00:03:26 *zmv* wonders why people sometimes use action many times in a row. 00:04:10 -!- jcazevedo [~jcazevedo@bl6-61-185.dsl.telepac.pt] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 00:05:29 well, that's interesting: the new ssets were within 3% of the current implementation, even with a buggy hash function that always returned 0. 00:07:09 st-json has code of the form (loop :for (key val) :on fields :by #'cddr 00:07:09 :collect (cons key val)) <-- is there some implementation where this works, or am I missing the ponit? 00:07:47 <_3b> looks portable to me, anything specific you aren't sure about? 00:08:00 no_nada [~chatzilla@adsl-69-224-150-185.dsl.scrm01.pacbell.net] has joined #lisp 00:08:42 armence [~armence@unaffiliated/armence] has joined #lisp 00:11:05 -!- thom_logn [~thom@pool-108-38-79-155.lsanca.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 00:12:13 ACtually, it's grenading on this: (loop :for key :being :the :hash-key :using (hash-value val) :of (make-hash-table) :collect (cons key val)) It's complaining in lispworks "unknown loop keyword in ) 00:12:50 It's the "using" part. 00:12:56 Failing on lispworks 00:13:54 <_3b> yeah, that looks broken 00:14:07 That form appears on here: 00:14:08 http://www.unixuser.org/~euske/doc/cl/loop.html 00:15:07 Works on sBCL though 00:15:14 <_3b> IN/OF has to be before USING 00:15:45 <_3b> SBCL's LOOP is much less strict about confirmance than the rest of sbcl :( 00:15:49 <_3b> *conformance 00:18:34 mobydick [~textual@124-171-177-47.dyn.iinet.net.au] has joined #lisp 00:22:32 xxxyyy [~xyxu@222.68.163.42] has joined #lisp 00:25:15 -!- tempire_ [~tempire@pool-72-91-241-135.tampfl.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 00:26:24 tempire [~tempire@pool-72-91-241-135.tampfl.fios.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 00:29:05 -!- lester- [~lester@76.73.16.26] has quit [Quit: CGI:IRC (Ping timeout)] 00:32:09 -!- Phoodus [~foo@68.107.217.139] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 00:34:14 -!- MeanWeen [~KAPITAL@cpe-174-099-078-028.nc.res.rr.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 268 seconds] 00:34:20 -!- Guthur [~Guthur@host86-138-192-24.range86-138.btcentralplus.com] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 00:34:21 Oddity [~Oddity@unaffiliated/oddity] has joined #lisp 00:36:17 Modius: Try putting :using after :of. 00:36:30 beach: Yeah, that got it. 00:36:42 What you wrote is not supposed to work. 00:36:42 -!- pnq [~nick@ACA368AB.ipt.aol.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 268 seconds] 00:37:16 _3b: Oh, sorry, I saw what you wrote too late. 00:37:53 [and Good morning everyone! by the way] 00:38:01 hi 00:40:08 Oddity: Wow, almost exactly one year since you last uttered something. 00:40:20 cool 00:40:29 how did you find that out? 00:40:32 grep through logs? 00:40:35 Yeah. 00:40:45 that's odd :> 00:42:10 lurker-x [~androirc@32.171.188.22] has joined #lisp 00:46:36 -!- gozoner [~ebg@ip68-6-68-92.sb.sd.cox.net] has quit [Quit: Computer has gone to sleep.] 00:48:23 -!- redline6561-work [~redline65@adsl-98-92-85-119.asm.bellsouth.net] has quit [Quit: Computer has gone to sleep.] 00:51:21 -!- xxxyyy [~xyxu@222.68.163.42] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 00:51:45 beach: What is your opinion of http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Design_pattern_(computer_science)#Classification_and_list ? 00:53:43 -!- exumirabilis [~u@dslb-188-105-136-089.pools.arcor-ip.net] has left #lisp 00:55:31 -!- taiyal [~taiyal@bb-216-195-184-102.gwi.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 00:56:13 Quadrescence: Not sure. Looks reasonable. What did you specifically want me to comment on? 00:59:36 xxxyyy1 [~xyxu@222.68.163.42] has joined #lisp 01:00:37 *beach* goes to the store while the outside temperature is still tolerable. 01:00:45 -!- gigamonkey [~user@adsl-99-39-5-241.dsl.pltn13.sbcglobal.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 268 seconds] 01:05:11 -!- katesmith [~katesmith@unaffiliated/costume] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 01:05:27 general-general [~marypatri@86-46-61-67-dynamic.b-ras3.mvw.galway.eircom.net] has joined #lisp 01:06:42 Mococa [~Mococa@186.214.255.138] has joined #lisp 01:10:07 -!- lurker-x [~androirc@32.171.188.22] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 01:11:55 katesmith [~katesmith@97-89-229-3.static.snfr.nc.charter.com] has joined #lisp 01:11:55 -!- katesmith [~katesmith@97-89-229-3.static.snfr.nc.charter.com] has quit [Changing host] 01:11:55 katesmith [~katesmith@unaffiliated/costume] has joined #lisp 01:14:35 -!- Mococa [~Mococa@186.214.255.138] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 01:14:44 -!- catphive [~brenmill@c-76-104-152-119.hsd1.wa.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 01:19:27 ... 01:20:30 rncarpio [rncarpio@ppp-69-230-118-97.dsl.scrm01.pacbell.net] has joined #lisp 01:22:10 -!- seangrove [~user@c-69-181-41-116.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 01:23:10 -!- peterhil [~peterhil@a91-152-135-21.elisa-laajakaista.fi] has quit [Quit: Must not waste too much time here...] 01:23:36 -!- urandom__ [~user@p548A6123.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 01:28:24 -!- replore_ [~replore@ntkngw256114.kngw.nt.ftth.ppp.infoweb.ne.jp] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 01:28:25 quit 01:28:31 -!- general-general [~marypatri@86-46-61-67-dynamic.b-ras3.mvw.galway.eircom.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 01:30:08 dfox [~dfox@ip-94-113-17-246.net.upcbroadband.cz] has joined #lisp 01:30:23 Mococa [~Mococa@186.214.255.138] has joined #lisp 01:33:59 gigamonkey [~user@adsl-99-39-5-241.dsl.pltn13.sbcglobal.net] has joined #lisp 01:35:13 general-general [~marypatri@86-46-61-67-dynamic.b-ras3.mvw.galway.eircom.net] has joined #lisp 01:38:09 -!- Salamander [~Salamande@ppp118-210-165-59.lns20.adl6.internode.on.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 01:40:06 gozoner [~ebg@ip68-6-68-92.sb.sd.cox.net] has joined #lisp 01:40:24 PuffTheMagic [~PuffTheMa@unaffiliated/puffthemagic] has joined #lisp 01:40:44 -!- general-general [~marypatri@86-46-61-67-dynamic.b-ras3.mvw.galway.eircom.net] has left #lisp 01:43:43 -!- varjag [~eugene@253.79.34.95.customer.cdi.no] has quit [Quit: Ex-Chat] 01:50:51 *beach* is back from the store. 01:51:42 Salamander [~Salamande@ppp203-122-208-20.lns5.adl6.internode.on.net] has joined #lisp 01:52:11 gonzojive [~red@101.109.73.198] has joined #lisp 01:53:19 beach: what did you get? 01:55:34 Quadrescence: Lessee, coffee, bread, cheese, fruit, ground pork, yoghurt. 01:57:56 does anybody happen to know the solution to the problem pasted here? http://pastebin.com/ZG0a2LAL 02:00:02 it's a CXML-STP problem when evaluating xpath, and it seems somebody has had it before. I am getting an identical nonexistent type error 02:01:05 gonzojive: it might be a version mismatch between CXML and suriella. 02:03:59 <|3b|> searching #lisp logs for that link suggests it is a problem with some code that only works on sbcl 02:04:57 araujo [~araujo@gentoo/developer/araujo] has joined #lisp 02:06:25 |3b|: thanks, where are these #lisp logs by the way? 02:06:36 <|3b|> minion: tell gonzojive about logs 02:06:36 gonzojive: direct your attention towards logs: #lisp logs are available at http://ccl.clozure.com/irc-logs/lisp/ (since 2008-09) and http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/lisp/ (since 2000) 02:08:09 yeah, I am using CCL because I'm stuck on a mac but need threading. I thought I built my sbcl with thread support but now it seems not so. 02:14:10 I believe both SBCL and ECL support threads on MacOS X as well 02:14:46 ABCL also supports threads 02:18:22 marioxcc [~user@200.92.179.219] has joined #lisp 02:19:39 -!- carlocci [~nes@93.37.192.171] has quit [Quit: eventually IE will rot and die] 02:22:23 Evanescence [~chris@122.237.27.160] has joined #lisp 02:22:54 -!- Evanescence [~chris@122.237.27.160] has quit [Client Quit] 02:23:15 Evanescence [~chris@122.237.27.160] has joined #lisp 02:25:54 -!- gffa [~gffa@unaffiliated/gffa] has quit [Quit: sleep] 02:27:47 Salamander_ [~Salamande@ppp121-45-157-155.lns21.adl6.internode.on.net] has joined #lisp 02:28:01 -!- dfox [~dfox@ip-94-113-17-246.net.upcbroadband.cz] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 02:28:06 -!- tempire [~tempire@pool-72-91-241-135.tampfl.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 02:28:20 tempire_ [~tempire@pool-72-91-241-135.tampfl.fios.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 02:29:59 -!- Salamander [~Salamande@ppp203-122-208-20.lns5.adl6.internode.on.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 02:31:45 cbp [~cesarbol9@189.247.106.6] has joined #lisp 02:34:29 thanks joshe and loke. i thought SBCL os x threading support was experimental--is this still the case 02:35:49 For PowerPC, yes. For x86, I believe it's somewhat mature-ish by now. 02:35:59 The only way to find out if it works for you is to try it. 02:37:14 by the way the cxml problem on CCL is because of a CCL bug described here: http://ccl.clozure.com/irc-logs/lisp/2008-11/lisp-2008.11.30.txt 02:37:21 BlankVerse [~pankajm@122.172.243.98] has joined #lisp 02:43:49 jingtao [~jingtaozf@123.120.13.198] has joined #lisp 02:43:57 -!- cmm [~cmm@109.67.199.173] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 02:44:55 cmm [~cmm@109.67.199.173] has joined #lisp 02:47:03 -!- xan_ [~xan@216.Red-88-19-137.staticIP.rima-tde.net] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 02:49:05 pnq [~nick@AC82C833.ipt.aol.com] has joined #lisp 02:55:04 -!- Kenjin [~josesanto@bl19-211-17.dsl.telepac.pt] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 03:04:06 -!- tempire_ [~tempire@pool-72-91-241-135.tampfl.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 03:04:20 tempire [~tempire@pool-72-91-241-135.tampfl.fios.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 03:04:43 -!- macrocat [~marmalade@99.192.107.114] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 03:10:05 Salamander__ [~Salamande@ppp118-210-179-200.lns20.adl6.internode.on.net] has joined #lisp 03:11:35 -!- am0c [~am0c@124.49.51.197] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 03:11:59 -!- Salamander_ [~Salamande@ppp121-45-157-155.lns21.adl6.internode.on.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 03:13:02 -!- dlila [~dlila@CPE0014d1c9243c-CM001bd71cede2.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 03:15:37 Salamander_ [~Salamande@ppp121-45-128-9.lns10.adl2.internode.on.net] has joined #lisp 03:16:04 -!- Salamander__ [~Salamande@ppp118-210-179-200.lns20.adl6.internode.on.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 03:16:42 BrianRice` [~water@97-126-51-249.tukw.qwest.net] has joined #lisp 03:17:20 -!- BrianRice` is now known as BrianRice-home 03:30:39 -!- anderson [~user@c-76-18-219-103.hsd1.fl.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 03:32:15 -!- splittist [~splittist@30-245.62-188.cust.bluewin.ch] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 03:33:55 splittist [~splittist@30-245.62-188.cust.bluewin.ch] has joined #lisp 03:41:13 is there a function that will check if a lisp form in a string is complete or partial? 03:41:54 You mean, something that can tell you "(+ 1 2 3" isn't a valid sexp, for example? 03:41:58 yes 03:43:16 kennyd: read-from-string 03:43:22 I think you have to use read-from-string and then handle the error. 03:43:23 -!- Mococa [~Mococa@186.214.255.138] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 03:45:54 Or just use #'ignore-errors. 03:46:14 Which I guess qualifies as "handling the error". 03:47:33 -!- Bike [~Glossina@71-38-157-5.ptld.qwest.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 03:47:48 zerogeedawg [~brian@c-71-202-139-217.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 03:47:57 ignore errors, and check if nth-value 1 is nil? 03:48:10 -!- zerogeedawg [~brian@c-71-202-139-217.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has left #lisp 03:48:53 -!- Kruppe [~user@CPE00222d128ba2-CM00222d128b9e.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 03:49:42 -!- BrianRice-home is now known as BrianRice 03:50:04 Bike [~Glossina@71-38-157-3.ptld.qwest.net] has joined #lisp 03:50:53 Did this function disappear from SBCL recently? SLOT-DEFINITION-READER-FUNCTION. Elephant gives me 'no symbol named "SLOT-DEFINITION-READER-FUNCTION" in "SB-PCL" ' 03:51:04 zerogeedawg [~brian@c-71-202-139-217.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 03:51:25 If you don't care about nil, you can just use the primary return value of ignore errors. (ignore-errors (read-from-string string)) will return nil if read-from-string signals an error. 03:52:10 -!- __class__ [~class@99-105-56-162.lightspeed.sntcca.sbcglobal.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 03:53:15 zerogeedawg pasted "Adder (NOT LOGIC)" at http://paste.lisp.org/display/122579 03:53:57 pinterface is right 03:54:32 zerogeedawg: Why did you paste that code? 03:54:37 mm? 03:54:55 oh I have a really bad interpreter and I get an error when I try to use that function 03:55:05 (add(4 5 6)) 03:55:06 zerogeedawg: It is pretty badly written. 03:55:13 that is true 03:55:17 :l 03:55:31 zerogeedawg: Why do you paste code that you know is badly written? 03:55:32 That's not the interpreter's fault, (4 5 6) is an illegal function call, semantically. 03:55:42 i dont know 03:56:37 do you have a better idea? 03:56:53 What do you want to do? 03:56:58 add 03:57:01 zerogeedawg: To start with, indent your code properly. 03:57:11 oh 03:57:12 fine 03:57:21 (+ 4 5 6) 03:57:28 zerogeedawg: Then, in Lisp, we rarely use return because the value of the last form is returned automatically. 03:57:39 oh 03:57:46 zerogeedawg: Instead of a series of IFs, use a COND. 03:57:54 so like, I could just say (+ (car l) (cdr l)) 03:57:57 zerogeedawg: And don't put `)' by iteself on a line. 03:58:07 fine/ 03:58:13 i meant fine. 03:58:37 (cdr l) in that case would be a list anyway. 03:58:45 zerogeedawg: Furthermore, instead of (eq ... nil) it is better to use (null ...). 03:58:51 zerogeedawg pasted "untitled" at http://paste.lisp.org/display/122580 03:59:02 oh 03:59:05 okay then 03:59:17 I tend to differ. 03:59:27 If you are processing a list, it's better to use endp instead of null. 03:59:46 zerogeedawg pasted "Adder (NOT LOGIC)" at http://paste.lisp.org/display/122581 03:59:53 and (first list) and (rest list) instead of car and cdr. 04:00:01 or just (apply #'+ '(1 2 3)) 04:00:02 oh 04:00:08 you can do that? 04:00:14 Yes. 04:00:40 ..... 04:01:02 Vowyer: That is not equivalent to the current function though. 04:01:16 hba [~hba@189.130.166.233] has joined #lisp 04:01:21 beach: he wants to add numbers in a list right? 04:01:34 Vowyer: How would I know. 04:01:38 s/./?/ 04:01:40 yeah 04:01:54 zerogeedawg: Then why do you test (car l) for nil? 04:02:09 -!- jingtao [~jingtaozf@123.120.13.198] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 04:02:15 jingtao [~jingtaozf@123.120.13.198] has joined #lisp 04:02:16 in case someone wants to (add()) 04:02:18 zerogeedawg: And why do you use + on (car l) and (cdr l)? 04:02:33 zerogeedawg: That would be testing l for nil, not (car l). 04:02:50 because that would add (example) (5 6 7) (+ 5 (6 7)) 04:02:56 zerogeedawg: (cdr l) is never a number if you have a list of number initially. 04:02:57 I know 04:03:19 zerogeedawg: But you cannot use + on a list. 04:03:24 unless it is only a 2 number list 04:03:28 oh 04:03:32 zerogeedawg: Not true. 04:03:47 zerogeedawg: Don't confuse the list and the elements of the list. 04:03:48 either way how do I add it 04:03:56 atoms and lists 04:04:04 I am smarter than you think. 04:04:18 zerogeedawg: I haven't said anything about you not being smart. 04:04:19 but fine 04:04:25 thats true 04:04:49 how do I add it though? 04:05:10 <|3b|> (reduce '+ l) ? 04:05:35 redline6561-work [~redline65@adsl-98-92-85-119.asm.bellsouth.net] has joined #lisp 04:06:19 zerogeedawg pasted "Adding" at http://paste.lisp.org/display/122582 04:06:28 -!- redline6561-work [~redline65@adsl-98-92-85-119.asm.bellsouth.net] has quit [Client Quit] 04:06:43 Daev [~KAPITAL@cpe-174-099-078-028.nc.res.rr.com] has joined #lisp 04:06:44 Why don't you just use reduce or apply to start with, though? 04:07:08 <|3b|> or maybe (and (car l) (reduce '+ l)) if you want to keep the odd ability to accept NIL for the first number 04:07:31 <|3b|> also, annotate 1 paste instead of making new ones for every change 04:07:35 okay then... 04:07:47 huh 04:07:54 <|3b|> and the reduce call was to replace the entire function, not just that last bit 04:08:05 zerogeedawg: Are you just doing this for fun, or is it an actual problem you are trying to solve? 04:08:22 no 04:08:32 <|3b|> it looks like you were trying to write it recursively and forgot the actual recursion, but implementing iteration with recursion isn't really good CL style anyway 04:08:46 Fun, I can do addition, what did you think. 04:08:48 oh 04:09:11 no I was not trying to do that at all, just basic 04:10:39 anonymous coward annotated #122582 "Adding" at http://paste.lisp.org/display/122582#1 04:11:52 that will work?! 04:12:37 I still get the same error 04:12:50 If I'm not wrong, the function adds numbers in a list unless the first element is nil, so (add '(nil 1 2 3)) would render nil, right? 04:13:14 yeah, although that would be pointless. 04:13:20 <|3b|> Vowyer: that seems to be the intent, dunno why though 04:13:30 zerogeedawg: How are you calling the function? 04:13:41 hm 04:13:44 Maybe replace all nils with 0? So you can keep adding? 04:13:48 just not recursively 04:13:49 oh 04:13:51 sure 04:14:00 I guess that would work. 04:14:10 <|3b|> zerogeedawg: are you sure it is even getting to the function? (add (1 2 3)) isn't a valid call 04:14:15 you should be calling it as (add '(1 2 3 4)) 04:14:37 <|3b|> or (add (list 1 2 3 4)) 04:14:38 okay I will try that then 04:14:58 yay 04:15:01 <|3b|> or (add (anything-else-that-returns-a-list-of-numbers)) 04:15:03 It worked 04:19:17 -!- zerogeedawg [~brian@c-71-202-139-217.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: zerogeedawg] 04:21:49 (integerp (nth-value 1 (ignore-errors (read-from-string string))))) <- is this a valid way to check if string contains a valid sexp? 04:22:15 any corner cases I'm missing? it appears to work fine 04:30:24 -!- Vowyer [~sebas@71-208-17-190.fibertel.com.ar] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 04:34:13 -!- ignas [~ignas@ctv-79-132-160-221.vinita.lt] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 04:39:12 -!- bgs100 [~ian@unaffiliated/bgs100] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 04:42:04 -!- marioxcc [~user@200.92.179.219] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 04:42:44 Anyone here use Drakma? Just interested, it seems the request call is synchronous, what would the issues be with making this Asynch? Is it difficulty of implementation or are there tangible barriers? 04:43:22 -!- gozoner [~ebg@ip68-6-68-92.sb.sd.cox.net] has quit [Quit: Computer has gone to sleep.] 04:46:18 kennyd: There might be junk behind the firs valid expression, for instance "234 ))))" will succeed. 04:48:27 phadthai [mmondor@ginseng.pulsar-zone.net] has joined #lisp 04:53:20 -!- Modius [~Modius@cpe-70-123-140-183.austin.res.rr.com] has quit [Quit: "Object-oriented design" is an oxymoron] 04:58:49 -!- zmv [~daniel@c95315ce.virtua.com.br] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 05:09:14 -!- gigamonkey [~user@adsl-99-39-5-241.dsl.pltn13.sbcglobal.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 05:09:35 gozoner [~ebg@ip68-6-68-92.sb.sd.cox.net] has joined #lisp 05:10:26 gzip4 [~xxx@95-31-40-177.broadband.corbina.ru] has joined #lisp 05:12:26 -!- gzip4 [~xxx@95-31-40-177.broadband.corbina.ru] has quit [Client Quit] 05:12:42 -!- BlankVerse [~pankajm@122.172.243.98] has quit [Quit: Lost terminal] 05:13:11 gzip4 [~xxx@95-31-40-177.broadband.corbina.ru] has joined #lisp 05:15:47 -!- gzip4 [~xxx@95-31-40-177.broadband.corbina.ru] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 05:16:46 gzip4 [~xxx@95-31-40-177.broadband.corbina.ru] has joined #lisp 05:20:26 -!- gzip4 [~xxx@95-31-40-177.broadband.corbina.ru] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 05:25:53 -!- pnq [~nick@AC82C833.ipt.aol.com] has quit [Quit: sleep] 05:29:12 BlankVerse [~pankajm@122.167.73.224] has joined #lisp 05:32:37 -!- ltriant [~ltriant@124-170-17-10.dyn.iinet.net.au] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 05:40:18 -!- gko [~gko@220-135-201-90.HINET-IP.hinet.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 05:42:48 -!- colazero [~colazero@www5054u.sakura.ne.jp] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 05:45:59 -!- Salamander_ [~Salamande@ppp121-45-128-9.lns10.adl2.internode.on.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 05:46:22 Salamander_ [~Salamande@ppp121-45-119-199.lns20.adl6.internode.on.net] has joined #lisp 05:47:11 colazero [~colazero@www5054u.sakura.ne.jp] has joined #lisp 05:48:32 how to assign to a symbol I made from a string? 05:48:42 (setf (intern "FOO") nil) gives me: FUNCTION: undefined function (SETF INTERN) 05:48:47 Salamander__ [~Salamande@ppp118-210-228-238.lns20.adl6.internode.on.net] has joined #lisp 05:48:58 Try (setf (symbol-value (intern "FOO")) nil) 05:49:34 works thanks! 05:51:12 -!- Salamander_ [~Salamande@ppp121-45-119-199.lns20.adl6.internode.on.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 268 seconds] 05:54:09 -!- Salamander__ [~Salamande@ppp118-210-228-238.lns20.adl6.internode.on.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 05:54:30 -!- Evanescence [~chris@122.237.27.160] has quit [Quit: WeeChat 0.3.4] 05:55:17 Salamander__ [~Salamande@ppp121-45-149-30.lns21.adl6.internode.on.net] has joined #lisp 05:56:52 -!- Salamander__ is now known as Salamander 06:01:41 -!- cmm [~cmm@109.67.199.173] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 06:01:44 housel [~user@217.115.14.5] has joined #lisp 06:01:57 Evanescence [~chris@122.237.19.145] has joined #lisp 06:02:36 cmm [~cmm@109.67.199.173] has joined #lisp 06:02:40 -!- Evanescence [~chris@122.237.19.145] has quit [Client Quit] 06:03:01 Evanescence [~chris@122.237.19.145] has joined #lisp 06:03:17 -!- gozoner [~ebg@ip68-6-68-92.sb.sd.cox.net] has quit [Quit: Computer has gone to sleep.] 06:06:11 nikodemus sent a patch to the elephant mailing list with the output of a 'darcs diff'. anyone know how to apply this thing to a darcs repository? Not having much luck on the web 06:07:33 -!- BrianRice [~water@97-126-51-249.tukw.qwest.net] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 06:07:49 redline6561-work [~redline65@c-66-56-55-169.hsd1.ga.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 06:16:20 -!- gonzojive [~red@101.109.73.198] has quit [Quit: gonzojive] 06:19:56 gonzojive [~red@182.53.160.85] has joined #lisp 06:20:14 -!- gonzojive [~red@182.53.160.85] has quit [Client Quit] 06:20:59 -!- Salamander [~Salamande@ppp121-45-149-30.lns21.adl6.internode.on.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 06:21:40 BrianRice [~water@97-126-51-249.tukw.qwest.net] has joined #lisp 06:22:58 Salamander [~Salamande@ppp118-210-50-170.lns20.adl2.internode.on.net] has joined #lisp 06:22:58 -!- splittist [~splittist@30-245.62-188.cust.bluewin.ch] has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 06:23:20 -!- anonchik [~anonymous@88.80.28.189] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 06:23:38 gravicappa [~gravicapp@h178-129-47-77.dyn.bashtel.ru] has joined #lisp 06:27:30 -!- Salamander [~Salamande@ppp118-210-50-170.lns20.adl2.internode.on.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 06:29:11 (set (intern "FOO") 0) works too in here. is that guaranteed to work? 06:29:50 -!- Bike [~Glossina@71-38-157-3.ptld.qwest.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 06:30:29 -!- symbole [~user@ool-4a5a4bdd.dyn.optonline.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 06:31:46 kennyd: clhs set clsh intern 06:32:19 mrSpec [~Spec@88.208.105.6] has joined #lisp 06:32:19 -!- mrSpec [~Spec@88.208.105.6] has quit [Changing host] 06:32:19 mrSpec [~Spec@unaffiliated/mrspec] has joined #lisp 06:33:52 a5h15h [~a5h15h@59.95.1.115] has joined #lisp 06:37:05 Bike [~Glossina@71-38-158-146.ptld.qwest.net] has joined #lisp 06:41:29 -!- Bike [~Glossina@71-38-158-146.ptld.qwest.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 06:41:53 Salamander [~Salamande@ppp121-45-38-221.lns20.adl2.internode.on.net] has joined #lisp 06:46:20 -!- a5h15h [~a5h15h@59.95.1.115] has quit [Quit: Ex-Chat] 06:47:14 -!- Salamander [~Salamande@ppp121-45-38-221.lns20.adl2.internode.on.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 06:48:14 a5h15h [~a5h15h@59.95.1.115] has joined #lisp 06:48:52 tcr1 [~tcr@155-dom-3.acn.waw.pl] has joined #lisp 06:48:53 -!- a5h15h [~a5h15h@59.95.1.115] has quit [Changing host] 06:48:53 a5h15h [~a5h15h@unaffiliated/a5h15h] has joined #lisp 06:52:06 Guest17727 [~b-tag@183.15.164.72] has joined #lisp 06:58:33 -!- BlankVerse [~pankajm@122.167.73.224] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 06:59:56 jsoft [~jsoft@unaffiliated/jsoft] has joined #lisp 07:00:11 BlankVerse [~pankajm@122.167.87.68] has joined #lisp 07:07:08 Salamander [~Salamande@ppp121-45-158-125.lns21.adl6.internode.on.net] has joined #lisp 07:10:10 -!- homie` [~levent.gu@xdsl-84-44-152-235.netcologne.de] has quit [Quit: ERC Version 5.3 (IRC client for Emacs)] 07:10:37 eadmund [~eadmund@67-6-156-162.hlrn.qwest.net] has joined #lisp 07:11:09 hey, has anyone here done any work with UDP servers? I've been trying out the examples for usocket, and they all fail on passing (nil nil) for (host port) 07:12:49 why would you pass nil nil? 07:12:56 -!- sabalaba [~sabalaba@75-101-62-95.dsl.static.sonic.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 07:13:05 oh the examples 07:13:32 gor[e] [~svr@95.106.9.134] has joined #lisp 07:14:18 exactly. usocket's examples all show nil nil when creating an unconnected UDP socket...but it generates an error. i've tried looking at the source, but it's not really clear 07:14:39 all i'm trying to do is create a socket and listen on it for datagrams...should be dirt-simple 07:16:04 homie [~levent.gu@xdsl-84-44-152-235.netcologne.de] has joined #lisp 07:16:34 bsod1 [~sinan@88.240.128.146] has joined #lisp 07:17:34 -!- kennyd [~kennyd@93-141-86-79.adsl.net.t-com.hr] has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 07:18:35 -!- gor[e] [~svr@95.106.9.134] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 07:19:51 gor[e] [~svr@95.106.9.134] has joined #lisp 07:21:21 kennyd 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has quit [*.net *.split] 07:44:40 -!- ianmcorvidae [~ianmcorvi@fsf/member/ianmcorvidae] has quit [Quit: Reconnecting] 07:44:47 xpf [~xpf@78.31.74.25] has joined #lisp 07:44:59 -!- erk [~MrEd@BZ.BZFLAG.BZ] has quit [Max SendQ exceeded] 07:45:02 tty234 [telex@gateway/shell/anapnea.net/x-ucbiwzugzfloubda] has joined #lisp 07:45:03 ianmcorvidae [~ianmcorvi@ip72-200-123-53.tc.ph.cox.net] has joined #lisp 07:45:03 -!- ianmcorvidae [~ianmcorvi@ip72-200-123-53.tc.ph.cox.net] has quit [Changing host] 07:45:03 ianmcorvidae [~ianmcorvi@fsf/member/ianmcorvidae] has joined #lisp 07:45:03 -!- shachaf [~shachaf@204.109.63.130] has quit [Max SendQ exceeded] 07:45:03 hello, have a newbie question: how to get message of a condition? 07:45:24 shachaf [~shachaf@204.109.63.130] has joined #lisp 07:45:36 -!- homie [~levent.gu@xdsl-84-44-152-3.netcologne.de] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 07:45:39 I've read searched for "message" in "Beyond Exception Handling: Conditions and Restarts" in Practical Common lisp book and it only got mentioned once 07:46:01 cods [~cods@tuxee.net] has joined #lisp 07:46:05 jewel [~jewel@196-215-117-83.dynamic.isadsl.co.za] has joined #lisp 07:46:26 -!- 5EXACSN1O [~Spec@88.208.105.6] has quit [Read error: No route to host] 07:47:25 -!- cods [~cods@tuxee.net] has quit [Changing host] 07:47:25 cods [~cods@rsbac/developer/cods] has joined #lisp 07:47:32 eadmund [~eadmund@67-6-156-162.hlrn.qwest.net] has joined #lisp 07:47:44 sid3k` [~user@li298-167.members.linode.com] has joined #lisp 07:47:47 mippymoe89 [~mippymoe8@c-24-147-92-217.hsd1.vt.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 07:48:03 -!- gor[e] [~svr@95.106.9.134] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 07:49:01 housel [~user@mccarthy.opendylan.org] has joined #lisp 07:49:01 Salamander [~Salamande@ppp121-45-158-125.lns21.adl6.internode.on.net] has joined #lisp 07:49:01 tvaalen [~r@67.217.170.35] has joined #lisp 07:49:01 lundis [~lundis@gprs-prointernet-ff916a00-103.dhcp.inet.fi] has joined 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has joined #lisp 07:49:01 antoszka [~antoszka@unaffiliated/antoszka] has joined #lisp 07:49:04 -!- sid3k [~user@li298-167.members.linode.com] has quit [Max SendQ exceeded] 07:49:17 <|3b|`> (princ-to-string condition) ? 07:49:38 jkantz [~jkantz@ita4fw1.itasoftware.com] has joined #lisp 07:49:38 _main_ [~main@adsl-99-173-15-158.dsl.pltn13.sbcglobal.net] has joined #lisp 07:49:38 Bootvis_ [bob@baltar.lan.endoria.net] has joined #lisp 07:49:38 noogenesis [~derekv@c-68-62-78-203.hsd1.mi.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 07:49:38 loke [~elias@bb116-15-153-239.singnet.com.sg] has joined #lisp 07:49:38 theBlackDragon [~dragon@83.101.80.15] has joined #lisp 07:49:38 prip [~foo@host80-120-dynamic.42-79-r.retail.telecomitalia.it] has joined #lisp 07:49:38 mathrick [~mathrick@users177.kollegienet.dk] has joined #lisp 07:49:38 df_aldur [~df@aldur.bowerham.net] has joined #lisp 07:49:38 sausages [~sausages@balmora.robotjunkyard.org] has joined #lisp 07:49:38 bege [~bege@S0106001cf0520ea3.ed.shawcable.net] has joined #lisp 07:49:38 abeaumont [~abeaumont@90.165.165.246] has joined #lisp 07:49:38 tychoish [~tychoish@foucault.cyborginstitute.net] has joined #lisp 07:49:51 erk [~MrEd@BZ.BZFLAG.BZ] has joined #lisp 07:49:51 billitch_ [~billitch@bastille.ma3.tv] has joined #lisp 07:49:51 jsoft [~jsoft@unaffiliated/jsoft] has joined #lisp 07:49:51 colazero [~colazero@www5054u.sakura.ne.jp] has joined #lisp 07:49:51 Oddity [~Oddity@unaffiliated/oddity] has joined #lisp 07:49:51 Beetny [~Beetny@ppp118-208-19-192.lns20.bne1.internode.on.net] has joined #lisp 07:49:51 benny [~benny@i577A1637.versanet.de] has joined #lisp 07:49:51 timjstewart1 [~tims@159.182.183.6] has joined #lisp 07:49:51 specbot [~specbot@tiger.common-lisp.net] has joined #lisp 07:49:51 pchrist [~spirit@gentoo/developer/pchrist] has joined #lisp 07:49:51 ok2 [ok2@kozachuk.info] has joined #lisp 07:49:51 Xantoz [~hejhej@c83-251-227-152.bredband.comhem.se] has joined #lisp 07:49:51 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[~rmm@208.72.159.209] has joined #lisp 07:50:19 afa [u476@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-czyqlkeystfiotqk] has joined #lisp 07:50:19 Katibe [~Katibe@212.174.109.55] has joined #lisp 07:50:19 krl [~krl@rymdkoloni.se] has joined #lisp 07:50:19 amaron_ [~amaron@greenzone.copyleft.no] has joined #lisp 07:50:19 codewad [~codewad@50-47-240-200.evrt.wa.frontiernet.net] has joined #lisp 07:50:19 C-Keen [cckeen@pestilenz.org] has joined #lisp 07:50:19 rabite [~rabite@4chan.fm] has joined #lisp 07:50:19 Borbus [borbus@borbus.kicks-ass.net] has joined #lisp 07:50:46 -!- erk [~MrEd@BZ.BZFLAG.BZ] has quit [Max SendQ exceeded] 07:50:58 erk [~MrEd@about/apple/iPod/BeZerk] has joined #lisp 07:51:14 thanks 3b that works. I thought I'd have to fetch a slot or call a method 07:51:24 didn't think of calling princ 07:53:07 <|3b|`> printing it more or less does that internally, don't think there is any way to do it by hand in the spec though 07:54:19 anderson [~user@c-76-18-219-103.hsd1.fl.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 07:54:42 Munksgaard [~Munksgaar@1807ds2-noe.0.fullrate.dk] has joined #lisp 07:54:43 <|3b|`> and even if you could, you would just get a function to write the message to a stream, so princ-to-string is easier anyway 07:55:13 -!- |3b|` is now known as |3b| 07:55:15 lhz [~shrekz@c-dba672d5.021-158-73746f34.cust.bredbandsbolaget.se] has joined #lisp 07:56:35 homie [~levent.gu@xdsl-84-44-152-3.netcologne.de] has joined #lisp 07:57:52 -!- Guest17727 [~b-tag@183.15.164.72] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 08:00:01 -!- eadmund [~eadmund@67-6-156-162.hlrn.qwest.net] has left #lisp 08:01:00 ehu [~ehuels@ip118-64-212-87.adsl2.static.versatel.nl] has joined #lisp 08:02:01 gravicappa [~gravicapp@h178-129-47-77.dyn.bashtel.ru] has joined #lisp 08:03:44 -!- cmm [~cmm@109.67.199.173] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 08:04:05 cmm [~cmm@109.67.199.173] has joined #lisp 08:04:42 spiaggia` [~user@113.161.72.9] has joined #lisp 08:06:02 -!- spiaggia [~user@113.161.72.9] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 08:10:26 tcr [~tcr@155-dom-3.acn.waw.pl] has joined #lisp 08:10:26 -!- tcr1 [~tcr@155-dom-3.acn.waw.pl] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 08:11:50 mrSpec [~Spec@88.208.105.6] has joined #lisp 08:11:50 -!- mrSpec [~Spec@88.208.105.6] has quit [Changing host] 08:11:50 mrSpec [~Spec@unaffiliated/mrspec] has joined #lisp 08:11:56 -!- mrSpec [~Spec@unaffiliated/mrspec] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 08:12:10 -!- lhz [~shrekz@c-dba672d5.021-158-73746f34.cust.bredbandsbolaget.se] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 08:12:45 mk2 [~user@cpc7-lewi14-2-0-cust39.2-4.cable.virginmedia.com] has joined #lisp 08:13:08 -!- tcr [~tcr@155-dom-3.acn.waw.pl] has quit [Client Quit] 08:14:01 Guest17727 [~b-tag@183.15.164.72] has joined #lisp 08:14:35 lanthan_ [~ze@p54B7D9CC.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #lisp 08:16:05 is there a function like princ-to-string that will not remove quotes from strings? format does it too with ~a 08:16:36 i want same output that print gives 08:17:01 -!- dmiles [dmiles@c-24-21-133-103.hsd1.wa.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 08:17:04 I could use with-output-to-string I guess if there's no such function 08:17:25 <|3b|> yeah, with-output-to-string or format nil "~s" 08:17:37 <|3b|> or maybe write :readably t 08:17:45 ~s does it nice 08:17:58 -!- lanthan [~ze@p54B7DFDA.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 268 seconds] 08:17:59 <|3b|> write-to-string rather 08:18:38 <|3b|> hmm, prin1-to-string i guess should print comparably to print 08:19:12 <|3b|> since print is just prin1 with an extra newline and space 08:20:03 yes prin1-to-string works too 08:21:21 -!- ehu [~ehuels@ip118-64-212-87.adsl2.static.versatel.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 08:21:57 <|3b|> not that princ or ~a 'remove' quotes, since the quotes aren't actually part of the strings, just part of the syntax that READ uses to parse strings 08:22:50 yes that's true 08:23:13 <|3b|> so it is more a question of which function/settings/format command will write things in a format suitable for READing 08:23:24 -!- twbd|eweej is now known as twbd 08:28:08 -!- anderson [~user@c-76-18-219-103.hsd1.fl.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 08:28:22 morphling [~stefan@gssn-4d003b2e.pool.mediaWays.net] has joined #lisp 08:28:39 -!- mippymoe89 [~mippymoe8@c-24-147-92-217.hsd1.vt.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 08:29:25 qizwiz``` [~user@ppp-70-247-127-103.dsl.rcsntx.swbell.net] has joined #lisp 08:29:30 -!- twbd [~willem@91.177.54.220] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 08:30:18 Davidbrcz [~david@212-198-126-167.rev.numericable.fr] has joined #lisp 08:31:28 -!- araujo [~araujo@gentoo/developer/araujo] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 08:32:40 twbd [~willem@91.177.177.201] has joined #lisp 08:32:41 -!- qizwiz`` [~user@ppp-70-247-127-103.dsl.rcsntx.swbell.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 08:38:39 -!- Salamander [~Salamande@ppp121-45-158-125.lns21.adl6.internode.on.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 08:39:06 bsod1 [~sinan@88.240.128.146] has joined #lisp 08:40:03 -!- Axioplas1_ [~Axioplase@fortigate.kb.ecei.tohoku.ac.jp] has quit [Quit: Reconnecting] 08:40:08 Axioplase_ [~Axioplase@fortigate.kb.ecei.tohoku.ac.jp] has joined #lisp 08:40:19 Salamander [~Salamande@ppp121-45-109-88.lns20.adl6.internode.on.net] has joined #lisp 08:43:04 gko [~gko@220-135-201-90.HINET-IP.hinet.net] has joined #lisp 08:46:15 Is there a way to use POP to remove an element from a list that is not at the top of the list or do I need to rearrange the list? 08:46:19 Salamander_ [~Salamande@ppp118-210-102-42.lns20.adl2.internode.on.net] has joined #lisp 08:46:49 -!- Salamander [~Salamande@ppp121-45-109-88.lns20.adl6.internode.on.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 08:48:29 -!- bsod1 [~sinan@88.240.128.146] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 08:48:37 -!- pchrist [~spirit@gentoo/developer/pchrist] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 08:49:02 -!- Salamander_ is now known as Salamander 08:51:52 Kajtek [~paniwladc@nat4-230.ghnet.pl] has joined #lisp 08:52:51 mobydick: pop works on places. 08:53:28 -!- kennyd [~kennyd@93-136-62-168.adsl.net.t-com.hr] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 08:54:22 pjb: by places you mean? am i better off using delete or remove then? 08:54:34 (cdr x) is a place. 08:54:47 -!- Guest17727 [~b-tag@183.15.164.72] has quit [Quit: Ex-Chat] 08:55:50 -!- dnolen [~davidnole@184.152.69.75] has quit [Quit: dnolen] 08:56:10 taocp [~user@175.124.94.167] has joined #lisp 08:56:21 kennyd [~kennyd@93-136-62-168.adsl.net.t-com.hr] has joined #lisp 08:58:42 -!- elliottcable is now known as ec|detached 09:02:53 -!- morphling [~stefan@gssn-4d003b2e.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 09:03:02 mobydick: said otherwise, (pop x) is just (setf x (cdr x)) and (pop (cdr x)) is just (setf (cdr x) (cdr (cdr x))) 09:03:13 morphling [~stefan@gssn-4d003b2e.pool.mediaWays.net] has joined #lisp 09:03:55 pjb: so its changing the address of the element rather than removing it? 09:04:16 pjb: how can you remove the element completely from the list? 09:04:27 Athas [~athas@130.225.165.35] has joined #lisp 09:08:31 -!- gravicappa [~gravicapp@h178-129-47-77.dyn.bashtel.ru] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 09:11:14 hi 09:11:44 mrSpec [~Spec@88.208.105.6] has joined #lisp 09:11:44 -!- mrSpec [~Spec@88.208.105.6] has quit [Changing host] 09:11:44 mrSpec [~Spec@unaffiliated/mrspec] has joined #lisp 09:12:07 What does the standard say about function redefinition? (specifically how it affects other functions that call the redefined function) 09:14:25 bsod1 [~sinan@88.244.175.247] has joined #lisp 09:31:22 -!- cbp [~cesarbol9@189.247.106.6] has quit [] 09:38:53 -!- Athas [~athas@130.225.165.35] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 09:39:27 drdo: it is expected to work, unless the functions that call it were compiled in the same file 09:39:28 clhs 3.2.2.3 09:39:29 http://www.lispworks.com/reference/HyperSpec/Body/03_bbc.htm 09:40:05 nikodemus [~nikodemus@cs181063174.pp.htv.fi] has joined #lisp 09:43:16 mishoo_ [~mishoo@79.112.236.132] has joined #lisp 09:43:30 is there something like conditionp ? 09:43:42 <|3b|> typep ... condition? 09:44:24 nice didnt know about that 09:46:12 -!- mishoo [~mishoo@79.112.236.132] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 09:46:36 hope i'm not miking the help in here :). but can I somehow turn values into a list? 09:47:46 <|3b|> multiple-values-list? 09:48:56 thanks really appreciate it. I want to do more things than my current knowledge allows me, I should go back to reading practical common lisp 09:51:21 -!- cmm [~cmm@109.67.199.173] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 09:52:19 cmm [~cmm@109.67.199.173] has joined #lisp 09:55:00 dfox [~dfox@ip-94-113-17-246.net.upcbroadband.cz] has joined #lisp 09:57:47 xan_ [~xan@216.Red-88-19-137.staticIP.rima-tde.net] has joined #lisp 10:02:22 Ragnaroek [~chatzilla@p4FF90566.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #lisp 10:07:13 -!- setmeaway [stemearay@183.106.96.30] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 10:10:06 setmeaway [setmeaway3@118.45.149.131] has joined #lisp 10:10:46 -!- Oddity [~Oddity@unaffiliated/oddity] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 10:11:15 leo2007 [~leo@123.114.37.116] has joined #lisp 10:11:39 ehu [~ehuels@ip118-64-212-87.adsl2.static.versatel.nl] has joined #lisp 10:12:53 -!- xan_ [~xan@216.Red-88-19-137.staticIP.rima-tde.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 10:13:04 xan_ [~xan@216.Red-88-19-137.staticIP.rima-tde.net] has joined #lisp 10:16:00 Kenjin [~josesanto@bl19-232-217.dsl.telepac.pt] has joined #lisp 10:24:41 -!- Ragnaroek [~chatzilla@p4FF90566.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 10:26:11 <^micro> nfo 10:27:09 schaueho [~schaueho@dslb-088-066-023-247.pools.arcor-ip.net] has joined #lisp 10:27:54 ignas [~ignas@ctv-79-132-160-221.vinita.lt] has joined #lisp 10:30:10 -!- hba [~hba@189.130.166.233] has quit [Quit: leaving] 10:34:44 daniel__ [~daniel@p5082A020.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #lisp 10:36:21 -!- daniel___ [~daniel@p5082BC2F.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 10:42:19 -!- Davidbrcz [~david@212-198-126-167.rev.numericable.fr] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 10:48:40 milanj [~milanj_@109-93-62-183.dynamic.isp.telekom.rs] has joined #lisp 10:55:16 Davidbrcz [~david@212-198-126-167.rev.numericable.fr] has joined #lisp 11:01:41 -!- gemelen [~shelta@shpd-92-101-141-234.vologda.ru] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 11:05:37 varjag [~eugene@253.79.34.95.customer.cdi.no] has joined #lisp 11:06:46 gemelen [~shelta@shpd-95-53-171-252.vologda.ru] has joined #lisp 11:13:06 Is there some sneaky way to do a collect (blah) so long as (blah) returns non nill? 11:13:38 when blah collect blah? 11:15:01 Won't it call (blah) twice collecting possibly a different result than the one giving truth? 11:15:30 Might be, but you can use a let or with or something for that. 11:16:12 <_3b> when (blah) collect it ? 11:18:23 gravicappa [~gravicapp@h178-129-45-250.dyn.bashtel.ru] has joined #lisp 11:18:53 jsoft, (loop for i in '(1 nil 3 nil 5) when i collect i) 11:18:58 like that? 11:20:01 oh right, Zhivago already suggested it 11:21:34 -!- leo2007 [~leo@123.114.37.116] has quit [Quit: rcirc on GNU Emacs 23.3.50.1] 11:25:20 francogrex [~user@109.130.225.20] has joined #lisp 11:25:45 jtza8 [~jtza8@iburst-41-213-46-251.iburst.co.za] has joined #lisp 11:27:35 -!- francogrex [~user@109.130.225.20] has 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-!- varjag [~eugene@253.79.34.95.customer.cdi.no] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 11:55:13 antoszka: (loop for i = blah when i collect i) + stop condition 11:57:35 *_3b* guesses mobody likes IT in loop 11:57:39 <_3b> *nobody 12:01:25 sellout- [~Adium@64.134.67.68] has joined #lisp 12:04:18 -!- ec|detached is now known as elliottcable 12:04:40 varjag [~eugene@253.79.34.95.customer.cdi.no] has joined #lisp 12:04:49 -!- bsod1 [~sinan@88.242.78.145] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 12:07:44 *antoszka* loves IT in loop. 12:08:01 _ is good. 12:14:54 MoALTz [~no@host-92-9-77-82.as43234.net] has joined #lisp 12:25:11 -!- lnostdal-laptop [~lnostdal@2.149.29.184.tmi.telenormobil.no] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 12:27:02 francogrex [~user@109.130.225.20] has joined #lisp 12:33:35 steevy [~steevy@95-89-223-125-dynip.superkabel.de] has joined #lisp 12:33:39 -!- steevy [~steevy@95-89-223-125-dynip.superkabel.de] has quit [Client Quit] 12:38:53 lnostdal-laptop [~lnostdal@77.17.136.76.tmi.telenormobil.no] has joined #lisp 12:41:04 kenjin2201 [~kenjin@218.235.8.175] has joined #lisp 12:48:23 nikodemus pasted "with-open-file indentation -- which do you like the best?" at http://paste.lisp.org/display/122586 12:49:48 They are all fine 12:50:11 -!- taocp [~user@175.124.94.167] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 12:50:13 But probably second or third since they take up less space and don't reduce readability 12:51:26 maybe alt 1. maybe current. no strong feelings... 12:52:00 nikodemus annotated #122586 "more generally: keyword indentation when the previous line doesn't have a keyword" at http://paste.lisp.org/display/122586#1 12:54:39 Don't have a strong opinion here either, but going with alternative for the same reason 12:55:19 nikodemus annotated #122586 "finally, indenting unknown keyword forms" at http://paste.lisp.org/display/122586#2 12:55:26 One where i do have an opinion is IF, identation should be two spaces or maybe like it in in emacs lisp 12:56:06 -!- Beetny [~Beetny@ppp118-208-19-192.lns20.bne1.internode.on.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 12:56:25 nikodemus: alternative there, even yesterday i was secretly wishing sdl:with-events would indent properly 12:57:29 drdo: i disgree on IF, but common-lisp-style: classic and you have your wish :) or (define-common-lisp-style "drdo" (:inherit "modern") (:indentation (if (4 2 2))) -- or (if (4 4 &rest 2)) for _really_ elisp like :) 12:58:43 -!- francogrex [~user@109.130.225.20] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 12:59:45 bgs100 [~ian@unaffiliated/bgs100] has joined #lisp 13:00:32 billstclair [~billstcla@unaffiliated/billstclair] has joined #lisp 13:02:34 stassats [~stassats@wikipedia/stassats] has joined #lisp 13:02:50 lurker-x [~androirc@c-174-53-229-4.hsd1.mn.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 13:03:05 lacedaemon [~quassel@pdpc/supporter/professional/fenlix] has joined #lisp 13:03:52 cmbntr_ [~cmbntr@slice.loopback.ch] has joined #lisp 13:04:11 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[~x@2001:4968:200:0:20c:29ff:fe47:788] has quit [*.net *.split] 13:10:30 ilmari [ilmari@knuth.ping.uio.no] has joined #lisp 13:10:33 flor [~flor@76.73.16.26] has joined #lisp 13:12:49 leo2007 [~leo@2402:f000:5:2901:225:4bff:fea9:b9e4] has joined #lisp 13:15:16 -!- varjag [~eugene@253.79.34.95.customer.cdi.no] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 13:15:26 Bacteria [~Bacteria@115-64-180-132.static.tpgi.com.au] has joined #lisp 13:16:13 Nshag [user@chl45-1-88-123-84-8.fbx.proxad.net] has joined #lisp 13:16:54 hello. is it possible to drop into repl at some point of code? so that I can inspect variables etc 13:17:20 tomaw [tom@freenode/staff/tomaw] has joined #lisp 13:17:51 Yuuhi [benni@p5483D93D.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #lisp 13:19:58 clhs break 13:19:58 http://www.lispworks.com/reference/HyperSpec/Body/f_break.htm 13:20:06 flor: Is that what you want? 13:22:00 precisely what I wanted, thanks 13:22:08 nice that I can continue execution too 13:25:54 :o Cool 13:31:25 -!- sellout- [~Adium@64.134.67.68] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 13:31:38 zerogeedawg [~brian@c-71-202-139-217.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 13:33:29 jajcloz [~jaj@pool-108-20-32-147.bstnma.fios.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 13:33:46 Modius [~Modius@cpe-70-123-140-183.austin.res.rr.com] has joined #lisp 13:36:11 varjag [~eugene@253.79.34.95.customer.cdi.no] has joined #lisp 13:36:18 -!- jtza8 [~jtza8@iburst-41-213-46-251.iburst.co.za] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 13:40:01 -!- lurker-x [~androirc@c-174-53-229-4.hsd1.mn.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: bye...] 13:43:45 -!- zerogeedawg [~brian@c-71-202-139-217.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: zerogeedawg] 13:50:36 -!- jajcloz [~jaj@pool-108-20-32-147.bstnma.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Quit: jajcloz] 13:52:25 excelsior1979 [~excelsior@cpe-68-175-63-138.nyc.res.rr.com] has joined #lisp 13:52:35 is lisp as fast as c++? 13:52:53 Your question is incorrect. 13:53:11 Is 3 as heavy as 17? 13:53:30 Whoa, you just blew my mind. 13:53:36 Just kidding. 13:53:41 did you code lisp as proper and due to the problem such that it is as fast as it can be ? 13:54:28 excelsior1979: more exactly, is French as fast as English? 13:54:30 excelsior1979: depends entirely on what you're doing. some types of OO code and easily end up faster then C++. different types are on par. sometimes you lose 13:54:48 languages are isomorphic 13:54:59 C++ implementations tend to be faster than lisp implementations for many tasks. 13:55:04 and the transformed ones call themselves bilingual 13:55:08 or multilingual 13:55:09 lol 13:55:10 No. That depends entirely on the person. There are English speaking persons who are much slower than French speaking persons, and vice-versa. 13:55:17 pjb: more like: Is french or english more efficient when saying something? 13:55:25 So you'd say lisp is definitely faster than python then? 13:55:33 loke: define "efficient"> 13:55:39 it depends a lot on the implementation as well. if you're doing numerics, sbcl tends so be a bit slower, but within a small (1.x - 3x) constant factor 13:55:47 excelsior: Please come back when you are not a moron. 13:55:51 pjb: nope, the whole point is that I'm not defining it. :-) 13:55:51 but then again, sometimes it's faster 13:56:10 Wow, I'm feeling the lisp love... 13:56:19 excelsior1979: have a lookt at http://cliki.net/Performance 13:56:31 feed the troll 13:56:34 excelsior: Stop confusing languages with implementations. 13:56:50 excelsior1979: It's more because the whole premise for saying that X is "definitely" more Y than Z is flawed, as you can always come up with counteraxamples. 13:56:54 excelsior1979: basically, lisp is 2 to 10 times faster than C++. 13:57:03 excelsior: If you can't do that, then you are too stupid to talk to. 13:57:31 excelsior1979: compiled implementations are typically clearly faster than python, but if you're comparing performance of a python library actually implemented in C, then pure lisp solutions on good implementations tend to -- again -- be within that small constant factor. 13:57:35 add^_ pasted "raytracer - render gives me an warning/error that I'll post next" at http://paste.lisp.org/display/122587 13:57:36 There are C++ implementations that are slower than lisp implementations and vice versa. 13:57:37 Jubb [~ghost@c-68-33-4-101.hsd1.md.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 13:57:59 The same goes for C++ implementations and python implementations, for that matter. 13:58:04 add^_ annotated #122587 "error/warnings" at http://paste.lisp.org/display/122587#1 13:58:23 Even if you specify the implementation, you can't just compare them like that 13:58:34 guys, while his question is a typical troll question, and confusing language and implementation is irritating, give him a break till he shows if he's serious or trolling 13:58:35 It depends on the program you are comparing with 13:58:40 sometimes called benchmark 13:59:10 so C++ and lisp compiled are on the same order of speed, while python scripted is an order or two slower? 13:59:49 compiled C and compiled lisp are in the same magniture, assuming it's apples to apples comparison 14:00:43 the implementing a python library in C comment is not apples to apples is it? But I could do it with cython or shedskin, I suppose. 14:00:44 interpreted languages pay an order of magnitude (anything from -- to pull a number out of my ass -- 8x to 20x) 14:00:55 -!- jefhsf [~jef@5ac8b0e6.bb.sky.com] has quit [Quit: Lost terminal] 14:01:19 urandom__ [~user@p548A5160.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #lisp 14:01:38 gffa [~gffa@unaffiliated/gffa] has joined #lisp 14:02:07 add: Try 1.0s 14:02:16 so if I have a program I write in python, and decide it's too slow, am I better off climbing the learning curve in lisp or c++? 14:02:24 i only can say that speed has never been an obstacle for me while using Lisp 14:02:56 Zhivago: 1.0s? 14:02:57 excel: It depends on what your program does ... 14:03:09 When I read about lisp, I get excited, but when I see it implemented, I get discouraged. 14:03:18 excelsior1979: explain the second part 14:03:19 excelsior1979: i would say you're initially best of by profiling your python program and see what the problem is. Not that that excludes learning CL of course. :) 14:03:24 let's say you're doing numerics, and calling out to lapack from python, vs using a similar library written in lisp (instead of calling out to lapack from lisp) -- it's not a python to lisp comparison then, but a fortran to lisp comparison 14:03:34 excel: If lisp discourages you, you can always try javascript. :) 14:03:40 hell no 14:03:44 excelsior1979: what implementations have you looked at? 14:03:45 excel: v8 kicks the crap out of cpython. 14:03:56 what kind of program(s) are you planning to write? 14:04:10 I mean looking at a program written in lisp. I don't understand it. 14:04:23 learning the language first helps with that :) 14:04:27 That's surprising! You never learned lisp and you don't understand it 14:04:30 and I feel like I should because of what I've read about it. 14:04:44 that's just not true 14:04:44 excel: When I look at text written in Spanish I can pretend to read it. 14:05:03 excel: That doesn't mean that I actually understand what it says -- but I can usually guess reasonably well. 14:05:19 excelsior1979: on the bnchmark game, SBCL (CL), Erlang/HiPE and Haskell (GHC) all beat Python significantly, if that's any use to you ;-) 14:05:24 araujo [~araujo@gentoo/developer/araujo] has joined #lisp 14:05:31 Zhivago: I know you're being a smartass, but that's a good point. I've read about Russian, learned the alphabet, and I can understand it. 14:05:31 excelsior1979: while it's true that if someone explains things to you clearly, you can start reading lisp very very soon -- since the syntax is trivial -- but learning to be fluent always takes time 14:05:44 excel: I think that you're doing the same thing with programming languages. 14:05:59 minion: tell excelsior1979 about pcl-book 14:06:02 excel: Then stop worrying about superficially understanding prior to learning. 14:06:05 minion? crap 14:06:33 here's a good book to learn from: http://www.gigamonkeys.com/book/ # free on the web 14:07:45 :-/ 14:08:11 excel: Seriously -- if you want a fast alternative to cpython, I recommend v8 javascript. :) 14:08:15 excelsior1979: but trivial programs in lisp _are_ trival to read even without learning the language 14:08:18 I use Ubuntu, what's the name of the package I need to download from the repos to get started? (like: sudo apt-get install blahcommonlisp) 14:08:21 hello world: (write-line "Hello world!") 14:08:35 excelsior1979: sbcl probably 14:09:02 sbcl -- but the ubuntu packages tend to sometimes lag a bit, so you /might/ consider getting it from www.sbcl.org instead 14:09:09 you might want to get emacs and slime too 14:09:31 hmm. by accident i must have enabled something odd in emacs. my slime-repl says "text is read-only". how do i get write access back? (C-x C-q didn't work) 14:09:35 -!- ehu [~ehuels@ip118-64-212-87.adsl2.static.versatel.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 14:09:51 excelsior1979: also, avoid other ubuntu CL packages. In fact, you might want to avoid even implmntation packages and install from net (due to some weird stuff they pull) 14:10:34 Salamander_ [~Salamande@ppp118-210-56-247.lns20.adl2.internode.on.net] has joined #lisp 14:10:49 p_l|backup is right. distro packaging of lisp stuff is pretty terrible, and can have wierd interactions with non-distro stuff -- which you will want soon anyways 14:11:04 I'm not learning emacs while I'm learning lisp. I already started playing with vim. I don't get the productivity idea. Maybe later. 14:11:32 -!- jsoft [~jsoft@unaffiliated/jsoft] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 14:11:42 you can use emacs without using the keychords. everything is accessible from a menu 14:11:51 is there a .deb package at the site? 14:11:59 no, sorry 14:12:04 excelsior1979: Just untar the binary and run it. 14:12:18 excelsior1979: Get your packages from quicklisp (once you get the binary running). 14:12:19 excelsior1979: You will be missing out, slime is really nice 14:12:31 the binary installs under /usr/local, or you can use the run-sbcl.sh script to run it from where you untarred it 14:12:54 -!- Salamander [~Salamande@ppp118-210-102-42.lns20.adl2.internode.on.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 14:14:37 -!- jingtao [~jingtaozf@123.120.13.198] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 14:14:39 How do I know you're not install a bot on my computer if I use your binary? 14:15:25 I trust you, but due diligence, you know. 14:15:29 ... 14:15:58 excelsior1979: Come on. It's not like you can trust any other arbitrary binary either. 14:16:26 excelsior1979: there are mandatory access control systems available, and you can compile it from source too... 14:16:34 excelsior1979: this channel is just a cover for our massive botnet operation 14:16:39 ehu [~ehuels@ip118-64-212-87.adsl2.static.versatel.nl] has joined #lisp 14:16:41 we rely on people like you 14:17:22 drdo: I'm just a little paranoid. thanks, I'm full now. 14:21:39 -!- c_arenz [~arenz@p5B2CC985.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 14:22:38 jajcloz [~jaj@pool-108-20-32-147.bstnma.fios.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 14:22:46 problem solved.. 14:25:21 so steel bank is heartily endorsed by most lisp programmers? 14:28:12 isn't ccl and abcl fairly popular too? 14:28:48 see, that's why I check with real people. Google is nice, but it's no panacea... 14:29:05 excelsior1979: you're asking very naïve questions. Have a look at http://cm.bell-labs.com/who/ken/trust.html 14:30:17 -!- mornfall_ is now known as mornfall 14:30:17 -!- mornfall [~mornfall@anna.fi.muni.cz] has quit [Changing host] 14:30:17 mornfall [~mornfall@kde/developer/mornfall] has joined #lisp 14:30:19 p_l|backup: compiling from sources doesn't help. 14:30:23 You have to start from sand. 14:30:26 add^_: CCL definitely, ABCL less so. CCL has a lot of pluses on platforms where SBCL has some problems (win32/64, threaded OSX) and is generally faster in compilation and takes less memory (which afaik was a reason for its use in ITA) 14:30:29 general-general [~marypatri@86-46-61-67-dynamic.b-ras3.mvw.galway.eircom.net] has joined #lisp 14:30:32 pjb: true... 14:30:46 .. 14:30:51 *p_l|backup* recently decompiled android programs before installing to check for backdoors 14:31:12 Insufficient. You should decompile the chips. 14:31:16 p_l|backup: ah 14:31:43 p_l|backup: Clearly they have installed backdoors in your cpu 14:32:12 decompile your decompiler too... 14:32:18 http://www.visual6502.org/ 14:32:21 decompile yourself, you never know 14:33:03 Indeed, the next step is to decompile the universe. However God prodides us with a garantee: we have free will. 14:33:31 Just a pity that there's no guarantee that God can guarantee that. 14:33:51 -!- armence [~armence@unaffiliated/armence] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 14:33:55 Yep, you have to have faith. 14:34:01 What does the >>> operator mean here?: http://googleresearch.blogspot.com/2006/06/extra-extra-read-all-about-it-nearly.html 14:34:08 drdo: there actually is one... 14:35:11 excelsior1979: who knows? It's java... 14:35:45 From the context, >>>1 is /2 14:36:03 Ragnaroek [~chatzilla@vpnsh0089.fh-trier.de] has joined #lisp 14:36:10 /2? means floor? 14:36:26 Or truncate. 14:36:38 Confusal. 14:36:44 pretty sure it means divide by 2 14:37:04 Integer division, I'd guess. 14:37:50 ... shift right, i think 14:38:11 yes, >> definetly means shift right there 14:38:21 since they just said it's equivalent to /2 14:39:00 -!- general-general [~marypatri@86-46-61-67-dynamic.b-ras3.mvw.galway.eircom.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 14:41:14 workthrick [~mathrick@emp.nat.sdu.dk] has joined #lisp 14:41:45 general-general [~marypatri@86-46-61-67-dynamic.b-ras3.mvw.galway.eircom.net] has joined #lisp 14:42:49 npoektop [~npoektop@85.202.112.90] has joined #lisp 14:43:23 Guthur [~Guthur@host86-138-192-24.range86-138.btcentralplus.com] has joined #lisp 14:50:30 anukalp [~anukalp@42.104.148.233] has joined #lisp 14:53:43 hum, I get that "camera-pos" isn't defined although in the class camera, I do have pos... shouldn't that count as a definition? (risks being hanged for nooby question) 14:54:48 You didn't paste the definition of camera. But with defclass, you need to name all the accessors you want. 14:55:23 Should I just paste the code? 14:55:29 in paste.lisp 14:55:31 ? 14:55:51 You can make an annotation to your previous paste. 14:56:05 sellout- [~Adium@c-24-61-13-161.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 14:56:11 peterhil [~peterhil@a91-152-135-21.elisa-laajakaista.fi] has joined #lisp 14:56:30 I'll do that 14:56:34 add^_ annotated #122587 "camera.lisp" at http://paste.lisp.org/display/122587#2 14:57:01 Yep, you see, no definition for any accessor for the pos slot. 14:57:03 the other problem I had got fixed though 14:57:10 oh 14:57:43 There are readers for the direction and the fov, that's all... 14:57:54 :-/ 14:58:45 I'm not sure if you were here yesterday but I had a bunch of problems with the code then too, I'm following along with a screencast about making a raytracer :-) 14:59:04 So I'm not entirely sure about what to do 14:59:07 *add^_* sighs 14:59:29 Add a: :reader camera-pos 15:00:08 Check this out: 10 year old paper, Lisp (Scheme) is faster than C++ in terms of both run time and development - http://www.flownet.com/gat/papers/lisp-java.pdf 15:00:20 hm ok 15:00:35 maybe they mean lisp or scheme 15:00:48 -!- mobydick [~textual@124-171-177-47.dyn.iinet.net.au] has quit [Quit: Computer has gone to sleep.] 15:01:28 that seems to have done it, thanks pjb! 15:01:32 lurker-x [~androirc@32.170.51.196] has joined #lisp 15:01:51 yeah, it's or, common lisp being allegro CL 4.3 15:04:49 excel: And why do you care? 15:04:54 kushal [~kdas@fedora/kushal] has joined #lisp 15:05:22 Zhivago: why are are you an asshole? 15:05:35 Sbidicuda [~antani@host52-175-dynamic.7-87-r.retail.telecomitalia.it] has joined #lisp 15:05:48 ni 15:05:49 touche. 15:05:50 hi 15:06:05 -!- anukalp [~anukalp@42.104.148.233] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 15:06:08 how can I create an array of functions and evaluate them? 15:06:30 why do you want to? 15:06:38 I mean f(1, x0, x1, x2, ..., xn) 15:06:49 to solve DAE systems 15:06:50 that doesn't look like Lisp 15:07:18 in fact it's called function :) 15:07:37 f1, f2, ..., fn 15:07:50 defined as above 15:07:59 where f1 = f1(x1, x2, ..., xn) 15:08:13 fm = fm(x1, x2, ..., xn) 15:08:14 are you sure that it's the best way to solve DAEs? 15:08:38 especially if you change f runtime 15:08:53 f must be run time defined 15:09:00 excel: Let me know if you figure out why you care about this. 15:09:14 excel: I suspect that you don't know why. 15:09:26 stassats: it depends on the particular physical system you're going top solve 15:10:10 -!- Krystof [~csr21@csrhodes.plus.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 15:10:47 stassats: I need to create every f during runtime 15:11:21 -!- lolsuper_ [~super_@unaffiliated/lolsuper-/x-9881387] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 15:11:35 -!- Evanescence [~chris@122.237.19.145] has quit [Quit: WeeChat 0.3.4] 15:11:49 lolsuper_ [~super_@unaffiliated/lolsuper-/x-9881387] has joined #lisp 15:14:35 -!- redline6561-work [~redline65@c-66-56-55-169.hsd1.ga.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 15:15:57 re. trusting binaries. signed hashes for sbcl binaries are available. if you're connected through the debian keychain you should be able to get a chain of trust 15:16:15 Zhivago: If I decide it's your business, I'll tell you. 15:17:04 excel: Have fun being a moron :) 15:17:25 stassats: ? 15:18:02 Sbidicuda: i know how to create an array of functions, but i don't think that it'll help you 15:18:20 AND WHAT THEN? 15:18:21 sprry 15:18:30 and what then? 15:18:38 how can I build f every time? 15:18:43 have you read Practical Common Lisp? 15:18:50 yes 15:19:06 from cover to cover? 15:19:14 no 15:19:18 then you can read PAIP now 15:19:38 PAIP? 15:19:45 -!- ramus_ [~ramus@adsl-108-68-168-62.dsl.chcgil.sbcglobal.net] has quit [Quit: Reconnecting] 15:20:00 ramus [~ramus@adsl-108-68-168-62.dsl.chcgil.sbcglobal.net] has joined #lisp 15:20:04 google it 15:20:12 PAIP? 15:20:13 with the dual of once-only ? 15:20:16 lol 15:20:51 -!- tsuru [~charlie@adsl-74-179-198-44.bna.bellsouth.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 15:21:13 ah Peter Norvig book 15:22:16 then? 15:22:32 is there a DAE solving system? 15:23:14 now, it teaches you how to think about things 15:23:20 so you can answer your questions better 15:23:32 s/now/no/ 15:23:45 ok, but I don't think there's a better way to do that 15:24:06 Zhivago: mom didn't hug you as a kid? too ugly? or just too unlikable? 15:24:23 excelsior1979: please stop this 15:25:06 Hey, I know I'm a guest in your channel, but I'm not a doormat. 15:25:25 excel: Like I said -- have fun being a moron. 15:25:43 stassats: problem is that I have different physical systems to simulate 15:26:10 Zhivago: did your mom abuse you? like sexually? 15:26:23 is there no mods around 15:26:44 *sellout-* isn't sure who should get kicked. 15:26:46 excelsior1979: there's no reason to turn this into a kindergarten 15:26:52 stassats: I've already done simulation using matrix algebra, but I need the solver to be more flexible 15:27:05 sellout-, pretty obvious I though, the moron 15:27:13 thought* 15:27:24 Guthur: Zhivago is pretty antagonistic, though. 15:27:27 there is a positive feedback loop 15:27:33 Here, I'll fix it for you, good bye! 15:27:39 -!- excelsior1979 [~excelsior@cpe-68-175-63-138.nyc.res.rr.com] has left #lisp 15:31:26 pizzledizzle [~pizdets@pool-98-113-194-183.nycmny.fios.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 15:32:26 -!- morphling [~stefan@gssn-4d003b2e.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 15:32:27 On #emacs they have a rule to avoid making newbies leave in disgust or something. Zhivago clearly would have failed that rule... 15:32:33 iori [~iori@110-133-45-54.rev.home.ne.jp] has joined #lisp 15:32:56 might have been my fault for calling for a mod 15:33:05 ecraven [~user@140.78.42.213] has joined #lisp 15:33:48 but the last few comments were properly moronic imo 15:34:12 Some people require house-training. 15:36:06 gko [~gko@220-135-201-90.HINET-IP.hinet.net] has joined #lisp 15:36:54 gozoner [~ebg@ip68-6-68-92.sb.sd.cox.net] has joined #lisp 15:37:23 -!- iori [~iori@110-133-45-54.rev.home.ne.jp] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 15:39:15 iori [~iori@110-133-45-54.rev.home.ne.jp] has joined #lisp 15:44:46 pjb: Remember the amusement clause! 15:48:08 Krystof [~csr21@csrhodes.plus.com] has joined #lisp 15:51:25 stassats` [~stassats@wikipedia/stassats] has joined #lisp 15:52:15 -!- leo2007 [~leo@2402:f000:5:2901:225:4bff:fea9:b9e4] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 15:52:20 -!- lurker-x [~androirc@32.170.51.196] has quit [Quit: bye...] 15:53:11 arborist [~arborist@g231004148.adsl.alicedsl.de] has joined #lisp 15:53:22 -!- iori [~iori@110-133-45-54.rev.home.ne.jp] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 15:53:28 Yeah, I think the abuse was a uncalled for. 15:54:14 -!- stassats [~stassats@wikipedia/stassats] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 15:57:07 Bike [~Glossina@71-38-158-146.ptld.qwest.net] has joined #lisp 15:59:41 -!- Bacteria [~Bacteria@115-64-180-132.static.tpgi.com.au] has quit [Quit: Bacteria] 16:00:34 Bahman [~bahman@2.144.209.160] has joined #lisp 16:00:57 Hi all 16:01:01 hello 16:01:54 Is it stylistically kosher to use OR to lazily get a value from n potential sources? 16:02:21 sure. 16:02:55 Salamander__ [~Salamande@ppp121-45-71-29.lns20.adl6.internode.on.net] has joined #lisp 16:03:10 iori [~iori@110-133-45-54.rev.home.ne.jp] has joined #lisp 16:03:34 prxq [~mommer@mnhm-5f75e2b6.pool.mediaWays.net] has joined #lisp 16:03:44 -!- Salamander_ [~Salamande@ppp118-210-56-247.lns20.adl2.internode.on.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 16:11:06 hi 16:13:39 felipe [~felipe@unaffiliated/felipe] has joined #lisp 16:13:46 renjikken [~ryuurei@blk-224-243-35.eastlink.ca] has joined #lisp 16:14:23 -!- itsyou49 [~lewisj@c-67-189-133-83.hsd1.nh.comcast.net] has quit [] 16:16:39 kruhft [~burton@S0106002401f331bd.cg.shawcable.net] has joined #lisp 16:19:39 -!- renjikken [~ryuurei@blk-224-243-35.eastlink.ca] has left #lisp 16:20:53 for those who weren't there earlier: http://paste.lisp.org/display/122586 # input sought on indentation 16:21:06 context being slime-indentation contrib, of course 16:21:18 -!- gko [~gko@220-135-201-90.HINET-IP.hinet.net] has quit [Quit: rcirc on GNU Emacs 23.3.1] 16:21:26 -!- iori [~iori@110-133-45-54.rev.home.ne.jp] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 16:21:41 w-o-f, definitely not 3 16:22:09 not what? 16:22:10 nikodemus: I like the current behaviour. 16:22:23 oh, alt2. 16:22:40 right 16:22:40 alternative 2 looks nice. 16:22:44 iori [~iori@110-133-45-54.rev.home.ne.jp] has joined #lisp 16:23:19 with the keyword args lined up on the pathname element, it makes the call super clear. 16:23:23 /imo 16:23:43 ace4016 [ace4016@adsl-184-32-14-120.mia.bellsouth.net] has joined #lisp 16:23:52 weinreb on the pro-list: "...and we have like 700MLOC of code in QRes." heh. i take it that is a typo or tongue in cheek. 16:24:50 _iori_ [~iori@110-133-45-54.rev.home.ne.jp] has joined #lisp 16:25:07 it should be self-aware by now with that amount of code 16:28:15 -!- iori [~iori@110-133-45-54.rev.home.ne.jp] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 16:29:26 -!- peterhil [~peterhil@a91-152-135-21.elisa-laajakaista.fi] has quit [Quit: Must not waste too much time here...] 16:30:27 -!- kpreid [~kpreid@adsl-75-36-176-90.dsl.pltn13.sbcglobal.net] has quit [Quit: Quitting] 16:31:32 kpreid [~kpreid@adsl-75-36-176-90.dsl.pltn13.sbcglobal.net] has joined #lisp 16:31:34 -!- ehine1 [~ericyoda@69.205.154.161] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 16:32:39 redline6561-work [~redline65@c-66-56-55-169.hsd1.ga.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 16:33:32 knob [~knob@66-50-60-128.prtc.net] has joined #lisp 16:33:37 Good evening everyone =) 16:34:39 Wooho. My JDBC backend for ABCL works pretty well 16:36:18 -!- xxxyyy1 [~xyxu@222.68.163.42] has left #lisp 16:36:51 nikodemus: if the keyword thingies are arguments to a function or macro call, then align them as arguments. If they're within some other kind of syntax, then align them as data 16:36:58 16:37:55 so that gives alternative 1 for with-open-file, "current" for foo and make-instance, and "neither" for some-macro 16:39:15 -!- lolsuper_ [~super_@unaffiliated/lolsuper-/x-9881387] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 16:39:35 lolsuper_ [~super_@unaffiliated/lolsuper-/x-9881387] has joined #lisp 16:40:39 leo2007 [~leo@2402:f000:5:2901:225:4bff:fea9:b9e4] has joined #lisp 16:41:03 -!- Jubb [~ghost@c-68-33-4-101.hsd1.md.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: Jubb] 16:48:14 -!- _iori_ [~iori@110-133-45-54.rev.home.ne.jp] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 16:48:44 catphive [~brenmill@c-76-104-152-119.hsd1.wa.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 16:48:45 -!- xan_ [~xan@216.Red-88-19-137.staticIP.rima-tde.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 16:49:07 vozhyk_ [~vozhyk@93.84.100.36] has joined #lisp 16:49:32 xan_ [~xan@216.Red-88-19-137.staticIP.rima-tde.net] has joined #lisp 16:52:55 What to do if I have name conflicts between COMMON-LISP:LOOP and OTHER-PACKAGE::LOOP(imported from COMMON-LISP)? 16:56:51 following a tutorial I have started a hunchentoot acceptor with (start (make-instance 'acceptor :port 8080)) 16:56:57 how to stop it again? 16:59:03 (hunchentoot:stop ACCEPTOR) but how am I supposed to know what to substitute for ACCEPTOR? 16:59:31 should have used (defparameter *something* when I started it, right? 16:59:47 but I also like to know how to stop without restarting now 16:59:58 -!- benny [~benny@i577A1637.versanet.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 17:00:19 insomniaSalt: you might have to restart you lisp 17:00:37 insomniaSalt: then defparameter it so you at least have a copy of the acceptor object 17:01:18 in other words, the acceptor started from the tutorial cant be stopped without restarting sbcl? 17:01:20 You can also use slime-list-threads to find the thread you want to kill. 17:01:25 vozhyk_: You'll probably have a restart to resolve the conflicts 17:01:34 pkhuong: thank i was looking for something like that 17:01:44 insomniaSalt: yes, but you're meant to keep a reference to the acceptor to stop it cleanly 17:02:28 There's no telling in what half-broken state killing a thread will leave your environment. 17:03:02 -!- BlankVerse [~pankajm@122.167.87.68] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 17:03:15 insomniaSalt: perhaps * or ** or *** still have the object? 17:03:21 I just want to kill it with fire 17:04:16 -!- redline6561-work [~redline65@c-66-56-55-169.hsd1.ga.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: Computer has gone to sleep.] 17:04:46 sbryant_work [~user@ghanima.slavasaur.com] has joined #lisp 17:08:29 jtza8 [~jtza8@iburst-41-213-46-251.iburst.co.za] has joined #lisp 17:12:30 -!- vozhyk_ [~vozhyk@93.84.100.36] has quit [*.net *.split] 17:12:30 -!- kpreid [~kpreid@adsl-75-36-176-90.dsl.pltn13.sbcglobal.net] has quit [*.net *.split] 17:12:30 -!- prxq [~mommer@mnhm-5f75e2b6.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit [*.net *.split] 17:12:30 -!- Salamander__ 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*.split] 17:12:31 -!- reb [~user@nat/google/x-zrcfgkxirfsypqlz] has quit [*.net *.split] 17:12:31 -!- antoszka [~antoszka@unaffiliated/antoszka] has quit [*.net *.split] 17:16:08 Kajtek [~paniwladc@nat4-230.ghnet.pl] has joined #lisp 17:17:18 -!- lolsuper_ [~super_@unaffiliated/lolsuper-/x-9881387] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 17:17:34 super__ [~super_@unaffiliated/lolsuper-/x-9881387] has joined #lisp 17:18:26 fasta [1334259@xs8.xs4all.nl] has joined #lisp 17:18:55 -!- super__ [~super_@unaffiliated/lolsuper-/x-9881387] has quit [Max SendQ exceeded] 17:20:04 super__ [~super_@unaffiliated/lolsuper-/x-9881387] has joined #lisp 17:21:16 Guthur_ [~Guthur@host86-139-108-200.range86-139.btcentralplus.com] has joined #lisp 17:23:22 -!- Guthur [~Guthur@host86-138-192-24.range86-138.btcentralplus.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 17:23:53 nikodemus annotated #122586 "dwimmish" at http://paste.lisp.org/display/122586#3 17:24:09 -!- sbryant_work [~user@ghanima.slavasaur.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 17:27:14 -!- Guthur_ is now known as Guthur 17:28:31 benny [~benny@i577A8C7B.versanet.de] has joined #lisp 17:35:45 -!- Ragnaroek [~chatzilla@vpnsh0089.fh-trier.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 17:36:52 dnolen [~davidnole@184.152.69.75] has joined #lisp 17:37:06 sbryant_work [~user@ghanima.slavasaur.com] has joined #lisp 17:41:12 jrockway [~jrockway@2600:3c00::f03c:91ff:fe93:50b0] has joined #lisp 17:43:42 kpreid [~kpreid@adsl-75-36-176-90.dsl.pltn13.sbcglobal.net] has joined #lisp 17:43:42 prxq [~mommer@mnhm-5f75e2b6.pool.mediaWays.net] has joined #lisp 17:43:42 Salamander__ [~Salamande@ppp121-45-71-29.lns20.adl6.internode.on.net] has joined #lisp 17:43:42 varjag [~eugene@253.79.34.95.customer.cdi.no] has joined #lisp 17:43:42 ilmari [ilmari@knuth.ping.uio.no] has joined #lisp 17:43:42 juniorroy [~juniorroy@212.36.228.103] has joined #lisp 17:43:42 xristos_ [~x@2001:4968:200:0:20c:29ff:fe47:788] has joined #lisp 17:43:42 cmm- 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[~user@nat/google/x-zrcfgkxirfsypqlz] has joined #lisp 17:43:42 antoszka [~antoszka@unaffiliated/antoszka] has joined #lisp 17:43:42 -!- Quadrescence [~quad@unaffiliated/quadrescence] has quit [Excess Flood] 17:43:45 Salamander_ [~Salamande@ppp121-45-95-201.lns20.adl6.internode.on.net] has joined #lisp 17:43:47 Quadrescence [~quad@unaffiliated/quadrescence] has joined #lisp 17:45:19 Harag [~Harag@dsl-242-246-28.telkomadsl.co.za] has joined #lisp 17:46:26 -!- Salamander__ [~Salamande@ppp121-45-71-29.lns20.adl6.internode.on.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 17:47:27 -!- muhdick [~qle@74-92-196-145-Atlanta.hfc.comcastbusiness.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 17:48:08 -!- pinterface [~pinterfac@173-20-55-85.client.mchsi.com] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 17:50:00 anybody know of a way to get the number of bytes that a data structure references in sbcl? 17:50:29 Vowyer [~sebas@71-208-17-190.fibertel.com.ar] has joined #lisp 17:50:49 Is there any lint tool for CL? 17:51:40 davazp [~user@18.Red-88-1-93.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net] has joined #lisp 17:52:04 Vowyer: Not that I know of. I don't think a lint tool would be quite as effective for lisp 17:52:48 Ok, thanks 17:53:26 sbcl's compiler might as well be a linter 17:53:59 Kinda useless if you can't build under sbcl though :( 17:55:02 there's lisp-critic. 17:55:37 kruhft: there are various reference-walking functions in sb-introspect (walk-root, mainly, iirc), but, with sharing, that concept is a bit fuzzy 18:08:17 itegebo [~quassel@c-76-102-2-0.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 18:11:38 -!- ignas [~ignas@ctv-79-132-160-221.vinita.lt] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 18:13:49 pkhuong: http://www.cs.northwestern.edu/academics/courses/325/programs/lisp-critic.lisp  is this the official whereabouts of lisp-critic, or is there a better/newer location? 18:16:36 bsod1 [~sinan@188.58.156.111] has joined #lisp 18:19:02 antoszka: no clue. 18:23:41 -!- flor [~flor@76.73.16.26] has quit [Quit: CGI:IRC (Session timeout)] 18:24:55 It's useless without the rules file 18:26:45 how hard would it be to add RESTART-FRAME support to SBCL? 18:28:29 tcr1 [~tcr@155-dom-3.acn.waw.pl] has joined #lisp 18:29:12 AntiSpamMeta [~MetaBot@unaffiliated/afterdeath/bot/antispambot] has joined #lisp 18:31:31 HG` [~HG@p579F775F.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #lisp 18:31:51 Has there been any work to extend CLOS (or have a new system entirely) which can dispatch on more general types, as opposed to simple classes? 18:33:35 zmv [~daniel@c95315ce.virtua.com.br] has joined #lisp 18:33:40 -!- lnostdal-laptop [~lnostdal@77.17.136.76.tmi.telenormobil.no] has quit [Quit: ubuntu natty is such a mess ...] 18:35:09 -!- sacho [~sacho@90.154.206.145] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 18:37:22 Quadrescence: what do you mean by that? 18:39:16 Well, it'd be nice (even if not necessarily efficient) to define generic functions which can dispatch on, say, (Complex Integer) separately from (Complex Rational) without having to make a ComplexInteger and ComplexRational class. 18:40:22 Quadrescence: you're straying into SATISFIES territory now, and that's in general not possible 18:40:47 you can't dispatch reliably unless you have separate COMPLEX-INTEGER and COMPLEX-RATIONAL types 18:40:56 You're right, that is generally not possible 18:41:00 Quadrescence: you can try filtered methods 18:41:19 http://common-lisp.net/project/closer/filtered.html 18:41:51 it provides some syntactic sugar for certain classes of predicate-based dispatch 18:42:01 ah, I'll look, thanks 18:42:21 -!- leo2007 [~leo@2402:f000:5:2901:225:4bff:fea9:b9e4] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 18:44:49 workthrick: neat 18:45:03 -!- nikodemus [~nikodemus@cs181063174.pp.htv.fi] has quit [Quit: This computer has gone to sleep] 18:45:17 yep, typical Pascal neatness 18:45:17 -!- zmv [~daniel@c95315ce.virtua.com.br] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 18:45:22 -!- kenjin2201 [~kenjin@218.235.8.175] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 18:47:48 zmv [~daniel@c95315ce.virtua.com.br] has joined #lisp 18:48:09 schoppenhauer [~christoph@unaffiliated/schoppenhauer] has joined #lisp 18:48:17 lnostdal-laptop [~lnostdal@77.17.136.76.tmi.telenormobil.no] has joined #lisp 18:48:43 wow... i am using that and did not even know that it was an addition to cl and not part of it! 18:48:52 heh 18:49:19 its amaizing what you pick up from other peoples code without knowing it 18:49:53 Ragnaroek [~chatzilla@vpnsh0041.fh-trier.de] has joined #lisp 18:50:42 sacho [~sacho@90.154.206.145] has joined #lisp 18:52:37 talking about amaizing ... i have got cl-prevalence using up to 8 gigs without crashing my system... 18:54:21 Harag: unwittingly picking up things that aren't standard is exactly why #lisp is pretty insistent on consulting CLHS on every occasion 18:55:29 Harag: interesting, how much data you have in it? Millions of records? 18:55:49 Vowyer: i am trying to load it with 30 million records 18:56:18 i think when the load is finished and I make a snap shot it will be a lot less 18:56:49 loading seems to eat a lot of memory and I forgot to and forcing gc in the loading loop this time 18:57:33 but then again i have a brand new dev box with a ssd drive and 16 gigs of ram ... so I hope I will survive the loading process 18:57:39 How much is on disk? 18:57:55 4.4 gigs log file 18:57:58 so far 18:58:11 So twice as much once in memory? 18:58:16 sabalaba [~sabalaba@75-101-62-95.dsl.static.sonic.net] has joined #lisp 18:58:32 Vowyer, its still loading 18:58:56 when you finish the loading and reload the log file it uses much the same as on disk 18:59:29 I've got a quick coding style question. Is it better to have very specific conditions that inherit from a more general condition, or, is it better to have less conditions and specify reasons for signaling them via a slot? Method A might cause a "class explosion", method B might be inefficient. Any suggestions? 18:59:42 when i did it with a million records it was about 300 megs log file and and the snap shot was only 70 megs 19:00:27 pinterface [~pinterfac@173-20-55-85.client.mchsi.com] has joined #lisp 19:00:28 Harag: how much structure you have in there? Compared to say an SQL based solution? 19:01:03 -!- Ragnaroek [~chatzilla@vpnsh0041.fh-trier.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 19:01:03 Vowyer: i am trying to migrate my RDBMS to a doc/key-value db 19:01:17 jtza8: If it were me, I'd choose the simpler, possibly less efficient solution 19:01:26 And then benchmark when you actually have issues 19:02:32 Vowyer: what is nice about cl-prevalence is that you choose the structure to hold your data when loaded in memory 19:02:35 Quadrescence: Good advice, thanks. 19:03:11 I have been testing a btree with a million records and an aggregate takes about 0.05 seconds 19:03:57 the searches are obviously lightning fast 19:04:21 0.002 to find any key 19:04:22 jtza8: depends on how much handling you will do. If you need to distinguish between some conditions for handler matching purposes, classes are better. If you only need to know it once you display things, slots are perfectly fine 19:04:54 of course you can also test the slot and refuse to handle it in the handler body. But that's less elegant if you do it a lot 19:05:25 Vowyer: its the aggregates that are the fall down of most of the NoSQL dbs i have been testing 19:07:24 Harag: I guess most NoSQL databases on web are mostly reads and some writes, so it's a good trade off 19:08:27 -!- jewel [~jewel@196-215-117-83.dynamic.isadsl.co.za] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 19:09:06 Vowyer: I can understand that but there are so much about the NoSQL dbs that gives you freedom with design that dont exist in rbms I would like to see aggregates aswell 19:09:51 one of the most irritating things about SQL is the need for a schema 19:10:13 pkhuong: Looks like Xach is up to some new stuff with that code. 19:10:14 catphive: thats exactly why I finally gave up on it 19:10:56 I like mongodb, it just lets you store a collection of json 19:11:14 if my tests with the btree pan out it just shows that it was pure neglect from the majour open source nosql guys not to add decent aggregate functionality 19:11:57 catphive: i like mongodb aswell but cl-mongo is not up to scratch 19:12:24 pkhuong: http://xach.com/lisp/lisp-critic/README.html 19:12:27 and the same aggregate in mongdb with the javascript map reduce ran over 25 seconds 19:12:34 -!- McMAGIC--Copy [~McMAGIC--@gateway/tor-sasl/mcmagic--copy] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 19:13:09 -!- varjag [~eugene@253.79.34.95.customer.cdi.no] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 19:13:12 McMAGIC--Copy [~McMAGIC--@gateway/tor-sasl/mcmagic--copy] has joined #lisp 19:13:49 yeah, what I was using it for wasn't performance intensive 19:14:10 mainly I just chose it because it was convenient 19:14:50 catphive: if my tests go well i will blog about how to do a doc and key/value combination db in cl-prevalence 19:16:43 -!- catphive [~brenmill@c-76-104-152-119.hsd1.wa.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 19:18:05 Athas [~athas@130.225.165.35] has joined #lisp 19:18:38 -!- no_nada [~chatzilla@adsl-69-224-150-185.dsl.scrm01.pacbell.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 19:19:44 mmm things went splat 19:20:49 sbcl stopped working at 8gigs of memory 19:21:05 no crashes ... just went to sleep 19:21:22 tshauck [~tshauck@99-109-59-35.lightspeed.mssnks.sbcglobal.net] has joined #lisp 19:21:38 may be it finally decided to some gc 19:22:17 -!- tshauck [~tshauck@99-109-59-35.lightspeed.mssnks.sbcglobal.net] has left #lisp 19:24:10 -!- lonstein_ is now known as lonstein 19:27:11 Harag: 8 gigs of memory is awful close to the default heap limit. Are you sure it hasn't crashed? 19:27:45 lisp's bug due to much memory? 19:27:49 Oddity [~Oddity@unaffiliated/oddity] has joined #lisp 19:27:57 pkhuong: nothing in any buffers 19:28:05 -!- gravicappa [~gravicapp@h178-129-45-250.dyn.bashtel.ru] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 19:29:01 pkhuong: usually it drops me in that low level debugger thingy when the heap goes splat 19:29:35 and it gives me a "end of the world" message 19:29:36 it would. 19:29:50 this time there was none of that 19:30:32 C-c and look at a backtrace. 19:31:04 -!- rncarpio [rncarpio@ppp-69-230-118-97.dsl.scrm01.pacbell.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 19:31:13 to late .. sorry I killed it after it did not want to C-c C-c 19:32:18 then again i am using ergoemacs so did you mean "Interupt command"? 19:32:24 if you really want to know, in the very worst case, you can attach gdb; the c runtime includes a backtrace function. 19:33:04 -!- kruhft [~burton@S0106002401f331bd.cg.shawcable.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 19:33:10 gor[e] [~svr@195.110.46.34] has joined #lisp 19:33:14 Also, there's a difference between C-c C-c ing at the REPL and in *inferior-lisp*. 19:33:32 pkhuong: i am trying to reload what is already in the log file and if that crashes aswell I will try to find out 19:34:43 pkhuong: i am not very strong on all the debugging stuff I write simple apps for a living but now would be a good time to learn ;) 19:36:09 now that you mention it i cant remember seeing the inferior-lisp buffer in the buffer list after things went splat 19:36:34 there was only the repl,scratch and the slime-events buffer 19:37:05 and the messages buffer 19:37:44 kill that buffer would also kill SBCL 19:37:50 -!- Daev [~KAPITAL@cpe-174-099-078-028.nc.res.rr.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 19:37:55 Salamander__ [~Salamande@ppp118-210-14-186.lns20.adl2.internode.on.net] has joined #lisp 19:39:44 cpt_nemo [cpt_nemo@rfc1459.de] has joined #lisp 19:39:46 well the reload is already at a gig so we will know soon 19:40:11 -!- Salamander_ [~Salamande@ppp121-45-95-201.lns20.adl6.internode.on.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 19:49:55 -!- arborist [~arborist@g231004148.adsl.alicedsl.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 19:50:47 carlocci [~nes@93.37.196.172] has joined #lisp 19:57:42 mobydick [~textual@124-171-177-47.dyn.iinet.net.au] has joined #lisp 19:58:16 -!- Bahman [~bahman@2.144.209.160] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 20:00:05 -!- dmiles_afk [dmiles@c-24-21-133-103.hsd1.wa.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 20:01:52 arborist [~arborist@e182018010.adsl.alicedsl.de] has joined #lisp 20:02:21 -!- cmm- [~cmm@109.67.199.173] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 20:03:07 cmm [~cmm@109.67.199.173] has joined #lisp 20:06:16 -!- bsod1 [~sinan@188.58.156.111] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 20:08:00 -!- lnostdal-laptop [~lnostdal@77.17.136.76.tmi.telenormobil.no] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 20:14:01 c_arenz 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[~lnostdal@77.17.136.76.tmi.telenormobil.no] has joined #lisp 20:44:09 cmm [~cmm@109.67.199.173] has joined #lisp 20:44:59 kruhft [~burton@S0106002401f331bd.cg.shawcable.net] has joined #lisp 20:45:45 -!- homie` [~levent.gu@xdsl-78-35-146-102.netcologne.de] has quit [Quit: ERC Version 5.3 (IRC client for Emacs)] 20:46:01 -!- redline6561-work [~redline65@adsl-98-92-85-119.asm.bellsouth.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 20:47:23 -!- workthrick [~mathrick@emp.nat.sdu.dk] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 20:48:33 -!- kushal [~kdas@fedora/kushal] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 20:48:37 francogrex [~user@109.130.225.20] has joined #lisp 20:51:41 redline6561-work [~redline65@cei-gla-cpk2.coxinc.com] has joined #lisp 20:51:42 milanj [~milanj_@109-93-62-183.dynamic.isp.telekom.rs] has joined #lisp 20:52:12 homie [~levent.gu@xdsl-78-35-146-102.netcologne.de] has joined #lisp 20:56:15 -!- ace4016 [ace4016@adsl-184-32-14-120.mia.bellsouth.net] has quit [Disconnected by services] 20:56:16 Atomsk [ace4016@adsl-184-32-14-120.mia.bellsouth.net] has joined #lisp 20:57:27 -!- Atomsk is now known as ace4017 20:57:29 -!- ace4017 is now known as ace4016 20:59:36 -!- splittist [~splittist@30-245.62-188.cust.bluewin.ch] has quit [Quit: splittist] 21:01:11 loke: nice! can you tell me anything about what you're doing there with ABCL? 21:02:45 pnq [~nick@ACA214EB.ipt.aol.com] has joined #lisp 21:03:04 macrocat [~marmalade@142.177.215.212] has joined #lisp 21:04:07 -!- dnolen [~davidnole@184.152.69.75] has quit [Quit: dnolen] 21:04:45 One of the many features I like about CL is "push" and "pop", I can't seem to find a equivalent in the target language(s) for my translator.. (expect the ugly realloc(s)) 21:11:09 workthrick [~mathrick@emp.nat.sdu.dk] has joined #lisp 21:14:25 -!- lnostdal-laptop [~lnostdal@77.17.136.76.tmi.telenormobil.no] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 21:14:25 -!- add^_ [~add^_^@h245n2c1o838.bredband.skanova.com] has quit [Quit: add^_] 21:16:09 no_nada [~chatzilla@adsl-69-224-150-185.dsl.scrm01.pacbell.net] has joined #lisp 21:20:35 pkhuong: you where right ...heap exhauseted, game over 21:27:48 -!- c_arenz [~arenz@p5B2CE927.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 21:29:41 -!- mrSpec [~Spec@unaffiliated/mrspec] has quit [Quit: mrSpec] 21:31:01 -!- juniorroy [~juniorroy@212.36.228.103] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 21:33:19 -!- workthrick [~mathrick@emp.nat.sdu.dk] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 21:37:27 -!- xan_ [~xan@216.Red-88-19-137.staticIP.rima-tde.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 21:37:40 -!- tcr1 [~tcr@155-dom-3.acn.waw.pl] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 21:37:42 -!- lacedaemon is now known as fe[nl]ix 21:39:11 xan_ [~xan@94.Red-193-152-140.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net] has joined #lisp 21:46:24 -!- bobbysmith007 [~russ@216.155.103.30] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 21:47:46 -!- Kenjin [~josesanto@bl19-232-217.dsl.telepac.pt] has quit [Quit: Computer has gone to sleep] 21:48:37 Beetny [~Beetny@ppp118-208-19-192.lns20.bne1.internode.on.net] has joined #lisp 21:48:57 eugu [~Miranda@213.141.157.147] has joined #lisp 21:49:56 -!- Modius [~Modius@cpe-70-123-140-183.austin.res.rr.com] has quit [Quit: "Object-oriented design" is an oxymoron] 21:50:45 workthrick [~mathrick@emp.nat.sdu.dk] has joined #lisp 21:56:06 -!- workthrick [~mathrick@emp.nat.sdu.dk] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 21:56:43 lnostdal-laptop [~lnostdal@77.17.136.76.tmi.telenormobil.no] has joined #lisp 21:58:27 -!- prxq [~mommer@mnhm-5f75e2b6.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 22:04:11 francogrex: c_push(void *x, list* y) { &y = make_list(x, y); return y; } /* approximately -- nothing magical about linked lists */ 22:05:40 -!- nikodemus [~nikodemus@cs181063174.pp.htv.fi] has quit [Quit: This computer has gone to sleep] 22:06:32 -!- milanj [~milanj_@109-93-62-183.dynamic.isp.telekom.rs] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 22:15:24 -!- francogrex [~user@109.130.225.20] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 22:19:11 -!- gor[e] [~svr@195.110.46.34] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 22:21:20 -!- Davidbrcz [~david@212-198-126-167.rev.numericable.fr] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 22:28:42 -!- araujo [~araujo@gentoo/developer/araujo] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 22:29:43 -!- redline6561-work [~redline65@cei-gla-cpk2.coxinc.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 22:32:05 Kenjin [~josesanto@bl16-204-161.dsl.telepac.pt] has joined #lisp 22:32:06 araujo [~araujo@gentoo/developer/araujo] has joined #lisp 22:34:18 wgl [~wgl@209.242.26.41] has joined #lisp 22:34:28 -!- davazp [~user@18.Red-88-1-93.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net] has quit [Quit: ERC Version 5.3 (IRC client for Emacs)] 22:40:12 Good morning everyone! 22:44:15 -!- lnostdal-laptop [~lnostdal@77.17.136.76.tmi.telenormobil.no] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 22:44:19 Good morning beach! =) 22:44:28 -!- araujo [~araujo@gentoo/developer/araujo] has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 22:45:08 gor[e] [~svr@195.110.46.34] has joined #lisp 22:45:27 knob: Hey, haven't seen you for almost a year. What have you been doing? 22:46:49 knob: Did you ever read all of Practical Common Lilsp? 22:48:11 -!- mishoo_ [~mishoo@79.112.236.132] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 22:49:06 mippymoe89 [~mippymoe8@c-24-147-92-217.hsd1.vt.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 22:49:44 workthrick [~mathrick@emp.nat.sdu.dk] has joined #lisp 22:51:05 mishoo_ [~mishoo@79.112.236.132] has joined #lisp 22:54:30 -!- Guthur [~Guthur@host86-139-108-200.range86-139.btcentralplus.com] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 22:56:44 -!- ehu [~ehuels@ip118-64-212-87.adsl2.static.versatel.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 22:58:47 -!- jtza8 [~jtza8@iburst-41-213-46-251.iburst.co.za] has quit [Quit: leaving] 23:08:51 () 23:09:18 gigamonkey [~user@adsl-99-39-5-241.dsl.pltn13.sbcglobal.net] has joined #lisp 23:11:45 -!- sbryant_work [~user@ghanima.slavasaur.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 23:12:26 general-general: New here? 23:12:41 -!- mishoo_ [~mishoo@79.112.236.132] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 23:13:33 Hello folks. 23:13:55 gigamonkey: hi 23:14:02 beach, yes. 23:14:30 general-general: What brings you to #lisp? Are you planning to learn Lisp? 23:15:23 Well, I am working through it... that said, my code is messy. 23:16:06 This past week I've been snailing along getting usocket, bordeaux-threads & finally hunchentoot up & running... 23:16:26 general-general: you know about quicklisp? 23:16:38 I know nothing of quicklisp 23:16:47 I know only the sbcl 23:16:56 gigamonkey: you mentioned Clack a couple weeks ago, I think. Have you had a look and have any thoughts on it? 23:16:57 www.quicklisp.org 23:17:06 Kenjin: not really. Is that yours? 23:18:57 beach, do you code a lot of lisp? 23:18:58 gigamonkey: no. But it caught my attention. Also the micro framework built with it, Caveman, seems interesting. Looks like inspired by Sinatrarb 23:19:45 Mococa [~Mococa@186.214.255.138] has joined #lisp 23:19:59 Quicklisp is like a CPAN gopher? 23:20:04 general-general: What I code, I code in Lisp. How much I do varies, because I have a full-time job as well. 23:20:33 I see. 23:22:15 general-general: quicklisp is th ecurrnt preferred way to distribute and install code 23:22:45 So it is a replacement for asdf ? 23:22:56 No, it's a replacement for asdf-install. 23:23:00 Ah 23:23:04 I meant that. 23:23:27 For me, there is no difference effectively as all I know is using asdf for the install 23:23:50 Try quicklisp, you won't regret it. Much easier than asdf-install 23:24:27 tildeleb [~leb@c-24-7-85-179.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 23:24:28 I must say that I've found asdf-install fine. 23:24:43 However, I will try. 23:25:01 general-general: ASDF is sort of like make 23:25:29 Well, when I used Windows I used to install programs downloading an .exe and then going over the install screens pushing next 23:25:37 I didn't know that. 23:25:39 then came Linux with centralized repositories 23:25:57 Ah Windows. 23:26:10 Distance does make the heart grow fonder. 23:27:06 doing a sum over 10 million key/value nodes in cl-pervalence took 0.252 seconds...not bad 23:28:37 -!- workthrick [~mathrick@emp.nat.sdu.dk] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 23:28:45 quotemstr [~quotemstr@dancol.org] has joined #lisp 23:28:56 Is there a half-decent read syntax for N-ary trees? 23:30:33 quotemstr: You can make one up very fast. It is hard to make something like that general because it depends on what kind of data you put in the nodes. 23:32:27 lnostdal-laptop [~lnostdal@77.17.136.76.tmi.telenormobil.no] has joined #lisp 23:32:45 Fair enough. 23:33:35 -!- arborist [~arborist@e182018010.adsl.alicedsl.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 23:34:05 dmiles_afk [dmiles@c-24-21-133-103.hsd1.wa.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 23:36:37 quotemstr: I usually do something like [ :initarg1 val1 :initarg2 val2 ...]. That way I can read any such thing by doing (apply #'make-instance list-of-stuff) 23:37:27 beach: so far I have gotten nothing under 25 secs with any other nosql solution I have access from lisp with....and since i am trying to build a key/value db that 0.2 secs is pretty gooh 23:37:38 good 23:39:29 juniorroy [~juniorroy@212.36.228.103] has joined #lisp 23:41:57 Harag: what about using something that is a k/v store not an object database? 23:42:03 Harag: I am not sure how you do that, because even with an in-core hash table, I get more than 1s. You must have some other way of organizing the key/value pairs. 23:44:32 -!- Mococa [~Mococa@186.214.255.138] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 23:44:34 -!- lnostdal-laptop [~lnostdal@77.17.136.76.tmi.telenormobil.no] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 23:47:44 lnostdal-laptop [~lnostdal@77.17.136.76.tmi.telenormobil.no] has joined #lisp 23:49:31 araujo [~araujo@190.73.44.29] has joined #lisp 23:49:34 -!- araujo [~araujo@190.73.44.29] has quit [Changing host] 23:49:34 araujo [~araujo@gentoo/developer/araujo] has joined #lisp 23:50:58 -!- insomniaSalt [~milan@port-92-204-3-118.dynamic.qsc.de] has left #lisp 23:51:32 -!- katesmith [~katesmith@unaffiliated/costume] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 23:52:51 -!- mippymoe89 [~mippymoe8@c-24-147-92-217.hsd1.vt.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 23:55:54 beach: i found a little btree in rucksack that works well 23:56:37 I must admit that i am running with 16 gigs of ram but I dont thing that is the difference i think its the btree 23:57:29 p_l|backup: everything i found is object based but a lot of the code is not object based 23:57:43 -!- Kajtek [~paniwladc@nat4-230.ghnet.pl] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 23:58:29 -!- no_nada [~chatzilla@adsl-69-224-150-185.dsl.scrm01.pacbell.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 23:58:34 what makes prevalence nice to work with is that you can choose what structure to load your data in 23:58:59 -!- jajcloz [~jaj@pool-108-20-32-147.bstnma.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Quit: jajcloz] 23:59:31 symbole [~user@ool-4a5a4bdd.dyn.optonline.net] has joined #lisp