.git (but postmodern is pretty cool too) 14:59:48 thx 14:59:55 -!- H4ns [~user@p4FFC91DD.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 15:00:15 kpreid [~kpreid@128.153.178.203] has joined #lisp 15:01:08 puchacz: if you still have issues please report them to the bug list. Also that version of clsql has a second postgres socket backend based on cl-postgres (the backend of postmodern) so you can have your cake and eat it too (cl-postgresql-socket3) 15:01:28 oki, cheers 15:02:14 scode [~scode@hyperion.scode.org] has joined #lisp 15:02:55 OODavo_ [~david@ppp121-44-234-212.lns20.syd7.internode.on.net] has joined #lisp 15:03:04 -!- Mococa [~Mococa@177.16.255.118] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 15:03:07 -!- OODavo [~david@ppp121-44-234-212.lns20.syd7.internode.on.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 15:03:07 does postmodern use pooled connections? 15:03:23 it has an option to pool connections 15:03:29 -!- Kajtek [~nope@nat4-230.ghnet.pl] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 15:03:31 -!- xyxu [~xyxu@222.68.167.143] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 15:04:12 puchacz: clsql can do its own connection pooling reguardless of what the backend does 15:04:31 ok 15:05:22 I found pooling in postmodern manual: connect (database user password host &key (port 5432) pooled-p use-ssl) 15:05:37 but I can't find if this connection can be used across threads 15:05:41 can it? 15:06:20 puchacz: did you read documentation? 15:07:37 no, just starting 15:07:51 Kajtek [~nope@nat4-230.ghnet.pl] has joined #lisp 15:08:23 word "thread" not found 15:08:33 not found where? 15:08:34 puchacz: in general do not share connections across threads (one connection being used in two threads is pretty much always gonna cause trouble) 15:09:09 Not sharing anything between threads is also a good idea. :) 15:09:12 -!- urandom__ [~user@p548A54CD.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 15:09:14 Then you can use processes. 15:09:19 silenius [~silenius@p4FFC87E8.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #lisp 15:09:35 gravicappa [~gravicapp@ppp91-77-178-21.pppoe.mtu-net.ru] has joined #lisp 15:09:48 puchacz: at least not at the same time - if you release to a pool in one thread - another should be able to get it from the pool and use it without trouble 15:10:13 -!- jiacobucci [~jiacobucc@gw-asdl.ae.gatech.edu] has left #lisp 15:10:20 ok, thanks 15:10:21 jiacobucci [~jiacobucc@gw-asdl.ae.gatech.edu] has joined #lisp 15:10:44 Does anyone here use SDL or similar with common lisp? 15:10:57 I will use connect/disconnect :pool t with unwind-protect 15:11:28 EClaesson: i don't, personally, but i know several do via lispbuilder-sdl. 15:11:35 EClaesson: #lispgames might know more 15:12:09 -!- cfy [~cfy@unaffiliated/chenfengyuan] has quit [Quit: bye all] 15:12:13 H4ns [~user@p4FFC91DD.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #lisp 15:12:16 puchacz: if in clsql there is a with-database macro that does this for you 15:12:29 puchacz: you really should read the documentation. (there is postmodern:with-connection and postmodern:call-with-connection) 15:16:27 Mococa [~Mococa@177.16.255.118] has joined #lisp 15:16:31 Xach: Could you announce at the Planet Lisp Lisp Meeting calendar a Lisp meeting in Hamburg, tomorrow evening at 19:00 at the Ristorante Marilú? 15:20:49 benkard [~benkard@mnch-4d04cc66.pool.mediaWays.net] has joined #lisp 15:20:54 -!- spradnyesh [~pradyus@nat/yahoo/x-rwlarekuqzlgluew] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 15:23:07 ok, i did tht 15:23:13 -!- mathrick [~mathrick@85.218.136.127] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 15:26:28 -!- scharan [~scharan@169.235.25.47] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 15:27:46 Vivitron [~user@pool-108-7-56-243.bstnma.fios.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 15:28:39 -!- e-user [~e-user@nat/nokia/x-xidzuavkkzawblbf] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 15:30:13 naeg [~naeg@194.208.239.170] has joined #lisp 15:30:36 -!- Joreji [~thomas@64-073.eduroam.RWTH-Aachen.DE] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 15:34:23 Joreji [~thomas@64-073.eduroam.RWTH-Aachen.DE] has joined #lisp 15:36:06 Phoodus [~foo@68.107.217.139] has joined #lisp 15:36:06 mathrick [~mathrick@85.218.136.127] has joined #lisp 15:37:06 Does anyone know how to reach pdn? 15:38:49 What is pdn? 15:40:09 Spion_ [~spion@unaffiliated/spion] has joined #lisp 15:40:10 -!- jdz [~jdz@193.206.22.97] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 15:41:18 algal [~anonymous@78-86-30-77.zone2.bethere.co.uk] has joined #lisp 15:41:22 -!- scrimohsin [~cmsimon@unaffiliated/scrimohsin] has left #lisp 15:42:57 Xach: in buildapp, when passing a system to load that depends on clsql-odbc, It seems it can't find the clsql_uffi.dll. Is there a way to make buildapp aware of this? 15:43:25 Xach: thanks! 15:43:32 -!- Spion [~spion@unaffiliated/spion] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 15:43:38 Kenjin: Is it in your PATH? 15:44:28 Xach: it seems it's not 15:45:05 Xach: wouldn't being in the --asdf-tree supplied path be enough? 15:45:06 -!- Modius [~Modius@cpe-70-123-140-183.austin.res.rr.com] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 15:45:21 nikodemus [~nikodemus@cs181056239.pp.htv.fi] has joined #lisp 15:46:44 Xach: I see it in the calendar, but it is not in the list on the right of the front page of Planet Lisp. Is there some cache? 15:46:57 -!- misoczki [~misoczki@2001:660:3013:3:222:19ff:fe24:d155] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 15:47:15 -!- dacoda [~user@gate.cdc.informatik.tu-darmstadt.de] has quit [Quit: ERC Version 5.3 (IRC client for Emacs)] 15:47:36 Xach: I believe that buildapp not finding the .dll is the cause for this error http://paste.lisp.org/display/124326#1 15:47:49 LiamH [~healy@vpn219118.nrl.navy.mil] has joined #lisp 15:49:19 -!- Mococa [~Mococa@177.16.255.118] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 15:49:54 serichsen: the front page is updated once per day 15:50:11 Kenjin: loading foreign libraries is not something managed by buildapp or asdf 15:50:19 Mococa [~Mococa@177.16.255.118] has joined #lisp 15:51:06 Zulu [~Zulu@c-174-58-204-235.hsd1.fl.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 15:51:12 -!- Amyn [~abennama@64.208.49.45] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 15:52:21 Xach: what would be the proper way to get a system to load with buildapp that is dependent on clsql? 15:52:54 -!- kpreid [~kpreid@128.153.178.203] has quit [Quit: Offline] 15:52:57 Xach: would adding the .ddl dir to PATH do the trick? 15:54:25 Xach: seems not. I've added it and the compile error remains 15:56:42 jfleming: I might take a stab at least reading the FLAC metadata (non-FFI) stuff sometime in the next week or so 15:56:45 -!- benkard [~benkard@mnch-4d04cc66.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit [Quit: benkard] 15:58:30 kpreid [~kpreid@128.153.178.203] has joined #lisp 15:59:03 Xach: I've also tried passing to --eval some code to have the clsql:*foreign-library-search-paths* contain the .dll dir, but the error remains. Or it doesn't work this way or I'm doing something wrong 16:00:01 I don't know, sorry. I don't think buildapp is particularly relevant. 16:00:07 music/mp3s seems to be the most often area lispers wanna write software in 16:00:23 if any of you are experts on audio processing /me needs some pointers 16:00:46 benkard [~benkard@mnch-4d04cc66.pool.mediaWays.net] has joined #lisp 16:00:53 Xach: the system in case loads fine with quicklisp 16:01:15 -!- pnq [~nick@AC81F452.ipt.aol.com] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 16:01:41 Xach: with all dependecies, including clsql-uffi 16:01:52 -!- Bike1 [~Glossina@69.166.35.233] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 16:04:21 oconnore [~Eric@75-150-66-254-NewEngland.hfc.comcastbusiness.net] has joined #lisp 16:05:00 -!- OODavo_ [~david@ppp121-44-234-212.lns20.syd7.internode.on.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 16:05:54 OODavo [~david@ppp121-44-234-212.lns20.syd7.internode.on.net] has joined #lisp 16:06:49 quasisane [~sanep@c-76-24-80-97.hsd1.nh.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 16:07:59 -!- ignas [~ignas@212.180.202.114] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 16:09:06 oudeis [~oudeis@2.54.254.131] has joined #lisp 16:09:16 oconnore1 [~Eric@75-150-66-254-NewEngland.hfc.comcastbusiness.net] has joined #lisp 16:10:04 Bike1 [~Glossina@69.166.35.235] has joined #lisp 16:10:19 ISF [~ivan@143.106.196.206] has joined #lisp 16:11:12 -!- oconnore [~Eric@75-150-66-254-NewEngland.hfc.comcastbusiness.net] has quit [Disconnected by services] 16:11:19 -!- oconnore1 is now known as oconnore 16:12:35 -!- naeg [~naeg@194.208.239.170] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 16:14:35 -!- mvilleneuve [~mvilleneu@LLagny-156-36-4-214.w80-14.abo.wanadoo.fr] has quit [Quit: Lost terminal] 16:16:54 -!- kpreid [~kpreid@128.153.178.203] has quit [Quit: Offline] 16:18:36 -!- ISF [~ivan@143.106.196.206] has quit [Quit: WeeChat 0.3.5] 16:18:53 ISF [~ivan@143.106.196.206] has joined #lisp 16:18:54 -!- Mococa [~Mococa@177.16.255.118] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 16:19:17 altsrid [~altsrid@remote.activestate.com] has joined #lisp 16:21:39 Is it common praxis to write lisp-code in upper-case or lower-case? 16:21:49 tritchey [~tritchey@70-35-37-146.static.wiline.com] has joined #lisp 16:22:27 lower 16:22:39 Ok, thanks fe[nl]ix 16:24:03 kpreid [~kpreid@128.153.178.203] has joined #lisp 16:25:30 blb [~blb@c-24-1-36-10.hsd1.il.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 16:27:59 -!- abeaumont [~abeaumont@90.165.165.246] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 16:29:38 -!- theBlackDragon [~dragon@213.219.142.186.adsl.dyn.edpnet.net] has quit [Quit: ...boom!] 16:29:53 -!- Bike1 [~Glossina@69.166.35.235] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 16:29:57 Bike1 [~Glossina@69.166.35.235] has joined #lisp 16:30:52 SegFaultAX [~mkbernard@VEROXITY.ipcolo1.SanFrancisco1.Level3.net] has joined #lisp 16:35:19 jdz [~jdz@host248-105-dynamic.4-87-r.retail.telecomitalia.it] has joined #lisp 16:35:28 -!- BlankVerse [~pankajm@202.3.77.219] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 16:35:52 should i put a defun's end ) on a line of it's own, or after the functions last line? 16:36:20 (defun like-this (arg) 16:36:26 we stack closing parens at the end of the relevant sexp. 16:36:31 <_schulte_> don't ever put ")"s on lines by themselves 16:36:31 ..wow fail. Put it on the last exp 16:37:09 -!- ehu [~ehuels@109.32.131.21] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 16:40:15 jewel_ [~jewel@196-215-88-11.dynamic.isadsl.co.za] has joined #lisp 16:41:13 <_schulte_> also, hopefully your editor can take care of closing parenthesis for you, e.g., paredit-mode for Emacs 16:41:20 *Phoodus* has lone )'s only when in the middle of editing, if he knows he's going to add more within that scope 16:41:34 -!- oudeis [~oudeis@2.54.254.131] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 16:42:03 Xach: pdn is a guy who helped me out some time ago and wanted to see the result 16:42:59 -!- Bike1 [~Glossina@69.166.35.235] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 16:44:09 sellout [~Adium@c-98-245-161-7.hsd1.co.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 16:45:52 Bike1 [~Glossina@69.166.35.235] has joined #lisp 16:47:24 ngz [~user@171.203.70.86.rev.sfr.net] has joined #lisp 16:48:08 kslt1 [~karl.sier@netblock-208-127-156-174.dslextreme.com] has joined #lisp 16:49:11 gkeith_lt [~georgekei@nat/google/x-yaoudpdhfycbinrt] has joined #lisp 16:50:52 abeaumont [~abeaumont@90.165.165.246] has joined #lisp 16:51:50 jtza8 [~jtza8@wbs-196-2-106-72.wbs.co.za] has joined #lisp 16:52:13 *sykopomp* wonders if there's a lisp library with a url-encode function. 16:53:04 loke [~elias@bb115-66-85-121.singnet.com.sg] has joined #lisp 16:53:14 *Xach* wishes he finished the Quicklisp dist-wide offline symbol apropos to answer that easily for sykopomp :( 16:53:40 *sykopomp* needs to use apropos more. 16:53:44 sykopomp: I think the last time I searched for one, I ended up plucking it out of Hunchentoot. 16:53:47 zs3 wins this round. 16:54:46 I guess zs3 plucked it from drakma, which plucked it from ht 16:54:49 (or vice versa?) 16:55:10 I might have got it from Drakma. 16:55:16 Xach: Are there any cases when UPDATE-CLIENT and UPDATE-ALL-DISTS does not go hand-in and? (in other words, every time one has been updated, the other one seems to be updated too). So wouldn't it make sense to just have a QL:UPDATE-EVERYTHING ? 16:55:46 loke: They are not at all updated on the same schedule. 16:55:54 loke: I update the dists regularly and the client very irregularly. 16:56:22 -!- nikodemus [~nikodemus@cs181056239.pp.htv.fi] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 16:57:25 I see 16:57:32 waaaaargh [~waaaaargh@agsb-5d87e33e.pool.mediaWays.net] has joined #lisp 16:58:04 -!- blb [~blb@c-24-1-36-10.hsd1.il.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 16:58:09 -!- xan_ [~xan@227-236.62-188.cust.bluewin.ch] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 16:58:53 *Xach* updating the dist today, in fact 16:58:54 -!- algal [~anonymous@78-86-30-77.zone2.bethere.co.uk] has quit [Quit: algal] 16:58:55 sykopomp: Oh, Hunchentoot actually exports url-encode. I copied alist-to-url-encoded-string from Drakma. 16:59:42 ah 17:00:08 <_8david> Dear Lazyweb -- which cool CL library can write bitmaps (e.g. from gif or png, tranparency support matters) to old-style SWF files (for the old AVM1 virtual machine)? 17:00:08 argh. what was the QL command to show all availavel packages? 17:00:52 ah. SYSTEM-LIST. Why does QL have so many exported symbols... 17:00:58 <_3b> 3b-swf could probably be convinced to do so, not sure it qualifies as 'cool' yet though 17:01:28 If i have a (defvar *a-global-var (list ..... )) alone in a lisp-file, and i load that file in another file using (load "thefile.lisp"), why can't i access the variable defined in the first file? 17:02:11 EClaesson: sounds like you're not describing the situation fully. What did you try, what happened? 17:02:39 -!- abeaumont [~abeaumont@90.165.165.246] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 17:04:06 i have (defvar *globalvar* (list :a 1 :b 2 :c 3)) in a.lisp. I do (load "a.lisp") in b.lisp. But i can't do (getf *globalvar* :a) in b.lisp as it can't find *globalvar* 17:04:23 EClaesson: make sure you're both defining and using the variable in the correct package 17:04:34 EClaesson: GETF is not doing what you think it does 17:04:38 EClaesson: try ASSOC 17:05:44 I want to parse a float from a string - can i use READ-FROM-STRING or is there any other preferred way? 17:06:07 abeaumont [~abeaumont@90.165.165.246] has joined #lisp 17:06:28 <_8david> churib_: the PARSE-NUMBER library 17:06:31 <_3b> if you are sure it only contains a float, you can use read-from-string, don't use it for untrusted input though 17:07:29 loke: why assoc? 17:07:39 thanks _8david and _3b 17:08:09 austinh: you're right. ASSOC wouldn't be usable there. He'd have to change the layout of the list. 17:08:57 What's wrong with getf there? 17:09:10 -!- Bike1 is now known as Bike 17:09:25 nothing 17:09:43 rpg [~rpg@mpls.sift.info] has joined #lisp 17:10:08 oops. sorry. My bad. Ignore what I said 17:10:27 gffa [~gffa@unaffiliated/gffa] has joined #lisp 17:11:54 EClaesson: i still think you are not describing the situation fully. 17:12:01 EClaesson: in a very simple test-case with 2 files "a.lisp" and "b.lisp" your example works for me... 17:12:16 EClaesson: paste files, session to paste.lisp.org, perhaps? 17:14:25 For example, you might not be loading the file like you think you are, or you might have a typo, or something else. 17:14:35 bfein [~bfein@ita4fw1.itasoftware.com] has joined #lisp 17:17:09 *Xach* updates dist 17:18:39 Qworkescence [~quad@unaffiliated/quadrescence] has joined #lisp 17:19:15 kleppari_ [~spa@bitbucket.is] has joined #lisp 17:20:42 Kaid [~Kaid@123.149.197.134] has joined #lisp 17:24:31 -!- Astrology [~chris@122.237.37.192] has quit [Quit: WeeChat 0.3.4] 17:25:24 oudeis [~oudeis@89-139-150-123.bb.netvision.net.il] has joined #lisp 17:25:56 BlankVerse [~pankajm@202.3.77.209] has joined #lisp 17:26:35 -!- EClaesson [~EClaesson@c-0f89e555.013-19-6c6b7013.cust.bredbandsbolaget.se] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 17:26:59 theBlackDragon [~dragon@213.219.142.186.adsl.dyn.edpnet.net] has joined #lisp 17:27:36 -!- rpg [~rpg@mpls.sift.info] has quit [Quit: Linkinus is updating...] 17:27:42 -!- Bike [~Glossina@69.166.35.235] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 17:27:54 <_3b> _8david: https://github.com/3b/3bil/blob/master/file/3b-swf-write.lisp#L617 is an example of bulding a 32bit RGBA tag, i think it should work for flash 3+ (assuming the rest of the file is valid for the same versions) 17:27:59 Bike [~Glossina@69.166.35.235] has joined #lisp 17:28:01 rpg [~rpg@mpls.sift.info] has joined #lisp 17:28:35 EClaesson [~EClaesson@c-0f89e555.013-19-6c6b7013.cust.bredbandsbolaget.se] has joined #lisp 17:31:38 -!- rpg [~rpg@mpls.sift.info] has quit [Client Quit] 17:32:46 Tristam [~Tristam@cpe-72-226-124-205.nycap.res.rr.com] has joined #lisp 17:33:36 rpg [~rpg@mpls.sift.info] has joined #lisp 17:33:50 <_8david> _3b: thank you 17:34:41 -!- rpg [~rpg@mpls.sift.info] has quit [Read error: No route to host] 17:38:09 -!- ISF [~ivan@143.106.196.206] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 17:38:45 rpg [~rpg@mpls.sift.info] has joined #lisp 17:39:28 HG` [~HG@p5DC058EE.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #lisp 17:40:05 -!- Bike [~Glossina@69.166.35.235] has left #lisp 17:41:12 -!- LiamH [~healy@vpn219118.nrl.navy.mil] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 17:50:17 *Xach* hopes nothing broke in this update 17:50:41 -!- SegFaultAX [~mkbernard@VEROXITY.ipcolo1.SanFrancisco1.Level3.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 17:51:21 -!- lnostdal_ [~lnostdal@ti0030a380-dhcp0111.bb.online.no] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 17:52:16 -!- BlankVerse [~pankajm@202.3.77.209] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 17:53:12 -!- waaaaargh [~waaaaargh@agsb-5d87e33e.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 17:53:36 -!- kpreid [~kpreid@128.153.178.203] has quit [Quit: Offline] 17:55:56 when setting the value of various places via setf, is it more common to use multiple setf's, or a single one with multiple 'place value' pairs? 17:56:07 -!- puchacz [~puchacz@87-194-5-99.bethere.co.uk] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 17:56:17 *_3b* does both 17:56:41 <_3b> not sure if i have any particular reason for choosing either in a particular case or not 17:56:56 -!- benny [~benny@i577A8A92.versanet.de] has quit [Quit: rcirc on GNU Emacs 23.3.1] 17:57:07 Okay so 'whatever looks best'? 17:57:29 Zulu, If they are sufficiently related i would use a singe setf 17:57:35 -!- dl [~user@chpcwl01.hpc.unm.edu] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 17:57:48 but that's just me 17:57:53 -!- rpg [~rpg@mpls.sift.info] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 17:58:18 Zulu: i find multiple pairs a little harder to read, but i do use it from time to time. 17:58:30 Zulu: sometimes i use them to avoid adding a progn to an if, which is not a great reason. 18:00:22 Xach: Yes I've found myself doing that [avoiding progn] in a few places myself 18:00:29 Thanks _3b, pavelludiq and Xach 18:00:29 fmeyer [~fmeyer@187.38.98.102] has joined #lisp 18:00:45 benny [~benny@i577A8A92.versanet.de] has joined #lisp 18:01:08 kpreid [~kpreid@128.153.178.203] has joined #lisp 18:03:49 naeg [~naeg@194.208.239.170] has joined #lisp 18:05:04 -!- sdemarre [~serge@91.176.86.170] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 18:08:39 sdemarre [~serge@91.176.86.170] has joined #lisp 18:09:13 -!- hohum [~dcorbe@apollo.corbe.net] has quit [Quit: Lost terminal] 18:11:49 -!- lolsuper_ [~super_@unaffiliated/lolsuper-/x-9881387] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 18:17:24 -!- trigen [~MSX@ec2-46-51-179-218.eu-west-1.compute.amazonaws.com] has left #lisp 18:17:26 trigen [~MSX@ec2-46-51-179-218.eu-west-1.compute.amazonaws.com] has joined #lisp 18:18:02 nicdev_ [~user@static-72-74-85-37.bstnma.fios.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 18:20:43 -!- attila_lendvai [~attila_le@unaffiliated/attila-lendvai/x-3126965] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 18:23:18 Xach: My connection died. Here are my code: http://paste.lisp.org/display/124354 http://paste.lisp.org/display/124354 settings.lisp is in a folder called data. The folder data lies in the folder where game.lisp are 18:29:08 <_3b> EClaesson: are you sure you want defvar there? and are you reading that in the correct package? 18:30:16 why not defvar? and i dont declare any packages, unless folders are 18:30:48 <_3b> defvar doesn't do anything if the variable already exists and has a value 18:31:15 are there any similar that forces it so set its value? 18:31:22 <_3b> defparameter 18:31:46 -!- mon_key [~user@unaffiliated/monkey/x-267253] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 18:32:01 mon_key [~user@unaffiliated/monkey/x-267253] has joined #lisp 18:32:03 <_3b> and if you aren't using defpackage and in-package anywhere, you should probably read up on CL some more :/ 18:33:10 EClaesson: People don't usually use LOAD in source files to bring in global variables the way you are attempting. That looks like C. 18:33:57 -!- REPLeffect [~REPLeffec@69.54.115.254] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 18:33:59 *_3b* interpreted it more as a config file than a source file, in which case it doesn't seem unreasonable 18:34:05 SegFaultAX [~mkbernard@173.228.45.162] has joined #lisp 18:34:19 -!- jewel_ [~jewel@196-215-88-11.dynamic.isadsl.co.za] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 18:34:50 austinh: Yep, i'm probably very c-damaged 18:35:05 _3b: I see what you mean. 18:35:24 Yes, i meant to use it purely as a config-file 18:35:33 or should i do it elseway? 18:35:41 anoyne of you have a running auctex with display etc... ? 18:37:10 -!- jiacobucci [~jiacobucc@gw-asdl.ae.gatech.edu] has left #lisp 18:37:28 wbooze: you may get better answers in #emacs 18:39:13 -!- silenius [~silenius@p4FFC87E8.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 18:41:22 EClaesson: It sounds like you need to read up on packages, and maybe systems, too. To answer your question, if I was making a config file that is external to my source code, I'd probably want it to be something like an alist or plist that I read in and parse. 18:41:53 jiacobucci [~jiacobucc@gw-asdl.ae.gatech.edu] has joined #lisp 18:44:28 algal [~anonymous@78-86-30-77.zone2.bethere.co.uk] has joined #lisp 18:47:01 REPLeffect [~REPLeffec@69.54.115.254] has joined #lisp 18:48:27 -!- ecraven [~user@140.78.42.213] has quit [Quit: brb] 18:49:28 Bike [~Glossina@69.166.35.233] has joined #lisp 18:49:49 EClaesson: If I was you, I'd start by creating a system definition and package and put your (defparameter *settings* ...) in a file called specials, and specify that it is loaded before code where it is needed. 18:50:29 Later, you set it up to populate *settings* at run-time, by loading the data from an external config file. 18:52:33 -!- naeg [~naeg@194.208.239.170] has quit [Quit: WeeChat 0.3.5] 18:53:12 -!- kpreid [~kpreid@128.153.178.203] has quit [Quit: Offline] 18:53:23 EClaesson: Xach's quickproject is a great way to get a project started with an initial system, package, and files. 18:55:18 austinh: Thanks, i'll take a look at that 18:55:48 style-warning: :HEIGHT is not a known argument keyword. <--- Should i care about that? 18:57:26 yes 18:58:03 :height is a param the function takes, or is it perhaps a syntax error of any other kind? 18:58:42 EClaesson: http://paste.lisp.org/new/lisp 18:59:01 paste your code there and it'll be easier to say exactly what's wrong 19:01:00 http://paste.lisp.org/display/124358 19:01:37 ecraven [~user@140.78.42.213] has joined #lisp 19:02:58 EClaesson: If this is Lispbuilder, the width and height are just the first two arguments, not keys 19:03:00 Is height a keyword argument for that function? 19:03:18 Jasko [~tjasko@c-174-59-204-245.hsd1.pa.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 19:03:20 EClaesson: width and height aren't keyword arguments to that function 19:03:53 jasom, Bike: Aah, thanks. Misread the docs 19:04:36 If you're using Slime, it'd show you the arguments as you type. 19:05:26 Hexstream [~hexstream@modemcable075.97-200-24.mc.videotron.ca] has joined #lisp 19:05:33 -!- Jasko3 [~tjasko@209.74.44.225] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 19:08:37 -!- kleppari_ [~spa@bitbucket.is] has quit [Quit: leaving] 19:08:41 -!- Joreji [~thomas@64-073.eduroam.RWTH-Aachen.DE] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 19:09:27 Joreji [~thomas@64-073.eduroam.RWTH-Aachen.DE] has joined #lisp 19:09:44 -!- zort- [~eitan@bas1-toronto07-1176320600.dsl.bell.ca] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 19:12:24 Amadiro [~Amadiro@ti0021a380-dhcp3462.bb.online.no] has joined #lisp 19:13:14 mstevens [~mstevens@fsf/member/pdpc.active.mstevens] has joined #lisp 19:14:30 -!- billstclair is now known as wws 19:14:32 -!- kushal [~kdas@fedora/kushal] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 19:14:43 back 19:14:48 back 19:15:09 -!- EyesIsMine [~eyes@unaffiliated/eyesismine] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 19:15:10 back 19:16:28 waaaaargh [~waaaaargh@agsb-5d87e33e.pool.mediaWays.net] has joined #lisp 19:17:24 rolando` [~user@71.60.108.93.rev.vodafone.pt] has joined #lisp 19:19:46 kpreid [~kpreid@128.153.178.203] has joined #lisp 19:24:14 What are you driving off? 19:24:30 -!- kpreid [~kpreid@128.153.178.203] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 19:28:58 Is there a way to get format to print out a floating point value always without an exponent (short of doing something like ~1000F and stripping off all the spaces at the beginning) 19:32:09 -!- oconnore [~Eric@75-150-66-254-NewEngland.hfc.comcastbusiness.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 19:32:48 oconnore [~Eric@75-150-66-254-NewEngland.hfc.comcastbusiness.net] has joined #lisp 19:36:58 <_3b> does ~f not do that? 19:38:06 <_3b> ah, i guess it doesn't have to for more than 100 digits 19:42:17 gonzojive [~gonzojive@178-83-238-199.dynamic.hispeed.ch] has joined #lisp 19:42:41 haha, I'm at a lispy meeting in vienna and we have come up with a fun sbcl contrib for nikodemus to do if he has too much money (: 19:44:18 sodel [~dralston@S0106687f74a12729.va.shawcable.net] has joined #lisp 19:44:20 And what's that? 19:45:46 sb-lockdown - a contrib that lets you lock down a lisp image against malicious redefinition of stuff 19:48:31 Ah. I've been thinking of a similar mechanism but for the purposes of efficiency rather than safety. For example, a function defined via defun could be declared to be 'static' to avoid dynamic lookup of the symbol's function-value when making a call to it, and instead produce a direct inline call 19:48:48 Though I am not familiar with SBCL internals on any level. Maybe some sort of mechanism like this already exists. 19:49:23 Zulu: What about (declaim inline my-function)? 19:49:39 Zulu: Richard Gabriel's goodnew/badnews article actually calls out redefinability of defun forms as possibly excessive dynamicism 19:49:47 I mean, (declaim (inline my-function)) 19:51:19 Hexstream: That's a good point, I'll have to look at how inline declarations interact with redefenitions 19:51:26 redefinitions* 19:51:44 algal: Would you mind linking me that article? Sounds interesting 19:51:48 edgar-rft [~user@HSI-KBW-109-192-059-240.hsi6.kabel-badenwuerttemberg.de] has joined #lisp 19:53:23 <_3b> inline isn't quite the same thing, you don't really want that for large functions called in lots of places, but still might want a more efficient calling convention 19:53:31 -!- gko [~gko@220-135-201-90.HINET-IP.hinet.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 19:53:34 Zulu: http://dreamsongs.com/Files/LispGoodNewsBadNews.pdf and page 16 has the example 19:53:46 Zulu: An inlined function acts a bit like a macro with respect to redefinition: you have to recompile all the code that used the inlined function or macro. 19:53:49 It's a classic article. 19:54:13 *_3b* has considered inlining a function that calls a lower-level version of the function in cases like that though 19:54:40 Right, maybe (declaim (static my-function)) could be useful. 19:54:42 Gabriel asks "Some aspects of the extreme dynamism of Common Lisp should be reexamined, or at least the 19:54:42 tradeoffs reconsidered. For example, how often does a real program do this?" and then gives the example of redefining a top-level defun form within a dotimes loop. 19:55:31 manuel_ [~manuel@pD9FDD263.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #lisp 19:56:32 -!- Kenjin [~josesanto@bl5-138-98.dsl.telepac.pt] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 19:56:32 <_3b> some of that is already allowed for function calls within a file though (or maybe within a compilation unit) 19:56:55 _3b: Yes, the inline expansion of large functions is an issue that wouldn't arise in a 'static' definition. 19:57:11 dskang [~user@unaffiliated/dskang] has joined #lisp 19:57:23 Kenjin [~josesanto@bl5-138-98.dsl.telepac.pt] has joined #lisp 19:57:24 algal: Yes I see, thank you for the article 19:58:18 Zulu: np. poignant to consider it's in a section titled "The Next Lisp" 19:59:23 -!- Tristam [~Tristam@cpe-72-226-124-205.nycap.res.rr.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 20:02:32 kami` [~user@unaffiliated/kami-] has joined #lisp 20:03:01 ehu [~ehuels@ip118-64-212-87.adsl2.static.versatel.nl] has joined #lisp 20:03:03 -!- dskang [~user@unaffiliated/dskang] has left #lisp 20:03:53 -!- Kaid [~Kaid@123.149.197.134] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 20:04:55 -!- kami [~user@unaffiliated/kami-] has quit [Ping timeout: 268 seconds] 20:05:11 lakatos [~lakatos@83.166.210.157] has joined #lisp 20:06:10 attila_lendvai [~attila_le@adsl-89-135-203-31.monradsl.monornet.hu] has joined #lisp 20:06:10 -!- attila_lendvai [~attila_le@adsl-89-135-203-31.monradsl.monornet.hu] has quit [Changing host] 20:06:10 attila_lendvai [~attila_le@unaffiliated/attila-lendvai/x-3126965] has joined #lisp 20:06:20 Hey Attila 20:08:12 -!- joast [~rick@76.178.178.72] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 20:08:51 ASau [~user@93-80-104-193.broadband.corbina.ru] has joined #lisp 20:09:56 -!- _schulte_ [~eschulte@c-174-56-1-147.hsd1.nm.comcast.net] has left #lisp 20:13:36 -!- kwertii [~kwertii@ResNet-33-19.resnet.ucsb.edu] has quit [Quit: bye] 20:15:28 -!- gemelen [~shelta@shpd-92-101-144-119.vologda.ru] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 20:17:49 -!- Bike [~Glossina@69.166.35.233] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 20:19:17 -!- manuel_ [~manuel@pD9FDD263.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Quit: manuel_] 20:21:34 I noticed that QL:QUICKLOAD seems to ignore the keyword arguments :verbose and :explain. Does anyone know if there is a reason for this except that they just haven't been implemented yet? 20:22:19 :verbose definitely works in the version I have 20:23:43 austinh: meaning that :verbose nil suppresses its output? 20:24:17 austinh: right now I'm redirecting stdout and stderr to temporary broadcast streams, so I can shut it up to get a clean output. 20:25:34 I don't think verbose does what you want, since nil is the default. 20:27:46 Bike [~Glossina@69.166.35.201] has joined #lisp 20:28:56 austinh: ah, you're right. I was looking at the default keyword value on slime-describe-symbol for QL:QUICKLOAD, but I guess what matters is the value of QL:*QUICKLOAD-VERBOSE*. Right? 20:29:39 joast [~rick@76.178.187.139] has joined #lisp 20:29:44 -!- sdemarre [~serge@91.176.86.170] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 20:29:54 Or am I misinterpreting the significance of "&KEY (:VERBOSE T) etc.." in the slime help on QL:QUICKLOAD? 20:30:09 I don't know anything about that. I just know that :verbose t means that it will show the details of each package as it is compiled, which is very necessary when loading your own WIP. 20:30:14 -!- kslt1 [~karl.sier@netblock-208-127-156-174.dslextreme.com] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 20:30:22 zmv [~daniel@c95334de.virtua.com.br] has joined #lisp 20:31:44 There may be a newer version of Quicklisp that uses :verbose t as the default. Mine doesn't. 20:31:53 -!- Hexstream [~hexstream@modemcable075.97-200-24.mc.videotron.ca] has left #lisp 20:32:01 -!- Bike [~Glossina@69.166.35.201] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 20:32:40 -!- jdz [~jdz@host248-105-dynamic.4-87-r.retail.telecomitalia.it] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 20:33:02 austinh: ok. 20:35:49 kpreid [~kpreid@128.153.178.203] has joined #lisp 20:36:00 austinh: I thought :verbose t was the default from slime help on the function, but I can see now from experimenting that :verbose t is producing more output than :verbose nil, so :verbose nil must have been the default all along. So I must have misinterpreted the slime help. 20:36:39 Bike [~Glossina@69.166.35.237] has joined #lisp 20:36:48 _3b: ~f is actually worse than "not more than 100 digits" it's "if d and w are both emitted, works just like prin1" 20:38:18 <_3b> jasom: that isn't how i read it 20:38:32 If both w and d are omitted, then the effect is to print the value using ordinary free-format output; prin1 uses this format for any number whose magnitude is either zero or between 10^-3 (inclusive) and 10^7 (exclusive). 20:38:47 oh you're right I misread it 20:38:50 -!- mstevens [~mstevens@fsf/member/pdpc.active.mstevens] has quit [Quit: leaving] 20:40:10 nevertheless clozure does: 1.23456E-8 with ~F 20:41:08 *_3b* wonders if "free-format" is defined anywhere 20:41:10 sbcl does what I was expecting; this may be a bug in clozure 20:41:44 <_3b> the "more than 100 digits" part in th enext paragraph implies it is 20:41:54 yeah 20:48:31 Evious [~n_a@s64-180-62-209.bc.hsia.telus.net] has joined #lisp 20:50:30 silenius [~silenius@p4FFC87E8.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #lisp 20:54:17 How do I quote an atom programmatically? Turn a foo into 'foo. 20:54:17 mishoo_ [~mishoo@79.112.115.118] has joined #lisp 20:54:34 <_3b> you don't? 20:54:39 Is 'foo syntax sugar for (quote foo)? 20:54:57 What are you trying to do, here? 20:54:59 <_3b> 'foo reads as (quote foo) which evaluates to foo 20:55:25 Bike, learn :) 20:55:59 Well, at runtime you'd already have a symbol, probably 20:57:39 -!- mishoo__ [~mishoo@79.112.115.118] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 20:57:42 frhodes [~frhodes@75-173-66-9.albq.qwest.net] has joined #lisp 20:57:48 -!- frhodes [~frhodes@75-173-66-9.albq.qwest.net] has quit [Client Quit] 20:58:13 (defun quote-symbol (sym) (list 'quote sym)) 20:58:38 -!- oudeis [~oudeis@89-139-150-123.bb.netvision.net.il] has quit [Quit: This computer has gone to sleep] 20:59:56 -!- algal [~anonymous@78-86-30-77.zone2.bethere.co.uk] has quit [Quit: algal] 21:02:10 -!- SucklinPig is now known as MeanWeen 21:02:32 BlankVerse [~pankajm@202.3.77.219] has joined #lisp 21:03:08 -!- Athas [~athas@130.225.165.40] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 21:04:59 -!- gravicappa [~gravicapp@ppp91-77-178-21.pppoe.mtu-net.ru] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 21:06:17 _3b: from the CCL implementation of ~F: (if (not (or w d)) (prin1 number stream)) 21:09:03 _3b: it completely ignores all options, including the scaling parameter :( 21:09:32 -!- sodel [~dralston@S0106687f74a12729.va.shawcable.net] has quit [Quit: leaving] 21:10:46 -!- mishoo_ [~mishoo@79.112.115.118] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 21:19:33 -!- BlankVerse [~pankajm@202.3.77.219] has quit [Quit: Lost terminal] 21:19:41 -!- rmarianski [~rmariansk@mail.marianski.com] has quit [Quit: leaving] 21:20:47 BlankVerse [~pankajm@202.3.77.219] has joined #lisp 21:21:21 -!- y3llow [~y3llow@111-240-173-247.dynamic.hinet.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 21:21:47 y3llow [~y3llow@111-240-173-247.dynamic.hinet.net] has joined #lisp 21:24:01 -!- ChibaPet [~mason@74.203.221.34] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 21:24:37 -!- 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[~frhodes@75-173-66-9.albq.qwest.net] has joined #lisp 22:21:22 -!- kpreid [~kpreid@128.153.178.203] has quit [Quit: Offline] 22:27:15 GrayMagiker [~Steve@c-68-35-43-203.hsd1.nm.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 22:27:58 RenJuan [~juan@cpe-72-228-177-92.buffalo.res.rr.com] has joined #lisp 22:31:22 -!- drdo [~drdo@91.205.108.93.rev.vodafone.pt] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 22:31:28 -!- frhodes [~frhodes@75-173-66-9.albq.qwest.net] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 22:31:40 drdo [~drdo@91.205.108.93.rev.vodafone.pt] has joined #lisp 22:37:39 -!- pnq [~nick@ACA2D45A.ipt.aol.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 22:39:14 kpreid [~kpreid@128.153.212.131] has joined #lisp 22:40:54 -!- Evious [~n_a@s64-180-62-209.bc.hsia.telus.net] has left #lisp 22:43:01 Mococa [~Mococa@187.114.164.25] has joined #lisp 22:43:53 bgs100 [~ian@unaffiliated/bgs100] has joined #lisp 22:45:51 -!- zmv [~daniel@c95334de.virtua.com.br] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 22:47:48 zmv [~daniel@c95334de.virtua.com.br] has joined #lisp 22:48:54 -!- Mococa [~Mococa@187.114.164.25] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 22:49:29 S11001001 [~sirian@c-98-216-247-191.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 22:50:18 Xach: Sorry for the long delay in responding. There is no canonical representation of a UUID. The idea with Unicly is that one _may_ opt to use strings, byte-arrays, bit-vectors, bignums etc. as/if applicable. IOW while the constituent parts of a UUID _may_ be represented by a 128 BIGNUM there is nothing requiring that one do so (we could use a structured tiddlywink if desired). 22:51:11 frhodes [~frhodes@75-173-66-9.albq.qwest.net] has joined #lisp 22:55:25 -!- S11001001 [~sirian@c-98-216-247-191.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has left #lisp 22:56:14 mon_key: the custom hash tables that only work on sbcl seem like a lose 22:57:17 -!- TeMPOraL [~user@cpc12-oxfd18-2-0-cust64.4-3.cable.virginmedia.com] has quit [Quit: Nyan nyan nyan!] 22:59:46 Xach: Yes, maybe at some point i need to spend more time investigating what other implementations do. 23:00:58 Xach: Was it at all clear why investigation UUID equality is a difficult endeavor? 23:04:31 No, it's a mess of almost unreadable gibberish to me. 23:04:41 Mococa [~Mococa@187.114.164.25] has joined #lisp 23:04:44 -!- MoALTz [~no@host-92-18-2-240.as13285.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 23:05:11 -!- ngz [~user@171.203.70.86.rev.sfr.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 23:05:17 MoALTz [~no@host-92-18-2-240.as13285.net] has joined #lisp 23:06:40 That is not good. 23:07:08 Sa[i]nT [~sabayonus@fl-67-235-178-42.dhcp.embarqhsd.net] has joined #lisp 23:09:13 -!- frhodes [~frhodes@75-173-66-9.albq.qwest.net] has quit [Quit: leaving] 23:09:19 frhodes [~frhodes@75-173-66-9.albq.qwest.net] has joined #lisp 23:10:15 -!- Joreji [~thomas@64-073.eduroam.RWTH-Aachen.DE] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 23:15:51 Amyn [~abennama@cac94-2-87-91-21-215.dsl.sta.abo.bbox.fr] has joined #lisp 23:21:50 H4ns` [~user@p4FFC91DD.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #lisp 23:23:06 Deathaholic [~Mococa@187.114.164.25] has joined #lisp 23:23:40 -!- H4ns [~user@p4FFC91DD.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 23:26:19 H4ns`` [~user@p4FFC906B.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #lisp 23:26:24 -!- Mococa [~Mococa@187.114.164.25] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 23:29:22 -!- araujo [~araujo@gentoo/developer/araujo] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 23:29:56 qsun [~Quan@eth123.nsw.adsl.internode.on.net] has joined #lisp 23:30:09 -!- H4ns` [~user@p4FFC91DD.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 23:32:29 sodel [~dralston@S0106687f74a12729.va.shawcable.net] has joined #lisp 23:35:07 -!- Sa[i]nT [~sabayonus@fl-67-235-178-42.dhcp.embarqhsd.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 23:36:51 -!- benkard [~benkard@mnch-4d04cc66.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit [Quit: benkard] 23:37:51 -!- mrSpec [~Spec@unaffiliated/mrspec] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 23:38:23 -!- Oddity [~Oddity@unaffiliated/oddity] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 23:38:55 -!- katesmith [~katesmith@unaffiliated/costume] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 23:43:46 nicdev [~nicdev@209-6-50-99.c3-0.smr-ubr1.sbo-smr.ma.cable.rcn.com] has joined #lisp 23:45:15 -!- tsuru [~user@c-68-53-57-241.hsd1.tn.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 23:46:13 -!- altsrid [~altsrid@remote.activestate.com] has quit [Quit: Computer has gone to sleep.] 23:51:37 pinterface1 [~pinterfac@173-20-55-85.client.mchsi.com] has joined #lisp 23:51:49 -!- juniorroy [~juniorroy@212.36.228.103] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 23:52:31 -!- pinterface [~pinterfac@173-20-55-85.client.mchsi.com] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 23:54:25 -!- anvandare [~anvandare@78-22-146-198.access.telenet.be] has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 23:54:32 Oddity [~Oddity@unaffiliated/oddity] has joined #lisp 23:55:14 McOmghall [~quassel@77.209.177.187] has joined #lisp 23:55:44 -!- pavelludiq [~pavelludi@87.246.58.193] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 23:55:46 mjonsson [~mjonsson@38.109.95.133] has joined #lisp 23:56:02 -!- jtza8 [~jtza8@wbs-196-2-106-72.wbs.co.za] has quit [Quit: leaving] 23:57:49 dnolen [~davidnole@pool-68-161-129-121.ny325.east.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 23:58:29 -!- oconnore [~Eric@75-150-66-254-NewEngland.hfc.comcastbusiness.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds]