00:02:40 cpc26 [cpc26@pilot.trilug.org] has joined #lisp 00:03:28 -!- tauntaun [~Crumpet@ool-44c711b3.dyn.optonline.net] has quit [Quit: Ex-Chat] 00:03:39 tauntaun [~Crumpet@ool-44c711b3.dyn.optonline.net] has joined #lisp 00:07:43 -!- vhost- [~kyle@robodance.kyleterry.com] has quit [Changing host] 00:07:43 vhost- [~kyle@unaffiliated/vhost-] has joined #lisp 00:09:32 Hun^23 [~Hunden@e180105044.adsl.alicedsl.de] has joined #lisp 00:11:45 -!- Mococa [~Mococa@189.115.187.118] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 00:13:21 -!- kunwon1 [~kunwon1@unaffiliated/kunwon1] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 00:13:28 -!- Hunden [~Hunden@e180105044.adsl.alicedsl.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 00:13:28 -!- Hun^23 is now known as Hunden 00:15:31 kunwon1 [~kunwon1@unaffiliated/kunwon1] has joined #lisp 00:15:46 -!- tychoish [~tychoish@foucault.cyborginstitute.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 00:16:34 -!- sabalaba [~sabalaba@75-101-62-95.dsl.static.sonic.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 00:16:38 tychoish [~tychoish@foucault.cyborginstitute.net] has joined #lisp 00:18:45 -!- fmu [UNKNOWN@unaffiliated/fmu] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 00:19:22 -!- loke [~elias@bb119-74-154-54.singnet.com.sg] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 00:19:23 -!- srid [~srid@unaffiliated/srid] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 00:22:13 fmu [UNKNOWN@unaffiliated/fmu] has joined #lisp 00:26:21 -!- seangrove [~user@c-98-248-33-169.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 00:28:59 -!- AntiSpamMeta [~MetaBot@unaffiliated/afterdeath/bot/antispambot] has quit [Excess Flood] 00:29:53 -!- ltriant [~ltriant@lithium.mailguard.com.au] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 00:30:49 xxxyyy [~xyxu@58.41.1.251] has joined #lisp 00:31:13 AntiSpamMeta [~MetaBot@unaffiliated/afterdeath/bot/antispambot] has joined #lisp 00:32:17 Mococa [~Mococa@189.115.187.118] has joined #lisp 00:32:40 -!- pislocide [~PC@ip72-213-141-195.ok.ok.cox.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 00:32:44 -!- lifechamp [~gary@71.242.21.95.dynamic.jazztel.es] has quit [Quit: lifechamp] 00:33:41 -!- OliverUv [~gandhi@195.159.235.178] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 00:34:18 Demosthenes [~demo@mb12536d0.tmodns.net] has joined #lisp 00:35:45 ltriant [~ltriant@lithium.mailguard.com.au] has joined #lisp 00:38:44 -!- mk2 [~user@cpc7-lewi14-2-0-cust39.2-4.cable.virginmedia.com] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 00:39:45 -!- Mococa [~Mococa@189.115.187.118] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 00:48:08 -!- iwillig [~iwillig@ool-18b945c3.dyn.optonline.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 00:50:05 Mococa [~Mococa@189.115.187.118] has joined #lisp 00:51:21 pizzledizzle [~pizdets@pool-98-113-194-183.nycmny.fios.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 00:53:08 -!- roblally [~roblally@roblally.plus.com] has quit [Quit: roblally] 00:59:24 neoesque [~neoesque@210.59.147.232] has joined #lisp 00:59:24 -!- ltriant [~ltriant@lithium.mailguard.com.au] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 01:00:02 -!- serichsen [~user@hmbg-5f764306.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit [Quit: Good night!] 01:00:18 ltriant [~ltriant@lithium.mailguard.com.au] has joined #lisp 01:01:08 -!- pnq [~nick@ACA2F681.ipt.aol.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 01:01:48 setmeaway [setmeaway3@118.45.149.131] has joined #lisp 01:06:12 -!- ramus [~ramus@adsl-108-68-169-203.dsl.chcgil.sbcglobal.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 01:06:17 -!- AntiSpamMeta [~MetaBot@unaffiliated/afterdeath/bot/antispambot] has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 01:08:20 -!- SegFaultAX [~mkbernard@VEROXITY.ipcolo1.SanFrancisco1.Level3.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 01:11:14 AntiSpamMeta [~MetaBot@unaffiliated/afterdeath/bot/antispambot] has joined #lisp 01:12:21 Penten [~user@114.255.149.182] has joined #lisp 01:13:58 dnolen [~davidnole@pool-68-161-137-73.ny325.east.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 01:15:06 -!- ikki [~ikki@201.155.92.12] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 01:15:50 ramus [~ramus@adsl-99-136-196-137.dsl.chcgil.sbcglobal.net] has joined #lisp 01:18:04 -!- dto [~dto@pool-96-252-62-25.bstnma.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 01:18:16 -!- xan_ [~xan@94.Red-193-152-140.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 01:18:20 -!- Demosthenes [~demo@mb12536d0.tmodns.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 01:23:15 dlowe [~dlowe@c-66-30-116-162.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 01:26:45 Demosthenes [~demo@72-255-11-240.client.stsn.net] has joined #lisp 01:30:56 -!- Mococa [~Mococa@189.115.187.118] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 01:31:53 Mococa [~Mococa@189.115.187.118] has joined #lisp 01:35:27 -!- araujo [~araujo@gentoo/developer/araujo] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 01:35:42 -!- hargettp [~hargettp@pool-71-174-132-222.bstnma.east.verizon.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving...] 01:40:08 didi` [~user@unaffiliated/didi/x-1022147] has joined #lisp 01:41:05 -!- dlowe [~dlowe@c-66-30-116-162.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: *poof*] 01:41:50 -!- didi [~user@unaffiliated/didi/x-1022147] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 01:41:57 -!- kushal [~kdas@fedora/kushal] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 01:43:19 -!- Jubb [~ghost@c-68-33-206-95.hsd1.va.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: Jubb] 01:44:55 -!- AntiSpamMeta [~MetaBot@unaffiliated/afterdeath/bot/antispambot] has quit [Excess Flood] 01:45:52 -!- ramus [~ramus@adsl-99-136-196-137.dsl.chcgil.sbcglobal.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 01:46:48 AntiSpamMeta [~MetaBot@unaffiliated/afterdeath/bot/antispambot] has joined #lisp 01:49:13 ramus [~ramus@adsl-99-23-144-24.dsl.chcgil.sbcglobal.net] has joined #lisp 01:50:20 kushal [~kdas@114.143.163.210] has joined #lisp 01:50:21 -!- kushal [~kdas@114.143.163.210] has quit [Changing host] 01:50:21 kushal [~kdas@fedora/kushal] has joined #lisp 02:02:11 araujo [~araujo@gentoo/developer/araujo] has joined #lisp 02:03:55 -!- sanjoyd [~sanjoyd@unaffiliated/sanjoyd] has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 02:06:01 -!- Demosthenes [~demo@72-255-11-240.client.stsn.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 02:07:37 Good morning everyone! 02:07:55 -!- ltriant [~ltriant@lithium.mailguard.com.au] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 02:08:03 ltriant [~ltriant@lithium.mailguard.com.au] has joined #lisp 02:08:36 -!- Yuuhi [benni@p5483B99B.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 02:10:03 zhuchong530 [~wangchang@124.114.91.40] has joined #lisp 02:10:08 -!- zhuchong530 [~wangchang@124.114.91.40] has quit [Max SendQ exceeded] 02:10:48 zhuchong530 [~wangchang@124.114.91.40] has joined #lisp 02:10:56 -!- zhuchong530 [~wangchang@124.114.91.40] has quit [Max SendQ exceeded] 02:12:08 zhuchong530 [~wangchang@124.114.91.40] has joined #lisp 02:12:38 -!- zhuchong530 [~wangchang@124.114.91.40] has quit [Max SendQ exceeded] 02:14:15 -!- tessier_ [~treed@216.105.40.125] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 02:14:43 dto [~dto@pool-96-252-62-25.bstnma.fios.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 02:15:22 -!- Mococa [~Mococa@189.115.187.118] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 02:18:15 -!- cmm [~cmm@bzq-79-176-200-19.red.bezeqint.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 02:18:40 Demosthenes [~demo@72-255-11-240.client.stsn.net] has joined #lisp 02:19:32 -!- kushal [~kdas@fedora/kushal] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 02:23:29 -!- gffa [~gffa@unaffiliated/gffa] has quit [Quit: sleep] 02:24:40 -!- pizzledizzle [~pizdets@pool-98-113-194-183.nycmny.fios.verizon.net] has quit [] 02:24:59 -!- phax [~phax@unaffiliated/phax] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 02:26:26 simplechat [~simplecha@unaffiliated/simplechat] has joined #lisp 02:26:47 Mococa [~Mococa@189.115.187.118] has joined #lisp 02:28:13 kushal [~kdas@nat/redhat/x-eyzimyvtlrarhszb] has joined #lisp 02:28:14 -!- kushal [~kdas@nat/redhat/x-eyzimyvtlrarhszb] has quit [Changing host] 02:28:14 kushal [~kdas@fedora/kushal] has joined #lisp 02:29:14 -!- tritchey [~tritchey@c-98-213-213-26.hsd1.in.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 02:30:50 zhuchong530 [~wangchang@124.114.91.40] has joined #lisp 02:30:56 -!- zhuchong530 [~wangchang@124.114.91.40] has quit [Max SendQ exceeded] 02:32:33 zhuchong530 [~wangchang@124.114.91.40] has joined #lisp 02:32:38 -!- zhuchong530 [~wangchang@124.114.91.40] has quit [Max SendQ exceeded] 02:34:18 Jasko [~tjasko@c-174-59-204-245.hsd1.pa.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 02:34:56 sanjoyd [~sanjoyd@unaffiliated/sanjoyd] has joined #lisp 02:38:50 -!- dto [~dto@pool-96-252-62-25.bstnma.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 02:42:46 -!- AntiSpamMeta [~MetaBot@unaffiliated/afterdeath/bot/antispambot] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 02:43:32 pnkfelix [~Adium@c-76-121-97-74.hsd1.wa.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 02:43:48 -!- cmpitg [~cmpitg@113.22.105.27] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 02:46:59 AntiSpamMeta [~MetaBot@unaffiliated/afterdeath/bot/antispambot] has joined #lisp 02:47:43 -!- littlebobby [~bob@unaffiliated/littlebobby] has quit [Quit: Ex-Chat] 02:49:34 -!- pnkfelix [~Adium@c-76-121-97-74.hsd1.wa.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 02:50:57 tritchey [~tritchey@c-98-213-213-26.hsd1.in.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 03:01:44 foocraft [~ewanas@178.152.117.94] has joined #lisp 03:02:04 -!- foocraft [~ewanas@178.152.117.94] has quit [Client Quit] 03:02:55 -!- tritchey [~tritchey@c-98-213-213-26.hsd1.in.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: tritchey] 03:07:35 -!- vervic [~vervic@84.114.246.246] has quit [Quit: vervic] 03:08:21 tritchey [~tritchey@c-98-213-213-26.hsd1.in.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 03:08:46 Modius [~Modius@cpe-70-123-140-183.austin.res.rr.com] has joined #lisp 03:10:37 Anybody know of a unit-testing algorithm, or ideas for one, for a copying garbage collector? 03:10:53 I.e. to look for the degenerate cases. 03:17:00 depends on which part you want to test. 03:20:40 Anything I can automate, ideas for creative cases. I can change one tiny thing naively and break "reference from generation X to generation Y changed to one to generation Z changes on a tuesday when allocation Foo is promoted" 03:20:51 I hate it when that happens 03:22:06 -!- Salamander_ [~Salamande@ppp121-45-32-49.lns20.adl2.internode.on.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 03:23:41 I found very interesting. 03:24:11 basically, just walk the heap to check GC invariants. 03:24:48 -!- faust45 [~faust45@161-12-93-178.pool.ukrtel.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 03:26:37 Making a copying GC is an interesting exercise (esp given that I haven't done bit-twiddling work in a while) - using 8 generations, unless you're very pessimistic, you can't be sure how many future generations you have to push around to get the space to allocate the new big item in Gen0, you can have to go back and forth through generations pushing for space. 03:26:42 -!- bugQ [~bug@c-71-195-207-34.hsd1.ut.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 03:27:14 pkhuong: Thanks, I'll try to read this (I'm not up on the language) 03:27:32 I mean, the computer science language for this type of thing 03:27:37 push around? Oh, you have a linearly laid out heap? 03:28:33 You know, address space is free. 03:30:01 faust45 [~faust45@49-12-93-178.pool.ukrtel.net] has joined #lisp 03:30:09 I don't have a linearly laid out heap. 03:30:44 I mean, generating pressure in gen 0, which promotes stuff to gen1; but probably less than you may have wanted. . . 03:30:50 I could probably do that smarter/more pessimistically. 03:31:06 Have it mark to gen N to get the space, rather than one at a time. 03:32:28 bugQ [~bug@c-71-195-207-34.hsd1.ut.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 03:35:29 Salamander_ [~Salamande@ppp118-210-250-178.lns20.adl6.internode.on.net] has joined #lisp 03:38:04 tessier [~treed@216.105.40.125] has joined #lisp 03:39:18 -!- tessier [~treed@216.105.40.125] has quit [Client Quit] 03:39:37 tessier [~treed@216.105.40.125] has joined #lisp 03:39:48 -!- tessier [~treed@216.105.40.125] has quit [Changing host] 03:39:48 tessier [~treed@kernel-panic/copilotco] has joined #lisp 03:43:03 iwillig [~iwillig@ool-18b945c3.dyn.optonline.net] has joined #lisp 03:46:40 -!- ski_ [~slj@c83-254-21-112.bredband.comhem.se] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 03:48:58 ski_ [~slj@c83-254-21-112.bredband.comhem.se] has joined #lisp 03:52:31 BlankVerse [~pankajm@122.166.119.36] has joined #lisp 03:52:52 -!- Mococa [~Mococa@189.115.187.118] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 03:55:37 cmm [~cmm@bzq-79-176-200-19.red.bezeqint.net] has joined #lisp 03:56:44 psilord2 [~psilord@76.201.159.108] has joined #lisp 03:57:01 -!- psilord2 [~psilord@76.201.159.108] has left #lisp 04:00:48 -!- didi` [~user@unaffiliated/didi/x-1022147] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 04:04:04 -!- tritchey [~tritchey@c-98-213-213-26.hsd1.in.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: tritchey] 04:05:17 nefo [~nefo@2001:da8:200:900e:200:5efe:3b42:8f51] has joined #lisp 04:05:17 -!- nefo [~nefo@2001:da8:200:900e:200:5efe:3b42:8f51] has quit [Changing host] 04:05:17 nefo [~nefo@unaffiliated/nefo] has joined #lisp 04:10:41 -!- nefo [~nefo@unaffiliated/nefo] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 04:14:36 -!- bugQ [~bug@c-71-195-207-34.hsd1.ut.comcast.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 04:20:37 -!- dnolen [~davidnole@pool-68-161-137-73.ny325.east.verizon.net] has quit [Quit: dnolen] 04:22:38 lolsuper_ [~super_@unaffiliated/lolsuper-/x-9881387] has joined #lisp 04:23:28 bzzbzz [~franco@modemcable240.34-83-70.mc.videotron.ca] has joined #lisp 04:25:09 ISF [~ivan@201.82.135.204] has joined #lisp 04:34:54 abeaumont [~abeaumont@90.165.165.246] has joined #lisp 04:36:06 gaidal [~gaidal@113.109.104.181] has joined #lisp 04:36:39 -!- faust45 [~faust45@49-12-93-178.pool.ukrtel.net] has quit [Quit: faust45] 04:42:02 -!- bzzbzz [~franco@modemcable240.34-83-70.mc.videotron.ca] has quit [Quit: leaving] 04:42:49 Hun^85 [~Hunden@e180098009.adsl.alicedsl.de] has joined #lisp 04:43:58 -!- sellout- [~Adium@ALagny-751-1-15-55.w83-112.abo.wanadoo.fr] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 04:43:59 dnolen [~davidnole@184.152.69.75] has joined #lisp 04:44:15 sellout- [~Adium@ALagny-751-1-15-55.w83-112.abo.wanadoo.fr] has joined #lisp 04:44:27 -!- Hun^03 [~Hunden@e180105044.adsl.alicedsl.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 04:45:05 bzzbzz [~franco@modemcable240.34-83-70.mc.videotron.ca] has joined #lisp 04:45:42 -!- Hundenn [~Hunden@e180105044.adsl.alicedsl.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 04:45:54 -!- Hunden [~Hunden@e180105044.adsl.alicedsl.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 04:45:54 -!- Hun^85 is now known as Hunden 04:50:16 Hundenn [~Hunden@e180098009.adsl.alicedsl.de] has joined #lisp 04:50:18 -!- ISF [~ivan@201.82.135.204] has quit [Quit: WeeChat 0.3.5] 04:50:37 Hun^78 [~Hunden@e180098009.adsl.alicedsl.de] has joined #lisp 04:53:44 gravicappa [~gravicapp@ppp91-77-161-204.pppoe.mtu-net.ru] has joined #lisp 04:54:29 joshe [~joshe@opal.elsasser.org] has joined #lisp 04:55:58 -!- sellout- [~Adium@ALagny-751-1-15-55.w83-112.abo.wanadoo.fr] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 04:56:16 sellout- [~Adium@ALagny-751-1-15-55.w83-112.abo.wanadoo.fr] has joined #lisp 04:57:46 spradnyesh [~pradyus@nat/yahoo/x-yrujyjaaiutdcfbh] has joined #lisp 04:58:41 -!- cafesofie [~cafesofie@ool-18b97779.dyn.optonline.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 05:08:40 -!- dnolen [~davidnole@184.152.69.75] has quit [Quit: dnolen] 05:22:29 Spion_ [~spion@unaffiliated/spion] has joined #lisp 05:24:15 -!- tauntaun [~Crumpet@ool-44c711b3.dyn.optonline.net] has quit [Quit: Ex-Chat] 05:26:00 -!- Spion [~spion@unaffiliated/spion] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 05:27:20 -!- rtoym [~chatzilla@user-0c99ag2.cable.mindspring.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 05:31:56 -!- bgs100 [~ian@unaffiliated/bgs100] has quit [Quit: o_o] 05:39:44 Salamander [~Salamande@ppp118-210-239-150.lns20.adl6.internode.on.net] has joined #lisp 05:39:58 -!- spradnyesh [~pradyus@nat/yahoo/x-yrujyjaaiutdcfbh] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 05:41:50 gxdssoft [~gxdssoft@190.236.155.210] has joined #lisp 05:41:58 -!- Salamander_ [~Salamande@ppp118-210-250-178.lns20.adl6.internode.on.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 05:42:00 -!- X-Scale [email@2001:470:1f14:135b::2] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 05:42:51 schaueho [~schaueho@dslb-088-066-014-173.pools.arcor-ip.net] has joined #lisp 05:46:56 cyrillos [~cyrill@93-80-218-114.broadband.corbina.ru] has joined #lisp 05:47:54 -!- iwillig [~iwillig@ool-18b945c3.dyn.optonline.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 05:56:34 -!- setmeaway [setmeaway3@118.45.149.131] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 05:57:24 -!- gxdssoft [~gxdssoft@190.236.155.210] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 05:57:38 spradnyesh [~pradyus@nat/yahoo/x-jzmxdwqntxnfyhgk] has joined #lisp 06:06:09 -!- spradnyesh [~pradyus@nat/yahoo/x-jzmxdwqntxnfyhgk] has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 06:07:36 -!- plage [~user@ABordeaux-552-1-128-43.w81-50.abo.wanadoo.fr] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 06:11:02 setmeaway [setmeaway3@118.45.149.131] has joined #lisp 06:23:18 spradnyesh [~pradyus@nat/yahoo/x-tgmocjrwghxktemu] has joined #lisp 06:23:47 cmpitg [~cmpitg@113.22.105.27] has joined #lisp 06:24:22 abaw [~user@220-132-117-169.HINET-IP.hinet.net] has joined #lisp 06:25:28 kiuma [~kiuma@85-18-55-37.ip.fastwebnet.it] has joined #lisp 06:25:49 -!- Modius [~Modius@cpe-70-123-140-183.austin.res.rr.com] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 06:26:18 Modius [~Modius@cpe-70-123-140-183.austin.res.rr.com] has joined #lisp 06:27:29 flip214 [~marek@2001:858:107:1:7a2b:cbff:fed0:c11c] has joined #lisp 06:27:29 -!- flip214 [~marek@2001:858:107:1:7a2b:cbff:fed0:c11c] has quit [Changing host] 06:27:29 flip214 [~marek@unaffiliated/flip214] has joined #lisp 06:28:04 super__ [~super_@unaffiliated/lolsuper-/x-9881387] has joined #lisp 06:29:00 roblally [~roblally@roblally.plus.com] has joined #lisp 06:30:43 -!- lolsuper_ [~super_@unaffiliated/lolsuper-/x-9881387] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 06:36:37 rimmjob_ [~rimmjob@99.45.100.139] has joined #lisp 06:36:44 mvilleneuve [~mvilleneu@LLagny-156-36-4-214.w80-14.abo.wanadoo.fr] has joined #lisp 06:37:04 good morning 06:38:09 It was, thankyou :) 06:45:40 -!- Demosthenes [~demo@72-255-11-240.client.stsn.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 06:48:06 -!- ltriant [~ltriant@lithium.mailguard.com.au] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 06:48:06 -!- abaw [~user@220-132-117-169.HINET-IP.hinet.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 06:48:12 -!- gravicappa [~gravicapp@ppp91-77-161-204.pppoe.mtu-net.ru] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 06:48:51 ltriant [~ltriant@lithium.mailguard.com.au] has joined #lisp 06:49:17 abaw [~user@220-132-117-169.HINET-IP.hinet.net] has joined #lisp 06:55:58 e-user [~e-user@nat/nokia/x-wbqdbwawalvijeuh] has joined #lisp 06:56:47 -!- abaw [~user@220-132-117-169.HINET-IP.hinet.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 06:56:58 -!- ltriant [~ltriant@lithium.mailguard.com.au] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 06:57:33 ltriant [~ltriant@lithium.mailguard.com.au] has joined #lisp 07:00:07 Demosthenes [~demo@72-255-11-240.client.stsn.net] has joined #lisp 07:00:29 -!- Bike [~Glossina@71-38-152-59.ptld.qwest.net] has left #lisp 07:00:44 Bike [~Glossina@71-38-152-59.ptld.qwest.net] has joined #lisp 07:01:05 whee [~whee@misplaced.smaertness.net] has joined #lisp 07:02:37 gravicappa [~gravicapp@ppp91-77-189-67.pppoe.mtu-net.ru] has joined #lisp 07:11:17 urandom__ [~user@p548A41CA.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #lisp 07:14:37 blandest [~user@85.204.33.242] has joined #lisp 07:14:53 -!- sword [~user@c-76-115-88-63.hsd1.wa.comcast.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 07:14:58 sword [~sword@c-76-115-88-63.hsd1.wa.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 07:15:24 -!- schaueho [~schaueho@dslb-088-066-014-173.pools.arcor-ip.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 07:17:10 Does someone know how to link ecl statically into my binary, so that no extra libecl.so is needed? 07:20:06 -!- rimmjob_ [~rimmjob@99.45.100.139] has left #lisp 07:21:09 -!- gravicappa [~gravicapp@ppp91-77-189-67.pppoe.mtu-net.ru] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 07:24:30 jdz [~jdz@193.206.22.97] has joined #lisp 07:27:09 -!- H4ns````` is now known as H4ns 07:34:42 -!- Bike [~Glossina@71-38-152-59.ptld.qwest.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 07:35:27 -!- Jasko3 [~tjasko@c-174-59-204-245.hsd1.pa.comcast.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 07:36:17 Jasko3 [~tjasko@c-174-59-204-245.hsd1.pa.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 07:44:22 Beetny [~Beetny@ppp118-208-143-106.lns20.bne1.internode.on.net] has joined #lisp 07:44:22 -!- ltriant [~ltriant@lithium.mailguard.com.au] has quit [Quit: Computer has gone to sleep] 07:47:02 -!- nilly [~nil@c-174-61-233-189.hsd1.wa.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: quit] 07:55:03 insomniaSalt [~milan@port-92-204-66-89.dynamic.qsc.de] has joined #lisp 07:55:21 -!- BlankVerse [~pankajm@122.166.119.36] has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 07:57:08 -!- Bacteria [~Bacteria@dyn-118-139-18-2.its.monash.edu.au] has quit [Quit: Bacteria] 07:58:57 -!- insomnia1alt [~milan@port-92-204-98-8.dynamic.qsc.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 07:59:56 c_arenz [~arenz@nat/ibm/x-vzdykrmqykyzkymr] has joined #lisp 08:00:12 gravicappa [~gravicapp@ppp91-77-185-169.pppoe.mtu-net.ru] has joined #lisp 08:02:25 morphling [~stefan@gssn-5f757a13.pool.mediaWays.net] has joined #lisp 08:03:53 malbertife [~marcoalbe@bl7-33-144.dsl.telepac.pt] has joined #lisp 08:06:23 schaueho [d5a445c1@gateway/web/freenode/ip.213.164.69.193] has joined #lisp 08:06:56 hlavaty [~user@91-65-223-81-dynip.superkabel.de] has joined #lisp 08:07:29 -!- alfa_y_omega [~alfa_y_om@90.166.231.220] has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 08:14:36 alfa_y_omega [~alfa_y_om@90.166.231.220] has joined #lisp 08:15:38 xan_ [~xan@94.Red-193-152-140.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net] has joined #lisp 08:22:39 -!- gravicappa [~gravicapp@ppp91-77-185-169.pppoe.mtu-net.ru] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 08:26:50 -!- quasisane [~sanep@c-76-24-80-97.hsd1.nh.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: leaving] 08:27:14 BlankVerse [~pankajm@122.166.119.36] has joined #lisp 08:30:18 vervic [~vervic@84.114.246.246] has joined #lisp 08:31:47 -!- morphling [~stefan@gssn-5f757a13.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 08:32:18 nha [~prefect@imamac13.epfl.ch] has joined #lisp 08:38:04 littlebobby [~bob@unaffiliated/littlebobby] has joined #lisp 08:42:09 -!- kennyd [~kennyd@93-138-187-107.adsl.net.t-com.hr] has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 08:44:51 kennyd [~kennyd@93-138-84-69.adsl.net.t-com.hr] has joined #lisp 08:45:19 pdo [~pdo@217.33.254.141] has joined #lisp 08:45:57 Bacteria [~Bacteria@115-64-180-132.static.tpgi.com.au] has joined #lisp 08:46:05 -!- Bacteria [~Bacteria@115-64-180-132.static.tpgi.com.au] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 08:46:25 Bacteria [~Bacteria@115-64-180-132.static.tpgi.com.au] has joined #lisp 08:52:54 ramkrsna [~ramkrsna@nat/redhat/x-taixyeqtkqrxgtfl] has joined #lisp 08:52:54 -!- ramkrsna [~ramkrsna@nat/redhat/x-taixyeqtkqrxgtfl] has quit [Changing host] 08:52:54 ramkrsna [~ramkrsna@unaffiliated/ramkrsna] has joined #lisp 08:54:13 leo2007 [~leo@123.114.34.143] has joined #lisp 09:02:58 quasisane [~sanep@c-76-24-80-97.hsd1.nh.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 09:07:51 -!- Krystof [~csr21@csrhodes.plus.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 09:07:59 -!- sellout- [~Adium@ALagny-751-1-15-55.w83-112.abo.wanadoo.fr] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 09:08:16 sellout- [~Adium@ALagny-751-1-15-55.w83-112.abo.wanadoo.fr] has joined #lisp 09:36:19 cmatei_ [~cmatei@89.137.205.111] has joined #lisp 09:37:55 -!- littlebobby [~bob@unaffiliated/littlebobby] has quit [Quit: Ex-Chat] 09:38:10 -!- cmatei [~cmatei@78.96.101.216] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 09:39:12 -!- cmatei_ is now known as cmatei 09:44:30 -!- alfa_y_omega [~alfa_y_om@90.166.231.220] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 09:46:44 alfa_y_omega [~alfa_y_om@90.166.231.220] has joined #lisp 09:49:07 jmbr [~jmbr@curio.mat.ucm.es] has joined #lisp 09:49:12 -!- sanjoyd [~sanjoyd@unaffiliated/sanjoyd] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 09:52:28 gffa [~gffa@unaffiliated/gffa] has joined #lisp 09:54:10 Krystof [~csr21@158.223.51.76] has joined #lisp 10:01:34 lifechamp [~gary@71.242.21.95.dynamic.jazztel.es] has joined #lisp 10:03:03 -!- leo2007 [~leo@123.114.34.143] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 10:03:06 -!- alfa_y_omega [~alfa_y_om@90.166.231.220] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 10:04:35 alfa_y_omega [~alfa_y_om@90.166.231.220] has joined #lisp 10:06:09 -!- neoesque [~neoesque@210.59.147.232] has quit [Quit: Bye!] 10:08:08 hargettp [~hargettp@pool-71-174-132-222.bstnma.east.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 10:10:35 alama [~alama@tmp4.logic.tuwien.ac.at] has joined #lisp 10:10:42 -!- cmatei [~cmatei@89.137.205.111] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 10:12:10 -!- Penten [~user@114.255.149.182] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 10:12:23 -!- Jasko [~tjasko@c-174-59-204-245.hsd1.pa.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: This computer has gone to sleep] 10:35:23 -!- hargettp [~hargettp@pool-71-174-132-222.bstnma.east.verizon.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving...] 10:38:10 hargettp [~hargettp@pool-71-174-132-222.bstnma.east.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 10:42:41 -!- alfa_y_omega [~alfa_y_om@90.166.231.220] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 10:44:33 -!- jimmy1980 [~jimmy@112.224.2.113] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 10:44:46 alfa_y_omega [~alfa_y_om@90.166.231.220] has joined #lisp 10:45:15 -!- xxxyyy [~xyxu@58.41.1.251] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 10:45:16 mstevens [~mstevens@ceres.etla.org] has joined #lisp 10:45:16 -!- mstevens [~mstevens@ceres.etla.org] has quit [Changing host] 10:45:16 mstevens [~mstevens@fsf/member/pdpc.active.mstevens] has joined #lisp 10:45:56 zfx [~zfx@unaffiliated/zfx] has joined #lisp 10:53:01 jimmy1980 [~jimmy@112.224.2.113] has joined #lisp 10:54:10 curious_corn [~ecausaran@84-53-64-50.adsl.unet.nl] has joined #lisp 10:55:40 markskil1eck [~mark@host86-136-237-221.range86-136.btcentralplus.com] has joined #lisp 10:57:42 -!- markskilbeck [~mark@unaffiliated/markskilbeck] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 10:58:33 H4ns` [~user@pD4B9EA0C.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #lisp 10:58:43 daniel [~daniel@p50829AB8.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #lisp 11:00:12 -!- daniel__1 [~daniel@p5082AE4D.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 11:01:01 -!- alama [~alama@tmp4.logic.tuwien.ac.at] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 11:02:42 -!- H4ns [~user@p4FFC8483.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 11:03:20 alama [~alama@tmp4.logic.tuwien.ac.at] has joined #lisp 11:08:59 markskilbeck [~mark@unaffiliated/markskilbeck] has joined #lisp 11:10:57 -!- jmbr [~jmbr@curio.mat.ucm.es] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 11:11:41 -!- markskil1eck [~mark@host86-136-237-221.range86-136.btcentralplus.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 11:14:45 phax [~phax@unaffiliated/phax] has joined #lisp 11:19:31 Yuuhi [benni@p5483B954.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #lisp 11:21:02 tfb [~tfb@80.238.0.145] has joined #lisp 11:23:20 -!- amb007 [~a_bakic@253.4.68.86.rev.sfr.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 11:25:53 xxxyyy [~xyxu@222.68.165.156] has joined #lisp 11:26:06 dfox [~dfox@ip-94-113-17-246.net.upcbroadband.cz] has joined #lisp 11:26:18 -!- sword [~sword@c-76-115-88-63.hsd1.wa.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 11:27:46 -!- hargettp [~hargettp@pool-71-174-132-222.bstnma.east.verizon.net] has quit [Quit: Linkinus - http://linkinus.com] 11:28:45 -!- c_arenz [~arenz@nat/ibm/x-vzdykrmqykyzkymr] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 11:29:45 c_arenz [~arenz@nat/ibm/x-oxrlgewhlcazizkl] has joined #lisp 11:29:45 -!- c_arenz [~arenz@nat/ibm/x-oxrlgewhlcazizkl] has quit [Client Quit] 11:35:06 -!- chu_ [~chu@CPE-58-165-253-149.lns1.civ.bigpond.net.au] has quit [Quit: leaving] 11:37:55 c_arenz [~arenz@nat/ibm/x-uvqxwgaqkgwztzvc] has joined #lisp 11:41:21 hargettp [~hargettp@pool-71-174-132-222.bstnma.east.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 11:44:14 sacho [~sacho@95-42-102-15.btc-net.bg] has joined #lisp 11:46:34 faust45 [~faust45@109.167.117.118] has joined #lisp 11:49:41 -!- churib [~churib@95.156.194.105] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 11:51:18 -!- phax [~phax@unaffiliated/phax] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 11:51:49 silenius [~silenus@p54947B1F.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #lisp 11:52:24 -!- xxxyyy [~xyxu@222.68.165.156] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 11:54:02 -!- faust45 [~faust45@109.167.117.118] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 11:57:09 -!- Jasko3 [~tjasko@c-174-59-204-245.hsd1.pa.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 11:58:29 gz__ [~gz@209-6-49-85.c3-0.smr-ubr1.sbo-smr.ma.cable.rcn.com] has joined #lisp 11:58:54 -!- kushal [~kdas@fedora/kushal] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 12:00:11 tritchey [~tritchey@c-98-213-213-26.hsd1.in.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 12:02:41 -!- gz__ [~gz@209-6-49-85.c3-0.smr-ubr1.sbo-smr.ma.cable.rcn.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 12:03:51 dlowe [~dlowe@c-66-30-116-162.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 12:04:17 -!- sonnym [~evissecer@rrcs-184-74-137-167.nys.biz.rr.com] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 12:04:43 razieliyo [~user@unaffiliated/razieliyo] has joined #lisp 12:05:18 xxxyyy [~xyxu@222.68.165.156] has joined #lisp 12:05:29 sbryant_work [~user@ghanima.slavasaur.com] has joined #lisp 12:05:56 val740 [irc2gowebc@net-2-40-110-82.cust.dsl.teletu.it] has joined #lisp 12:07:50 serichsen [~user@hmbg-5f764306.pool.mediaWays.net] has joined #lisp 12:07:53 Hello! 12:08:02 Hello! 12:09:31 EHLO localhost 12:09:32 hello 12:09:50 i can't figure out what is the function of (defun (setf ...) .. 12:09:55 kushal [~kdas@114.143.166.112] has joined #lisp 12:09:55 who can explain it to me? 12:09:55 -!- kushal [~kdas@114.143.166.112] has quit [Changing host] 12:09:55 kushal [~kdas@fedora/kushal] has joined #lisp 12:10:06 It's (setf ...). Functions can be named like that. 12:10:16 ? 12:10:18 :-\ 12:10:21 val740: this defines a setter function 12:10:27 what this means? 12:10:31 (defun (setf f) (nv) (print '(I am (setf f))) nv) (funcall '(setf f) 42) 12:10:39 what other languages do you know? maybe I can find a better term 12:10:40 -!- sacho [~sacho@95-42-102-15.btc-net.bg] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 12:10:45 c++ 12:10:45 that you already know 12:10:47 :D 12:10:47 You can also call it as: (setf (f) 42) 12:11:12 mmm 12:11:18 yes but why i would do this? 12:11:21 well, imagine a class ... instead of directly writing into an instance, you call some function to write it for you 12:11:32 val740: to set the value of some slot in some object. 12:11:44 eg. (setf (point-x p) 42) 12:11:56 mmm 12:12:15 -!- Beetny [~Beetny@ppp118-208-143-106.lns20.bne1.internode.on.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 12:12:15 -!- val740 [irc2gowebc@net-2-40-110-82.cust.dsl.teletu.it] has quit [Quit: http://irc2go.com/] 12:14:22 A more usualy example would be: (defun (setf field) (nv something) (set-field-of-something something nv) nv) (setf (field something) 42) 12:14:30 Jasko3 [~tjasko@209.74.44.225] has joined #lisp 12:18:33 -!- Demosthenes [~demo@72-255-11-240.client.stsn.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 12:19:05 -!- alfa_y_omega [~alfa_y_om@90.166.231.220] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 12:19:09 -!- hargettp [~hargettp@pool-71-174-132-222.bstnma.east.verizon.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving...] 12:20:54 alfa_y_omega [~alfa_y_om@90.166.231.220] has joined #lisp 12:22:11 val392 [irc2gowebc@net-2-40-110-82.cust.dsl.teletu.it] has joined #lisp 12:22:15 sorry 12:22:26 here i'm, the guy who's asking about (defun (setf .. 12:22:38 A more usualy example would be: (defun (setf field) (nv something) (set-field-of-something something nv) nv) (setf (field something) 42) 12:23:09 mmm 12:23:35 sacho [~sacho@87-126-0-180.btc-net.bg] has joined #lisp 12:23:38 if i write... (defun (setf aa) (val) (format t "(tilde)S" val)) 12:23:53 No. It should return it's first argument. 12:24:10 in my defun who is the first argumento? 12:24:14 val 12:24:20 ah 12:24:24 ok 12:24:38 can i think of (Defun (setf like a rewriting of setf function? 12:24:58 This is meaningless, but if you want to think that, you can. 12:25:08 why is meaningless? 12:25:20 val392: read clhs setf 12:25:26 ok thx 12:27:00 Joreji [~thomas@90-056.eduroam.RWTH-Aachen.DE] has joined #lisp 12:27:13 -!- alama [~alama@tmp4.logic.tuwien.ac.at] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 12:27:33 alama [~alama@tmp4.logic.tuwien.ac.at] has joined #lisp 12:31:25 lanthan [~ze@p50992b91.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #lisp 12:31:29 -!- kunwon1 [~kunwon1@unaffiliated/kunwon1] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 12:31:51 -!- sacho [~sacho@87-126-0-180.btc-net.bg] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 12:32:18 -!- BlankVerse [~pankajm@122.166.119.36] has quit [Quit: Lost terminal] 12:32:18 iwillig [~iwillig@ool-18b945c3.dyn.optonline.net] has joined #lisp 12:32:24 -!- vervic [~vervic@84.114.246.246] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 12:34:55 sacho [~sacho@87-126-7-117.btc-net.bg] has joined #lisp 12:35:43 -!- Jasko3 [~tjasko@209.74.44.225] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 12:35:58 BlankVerse [~pankajm@122.166.119.36] has joined #lisp 12:36:41 dlowe1 [~dlowe@nat/google/x-fmnorjaqkqahqtfk] has joined #lisp 12:37:17 sonnym [~sonny@singlebrookvpn.lightlink.com] has joined #lisp 12:38:07 kunwon1 [~kunwon1@unaffiliated/kunwon1] has joined #lisp 12:38:45 -!- daimrod [~daimrod@sbrk.org] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 12:39:24 TristamWrk [~tristamwr@2620:0:2820:b03:214:22ff:fe45:5204] has joined #lisp 12:39:39 -!- kiuma [~kiuma@85-18-55-37.ip.fastwebnet.it] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 12:40:13 -!- BlankVerse [~pankajm@122.166.119.36] has quit [Client Quit] 12:42:12 -!- katesmith [~katesmith@unaffiliated/costume] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 12:44:13 Evanescence [~chris@122.237.17.115] has joined #lisp 12:44:29 ignas [~ignas@ctv-79-132-160-221.vinita.lt] has joined #lisp 12:44:42 ignas_ [~ignas@ctv-79-132-160-221.vinita.lt] has joined #lisp 12:48:44 Jasko [~tjasko@c-174-59-204-245.hsd1.pa.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 12:50:38 katesmith [~katesmith@97-89-229-3.static.snfr.nc.charter.com] has joined #lisp 12:50:38 -!- katesmith [~katesmith@97-89-229-3.static.snfr.nc.charter.com] has quit [Changing host] 12:50:38 katesmith [~katesmith@unaffiliated/costume] has joined #lisp 12:51:54 -!- gaidal [~gaidal@113.109.104.181] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 12:53:13 misterncw [~misterncw@82.71.241.25] has joined #lisp 12:53:59 pislocide [~PC@ip72-213-141-195.ok.ok.cox.net] has joined #lisp 12:55:13 Jasko2 [~tjasko@c-174-59-204-245.hsd1.pa.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 12:57:08 katesmith_ [~katesmith@unaffiliated/costume] has joined #lisp 12:57:32 roblally_ [~roblally@roblally.plus.com] has joined #lisp 12:58:45 -!- alfa_y_omega [~alfa_y_om@90.166.231.220] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 12:59:11 -!- roblally [~roblally@roblally.plus.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 12:59:12 -!- roblally_ is now known as roblally 12:59:54 -!- katesmith [~katesmith@unaffiliated/costume] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 13:01:03 alfa_y_omega [~alfa_y_om@90.166.231.220] has joined #lisp 13:01:56 kambu [~dilip@59.92.166.173] has joined #lisp 13:03:41 gaidal [~gaidal@113.109.133.89] has joined #lisp 13:04:05 -!- alfa_y_omega [~alfa_y_om@90.166.231.220] has quit [Max SendQ exceeded] 13:05:40 alfa_y_omega [~alfa_y_om@90.166.231.220] has joined #lisp 13:07:22 -!- kambu [~dilip@59.92.166.173] has left #lisp 13:10:04 kiuma [~kiuma@85-18-55-37.ip.fastwebnet.it] has joined #lisp 13:12:34 -!- alfa_y_omega [~alfa_y_om@90.166.231.220] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 13:12:45 -!- madnificent [~madnifice@83.101.62.132] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 13:13:22 madnificent [~madnifice@83.101.62.132] has joined #lisp 13:13:43 -!- sbryant_work [~user@ghanima.slavasaur.com] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 13:13:45 daimrod [~daimrod@sbrk.org] has joined #lisp 13:14:55 is there a reason why when I load up a .lisp file in SBCL that it produces the same output? I've (random) to generate random numbers and they always come out the same after the first run. Do I need to clear the variables on exit; I'm using (break) for this, don't know any other way. 13:15:08 felideon [~felideon@65.23.61.98.nw.nuvox.net] has joined #lisp 13:15:19 Random is not random. 13:15:27 It's always using the same seed. 13:15:56 -!- val392 [irc2gowebc@net-2-40-110-82.cust.dsl.teletu.it] has quit [Quit: http://irc2go.com/] 13:17:16 pislocide: look at (make-random-state) 13:17:55 alfa_y_omega [~alfa_y_om@90.166.231.220] has joined #lisp 13:18:01 ahh crazy upside down quotation mark! the power of Christ compels you! 13:18:31 pislocide: if you're on sbcl, (seed-random-state) or (make-random-state t) 13:18:32 -!- zfx [~zfx@unaffiliated/zfx] has quit [Quit: Be back later] 13:19:41 dnolen [~davidnole@184.152.69.75] has joined #lisp 13:19:43 Deesl [~bsdboy@unaffiliated/deesl] has joined #lisp 13:19:50 -!- hlavaty [~user@91-65-223-81-dynip.superkabel.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 13:21:43 -!- silenius [~silenus@p54947B1F.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 13:22:06 -!- prip [~foo@host8-197-dynamic.17-79-r.retail.telecomitalia.it] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 13:22:38 thanks flip214. 13:22:51 -!- kiuma [~kiuma@85-18-55-37.ip.fastwebnet.it] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 13:23:00 and otwieracz. 13:23:08 -!- mrSpec [~Spec@unaffiliated/mrspec] has quit [Quit: mrSpec] 13:24:13 ChibaPet [~mason@74.203.221.34] has joined #lisp 13:24:29 G'morning, all. 13:25:55 marmalade [~marmalade@142.177.93.176] has joined #lisp 13:26:32 -!- iwillig [~iwillig@ool-18b945c3.dyn.optonline.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 13:26:38 -!- marmalade is now known as macrocat 13:27:15 rmarianski [~rmariansk@mail.marianski.com] has joined #lisp 13:27:48 bgs100 [~ian@unaffiliated/bgs100] has joined #lisp 13:30:27 http://pastie.org/private/iu0sivop6amcsl4nxjlstw 13:30:46 DelPuerto [~youguy@240.pool85-56-66.dynamic.orange.es] has joined #lisp 13:30:57 I'm catching errors very well, but I have problem when there's no problems. 13:31:03 -!- Deesl [~bsdboy@unaffiliated/deesl] has quit [Quit: Bye!] 13:31:06 cmm- [~cmm@bzq-79-176-200-19.red.bezeqint.net] has joined #lisp 13:31:07 Oh, wait, I must repaste it. 13:31:31 Deesl [~bsdboy@unaffiliated/deesl] has joined #lisp 13:32:19 http://pastie.org/private/c5wac2ho0vtk1ykan5zq 13:32:23 That's good version. 13:34:07 prip [~foo@host180-197-dynamic.17-79-r.retail.telecomitalia.it] has joined #lisp 13:34:52 -!- alfa_y_omega [~alfa_y_om@90.166.231.220] has quit [*.net *.split] 13:34:52 -!- ramkrsna [~ramkrsna@unaffiliated/ramkrsna] has quit [*.net *.split] 13:34:52 -!- cmm [~cmm@bzq-79-176-200-19.red.bezeqint.net] has quit [*.net *.split] 13:34:52 -!- peterhil` [~peterhil@gw.maxisat.fi] has quit [*.net *.split] 13:34:52 -!- colazero [~colazero@www5054u.sakura.ne.jp] has quit [*.net *.split] 13:34:52 -!- ok2 [ok2@kozachuk.info] has quit [*.net *.split] 13:35:22 otwieracz: you still have the call to SIGNAL in there 13:35:33 Yes 13:35:45 But I don't know how to do this. 13:35:58 do what? 13:36:09 How to check that everything is ok. 13:36:41 Catching bad argument to signal condition and then reparsing JSON isn't good idea, I think. 13:36:58 what? 13:37:08 Look: 13:37:26 handler-case returns the result of the expression if there are no errors 13:39:35 -!- ignas [~ignas@ctv-79-132-160-221.vinita.lt] has quit [Quit: Ex-Chat] 13:39:40 -!- ignas_ [~ignas@ctv-79-132-160-221.vinita.lt] has quit [Quit: Ex-Chat] 13:40:03 Hmm. 13:41:25 peterhil` [~peterhil@gw.maxisat.fi] has joined #lisp 13:41:42 -!- katesmith_ is now known as katesmith 13:41:46 ramkrsna [~ramkrsna@unaffiliated/ramkrsna] has joined #lisp 13:42:14 aperturefever` [20164@ninthfloor.org] has joined #lisp 13:42:39 -!- aperturefever` [20164@ninthfloor.org] has quit [Client Quit] 13:42:43 -!- DelPuerto [~youguy@240.pool85-56-66.dynamic.orange.es] has quit [Quit: Colloquy for iPhone - http://colloquy.mobi] 13:43:07 Oh, that (signal ()) was unnecessery 13:44:26 that's what i said 13:45:11 mrSpec [~Spec@c-66-31-28-194.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 13:45:11 -!- mrSpec [~Spec@c-66-31-28-194.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has quit [Changing host] 13:45:11 mrSpec [~Spec@unaffiliated/mrspec] has joined #lisp 13:45:14 -!- katesmith [~katesmith@unaffiliated/costume] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 13:45:23 Yes, thank you. 13:47:36 alfa_y_omega [~alfa_y_om@90.166.231.220] has joined #lisp 13:47:36 -!- alfa_y_omega [~alfa_y_om@90.166.231.220] has quit [Excess Flood] 13:51:05 -!- TristamWrk [~tristamwr@2620:0:2820:b03:214:22ff:fe45:5204] has quit [Quit: Some days you're the pigeon, some days the statue...] 13:51:53 jimmy__ [~jimmy@218.193.190.132] has joined #lisp 13:52:08 -!- spradnyesh [~pradyus@nat/yahoo/x-tgmocjrwghxktemu] has left #lisp 13:55:13 -!- macrocat [~marmalade@142.177.93.176] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 13:55:17 -!- dlowe1 [~dlowe@nat/google/x-fmnorjaqkqahqtfk] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 13:58:23 alfa_y_omega [~alfa_y_om@90.166.231.220] has joined #lisp 14:00:36 Hello. there, I'm interested in Translating the sexy book "Practical Common Lisp" by Peter Seibel into Chinese version, But I've a problem contacting Peter, that is, I want his email. Please help, thanks! 14:00:37 -!- parabolize [~paraboliz@203.83.50.36] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 14:01:18 francogrex [franco@grex.cyberspace.org] has joined #lisp 14:01:21 jimmy__: http://gigamonkeys.com/ has his address. 14:01:32 Is this email address "book@gigamonkeys.com" on http://www.gigamonkeys.com/book/? 14:02:42 jimmy__: be sure to contact him, IIRC, there are already translations in progress! 14:03:23 samIamIsam [~samIamIsa@wn14jp.aic.nrl.navy.mil] has joined #lisp 14:04:11 katesmith [~katesmith@97-89-229-3.static.snfr.nc.charter.com] has joined #lisp 14:04:11 -!- katesmith [~katesmith@97-89-229-3.static.snfr.nc.charter.com] has quit [Changing host] 14:04:11 katesmith [~katesmith@unaffiliated/costume] has joined #lisp 14:04:15 -!- alfa_y_omega [~alfa_y_om@90.166.231.220] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 14:04:26 As far as I know, there is not a Chinese version by now, but I'm trying to make sure of it, 14:05:42 I just want his email adress or the other way I can contact him. 14:06:04 Is this email address "book@gigamonkeys.com" on http://www.gigamonkeys.com/book/ right? 14:06:24 silenius [~silenus@p54947B1F.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #lisp 14:07:14 -!- Bacteria [~Bacteria@115-64-180-132.static.tpgi.com.au] has quit [Quit: Bacteria] 14:07:29 This code is written in ecl/c to calculate pi at 2400 decimals but something weird happens: http://pastebin.com/8c6UgzLC 14:07:58 when there is no 'print' statement, subsequent calls are not correct 14:08:19 -!- dnolen [~davidnole@184.152.69.75] has quit [Quit: dnolen] 14:08:27 alfa_y_omega [~alfa_y_om@90.166.231.220] has joined #lisp 14:09:38 hi luis :) 14:10:07 amb007 [~a_bakic@253.4.68.86.rev.sfr.net] has joined #lisp 14:11:06 -!- alfa_y_omega [~alfa_y_om@90.166.231.220] has quit [Excess Flood] 14:12:27 alfa_y_omega [~alfa_y_om@90.166.231.220] has joined #lisp 14:14:00 dlowe1 [~dlowe@c-66-30-116-162.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 14:14:23 francogrex: #+clisp (progn (setf (EXT:LONG-FLOAT-DIGITS) (ceiling 2400 (log 2 10))) (length (prin1-to-string pi))) 14:15:56 -!- alfa_y_omega [~alfa_y_om@90.166.231.220] has quit [Max SendQ exceeded] 14:17:17 alfa_y_omega [~alfa_y_om@90.166.231.220] has joined #lisp 14:17:47 sword [~sword@c-76-115-88-63.hsd1.wa.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 14:18:16 -!- dlowe1 [~dlowe@c-66-30-116-162.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 14:18:41 Hello francogrex! 14:19:11 Can you tell me how you got a 320kB executable with ECL? I cannot get it to compile with --disable-shared .. and I think you've got some more tricks, too 14:19:15 dlowe1 [~dlowe@nat/google/x-icwagewkqjvycvwg] has joined #lisp 14:21:41 I have a COURSE struct, and it has several LECTURES (weekly lectures) associated with it. I may want each lecture to be associated with its course, but I feel kind of silly giving the COURSE struct a LECTURES slot /and/ the LECTURE struct a COURSE slot. There isn't a better way, is there? (I don't know anything about CLOS.) 14:22:27 zfx [~zfx@unaffiliated/zfx] has joined #lisp 14:22:30 I don't think there's another way 14:22:39 even in SQL, you'll need a parent_id row 14:23:03 -!- prip [~foo@host180-197-dynamic.17-79-r.retail.telecomitalia.it] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 14:23:15 a-ok 14:23:44 -!- schaueho [d5a445c1@gateway/web/freenode/ip.213.164.69.193] has quit [Quit: Page closed] 14:28:32 But make sure you ask the CLOS-gurus here as well. 14:29:22 -!- jimmy__ [~jimmy@218.193.190.132] has quit [Quit: leaving] 14:29:25 zort-: you could have an auxilliary list with (lectures, course) as elements ... then both wouldn't need to point to the other 14:29:28 but that might be slow 14:29:36 iwillig [~iwillig@2002:803b:9627:0:224:d6ff:fe4a:a942] has joined #lisp 14:29:58 of course, (setf) methods in CLOS could update the other class instance, too 14:30:20 don't know whether you want to get rid of the doubled bookkeeping in source, or the doubled pointers in memory 14:30:22 speed's no issue 14:33:10 -!- dlowe1 [~dlowe@nat/google/x-icwagewkqjvycvwg] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 14:33:32 -!- dlowe [~dlowe@c-66-30-116-162.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: *poof*] 14:34:52 prip [~foo@host233-120-dynamic.35-79-r.retail.telecomitalia.it] has joined #lisp 14:35:31 Ok, I (let ((rand-state (make-random-state t)))) and then (let ((some-rand (random 1.0 rand-state)))) but now when I run this through a loop, my output comes back as the same number. Does this not reseed itself? HyperSpec seemed to imply that. 14:37:04 pislocide: what CL are you using? 14:37:13 pislocide: read again clhs random 14:37:17 which random state does it use? 14:38:36 flip214: SBCL. pjb: I don't think it is using *random-state*, I set my binding to rand-state and make-random-state t. I am not familiar with clhs. 14:39:04 clhs is the Common Lisp Hyper Spec. http://www.lispworks.com/documentation/HyperSpec/Front/index.htm 14:39:07 pislocide: I'm not sure about your code; you code paste it. 14:39:12 galumph [~ron@bzq-84-109-188-221.red.bezeqint.net] has joined #lisp 14:39:24 If you always give the same random-state to (random), you'll get the same output back. 14:39:41 clhs make-rand-state 14:39:49 -!- galumph [~ron@bzq-84-109-188-221.red.bezeqint.net] has quit [Max SendQ exceeded] 14:39:49 hmm, bot botched ;/ 14:40:02 so I need to have one random-state to seed the random-state-2 and then use random-state-2 to produce my output in the loop? 14:40:27 this is what I am reading : http://www.lispworks.com/documentation/HyperSpec/Body/f_mk_rnd.htm#make-random-state 14:40:30 flip214: I know, the latest ECL unfortunetly is severely broken for compilation statically. I use an older 2008 version 0.9l 14:40:37 galumph [~ron@bzq-84-109-188-221.red.bezeqint.net] has joined #lisp 14:40:46 pislocide: also, in fast loops, you may have some problem, since some implementation use the wall time to initialize the random state. 14:41:14 -!- galumph [~ron@bzq-84-109-188-221.red.bezeqint.net] has quit [Max SendQ exceeded] 14:41:17 pjb: yes I know there are many ways, I just wanted to introiduce my onw writen in C 14:42:00 pislocide: But basically, if you just want your program runs to be random, and nothing more sophisticated with random states, then just (setf *random-state* (make-random-state t)) at the start. 14:42:30 -!- alfa_y_omega [~alfa_y_om@90.166.231.220] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 14:42:39 pjb: ok, and don't even specify a state in (random)? 14:42:48 Exactly. 14:43:15 tritchey_ [~tritchey@c-98-213-213-26.hsd1.in.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 14:43:16 -!- razieliyo [~user@unaffiliated/razieliyo] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 14:43:21 francogrex: thanks for the information. 14:43:36 ok, heading back to it again. 14:43:50 -!- kunwon1 [~kunwon1@unaffiliated/kunwon1] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 14:43:57 -!- alama [~alama@tmp4.logic.tuwien.ac.at] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 14:44:44 alfa_y_omega [~alfa_y_om@90.166.231.220] has joined #lisp 14:45:34 kunwon1 [~kunwon1@unaffiliated/kunwon1] has joined #lisp 14:46:35 -!- tritchey [~tritchey@c-98-213-213-26.hsd1.in.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 14:46:38 gemelen [~shelta@shpd-95-53-219-102.vologda.ru] has joined #lisp 14:47:24 -!- tritchey_ [~tritchey@c-98-213-213-26.hsd1.in.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 14:50:07 vervic [~vervic@84.114.246.246] has joined #lisp 14:52:58 -!- Obfuscate [~keii@ip98-176-17-38.sd.sd.cox.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 14:53:29 -!- Evanescence [~chris@122.237.17.115] has quit [Quit: WeeChat 0.3.4] 14:53:34 -!- gaidal [~gaidal@113.109.133.89] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 14:54:10 Obfuscate [~keii@ip98-176-17-38.sd.sd.cox.net] has joined #lisp 14:54:11 jmbr [~jmbr@curio.mat.ucm.es] has joined #lisp 14:57:02 -!- jfletcher [~jef@5ac8b0e6.bb.sky.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 14:57:20 francogrex: but nonetheless - even with the old ECL version you'd have to have some tricks to get _that_ small executables, no? 14:59:19 -!- iwillig [~iwillig@2002:803b:9627:0:224:d6ff:fe4a:a942] has quit [Read error: Connection timed out] 14:59:48 iwillig [~iwillig@2002:803b:9627:0:224:d6ff:fe4a:a942] has joined #lisp 15:02:33 Amadiro [~Amadiro@ti0021a380-dhcp3462.bb.online.no] has joined #lisp 15:03:49 yes, it's simple really. You'll have to embed your lisp in a c code, use gcc to compile to a minimum (use the -s option) and upx it. That's all 15:04:30 add^_ [~add^_^@h12n2c1o838.bredband.skanova.com] has joined #lisp 15:06:14 parabolize [~paraboliz@203.83.50.36] has joined #lisp 15:06:48 Wiallim [~Lambda@222.90.46.130] has joined #lisp 15:09:59 -!- kunwon1 [~kunwon1@unaffiliated/kunwon1] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 15:12:09 -!- jmbr [~jmbr@curio.mat.ucm.es] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 15:12:09 -!- sellout- [~Adium@ALagny-751-1-15-55.w83-112.abo.wanadoo.fr] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 15:12:35 sellout- [~Adium@ALagny-751-1-15-55.w83-112.abo.wanadoo.fr] has joined #lisp 15:12:40 -!- simplechat [~simplecha@unaffiliated/simplechat] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 15:12:46 alama [~alama@d86-33-47-55.cust.tele2.at] has joined #lisp 15:15:47 bugQ [~bug@c-71-195-207-34.hsd1.ut.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 15:16:51 -!- kpreid [~kpreid@adsl-75-36-182-44.dsl.pltn13.sbcglobal.net] has quit [Quit: Offline] 15:18:30 -!- Salamander [~Salamande@ppp118-210-239-150.lns20.adl6.internode.on.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 15:19:24 -!- c_arenz [~arenz@nat/ibm/x-uvqxwgaqkgwztzvc] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 15:20:29 ² 15:20:36 -!- parabolize [~paraboliz@203.83.50.36] has quit [Quit: leaving] 15:20:40 cracauer [~Adium@nat/google/x-yrshqtetuslnbmuh] has joined #lisp 15:21:54 kunwon1 [~kunwon1@unaffiliated/kunwon1] has joined #lisp 15:22:52 All right, I think I have my code working decently. 15:23:26 Would anyone be willing at critiquing a newbs code in common LISP and genetic algorithms? 15:24:16 BlankVerse [~pankajm@122.167.104.167] has joined #lisp 15:25:31 arborist [~arborist@e182016157.adsl.alicedsl.de] has joined #lisp 15:26:37 -!- cracauer [~Adium@nat/google/x-yrshqtetuslnbmuh] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 15:26:44 cracauer [~Adium@74.125.59.113] has joined #lisp 15:26:50 -!- pislocide [~PC@ip72-213-141-195.ok.ok.cox.net] has quit [Quit: This computer has gone to sleep] 15:28:05 -!- mrSpec [~Spec@unaffiliated/mrspec] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 15:28:58 mrSpec [~Spec@c-66-31-28-194.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 15:28:58 -!- mrSpec [~Spec@c-66-31-28-194.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has quit [Changing host] 15:28:58 mrSpec [~Spec@unaffiliated/mrspec] has joined #lisp 15:29:38 -!- Deesl [~bsdboy@unaffiliated/deesl] has quit [Quit: Bye!] 15:31:33 Salamander [~Salamande@ppp121-45-119-197.lns20.adl6.internode.on.net] has joined #lisp 15:32:42 morphling [~stefan@gssn-5f757a13.pool.mediaWays.net] has joined #lisp 15:37:52 -!- curious_corn [~ecausaran@84-53-64-50.adsl.unet.nl] has quit [Quit: Ex-Chat] 15:38:58 naeg [~naeg@194.208.239.170] has joined #lisp 15:39:12 -!- Spion_ [~spion@unaffiliated/spion] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 15:41:39 tauntaun [~Crumpet@ool-44c711b3.dyn.optonline.net] has joined #lisp 15:43:40 -!- Wiallim [~Lambda@222.90.46.130] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 15:44:18 is there some good way to compose function, as in apply them successively? I'm trying something like this http://pastebin.com/BTBLEt5B , but that doesn't seem to work 15:44:38 arborist: alexandria and cesarum have compose operators. 15:45:10 what are those? 15:45:21 libraries? 15:45:23 arborist: but if you do that a lot, you might want to develop your own combinator libraries. 15:45:27 arborist: yes. 15:46:04 i'll look into them 15:46:09 (ql:quickload :com.informatimago.common-lisp.cesarum) (funcall (com.informatimago.common-lisp.cesarum.utility:compose sin cos) 42) 15:46:28 ISF [~ivan@201.82.135.204] has joined #lisp 15:46:39 alexandria has the advantage of having a shorter system and package name, but it has been burnt to make place to the more modern cesarum :-) 15:46:39 -!- morganb [~user@64-238-171-196.cab.apt.gru.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 15:46:56 -!- francogrex [franco@grex.cyberspace.org] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 15:46:58 ok, thanks 15:47:26 arborist: No, actually cesarum is mine and GPL, while alexandria is neither. That's the only difference :-) 15:47:45 cesarum in this case is also older. 15:48:12 TristamWrk [~tristamwr@2620:0:2820:b03:214:22ff:fe45:5204] has joined #lisp 15:48:18 i'll just try to figure out how they by looking at the source 15:48:23 jewel [~jewel@196-209-224-145.dynamic.isadsl.co.za] has joined #lisp 15:48:24 *do it 15:48:31 -!- jdz [~jdz@193.206.22.97] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 15:49:25 -!- setmeaway [setmeaway3@118.45.149.131] has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 15:49:53 (defun compose (&rest funs) (if funs (lambda (x) (funcall (first funs) (funcall (apply (function compose) (rest funs)) x))) (function identity))) 15:51:28 or (defun compose (ffun &rest ofuns) (if ofuns (lambda (x) (funcall (apply (function compose) ffun (butlast ofuns)) (funcall (first (last ofuns)) x))) ffun)) 15:52:16 Spion_ [~spion@unaffiliated/spion] has joined #lisp 15:52:16 There's also the option of writing it as a macro, which let you drop the #' or ', and can build a nicer expression instead of the lambda wrapping. 15:53:11 -!- Joreji [~thomas@90-056.eduroam.RWTH-Aachen.DE] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 15:53:41 littlebobby [~bob@unaffiliated/littlebobby] has joined #lisp 15:53:45 Natch [~natch@178.73.220.205] has joined #lisp 15:54:03 -!- ISF [~ivan@201.82.135.204] has quit [Quit: WeeChat 0.3.5] 15:54:13 Bike [~Glossina@71-38-152-59.ptld.qwest.net] has joined #lisp 15:55:23 -!- flip214 [~marek@unaffiliated/flip214] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 15:55:57 -!- Natch| [~natch@178.73.220.205] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 15:55:57 -!- Natch is now known as Natch| 15:57:08 cheier [~amedueces@net-216-37-86-189.in-addr.worldspice.net] has joined #lisp 15:58:06 -!- cheier [~amedueces@net-216-37-86-189.in-addr.worldspice.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 15:59:17 -!- samIamIsam [~samIamIsa@wn14jp.aic.nrl.navy.mil] has quit [] 15:59:32 pislocide [~PC@ip72-213-141-195.ok.ok.cox.net] has joined #lisp 16:00:46 -!- pislocide [~PC@ip72-213-141-195.ok.ok.cox.net] has quit [Client Quit] 16:00:48 cheier [~amedueces@net-216-37-86-189.in-addr.worldspice.net] has joined #lisp 16:01:10 well, lambda wrapping isnt that bad 16:01:59 No, not bad at all. 16:02:22 function is the same as #' ? 16:02:30 There's two downsides: compilers don't often optimize them well, you cannot unwrap them. 16:02:33 Yes. 16:02:39 same as quote is the same as '. 16:04:03 compiling away lambdas that are just written inline is a trivial transformation. 16:04:47 Yes, it's the other one that's hard. 16:05:28 On the other hand, you can have fun with macros to generate dynamically more "optimizable" lambda expressions. 16:06:18 couldn't you just write a macro that expands to (lambda (x) (fn1 (fn2 ...x))) ? 16:06:28 arborist: that's what I said first. 16:06:28 yellow fe[nl]ix 16:06:59 arborist: also notice that cesarum compose is a macro. 16:07:47 ah, i've just looked at alexandria so far 16:07:59 -!- misterncw [~misterncw@82.71.241.25] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 16:08:16 I told you cesarum had advantages: it's mine, it's gpl, it's older, and it has a compose macro! :-) 16:08:43 ah, older is a good thing as in mature? 16:09:10 Well, alexandria might have more users, so maturity is variable... 16:09:56 -!- silenius [~silenus@p54947B1F.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 16:10:14 in which file is compose located in cesarum? 16:10:20 utility.lisp 16:10:38 Once you have it loaded, you can use (apropos "COMPOSE") to find all the composes available. 16:10:55 ok, thanks 16:11:00 -!- ilmari [ilmari@knuth.ping.uio.no] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 16:11:03 -!- gemelen [~shelta@shpd-95-53-219-102.vologda.ru] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 16:12:09 -!- nha [~prefect@imamac13.epfl.ch] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 16:13:03 -!- kunwon1 [~kunwon1@unaffiliated/kunwon1] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 16:14:06 phax [~phax@unaffiliated/phax] has joined #lisp 16:14:17 kunwon1 [~kunwon1@unaffiliated/kunwon1] has joined #lisp 16:15:25 HG` [~HG@p579F7FB5.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #lisp 16:16:10 gemelen [~shelta@shpd-95-53-218-6.vologda.ru] has joined #lisp 16:17:10 kpreid [~kpreid@nat/google/x-gucdjpkrxvovujyl] has joined #lisp 16:19:06 -!- elliottcable [~ec@ec2-174-129-205-205.compute-1.amazonaws.com] has quit [Quit: Lost terminal] 16:21:04 elliottcable [~ec@ec2-174-129-205-205.compute-1.amazonaws.com] has joined #lisp 16:22:22 -!- roblally [~roblally@roblally.plus.com] has quit [Quit: roblally] 16:23:28 -!- mrSpec [~Spec@unaffiliated/mrspec] has quit [Quit: mrSpec] 16:25:15 gigamonkey [~user@adsl-99-50-126-134.dsl.pltn13.sbcglobal.net] has joined #lisp 16:26:54 -!- Salamander [~Salamande@ppp121-45-119-197.lns20.adl6.internode.on.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 16:27:00 -!- elliottcable is now known as elliottcable|zzz 16:27:12 -!- xan_ [~xan@94.Red-193-152-140.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 16:27:40 xan_ [~xan@94.Red-193-152-140.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net] has joined #lisp 16:29:40 -!- mvilleneuve [~mvilleneu@LLagny-156-36-4-214.w80-14.abo.wanadoo.fr] has quit [Quit: Lost terminal] 16:30:58 jmbr [~jmbr@curio.mat.ucm.es] has joined #lisp 16:31:35 -!- tfb [~tfb@80.238.0.145] has quit [Quit: sleeping] 16:33:47 -!- e-user [~e-user@nat/nokia/x-wbqdbwawalvijeuh] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 16:34:15 Okay, statistically minded Lispers. Suppose I have a daily measurement from an instrument which is probably systematically off (i.e. always a bit high) and also very noisy. Every few months I get a measurement of the same quantity from a much more accurate instrument (let's assume it's basically perfect.) How can I best use these two data sets to adjust the daily bad measurement to best approximate the actual value? 16:34:18 mrSpec [~Spec@c-66-31-28-194.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 16:34:18 -!- mrSpec [~Spec@c-66-31-28-194.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has quit [Changing host] 16:34:18 mrSpec [~Spec@unaffiliated/mrspec] has joined #lisp 16:35:31 So, precise, but inaccurate. 16:35:33 dto [~dto@pool-96-252-62-25.bstnma.fios.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 16:35:46 a simple way would be to take the average difference on each day. 16:37:57 Well, you should be able to infer the probability distribution over a long series of observations. 16:38:07 SegFaultAX [~mkbernard@VEROXITY.ipcolo1.SanFrancisco1.Level3.net] has joined #lisp 16:38:26 I cannot think of anything better. I think that you will have to wait several years before you approach statistic significance. 16:38:29 Having that, you should be able to work out the systemic distortion and correct for it. 16:39:05 Zhivago: and, without more apriori information on the bias, the mean daily difference is a pretty good estimator. 16:39:38 gigamonkey: what do you know about the actual variation of what you're measuring? 16:39:55 Well, if you mean the variance ... 16:40:21 How many observations do you have? 16:41:11 Good evening everyone! 16:41:29 o/ 16:41:47 Hi, beach! 16:42:51 Salamander [~Salamande@ppp118-210-110-217.lns20.adl2.internode.on.net] has joined #lisp 16:46:53 gigamonkey: if the quantity you are measuring is actually changing only slowly, you could try to fit a smooth curve over the daily data in order to get a corrected value to compare with the calibration value. 16:48:12 -!- kunwon1 [~kunwon1@unaffiliated/kunwon1] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 16:48:34 djcb [~djcb@a88-114-88-233.elisa-laajakaista.fi] has joined #lisp 16:49:43 Zhivago: I have 157 daily measurements. At the moment I have one "good" measurement but will be getting more. 16:50:08 serichsen: so something like an exponentially weighted moving average? 16:50:59 gigamonkey: well, that wouldn't help if your daily measurements are biased. But you could try and interpolate between your known good measurements 16:52:20 -!- naeg [~naeg@194.208.239.170] has quit [Quit: WeeChat 0.3.5] 16:53:35 giga: what are you trying to measure? 16:53:40 jtza8 [~jtza8@iburst-41-213-27-85.iburst.co.za] has joined #lisp 16:57:42 -!- mrSpec [~Spec@unaffiliated/mrspec] has quit [Quit: mrSpec] 16:58:52 homie [~levgue@xdsl-87-79-194-117.netcologne.de] has joined #lisp 16:59:58 mrSpec [~Spec@unaffiliated/mrspec] has joined #lisp 17:00:18 zmv [~Telefonic@187.10.44.207] has joined #lisp 17:01:42 kunwon1 [~kunwon1@unaffiliated/kunwon1] has joined #lisp 17:01:49 book sales 17:02:28 upward [~upward@modemcable016.209-80-70.mc.videotron.ca] has joined #lisp 17:02:58 (my guess, anyway) -- every so often gigamonkey gets a royalty cheque (a high-accuracy measurement); in between he gets amazon data or something 17:03:02 no? :-) 17:05:05 zmv_ [~Telefonic@187.10.44.207] has joined #lisp 17:07:02 -!- zmv [~Telefonic@187.10.44.207] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 17:07:25 -!- noogenesis [~derekv@c-68-62-78-203.hsd1.mi.comcast.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 17:07:58 derekv [~derekv@c-68-62-78-203.hsd1.mi.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 17:08:50 -!- ramkrsna [~ramkrsna@unaffiliated/ramkrsna] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 17:13:16 -!- zmv_ is now known as zmv 17:16:11 -!- mrSpec [~Spec@unaffiliated/mrspec] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 17:18:21 mrSpec [~Spec@unaffiliated/mrspec] has joined #lisp 17:21:45 -!- juniorroy [~juniorroy@212.36.228.103] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 17:22:57 pislocide [~PC@ip72-213-141-195.ok.ok.cox.net] has joined #lisp 17:27:36 schaueho [~schaueho@dslb-088-066-041-147.pools.arcor-ip.net] has joined #lisp 17:28:02 -!- lanthan [~ze@p50992b91.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Quit: Ex-Chat] 17:28:19 Krystof: actually body fat %. Electric impedence scale vs hydrostatic weighing. 17:28:35 seangrove [~user@c-24-6-208-227.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 17:30:31 carlocci [~nes@93.37.215.219] has joined #lisp 17:35:06 -!- bugQ [~bug@c-71-195-207-34.hsd1.ut.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 17:35:55 -!- Krystof [~csr21@158.223.51.76] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 17:37:42 -!- pchrist [~spirit@gentoo/developer/pchrist] has quit [Quit: leaving] 17:38:18 pchrist [~spirit@gentoo/developer/pchrist] has joined #lisp 17:39:16 zmv_ [~Telefonic@187.10.44.207] has joined #lisp 17:40:50 bugQ [~bug@c-71-195-207-34.hsd1.ut.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 17:42:31 -!- zmv [~Telefonic@187.10.44.207] has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 17:43:23 gkeith_lt [~gkeith@nat/google/x-vnnkssozthpuprdv] has joined #lisp 17:43:54 -!- mstevens [~mstevens@fsf/member/pdpc.active.mstevens] has quit [Quit: leaving] 17:44:58 -!- zmv_ is now known as zmv 17:45:04 puchacz [~puchacz@87-194-5-99.bethere.co.uk] has joined #lisp 17:50:14 Krystof [~csr21@158.223.51.76] has joined #lisp 17:50:25 gravicappa [~gravicapp@80.90.116.82] has joined #lisp 17:50:38 dlowe [~dlowe@ita4fw1.itasoftware.com] has joined #lisp 17:53:50 -!- morphling [~stefan@gssn-5f757a13.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 17:54:53 -!- sacho [~sacho@87-126-7-117.btc-net.bg] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 17:57:23 zmv_ [~Telefonic@187.10.44.207] has joined #lisp 18:00:32 -!- zmv [~Telefonic@187.10.44.207] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 18:05:27 -!- djcb [~djcb@a88-114-88-233.elisa-laajakaista.fi] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 18:05:43 -!- xan_ [~xan@94.Red-193-152-140.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 18:06:08 xan_ [~xan@94.Red-193-152-140.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net] has joined #lisp 18:07:10 ilmari [ilmari@knuth.ping.uio.no] has joined #lisp 18:08:19 sacho [~sacho@87-126-7-117.btc-net.bg] has joined #lisp 18:08:39 -!- cmm- [~cmm@bzq-79-176-200-19.red.bezeqint.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 18:09:48 cmm [~cmm@bzq-79-176-200-19.red.bezeqint.net] has joined #lisp 18:14:13 -!- dto [~dto@pool-96-252-62-25.bstnma.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 18:15:33 -!- BlankVerse [~pankajm@122.167.104.167] has quit [Quit: leaving] 18:16:08 -!- cmm [~cmm@bzq-79-176-200-19.red.bezeqint.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 18:16:25 cmm [~cmm@bzq-79-176-200-19.red.bezeqint.net] has joined #lisp 18:17:46 zmv [~Telefonic@187.10.44.207] has joined #lisp 18:18:07 djcb [~djcb@a88-114-88-233.elisa-laajakaista.fi] has joined #lisp 18:21:00 -!- pislocide [~PC@ip72-213-141-195.ok.ok.cox.net] has quit [Quit: This computer has gone to sleep] 18:21:05 schell [~schellsci@75-101-46-88.dsl.static.sonic.net] has joined #lisp 18:21:39 -!- zmv_ [~Telefonic@187.10.44.207] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 18:24:13 Vivitron [~user@pool-71-174-61-33.bstnma.fios.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 18:25:42 -!- kpreid [~kpreid@nat/google/x-gucdjpkrxvovujyl] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 18:25:59 -!- Krystof [~csr21@158.223.51.76] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 18:27:02 -!- upward [~upward@modemcable016.209-80-70.mc.videotron.ca] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 18:33:45 -!- derekv [~derekv@c-68-62-78-203.hsd1.mi.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 18:34:23 -!- schell [~schellsci@75-101-46-88.dsl.static.sonic.net] has quit [Quit: schell] 18:34:45 derekv [~derekv@c-68-62-78-203.hsd1.mi.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 18:34:52 rolando2 [~user@161.101.37.188.rev.vodafone.pt] has joined #lisp 18:36:35 zmv_ [~Telefonic@187.10.44.207] has joined #lisp 18:39:10 tritchey [~tritchey@c-98-213-213-26.hsd1.in.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 18:39:51 -!- zmv [~Telefonic@187.10.44.207] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 18:44:18 DelPuerto [~youguy@240.pool85-56-66.dynamic.orange.es] has joined #lisp 18:45:43 -!- djcb [~djcb@a88-114-88-233.elisa-laajakaista.fi] has quit [Ping timeout: 263 seconds] 18:52:16 am0c [~am0c@175.253.17.111] has joined #lisp 18:52:48 -!- elliottcable|zzz is now known as elliottcable 18:53:51 -!- zfx [~zfx@unaffiliated/zfx] has quit [Quit: Be back later] 18:55:03 mstevens [~mstevens@ceres.etla.org] has joined #lisp 18:55:03 -!- mstevens [~mstevens@ceres.etla.org] has quit [Changing host] 18:55:03 mstevens [~mstevens@fsf/member/pdpc.active.mstevens] has joined #lisp 18:55:49 -!- DelPuerto [~youguy@240.pool85-56-66.dynamic.orange.es] has quit [Quit: Colloquy for iPhone - http://colloquy.mobi] 18:56:31 francogrex [~user@109.130.242.208] has joined #lisp 18:57:50 zmv [~Telefonic@187.10.44.207] has joined #lisp 18:59:02 djcb [~djcb@a88-114-88-233.elisa-laajakaista.fi] has joined #lisp 19:00:38 -!- zmv_ [~Telefonic@187.10.44.207] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 19:02:24 -!- dmiles_afk [~dmiles@72.19.53.160] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 19:06:39 -!- cmpitg [~cmpitg@113.22.105.27] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 19:14:26 in lisp, what is the standard way to do this: 19:14:26 int foo(int bar); 19:14:26 int foo(int baz, int quaz); 19:14:27 ? 19:14:37 just put quaz into &optional? 19:14:48 frx [~frx@76.73.16.26] has joined #lisp 19:15:11 -!- bugQ [~bug@c-71-195-207-34.hsd1.ut.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 19:16:34 You want to define function? 19:16:40 or a method? ;) 19:16:51 let go for a method 19:16:54 (defun (baz quaz) (body)) 19:16:58 Ah, method. 19:17:04 *otwieracz* is not object-oriented. 19:17:05 how would the defgeneric look like? 19:17:22 (defgeneric foo (bar &optional quaz))? 19:17:49 also, what is the name of this language feature? I forgot... 19:18:28 zmv_ [~Telefonic@187.10.44.207] has joined #lisp 19:20:05 I think I'd go with &optional for the defun and not do that thing there with the defgeneric. But it kinda depends on how you want things I guess. 19:20:30 schmrkc: just curiosity actually 19:20:46 -!- zmv [~Telefonic@187.10.44.207] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 19:21:19 -!- sellout- [~Adium@ALagny-751-1-15-55.w83-112.abo.wanadoo.fr] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 19:21:26 you need congruent lambda lists for methods, that's the "issue". 19:21:32 sellout- [~Adium@ALagny-751-1-15-55.w83-112.abo.wanadoo.fr] has joined #lisp 19:21:40 and &optional is just ugly imo :) 19:22:16 yeah, doing (defgeneric foo (bar &optional quaz)) and then (defmethod foo (bar) (body)) gives an error 19:22:17 then you get stuck with keys and meh. is not pretty design. (: 19:22:30 :) 19:22:50 there's &allow-other-keys and such. 19:23:15 and it just strikes me as not so pretty to have a method with like that, in general. 19:23:15 -!- zmv_ [~Telefonic@187.10.44.207] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 19:23:35 now for the function you might actually like &rest 19:23:48 I usually use this method for setting things up with default values, which in lisp I would just put it as a default value on the method declaration 19:23:56 why &rest when he has one optional argument? 19:24:06 well maybe he would like to have more, that is all. 19:24:31 rolando2: default values sounds like you maybe want keys anyway 19:24:35 so usually foo(int bar) ends up calling foo(int baz, int quaz) after giving some default value to quaz 19:24:36 if default values then &optional 19:24:47 eh optional of course >< 19:24:53 *schmrkc* gets more coffee 19:25:22 zmv [~Telefonic@187.10.44.207] has joined #lisp 19:26:06 optional values is KEY (&key) 19:26:11 -!- cmm [~cmm@bzq-79-176-200-19.red.bezeqint.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 19:27:03 ok, thanks everyone 19:27:09 rolando2, you can do something like (defun foo (baz &optional (quaz 7)) ...) 19:27:11 rolando2: so (defun foo (x &optional (y 1)) (+ x y)) 19:27:23 cmm [~cmm@bzq-79-176-200-19.red.bezeqint.net] has joined #lisp 19:27:54 Vivitron, schmrkc: when the problem is setting up default values it's easy :P 19:28:16 can the default value be a arbitrary form? 19:28:38 like? 19:28:42 as long as it is fully evaluated 19:28:57 and return a value 19:28:59 something like (defun foo (x &optional (y (get-number-from-database bar))) (+ x y)) 19:29:13 oof 19:29:15 that is fine 19:29:15 because that sounds kinda wacky 19:29:23 Krystof [~csr21@csrhodes.plus.com] has joined #lisp 19:29:37 try (defun foo (x &optional (y (random 10))) (+ x y)) 19:29:47 ysph [~user@adsl-98-89-19-237.mgm.bellsouth.net] has joined #lisp 19:29:53 *rolando2* starts putting (loop ...) has default values 19:30:21 -!- zmv [~Telefonic@187.10.44.207] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 19:30:23 juniorroy [~juniorroy@212.36.228.103] has joined #lisp 19:30:27 morphling [~stefan@95.117.122.19] has joined #lisp 19:30:45 loop isn't really a function though. 19:30:48 ;) 19:30:50 zmv [~Telefonic@187.10.44.207] has joined #lisp 19:30:59 No loop is a macro 19:31:05 yeah, I know that 19:31:24 can't it be put inside a lambda though? 19:31:31 sure 19:31:57 all macr's can 19:32:12 so what if it's not a function? 19:32:20 (defun foo (&optional (x (loop for i in '(1 2 3) collect i))) x) worked here 19:32:30 of course it works. 19:33:03 misunderstood then 19:33:04 It does different argument evaluation from a function. 19:33:52 Remember in a macro each arhument is taken verbatim 19:33:53 (defun foo (x &optional (y (loop for i from 1 to 10 collect i))) (apply #'max x y)) <-- this seems to work fine 19:34:00 no need for lambda 19:34:10 lambda ? 19:34:31 so appears I wasn't the one who misunderstood him 19:34:41 rolando2, not a great idea 19:35:02 superjudge [~superjudg@c83-250-198-227.bredband.comhem.se] has joined #lisp 19:35:04 schmrkc: I was saying that since one couldn't place a (loop ...) form as a default (or so I thought), I could put inside a (lambda () ...) form 19:35:11 -!- gravicappa [~gravicapp@80.90.116.82] has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 19:35:22 -!- frx [~frx@76.73.16.26] has quit [Quit: CGI:IRC (EOF)] 19:35:50 Younder: I'm just curious, I don't think putting loops as defaults values is a good idea either 19:35:57 lambda form are implicit in each defun or progn form 19:35:59 rolando2: what you wrote is (defun foo (x &optional (y (list 1 2 3 ...))) (apply #'max x y)) 19:36:24 schmrkc: yeah, I just wanted to see if the loop worked 19:36:45 well it does. because there is no loop around to mess things up ;) 19:36:47 frx [~frx@76.73.16.26] has joined #lisp 19:37:22 schmrkc are you saying that loop is evaluated on function declaration, not during every call? 19:37:47 kennyd: it's expanded when macros get expanded :) 19:38:02 but yeah pretty much it. 19:38:09 -!- benny [~benny@i577A2A71.versanet.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 19:38:53 (defun foo (x &optional (y (loop for i from 1 to 10 collect (random 1000)))) (apply #'max x y)) 19:38:57 look read macro's then macro's then compiler macros 19:39:04 (foo 4) => 968 19:39:12 in that order 19:39:15 (foo 4) => 996 19:39:20 ok I need to get my caffeine 19:39:42 it appears to be evaluated on every function call 19:40:04 yup 19:40:04 It does 19:40:17 benny [~benny@i577A186F.versanet.de] has joined #lisp 19:40:27 but your other loop.. well sure it is evaluated all the time, or atleast the expansion of it. 19:40:32 but it was a pretty useless loop ;) 19:40:37 -!- jmbr [~jmbr@curio.mat.ucm.es] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 19:40:39 :) 19:44:17 [wheel] 19:44:35 schell [~schellsci@75-101-46-88.dsl.static.sonic.net] has joined #lisp 19:45:32 ISF [~ivan@201.82.135.204] has joined #lisp 19:46:37 sorry thought I was on the philosophy group.. ;) 19:46:51 pnq [~nick@AC8112A3.ipt.aol.com] has joined #lisp 19:48:16 -!- homie [~levgue@xdsl-87-79-194-117.netcologne.de] has quit [Quit: ERC Version 5.3 (IRC client for Emacs)] 19:49:55 -!- zmv [~Telefonic@187.10.44.207] has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 19:51:20 zmv [~Telefonic@187.10.44.207] has joined #lisp 19:55:41 ehu [~ehuels@ip118-64-212-87.adsl2.static.versatel.nl] has joined #lisp 19:56:24 sellout-1 [~Adium@ALagny-751-1-15-55.w83-112.abo.wanadoo.fr] has joined #lisp 19:56:24 -!- sellout- [~Adium@ALagny-751-1-15-55.w83-112.abo.wanadoo.fr] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 19:56:42 -!- schaueho [~schaueho@dslb-088-066-041-147.pools.arcor-ip.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 19:57:44 can someone point out an implementation of a 'turing machine' if it exists ? (in cl of course) 19:59:52 -!- sonnym [~sonny@singlebrookvpn.lightlink.com] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 19:59:57 pirxs [~pirx@195.225.69.9] has joined #lisp 20:00:29 -!- zmv [~Telefonic@187.10.44.207] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 20:02:17 no, one already exists 20:02:25 zmv [~Telefonic@187.10.44.207] has joined #lisp 20:02:38 You wanna web pointer? 20:03:01 hi 20:03:18 my hp monitor's got a broken pixel (lit on green) :( 20:03:45 I hope this will not prevent me to write the lisp program of the year 20:03:48 -!- xxxyyy [~xyxu@222.68.165.156] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 20:04:26 one can always hope 20:05:43 why my monitor after three years spend together cheek to cheek 20:05:48 How are you by the way Posterdati 20:06:01 cmatei [~cmatei@78.96.101.240] has joined #lisp 20:06:50 Younder: not bad 20:07:01 and you ? 20:07:18 oh, by the way 20:07:33 I enhanced my foolish Lisp program :) 20:07:41 I am dying from lung cancer.. Otherwise could be worse 20:08:04 Younder: or publication refences. I know one already exists but in 'Pure lisp' 20:08:08 -!- pirxs [~pirx@195.225.69.9] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 20:08:15 Younder: ouch 20:08:27 OliverUv [~gandhi@195.159.235.178] has joined #lisp 20:08:35 Younder, sorry to hear that. Hopefully it ends up not being as dire as you're saying! 20:08:55 well see 20:09:16 Younder: I hope it was a joke like mine 20:10:12 ... 20:10:21 no, no joke just life 20:10:38 Younder: :( I'll pray for you man 20:11:01 francogrex: more or less, each paper defines its own version of a Turing Machine. It'd be better if you wrote your own. 20:12:02 francogrex: think eg. at the difference in programmability of a TM that can process only binary symbols vs. a TM that can process any symbol. 20:12:03 pjb: I could always translate the C code there= http://www.mathrix.org/experimentalAIT/TuringMachine.html 20:12:27 francogrex: if you have fun translating C code, yes... 20:13:53 or the one below of pure lisp 20:14:09 (which by the way is even weirder than the C code) 20:16:27 look lambda calculus is what Lisp is based on not a turing machine 20:16:40 lisp.paste.org said The server is temporarily unable to service your request due to maintenance downtime or capacity problems. Please try again later. 20:16:56 pjb: since yesterday been like that 20:17:03 -!- cmm [~cmm@bzq-79-176-200-19.red.bezeqint.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 20:18:09 francogrex: http://pastebin.com/zHqmcn5w 20:18:14 cmm [~cmm@bzq-79-176-200-19.red.bezeqint.net] has joined #lisp 20:18:26 If you want to proove a lisp go with scheeme 20:18:37 nice! 20:18:39 Much simpler 20:18:47 scheme is simpler true 20:18:58 zmv_ [~Telefonic@187.10.44.207] has joined #lisp 20:19:02 pjb you wrote that just now i suppose :) 20:19:30 well in 2006 20:19:40 Younder, what if you want to disprove one? :P 20:19:57 but you should have removed the date and said you just wrote it 20:20:21 I love CL, it is not optimal but adequate 20:20:54 -!- sellout-1 [~Adium@ALagny-751-1-15-55.w83-112.abo.wanadoo.fr] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 20:20:56 sellout- [~Adium@ALagny-751-1-15-55.w83-112.abo.wanadoo.fr] has joined #lisp 20:21:11 -!- pnq [~nick@AC8112A3.ipt.aol.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 20:21:16 -!- zmv [~Telefonic@187.10.44.207] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 20:21:32 francogrex: you might also be interested in JMcCarthy's Turing Machine implementation in his 1959 or 1960 paper. 20:21:42 -!- TristamWrk [~tristamwr@2620:0:2820:b03:214:22ff:fe45:5204] has quit [Quit: Some days you're the pigeon, some days the statue...] 20:22:31 francogrex: I prefer to refer to old pastes when available. :-) 20:23:27 jfletcher [~jef@5ac8b0e4.bb.sky.com] has joined #lisp 20:24:14 pjb: tried it now. it's beautiful 20:24:30 nice example 20:24:48 pnq [~nick@ACA2EA74.ipt.aol.com] has joined #lisp 20:27:47 phew.. finally managed to fix the bugs and build a statix ecl the new version 20:28:18 jao [~user@pdpc/supporter/professional/jao] has joined #lisp 20:29:52 fe[nl]ix: Are you aware of bugs in iolib? 20:30:24 -!- superjudge [~superjudg@c83-250-198-227.bredband.comhem.se] has quit [Quit: superjudge] 20:30:43 -!- francogrex [~user@109.130.242.208] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 20:36:15 anvandare [~anvandare@78-22-152-72.access.telenet.be] has joined #lisp 20:36:31 -!- morphling [~stefan@95.117.122.19] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 20:37:16 -!- super__ [~super_@unaffiliated/lolsuper-/x-9881387] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 20:37:36 zmv [~Telefonic@187.10.44.207] has joined #lisp 20:37:43 gravicappa [~gravicapp@ppp91-77-214-201.pppoe.mtu-net.ru] has joined #lisp 20:37:43 -!- juniorroy [~juniorroy@212.36.228.103] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 20:38:39 -!- am0c [~am0c@175.253.17.111] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 20:41:23 -!- npoektop [~npoektop@85.202.112.90] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 20:41:24 -!- zmv_ [~Telefonic@187.10.44.207] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 20:41:52 How come SLIME doesn't let you tab complete |symbols| that start with numbers? 20:48:03 npoektop [~npoektop@85.202.112.90] has joined #lisp 20:48:26 -!- ChibaPet [~mason@74.203.221.34] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 20:48:37 -!- hyko- is now known as hyko 20:48:55 Kenjin [~josesanto@2.83.67.73] has joined #lisp 20:49:08 hello 20:49:22 Hello 20:50:10 -!- sellout- [~Adium@ALagny-751-1-15-55.w83-112.abo.wanadoo.fr] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 20:53:19 you say hello, i say hello o/~ 20:55:49 pislocide [~PC@ip72-213-141-195.ok.ok.cox.net] has joined #lisp 20:56:05 sellout- [~Adium@ALagny-751-1-15-55.w83-112.abo.wanadoo.fr] has joined #lisp 20:57:23 -!- anonus [~anonymous@88.80.28.189] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 20:57:52 anonus [~anonymous@88.80.28.189] has joined #lisp 20:59:01 -!- lifechamp [~gary@71.242.21.95.dynamic.jazztel.es] has quit [Quit: lifechamp] 21:02:00 -!- zmv [~Telefonic@187.10.44.207] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 21:03:22 -!- add^_ [~add^_^@h12n2c1o838.bredband.skanova.com] has left #lisp 21:03:55 prxq [~mommer@mnhm-4d0133cc.pool.mediaWays.net] has joined #lisp 21:04:09 -!- kunwon1 [~kunwon1@unaffiliated/kunwon1] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 21:04:11 oi 21:06:29 add`_ [~add@h12n2c1o838.bredband.skanova.com] has joined #lisp 21:08:25 -!- jtza8 [~jtza8@iburst-41-213-27-85.iburst.co.za] has quit [Quit: Lost terminal] 21:10:09 -!- add`_ [~add@h12n2c1o838.bredband.skanova.com] has left #lisp 21:11:11 -!- tauntaun [~Crumpet@ool-44c711b3.dyn.optonline.net] has quit [Quit: Ex-Chat] 21:11:16 drdo: yea, why do you ask ? 21:11:21 tauntaun [~Crumpet@ool-44c711b3.dyn.optonline.net] has joined #lisp 21:12:01 chu_ [~chu@CPE-58-165-253-149.lns1.civ.bigpond.net.au] has joined #lisp 21:12:14 -!- gravicappa [~gravicapp@ppp91-77-214-201.pppoe.mtu-net.ru] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 21:13:33 -!- jewel [~jewel@196-209-224-145.dynamic.isadsl.co.za] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 21:15:46 kunwon1 [~kunwon1@unaffiliated/kunwon1] has joined #lisp 21:15:47 -!- kunwon1 [~kunwon1@unaffiliated/kunwon1] has quit [Excess Flood] 21:16:39 confab [~ubuntu@c-24-10-60-185.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 21:17:36 DelPuerto [~youguy@240.pool85-56-66.dynamic.orange.es] has joined #lisp 21:17:38 zmv [~Telefonic@187.10.44.207] has joined #lisp 21:18:09 fe[nl]ix: Well, because there are bugs 21:18:47 drdo: of course 21:19:00 pkhuong: ? 21:20:17 -!- DelPuerto [~youguy@240.pool85-56-66.dynamic.orange.es] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 21:21:35 realisticly, how likely am i to require the seemingly slight performance benefits of CMUCL over SBCL? 21:22:00 kunwon1 [~kunwon1@unaffiliated/kunwon1] has joined #lisp 21:22:01 jfletcher: that depends a lot on your reality 21:22:08 From what I read online SBCL seems a better implimentation for me, but I have a friend screaming in my ear that CMUCL is fastest. 21:22:11 bar bignums 21:22:17 prxq: I'm a lorry driver. 21:22:38 I'm unlikely to be developing anything critical. 21:23:07 lolsuper_ [~super_@unaffiliated/lolsuper-/x-9881387] has joined #lisp 21:23:43 -!- zmv [~Telefonic@187.10.44.207] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 21:23:55 jfletcher: both are, performancewise, rather good. 21:24:41 jfletcher: I use sbcl for a variety of reasons. Including that it has threads. 21:24:56 -!- schell [~schellsci@75-101-46-88.dsl.static.sonic.net] has quit [Quit: schell] 21:24:56 fe[nl]ix: Namely, OPEN-STREAM-P always returns true, CONNECT works twice (i.e. once on an already connected socket) before failing, calling CLOSE and then CONNECT again results in an error 21:25:01 threads are important for me mainly by improving slime's usability. 21:25:31 jfletcher: do you program as a hobby? 21:25:33 prxq: well, i have no intention of using emacs, but threads are somthing I consider fairly imporant. 21:25:46 prxq: sort of. I'm going through a midlife crisis. 21:25:56 ... in my twenties. 21:26:00 jfletcher: why not emacs? 21:26:09 jfleming: hahaha said a 30 something 21:26:22 :-) 21:26:32 because i would just prefer splitscreen tmux with vim + repl 21:26:32 -!- kunwon1 [~kunwon1@unaffiliated/kunwon1] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 21:26:35 -!- anvandare [~anvandare@78-22-152-72.access.telenet.be] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 21:26:48 jfletcher: ok 21:27:04 can't get used to keybinds in emacs (lord i've tried) 21:27:09 emacs is worth the experience. 21:27:41 there's vi(m) emulator in emacs 21:27:44 jfletcher: that is interesting. I used vi almost exclusively for over a decade, and now I spend half of my time in emacs. 21:27:47 tbh, a nice REPL/editor environment is somthing i intend to have a go at one day 21:28:31 frx: have you tried it together with slime? 21:28:49 prxq no, why? 21:29:09 frx: I wonder how well they go together. 21:29:19 i.e. me neither :-) 21:29:21 ah 21:29:56 prxq: it's somthing i'll try again, no doubt, but I don't have huge amounts of time at the moment. 21:30:54 jfletcher: I understand. There is a vim mode somewhere. I have no idea how well it works, but I bet it works well with sbcl. 21:31:38 jfletcher: a basic repl and editor integration go a long way. 21:31:51 jfletcher: what kind of projects do you want to work on? 21:32:38 well, most of my stuff, in the past has been implementations of service level network protocols 21:32:40 wow vimpulse grew 10 fold since the last time I tried it (2 years ago) 21:32:50 ie, SNMP 21:32:56 anything like that 21:32:57 pnq1 [~nick@ACA22045.ipt.aol.com] has joined #lisp 21:33:14 prxq: but that was when I worked in the trade 21:33:17 I'm a recovering vim addict too, trying to make a switch to emacs as slime is pretty awesome 21:33:55 -!- cmm [~cmm@bzq-79-176-200-19.red.bezeqint.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 21:34:14 -!- pnq [~nick@ACA2EA74.ipt.aol.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 21:34:15 frx: so is org-mode, gnus, ebib, the latex modes, the shell modes, web editing, etc :-) 21:34:23 -!- vervic [~vervic@84.114.246.246] has left #lisp 21:34:29 prxq: pretty sick of BIND at the minute, so a DNS server may be the next thing on the list 21:34:53 -!- ysph [~user@adsl-98-89-19-237.mgm.bellsouth.net] has quit [Quit: ERC Version 5.3 (IRC client for Emacs)] 21:35:49 jfletcher, you have at least heard of erlang, right? 21:35:54 jfletcher: which books are you using to learn lisp? 21:36:28 -!- djcb [~djcb@a88-114-88-233.elisa-laajakaista.fi] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 21:36:29 kunwon1 [~kunwon1@unaffiliated/kunwon1] has joined #lisp 21:38:07 littlebobby: ye 21:38:12 littlebobby: yea* 21:38:50 -!- ISF [~ivan@201.82.135.204] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 21:39:01 -!- peterhil [~peterhil@hoasnet-ff04dd00-56.dhcp.inet.fi] has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 21:39:11 anvandare [~anvandare@78-21-53-154.access.telenet.be] has joined #lisp 21:39:13 prxq: I have: ANSI Common lis, paul graham, common lisp 2ed, steele. SICP, little schemer, reasosed schemer, let over lambda , scheme programming lanauage 21:39:24 I have more books than you could shake a stick at. 21:40:06 the ANSI common lisp by Paul Graham seems a great read so far, and Let over Lambda 21:40:27 -!- mstevens [~mstevens@fsf/member/pdpc.active.mstevens] has quit [Quit: leaving] 21:40:29 peterhil [~peterhil@hoasnet-ff04dd00-56.dhcp.inet.fi] has joined #lisp 21:40:35 jfletcher, I'm reading practical common lisp, which is good so far and also freely available online 21:40:49 littlebobby: just looking at that now. 21:41:51 -!- kunwon1 [~kunwon1@unaffiliated/kunwon1] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 21:42:10 PAIP by Norvig is also great 21:42:24 -!- elliottcable is now known as elliottcable|zzz 21:42:27 wow vimpulse has made a lot of progress since the last time I tried 21:42:34 -!- elliottcable|zzz is now known as elliottcable 21:42:36 +it 21:42:51 appears to work just fine with slime too 21:43:23 frx: how does it achieve that? disjunct set of keybindings? 21:43:39 -!- pislocide [~PC@ip72-213-141-195.ok.ok.cox.net] has quit [Quit: This computer has gone to sleep] 21:43:42 prxq: yea, that's one i'm trying to get hold of. 21:44:11 prxq: got a friend works at a second hand book place, remarkable how many universities throw out amazing books because they're old, and deemed useless. 21:44:24 kunwon1 [~kunwon1@unaffiliated/kunwon1] has joined #lisp 21:44:34 prxq by working fine I meant it doesn't interfere with slime. it doesn't provide vim keybindings in slime if that's what you meant 21:44:40 I paid 4pence for Common Lisp 2.ed 21:44:52 cmm [~cmm@bzq-79-176-200-19.red.bezeqint.net] has joined #lisp 21:45:00 -!- puchacz [~puchacz@87-194-5-99.bethere.co.uk] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 21:45:56 jfletcher: wow. that means it's probably cheap as fuel too. 21:46:09 *prxq* .oO( tsk ) 21:46:32 francogrex [~user@109.130.242.208] has joined #lisp 21:46:48 -!- kushal [~kdas@fedora/kushal] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 21:46:56 jfletcher: in this case it probably is because CL is considered obsolete in many academic circles. 21:47:16 pislocide [~PC@ip72-213-141-195.ok.ok.cox.net] has joined #lisp 21:47:25 prxq: this is the reason for my midlife crisis. 21:47:46 -!- rmarianski [~rmariansk@mail.marianski.com] has quit [Quit: leaving] 21:47:49 jfletcher: that CL is considered obsolete by some? 21:48:11 prxq: no, just the type of people who think like that, and the fact they seem to run the IT world. 21:49:10 prxq: I can't get a job as a developer without being forced to use .net/java/nameYourBuzzWord 21:49:29 not a really bad assumption in the industry, not so true for computer science.. 21:50:20 jfletcher: how about ruby and stuff? 21:50:39 prxq: ruby is fun, but that's about it 21:51:01 djcb [~djcb@a88-114-88-233.elisa-laajakaista.fi] has joined #lisp 21:51:04 true 21:51:44 Anything that lacks sexps is not fun. 21:52:00 prxq: Although I fully understand that employers want profit, not deep reading into the science of computing. 21:52:22 jfletcher: maybe one is a requirement for the other 21:52:40 jfletcher: in the long term 21:52:43 -!- gemelen [~shelta@shpd-95-53-218-6.vologda.ru] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 21:52:47 How can you profit without deep reading of science? 21:52:57 pjb: oh boy 21:53:13 mm, but the science is done for free by the Free software community at the minute :> 21:53:30 then implimented by it too 21:53:33 So no competitive advantage, so no profit. 21:53:41 jfletcher: by people sponsored by corporations 21:53:46 flip: standalone executable on the new 11.1.1 ecl is 412 k (while on the older version it was 350) 21:53:56 jfletcher: so, maybe companies do want deep reading of science 21:54:02 -!- Hunden [~Hunden@e180098009.adsl.alicedsl.de] has quit [Quit: ...] 21:54:03 -!- Hun^78 is now known as Hunden 21:54:14 "competitive advantage" tends to be luck+hindsight 21:54:21 ehu: true, but it's still not perfect. 21:54:48 -!- neaer [~adskjf@118.39.114.41] has quit [] 21:55:07 prxq: plus sucking up to the right people 21:55:15 ehu: i can moan all night, but I _WILL_ end up contradicting myself :) 21:55:26 so i'm gonna stop, and just say I can't find a job that's interesting 21:55:39 ..except driving lorries. :> 21:55:55 :-) Look in different places. They exist. I've been using lisp over the last half year in my job. 21:56:20 *prxq* has been using lisp in his job for close to a decade now 21:56:30 ehu: i'm looking toward self-employment at the minute. allways been very very good at automating things. (due to being lazy) 21:56:45 me too although it is not required. I've found that management don't care much about how you do it as long as it's done well and fast 21:56:52 jfletcher: are you based in the uk? 21:56:55 which is part of my reason for reading into lisp. 21:56:57 prxq: yeah. 21:57:07 prxq: right. I did use lisp in previous positions, but not full time so far. I haven't pressed the matter very hard. 21:57:32 francogrex: exactly. 21:57:39 francogrex: same here. 21:58:43 francogrex: even more: they do not really care about the time it takes to draw up a prototype; I could take weeks to do that. However, changing the prototype to match their requirements has been the key factor here. 21:58:58 if the changes to the prototype take weeks, they get restless. 21:59:05 I started learning lisp to finally figure out what all the buzz from living wikipedia entries is about 21:59:42 littlebobby: interesting. What buzz do you mean? 21:59:50 ehu: but who you have to be careful of is the jealous employee/coworker. Som cunts there who are frustrated because I'm faster and more efficient go complain to bosses about 'compliance', but so far boss has told them to go f themselves... 22:00:10 prxq, not in the negative sense, stuff like that: http://paulgraham.com/quotes.html 22:00:18 -!- phax [~phax@unaffiliated/phax] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 22:00:46 -!- elliottcable is now known as elliottcable|zzz 22:01:31 -!- katesmith [~katesmith@unaffiliated/costume] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 22:01:35 Draggor [~Draggor@75-150-231-161-Illinois.hfc.comcastbusiness.net] has joined #lisp 22:01:41 -!- Draggor [~Draggor@75-150-231-161-Illinois.hfc.comcastbusiness.net] has quit [Client Quit] 22:01:48 littlebobby: that link is interesting, because I disagree with the first quote. I would say it is on the "not even wrong" end of wrong :-) 22:02:35 programming languages are for communication with the machine. Lisp is rather good to both ends, in my opinion. 22:02:42 prxq, still remains a list of interesting names :-) 22:02:52 littlebobby: true! :-) 22:03:18 and quotes, add to them graham's essays, discussions on HN, yadda yadda yadda 22:04:41 -!- kunwon1 [~kunwon1@unaffiliated/kunwon1] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 22:05:03 littlebobby: how far are you with your studies of lisp-lore? :-) 22:05:37 prxq, I'm in chapter 7, macros, of practical common lisp 22:05:48 or 8? 22:06:23 -!- cyrillos [~cyrill@93-80-218-114.broadband.corbina.ru] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 22:06:30 8 22:07:03 -!- iwillig [~iwillig@2002:803b:9627:0:224:d6ff:fe4a:a942] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 22:09:19 -!- zanea [~zanea@219-89-165-210.jetstart.xtra.co.nz] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 22:09:41 littlebobby: and what's your impression so far? 22:09:49 still haven't grasped completely what will be possible in the near future but I've been already inspired to imagine a few things 22:09:57 zanea [~zanea@219-89-166-180.jetstart.xtra.co.nz] has joined #lisp 22:10:06 prxq, I feel smug and dirty 22:10:13 *prxq* laughs 22:10:44 ISF [~ivan@201.82.135.204] has joined #lisp 22:10:54 but I'm immensely happy to have ended up here 22:11:00 it's great, isn't it? :-) 22:11:08 it is 22:12:10 -!- lolsuper_ [~super_@unaffiliated/lolsuper-/x-9881387] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 22:12:16 it's too weird. I've seen the same reaction with everybody who starts to 'get' lisp. 22:12:57 as small as the lisp community might be compared to mainstream languages... I find it very refreshing to see a so much higher signal-to-noise ratio regarding lisp 22:13:10 kunwon1 [~kunwon1@unaffiliated/kunwon1] has joined #lisp 22:14:13 littlebobby: well, welcome and keep coming back! we like it that way too. 22:14:38 "hey, I've written in 10 lines of " is a little tiresome after a while 22:14:45 ehu, thanks I will :-) 22:16:03 -!- felideon [~felideon@65.23.61.98.nw.nuvox.net] has quit [Quit: ERC Version 5.3 (IRC client for Emacs)] 22:16:40 -!- mrSpec [~Spec@unaffiliated/mrspec] has quit [Quit: mrSpec] 22:17:50 ltriant [~ltriant@lithium.mailguard.com.au] has joined #lisp 22:18:28 -!- francogrex [~user@109.130.242.208] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 22:19:03 Mococa [~Mococa@189.115.146.76] has joined #lisp 22:21:03 -!- kunwon1 [~kunwon1@unaffiliated/kunwon1] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 22:21:04 -!- ehu [~ehuels@ip118-64-212-87.adsl2.static.versatel.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 22:22:30 -!- prxq [~mommer@mnhm-4d0133cc.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 22:22:31 kunwon1 [~kunwon1@unaffiliated/kunwon1] has joined #lisp 22:24:36 kpreid [~kpreid@nat/google/x-tlujvfekqgkygorf] has joined #lisp 22:25:02 -!- Mococa [~Mococa@189.115.146.76] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 22:31:01 -!- kunwon1 [~kunwon1@unaffiliated/kunwon1] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 22:32:17 kunwon1 [~kunwon1@unaffiliated/kunwon1] has joined #lisp 22:33:35 -!- PissedNumlock [~resteven@igwe32.vub.ac.be] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 22:35:42 vervic [~vervic@84.114.246.246] has joined #lisp 22:36:37 mrSpec [~Spec@pool-151-204-255-122.bstnma.btas.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 22:36:37 -!- mrSpec [~Spec@pool-151-204-255-122.bstnma.btas.verizon.net] has quit [Changing host] 22:36:37 mrSpec [~Spec@unaffiliated/mrspec] has joined #lisp 22:36:52 -!- bzzbzz [~franco@modemcable240.34-83-70.mc.videotron.ca] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 22:36:55 -!- kunwon1 [~kunwon1@unaffiliated/kunwon1] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 22:37:45 -!- pislocide [~PC@ip72-213-141-195.ok.ok.cox.net] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 22:37:51 bzzbzz [~franco@modemcable240.34-83-70.mc.videotron.ca] has joined #lisp 22:38:43 PissedNumlock [~resteven@igwe32.vub.ac.be] has joined #lisp 22:39:14 -!- cheier [~amedueces@net-216-37-86-189.in-addr.worldspice.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 22:40:51 pislocide [~PC@ip72-213-141-195.ok.ok.cox.net] has joined #lisp 22:41:00 drdo: ping 22:41:21 Mococa [~Mococa@189.115.146.76] has joined #lisp 22:41:58 kunwon1 [~kunwon1@unaffiliated/kunwon1] has joined #lisp 22:42:43 zfx [~zfx@host81-129-142-184.range81-129.btcentralplus.com] has joined #lisp 22:42:43 -!- zfx [~zfx@host81-129-142-184.range81-129.btcentralplus.com] has quit [Changing host] 22:42:43 zfx [~zfx@unaffiliated/zfx] has joined #lisp 22:43:35 fe[nl]ix: hey 22:45:01 juniorroy [~juniorroy@212.36.228.103] has joined #lisp 22:45:47 drdo: https://github.com/sionescu/iolib/commit/84b6f8d4268516bee5379a2110436370915d91a2 22:46:21 -!- gkeith_lt [~gkeith@nat/google/x-vnnkssozthpuprdv] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 22:51:40 fe[nl]ix: thanks 22:52:06 -!- naryl [~weechat@213.170.70.141] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 22:54:19 -!- elliottcable|zzz is now known as elliottcable 22:57:00 -!- alama [~alama@d86-33-47-55.cust.tele2.at] has quit [Quit: alama] 22:59:21 -!- sellout- [~Adium@ALagny-751-1-15-55.w83-112.abo.wanadoo.fr] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 22:59:38 sellout- [~Adium@ALagny-751-1-15-55.w83-112.abo.wanadoo.fr] has joined #lisp 23:02:28 -!- arborist [~arborist@e182016157.adsl.alicedsl.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 23:02:46 mon_key [~user@74-143-13-202.static.insightbb.com] has joined #lisp 23:04:11 Greetings Lispers! 23:04:46 I'm having trouble understanding hot wo invoke sb-ext:run-program with the following: 23:04:57 find "/path/possibly/with/ whitespace /" -type f -name "*\.lisp" -print0 23:06:51 mon_key: run-program is more like exec(2) than system(3) 23:07:12 -!- Mococa [~Mococa@189.115.146.76] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 23:07:15 so you don't need to quote things with spaces in them, but you have to split up the arguments yourself 23:07:58 antifuchs: OK. but i think i'm still not getting it. 23:08:00 so you don't run (run-program "find \"foo bar baz\" -name \"something\"") but (run-program "find" '("foo bar baz" "-name" "something") :search t) 23:08:23 I'm giving RUN-PROGRAM a full path to the executable. 23:08:30 it takes a list of arguments that are given to exec. no variable interpolation or wrod splitting is taking place 23:08:40 yeah, that was just so you can run it as an example (: 23:08:56 Mococa [~Mococa@189.115.146.76] has joined #lisp 23:08:57 this is my list for args 23:09:01 Do you have many files which end with backslash dot lisp? 23:09:15 '("/path/possibly/with/ whitespace /" "-type f" "-name \"*\\.lisp\" "-print0") 23:09:15 23:09:24 haha, that too 23:09:29 That seems like rather an off file extension. 23:09:37 odd 23:09:37 also, "-type f" won't do the right thing 23:09:49 "-type" "f" 23:09:59 yes. "-type f" is the source of my conundrum :) 23:10:06 You seem to be confuse as to how the shell parses arguments. 23:10:17 joshe: I don't think so. 23:10:21 -!- rolando2 [~user@161.101.37.188.rev.vodafone.pt] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 23:10:35 and yeah, the -name needs that splitting too 23:10:56 antifuchs: Ok. So does it need to be escaped as well? 23:11:10 escape what exactly? 23:11:25 (I don't follow) 23:11:26 e.g. "-name" ""*\\.lisp\"" 23:11:30 onpe 23:11:51 you use the quote marks on the shell because otherwise the shell will try to do things with wildcard characters 23:11:56 not in sbcl 23:11:59 so this is fine: "*\.lisp" 23:12:09 like I said, it passes that stuff to exec(2) verbatim 23:12:30 also note the \.lisp thing. -name will search for files ending in backslash dot lisp 23:13:06 if that's what you're going to search for, yeah that's fine (: 23:13:21 -!- taiyal [~taiyal@bb-216-195-184-102.gwi.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 23:13:32 antifuchs: Thanks for your help. 23:13:33 -!- Jasko [~tjasko@c-174-59-204-245.hsd1.pa.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 23:14:05 yw (: 23:14:23 I once created a file containing every 8-bit ascii character except nul and slash to test something. The next morning I got an awful lot of error emails from nightly maintanence cronjobs. 23:14:34 ahahahha 23:16:15 joshe: FWIW the 8-bit ASCII in filenames and whitespace frobbing are the "meta-target" for the output from find :) 23:17:29 Yes, the -print0 argument to find should always be used except for one-off interactive invocations where you know the filenames are safe. 23:17:57 -!- elliottcable is now known as elliottcable|zzz 23:18:12 -!- elliottcable|zzz is now known as elliottcable 23:20:11 -!- pislocide [~PC@ip72-213-141-195.ok.ok.cox.net] has quit [Quit: This computer has gone to sleep] 23:20:32 I somehow managed to hose a rather large directory tree migrating from an w32 data on fat32 drive which interfaced via CIFS to a linux -- there were multiple layers of locale encoding and charset junk coalescing. 23:21:06 Demosthenes [~demo@72-255-19-14.client.stsn.net] has joined #lisp 23:21:07 I'm trying to install lispbuilder-sdl and am running into a problem where the cocoahelper fails to load. I seems my sbcl is x86_64 and the cocoahelper.dylib is i386 23:21:38 I've installed sbcl with homebrew and am trying to install lispbuilder-sdl with quicklisp 23:23:22 antifuchs: Thanks again. I now have a large file containing a string with lots of delimiting null terminators. Whoo! 23:24:25 -!- serichsen [~user@hmbg-5f764306.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit [Quit: Good night!] 23:25:37 nice (: 23:29:39 Kenjin: I had similar problems. I think I compiled the cocoahelper.dylib manually or did some other trickery to get it working... 23:29:58 Lemme see the logs and my notes... 23:29:59 -!- malbertife [~marcoalbe@bl7-33-144.dsl.telepac.pt] has quit [Quit: malbertife] 23:30:11 peterhil: I know there is a intermediate step where you need to go into /cocoahelper and run make 23:31:15 -!- Oddity [~Oddity@unaffiliated/oddity] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 23:32:21 My mac is a dual core 64-bit and sbcl gets compiled for x86_64. However the Kernel arch is i386 and cocoahelper.dylib gets compiled to i386 23:35:35 drdo: the problem with connect seems to be caused by the kernel 23:36:10 -!- Demosthenes [~demo@72-255-19-14.client.stsn.net] has quit [Quit: leaving] 23:37:17 dnolen_ [~davidnole@pool-68-161-137-73.ny325.east.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 23:38:12 Odditus [~Oddity@unaffiliated/oddity] has joined #lisp 23:40:33 zanea_ [~zanea@210-86-94-154.jetstream.xtra.co.nz] has joined #lisp 23:40:48 -!- OliverUv [~gandhi@195.159.235.178] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 23:40:56 sabalaba [~sabalaba@c-67-180-32-11.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 23:41:36 -!- zanea [~zanea@219-89-166-180.jetstart.xtra.co.nz] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 23:46:43 setmeaway [setmeaway3@118.45.149.131] has joined #lisp 23:48:16 -!- juniorroy [~juniorroy@212.36.228.103] has left #lisp 23:48:30 Kenjin: It seems I actually gave up on lispbuilder-sdl and moved to cl-openal 23:49:50 -!- pnq1 [~nick@ACA22045.ipt.aol.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 23:51:19 -!- HG` [~HG@p579F7FB5.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 23:52:08 Kenjin: But see my struggle on #lispgames: http://pastebin.com/yTPPeqjT 23:52:39 I use iMac with Core i7 processor 23:53:02 Jasko [~tjasko@c-174-59-204-245.hsd1.pa.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 23:53:04 It seems I got lispbuilder-sdl working on Clozure CL but not on SBCL 23:53:09 peterhil: thank you. I'm actually playing around with cl-opengl 23:53:18 And I had some struggle with cl-openal too 23:53:28 was just trying to run some stuff that uses lispbuilder-sdl 23:53:44 noogenesis [~derekv@c-68-62-78-203.hsd1.mi.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 23:53:55 Evanescence [~chris@122.237.20.55] has joined #lisp 23:54:03 But it seems very promising. It even has surround sound (with Doppler effects!) 23:54:13 -!- derekv [~derekv@c-68-62-78-203.hsd1.mi.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 23:55:24 peterhil: just tried to load c-openal with quicklisp and does not load for me 23:59:12 peterhil: as I said I'm playing around with cl-opengl and would like to play with some physics systems :)