00:00:36 _3b: really? I don't remember what I hacked out (: 00:00:37 i tried having the swap-buffer on a separate thread from where the window was created, no go 00:00:59 <_3b> i think both trees try to start a new thread for glut stuff, so you have to undo that 00:01:12 -!- dnolen [n=dnolen@pool-70-107-135-30.ny325.east.verizon.net] has quit [] 00:01:57 <_3b> Guthur: yeah, not saying it is easy, just that it is harder on osx, particularly for glut :) 00:02:15 -!- pavelludiq [n=quassel@91.139.194.245] has quit [Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)] 00:03:17 kmc [n=keegan@206-71-236-70.c3-0.nyw-ubr1.nyr-nyw.ny.cable.rcn.com] has joined #lisp 00:03:36 -!- troussan [n=user@c-71-195-63-115.hsd1.mn.comcast.net] has quit [Read error: 60 (Operation timed out)] 00:06:00 brentb [n=buescher@71.181.168.227] has joined #lisp 00:08:07 troussan [n=user@c-71-195-63-115.hsd1.mn.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 00:10:17 -!- pfeyz [n=user@pool-74-108-144-105.nycmny.fios.verizon.net] has left #lisp 00:13:56 lionwoods [i=62c281e1@gateway/web/freenode/x-gwaavrlisjbhsdnt] has joined #lisp 00:14:16 -!- OmniMancer [n=OmniManc@219-89-91-86.jetstart.xtra.co.nz] has quit ["Leaving."] 00:15:34 lionwoods pasted "untitled" at http://paste.lisp.org/display/91224 00:17:42 that function counts all the number of atoms in a list. i was wondering, would there be a way to call my function by typing all-length '(A B C) instead of (all-length (A B C))? 00:19:06 it's lisp, surely you don't want to do this 00:19:29 if you want to you can create your own dsl .. but most likely a waste of time for something like this 00:20:32 <_3b> don't some REPLs do that? 00:20:58 *stassats* found that slime's inspector makes half of the user interface he needs 00:22:00 Odin- [n=sbkhh@s121-302.gardur.hi.is] has joined #lisp 00:22:53 daniel [i=daniel@unaffiliated/daniel] has joined #lisp 00:26:59 -!- daniel_ [i=daniel@unaffiliated/daniel] has quit [Read error: 60 (Operation timed out)] 00:27:08 -!- LiamH [n=nobody@pool-72-75-73-155.washdc.east.verizon.net] has quit ["Leaving."] 00:28:27 The_Doctor [n=Dalek@cpe-98-150-247-183.hawaii.res.rr.com] has joined #lisp 00:28:47 -!- morphling [n=stefan@gssn-5f757899.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit [Remote closed the connection] 00:29:08 morphling [n=stefan@gssn-5f757899.pool.mediaWays.net] has joined #lisp 00:29:57 -!- quodlibetor [n=user@pool-74-108-144-105.nycmny.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Remote closed the connection] 00:30:32 spilman [n=spilman@ARennes-552-1-40-235.w92-135.abo.wanadoo.fr] has joined #lisp 00:32:00 stassats: You know that you can customize the slots displayed and the description of an object in the inspector in SBCL, right?\ 00:32:51 *nyef* did this once to make ALIEN structures display with slot values instead of just a type and pointer slot. 00:33:14 i don't use much sbcl's inspector 00:33:28 It's more about SBCL than which inspector you use. 00:33:44 SWANK uses the same underlying mechanism on SBCL. 00:33:52 lionwoods: you can use funcall : (funcall 'all-length '(a b c)) ;) 00:34:07 thanks drewc 00:35:14 demmeln [n=Adium@dslb-094-216-053-199.pools.arcor-ip.net] has joined #lisp 00:35:33 lionwoods: i'm pretty sure it's not what you want, i'm being funny, but if that somehow solves your problem, then i'm happy to help. 00:35:49 nyef: i can customize slime's inspector itself for that matter 00:35:55 Fair enough. 00:36:00 -!- demmeln [n=Adium@dslb-094-216-053-199.pools.arcor-ip.net] has quit [Client Quit] 00:41:58 -!- mattrepl [n=mattrepl@pool-71-163-162-204.washdc.fios.verizon.net] has quit [] 00:43:08 -!- morphling [n=stefan@gssn-5f757899.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit [Remote closed the connection] 00:44:37 ugh.. I think babel encoders/decoders return (- start end) rather than (- end start) :( 00:45:06 which causes concatenate-strings-to-octets to fail miserably 00:45:17 good night 00:45:17 is it just me, or is there really a bug there? 00:45:39 -!- serichsen [n=user@hmbg-4d06cdcd.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit ["ah, distinctly I remember it was in the bleak december"] 00:46:02 -!- troussan [n=user@c-71-195-63-115.hsd1.mn.comcast.net] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 00:47:20 gigamonkey [n=user@adsl-99-58-28-83.dsl.pltn13.sbcglobal.net] has joined #lisp 00:47:30 Raptelan [n=Raptelan@99-138-48-236.lightspeed.iplsin.sbcglobal.net] has joined #lisp 00:47:35 sellout: herep 00:47:49 gigamonkey: t 00:48:02 Yo. How's it going? 00:49:34 Good. Got 2k done this morning, on my second batch of 2k for the day. Then 3k tomorrow and Monday. 00:49:34 I'm on west coast time as well, so I doing ok ;) 00:49:48 sellout: protip -- sex scenes and detailed fight scenes can both add a bunch of words in a hurry. 00:50:04 ... what kind of story are you writing? 00:50:18 p_l: http://www.nanowrimo.org 00:50:25 sellout is my writing buddy. 00:50:37 gigamonkey: I know, I meant what kind of story *YOU* are writing for nanowrimo 00:50:50 I might join nanowrimo next year 00:50:54 p_l: dystopic science fiction. 00:51:24 adeht: yeah, looks like a bug. I'd fix the encoders/decoders 00:51:51 gigamonkey: Those detaily bits are where I always have trouble. I've got a big fight scene left to write though, and I'm definitely hoping it'll do my wordcount good. 00:52:17 Just recount every blow and its exact effect. 00:52:35 butterfly effect 00:52:36 *gigamonkey* managed to work Tai Chi into both his fight scenes *and* his sex scene 00:52:37 or write the same scene from few separate POVs 00:52:40 pkhuong: yeah.. and I ran the tests and one failed, but not the one I expected.. the c-s-t-o test uses an encoding whose encoder isn't buggy 00:53:15 adeht: only the unibyte macros seem to be bugged 00:53:53 p_l: You should definitely do it. It's a lot of fun. 00:54:06 *p_l* finds it funny that despite crudeness of snap4, it still fits into his CPU's cache 00:54:28 (well, mostly fits) 00:55:14 gigamonkey: My novel has zero mentions of Tai Chi so far. 00:55:58 sellout: well, see, untapped veins await you on the way to 50k 00:56:07 -!- mcspiff [n=user@142.68.79.57] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 00:56:31 adeht: If only they'd used (and unsigned-byte fixnum) instead of fixnum for the return type, the bug would have been more easily detected. 00:58:14 somehow I find it a good thing that no-one reads what is submitted to NaNoWriMo unless you post it later... 00:58:43 Some of the stuff I find myself writing would tick of not only "moral guardians" 01:00:44 pkhuong: yeah, I'll submit a dummy patch and quote what you just wrote, if that's ok 01:06:51 quek [n=read_eva@router1.gpy1.ms246.net] has joined #lisp 01:09:38 milanj [n=milan@79.101.180.6] has joined #lisp 01:14:12 -!- lionwoods [i=62c281e1@gateway/web/freenode/x-gwaavrlisjbhsdnt] has quit ["Page closed"] 01:17:19 -!- grouzen [n=grouzen@91.214.124.2] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 01:23:44 -!- milanj [n=milan@79.101.180.6] has quit ["Leaving"] 01:24:27 also, I wonder why string-to-octets doesn't have the option to take a result octet vector and a result start index 01:25:18 G'night all. 01:25:52 -!- spilman [n=spilman@ARennes-552-1-40-235.w92-135.abo.wanadoo.fr] has quit ["Quitte"] 01:27:05 -!- pjb [n=t@211.Red-79-149-143.staticIP.rima-tde.net] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 01:27:24 gigamonk` [n=user@adsl-99-58-28-83.dsl.pltn13.sbcglobal.net] has joined #lisp 01:28:07 Lycurgus [n=Ren@cpe-72-228-150-44.buffalo.res.rr.com] has joined #lisp 01:28:29 or some other lower-level function that does that 01:30:19 pr_ [n=pr@p579CA802.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #lisp 01:30:44 -!- pr [n=pr@unaffiliated/pr] has quit [Nick collision from services.] 01:31:45 -!- pr_ is now known as pr 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[n=Ren@cpe-72-228-150-44.buffalo.res.rr.com] has joined #lisp 05:01:33 postamar [n=postamar@76-10-168-144.dsl.teksavvy.com] has joined #lisp 05:04:53 pkhuong: qu'est ce que j'ai oublié de faire? je veux profiler mon code qui utilise gurobi, je compile tout avec -pg et je lance gprof: le call graph est là, les nombres d'appels sont bien comptés, mais aucune information de temps, tout est à 0.0% et 0.0sec... 05:05:54 mon executable tourne pendant environ 10sec, je me dis que c'est pas parce que la sample size est trop petite 05:06:07 est-ce que ça a un rapport avec le multithreading? 05:06:43 that doesn't look like English at all 05:06:57 indeed 05:07:38 Jafet [n=Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet] has joined #lisp 05:07:38 postmar asks what it is that he forgot to do, he wants to profile his code with gurobi, he compiled with the option flags pg and launches with gprof.. the call graph is there, the number of calls get counted but no information for runtime is available.. it comes out all zeros 05:07:55 Yeees. 05:08:07 How does one even do that with lisp? 05:08:16 whoops, wrong channel 05:08:32 Maybe ecl 05:08:33 eh 05:08:35 sorry, it's late, and no, it doesn't involve lisp (yet) 05:08:37 :( 05:09:00 postamar: Too late. You can't undo what has been done. You better make it all lisp rite naow :D 05:09:15 *The_Doctor* "lolz legit" 05:09:55 gurobi looks interesting though. 05:12:04 SandGorgon [n=OmNomNom@122.173.249.152] has joined #lisp 05:12:12 it's a very neat linear programming solver, i'm hoping it will behave well enough with SBCL's ffi 05:14:24 -!- c|mell [n=cmell@79.126.200.181] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 05:15:53 -!- moah [n=gnu@dslb-188-101-027-047.pools.arcor-ip.net] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 05:16:56 Liu [n=Yuanhan@124.90.48.221] has joined #lisp 05:21:49 Good morning! 05:26:10 -!- crod [n=cmell@79.126.200.135] has quit ["Leaving"] 05:26:21 -!- marioxcc [n=user@200.92.169.131] has quit [Remote closed the connection] 05:27:44 -!- Liu [n=Yuanhan@124.90.48.221] has quit [Remote closed the connection] 05:28:37 Is there any implementation of dancing-links in lisp? Googled it but found only C, java and python :( 05:29:03 There's probably one in mix too, no doubt 05:30:28 lol xD 05:30:32 true... 05:30:45 altough it won't help me much xD 05:31:40 -!- postamar [n=postamar@76-10-168-144.dsl.teksavvy.com] has quit [] 05:32:09 baddog [n=liam@unaffiliated/baddog144] has joined #lisp 05:33:40 found it :D yay! :P 05:36:59 -!- exu0 [n=u@188.105.48.24] has quit [Remote closed the connection] 05:38:45 katchaFire [n=katcha@bas33-4-88-180-245-209.fbx.proxad.net] has joined #lisp 05:40:20 -!- saikatc [n=saikatc@pool-96-231-14-194.washdc.east.verizon.net] has quit [] 05:40:44 sellout- [n=greg@75-25-126-88.lightspeed.sjcpca.sbcglobal.net] has joined #lisp 05:40:44 -!- sellout [n=greg@75-25-126-88.lightspeed.sjcpca.sbcglobal.net] has quit [Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)] 05:40:48 morning beach 05:40:59 -!- sellout- is now known as sellout 05:41:13 schme: Up early as usual? 05:41:46 beach: Actually I have been up all night. Woke up at around 4pm yesterday so sleep was a bit out of the question. 05:42:17 It seems I was getting hammered at one of these here clubs here in prague and slept a heckuva long time. 05:42:33 I see! 05:42:36 JohnnyL [i=excellen@ool-182f0b98.dyn.optonline.net] has joined #lisp 05:43:08 What is your excuse then there, beach ? 05:43:27 nvoorhies [n=nvoorhie@72-254-61-67.client.stsn.net] has joined #lisp 05:43:30 schme: I don't have any. I just wake up early most of the time. 05:43:36 cools. 05:43:53 *stassats* have been writing lisp all night long 05:44:03 stassats: lucky guy :) 05:44:44 *schme* tried that. 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(Connection reset by peer)] 08:09:10 dmiles_afk [n=dmiles@c-76-104-220-73.hsd1.wa.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 08:17:47 -!- redblue [i=star@ppp098.108-253-207.mtl.mt.videotron.ca] has quit [""You cannot do a kindness too soon because you never know how soon it will be too late." -RWE"] 08:20:17 redblue [i=star@ppp041.108-253-207.mtl.mt.videotron.ca] has joined #lisp 08:20:43 -!- coyo [n=alex@99-6-151-42.lightspeed.rcsntx.sbcglobal.net] has quit [Read error: 54 (Connection reset by peer)] 08:23:10 jmbr [n=jmbr@124.33.220.87.dynamic.jazztel.es] has joined #lisp 08:27:36 HET2 [n=diman@cpc1-cdif12-2-0-cust125.5-1.cable.virginmedia.com] has joined #lisp 08:29:02 OmniMancer [n=OmniManc@219-89-91-86.jetstart.xtra.co.nz] has joined #lisp 08:34:13 -!- nvoorhies [n=nvoorhie@72-254-61-67.client.stsn.net] has quit [] 08:40:06 -!- HET2 [n=diman@cpc1-cdif12-2-0-cust125.5-1.cable.virginmedia.com] has quit ["Leaving"] 08:41:57 nice job by Kei Suzuki on tracking down the sb-posix darwin failures 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Quiet night. 13:16:40 G'morning all. 13:19:34 grouzen_ [n=grouzen@91.214.124.2] has joined #lisp 13:19:54 -!- grouzen [n=grouzen@91.214.124.2] has quit [Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)] 13:23:14 jimi_hendrix [n=jimi_hen@unaffiliated/jimihendrix] has joined #lisp 13:24:00 hi, if i have a foo.lisp and a bar.lisp, how do i import stuff from foo.lisp into bar.lisp? 13:25:59 That would rather depend on the meaning of "import". 13:26:12 -!- Adlai [n=adlai@unaffiliated/adlai] has quit [Remote closed the connection] 13:26:15 Adlai` [n=adlai@unaffiliated/adlai] has joined #lisp 13:26:24 jimi_hendrix: be sure to read on so called "packages" (for example in the "practical common lisp" book, which is available online). Also, both files have to be compiled and loaded in order. You can automate this using a "system". Check out one named "asdf" 13:26:25 In Common Lisp, symbol namespaces are disjoint from the notion of source files. 13:26:50 *jimi_hendrix* goes to read 13:31:17 x86-64 on MacOS is a cache-coherent multiprocess environ, isn't it? 13:32:33 benny [n=benny@i577A1C8A.versanet.de] has joined #lisp 13:33:50 nyef: pre-i7, it's classic SMP on shared bus, with i7 it's ccNUMA 13:33:50 -!- tufflax [n=tufflax@1-1-8-11a.ang.sth.bostream.se] has quit [Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)] 13:34:05 So... cache-coherent either way? 13:34:23 only difference is that Core2 models have shared L2 per core pair 13:34:27 yes 13:34:32 Okay, thanks. 13:34:34 just that i7 adds NUMA 13:34:37 -!- Adlai` is now known as Adlai 13:37:41 Ah, yeah, I see what's happening. Someone has a multi-threaded variable overwrite screw. 13:41:00 Xof: Ping? 13:41:30 ziga` [n=user@89.142.220.47] has joined #lisp 13:41:30 tufflax [n=tufflax@1-1-8-11a.ang.sth.bostream.se] has joined #lisp 13:47:24 Guthur [n=Michael@host81-156-232-46.range81-156.btcentralplus.com] has joined #lisp 13:55:18 -!- emma_ is now known as emma 13:55:22 cl [n=charli@p54B171F4.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #lisp 13:56:14 kejsaren_ [n=kejsaren@111.25.95.91.static.ras.siw.siwnet.net] has joined #lisp 13:58:25 -!- cl [n=charli@p54B171F4.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Client Quit] 13:58:50 cl [n=charli@p54B171F4.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #lisp 14:00:40 -!- cl [n=charli@p54B171F4.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Client Quit] 14:02:26 Mason [n=star@61.154.10.210] has joined #lisp 14:03:16 -!- Mason [n=star@61.154.10.210] has left #lisp 14:04:44 didi [n=user@unaffiliated/didi/x-1022147] has joined #lisp 14:06:19 -!- Pepe__ is now known as Pepe_ 14:09:50 -!- OmniMancer [n=OmniManc@219-89-91-86.jetstart.xtra.co.nz] has quit ["Leaving."] 14:10:58 -!- kejsaren [n=kejsaren@111.25.95.91.static.ras.siw.siwnet.net] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 14:12:04 Does someone use slime? I think something has changed in it. I am on a new instalation of it and the (format t) is not outputing. And least, not outputing at the *slime-repl clisp*. 14:12:57 you need more recent slime 14:14:43 stassats`: Really? Hum. It is funny because it is the slime that comes with the recent version of Ubuntu. The title say "; SLIME 2009-06-15" 14:15:08 June 15 is recent for you? 14:15:12 This falls under the "no vendor packages" rule. 14:15:27 stassats`: Yes, it is. 14:15:46 2009-11-26 is recent for me. 14:15:57 nyef: It is too. 14:16:02 didi: by general, avoid vendor packages. For some reason, Lisp has really bad luck there 14:16:07 Well, I will get the version from the site then. 14:16:22 p_l: :-) Ok. I will do it. 14:16:26 p_l: Actually, I suspect that part of the reason is lousy upstream release engineering. 14:16:44 Thank you. 14:17:00 nyef: sure... 14:17:13 *p_l* would love to see release engineering on the level of haskell 14:17:19 Oh? 14:17:45 nyef: the only problem nowadays is upgrading GHC 14:18:41 cause that requires recompiling everything 14:19:44 -!- didi [n=user@unaffiliated/didi/x-1022147] has quit [Remote closed the connection] 14:21:51 -!- wakeup^ [n=wakeup@koln-5d81415e.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit [Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)] 14:23:44 Heh. Trying to price hard drives on amazon is broken: You can't filter on capacity, interface, or form factor. 14:27:23 *p_l* ponders Win7 on 320mb ram 14:30:20 LiamH [n=nobody@pool-72-75-73-155.washdc.east.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 14:30:36 nyef: concurrency bug in PCL? 14:30:54 pkhuong: Hmm? 14:31:29 -!- dstatyvka [i=ejabberd@pepelaz.jabber.od.ua] has left #lisp 14:31:45 You pinged Xof 1 hour ago. 14:31:49 Oh. No. 14:31:53 CLX. 14:32:18 Ah, all right then. PCL has some racy-looking but correct code. 14:32:34 Yeah, I'm -so- not looking at PCL guts. 14:33:43 p_l its been a while sense any version of desktop windows ran on so little ram 14:34:05 ran well anyway 14:34:11 s/sense/since 14:35:04 Guthur: Nonsense! I keep a Win98 VM around that runs -fine- on that. 14:35:22 (Yes, I did just deliberately misinterpret what you said.) 14:35:33 hehe ok 14:35:44 i was about to qualify it more 14:37:09 strangely, nyef you have reminded me to change some dodgy code... 14:38:09 -!- redblue [i=star@ppp041.108-253-207.mtl.mt.videotron.ca] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 14:38:47 troussan [n=user@c-71-195-63-115.hsd1.mn.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 14:39:51 rudi [n=rudi@84-119-75-204.dynamic.xdsl-line.inode.at] has joined #lisp 14:41:14 aack [n=user@a83-161-214-179.adsl.xs4all.nl] has joined #lisp 14:43:39 Demosthenes [n=demo@206.180.154.148.adsl.hal-pc.org] has joined #lisp 14:43:42 didi [n=user@unaffiliated/didi/x-1022147] has joined #lisp 14:48:32 -!- rudi [n=rudi@84-119-75-204.dynamic.xdsl-line.inode.at] has quit ["Client exciting"] 14:54:15 drdo [n=drdo@214.130.108.93.rev.vodafone.pt] has joined #lisp 14:54:23 Hello 14:54:44 Hi. 14:55:00 Let's say there's double recursion between foo and bar 14:55:09 ikki [n=ikki@189.139.181.2] has joined #lisp 14:55:10 But at one point, i want to return from the whole call stack 14:55:15 Is there a way to do that? 14:55:39 clhs throw 14:55:40 http://www.lispworks.com/reference/HyperSpec/Body/s_throw.htm 14:56:45 drdo: That URL was for you. 14:57:06 Yes, i realised that, trying to understand it 14:57:06 -!- didi [n=user@unaffiliated/didi/x-1022147] has left #lisp 14:58:33 Hmm 14:58:45 or return. 14:58:48 dreish [n=dreish@minus.dreish.org] has joined #lisp 14:58:54 If i declare a CATCH won't it transfer control to the innermost one? 14:59:01 Once i THROW 14:59:37 pkhuong: How? 14:59:59 -!- legumbre_ is now known as legumbre 15:00:00 minion: Lisppaste 15:00:00 To use the lisppaste bot, visit http://paste.lisp.org/new/lisp and enter your paste. 15:00:16 (defun wrapper () (labels ((foo...) (bar ... (return-from wrapper ...))) ...)) 15:00:41 beach pasted "for drdo" at http://paste.lisp.org/display/91236 15:00:43 oh 15:01:12 Thank you guys 15:01:29 no problem 15:01:39 I wonder why VALUES-SPECIFIER-TYPE does not cache unknown type specifiers 15:01:40 beach: you're not using lisppaste.el? 15:01:53 quidnunc [n=user@bas16-montreal02-1242357050.dsl.bell.ca] has joined #lisp 15:01:54 pkhuong: No, I guess I am not. 15:02:23 where is it? 15:03:08 -!- mrSpec [n=Spec@unaffiliated/mrspec] has quit [Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)] 15:03:31 mrSpec [n=Spec@unaffiliated/mrspec] has joined #lisp 15:03:46 beach: 15:05:12 marioxcc [n=user@200.92.164.107] has joined #lisp 15:05:46 pkhuong: Thanks! 15:07:02 lhz [n=shrekz@c-b9aa72d5.021-158-73746f34.cust.bredbandsbolaget.se] has joined #lisp 15:11:37 Do a `git clone http://dept-info.labri.fr/~strandh/Compta' if you you want to look at the code that I think our third-year students are going to work on in their programming-project course. It is a working (but rudimentary) accounting system with a CLIM interface. It has < 400 lines of code. There is also an example input file `home', and a list (in French) of possible extensions. 15:13:50 reprore [n=reprore@ntkngw356150.kngw.nt.ftth.ppp.infoweb.ne.jp] has joined #lisp 15:15:07 nvoorhies [n=nvoorhie@72-254-85-155.client.stsn.net] has joined #lisp 15:18:39 bgs100 [n=ian@unaffiliated/bgs100] has joined #lisp 15:19:07 -!- Eko [n=eko@c-98-242-74-171.hsd1.ga.comcast.net] has quit ["This computer has gone to sleep"] 15:22:38 SimonH [n=simonh@92.29.187.150] has joined #lisp 15:26:41 decto [n=azeaze@pdpc/supporter/student/decto] has joined #lisp 15:27:06 beach: tva-à-daicaisser -> tva-à-décaisser 15:27:34 -!- thehcdreamer [n=thehcdre@93.37.244.254] has quit [] 15:27:49 -!- holycow [n=new@mail.fredcanhelp.com] has quit [Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)] 15:27:50 pjb: thanks 15:29:01 Otherwise, you could write tva à dais caissé, but it would be something else ... :-) 15:29:58 -!- mrSpec is now known as spec[away] 15:31:26 I would use nth-value: (defmacro make-time-function (name index) `(defun ,name () (nth-value ,(1+ index) (get-decoded-time)))) (make-time-function current-year 6) ... 15:31:32 gigamonk` [n=user@adsl-99-58-28-83.dsl.pltn13.sbcglobal.net] has joined #lisp 15:31:41 pjb: Fixed now, but I had to replace the repository. 15:32:18 Is there a fancy math name for the reciprocal of an integer. (I.e. a fraction of the form 1/N)? 15:32:36 pjb: I had the impression that function existed, but couldn't find it, so thought I remembered wrong. 15:32:41 Or, what would be a good name for a function that returns the nearest such number for a given fraction. 15:32:41 gigamonk 15:32:42 hehe 15:32:58 -!- gigamonk` is now known as gigamonkey` 15:33:02 aw 15:33:05 it was funnier the other way 15:33:16 Sorry. 15:33:26 -!- gigamonkey` is now known as gigamonk 15:34:45 denominator? 15:35:07 :D 15:35:15 Odin- [n=sbkhh@s121-302.gardur.hi.is] has joined #lisp 15:36:14 gigamonk: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Unit_fraction 15:36:16 reciprocate? 15:36:17 -!- ikki [n=ikki@189.139.181.2] has quit [Read error: 113 (No route to host)] 15:36:52 nyef: that sounds friendly, anyway. ;-) 15:37:08 But kpreid wins, I think. Thanks. 15:37:49 -!- Odin- [n=sbkhh@s121-302.gardur.hi.is] has quit [Client Quit] 15:39:57 -!- kpreid [n=kpreid@cpe-72-228-78-176.twcny.res.rr.com] has quit [] 15:39:59 kpreid [n=kpreid@cpe-72-228-78-176.twcny.res.rr.com] has joined #lisp 15:42:34 legumbre_ [n=leo@r190-135-0-220.dialup.adsl.anteldata.net.uy] has joined #lisp 15:42:53 -!- Jafet is now known as J 15:43:01 -!- J is now known as Jafet 15:45:18 -!- decto [n=azeaze@pdpc/supporter/student/decto] has quit ["Leaving"] 15:45:51 carlocci [n=nes@93.37.213.232] has joined #lisp 15:47:45 When I try to pull into a --bare repository, I get /usr/bin/git-pull cannot be used without a working tree. 15:47:55 Any ideas how to make that work? 15:48:29 Push instead? 15:48:31 push into it? 15:48:42 -!- legumbre [n=leo@r190-135-32-149.dialup.adsl.anteldata.net.uy] has quit [Read error: 60 (Operation timed out)] 15:49:51 *beach* tries... 15:51:02 It worked. Thanks! 15:51:29 I think I got &environment for deftypes working on sbcl 15:52:02 gigamonk: i tend to name such functions explicitly. as in (defun 1/x (x) (/ 1 x)) 15:52:47 that name may be a potential number, did you check? 15:53:33 prxq: that's (/ x) 15:53:54 beach: The reverse operation to push is fetch, not pull. 15:54:09 -!- konr [n=konrad@201.82.95.251] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 15:54:18 stassats`: (/ 1 x) is not wrong. 15:54:33 tcr: what do you mean? 15:54:39 pull = fetch && merge. It doesn't make sense to merge if you don't have a working copy in which to work your way through possible conflicts. 15:55:00 prxq: no need to defined your 1/x 15:55:00 (Since push worked, it means that it was a fast-forward anyway.) 15:55:28 prxq: potential numbers are symbols that look like numbers, and implementations are allowed to read them as implementation-dependent numbers 15:55:38 -!- quidnunc [n=user@bas16-montreal02-1242357050.dsl.bell.ca] has quit ["ERC Version 5.3 (IRC client for Emacs)"] 15:55:46 And you can request a non-fast-forward merge during pull, I believe. 15:55:47 potential-numbers are -token- that look like numbers 15:57:09 tcr: ah ok. Well in sbcl that's ok. 15:57:13 (defun one-over (x) (/ 1 x)) 15:58:19 prxq: but what's the name of my function? It's not 1/x (even leaving aside the potential number issue). 15:58:25 Jafet: yo do not need that function, (/ x) works just as fine 15:59:05 prxq: it computes this: (/ (round (/ n))) 15:59:21 -!- nvoorhies [n=nvoorhie@72-254-85-155.client.stsn.net] has quit [] 15:59:25 I thought we were discussing naming not implementation 16:00:08 mstevens [n=mstevens@81.2.103.24] has joined #lisp 16:00:18 Has anyone seen a non-trivial usage of deftype? 16:00:38 Krystof [n=csr21@84-51-132-95.christ977.adsl.metronet.co.uk] has joined #lisp 16:00:38 what's non-trivial ? 16:00:39 Jafet: I was. But the name of a different function. 16:01:12 I'm thinking round-unit-fraction or maybe round-to-unit-fraction. 16:01:21 fe[nl]ix: Something which actually computes the expansion 16:01:47 -!- plutonas [n=plutonas@port-92-195-84-54.dynamic.qsc.de] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 16:01:56 bonus point if it involves &environment 16:06:25 gigamonk: i'm not certain that'll always give the closest approximation. 16:07:33 slash_ [n=Unknown@p5DD1D50A.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #lisp 16:08:24 Joreji [n=thomas@46-247.eduroam.RWTH-Aachen.DE] has joined #lisp 16:08:36 pkhuong: No? Well, I haven't been good at math since high school so I wouldn't be astounded. 16:08:37 tcr: I use arguments sometimes, and I think used conditionals in the expander once or twice. 16:09:39 gigamonkey: I don't know if there's a nice algebraic solution for the closest unit fraction, except maybe trying both ceiling and floor. 16:11:48 gigamonk: could you give examples of what you want? 16:13:07 gigamonkey pasted "pkhuong, you mean something like this?" at http://paste.lisp.org/display/91238 16:13:33 prxq: (round-unit-fraction 10219/166181) => 1/16 16:13:51 whoppix [n=whoppix@ti0021a380-dhcp0681.bb.online.no] has joined #lisp 16:14:11 gigamonk: I'd use if, but yes, pretty much. 16:14:37 For some value of "closest" 16:15:16 I think gigamonk's implementation cuts at harmonic mean of 1/n and 1/(n+1) 16:16:01 Er, the first implementation 16:16:53 -!- slyrus [n=slyrus@adsl-75-52-254-21.dsl.pltn13.sbcglobal.net] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 16:17:06 -!- marioxcc is now known as marioxcc-AFK 16:19:27 -!- legumbre_ is now known as legumbre 16:19:58 -!- SandGorgon [n=OmNomNom@122.173.249.152] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 16:20:03 Eko [n=eko@lawn-128-61-121-151.lawn.gatech.edu] has joined #lisp 16:21:13 Jafet: so is there a definition of 'closest' for which (/ (round (/ x))) returns the closest unit-fraction to x? 16:21:47 -!- HET2 [n=diman@cpc1-cdif12-2-0-cust125.5-1.cable.virginmedia.com] has quit ["Leaving"] 16:21:55 <_deepfire> Did Climategate already hit #lisp? 16:22:06 I believe it is the one I just stated above 16:22:21 Can't be bothered to work it out at this hour 16:23:00 -!- SimonH [n=simonh@92.29.187.150] has quit ["This computer has gone to sleep"] 16:23:25 _deepfire: no, #lisp has had the good taste of discussing this elsewhere, as far as I can tell. 16:24:48 <_deepfire> pkhuong, the problem is, I know of no satisfactory parallel community for #lisp -- akin to what #offtopic was to #kernelnewbies, while both weren't dead.. 16:25:24 <_deepfire> Yes I know about #lispcafe.. 16:25:45 Jafet: Assuming you're right, the docstring would then be like 'returns the unit fraction closest to the harmonic mean of 1/n and 1/(n+1)' 16:26:07 Not that I really understand what that means. 16:26:28 So do I go with the elegant code and a docstring I don't understand or the elegant docstring and messy code. 16:27:56 The messy code is hidden behind a useful and simple interface; the elegant code would also be hidden behind a weird interface (: 16:28:00 "Returns the unit fraction 1/n for input x where x is between the harmonic mean of 1/n and 1/(n-1) and the harmonic mean of 1/n and 1/(n+1)" 16:29:33 pkhuong: yeah, put it that way and it's pretty clear which is better. 16:29:35 gigamonk: you can compute (/ (floor (/ n))) and (/ (ceiling (/ n))) and pick out the one you want 16:29:53 prxq: uh, yeah. see paste above. 16:30:51 :-) righty 16:31:23 pkhuong: though my old appreciation for the inherent elegance of mathematics makes me think that if I was more mathematically sophisticated, then the weird interface would then be the one I really want. 16:31:53 As, in, *of course* I want the unit fraction related to the harmonic means, blah, blah, blah. 16:32:21 the only useful way I could reason about your old definition would by mentally inlining it. 16:32:27 It doesn't seem like a useful function, no matter how ridiculously precise you want it defined 16:32:30 jewel [n=jewel@vc-41-29-198-34.umts.vodacom.co.za] has joined #lisp 16:32:42 gigamonk: I think you should tell us what you're going to use it for. 16:32:47 And round isn't particularly elegant. 16:32:55 pkhuong: well, there's that. 16:33:01 2wwwwwwwwwwwwwwwww 16:33:14 (cat on keyboard) 16:33:17 JAS415 [n=jon@c-71-233-58-7.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 16:33:30 kpreid: basically just pick a unit fraction that's a reasonable approximation to another fraction. 16:33:51 gigamonk: a little more context? 16:33:57 For some definition of 'reasonable' 16:34:36 gigamonk: why a unit fraction? What would a likely definition of reasonable be? 16:34:51 spo_0f [n=spoof@78.31.74.25] has joined #lisp 16:35:19 You could ask the ancient Egyptians. 16:35:54 that's sums of unit fractions, which is a bit different 16:36:37 I'm sure they studied the aesthetics of choosing unit fractions very closely 16:37:10 kpreid: For instance, there are were 1,270,220 programmers in the US in 2008 out of 135,185,230 total workers. Thus approximately 1 out of 106 workers were programmers. 16:37:49 konr [n=konrad@201.82.95.251] has joined #lisp 16:38:12 pkhuong: because 1 out of X is often easier to grok for a human being that more complicated fractions. 16:38:14 slyrus [n=slyrus@adsl-75-52-254-21.dsl.pltn13.sbcglobal.net] has joined #lisp 16:38:52 (defun make-statistic (true-value desired-value) desired-value) 16:39:16 If it's for something trivial like that, it shouldn't matter 16:40:01 pkhuong: maybe better would just be to explicitly choose whether you want the nearest unit fraction greater or less than the actual value. 16:40:14 Perhaps you want to make it handle zero divisions, though 16:41:56 Jafet: Right. But given that I have the function, I'd like to know what it actually does. But I've clearly wandered off into the weeds of higher math by accident. 16:42:29 SimonH [n=simonh@92.29.187.150] has joined #lisp 16:43:16 Well, if all your values are rational you're safely in the arms of high school algebra 16:43:42 But when you venture into floating point, there be subnormal dragons 16:44:02 denormals. 16:44:16 Huxley would approve of your usage. 16:44:54 Or in this case, the apparently inexplicable rules of NaN arithmetic 16:44:54 Jafet: Sorry, I didn't learn about harmonic means in algebra. 16:45:21 They're purely algebraic 16:45:30 hugod [n=hugod@bas1-montreal50-1279633779.dsl.bell.ca] has joined #lisp 16:45:50 gigamonk: mid high school or during a quantitative method course maybe? 16:46:16 hjpark [n=user@jaram.hanyang.ac.kr] has joined #lisp 16:46:21 pkhuong: perhaps they were mentioned somewhere along the way. But I have zero intuitive sense of what they, er, mean. 16:46:56 -!- Adlai [n=adlai@unaffiliated/adlai] has quit ["homeward bound!"] 16:47:12 mcspiff [n=user@142.68.79.57] has joined #lisp 16:47:40 Is O(f) + Theta(f) == Theta(f)? 16:47:58 -!- spo_0f [n=spoof@78.31.74.25] has quit ["Leaving"] 16:50:57 -!- hjpark [n=user@jaram.hanyang.ac.kr] has quit [Remote closed the connection] 16:51:31 tcr: if g in O(f) and h in Theta(f), g+h in Theta(f), yes. 16:51:40 -!- mstevens [n=mstevens@81.2.103.24] has quit [] 16:52:15 kejsaren [n=kejsaren@111.25.95.91.static.ras.siw.siwnet.net] has joined #lisp 16:59:37 -!- davazp [n=user@5.Red-83-54-164.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net] has quit [Read error: 60 (Operation timed out)] 17:00:45 ikki [n=ikki@189.139.232.23] has joined #lisp 17:02:04 *mcspiff* wishes the inspector in slime would autoupdate 17:02:05 jtza8_ [n=jtza8@wbs-41-208-205-8.wbs.co.za] has joined #lisp 17:02:59 mcspiff: I'm happy it doesn't! 17:05:31 troussan` [n=user@c-71-195-63-115.hsd1.mn.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 17:05:37 sellout- [n=greg@75-25-126-88.lightspeed.sjcpca.sbcglobal.net] has joined #lisp 17:05:39 Before I go off re-inventing the wheel. Does CL have standard support for simple intervals? 17:05:53 -!- sellout [n=greg@75-25-126-88.lightspeed.sjcpca.sbcglobal.net] has quit [Read error: 54 (Connection reset by peer)] 17:06:02 jtza8_: what sort of support? 17:06:08 -!- sellout- is now known as sellout 17:06:22 Well, union operations on intervals would be nice. 17:07:09 gigamonk: i think your original function did what you want rather well. 17:07:43 It supports interval types; you get union and intersection for free, along with membership testing and, sometimes, subset testing. Performance is completely undefined though. 17:08:04 I'd implement a special purpose data structure if it's really at the heart of your problem. 17:08:07 mcspiff: You can press `g' to update it 17:08:20 pkhuong: Thanks. 17:09:42 tcr: I know, but i usually just have it open in a seperate frame, and I just kind of glance at it. 17:09:56 tcr: might just script something myself 17:10:06 -!- bobrown [n=user@dsl081-198-234.nyc2.dsl.speakeasy.net] has quit [Remote closed the connection] 17:10:34 -!- troussan [n=user@c-71-195-63-115.hsd1.mn.comcast.net] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 17:10:45 msg gigamonkey are you interested in typos in coders at work? 17:10:50 gah 17:10:50 If only I hadn't screwed up that CDR about *inspector-hook*... 17:10:52 -!- jewel [n=jewel@vc-41-29-198-34.umts.vodacom.co.za] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 17:11:21 mcspiff: In principle, it would be nice if you could insert (inspect :foo :update t) in your CL code 17:11:27 demmeln [n=Adium@dslb-094-216-054-000.pools.arcor-ip.net] has joined #lisp 17:11:46 tcr: I'd agree that would be nice, but im sure I can hack something up with elisp 17:12:05 I don't think it'd be too hard to actually add that 17:13:11 delYsid: I am. Though if you can check http://www.codersatwork.com/errata.html first that'd be cool. Speaking of which, give he a chance to update that. Just a moment. 17:13:12 decto [n=azeaze@pdpc/supporter/student/decto] has joined #lisp 17:13:40 tcr: I tried once before, and what got me was the refresh function would return focus to the debugger buffer 17:14:13 bobrown [n=user@dsl081-198-234.nyc2.dsl.speakeasy.net] has joined #lisp 17:15:51 -!- kejsaren [n=kejsaren@111.25.95.91.static.ras.siw.siwnet.net] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 17:16:16 gigamonk: I presume "p. 326 Wrong typography." refers to the first exchange in the interview being in italic and prior to the horizontal line that usually separates the interview body from the introductory remarks? 17:17:43 holycow [n=new@mail.fredcanhelp.com] has joined #lisp 17:20:07 tcr: do you know if there is a hook that gets called when the inspecter frame is killed? 17:20:25 -!- bobrown [n=user@dsl081-198-234.nyc2.dsl.speakeasy.net] has quit [Remote closed the connection] 17:20:32 bobrown [n=user@dsl081-198-234.nyc2.dsl.speakeasy.net] has joined #lisp 17:22:21 Nshag [i=user@lns-bzn-37-82-253-36-195.adsl.proxad.net] has joined #lisp 17:22:27 -!- bombshelter13b [n=bombshel@76-10-149-209.dsl.teksavvy.com] has quit [] 17:22:48 -!- bobrown [n=user@dsl081-198-234.nyc2.dsl.speakeasy.net] has quit [Remote closed the connection] 17:22:58 jewel [n=jewel@vc-41-30-84-89.umts.vodacom.co.za] has joined #lisp 17:23:02 bobrown [n=user@dsl081-198-234.nyc2.dsl.speakeasy.net] has joined #lisp 17:23:36 delYsid: should be fully up to date now. 17:23:49 nyef: Yeah. 17:26:18 In theory, almost all the errata listed there now should be fixed in a upcoming 3rd printing. 17:26:21 mcspiff: not really 17:27:05 Raptelan [n=Raptelan@99-138-48-236.lightspeed.iplsin.sbcglobal.net] has joined #lisp 17:27:41 tcr: I'll tell you what im thinking: when the buffer is created, setup an idle timer to refresh the inspector, and destroy it when the buffer is killed 17:27:42 is there a shortcut in slime for recompiling all defuns that use a certain macro? 17:28:13 c|mell [n=cmell@85.30.67.5] has joined #lisp 17:28:56 serichsen: That's already an iffy proposition, given the variability in -tracking- which defuns use a random given macro. 17:29:17 plutonas [n=plutonas@port-92-195-84-54.dynamic.qsc.de] has joined #lisp 17:29:56 ejs [n=eugen@251-160-124-91.pool.ukrtel.net] has joined #lisp 17:33:05 So, this is kindof random, but... how well do speech recognition systems handle -whispered- speech? 17:33:54 It seems like there's no voicing, which would completely screw a lot of the theory stuff I've been reading. 17:34:01 *_deepfire* just sent an issue about READ-FOR-COMPILE-FILE calling ERROR on a non-SERIOUS-CONDITION 17:35:14 -!- ejs [n=eugen@251-160-124-91.pool.ukrtel.net] has quit ["This computer has gone to sleep"] 17:36:20 <_deepfire> nyef, my first uneducated guess is that voicing should be treated as discardable noise 17:38:35 <_deepfire> Voicing looks like it's only raison d'etre is amplification. 17:38:38 -!- demmeln [n=Adium@dslb-094-216-054-000.pools.arcor-ip.net] has left #lisp 17:38:42 spilman [n=spilman@ARennes-552-1-75-162.w92-135.abo.wanadoo.fr] has joined #lisp 17:39:12 No, because it's one of the major methods of adding pitch. 17:40:00 <_deepfire> Is pitch really essential? 17:40:02 But amplification is a good start... 17:40:47 Depends on the language, I think, but even in english you find cases where pitch changes yield non-phonetic linguistic information. 17:41:23 (Example: Raised pitch at the end of a querying sentence.) 17:42:44 You can often recover the questionhood from syntax, but if it's a case of offering a statement and asking for confirmation it's often phrased as the statement and given the pitch change at the end for a question. 17:43:25 ejs [n=eugen@222-212-178-94.pool.ukrtel.net] has joined #lisp 17:43:46 -!- Jafet [n=Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet] has quit [Read error: 60 (Operation timed out)] 17:44:04 -!- ejs [n=eugen@222-212-178-94.pool.ukrtel.net] has quit [Client Quit] 17:44:04 And in that case, your only shots at recognizing what's happening is basically the pitch-shift or a discourse model. 17:45:16 avalanche^ [i=Honningm@60.81-166-31.customer.lyse.net] has joined #lisp 17:45:22 wow 17:45:24 Also consider the difference between "Paul is dead", "Paul is dead?", "-Paul- is dead?", and "Paul is -dead-?!?" 17:45:34 I was just testing and wow, here is a lisp channel 17:45:37 nice nice 17:45:44 anyone know how to do user input? :P 17:45:53 SandGorgon [n=OmNomNom@122.173.249.152] has joined #lisp 17:46:22 avalanche^: Like in any other programming language, it's rather situational. 17:46:33 I just need it from the terminal 17:46:44 to get a polynomial equation I can manipulate 17:46:59 READ, READ-CHAR, READ-CHAR-NO-HANG, READ-SEQUENCE, READ-LINE... 17:47:02 jewel_ [n=jewel@vc-41-29-171-8.umts.vodacom.co.za] has joined #lisp 17:47:17 -!- SandGorgon [n=OmNomNom@122.173.249.152] has quit [SendQ exceeded] 17:47:20 that does not sound like something I've seen before 17:47:31 -!- jewel [n=jewel@vc-41-30-84-89.umts.vodacom.co.za] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 17:47:55 -!- troussan` [n=user@c-71-195-63-115.hsd1.mn.comcast.net] has quit [Remote closed the connection] 17:48:05 <_deepfire> avalanche, have you seen http://www.lispworks.com/documentation/HyperSpec/Body/23_.htm ? 17:48:05 SandGorgon [n=OmNomNom@122.173.249.152] has joined #lisp 17:48:06 troussan` [n=user@c-71-195-63-115.hsd1.mn.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 17:48:16 Alternately, I might start with a function definition for PARSE-POLYNOMIAL, taking a string, and then call it straight from the REPL (parse-polynomial "a^2 + 3b + 17") 17:48:22 but is that for lisp version euscheme? 17:48:36 <_deepfire> avalanche, what is? 17:48:41 timor [n=martin@p54B65255.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #lisp 17:48:51 Oh, you're using euscheme? 17:49:16 We're more a Common Lisp channel, you might have better luck in #scheme if you're using something like euscheme. 17:49:21 -!- SandGorgon [n=OmNomNom@122.173.249.152] has quit [SendQ exceeded] 17:49:57 *nyef* doesn't even know what euscheme is like, but presumes that it's a scheme implementation or variant. 17:50:02 sepult [n=levgue@xdsl-87-78-26-135.netcologne.de] has joined #lisp 17:50:04 -!- envi^home [n=envi@220.121.234.156] has quit ["Leaving"] 17:50:35 -!- sellout [n=greg@75-25-126-88.lightspeed.sjcpca.sbcglobal.net] has quit [] 17:51:53 Anyway, as I was saying, so long as I don't need to distribute my stuff to an "end user", I don't really have a problem with having to make an explicit function call to deal with various input for a great many situations. 17:54:29 -!- leo2007 [n=leo@cpc2-cmbg15-2-0-cust694.5-4.cable.virginmedia.com] has quit ["switch server"] 17:55:23 -!- madnificent [n=madnific@83.101.62.132] has quit [Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)] 17:56:25 <_deepfire> Clashing system names (for tests) is just another way how people are abusing ASDF.. 17:56:29 -!- kpreid [n=kpreid@cpe-72-228-78-176.twcny.res.rr.com] has quit [] 17:58:26 ... hunh. I have four systems in my current environment, two of which I load via ASDF and two of which I don't. 17:59:14 And the notation in my build script on one of them is "... by using its ASDF system (in the unlikely event that we obtain something that tries to pull it in via ASDF)." 17:59:19 leo2007 [n=leo@cpc2-cmbg15-2-0-cust694.5-4.cable.virginmedia.com] has joined #lisp 18:00:13 <_deepfire> nyef, do you distribute them? 18:00:35 Umm... Maybe one of them? 18:00:44 <_deepfire> LH-USB? 18:00:45 They're all things I pulled in from outside, though. 18:00:53 No, this environment doesn't have lh-usb. 18:01:31 is anyone actively using sbcl on ppc? 18:02:12 *_deepfire* ponders blacklisting test/ and tests/ module subdirectories for the purposes of system search. 18:02:38 -!- spec[away] [n=Spec@unaffiliated/mrspec] has quit [Read error: 113 (No route to host)] 18:02:41 -!- sepult [n=levgue@xdsl-87-78-26-135.netcologne.de] has quit [Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)] 18:03:23 <_deepfire> lhz, macos is somewhat popular among #lisp users, FWIW, so there are likely to be some users with pre-Intel hardware. 18:03:32 spec[away] [n=Spec@88.208.105.1] has joined #lisp 18:05:15 _deepfire: just wondering if "sh make.sh" makes it through on ppc (linux or darwin). 18:06:57 rpg [n=rpg@216.243.156.16.real-time.com] has joined #lisp 18:07:53 -!- decto [n=azeaze@pdpc/supporter/student/decto] has quit ["Leaving"] 18:08:47 <_deepfire> There used to be PPC buildslaves.. 18:09:01 -!- asksol [n=ask@pat-tdc.opera.com] has quit [SendQ exceeded] 18:09:13 <_deepfire> The last builds I have are 1.0.32.1 for linux-ppc and 1.0.30.49 for darwin-ppc 18:09:13 sepult [n=levgue@xdsl-87-78-26-135.netcologne.de] has joined #lisp 18:09:45 <_deepfire> It doesn't mean that the latter versions are unbuildable, just that the buildslaves went away. 18:10:15 SandGorgon [n=OmNomNom@122.173.249.152] has joined #lisp 18:10:28 <_deepfire> foom had access to the slave machines, which I don't, so they withered away. 18:13:34 _deepfire: thanks 18:16:17 -!- gigamonk [n=user@adsl-99-58-28-83.dsl.pltn13.sbcglobal.net] has quit [Remote closed the connection] 18:17:43 -!- jewel_ [n=jewel@vc-41-29-171-8.umts.vodacom.co.za] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 18:18:08 -!- Buganini_ is now known as Buganini__ 18:18:10 -!- Buganini__ is now known as Buganini_ 18:18:11 -!- kuwabara [n=kuwabara@cerbere.qosmos.net] has quit [Remote closed the connection] 18:18:51 kuwabara [n=kuwabara@cerbere.qosmos.com] has joined #lisp 18:19:35 [11/29][18:48:40] We're more a Common Lisp channel, you might have better luck in #scheme if you're using something like euscheme. 18:19:41 euscheme is not scheme 18:19:43 it is lisp 18:19:49 just a retarded name 18:19:49 -!- Buganini_ is now known as Buganini 18:19:54 avalanche^, but it's not Common Lisp. 18:20:03 very similar 18:20:05 I think 18:20:09 Ah, it's an EuLisp. 18:20:13 yes 18:20:40 ANSI Lisp, EU Lisp, ISO Lisp. Meh. 18:21:01 gigamonkey: ah, it already in the errata. 18:21:12 yeah, so how to do user input in that lisp =p 18:24:21 Well, having found something that looks like a language spec or reference (not sure which), and found a chapter on "streams", I can say that it looks like you do something with stdin or lispin, but haven't figured out what yet. 18:24:47 stdin has a "transaction unit", whatever that is, of character, and lispin has a "transaction unit" of object. 18:24:58 I thought it was something like (x (read)) 18:24:59 -!- timor [n=martin@p54B65255.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 18:25:18 And there's a read function that takes some three optional parameters. 18:25:24 Or are they keyword parameters? 18:26:06 not sure 18:26:36 You're the one using EuLisp, you're the one with the better chance at figuring it out. 18:27:21 Indeed 18:28:23 -!- jtza8_ [n=jtza8@wbs-41-208-205-8.wbs.co.za] has quit ["Later. :{)"] 18:30:02 postamar [n=postamar@76-10-155-218.dsl.teksavvy.com] has joined #lisp 18:30:55 kejsaren [n=kejsaren@111.25.95.91.static.ras.siw.siwnet.net] has joined #lisp 18:36:32 dstatyvka [i=ejabberd@pepelaz.jabber.od.ua] has joined #lisp 18:37:08 -!- dto [n=dto@pool-96-252-62-25.bstnma.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Remote closed the connection] 18:37:40 dto [n=dto@pool-96-252-62-25.bstnma.fios.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 18:38:08 Athas` [n=athas@0x50a157d6.alb2nxx15.dynamic.dsl.tele.dk] has joined #lisp 18:38:54 -!- Athas` [n=athas@0x50a157d6.alb2nxx15.dynamic.dsl.tele.dk] has quit [Remote closed the connection] 18:39:11 madnificent [n=madnific@83.101.62.132] has joined #lisp 18:44:45 serichsen: You can use C-c C-k in xref buffers 18:45:48 -!- kejsaren_ [n=kejsaren@111.25.95.91.static.ras.siw.siwnet.net] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 18:46:21 never knew there was an EU lisp 18:47:24 Adlai [n=adlai@unaffiliated/adlai] has joined #lisp 18:48:40 is it actually a European Union lisp standard? 18:48:41 kpreid [n=kpreid@216-171-189-244.northland.net] has joined #lisp 18:49:49 fiveop [n=fiveop@e179161102.adsl.alicedsl.de] has joined #lisp 18:50:03 hehe apparently because scheme was too little and CL was too much 18:50:46 demmeln1 [n=Adium@dslb-188-099-114-037.pools.arcor-ip.net] has joined #lisp 18:51:03 European union? Back in '86? 18:51:36 *c|mell* thought it was called euslisp 18:51:46 i met someone making a robot in it 18:52:12 i wasn't sure, though it does seem to have originated in Europe 18:52:17 the worst thing was the lack of non-dynamic extent closures 18:52:58 sellout [n=greg@75-25-126-88.lightspeed.sjcpca.sbcglobal.net] has joined #lisp 18:53:06 euLisp was actually sponsered by the EU 18:53:09 back in the day 18:53:19 thus the name 18:53:27 -!- Athas [n=athas@0x50a157d6.alb2nxx15.dynamic.dsl.tele.dk] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 18:53:34 sort-of like PyPy? 18:54:17 -!- demmeln1 [n=Adium@dslb-188-099-114-037.pools.arcor-ip.net] has quit [Client Quit] 18:54:23 demmeln [n=Adium@dslb-188-099-114-037.pools.arcor-ip.net] has joined #lisp 18:54:43 guess it's very different from euslisp then, sorry for dragging in that confusion 18:54:44 Guthur: EUropean Lisp 18:54:57 ah 18:54:57 not E.U. Lisp 18:55:08 makes more sense 18:55:20 or maybe "True Lisp"? 18:56:02 p_l EU does not always have the abbreviation dots though 18:56:11 actually i seldom see that at all 18:56:25 Stattrav [n=Stattrav@117.192.131.99] has joined #lisp 18:56:30 Guthur: dots were to signify acronymity 18:56:44 k 18:56:49 Guthur, eulisp = true lisp. lrn2grk! 18:57:32 -!- Kolyan [n=nartamon@93-81-150-101.broadband.corbina.ru] has quit [] 18:58:12 called “Eu”Lisp as its design was sponsored by the EU 18:58:21 The EU eventually lost interest, so the standard has not gained 18:58:21 popularity 18:58:32 eu implies healthy or well or advantageous, not true 18:59:24 adeht, I'm giving a proof by vivid example that those who tell others to go learn something don't always know/remember it that well themselves :\ 18:59:36 avalanche^: just out of curiosity, what were the reasons you choose eulisp? 18:59:50 more lecture wrote it 19:00:00 so I feel I should 19:00:35 I couldn't parse "more lecture wrote it". What did that mean? 19:01:03 oh, that came out wrong 19:01:16 my lecture wrote the language 19:02:02 Do you mean lecturer (one who lectures)? 19:02:14 Adlai: I actually remember "good", but did bother to look it up Penguin's Dictionary of Psychology 19:02:31 yeah 19:03:08 And by "wrote the language", do you mean was one of the designers, an implementor, or just uses it a lot? 19:03:57 Madsy^ [n=Madsy@ti0207a340-0573.bb.online.no] has joined #lisp 19:04:17 wrote the language, like in designed/implemented etc everything 19:04:34 -!- mcspiff [n=user@142.68.79.57] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 19:05:29 Ah, okay. 19:05:45 -!- tcr [n=tcr@host146.natpool.mwn.de] has quit ["Leaving."] 19:05:50 So you have a local expert, and possibly a local user community. 19:05:52 sorry for the confusion 19:06:15 he's not helpful, unfortunately 19:07:13 *Adlai* out 19:12:37 avalanche^: ...and he does his lectures referencing eulisp? 19:14:07 -!- SimonH [n=simonh@92.29.187.150] has quit ["Leaving"] 19:15:19 a continuation that can "only be used in the dynamic extent of their creation" essentially means that it is a throw catch thing, right? 19:15:31 *prxq* is looking at the eulisp standard 19:15:32 jewel [n=jewel@vc-41-31-29-23.umts.vodacom.co.za] has joined #lisp 19:16:09 decto [n=azeaze@pdpc/supporter/student/decto] has joined #lisp 19:16:51 prxq: I'm going to go with "not if they're multi-shot, and it rather depends on the notion of 'the dynamic extent of their creation'." 19:17:40 At a certain point, though, they could just devolve to closures plus non-local flow control. 19:18:23 -!- postamar [n=postamar@76-10-155-218.dsl.teksavvy.com] has quit [Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)] 19:18:58 quidnunc [n=user@bas16-montreal02-1242357050.dsl.bell.ca] has joined #lisp 19:19:02 it seems they are not multishot. So I'll go with that. 19:19:02 postamar [n=postamar@76-10-155-218.dsl.teksavvy.com] has joined #lisp 19:19:07 *prxq* closes the pdf 19:19:07 -!- postamar [n=postamar@76-10-155-218.dsl.teksavvy.com] has quit [Remote closed the connection] 19:19:45 -!- Madsy [n=Madsy@fu/coder/madsy] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 19:21:10 Seriously, if you can establish a dynamic extent, make a few levels of function call, and in -there- create the continuation and still have it be in the dynamic extent established earlier, that's sortof useful. 19:21:25 Otherwise, yeah, looks like catch/throw by any other name. 19:22:19 ... hey, there are -two- microphone holes on this machine. 19:22:32 ace4016 [i=ace4016@cpe-76-170-134-79.socal.res.rr.com] has joined #lisp 19:22:44 I think it might be a stereo mic! 19:24:03 And it looks like each side is separately controllable in alsamixer. 19:24:13 This calls for some experimentation later. 19:27:07 mcspiff [n=user@142.68.79.57] has joined #lisp 19:29:07 ruediger_ [n=quassel@93-82-12-242.adsl.highway.telekom.at] has joined #lisp 19:30:00 -!- reprore [n=reprore@ntkngw356150.kngw.nt.ftth.ppp.infoweb.ne.jp] has quit [Remote closed the connection] 19:30:37 reprore [n=reprore@ntkngw356150.kngw.nt.ftth.ppp.infoweb.ne.jp] has joined #lisp 19:37:18 nyef: you pinged my alter ego about a concurrency bug 19:37:29 No, about CLX. 19:38:03 in clx 19:38:08 or something 19:38:21 No, the concurrency bug was an entirely separate issue. 19:38:22 anyway, unwind. nyef: you pinged my alter ego 19:39:33 as far as I know, there's no useful clx mailing list. There was one at metacircles, and that dodoified. There was one at clozure, but I that was before 19:39:33 Yeah. One was to ask if there was a current CLX mailing list, and the other was about (unannounced) http://common-lisp.net/~abridgewater/dist/clx/ . 19:40:01 There are a few CLX, it seems. The one that comes with SBCL doesn't handle AltGr properly. Does your, Krystof? 19:40:13 ... SBCL doesn't come with CLX. 19:40:13 no CLX comes with sbcl 19:40:24 Hrm. 19:40:36 Wat. What am I using then. 19:40:46 also, no CLX supports XKEYBOARD (which is what I suppose you mean by "handle AltGr properly") 19:41:04 tic: you're using a CLX that you downloaded from some third-party source. 19:41:25 Anyway, what I was pinging about was basically to discuss release engineering and mailing lists for CLX. 19:41:26 Athas [n=athas@0x50a157d6.alb2nxx15.dynamic.dsl.tele.dk] has joined #lisp 19:41:39 Why is that anyway.. the lack of XKEYBOARD? is it something that makes it really hard to do in lisp, or is it just.. it hasn't been annoying enough for anyone yet? 19:41:44 Krystof, could be. I can't type (). 19:41:49 -!- reprore [n=reprore@ntkngw356150.kngw.nt.ftth.ppp.infoweb.ne.jp] has quit [Remote closed the connection] 19:41:57 schme: it's a certain amount of work and no-one has done that work 19:41:58 minion: Ping? 19:42:10 minion: DIE! 19:42:22 Krystof: Not itching enough for anyone to scratch it. Right :) 19:42:22 Ping: pong 19:42:23 go play in traffic 19:42:24 (keycode 25 = adiaeresis Adiaeresis parenleft) 19:42:41 tic: Yes. That won't work I noticed too (: 19:42:49 minion: Are you okay now? 19:42:50 no 19:43:08 schme, mhm. I find myself typing äload-module in stumpwm too often. 19:43:17 I mean, it might also be a separate bug. I suggest you investigate, debug, and fix the problem 19:43:21 Better, the bots aren't completely soaking clnet's CPU anymore. 19:43:46 fixing the bug? pah. when I can nag you. 19:43:56 you can nag me all you like, I won't fix your clx bugs 19:44:01 aww 19:44:05 no fair. 19:44:07 also: fuck off 19:44:07 stipet [n=user@c83-253-28-60.bredband.comhem.se] has joined #lisp 19:44:08 Anyway, should I just set up a launchpad project for CLX? 19:44:22 Krystof, that was uncalled for. 19:44:27 -!- Adlai [n=adlai@unaffiliated/adlai] has quit [Remote closed the connection] 19:44:36 nyef, that'd probably be a good idea. 19:44:42 Adlai [n=adlai@unaffiliated/adlai] has joined #lisp 19:44:47 tic: you might think you're being playful and "funny", but from where I'm sitting you're being incredibly offensive 19:44:48 faux [n=user@1-1-4-21a.gkp.gbg.bostream.se] has joined #lisp 19:45:09 Krystof, I'm sorry. please accept my apologies. 19:45:30 I did not mean to offend you. 19:45:33 -!- ruediger [n=quassel@188-23-93-51.adsl.highway.telekom.at] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 19:45:42 nyef: launchpad is fine with me. Dunno about everyone else 19:45:51 Is there an everyone else? 19:45:54 ha 19:45:57 Are there any recommended resources to understand XKEYBOARD ? 19:46:07 schme: the XKEYBOARD spec 19:46:32 *schme* clicks the link provided by the nice wikipedia article then. 19:46:36 schme: The spec, the server-side code, the C xlib implementation, etc. 19:46:36 schme, supposedly the StumpWM had it working in one version, then it stopped working again. Maybe you can try searching through their code and see? 19:46:38 *p_l* wonders what is wrong with Genera's X11 implementation 19:46:38 I'd also say "the xkb documentation", but there isn't any 19:46:53 p_l: it's missing about 20 years of extensions to the X11 protocol 19:47:02 fark. 155 pages xkb protocol specs. 19:47:09 schme: now you know :-) 19:47:13 -!- Madsy^ is now known as Madsy 19:47:19 Krystof: AFAIK the problem is that it's using something that glorious X.Org devs removed at one point without care 19:47:28 thus Save World always hangs 19:47:41 p_l: oh, sorry, I didn't realise that you were actually trying to debug it 19:48:00 I thought your comment was more speculative than that 19:48:00 Krystof: And I didn't even click the library spec link yet. But I guess that part is not so much important. I am, however, going to print this protocol spec out. 19:48:03 Krystof: If needed, I could probably run modenr CLX on it :P 19:48:20 lispm [n=joswig@g224120062.adsl.alicedsl.de] has joined #lisp 19:48:22 schme: I have a copy in my office, if you do get stuck into it 19:48:46 I don't think basic support is that hard (but it is a little bit hard, because you want to do it as transparently as possible to existing applications) 19:49:05 I guess the next question is, do you mind using git as the primary repository for CLX? 19:49:18 not at all 19:49:25 if you have a lossless history conversion 19:49:38 I don't know how lossy my history conversion is. 19:49:57 -!- dto [n=dto@pool-96-252-62-25.bstnma.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Read error: 113 (No route to host)] 19:49:59 well, at least not obviously lossy 19:50:10 same number of commits, roughly the same commit messages would do for me 19:50:14 dto [n=dto@pool-96-252-62-25.bstnma.fios.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 19:51:16 Seems like there are 12 commits with a comment of "Initial revision" by "dan " over a time stretching from july 2, 2000 to january 21, 2002. 19:51:17 Krystof: That makes sense with the transparently for existing apps. This seems like something interesting to have a whack at though. (: 19:52:24 CLX doesn't seem too overly huge to wrap ones head around either. Excellent! christmas is has been saved. 19:52:40 woo \o/ no wait Christmas, bah humbug 19:53:03 Looks like 162 commits, seven of which are my GLX fixes, so 155 from upstream. 19:53:32 Krystof: fortunately, I found Xmon :) 19:53:50 COFFEEWARE. that's a new one. 19:53:51 darcs changes --count says 181... Hrm. 19:53:58 schme, awesome, will you get my ()s working? 19:54:36 nyef: hm, a naive count here says I have 183 19:54:49 tic: I have not a clue :) I just now started browsing the CLX code to get some idea just what the heck .. and I need to print these xkb prot specs and maybe I'll work something out. Maybe not . I'll give it a try atleast (: 19:55:00 schme, fun fun. 19:55:05 Ah! The changes that establish tags aren't here. 19:55:33 schme, you could also write a proper ratclick using the *mumble mumble* event protocol! 19:55:37 And some of them show up in the darcs change list multiple times. 19:55:51 yes, our history is really ugly 19:56:00 tic: What is wrong with the current one? 19:56:08 possibly we should throw it away :-) 19:56:19 schme, other than it doesn't work? ;) (stumpwm's, that is) 19:56:34 I know I had a working #'ratclick someone pasted somewhere, but I've lost it. :-( 19:56:50 actually, that's a good point, nyef. Probably the major development push for clx in the last couple of years is from stumpwm 19:57:04 tic: Hmm ok. I don't know there. I gave up on stumpwm some time back. 19:57:08 it might be worth letting sabetts and the other committers know 19:57:13 schme, why? 19:57:21 (and when) 19:57:28 So, (- 181 155) => 26 "lost" changes, and sixteen tags, at least one of which is massively duplicated in the darcs changelog. 19:57:39 tic: too much crashing. and it ran like really slow on threaded sbcl. Which apperently was fixed. 19:57:44 tic: I do the xmonad now. 19:57:48 schme, yeah, have none of those problems. 19:57:49 -!- Raptelan [n=Raptelan@99-138-48-236.lightspeed.iplsin.sbcglobal.net] has quit ["Lost terminal"] 19:57:52 ah, xmonad. heard it's good. 19:58:15 I like it.. atleast for the desktop. on the laptop I'm on ratpoison. Too small a screen for the autotiling. 19:58:42 "sadly, CLX doesn't have the xtest extension like xlib does." 19:58:53 Dawgmatix [n=user@c-76-124-8-39.hsd1.nj.comcast.net] has joined #lisp 19:59:02 reprore_ [n=reprore@ntkngw356150.kngw.nt.ftth.ppp.infoweb.ne.jp] has joined #lisp 19:59:25 What is the xtest extension? 19:59:31 ... 26 changes with the word "tagged" in the description and no files affected. 19:59:37 I'd say we're good there. 19:59:40 maacl [n=mac@0x573526c8.virnxx17.dynamic.dsl.tele.dk] has joined #lisp 19:59:53 tic: at least in my repository that's not entirely true 20:00:20 So, do we call this thing "clx", "telent-clx", "portable-clx", or something else? 20:00:23 tic: I googled up some xtest extension. It looks really small. 20:00:30 ;;; Implementation of the XTest extension as described by 20:00:30 ;;; http://www.x.org/docs/Xext/xtest.pdf 20:00:54 Yeah, that's been around for, what, a year and a half now? 20:01:04 there are a bunch of clx implementations. Which is the canonical, if there is one? 20:01:42 tic: the one that I run is the least unportable, but back when I did anything at all I explicitly didn't test on anything but sbcl (and assumed that other lisp vendors would test on their lisp, have their own darcs branches, etc) 20:02:00 -!- ikki [n=ikki@189.139.232.23] has quit ["Leaving"] 20:02:00 tic: For SBCL, it's Krystof's CLX. For CMUCL, it's their mirror of Krystof's repository. For clisp, it's whatever they have going. And so on. 20:02:05 it was really trying to do completely distributed development, and ended up doing basically no development 20:02:14 nyef: I think clisp are doing two. 20:02:16 So it's all really Krystof's CLX people do use 20:02:17 ? 20:02:26 antoszka [n=antoszka@unaffiliated/antoszka] has joined #lisp 20:02:31 tic: Not the clispers (: 20:02:40 the informal contacts I had from Franz basically said that they would love to stop maintaining their own clx, and they definitely did pull some stuff from my repository 20:02:55 schme, meh, screw 'em. ;) * 20:03:15 tic: I thought clisp was quite popular for stumpwm. 20:03:31 okay, I might have two clx:es. One clbuild pulled, and some other version probably off cliki(?) 20:03:53 schme, yeah, probably because of issues w/ sbcl, like you had? 20:04:01 schme: dunno, I ran it on sbcl, now run it on ccl 20:04:01 and they say we don't have enough libraries, eh? 20:04:02 How can i activate profiling on all subcalls of a function? (SLIME) 20:04:21 tic: so clbuild pulls from my repository, and the cliki one is about 5 years old, I think 20:04:25 maybe slightly less than that 20:04:31 (Seriously, what do I call the launchpad project for this, just "CLX", or something more descriptive?) 20:04:44 fmeyer [n=fmeyer@189.4.254.233] has joined #lisp 20:04:46 I'm fine with CLX 20:04:49 madnificent: Yees that's what I do. But I distinctly recall that clisp was quite popular over in #stumpwm.. that channel seems huge nowadays though, so maybe things have changed. 20:04:52 Thanks. Cliki apps seems very outdated. 20:05:10 tic: or maybe because of the smaller binary size. 20:05:13 -!- jewel [n=jewel@vc-41-31-29-23.umts.vodacom.co.za] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 20:05:15 (like that really matters) 20:05:39 "X11 client protocol in Common Lisp" or something for an expanded title? 20:07:11 drewc [n=drewc@89.16.166.162] has joined #lisp 20:07:21 well I'm gonna do some code browsing instead of IRC browsing. \o/ 20:07:21 More the summary, I think. The title should be more like "CLX: Common Lisp X". 20:07:39 schme: Have fun, good luck, and have a look at the XInput spec while you're at it. ^_- 20:08:12 nyef: *googles* 20:08:26 -!- c|mell [n=cmell@85.30.67.5] has quit [Remote closed the connection] 20:10:19 Hrm. What do I put down for license? 20:10:56 is there a tickybox for "mostly MIT"? 20:10:57 jmbr_ [n=jmbr@177.33.220.87.dynamic.jazztel.es] has joined #lisp 20:11:36 Not really, though there's one for "MIT / X / Expat" and one for "Other/Open Source". 20:12:50 -!- mornfall [n=mornfall@kde/developer/mornfall] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 20:12:58 I'd guess the MIT / X / Expat isn't _too_ wrong 20:13:44 Hrm... gl.lisp and glx.lisp don't have a copyright/license header. 20:17:06 indeed. Fortunately, Janis is still fairly active, at least going by the datestamp on http://www.ltn.lv/~jonis/ 20:17:07 Yeah, looks more-or-less equivalent to the MIT license. 20:17:41 Yeah, jdz was surprised that the glx stuff was getting any attention at all. 20:19:53 Okay, launchpad project created. 20:21:06 CLX? great 20:21:27 perhaps my unicode keysyms can be added 20:22:11 Do we really need a devel mailing list? 20:22:47 yes 20:22:54 if we want to encourage outside contributions, yes 20:23:07 Fair enough. 20:23:15 hey, look, I have a whole clx orgfile 20:23:16 Should we do that through launchpad, or clnet, or other? 20:24:21 http://doc.gold.ac.uk/~mas01cr/tmp/clx.html 20:24:26 Heh. The progress timeline for glx gives a timestamp for a Ryohei Ueda finding the gl:enable thing as 2009-10-05. 20:24:41 clnet mail is a known quantity 20:24:46 -!- mtd [n=martin@ops-13.xades.com] has quit [Read error: 113 (No route to host)] 20:25:11 Okay, I'll request a mailing list in a bit. 20:25:35 (I'm short on time this afternoon, will probably be leaving soon.) 20:25:41 Bug tracker is done. 20:25:50 I have some ideas for making releases easier to manage. 20:26:00 -!- jmbr [n=jmbr@62.32.220.87.dynamic.jazztel.es] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 20:26:12 nyef: you want a clx mailing list ? 20:26:14 (Essentially, automate the heck out of it.) 20:26:20 fe[nl]ix: Yeah, "clx-devel" or similar. 20:26:46 ok. one mailing list coming up 20:26:58 Thanks! 20:27:21 Are you going to need my current email address to set it up, or is it going to be tied to my clnet account or something? 20:28:58 the latter 20:29:05 Okay. 20:29:54 Edward_ [i=Ed@AAubervilliers-154-1-69-125.w81-249.abo.wanadoo.fr] has joined #lisp 20:31:30 done 20:32:04 Thanks. 20:32:19 *nyef* updates his .forward file, having completely forgotten about it. 20:33:57 was that address invalid ? 20:34:21 It was... to an account that I stopped watching due to the amount of unfiltered spam I was getting. 20:35:11 -!- stassats` [n=stassats@wikipedia/stassats] has quit ["ERC Version 5.3 (IRC client for Emacs)"] 20:35:13 ThomasIl [n=thomas@unaffiliated/thomasi] has joined #lisp 20:35:29 Adamant [n=Adamant@unaffiliated/adamant] has joined #lisp 20:37:24 -!- josemanuel [n=josemanu@49.1.222.87.dynamic.jazztel.es] has quit ["Saliendo"] 20:38:00 *nyef* updates the CLX page on cliki to point to the tagged clx-0.7.4 tarball he made. 20:40:34 nyef: could you name the directory inside just clx-0.7.4 ? 20:40:45 Why? 20:42:08 for consistency 20:42:17 consistency with what? 20:42:31 is the tarball named clx-0.7.4.tar.gz? 20:42:36 When the time comes for an 0.7.5, I'll put it in the clx/ directory. 20:42:44 tic: No, .tgz. Should I change that? 20:42:45 nyef: the name of the tarball 20:42:58 varjag [n=eugene@103.80-202-117.nextgentel.com] has joined #lisp 20:43:16 fe[nl]ix: I'd suggest that it only looks inconsistent because I only have the 0.7.4 release in there now. 20:43:29 The_Doctor [n=The_Doct@cpe-98-150-247-183.hawaii.res.rr.com] has joined #lisp 20:43:30 nyef, .tgz is an old slack convention iirc for absolute files... but maybe what fe[nl]ix is aiming is that foo.tar.gz contains a directory foo/, and nothing else. (or I'm mistaken) 20:43:47 Oh, oops. 20:44:03 The directory -in- the tarball. 20:44:07 Sorry. 20:44:10 nyef: the directory inside is named "clx-upstream-0.7.4" 20:44:12 I'll fix that. 20:44:12 francogrex [n=user@184.88-243-81.adsl-dyn.isp.belgacom.be] has joined #lisp 20:44:12 :-) 20:44:23 ... as soon as I remember how. 20:44:33 nyef: could additional keysyms be added to main branch? 20:44:34 tar xzf? 20:44:43 (and tar cjf foo.tar.gz foo) 20:44:51 ziga`: Sure. 20:44:52 I'm surprised to see that many freenode channels that have nothing to do with lisp use http://paste.lisp.org/ 20:45:44 fe[nl]ix: Try now? 20:46:01 nyef: I'm not sure, but it might be that you have to specify in the launchpad project that it uses the bug tracker 20:46:18 at the moment, bugs.launchpad.net/clx says "Bug tracker: none specified" 20:46:56 nyef: ok 20:47:05 Yeah, just fixing that now. 20:47:19 nyef: in the project options you must specify that it used launchpad as bug tracker 20:48:42 Okay, I've got about 5-10 minutes left before I need to leave. 20:49:09 nyef: where can I put the file for you to see? it's too large for lisppaste 20:49:27 ziga`: In your webspace? 20:49:35 -!- ThomasI [n=thomas@unaffiliated/thomasi] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 20:49:46 it's a conversion of http://www.cl.cam.ac.uk/~mgk25/ucs/keysym2ucs.c 20:49:46 to CLX format 20:49:50 ziga`: If you have a clnet account, you could dump it there. 20:49:58 I don't have a web space 20:51:47 You might be able to file a bug in launchpad and attach it there... not sure what, if any, file size limits there are. 20:52:09 ok I'll try that.. 20:54:39 <_deepfire> Ok, ASDF doesn't cease to amaze me. 20:57:19 ht [n=ht@ip98-160-237-110.lv.lv.cox.net] has joined #lisp 20:58:49 -!- decto [n=azeaze@pdpc/supporter/student/decto] has quit ["Leaving"] 20:58:50 -!- spilman [n=spilman@ARennes-552-1-75-162.w92-135.abo.wanadoo.fr] has quit ["Quitte"] 20:59:23 -!- fiveop [n=fiveop@e179161102.adsl.alicedsl.de] has quit ["humhum"] 21:00:00 rvirding [n=chatzill@h92n3c1o1034.bredband.skanova.com] has joined #lisp 21:00:26 nyef: done 21:00:55 -!- stipet [n=user@c83-253-28-60.bredband.comhem.se] has quit ["ERC Version 5.3 (IRC client for Emacs)"] 21:03:09 ziga`: Thanks. 21:03:34 And now I have to go. 21:03:58 -!- fmeyer [n=fmeyer@189.4.254.233] has quit ["Leaving..."] 21:04:07 thanks for launchpad site 21:04:09 bye 21:05:28 _deepfire: why are you amazed by asdf? 21:08:04 yay, my ~/.gnus update put that bugmail where I expected 21:08:05 -!- Ralith [n=ralith@69.90.48.97] has quit [Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)] 21:08:12 Ralith [n=ralith@69.90.48.97] has joined #lisp 21:08:54 <_deepfire> francogrex, I'm trying to figure out, right now, why when I ask for system X I also get system Y. System X being "cl-utilities", Y -- "mcclim". 21:10:25 <_deepfire> Well, I do a dirty trick, by binding the ASDF's hashtable to an empty one, for the dynamic extent of the call to FIND-SYSTEM. But that is supposed to have a very predictable effect. 21:10:44 -!- Adamant [n=Adamant@unaffiliated/adamant] has left #lisp 21:10:55 -!- Stattrav [n=Stattrav@117.192.131.99] has quit ["time to sleep"] 21:11:23 almagus [n=almagus@62.33.5.31] has joined #lisp 21:11:24 -!- jimi_hendrix [n=jimi_hen@unaffiliated/jimihendrix] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 21:11:24 piso [n=peter@ip98-176-79-151.sd.sd.cox.net] has joined #lisp 21:11:33 -!- almagus [n=almagus@62.33.5.31] has left #lisp 21:12:15 _deepfire: ok i see; you did me that asdf was amazing you but not necessarily in a positive way 21:12:19 <_deepfire> Also, note that cl-utilities.asd has /no/ dependencies, and only loads sb-rotate-byte (in a violation of ASDF's declarative semantics). 21:12:42 almgs [n=almagus@62.33.5.31] has joined #lisp 21:13:41 <_deepfire> Well the use of word "get" above is not quite right. What I should have said is that McCLIM's systems end up in that hashtable. 21:14:07 -!- troussan` [n=user@c-71-195-63-115.hsd1.mn.comcast.net] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 21:18:13 almagus [n=almagus@62.33.4.149] has joined #lisp 21:21:30 _deepfire: well, there's always the other system that Fade developped if you're sick of asdf. though I think asdf it's ok for most of what i need. 21:21:35 njsg [n=nobody@unaffiliated/njsg] has joined #lisp 21:22:06 francogrex: s/Fade/Fare/ 21:22:35 right Fare sorry, I make a lot of typos 21:22:43 _deepfire: "ask for" == asdf-load? 21:23:25 is there a provided way to limit execution to a given time (sbcl here)? 21:23:51 pataphysic [n=user@82-41-78-129.cable.ubr10.sgyl.blueyonder.co.uk] has joined #lisp 21:24:03 <_deepfire> rpg, no, asdf:find-system 21:24:26 <_deepfire> I think I'm getting closer, certain COMMON-LISP-USER::BASIC-ROOT-MODULES-SEARCH is in ASDF:*S-D-S-F* 21:24:29 njsg: sleep? 21:24:45 -!- pataphysic [n=user@82-41-78-129.cable.ubr10.sgyl.blueyonder.co.uk] has left #lisp 21:24:46 dnolen [n=dnolen@pool-70-107-133-48.ny325.east.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 21:25:11 francogrex: the name suggest it sleeps :-\ 21:25:38 _deepfire: SBCL? 21:25:40 SBCL has timers and timeouts 21:26:21 <_deepfire> rpg, yeah. I must also mention that I use ASDF from Fare. 21:26:52 <_deepfire> (so I should really complain to him) 21:27:16 _deepfire: is that the same as bleeding-edge ASDF from gary? 21:27:43 njsg: yes making the system sleep is a way of delaying execution 21:28:24 <_deepfire> rpg, 1.369, last commit by gwking, yes 21:29:16 _deepfire: I'm not hugely surprised --- ASDF is probably groveling over your *central-registry* and looking for .asd files. It may be storing all the .asd's it trips over. 21:29:18 <_deepfire> grep is unable to find any references to basic-root-modules-search in my ~/source/, hmm 21:30:05 (defun print-message () (sleep 4) (format t "Waited for 4 seconds")) then (print-message) 21:30:20 <_deepfire> rpg, ah, it's patching over the "hidden systems" problem by loading known many-systems-per-definition-file clusters? 21:31:09 _deepfire: I believe sysdef-central-registry-search is the function you care about. 21:31:11 <_deepfire> No, not true. 21:31:19 <_deepfire> (To my line) 21:31:23 how hard can it be to press M-. on that function? 21:32:10 <_deepfire> lichtblau, having several versions of asdf doesn't help. also running different versions of asdf on the host and the buildslave doesn't help either. 21:32:32 <_deepfire> I don't have this problem on the host I develop on. 21:32:50 francogrex: i'm interested in stopping if it gets longer than a given time, not about running it for at least a given time 21:33:02 <_deepfire> s/several/two/, to be precise 21:33:15 okay, so you know it's random damage in your build environment. Then why try to blame it on upstream asdf? 21:34:30 <_deepfire> First, it's still the damage in development version of upstream, AIUI. 21:34:53 keepguessing [i=7aa75f95@gateway/web/freenode/x-lfhlfwtygoostxxf] has joined #lisp 21:34:56 <_deepfire> Second, it's only now that I'm approaching understanding of what happens. 21:35:59 njsg, well if it's for a specific time of the day or a given time length, then set a monitor using (get-universal-time) 21:37:57 -!- dnolen [n=dnolen@pool-70-107-133-48.ny325.east.verizon.net] has quit [] 21:38:25 Hi I have followed the instrcutions mentioned in the getting started tutorial of emacs and lisp here http://cl-cookbook.sourceforge.net/windows.html . However at the end when it asks me to load the clisp ... I try the C-M-F5 command but I get a message "let: Wrong type argument: number-or-marker-p, nil" I am new to emacs and list. 21:38:30 -!- almagus [n=almagus@62.33.4.149] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 21:38:31 dnolen [n=dnolen@pool-70-107-133-48.ny325.east.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 21:38:40 Please help thanks 21:40:10 -!- almgs [n=almagus@62.33.5.31] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 21:42:13 keepguessing: yeah all those tutorials didn't help me. It's actually very simple: in your .emacs set this: (defun ECL () (interactive) (inferior-lisp "C:\\ECL\\ECL.exe"));; replace ecl by your lisp system 21:42:33 arabesca [n=arabesca@83.231.47.173] has joined #lisp 21:42:36 then M-x ecl will get you lisp 21:42:48 hi 21:42:52 in your case it will be clisp 21:43:01 hmm ok 21:43:11 I shall give thata try .. Thank you 21:43:43 tell me if it works. You're on windows it seems so probably need to direct it to clisp.bat or something 21:44:01 <_deepfire> Ok, the only function in asdf.lisp that modifies *defined-systems* is register-system. And the only reference to register-system is within defsystem. And the only way you get the defsystem is by loading the system definition -- which is either an outright load-op or a find-system. 21:45:08 -!- slash_ [n=Unknown@p5DD1D50A.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Client Quit] 21:45:21 _deepfire: I feel your pain. I'm afraid I must go out now. I may be back later, else you could try to catch me tomorrow. I have the same problem with ASDF --- it's very hard to tell how its behavior is going to differ across build hosts. 21:45:23 <_deepfire> And sysdef-central-registry-search doesn't look like it's doing something unreasonable, so it must be that mysterious basic-root-modules-search. 21:45:55 <_deepfire> rpg, thank you! 21:46:04 I'm afraid basic-root-modules-search is not in my copy of asdf.lisp. Could this be a Fare-specific add-on? 21:46:37 <_deepfire> rpg, grep tells me nothing about it, I'll have to engage deeper forensics :-) 21:46:40 (it's perhaps equally likely that I've borked my git repo...) 21:48:39 <_deepfire> I doubt that your git repo is the problem. 21:48:43 francogrex: It does not 21:49:20 I did not work 21:49:24 It* 21:49:52 tell me what you did and do you have clisp properly installed? 21:50:36 I believe I have clisp properly installed ... 21:52:07 -!- dto [n=dto@pool-96-252-62-25.bstnma.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Read error: 113 (No route to host)] 21:52:16 (defun CLISP () (interactive) (inferior-lisp "C:\\bin\\clisp-2.48"));; I added this to .emacs and the after restart emacs I tried M-x CLISP .. I have got an error apply: Specified program for new process is a director 21:52:31 -!- morphling [n=stefan@gssn-5f755389.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit [Remote closed the connection] 21:52:45 davazp [n=user@160.Red-83-52-42.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net] has joined #lisp 21:52:45 hmm I got the mistake ... It is obvious :) I should have given the path of clisp.exe 21:53:51 KatchaFire [n=bernie@bas33-4-88-180-245-209.fbx.proxad.net] has joined #lisp 21:54:18 dto [n=dto@pool-96-252-62-25.bstnma.fios.verizon.net] has joined #lisp 21:54:45 keepguessing: ok and now when you specidy the exe or the bat (I'm not sure in clisp it may need clisp.bat instead of clisp.exe; try both) 21:56:17 francogrex: This is the new error message I am getttings is over here http://pastebin.com/d590c7a62 ... I do not see clisp.bat file in the installation clisp installation folder I do have clisp.exe 21:56:44 -!- drdo [n=drdo@214.130.108.93.rev.vodafone.pt] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 21:57:07 -!- spec[away] is now known as mrSpec 21:58:06 go get a fresh emacs from here: http://ftp.gnu.org/gnu/emacs/windows/ 22:01:02 what happens when yoiu double click directly the clisp.exe? 22:01:20 drdo [n=drdo@214.130.108.93.rev.vodafone.pt] has joined #lisp 22:01:21 I used to get am error svm.dll is missing 22:02:01 I could swear people tell me that installing software on windows is easier than on linux systems. 22:02:22 reality vs. fantasyland (: 22:02:25 I googled and found that i needed to move a file from libsvm to a different one. That worked. 22:04:08 OmniMancer [n=OmniManc@219-89-89-241.jetstart.xtra.co.nz] has joined #lisp 22:05:30 keepguessing: just copy the svm.dll to system32 22:05:54 or put it besides clisp.exe, perhaps that works also 22:06:15 when you have clisp working in 'cmd.exe', then move on to emacs 22:06:17 ziga`: I copied it beside clisp.exe it orked 22:06:24 ok 22:06:51 and it worked in cmd mode ... When I tried later in emacs .. it failed as I mentioned above. 22:07:02 -!- reprore_ [n=reprore@ntkngw356150.kngw.nt.ftth.ppp.infoweb.ne.jp] has quit [Remote closed the connection] 22:07:13 <_deepfire> Oh god, I have a monster in my *central-registry*.. 22:08:19 <_deepfire> A form which is EVALed by sysdef-central-registry-search. 22:09:13 keepguessing: try moving it to system32 instead? 22:10:13 otherwise try to find the clisp.bat by doing a search for it. Normally it should install on your desktop 22:10:32 mtd [n=martin@ops-13.xades.com] has joined #lisp 22:10:33 as a shortcut 22:10:37 I looked at the shortcup for clisp on the deskto and found that it was using clisp -k full 22:11:27 should i be modifing the (defun CLISP () (interactive) (inferior-lisp "C:\\bin\\clisp-2.48\clisp.exe"));; accordingly to have -k full too?? 22:12:19 run 'clisp --help' or something like that to see what this means 22:12:22 -!- SandGorgon [n=OmNomNom@122.173.249.152] has quit [Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)] 22:12:23 -!- ruediger_ [n=quassel@93-82-12-242.adsl.highway.telekom.at] has quit [Read error: 54 (Connection reset by peer)] 22:12:44 ruediger [n=quassel@93-82-12-242.adsl.highway.telekom.at] has joined #lisp 22:13:04 konr1 [n=konrad@201.82.95.251] has joined #lisp 22:13:05 trial n error might work if you try different things - also perhaps read some other guide for setting up slime + clisp on windows 22:14:20 -!- Davidbrcz [i=david@212-198-78-230.rev.numericable.fr] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 22:15:33 keepguessing: i'm not sure; let me try, which windows you have XP, and which clisp version? 22:16:29 -!- dstatyvka [i=ejabberd@pepelaz.jabber.od.ua] has quit [Remote closed the connection] 22:16:29 its windows 7 and I am using clisp-4.78 22:16:53 http://www.pchristensen.com/blog/articles/installing-clisp-emacs-and-slime-on-windows-xp/ 22:17:22 keepguessing: see this guide - it says (setq inferior-lisp-program [HOME]/bin/clisp/full/lisp.exe 22:17:22 -B [HOME]/bin/clisp/full 22:17:22 -M [HOME]/bin/clisp/full/lispinit.mem 22:17:22 -ansi -q) 22:18:25 -!- prxq [n=mommer@f051085020.adsl.alicedsl.de] has quit ["Leaving"] 22:18:39 cmm [n=cmm@bzq-82-81-33-165.red.bezeqint.net] has joined #lisp 22:19:59 SLIME is also much nicer than ILISP, but first get ilisp working, slime needs some additional configuration 22:21:50 dstatyvka [i=ejabberd@pepelaz.jabber.od.ua] has joined #lisp 22:22:18 -!- akamaus [n=maus@78.31.79.185] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 22:22:21 clisp-4.78?? are yu sure 22:23:03 faux` [n=user@1-1-4-21a.gkp.gbg.bostream.se] has joined #lisp 22:23:28 the latest is 2.48 22:23:33 for windows 22:23:55 -!- Athas [n=athas@0x50a157d6.alb2nxx15.dynamic.dsl.tele.dk] has quit [Remote closed the connection] 22:23:58 is it any faster now with JIT? :) 22:24:20 windows users are clearly second grade citizens of CL world 22:24:55 ziga: windows users are 2nd grade citizens in general, but i like windows 22:25:29 francogrex: ah it was a typo ... i meant 2.48 :) 22:25:41 -!- davazp [n=user@160.Red-83-52-42.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net] has quit [Read error: 101 (Network is unreachable)] 22:26:12 -!- Adlai [n=adlai@unaffiliated/adlai] has quit [Remote closed the connection] 22:26:45 Adlai [n=adlai@unaffiliated/adlai] has joined #lisp 22:26:49 fmeyer [n=fmeyer@189.4.254.233] has joined #lisp 22:27:35 good night 22:27:56 -!- serichsen [n=user@hmbg-4d0660c6.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit ["and each separate dying ember wrought its ghost upon the floor"] 22:28:16 keepguessing: i just did it and it works very well for me. I directed it to the exe like i said above. 22:28:47 keepguessing I suggest you reinstall your emacs? How did you install and which version? 22:28:47 -!- DrunkTomato [n=DEDULO@ext-gw.wellcom.tomsk.ru] has quit [] 22:28:54 hmm ... i am uninstalling the emacs and reinstalling it ... what version of emacs are u using 22:28:58 i am using 2.31 22:29:03 lol 22:29:10 23.1 is the latest 22:29:14 -!- konr [n=konrad@201.82.95.251] has quit [Connection timed out] 22:29:14 keepguessing: that doesn't exist 22:29:24 oops ... :) I meant 23.1 22:29:25 :P 22:30:12 I think ilisp comes with emacs these days - the guide you worked with is very outdated.. 22:31:10 try downloading a slightly older vesrion of emacs like 22.2 22:31:20 and by the way: drop clisp and use sbcl 22:31:32 and SLIME 22:31:54 but that last sugestion is based on personal preferance only, clisp is a good implemntation 22:32:01 attila_lendvai [n=ati@catv-89-134-66-143.catv.broadband.hu] has joined #lisp 22:32:41 <_deepfire> Ok, I think I found a way to reproduce the issue. 22:32:42 and slime, yes ok also but that is to make things more beautiful, for basic needs emacs+sbcl is just enough 22:32:54 mejja [n=user@c-49b6e555.023-82-73746f38.cust.bredbandsbolaget.se] has joined #lisp 22:33:00 hmm .. If I can get one working then will jump to the next ... 22:35:59 -!- cmm- [n=cmm@bzq-82-81-33-165.red.bezeqint.net] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 22:36:32 -!- faux [n=user@1-1-4-21a.gkp.gbg.bostream.se] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 22:36:53 I was just looking at XONG, the new lisp game, the game reminds me of teh 70's atari 22:37:25 who will play this game today? One needs graphics that kick ass 22:37:46 decto [n=azeaze@pdpc/supporter/student/decto] has joined #lisp 22:41:36 -!- moah [n=gnu@dslb-188-100-154-167.pools.arcor-ip.net] has quit ["Leaving"] 22:42:36 <_deepfire> Okay, sending the repro. 22:42:49 -!- Edico [n=Edico@unaffiliated/edico] has quit ["Ex-Chat"] 22:46:57 mcspiff [n=user@142.68.79.57] has joined #lisp 22:47:33 francogrex : i play interactive fiction games from day to day 22:47:43 those don't even have graphics 22:49:23 and there are IF competitions every year and dozens of releases 22:49:35 francogrex: Can you share with me your .emacs file 22:51:53 -!- joast [n=rick@76.178.178.72] has quit ["Leaving."] 22:52:28 joast [n=rick@76.178.178.72] has joined #lisp 22:53:10 knobo [n=user@90.149.4.182] has joined #lisp 22:53:28 keepguessing: sure but you have to deactive some code because I have a lot of other features such as interaction with VB and SAS codes for editing running etc 22:53:29 I realized that I tend to forget to use list*... 22:55:56 or francogrex : could you point me to a basic .emacs file online ... 23:03:04 i'm using erc in emacs; how do i send a file using dcc what is the command /dcc send ??? 23:03:38 francogrex: this it not #emacs 23:04:47 francogrex xong is really quite fun, which a game is suppose to be 23:05:06 -!- Dawgmatix [n=user@c-76-124-8-39.hsd1.nj.comcast.net] has quit [Remote closed the connection] 23:05:30 by the way on the games thing... 23:05:43 there is a interactive fiction interpreter for emacs lisp 23:05:46 Kameil [n=jjezsik@97-122-113-191.hlrn.qwest.net] has joined #lisp 23:05:52 i wonder how much difficult it would be to translate it into CL 23:06:03 -!- Kameil [n=jjezsik@97-122-113-191.hlrn.qwest.net] has left #lisp 23:06:15 francogrex: got it working :) probably there were two references to clisp in my .emacs file and since i was using an old tutorilal it was pointing to older .emacs files ... Thanks francogrex once again for your support. 23:06:25 arabesca the author of xong (dto) is thinking of doing a story based game i believe 23:06:39 keepguessing: your welcome 23:06:46 Guthur great, i love those games 23:07:15 arabesca: I doubt translating it to CL would be hard, besides the emacs-specific display and buffer manipulation code 23:07:23 you can check out #lispgames sometime if you want, nice wee lispy corner that is hopefully growing 23:07:34 Guthur: it's ok, i like such games; just comparing it to what's "on the market" now 23:08:16 are lispers publishing in peer-reviewed computer journals 23:08:24 Guthur i already have a lot of games ^^ more than i can possibly play in all my life 23:08:28 francogrex, no probs, he did design and build it (version 1.0) in 7 days, just been over 2 weeks now since he began 23:08:35 (look at http://parchment.toolness.com/ if interested) 23:08:47 you can't provide a default arguement for a method right? 23:09:14 ...of course not, that doesn't even make sense. 23:09:54 mcspiff: you can, but you can't specialise on such an argument 23:10:11 -!- rvirding [n=chatzill@h92n3c1o1034.bredband.skanova.com] has left #lisp 23:10:19 mathrick: whats the syntax for that look like? 23:10:33 mcspiff: &optional (foo default-value) 23:10:44 or &key (foo default-value) 23:11:17 mathrick: and is that done in the defmethod and the defgeneric? 23:12:00 mcspiff: yes, the lambda lists need to be congruent still, so the GF's lambda list needs to allow all any of the methods can take 23:12:04 shoafb [n=The_Doct@cpe-98-150-247-183.hawaii.res.rr.com] has joined #lisp 23:12:05 _deepfire: ping 23:12:07 -!- The_Doctor [n=The_Doct@cpe-98-150-247-183.hawaii.res.rr.com] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 23:12:21 jimi_hendrix [n=jimi_hen@unaffiliated/jimihendrix] has joined #lisp 23:12:21 mathrick: gotcha, thanks 23:12:49 mcspiff: you might want to use &allow-other-keys if you can't tell keys the methods will take 23:13:42 -!- lhz [n=shrekz@c-b9aa72d5.021-158-73746f34.cust.bredbandsbolaget.se] has quit ["Leaving"] 23:13:52 Hmmm might not be worth it if I can't specialize on the arg. Might define the method for the generic case and then wrap it in a defun with the default arg. 23:13:56 or alternatively, &allow-other-keys in methods if the GF's/other methods' lambda list specifies things you don't need 23:14:07 On another note since cliki has old articles is there any place where I can good getting started kindoff articles to ramp up on clisp or slime or sbcl ?? 23:14:12 mcspiff: aye, you can always hand-roll things 23:14:43 keepguessing: the slime video is good 23:14:43 ziga`` [n=user@BSN-176-214-61.dial-up.dsl.siol.net] has joined #lisp 23:15:11 mathrick: probably the least headache in the end 23:16:06 mathrick: where can I get it 23:16:16 keepguessing: http://common-lisp.net/project/slime/ 23:16:34 mathrick: thanks :) 23:17:34 -!- keepguessing [i=7aa75f95@gateway/web/freenode/x-lfhlfwtygoostxxf] has quit ["Page closed"] 23:18:38 when compiling sb-cga i get Symbol "REGISTER-INLINE-CONSTANT" not found in the SB-C package. 23:18:50 sigh CLOS is so...not frustrating. 23:19:03 Guthur: sb-cga? 23:19:19 -!- mrSpec [n=Spec@88.208.105.1] has quit [] 23:19:23 matrix/vector lib 23:19:32 http://github.com/nikodemus/sb-cga 23:19:38 -!- cmatei [n=cmatei@95.76.26.166] has quit [Remote closed the connection] 23:19:43 -!- maacl [n=mac@0x573526c8.virnxx17.dynamic.dsl.tele.dk] has quit [] 23:19:57 oh. For a while I thought someone was experimenting with driving *old* displays directly from CL... 23:20:00 Guthur: you need a recent SBCL. 23:20:38 1.0.29.54 and later. 23:20:38 pkhuong .29 not recent enough then? 23:20:49 umm let me check 23:20:51 -!- demmeln [n=Adium@dslb-188-099-114-037.pools.arcor-ip.net] has quit ["Leaving."] 23:21:05 -!- ikki [n=ikki@189.139.232.23] has quit [Read error: 113 (No route to host)] 23:21:43 -!- attila_lendvai [n=ati@catv-89-134-66-143.catv.broadband.hu] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 23:21:48 i suppose i'll just upgrade, *grumble* 23:22:01 1.0.30 is chock-full of floating point arithmetic optimisations which you want anyway if you're interested in sb-cga. 23:22:16 pkhuong, ok cheers 23:22:31 sigh CLOS is so...not frustrating. 23:24:35 -!- francogrex [n=user@184.88-243-81.adsl-dyn.isp.belgacom.be] has quit [Remote closed the connection] 23:26:25 sorry for the double post, not sure how i did that.. 23:28:46 -!- varjag [n=eugene@103.80-202-117.nextgentel.com] has quit ["Leaving"] 23:30:56 -!- ziga` [n=user@89.142.220.47] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 23:31:36 -!- quidnunc [n=user@bas16-montreal02-1242357050.dsl.bell.ca] has quit [Read error: 113 (No route to host)] 23:36:56 -!- jimi_hendrix [n=jimi_hen@unaffiliated/jimihendrix] has quit [Connection timed out] 23:37:47 -!- KatchaFire [n=bernie@bas33-4-88-180-245-209.fbx.proxad.net] has left #lisp 23:37:49 -!- Jabberwockey [n=jens@port-12673.pppoe.wtnet.de] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 23:40:07 -!- decto [n=azeaze@pdpc/supporter/student/decto] has quit ["Leaving"] 23:43:11 pkhuong: sbcl 1.0.33 compiled it no probs, cheers 23:43:19 -!- carlocci [n=nes@93.37.213.232] has quit ["eventually IE will rot and die"] 23:44:50 -!- hugod [n=hugod@bas1-montreal50-1279633779.dsl.bell.ca] has quit [] 23:45:37 hugod [n=hugod@bas1-montreal50-1279633779.dsl.bell.ca] has joined #lisp 23:50:44 hello 23:51:41 so i had a question about lisppaste... is it trivial to set up a bot like that on any irc channel... or is it at least doable for an individual? 23:52:04 I was hoping to do one for any general language on my irc... 23:54:54 you can ask for the lisppaste bot to be on your channel 23:57:26 and it will only spit back links from those users posting form that channel? I take it that information is passed in the url somewhere? 23:59:44 lisppaste: url 23:59:44 To use the lisppaste bot, visit http://paste.lisp.org/new/lisp and enter your paste. 23:59:51 yup, right there