":hkBst!n=hkBst@gentoo/developer/hkbst QUIT :Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)" ":jpcooper!n=justin@unaffiliated/jpcooper QUIT :Remote closed the connection" ":jfrancis!n=jfrancis@72.14.224.1 QUIT :" ":attila_lendvai!n=ati@catv-89-133-170-239.catv.broadband.hu QUIT :Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)" ":chandler!n=chandler@opendarwin/developer/chandler PRIVMSG #lisp :adicarlo: add-direct-subclass is more of a hook than a function that actually does something useful" ":chandler!n=chandler@opendarwin/developer/chandler PRIVMSG #lisp :to add a superclass for a class, use sb-mop:ensure-class" ":adicarlo!i=adam@66-234-56-82.nyc.cable.nyct.net PRIVMSG #lisp :ah, ok" ":adicarlo!i=adam@66-234-56-82.nyc.cable.nyct.net PRIVMSG #lisp :its a pickle of a situation because pkg a depends on pkg b, and I wanna make a pkg a class a superclass of pkg b, so I have to use the MOP I believe" ":chandler!n=chandler@opendarwin/developer/chandler PRIVMSG #lisp :you lost me. packages don't have anything to do with this" ":chandler!n=chandler@opendarwin/developer/chandler PRIVMSG #lisp :packages affect symbols and nothing else" ":adicarlo!i=adam@66-234-56-82.nyc.cable.nyct.net PRIVMSG #lisp :no worries -- in my example I stripped out all the pkg junk, its not important" ":chandler!n=chandler@opendarwin/developer/chandler PRIVMSG #lisp :what I'm saying is, packages wouldn't force you to use the MOP unless you needed to use it anyway" ":adicarlo!i=adam@66-234-56-82.nyc.cable.nyct.net PRIVMSG #lisp :its not so much packages as pkg dependencies" ":adicarlo!i=adam@66-234-56-82.nyc.cable.nyct.net PRIVMSG #lisp :i wanna monkey patch some fucntionality into a class in a core pkg, but only if you loaded this supplemental pkg" ":chandler!n=chandler@opendarwin/developer/chandler PRIVMSG #lisp :perhaps you should explain the situation, because the MOP is an awfully big hammer to use if you don't need it :-)" ":adicarlo!i=adam@66-234-56-82.nyc.cable.nyct.net PRIVMSG #lisp :yah i know... i've seen the dangers" ":adicarlo!i=adam@66-234-56-82.nyc.cable.nyct.net PRIVMSG #lisp :esp in some deep ruby hacking in an evil way" ":JohnnyL!i=JohnnyL@ool-182ddad4.dyn.optonline.net QUIT :Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)" ":hefner!n=hefner@c-68-50-101-139.hsd1.md.comcast.net PRIVMSG #lisp :whatever you're up to, it sounds like a bad idea :)" ":adicarlo!i=adam@66-234-56-82.nyc.cable.nyct.net PRIVMSG #lisp :hee" ":chandler!n=chandler@opendarwin/developer/chandler PRIVMSG #lisp :FYI, you can define a class with superclasses that don't exist yet." ":adicarlo!i=adam@66-234-56-82.nyc.cable.nyct.net PRIVMSG #lisp :and might never?" ":chandler!n=chandler@opendarwin/developer/chandler PRIVMSG #lisp :well, that one's a problem" ":schasi!n=schasi@p54A261EF.dip.t-dialin.net QUIT :\"Verlassend\"" ":adicarlo!i=adam@66-234-56-82.nyc.cable.nyct.net PRIVMSG #lisp :well, let me just try to figure out how this would work... (sb-mop:ensure-class 'foo :direct-superclasses (list 'bar)) ==> Control stack guard page temporarily disabled: proceed with caution" ":chandler!n=chandler@opendarwin/developer/chandler PRIVMSG #lisp :adicarlo: *that* shouldn't happen, and probably deserves a mail to sbcl-devel" ":chandler!n=chandler@opendarwin/developer/chandler PRIVMSG #lisp :but the actual problem is that you need to pass (find-class 'bar), not 'bar" ":adicarlo!i=adam@66-234-56-82.nyc.cable.nyct.net PRIVMSG #lisp :oh? I switched to a clean pkg and it seems to work ok" ":adicarlo!i=adam@66-234-56-82.nyc.cable.nyct.net PRIVMSG #lisp :let me try over again" ":chandler!n=chandler@opendarwin/developer/chandler PRIVMSG #lisp :oh really?" ":chandler!n=chandler@opendarwin/developer/chandler PRIVMSG #lisp :hey, learn something new every day" ":chandler!n=chandler@opendarwin/developer/chandler PRIVMSG #lisp :I wonder if you tried to make foo circular :-)" ":hefner!n=hefner@c-68-50-101-139.hsd1.md.comcast.net PRIVMSG #lisp :SBCL still blows up when you do that :)" ":adicarlo!i=adam@66-234-56-82.nyc.cable.nyct.net PRIVMSG #lisp :whee!" ":adicarlo!i=adam@66-234-56-82.nyc.cable.nyct.net PRIVMSG #lisp :chandler: i must have" ":chandler!n=chandler@opendarwin/developer/chandler PRIVMSG #lisp :ACTION never remembers when the MOP magically accepts class names instead of class metaobjects, and when it does not" ":adicarlo!i=adam@66-234-56-82.nyc.cable.nyct.net PRIVMSG #lisp :hee" ":bombshelter13!n=bombshel@209-161-229-68.dsl.look.ca JOIN :#lisp" ":lisppaste!n=lisppast@208.72.159.207 PRIVMSG #lisp :adicarlo annotated #69425 with \"FIXED!!\" at http://paste.lisp.org/display/69425#1" ":adicarlo!i=adam@66-234-56-82.nyc.cable.nyct.net PRIVMSG #lisp :thanks for the tip, chandler" ":chandler!n=chandler@opendarwin/developer/chandler PRIVMSG #lisp :now, explain why you're using the bazooka here :-)" ":vixey!n=witch@amcant.demon.co.uk PRIVMSG #lisp :adicarlo: you are going about this so bloody wrong I want to vomit" ":adicarlo!i=adam@66-234-56-82.nyc.cable.nyct.net PRIVMSG #lisp :well, going in to *all* the details would be hard, let me see" ":adicarlo!i=adam@66-234-56-82.nyc.cable.nyct.net PRIVMSG #lisp :oh my" ":adicarlo!i=adam@66-234-56-82.nyc.cable.nyct.net PRIVMSG #lisp :this is for a unit-test suite which is part of a utility package" ":adicarlo!i=adam@66-234-56-82.nyc.cable.nyct.net PRIVMSG #lisp :odcl is its name" ":chandler!n=chandler@opendarwin/developer/chandler PRIVMSG #lisp :vixey: stop being rude" ":adicarlo!i=adam@66-234-56-82.nyc.cable.nyct.net PRIVMSG #lisp :i have this suppplemental package call it foo-addons, which defines several method that let you do say:" ":adicarlo!i=adam@66-234-56-82.nyc.cable.nyct.net PRIVMSG #lisp :(test-http-request (make-instance 'http-transaction-valid) \"/some/url\")" ":adicarlo!i=adam@66-234-56-82.nyc.cable.nyct.net PRIVMSG #lisp :i'm trying to allow sensible unit class defaulting for each of the tests in the class" ":adicarlo!i=adam@66-234-56-82.nyc.cable.nyct.net PRIVMSG #lisp :so, given that 'self' is bound to the unit-test class, you can say:" ":adicarlo!i=adam@66-234-56-82.nyc.cable.nyct.net PRIVMSG #lisp :(test-http-request self \"/some/url\")" ":adicarlo!i=adam@66-234-56-82.nyc.cable.nyct.net PRIVMSG #lisp :anyhow so I wanted to take the basline unit-test class and put it in line of the generic dispatch" ":wchogg!n=wchogg@h216-165-145-181.mdtnwi.dsl.dynamic.tds.net JOIN :#lisp" ":Fare!n=Fare@ita4fw1.itasoftware.com QUIT :\"Leaving\"" ":adicarlo!i=adam@66-234-56-82.nyc.cable.nyct.net PRIVMSG #lisp :no need to do any of htis foolishness if we just pushed foo-addons into the odcl class, but it just brings in more dependancies that I wanna put on a utility pkg" ":adicarlo!i=adam@66-234-56-82.nyc.cable.nyct.net PRIVMSG #lisp :chandler: is that an adequate descr?" ":epoch!n=K-I-S-S@p3m/member/epoch QUIT :" ":tayssir`!n=user@ip503c4d9b.speed.planet.nl JOIN :#lisp" ":something!n=somethin@c-68-46-48-132.hsd1.nj.comcast.net JOIN :#lisp" ":chandler!n=chandler@opendarwin/developer/chandler PRIVMSG #lisp :I think so. It sounds like this is a case where you want the base class to be a generic hook that the addons package to extend." ":adicarlo!i=adam@66-234-56-82.nyc.cable.nyct.net PRIVMSG #lisp :yah" ":chandler!n=chandler@opendarwin/developer/chandler PRIVMSG #lisp :Well, using ENSURE-CLASS to add another superclass isn't the worst way of going about that, if you think there will be other things hooking onto that." ":chandler!n=chandler@opendarwin/developer/chandler PRIVMSG #lisp :If you just want to reserve a space for the addons to extend, put a simple empty mixin in the superclass list in the base package, and let the addons package redefine that mixin" ":adicarlo!i=adam@66-234-56-82.nyc.cable.nyct.net PRIVMSG #lisp :oooh" ":Buganini!n=buganini@cnmc12.hs.ntnu.edu.tw QUIT :Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)" ":something!n=somethin@c-68-46-48-132.hsd1.nj.comcast.net PRIVMSG #lisp :I'm using sbcl, is there a way for a lisp program to accept command arguments? I googled around and seems like *args* is what I want, but when I tried to use it, it says *args* is unbound." ":adicarlo!i=adam@66-234-56-82.nyc.cable.nyct.net PRIVMSG #lisp :something: sbcl --eval \"(foo)\"" ":adicarlo!i=adam@66-234-56-82.nyc.cable.nyct.net PRIVMSG #lisp :something: i don't think sbcl exposes ARGV per se" ":Athas!n=athas@0x50a157d6.alb2nxx15.dynamic.dsl.tele.dk QUIT :Remote closed the connection" ":chandler!n=chandler@opendarwin/developer/chandler PRIVMSG #lisp :adicarlo: Sure it does." ":chandler!n=chandler@opendarwin/developer/chandler PRIVMSG #lisp :something: http://www.sbcl.org/manual/Command_002dline-arguments.html" ":adicarlo!i=adam@66-234-56-82.nyc.cable.nyct.net PRIVMSG #lisp :ah... i was just wondering if I was wrong or right there thanks" ":something!n=somethin@c-68-46-48-132.hsd1.nj.comcast.net PRIVMSG #lisp :chandler: thanks!" ":tayssir!n=user@ip503c4d9b.speed.planet.nl QUIT :Read error: 60 (Operation timed out)" ":adicarlo!i=adam@66-234-56-82.nyc.cable.nyct.net PRIVMSG #lisp :sbcl is pretty cool" ":adicarlo!i=adam@66-234-56-82.nyc.cable.nyct.net PRIVMSG #lisp :altho I find the runtime vs toplevel options rather odd" ":something!n=somethin@c-68-46-48-132.hsd1.nj.comcast.net PRIVMSG #lisp :just to avoid confusion what you are passing the args to." ":something!n=somethin@c-68-46-48-132.hsd1.nj.comcast.net PRIVMSG #lisp :at least that's what the docs said." ":prip!n=_prip@host12-122-dynamic.32-79-r.retail.telecomitalia.it QUIT :Nick collision from services." ":chandler!n=chandler@opendarwin/developer/chandler PRIVMSG #lisp :I'm not sure what the reason is for confusing the user with the distinction between the two is." ":prip!n=_prip@host197-197-dynamic.17-79-r.retail.telecomitalia.it JOIN :#lisp" ":adicarlo!i=adam@66-234-56-82.nyc.cable.nyct.net PRIVMSG #lisp :its very odd, IMHO" ":adicarlo!i=adam@66-234-56-82.nyc.cable.nyct.net PRIVMSG #lisp :making matters perhaps worse, if you badly mix runtime and toplevel options, you don't get a warning, just the options inthe wrong place are ignored" ":something!n=somethin@c-68-46-48-132.hsd1.nj.comcast.net QUIT :" ":epoch!n=K-I-S-S@p3m/member/epoch JOIN :#lisp" ":foom!n=jknight@ita4fw1.itasoftware.com PRIVMSG #lisp :well, the supposed reason is that you can replace the toplevel, and then do your own toplevel arg parsing." ":foom!n=jknight@ita4fw1.itasoftware.com PRIVMSG #lisp :I agree though that it's not a very good idea. :)" ":rottcodd_!n=user@ppp59-167-47-200.lns2.cbr1.internode.on.net QUIT :Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)" ":jtoy!n=jtoy@58.63.218.55 JOIN :#lisp" ":something!n=somethin@c-68-46-48-132.hsd1.nj.comcast.net JOIN :#lisp" ":jtoy!n=jtoy@58.63.218.55 QUIT :Client Quit" ":hefner!n=hefner@c-68-50-101-139.hsd1.md.comcast.net PRIVMSG #lisp :hmm. billc's blog doesn't allow comments?" ":sctb!n=sebell@S01060016cbc2d41a.cg.shawcable.net QUIT :Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)" ":qbg!n=qbg@rn084084.morris.umn.edu QUIT :Remote closed the connection" ":bombshelter13!n=bombshel@209-161-229-68.dsl.look.ca QUIT :" ":c|mell!n=cmell@v113243.ppp.asahi-net.or.jp QUIT :\"cyas\"" ":bombshelter13!n=bombshel@209-161-229-68.dsl.look.ca JOIN :#lisp" ":syamajala!n=syamajal@140.232.178.248 JOIN :#lisp" ":syamajala!n=syamajal@140.232.178.248 PRIVMSG #lisp :is there no way to search planet lisp?" ":bpt!n=bpt@cpe-071-070-209-067.nc.res.rr.com JOIN :#lisp" ":stassats`!n=stassats@wikipedia/stassats PRIVMSG #lisp :google?" ":ahaas!n=ahaas@c-76-17-41-185.hsd1.ga.comcast.net PRIVMSG #lisp :syamajala: google site:http://planet.lisp.org/" ":Bzek!n=SK_sj@mcc-dyn-30-162.kosnet.ru QUIT :\".\"" ":syamajala!n=syamajal@140.232.178.248 PRIVMSG #lisp :ok" ":chandler!n=chandler@opendarwin/developer/chandler PRIVMSG #lisp :Is anyone else unable to load http://www.common-lisp.net/ ?" ":dthomp!n=dat@c-24-21-28-103.hsd1.or.comcast.net QUIT :Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)" ":chandler!n=chandler@opendarwin/developer/chandler PRIVMSG #lisp :Oh, there it goes. Slooow!" ":bpt!n=bpt@cpe-071-070-209-067.nc.res.rr.com QUIT :Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)" ":bpt!n=bpt@cpe-071-070-209-067.nc.res.rr.com JOIN :#lisp" ":syamajala!n=syamajal@140.232.178.248 PRIVMSG #lisp :i'm trying to figure out how to add multiple lisp implementations to my .emacs" ":chandler!n=chandler@opendarwin/developer/chandler PRIVMSG #lisp :I tried using slime-lisp-implementations, but I found it to be very difficult to use." ":jtoy!n=jtoy@58.61.221.101 JOIN :#lisp" ":syamajala!n=syamajal@140.232.178.248 PRIVMSG #lisp :i remember seeing something on planet lisp that had a good way of doing it but the page isn't working anymore" ":pkhuong!n=pkhuong@modemcable125.83-81-70.mc.videotron.ca PRIVMSG #lisp :i change inferior-lisp-program." ":stassats`!n=stassats@wikipedia/stassats PRIVMSG #lisp :i have several functions like (defun sbcl () (interactive) (slime \"sbcl\"))" ":Odin-!n=sbkhh@s121-302.gardur.hi.is QUIT :" ":lemonodor_!n=lemonodo@66.43.112.62 JOIN :#lisp" ":lemonodor_!n=lemonodo@66.43.112.62 QUIT :Client Quit" ":echo-area!n=user@cmdev1.test.cnz.alimama.com JOIN :#lisp" ":syamajala!n=syamajal@140.232.178.248 PRIVMSG #lisp :if you install something with asdf can you can share it between lisps or do you need two separate copies?" ":ManateeLazyCat!n=Andy@222.212.129.186 JOIN :#lisp" ":rtoym!n=chatzill@user-0c8hpll.cable.mindspring.com JOIN :#lisp" ":ahaas!n=ahaas@c-76-17-41-185.hsd1.ga.comcast.net PRIVMSG #lisp :syamajala: Do you mean asdf-install? If the package is portable among those lisps, then yes, but you can't share fasls." ":syamajala!n=syamajal@140.232.178.248 PRIVMSG #lisp :yeah i meant sharing fasls" ":syamajala!n=syamajal@140.232.178.248 PRIVMSG #lisp :because i'm trying to setup sbcl and openmcl side by side" ":ahaas!n=ahaas@c-76-17-41-185.hsd1.ga.comcast.net PRIVMSG #lisp :You can't share fasls between multiple versions of SBCL." ":syamajala!n=syamajal@140.232.178.248 PRIVMSG #lisp :but it looks like openmcl is 64bit only on intel systems running os x" ":syamajala!n=syamajal@140.232.178.248 PRIVMSG #lisp :and uffi doesn't seem to work" ":ahaas!n=ahaas@c-76-17-41-185.hsd1.ga.comcast.net PRIVMSG #lisp :syamajala: I don't know the best method for working with mult. lisps, though." ":syamajala!n=syamajal@140.232.178.248 PRIVMSG #lisp :ok" ":rme!n=rme@pool-70-104-127-61.chi.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #lisp :sbcl and ccl use different fasl extensions, so it should be ok to use the same copy of the library sources with both lisps, I would think." ":madnificent!n=user@83.101.62.132 QUIT :Remote closed the connection" ":bombshelter13!n=bombshel@209-161-229-68.dsl.look.ca QUIT :\"Where is the glory in complying with demands?\"" ":derekv!n=derek@noogenesis.resnet.mtu.edu JOIN :#lisp" ":ahaas!n=ahaas@c-76-17-41-185.hsd1.ga.comcast.net QUIT :\"leaving\"" ":ahaas!n=ahaas@c-76-17-41-185.hsd1.ga.comcast.net JOIN :#lisp" ":lemonodor!n=lemonodo@66.43.112.62 QUIT :Read error: 113 (No route to host)" ":mrsolo!n=mrsolo@nat/yahoo/x-3b775b5bf39dd083 QUIT :\"Leaving\"" ":_schulte_!n=Eric@ip98-169-93-242.dc.dc.cox.net JOIN :#lisp" ":jewel!n=jewel@dsl-242-166-102.telkomadsl.co.za QUIT :Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)" ":x6j8x!n=x6j8x@77.21.43.186 QUIT :Read error: 60 (Operation timed out)" ":ths_!n=ths@X5f28.x.pppool.de JOIN :#lisp" ":syamajala!n=syamajal@140.232.178.248 QUIT :" ":x6j8x!n=x6j8x@77.21.43.186 JOIN :#lisp" ":lemonodor!n=lemonodo@adsl-76-214-15-172.dsl.lsan03.sbcglobal.net JOIN :#lisp" ":_schulte_!n=Eric@ip98-169-93-242.dc.dc.cox.net QUIT :Remote closed the connection" ":_schulte_!n=Eric@ip98-169-93-242.dc.dc.cox.net JOIN :#lisp" ":chandler!n=chandler@opendarwin/developer/chandler PRIVMSG #lisp :minion: memo for syamajala: Look up asdf-binary-locations if you want to share libraries between multiple lisps, or even multiple versions of the same lisp." ":minion!n=minion@208.72.159.207 PRIVMSG #lisp :Remembered. I'll tell syamajala when he/she/it next speaks." ":ManateeLazyCat!n=Andy@222.212.129.186 QUIT :Remote closed the connection" ":b4|hraban!n=b4@0brg.xs4all.nl QUIT :Remote closed the connection" ":ths!n=ths@X769c.x.pppool.de QUIT :Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)" ":something!n=somethin@c-68-46-48-132.hsd1.nj.comcast.net QUIT :" ":fisxoj!n=fisxoj@149.43.108.7 QUIT :Remote closed the connection" ":epoch!n=K-I-S-S@p3m/member/epoch QUIT :" ":something!n=somethin@c-68-46-48-132.hsd1.nj.comcast.net JOIN :#lisp" ":sellout!n=greg@c-24-128-50-176.hsd1.ma.comcast.net JOIN :#lisp" ":ug!n=merlin@64.47.164.86 QUIT :\"Terminal ran away with the spoon\"" ":qbg!n=qbg@rn084084.morris.umn.edu JOIN :#lisp" ":_schulte_!n=Eric@ip98-169-93-242.dc.dc.cox.net PRIVMSG #lisp :can anyone recommend a good weblocks tutorial" ":_schulte_!n=Eric@ip98-169-93-242.dc.dc.cox.net PRIVMSG #lisp :also, would be happy for any recommendations as to a good lisp web framework for someone (like me) with some lisp experience, but no lisp web-dev experience" ":qbg!n=qbg@rn084084.morris.umn.edu PRIVMSG #lisp :_schulte_: What are you looking for in a web framework?" ":_schulte_!n=Eric@ip98-169-93-242.dc.dc.cox.net PRIVMSG #lisp :something that allows for modular development" ":_schulte_!n=Eric@ip98-169-93-242.dc.dc.cox.net PRIVMSG #lisp :don't need a database backend" ":jso!n=user@151.159.200.15 QUIT :Read error: 113 (No route to host)" ":_schulte_!n=Eric@ip98-169-93-242.dc.dc.cox.net PRIVMSG #lisp :preferably fairly simple (at least for smaller projects)" ":_schulte_!n=Eric@ip98-169-93-242.dc.dc.cox.net PRIVMSG #lisp :I've really enjoyed using lisp for writing emacs extensions, and I'd like to be able to start using lisp for some of the small web-scripts that I need to write from time to time" ":rme!n=rme@pool-70-104-127-61.chi.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #lisp :_schulte_: hunchentoot alone might be perfectly adequate, then." ":bashyal!n=bashyal@208.42.136.59 JOIN :#lisp" ":_schulte_!n=Eric@ip98-169-93-242.dc.dc.cox.net PRIVMSG #lisp :rme: any pointer for getting started?" ":something_!n=somethin@c-68-46-48-132.hsd1.nj.comcast.net JOIN :#lisp" ":tltstc`!n=nine@192.207.69.1 QUIT :" ":qbg!n=qbg@rn084084.morris.umn.edu PRIVMSG #lisp :_schulte_: The example that comes with hunchentoot is good at showing how the various features work" ":_schulte_!n=Eric@ip98-169-93-242.dc.dc.cox.net PRIVMSG #lisp :rme: thanks" ":rme!n=rme@pool-70-104-127-61.chi.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #lisp :thank qbg" ":qbg!n=qbg@rn084084.morris.umn.edu PRIVMSG #lisp :Also, take a look at this section in the documentation: http://www.weitz.de/hunchentoot/#example" ":_schulte_!n=Eric@ip98-169-93-242.dc.dc.cox.net PRIVMSG #lisp :too many short names" ":_schulte_!n=Eric@ip98-169-93-242.dc.dc.cox.net PRIVMSG #lisp :qbg: thanks" ":_schulte_!n=Eric@ip98-169-93-242.dc.dc.cox.net PRIVMSG #lisp :reading that right now" ":bashyal!n=bashyal@208.42.136.59 QUIT :" ":_schulte_!n=Eric@ip98-169-93-242.dc.dc.cox.net QUIT :\"out\"" ":xMilesTegx!n=Spune@c-69-137-224-211.hsd1.va.comcast.net QUIT :\"Snak 5.3.3 IRC For Macintosh - http://www.snak.com\"" ":pstickne!n=pstickne@c-71-236-177-238.hsd1.wa.comcast.net JOIN :#lisp" ":timor!n=icke@port-87-234-97-27.dynamic.qsc.de JOIN :#lisp" ":something!n=somethin@c-68-46-48-132.hsd1.nj.comcast.net QUIT :Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)" ":binarycodes!n=sujoy@59.93.192.230 QUIT :Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)" ":echo-area!n=user@cmdev1.test.cnz.alimama.com QUIT :Remote closed the connection" ":vixey!n=witch@amcant.demon.co.uk QUIT :\"Leaving\"" ":ghost77!n=the7thgh@c8u.is.edu.ro QUIT :" ":_sohail_!n=Sohail@d207-81-121-15.bchsia.telus.net JOIN :#lisp" ":sohail!n=Sohail@unaffiliated/sohail QUIT :Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)" ":haiwei!n=haiwei@192.9.202.3 JOIN :#lisp" ":derekv!n=derek@noogenesis.resnet.mtu.edu QUIT :Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)" ":radetsky!n=dan@adsl-76-212-8-201.dsl.pltn13.sbcglobal.net QUIT :\"leaving\"" ":rtoym!n=chatzill@user-0c8hpll.cable.mindspring.com QUIT :\"ChatZilla 0.9.83 [Firefox 3.0.3/2008092414]\"" ":Jasko2!n=tjasko@c-98-235-21-22.hsd1.pa.comcast.net QUIT :\"Leaving\"" ":defn_!i=tao@gateway/shell/blinkenshell.org/x-42fc70c071c06f11 NICK :defn" ":c|mell!n=cmell@61.121.210.70 JOIN :#lisp" ":hugo!n=hugo@unaffiliated/hugo QUIT :Remote closed the connection" ":Modius!n=Modius@ppp-70-244-122-30.dsl.austtx.swbell.net JOIN :#lisp" ":dthomp!n=dat@71.237.217.129 JOIN :#lisp" ":dialtone!n=dialtone@adsl-99-136-101-166.dsl.pltn13.sbcglobal.net QUIT :\"leaving\"" ":eno!n=eno@nslu2-linux/eno JOIN :#lisp" ":fisxoj!n=fisxoj@149.43.108.7 JOIN :#lisp" ":gigamonkey!n=user@adsl-99-169-83-0.dsl.pltn13.sbcglobal.net JOIN :#lisp" ":lanstin!n=lanstin@adsl-70-137-155-207.dsl.snfc21.sbcglobal.net JOIN :#lisp" ":|Soulman|!n=kvirc@132.80-202-239.nextgentel.com JOIN :#lisp" ":Adamant!n=Adamant@unaffiliated/adamant QUIT :" ":schme!n=marcus@c83-254-190-108.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #lisp :mornin'" ":qbg!n=qbg@rn084084.morris.umn.edu PRIVMSG #lisp :morning" ":schme!n=marcus@c83-254-190-108.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #lisp :Thursdays. Wonderful days for lisping :)" ":ushdf!n=ushdf@syru217-183.syr.edu PRIVMSG #lisp :thursdays are the worst days to lisp" ":ushdf!n=ushdf@syru217-183.syr.edu PRIVMSG #lisp :he's a scheme infiltrator!" ":elurin!n=user@81.213.203.109 QUIT :Read error: 60 (Operation timed out)" ":ushdf!n=ushdf@syru217-183.syr.edu PRIVMSG #lisp :kill him!!!" ":qbg!n=qbg@rn084084.morris.umn.edu PRIVMSG #lisp :Scheme is just another example that lisp-like languages evolve towards CL :p" ":lanstin!n=lanstin@adsl-70-137-155-207.dsl.snfc21.sbcglobal.net QUIT :" ":Modius!n=Modius@ppp-70-244-122-30.dsl.austtx.swbell.net QUIT :Connection reset by peer" ":timor!n=icke@port-87-234-97-27.dynamic.qsc.de QUIT :Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)" ":pkhuong!n=pkhuong@modemcable125.83-81-70.mc.videotron.ca PRIVMSG #lisp :with R6RS, devolve might be a better word " ":aja!n=aja@S01060018f3ab066e.ed.shawcable.net JOIN :#lisp" ":lanstin!n=lanstin@adsl-70-137-155-207.dsl.snfc21.sbcglobal.net JOIN :#lisp" ":sellout!n=greg@c-24-128-50-176.hsd1.ma.comcast.net QUIT :" ":lanstin!n=lanstin@adsl-70-137-155-207.dsl.snfc21.sbcglobal.net QUIT :Client Quit" ":creddy!n=CrazyEdd@220-253-146-88.VIC.netspace.net.au QUIT :Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)" ":creddy_!n=CrazyEdd@220-253-146-88.VIC.netspace.net.au JOIN :#lisp" ":something_!n=somethin@c-68-46-48-132.hsd1.nj.comcast.net QUIT :" ":aquateen!n=chris@c-71-231-10-116.hsd1.wa.comcast.net JOIN :#lisp" ":creddy_!n=CrazyEdd@220-253-146-88.VIC.netspace.net.au NICK :creddy" ":Soulman!n=kvirc@153.84-49-150.nextgentel.com QUIT :Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)" ":schme!n=marcus@c83-254-190-108.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #lisp :ushdf: I am?" ":schme!n=marcus@c83-254-190-108.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #lisp :ushdf: That's weird. I just got started with scheme like last week." ":ivanst_!i=ivans@93-138-67-93.adsl.net.t-com.hr QUIT :Read error: 60 (Operation timed out)" ":ivanst_!i=ivans@93-138-67-93.adsl.net.t-com.hr JOIN :#lisp" ":dthomp!n=dat@71.237.217.129 QUIT :Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)" ":ushdf!n=ushdf@syru217-183.syr.edu PRIVMSG #lisp :you don't get to do after you troll" ":ushdf!n=ushdf@syru217-183.syr.edu PRIVMSG #lisp :we'll judge that from your subsequent actions" ":drewc!n=drewc@89.16.166.162 PRIVMSG #lisp :ushdf: lest ye be judged" ":pkhuong!n=pkhuong@modemcable125.83-81-70.mc.videotron.ca PRIVMSG #lisp :ushdf: thanks for the insight." ":mikezor_!n=mikael@c-a388e253.04-404-7570701.cust.bredbandsbolaget.se JOIN :#lisp" ":sellout!n=greg@c-24-128-50-176.hsd1.ma.comcast.net JOIN :#lisp" ":ushdf!n=ushdf@syru217-183.syr.edu PRIVMSG #lisp :anytime" ":schme!n=marcus@c83-254-190-108.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #lisp :ushdf: So what is the best day for lisping?" ":aja!n=aja@S01060018f3ab066e.ed.shawcable.net PRIVMSG #lisp :I'd say thaturday" ":schme!n=marcus@c83-254-190-108.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #lisp :?" ":schme!n=marcus@c83-254-190-108.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #lisp :I personally like Monday on to and throughout Sunday." ":schme!n=marcus@c83-254-190-108.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #lisp :so about 7 days / week" ":birdsbite!n=user@75.110.164.248 QUIT :Remote closed the connection" ":photon2!n=photon@unaffiliated/photon JOIN :#lisp" ":binarycodes!n=sujoy@59.93.247.184 JOIN :#lisp" ":qbg!n=qbg@rn084084.morris.umn.edu QUIT :Remote closed the connection" ":mikezor!n=mikael@c-a388e253.04-404-7570701.cust.bredbandsbolaget.se QUIT :Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)" ":epoch!n=K-I-S-S@p3m/member/epoch JOIN :#lisp" ":binarycodes!n=sujoy@59.93.247.184 QUIT :\"WeeChat 0.2.6\"" ":photon!n=photon@unaffiliated/photon QUIT :Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)" ":slyrus_!n=slyrus@adsl-68-121-172-169.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net JOIN :#lisp" ":patmatch!n=wmbot@dsl093-216-036.aus1.dsl.speakeasy.net QUIT :Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)" ":lemoinem!n=swoog@modemcable125.83-81-70.mc.videotron.ca QUIT :Remote closed the connection" ":lemoinem!n=swoog@modemcable125.83-81-70.mc.videotron.ca JOIN :#lisp" ":ace4016!i=ace4016@cpe-76-168-248-118.socal.res.rr.com JOIN :#lisp" ":|Soulman|!n=kvirc@132.80-202-239.nextgentel.com QUIT :Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)" ":Soulman!n=kvirc@132.80-202-239.nextgentel.com JOIN :#lisp" ":Modius!n=Modius@ppp-70-244-122-30.dsl.austtx.swbell.net JOIN :#lisp" ":benny`!n=benny@i577A0084.versanet.de JOIN :#lisp" ":slyrus_!n=slyrus@adsl-68-121-172-169.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net PRIVMSG #lisp :yeah. my lzw implementation finally works on long files." ":fisxoj!n=fisxoj@149.43.108.7 PART #lisp :\"Ex-Chat\"" ":lukego!n=lukegorr@cpe-76-87-84-57.socal.res.rr.com JOIN :#lisp" ":pkhuong!n=pkhuong@modemcable125.83-81-70.mc.videotron.ca PRIVMSG #lisp :slyrus_: can you test it on an sbcl core some time?" ":lisppaste!n=lisppast@208.72.159.207 PRIVMSG #lisp :lukego pasted \"a glimpse of the state of the art in video driver development\" at http://paste.lisp.org/display/69434" ":lukego!n=lukegorr@cpe-76-87-84-57.socal.res.rr.com PRIVMSG #lisp :shoot me now" ":O_4!n=souchan@ip-118-90-15-177.xdsl.xnet.co.nz JOIN :#lisp" ":slyrus_!n=slyrus@adsl-68-121-172-169.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net PRIVMSG #lisp :(cons (length *sbcl-core*) (length *sbcl-core-lzw*))" ":slyrus_!n=slyrus@adsl-68-121-172-169.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net PRIVMSG #lisp :(26325020 . 13032497)" ":pkhuong!n=pkhuong@modemcable125.83-81-70.mc.videotron.ca PRIVMSG #lisp :slyrus_: how much time? It could save some time when shooting partial heaps across the network (:" ":epoch!n=K-I-S-S@p3m/member/epoch QUIT :" ":slyrus_!n=slyrus@adsl-68-121-172-169.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net PRIVMSG #lisp :pkhuong: I have done no performance optimization whatsoever, so don't laugh at the shitty performance" ":pkhuong!n=pkhuong@modemcable125.83-81-70.mc.videotron.ca PRIVMSG #lisp :I'll wait for 0.0.1 then!" ":beach!n=user@ABordeaux-158-1-73-156.w90-60.abo.wanadoo.fr PRIVMSG #lisp :Good morning." ":slyrus_!n=slyrus@adsl-68-121-172-169.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net PRIVMSG #lisp :62.913 seconds of real time" ":slyrus_!n=slyrus@adsl-68-121-172-169.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net PRIVMSG #lisp :2,964,914,776 bytes consed" ":slyrus_!n=slyrus@adsl-68-121-172-169.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net PRIVMSG #lisp :morning beach" ":slyrus_!n=slyrus@adsl-68-121-172-169.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net PRIVMSG #lisp :but, hey, at least the decoded and original cores match :)" ":pkhuong!n=pkhuong@modemcable125.83-81-70.mc.videotron.ca PRIVMSG #lisp :slyrus_: and that's how we can know you're not a C programmer" ":slyrus_!n=slyrus@adsl-68-121-172-169.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net PRIVMSG #lisp :because they match or because it's slow?" ":pkhuong!n=pkhuong@modemcable125.83-81-70.mc.videotron.ca PRIVMSG #lisp :both" ":slyrus_!n=slyrus@adsl-68-121-172-169.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net PRIVMSG #lisp :heh" ":slyrus_!n=slyrus@adsl-68-121-172-169.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net PRIVMSG #lisp :yeah, the real world tiff files out there probably don't conform to the spec :)" ":ushdf!n=ushdf@syru217-183.syr.edu PRIVMSG #lisp :your tiffs are lies" ":ushdf!n=ushdf@syru217-183.syr.edu PRIVMSG #lisp :the bitmap was the true way" ":ushdf!n=ushdf@syru217-183.syr.edu PRIVMSG #lisp :the compressionistic heathens will repent in their ways" ":benny!n=benny@i577A0ADD.versanet.de QUIT :No route to host" ":tiesje!n=user@202.51.72.181 JOIN :#lisp" ":mikezor_!n=mikael@c-a388e253.04-404-7570701.cust.bredbandsbolaget.se QUIT :clarke.freenode.net irc.freenode.net" ":pinterface!n=pixel@knvl-static-09-0024.dsl.iowatelecom.net JOIN :#lisp" ":ushdf!n=ushdf@syru217-183.syr.edu PART #lisp :" ":mikezor_!n=mikael@c-a388e253.04-404-7570701.cust.bredbandsbolaget.se JOIN :#lisp" ":O_4_!n=souchan@ip-118-90-77-116.xdsl.xnet.co.nz JOIN :#lisp" ":slyrus_!n=slyrus@adsl-68-121-172-169.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net PRIVMSG #lisp :I'm guessing this equalp hash-table is rather slow" ":enn_!i=eli@ahab.flyoverblues.com JOIN :#lisp" ":enn!i=eli@ahab.flyoverblues.com QUIT :Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)" ":billc!n=user@S0106001b63f442be.vn.shawcable.net JOIN :#lisp" ":billc!n=user@S0106001b63f442be.vn.shawcable.net PART #lisp :\"ERC Version 5.2 (IRC client for Emacs)\"" ":kij!n=user@x1-6-00-0c-f6-20-8c-57.k102.webspeed.dk QUIT :Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)" ":existentialmonk!n=carcdr@64.252.13.228 QUIT :Remote closed the connection" ":lukego!n=lukegorr@cpe-76-87-84-57.socal.res.rr.com QUIT :Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)" ":me-so-stupid!n=semka@77.236.84.166 JOIN :#lisp" ":impulse32!n=impulse@CPE001195396746-CM001ac3167610.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com JOIN :#lisp" ":O_4!n=souchan@ip-118-90-15-177.xdsl.xnet.co.nz QUIT :Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)" ":pinterface1!n=pixel@knvl-static-09-0024.dsl.iowatelecom.net QUIT :Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)" ":topo!n=topo@200.37.161.41 JOIN :#lisp" ":tic!n=tic@c83-249-197-248.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #lisp :yawn. morning." ":pstickne!n=pstickne@c-71-236-177-238.hsd1.wa.comcast.net QUIT :\"Leaving\"" ":beach!n=user@ABordeaux-158-1-73-156.w90-60.abo.wanadoo.fr PRIVMSG #lisp :hello tic" ":x6j8x!n=x6j8x@77.21.43.186 QUIT :" ":x6j8x!n=x6j8x@77.21.43.186 JOIN :#lisp" ":tayssir``!n=user@ip503c4d9b.speed.planet.nl JOIN :#lisp" ":tayssir`!n=user@ip503c4d9b.speed.planet.nl QUIT :Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)" ":mikezor_!n=mikael@c-a388e253.04-404-7570701.cust.bredbandsbolaget.se QUIT :clarke.freenode.net irc.freenode.net" ":mikezor_!n=mikael@c-a388e253.04-404-7570701.cust.bredbandsbolaget.se JOIN :#lisp" ":ivansto!i=ivans@93-138-0-14.adsl.net.t-com.hr JOIN :#lisp" ":ivanst_!i=ivans@93-138-67-93.adsl.net.t-com.hr QUIT :Read error: 60 (Operation timed out)" ":tic!n=tic@c83-249-197-248.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #lisp :hi, beach." ":mikezor_!n=mikael@c-a388e253.04-404-7570701.cust.bredbandsbolaget.se QUIT :clarke.freenode.net irc.freenode.net" ":mikezor_!n=mikael@c-a388e253.04-404-7570701.cust.bredbandsbolaget.se JOIN :#lisp" ":x6j8x!n=x6j8x@77.21.43.186 QUIT :" ":rottcodd!n=user@ppp59-167-52-95.lns1.cbr1.internode.on.net JOIN :#lisp" ":seelenquell_!n=seelenqu@pD9E47023.dip.t-dialin.net JOIN :#lisp" ":epoch!n=K-I-S-S@p3m/member/epoch JOIN :#lisp" ":tic!n=tic@c83-249-197-248.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #lisp :So, anyone doing presentations at ILC09?" ":jtoy!n=jtoy@58.61.221.101 QUIT :Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)" ":topo!n=topo@200.37.161.41 QUIT :Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)" ":beach!n=user@ABordeaux-158-1-73-156.w90-60.abo.wanadoo.fr PRIVMSG #lisp :I don't I got an answer to my question yesterday, so I'll ask it again: nikodemus made an argument in favor of setf expanders rather than (setf ...) function, but (setf ...) functions can be #'applied. Is there anything in the CLHS that prevents having both for a particular accessor function?" ":boyscared!n=bm3719@c-69-143-195-98.hsd1.va.comcast.net QUIT :\"leaving\"" ":beach!n=user@ABordeaux-158-1-73-156.w90-60.abo.wanadoo.fr PRIVMSG #lisp :*I don't think I got" ":seelenquell!n=seelenqu@pD9E47FE4.dip.t-dialin.net QUIT :Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)" ":boyscared!n=bm3719@c-69-143-195-98.hsd1.va.comcast.net JOIN :#lisp" ":tic!n=tic@c83-249-197-248.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #lisp :so does d-s-e wrap its original function? (it would seem so because macros are allowed)" ":beach!n=user@ABordeaux-158-1-73-156.w90-60.abo.wanadoo.fr PRIVMSG #lisp :what do you mean by \"wrap its original function\"?" ":tic!n=tic@c83-249-197-248.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #lisp :the access-fn you pass to d-s-e. But I really do not know enough about it to say anything. Just guessing wildly." ":beach!n=user@ABordeaux-158-1-73-156.w90-60.abo.wanadoo.fr PRIVMSG #lisp :tic: I think that's just a symbol." ":tic!n=tic@c83-249-197-248.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #lisp :Alright." ":tcr!n=tcr@host145.natpool.mwn.de JOIN :#lisp" ":tic!n=tic@c83-249-197-248.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #lisp :morning tcr." ":beach!n=user@ABordeaux-158-1-73-156.w90-60.abo.wanadoo.fr PRIVMSG #lisp :correct me if I am wrong: For ordinary (not generic) functions, the ability to use #'funcall or #'apply on (setf ...) is not terribly useful, but for generic functions, it's a great advantage to be able to write :before, :after, and :around methods." ":pkhuong!n=pkhuong@modemcable125.83-81-70.mc.videotron.ca PRIVMSG #lisp :beach: i don't see anything obvious either. The setf function just won't be used if a setf expander has been defined." ":beach!n=user@ABordeaux-158-1-73-156.w90-60.abo.wanadoo.fr PRIVMSG #lisp :pkhuong: That was my impression. Thanks!" ":amnesiac!n=amnesiac@p3m/member/Amnesiac QUIT :\"Leaving\"" ":icylisper!n=icylispe@61.12.19.50 JOIN :#lisp" ":lyte!n=lyte@unaffiliated/neerolyte JOIN :#lisp" ":tcr!n=tcr@host145.natpool.mwn.de PRIVMSG #lisp :beach: Why do you want to use both? Perhaps a compiler macro on the setf function would be a better choice." ":milanj!n=milan@93.86.112.88 QUIT :\"Leaving\"" ":pinterface1!n=pixel@knvl-static-09-0024.dsl.iowatelecom.net JOIN :#lisp" ":rme!n=rme@pool-70-104-127-61.chi.dsl-w.verizon.net QUIT :" ":BrianRice!n=water@c-98-225-51-174.hsd1.wa.comcast.net QUIT :" ":puchacz!n=puchacz@87-194-5-99.bethere.co.uk JOIN :#lisp" ":_sohail_!n=Sohail@d207-81-121-15.bchsia.telus.net QUIT :Client Quit" ":O_4_!n=souchan@ip-118-90-77-116.xdsl.xnet.co.nz QUIT :" ":_Jordan_!n=chatzill@69.169.139.178.provo.static.broadweave.net JOIN :#lisp" ":Bzek!n=SK_sj@mcc-dyn-17-237.kosnet.ru JOIN :#lisp" ":pinterface2!n=pixel@knvl-static-09-0024.dsl.iowatelecom.net JOIN :#lisp" ":sohail!n=Sohail@unaffiliated/sohail JOIN :#lisp" ":pinterface!n=pixel@knvl-static-09-0024.dsl.iowatelecom.net QUIT :Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)" ":pinterface2!n=pixel@knvl-static-09-0024.dsl.iowatelecom.net QUIT :Client Quit" ":pinterface!n=pixel@knvl-static-09-0024.dsl.iowatelecom.net JOIN :#lisp" ":O_4!n=souchan@ip-118-90-77-116.xdsl.xnet.co.nz JOIN :#lisp" ":VityokOrgUa!n=user@193.109.118.130 JOIN :#lisp" ":beach!n=user@ABordeaux-158-1-73-156.w90-60.abo.wanadoo.fr PRIVMSG #lisp :tcr: nikodemus explained why: http://random-state.net/log/3395558471.html" ":Bzek!n=SK_sj@mcc-dyn-17-237.kosnet.ru QUIT :Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)" ":pinterface1!n=pixel@knvl-static-09-0024.dsl.iowatelecom.net QUIT :Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)" ":cracki!n=cracki@sglty.kawo2.RWTH-Aachen.DE JOIN :#lisp" ":gigamonkey!n=user@adsl-99-169-83-0.dsl.pltn13.sbcglobal.net QUIT :Remote closed the connection" ":rudi_!n=rudi@z118l194.static.ctm.net JOIN :#lisp" ":tcr!n=tcr@host145.natpool.mwn.de QUIT :Remote closed the connection" ":rudi_!n=rudi@z118l194.static.ctm.net NICK :rudi" ":MHOOO!n=nah@3-007.vpn.RWTH-Aachen.DE JOIN :#lisp" ":_Jordan_!n=chatzill@69.169.139.178.provo.static.broadweave.net QUIT :Remote closed the connection" ":pinterface!n=pixel@knvl-static-09-0024.dsl.iowatelecom.net QUIT :Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)" ":pinterface!n=pixel@knvl-static-09-0024.dsl.iowatelecom.net JOIN :#lisp" ":Ijeroj__!n=nah@u-7-123.vpn.RWTH-Aachen.DE JOIN :#lisp" ":O_4!n=souchan@ip-118-90-77-116.xdsl.xnet.co.nz QUIT :" ":jso!n=user@host-9-143-107-208.midco.net JOIN :#lisp" ":benny`!n=benny@i577A0084.versanet.de QUIT :Read error: 113 (No route to host)" ":pstickne!n=pstickne@c-71-236-177-238.hsd1.wa.comcast.net JOIN :#lisp" ":zickzackv!n=zickzack@e178160039.adsl.alicedsl.de JOIN :#lisp" ":zickzackv!n=zickzack@e178160039.adsl.alicedsl.de PART #lisp :" ":spiaggia!n=user@armadillo.labri.fr PRIVMSG #lisp :Good morning." ":ecraven!n=nex@140.78.42.104 JOIN :#lisp" ":MHOOO!n=nah@3-007.vpn.RWTH-Aachen.DE QUIT :Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)" ":thom_logn!n=thom@pool-96-229-99-100.lsanca.dsl-w.verizon.net JOIN :#lisp" ":O_4!n=souchan@ip-118-90-77-116.xdsl.xnet.co.nz JOIN :#lisp" ":impulse32!n=impulse@CPE001195396746-CM001ac3167610.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com QUIT :\"leaving\"" ":vy!n=user@213.139.194.86 JOIN :#lisp" ":vy!n=user@213.139.194.86 PRIVMSG #lisp :Actually, FSET needs some love. IMHO, it has the potential to bring a true and consistent concurrency scheme to Common Lisp." ":replor_!n=replor@ntkngw375028.kngw.nt.ftth.ppp.infoweb.ne.jp JOIN :#lisp" ":l_a_m!n=lam@194.51.71.190 JOIN :#lisp" ":tayssir``!n=user@ip503c4d9b.speed.planet.nl QUIT :Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)" ":aja!n=aja@unaffiliated/aja QUIT :\"\"I am going to a commune in Vermont and will deal with no unit of time shorter than a season.\"\"" ":lnostdal!n=lnostdal@149-36-67.oke2-bras5.adsl.tele2.no PRIVMSG #lisp :anyone know of a reader macro for inlining text? .. i'm looking for something that does not require one to backslash \" and \\ characters etc." ":Ijeroj__!n=nah@u-7-123.vpn.RWTH-Aachen.DE QUIT :Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)" ":attila_lendvai!n=ati@catv-89-133-170-239.catv.broadband.hu JOIN :#lisp" ":sohail!n=Sohail@unaffiliated/sohail QUIT :Read error: 113 (No route to host)" ":replor!n=replor@ntkngw375028.kngw.nt.ftth.ppp.infoweb.ne.jp QUIT :Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)" ":NoorDextor!n=NoorDext@unaffiliated/noordextor JOIN :#lisp" ":kiuma!n=kiuma@83-103-59-156.ip.fastwebnet.it JOIN :#lisp" ":plage!n=user@laptop-147-210-128-154.labri.fr JOIN :#lisp" ":kiuma!n=kiuma@83-103-59-156.ip.fastwebnet.it PRIVMSG #lisp :hello lispers" ":cracki!n=cracki@sglty.kawo2.RWTH-Aachen.DE QUIT :\"The funniest things in my life are truth and absurdity.\"" ":plage!n=user@laptop-147-210-128-154.labri.fr PRIVMSG #lisp :hello kiuma" ":rottcodd!n=user@ppp59-167-52-95.lns1.cbr1.internode.on.net QUIT :\"ERC Version 5.3 (IRC client for Emacs)\"" ":mvilleneuve!n=mvillene@194.51.71.190 PRIVMSG #lisp :good morning" ":plage!n=user@laptop-147-210-128-154.labri.fr PRIVMSG #lisp :hello mvilleneuve" ":jdz!n=jdz@85.254.248.11 JOIN :#lisp" ":icylisper!n=icylispe@61.12.19.50 QUIT :Remote closed the connection" ":kiuma!n=kiuma@83-103-59-156.ip.fastwebnet.it PRIVMSG #lisp :morning mvilleneuve" ":O_4!n=souchan@ip-118-90-77-116.xdsl.xnet.co.nz QUIT :" ":mishok13!n=gdmfsob@dm.sonopia.com JOIN :#lisp" ":jtoy!n=jtoy@58.61.221.101 JOIN :#lisp" ":kiuma!n=kiuma@83-103-59-156.ip.fastwebnet.it PRIVMSG #lisp :I have a problem with writing the manual of the new CLAW. Since it is grown it is composed of subprojects: the 'claw' that is an application server, claw-html that is an html framework, claw-html.dojo that is the claw-html dojotoolkit integration, claw.i18n that is a localization library. So my question is How could I shortly define CLAW ?" ":kiuma!n=kiuma@83-103-59-156.ip.fastwebnet.it PRIVMSG #lisp :any ideas ?" ":splittist!n=splittis@213.235.9.122 JOIN :#lisp" ":splittist!n=splittis@213.235.9.122 PRIVMSG #lisp :morning" ":_deepfire!n=deepfire@80.92.100.69 QUIT :Read error: 101 (Network is unreachable)" ":kiuma!n=kiuma@83-103-59-156.ip.fastwebnet.it PRIVMSG #lisp :morning ?" ":splittist!n=splittis@213.235.9.122 PRIVMSG #lisp :Si" ":kiuma!n=kiuma@83-103-59-156.ip.fastwebnet.it PRIVMSG #lisp :splittist, cold fingers ! :D" ":pstickne!n=pstickne@c-71-236-177-238.hsd1.wa.comcast.net QUIT :Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)" ":kiuma!n=kiuma@83-103-59-156.ip.fastwebnet.it PRIVMSG #lisp :splittist, could youo help me plz? I've the writer block !" ":Krystof!n=csr21@84-51-132-95.christ977.adsl.metronet.co.uk PRIVMSG #lisp :well, give it back then!" ":eevar2!n=jalla@106.80-203-27.nextgentel.com JOIN :#lisp" ":x6j8x!n=x6j8x@tmo-100-153.customers.d1-online.com JOIN :#lisp" ":echo-area!n=user@cmdev1.test.cnz.alimama.com JOIN :#lisp" ":kiuma!n=kiuma@83-103-59-156.ip.fastwebnet.it PRIVMSG #lisp :Krystof, it seems odd, but I don't know how to briefly descripe CLAW, for the intro of the manual" ":kiuma!n=kiuma@83-103-59-156.ip.fastwebnet.it PRIVMSG #lisp ::(" ":Krystof!n=csr21@84-51-132-95.christ977.adsl.metronet.co.uk PRIVMSG #lisp :\"CLAW is a whatsit that makes thingifying easier\"" ":Krystof!n=csr21@84-51-132-95.christ977.adsl.metronet.co.uk PRIVMSG #lisp :there, all you need to do is replace two words" ":splittist!n=splittis@213.235.9.122 PRIVMSG #lisp :kiuma: as per Krystof, google for one of those 'elevator pitch' templates that were doing the rounds before the last market correction and fill in the gaps." ":kiuma!n=kiuma@83-103-59-156.ip.fastwebnet.it PRIVMSG #lisp :Krystof, thanks it could be a good start, mean while I'm waiting the new ISP that I've changed for the demo, becaute I've already put it online, but the connection is so terrible, that CLAW seems slow when in truth it's very fast, hoopefully I'll soon have a 2mbit upload/download connection" ":kiuma!n=kiuma@83-103-59-156.ip.fastwebnet.it PRIVMSG #lisp :splittist, I haven't understood :(" ":puchacz!n=puchacz@87-194-5-99.bethere.co.uk QUIT :Remote closed the connection" ":aquateen_!n=chris@c-71-231-10-116.hsd1.wa.comcast.net JOIN :#lisp" ":lnostdal!n=lnostdal@149-36-67.oke2-bras5.adsl.tele2.no PRIVMSG #lisp :isn't the description you mentioned just now \"good enough\", kiuma ? .. claw, application server .. claw-html, html-framework (templating?) .. claw-html.dojo, dojo-integration ...etc." ":aquateen!n=chris@c-71-231-10-116.hsd1.wa.comcast.net QUIT :Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)" ":NoorDextor!n=NoorDext@unaffiliated/noordextor QUIT :\"go Canada!\"" ":kiuma!n=kiuma@83-103-59-156.ip.fastwebnet.it PRIVMSG #lisp :lnostdal, yes but I don't know how to define all these things" ":kiuma!n=kiuma@83-103-59-156.ip.fastwebnet.it PRIVMSG #lisp :lnostdal, in the whole I mean" ":lnostdal!n=lnostdal@149-36-67.oke2-bras5.adsl.tele2.no PRIVMSG #lisp :maybe it is a has-a relationship instead of a is-a relationship .. the components" ":lnostdal!n=lnostdal@149-36-67.oke2-bras5.adsl.tele2.no PRIVMSG #lisp :..\"no common base class\".." ":kiuma!n=kiuma@83-103-59-156.ip.fastwebnet.it PRIVMSG #lisp :what Krystof said (more or less \"CLAW is a blob\") might be a solutino" ":kiuma!n=kiuma@83-103-59-156.ip.fastwebnet.it PRIVMSG #lisp :s/blob/set of instruments/" ":lnostdal!n=lnostdal@149-36-67.oke2-bras5.adsl.tele2.no PRIVMSG #lisp :web-application framework isn't a bad term i think?" ":lnostdal!n=lnostdal@149-36-67.oke2-bras5.adsl.tele2.no PRIVMSG #lisp :ex. ruby on rails: \"Ruby on Rails is an open-source web framework..\" ( http://www.rubyonrails.org/ )" ":kiuma!n=kiuma@83-103-59-156.ip.fastwebnet.it PRIVMSG #lisp :lnostdal, it's also an application server so framework is reductive" ":kiuma!n=kiuma@83-103-59-156.ip.fastwebnet.it PRIVMSG #lisp :and it's more then RoR" ":lnostdal!n=lnostdal@149-36-67.oke2-bras5.adsl.tele2.no PRIVMSG #lisp :ok" ":kiuma!n=kiuma@83-103-59-156.ip.fastwebnet.it PRIVMSG #lisp :there is an application server, lisplets (the web applications), the html framework, etch" ":kiuma!n=kiuma@83-103-59-156.ip.fastwebnet.it PRIVMSG #lisp :etc" ":rudi!n=rudi@pdpc/supporter/sustaining/rudi PRIVMSG #lisp :don't try to cram everything into one sentence then. If you" ":lyte!n=lyte@unaffiliated/neerolyte QUIT :Read error: 113 (No route to host)" ":rudi!n=rudi@pdpc/supporter/sustaining/rudi PRIVMSG #lisp :if you're afraid things get lost, make a bullet list in the second paragraph; your readers might not be asleep at that point yet ;)" ":abeaumont!n=abeaumon@30.pool85-49-182.dynamic.orange.es QUIT :Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)" ":abeaumont!n=abeaumon@30.pool85-49-182.dynamic.orange.es JOIN :#lisp" ":reaver__!n=reaver@212.88.117.162 JOIN :#lisp" ":H4ns!n=Hans@p57BB9A6D.dip0.t-ipconnect.de JOIN :#lisp" ":NoorDextor!n=NoorDext@unaffiliated/noordextor JOIN :#lisp" ":lyte!n=lyte@unaffiliated/neerolyte JOIN :#lisp" ":blx!i=krille@port-87-193-235-133.static.qsc.de QUIT :\"ERC Version 5.3 (IRC client for Emacs)\"" ":woodz!n=chatzill@213.128.226.209 JOIN :#lisp" ":plage!n=user@laptop-147-210-128-154.labri.fr PART #lisp :\"ERC Version 5.0.4 $Revision: 1.726.2.20 $ (IRC client for Emacs)\"" ":tst___!n=Tim@p4FD2FC21.dip.t-dialin.net JOIN :#lisp" ":lemonodor!n=lemonodo@adsl-76-214-15-172.dsl.lsan03.sbcglobal.net QUIT :" ":yangsx!n=yangsx@218.247.244.25 QUIT :Read error: 60 (Operation timed out)" ":trebor_win!n=none_ask@mail.dki.tu-darmstadt.de JOIN :#lisp" ":lemonodor!n=lemonodo@adsl-76-214-15-172.dsl.lsan03.sbcglobal.net JOIN :#lisp" ":reaver__!n=reaver@212.88.117.162 QUIT :Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)" ":trebor_win!n=none_ask@mail.dki.tu-darmstadt.de PRIVMSG #lisp :hello ;)" ":e271!i=[1Xmizzn@panix3.panix.com PRIVMSG #lisp :Lisp trivia question: what does \"FASL\" stand for?" ":stassats`!n=stassats@wikipedia/stassats PRIVMSG #lisp :fast load?" ":e271!i=[1Xmizzn@panix3.panix.com PRIVMSG #lisp :I don't know either: I'm wondering." ":e271!i=[1Xmizzn@panix3.panix.com PRIVMSG #lisp :But \"fast load\" is certainly plausible." ":rudi!n=rudi@pdpc/supporter/sustaining/rudi PRIVMSG #lisp :minion: what does fasl stand for?" ":minion!n=minion@208.72.159.207 PRIVMSG #lisp :Facepiece Alcine Summer Langbeinite" ":mvilleneuve!n=mvillene@194.51.71.190 PRIVMSG #lisp :heh :)" ":e271!i=[1Xmizzn@panix3.panix.com PRIVMSG #lisp :Yeah, right ;)" ":dash_!n=dash@dslb-088-065-131-107.pools.arcor-ip.net JOIN :#lisp" ":e271!i=[1Xmizzn@panix3.panix.com PRIVMSG #lisp :But that minion is pretty cool." ":mvilleneuve!n=mvillene@194.51.71.190 PRIVMSG #lisp :\"FASt Loading\", according to http://www.franz.com/support/documentation/8.0/doc/glossary.htm" ":ths!n=ths@p549AEF4B.dip.t-dialin.net JOIN :#lisp" ":ths_!n=ths@X5f28.x.pppool.de QUIT :Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)" ":djinni`!n=djinni`@ludios.net QUIT :Client Quit" ":djinni`!n=djinni`@ludios.net JOIN :#lisp" ":Odin-!n=sbkhh@s121-302.gardur.hi.is JOIN :#lisp" ":dash__!n=dash@dslb-088-065-131-066.pools.arcor-ip.net QUIT :Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)" ":Bzek!n=SK_sj@mcc-dyn-17-237.kosnet.ru JOIN :#lisp" ":jao!n=user@186.Red-81-32-186.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net QUIT :Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)" ":matley!n=matley@83.225.246.162 JOIN :#lisp" ":jtmoulia!n=user@bcm-131-111-216-239.girton.cam.ac.uk JOIN :#lisp" ":Odin-!n=sbkhh@s121-302.gardur.hi.is QUIT :" ":jtoy!n=jtoy@58.61.221.101 QUIT :Read error: 54 (Connection reset by peer)" ":jtoy!n=jtoy@58.61.221.101 JOIN :#lisp" ":nenorbot!n=Menas@87.69.67.210 QUIT :Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)" ":rudi!n=rudi@pdpc/supporter/sustaining/rudi QUIT :\"Client exciting\"" ":kij!n=user@pc.tv2.dk JOIN :#lisp" ":matley!n=matley@83.225.246.162 QUIT :\"ERC Version 5.3 (IRC client for Emacs)\"" ":jtmoulia!n=user@bcm-131-111-216-239.girton.cam.ac.uk PART #lisp :\"ERC Version 5.3 (IRC client for Emacs)\"" ":ignas!n=ignas@office.pov.lt JOIN :#lisp" ":ejs!n=eugen@80.91.178.218 JOIN :#lisp" ":jao!n=user@74.Red-80-24-4.staticIP.rima-tde.net JOIN :#lisp" ":jtoy!n=jtoy@58.61.221.101 QUIT :" ":_deepfire!n=deepfire@80.92.100.69 JOIN :#lisp" ":nikodemus_!n=nikodemu@cs181229041.pp.htv.fi JOIN :#lisp" ":echo-area!n=user@cmdev1.test.cnz.alimama.com QUIT :Remote closed the connection" ":Chrononaut!n=bjorn@195.20.207.210 QUIT :Remote closed the connection" ":Chrononaut!n=bjorn@195.20.207.210 JOIN :#lisp" ":c|mell!n=cmell@61.121.210.70 QUIT :\"Instain to the do way\"" ":silenius!n=jl@yian-ho03.nir.cronon.net JOIN :#lisp" ":reaver__!n=reaver@212.88.117.162 JOIN :#lisp" ":Krystof!n=csr21@84-51-132-95.christ977.adsl.metronet.co.uk QUIT :Read error: 113 (No route to host)" ":gonzojive!n=red@fun.Stanford.EDU QUIT :Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)" ":hkBst!n=hkBst@gentoo/developer/hkbst JOIN :#lisp" ":benny!n=benny@i577A0084.versanet.de JOIN :#lisp" ":vasa!n=vasa@mm-15-88-84-93.dynamic.pppoe.mgts.by JOIN :#lisp" ":semka_!n=semka@77.236.84.166 JOIN :#lisp" ":me-so-stupid!n=semka@77.236.84.166 QUIT :Remote closed the connection" ":cemerick!n=la_mer@c-71-232-219-241.hsd1.ma.comcast.net JOIN :#lisp" ":nikodemus_!n=nikodemu@cs181229041.pp.htv.fi PRIVMSG #lisp :woot! 11% off the SBCL build!" ":minion!n=minion@208.72.159.207 PRIVMSG #lisp :nikodemus_, memo from chandler: FreeBSD 7.1 will have an affinity API, which needless to say is different from every other system: http://www.FreeBSD.org/cgi/man.cgi?query=cpuset&sektion=2&apropos=0&manpath=FreeBSD+8-current" ":Xach!n=xach@207.5.178.18 PRIVMSG #lisp :nikodemus_: which trick this time?" ":_8david!n=user@port-83-236-3-70.dynamic.qsc.de PRIVMSG #lisp :nikodemus_: how much larger is the memory usage?" ":icylisper!n=icylispe@61.12.19.50 JOIN :#lisp" ":_8david!n=user@port-83-236-3-70.dynamic.qsc.de PRIVMSG #lisp :(I'm assuming this is the 'code components on separate pages' thing.)" ":pjb!n=t@67.Red-81-37-36.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net JOIN :#lisp" ":icylisper!n=icylispe@61.12.19.50 QUIT :Client Quit" ":lemonodor!n=lemonodo@adsl-76-214-15-172.dsl.lsan03.sbcglobal.net QUIT :" ":H4ns!n=Hans@p57BB9A6D.dip0.t-ipconnect.de PART #lisp :" ":H4ns!n=Hans@p57BB9A6D.dip0.t-ipconnect.de JOIN :#lisp" ":nikodemus_!n=nikodemu@cs181229041.pp.htv.fi PRIVMSG #lisp :i wish it was" ":_8david!n=user@port-83-236-3-70.dynamic.qsc.de PRIVMSG #lisp :oh, ok" ":semka_!n=semka@77.236.84.166 NICK :me-so-stupid" ":nikodemus_!n=nikodemu@cs181229041.pp.htv.fi PRIVMSG #lisp :this is making pretty printing marginally less stupid (but ignore the 11% for a second -- that was an apples and oranges number)" ":nikodemus_!n=nikodemu@cs181229041.pp.htv.fi PRIVMSG #lisp :still working on my first coffee of the day..." ":laki!n=d5ca7c8a@67.159.35.76 JOIN :#lisp" ":Xach!n=xach@207.5.178.18 PRIVMSG #lisp :heh" ":laki!n=d5ca7c8a@67.159.35.76 QUIT :Client Quit" ":kiuma!n=kiuma@83-103-59-156.ip.fastwebnet.it PRIVMSG #lisp :is there any common lisp library that make possible to work with dwg files ?" ":kiuma!n=kiuma@83-103-59-156.ip.fastwebnet.it PRIVMSG #lisp :dwg->autocad" ":H4ns!n=Hans@p57BB9A6D.dip0.t-ipconnect.de PRIVMSG #lisp :kiuma: eek! will claw evolve into a cad system now? :)" ":_adeht!n=death@nessers.org NICK :adeht" ":kiuma!n=kiuma@83-103-59-156.ip.fastwebnet.it PRIVMSG #lisp :H4ns, lol, A friend from Siemens asked for something like www.aperture.com" ":kiuma!n=kiuma@83-103-59-156.ip.fastwebnet.it PRIVMSG #lisp :H4ns, even if with the claw dojo integration I could create something that draws vectorial images :)" ":kiuma!n=kiuma@83-103-59-156.ip.fastwebnet.it PRIVMSG #lisp :anyway it wouldn't be impossible" ":nikodemus_!n=nikodemu@cs181229041.pp.htv.fi PRIVMSG #lisp :ok, the real difference is closer to 2%, but it does make the case on sbcl-devel work in a sane amount of time even if *print-pretty* is true" ":attila_lendvai!n=ati@catv-89-133-170-239.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #lisp :nikodemus_: fyi, i've met that slowness in real life much more often than your 2% build time suggests..." ":woodz!n=chatzill@213.128.226.209 QUIT :\"ChatZilla 0.9.83 [Firefox 3.0.3/2008092417]\"" ":cemerick!n=la_mer@c-71-232-219-241.hsd1.ma.comcast.net QUIT :" ":x6j8x!n=x6j8x@tmo-100-153.customers.d1-online.com QUIT :Read error: 60 (Operation timed out)" ":xinming!n=hyy@218.73.134.228 QUIT :Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)" ":xinming!n=hyy@218.73.134.228 JOIN :#lisp" ":x6j8x!n=x6j8x@tmo-100-153.customers.d1-online.com JOIN :#lisp" ":nikodemus_!n=nikodemu@cs181229041.pp.htv.fi PRIVMSG #lisp :yeah. iirc sbcl build is pretty good about binding *print-pretty* to nil" ":Jacob_H!n=jacob@92.4.94.15 JOIN :#lisp" ":pchrist_!n=spirit@gentoo/developer/pchrist JOIN :#lisp" ":pchrist!n=spirit@gentoo/developer/pchrist QUIT :Read error: 60 (Operation timed out)" ":attila_lendvai!n=ati@catv-89-133-170-239.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #lisp :nikodemus_: i have some long pending patches on sbcl-devel and noone complained not comitted them. any hints on what i should do?" ":nikodemus_!n=nikodemu@cs181229041.pp.htv.fi PRIVMSG #lisp :well, you can send me follow-up emails on them (replying on the original, for preference) and i'll make sure i have them tagged" ":attila_lendvai!n=ati@catv-89-133-170-239.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #lisp :ok, will do" ":Jacob_H!n=jacob@92.4.94.15 QUIT :\"Leaving\"" ":matley!n=matley@matley.imati.cnr.it JOIN :#lisp" ":sad0ur_!n=sad0ur@psi.cz JOIN :#lisp" ":envi^home!n=envi@220.121.234.156 JOIN :#lisp" ":sad0ur!n=sad0ur@psi.cz QUIT :Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)" ":x6j8x_!n=x6j8x@tmo-100-153.customers.d1-online.com JOIN :#lisp" ":cemerick!n=la_mer@75.147.38.122 JOIN :#lisp" ":lyte!n=lyte@unaffiliated/neerolyte QUIT :Read error: 113 (No route to host)" ":nikodemus_!n=nikodemu@cs181229041.pp.htv.fi PRIVMSG #lisp :Xach: is zs3 documentation wholly hand-written, or do you use a genenerator to extract and format docstrings?" ":envi_home!n=envi@220.121.234.156 JOIN :#lisp" ":vy!n=user@213.139.194.86 PRIVMSG #lisp :Isn't it yet another Ediware?" ":nikodemus_!n=nikodemu@cs181229041.pp.htv.fi PRIVMSG #lisp :office ->" ":nikodemus_!n=nikodemu@cs181229041.pp.htv.fi QUIT :\"This computer has gone to sleep\"" ":vy!n=user@213.139.194.86 PRIVMSG #lisp :nikodemus_: Checked this? http://weitz.de/documentation-template/" ":topo!n=topo@200.37.161.41 JOIN :#lisp" ":envi^home!n=envi@220.121.234.156 QUIT :Read error: 60 (Operation timed out)" ":x6j8x!n=x6j8x@tmo-100-153.customers.d1-online.com QUIT :Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)" ":sad0ur_!n=sad0ur@psi.cz QUIT :Read error: 60 (Operation timed out)" ":jewel!n=jewel@dsl-242-191-149.telkomadsl.co.za JOIN :#lisp" ":enn_!i=eli@ahab.flyoverblues.com QUIT :Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)" ":kij!n=user@pc.tv2.dk QUIT :Remote closed the connection" ":envi^home!n=envi@220.121.234.156 JOIN :#lisp" ":kiuma!n=kiuma@83-103-59-156.ip.fastwebnet.it PRIVMSG #lisp :isn't there any dxf2svg in CL around ?" ":envi_home!n=envi@220.121.234.156 QUIT :Read error: 60 (Operation timed out)" ":bertskert!n=mor_och_@c83-252-190-193.bredband.comhem.se JOIN :#lisp" ":Odin-!n=sbkhh@s121-302.gardur.hi.is JOIN :#lisp" ":b4|hraban!n=b4@0brg.xs4all.nl JOIN :#lisp" ":sellout!n=greg@c-24-128-50-176.hsd1.ma.comcast.net QUIT :" ":Jasko!n=tjasko@209.74.44.225 JOIN :#lisp" ":pchrist_!n=spirit@gentoo/developer/pchrist QUIT :\"leaving\"" ":pchrist!n=spirit@gentoo/developer/pchrist JOIN :#lisp" ":haiwei!n=haiwei@192.9.202.3 QUIT :\"Leaving.\"" ":nikodemus!n=nikodemu@cs27013130.pp.htv.fi JOIN :#lisp" ":x6j8x_!n=x6j8x@tmo-100-153.customers.d1-online.com QUIT :" ":x6j8x!n=x6j8x@tmo-100-153.customers.d1-online.com JOIN :#lisp" ":H4ns1!n=Hans@p57BB8E32.dip0.t-ipconnect.de JOIN :#lisp" ":H4ns!n=Hans@p57BB9A6D.dip0.t-ipconnect.de QUIT :Nick collision from services." ":H4ns1!n=Hans@p57BB8E32.dip0.t-ipconnect.de NICK :H4ns" ":jewel!n=jewel@dsl-242-191-149.telkomadsl.co.za QUIT :Connection timed out" ":aquateen_!n=chris@c-71-231-10-116.hsd1.wa.comcast.net QUIT :" ":MHOOO!n=nah@3-058.vpn.RWTH-Aachen.DE JOIN :#lisp" ":bombshelter13!n=bombshel@net2.senecac.on.ca JOIN :#lisp" ":vcgomes[away]!n=vcgomes@li17-238.members.linode.com NICK :vcgomes" ":Xach!n=xach@207.5.178.18 PRIVMSG #lisp :nikodemus: can you ever really completely hand-write something in emacs?" ":jewel!n=jewel@dsl-242-171-245.telkomadsl.co.za JOIN :#lisp" ":Xach!n=xach@207.5.178.18 PRIVMSG #lisp :nikodemus: but i know what you mean, and no, docstrings and the html docs are separate" ":bombshel1er13!n=bombshel@net2.senecac.on.ca JOIN :#lisp" ":bombshel1er13!n=bombshel@net2.senecac.on.ca QUIT :Client Quit" ":Xach!n=xach@207.5.178.18 PRIVMSG #lisp :kiuma: if not, i will write one for you for a modest fee!" ":kiuma!n=kiuma@83-103-59-156.ip.fastwebnet.it PRIVMSG #lisp :Xach, It might be an option :) , I've to get a reply from a contact" ":sellout!n=greg@guest-fw.dc4.itasoftware.com JOIN :#lisp" ":dlowe!n=dlowe@ita4fw1.itasoftware.com JOIN :#lisp" ":MHOOO!n=nah@3-058.vpn.RWTH-Aachen.DE QUIT :Read error: 60 (Operation timed out)" ":nikodemus!n=nikodemu@cs27013130.pp.htv.fi PRIVMSG #lisp :Xach: no fancy \"gimme-a-htmlized-doc-for-foo-here\", then?" ":Xach!n=xach@207.5.178.18 PRIVMSG #lisp :nikodemus: no." ":_8david!n=user@port-83-236-3-70.dynamic.qsc.de PRIVMSG #lisp :Xach: didn't you have an emacs command to update those docstrings?" ":rsynnott!i=rsynnott@spoon.netsoc.tcd.ie PRIVMSG #lisp :for a strict superset of C, obj-c allows some pretty impressive stuff: http://collison.ie/blog/2008/10/iphone-hackery-api-explorer" ":rsynnott!i=rsynnott@spoon.netsoc.tcd.ie PRIVMSG #lisp :oops, wrong channel" ":Xach!n=xach@207.5.178.18 PRIVMSG #lisp :_8david: i didn't." ":_8david!n=user@port-83-236-3-70.dynamic.qsc.de PRIVMSG #lisp :also, would you use a suitable automated docstring-based solution if it existed?" ":Xach!n=xach@207.5.178.18 PRIVMSG #lisp :Doubtful." ":Xach!n=xach@207.5.178.18 PRIVMSG #lisp :I don't think of them as being for the same audience." ":Xach!n=xach@207.5.178.18 PRIVMSG #lisp :ACTION is always up for trying new things though, as long as they are proven to be totally awesome in advance" ":ecraven!n=nex@140.78.42.104 PRIVMSG #lisp :has anyone here ever used EuLisp (or specifically Telos?)" ":locklace!i=locklace@gateway/tor/x-6ffe886e1dcc5fa2 PRIVMSG #lisp :heh." ":segv_!n=mb@p4FC1E474.dip.t-dialin.net PRIVMSG #lisp :Xach: heroin." ":Xach!n=xach@207.5.178.18 PRIVMSG #lisp :those creepy dolls climbing on the ceiling were so *not* awesome" ":epoch!n=K-I-S-S@p3m/member/epoch QUIT :" ":bombshel1er13!n=bombshel@net2.senecac.on.ca JOIN :#lisp" ":segv_!n=mb@p4FC1E474.dip.t-dialin.net PRIVMSG #lisp :Xach: i don't suggest you stop using." ":bombshelter13!n=bombshel@net2.senecac.on.ca QUIT :Client Quit" ":bombshel1er13!n=bombshel@net2.senecac.on.ca QUIT :Client Quit" ":bombshelter13!n=bombshel@net2.senecac.on.ca JOIN :#lisp" ":tayssir!n=user@streamtech.xs4all.nl JOIN :#lisp" ":bombshel1er13!n=bombshel@net2.senecac.on.ca JOIN :#lisp" ":segv_!n=mb@p4FC1E474.dip.t-dialin.net PRIVMSG #lisp :anyway...moving on..." ":_8david!n=user@port-83-236-3-70.dynamic.qsc.de PRIVMSG #lisp :the modularized bastard child of documentation-template, atdoc, AND cmucl-style texinfo-docstrings would have to absolutely awesome." ":Xach!n=xach@207.5.178.18 PRIVMSG #lisp :_8david: i would take a look at things, i think, but i've worn a semi-comfortable groove with my workflow at the moment." ":bombshelter13!n=bombshel@net2.senecac.on.ca QUIT :Client Quit" ":bombshel1er13!n=bombshel@net2.senecac.on.ca QUIT :Client Quit" ":ThomasI!n=thomas@unaffiliated/thomasi JOIN :#lisp" ":bombshelter13!n=bombshel@net2.senecac.on.ca JOIN :#lisp" ":Nshag!i=user@Mix-Orleans-105-3-32.w193-250.abo.wanadoo.fr JOIN :#lisp" ":Xach!n=xach@207.5.178.18 PRIVMSG #lisp :nikodemus: are you looking for something to use? _8david might have something!" ":locklace!i=locklace@gateway/tor/x-6ffe886e1dcc5fa2 PRIVMSG #lisp :i was going to try atdoc but then found out i needed to install a ton of dependency infrastructure in order to use it" ":Xach!n=xach@207.5.178.18 PRIVMSG #lisp :you poor thing." ":brandelune!n=JC@pl157.nas934.takamatsu.nttpc.ne.jp QUIT :\"Leaving\"" ":rsynnott!i=rsynnott@spoon.netsoc.tcd.ie PRIVMSG #lisp :locklace: there are various tools that will do that for you" ":locklace!i=locklace@gateway/tor/x-6ffe886e1dcc5fa2 PRIVMSG #lisp :indeed. in fact, i have trouble keeping track of them all :)" ":ahaas_!n=ahaas@c-76-17-41-185.hsd1.ga.comcast.net JOIN :#lisp" ":ahaas_!n=ahaas@c-76-17-41-185.hsd1.ga.comcast.net QUIT :Client Quit" ":deximer!n=deximer@168.203.117.66 JOIN :#lisp" ":Odin-!n=sbkhh@s121-302.gardur.hi.is QUIT :" ":dv_!n=dv@85-127-102-97.dynamic.xdsl-line.inode.at QUIT :\"Gone\"" ":ThomasI!n=thomas@unaffiliated/thomasi QUIT :\"Bye Bye!\"" ":nikodemus!n=nikodemu@cs27013130.pp.htv.fi PRIVMSG #lisp :bunch of things i'd like to document using a format like zs3 and ediware uses" ":nikodemus!n=nikodemu@cs27013130.pp.htv.fi PRIVMSG #lisp :i'll probably hack the sbcl docstring extractor to write html, and turn it into a contrib" ":nikodemus!n=nikodemu@cs27013130.pp.htv.fi PRIVMSG #lisp :in a week or two" ":kreuter!n=kreuter@pool-96-252-14-107.bstnma.fios.verizon.net PRIVMSG #lisp :you could use makeinfo to generate HTML (or DocBook XML, and then convert that into HTML)." ":bombshelter13!n=bombshel@net2.senecac.on.ca QUIT :Read error: 60 (Operation timed out)" ":nikodemus!n=nikodemu@cs27013130.pp.htv.fi PRIVMSG #lisp :maybe" ":willb!n=wibenton@h69-129-204-3.mdsnwi.broadband.dynamic.tds.net JOIN :#lisp" ":kreuter!n=kreuter@pool-96-252-14-107.bstnma.fios.verizon.net PRIVMSG #lisp :IIRC, makeinfo's generated HTML lacks a doctype, but is otherwise valid." ":nikodemus!n=nikodemu@cs27013130.pp.htv.fi PRIVMSG #lisp :though i think i really want the xacediware look & feel, which is going to be hard to get like that" ":kreuter!n=kreuter@pool-96-252-14-107.bstnma.fios.verizon.net PRIVMSG #lisp :ok" ":pinterface!n=pixel@knvl-static-09-0024.dsl.iowatelecom.net QUIT :Read error: 54 (Connection reset by peer)" ":pdeb!n=user@li37-218.members.linode.com JOIN :#lisp" ":Xach!n=xach@207.5.178.18 PRIVMSG #lisp :i write it through a bunch of little elisp helpers." ":Xach!n=xach@207.5.178.18 PRIVMSG #lisp :sort of a manual markdown process." ":pinterface!n=pixel@knvl-static-09-0024.dsl.iowatelecom.net JOIN :#lisp" ":lnxz!n=joachim@bjo1-1x-dhcp208.studby.uio.no JOIN :#lisp" ":creddy!n=CrazyEdd@wrongplanet/CrazyEddy QUIT :Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)" ":nikodemus!n=nikodemu@cs27013130.pp.htv.fi PRIVMSG #lisp :hm, or maybe i should use esrap for the parsing" ":nikodemus!n=nikodemu@cs27013130.pp.htv.fi PRIVMSG #lisp :blech, i'll think about this later" ":mathrick!n=mathrick@users177.kollegienet.dk PRIVMSG #lisp :what foo do I need to cast to disable TCO in SBCL's compiler?" ":mathrick!n=mathrick@users177.kollegienet.dk PRIVMSG #lisp :is (debug 3) enough?" ":kreuter!n=kreuter@pool-96-252-14-107.bstnma.fios.verizon.net PRIVMSG #lisp :mathrick: that will do it." ":_8david!n=user@port-83-236-3-70.dynamic.qsc.de PRIVMSG #lisp :nikodemus: what I'd really like is a modular-ish approach" ":mathrick!n=mathrick@users177.kollegienet.dk PRIVMSG #lisp :kreuter: thanks" ":kreuter!n=kreuter@pool-96-252-14-107.bstnma.fios.verizon.net PRIVMSG #lisp :mathrick: IIRC, so will (> debug (max speed space)), but I might be misremembering." ":_8david!n=user@port-83-236-3-70.dynamic.qsc.de PRIVMSG #lisp :For example, I like this special atdoc-style syntax for my own projects, but I realize that nobody will ever use atdoc because nobody else likes to put this javadoc-like syntax into their docstrings." ":nikodemus!n=nikodemu@cs27013130.pp.htv.fi PRIVMSG #lisp :_8david: right" ":mathrick!n=mathrick@users177.kollegienet.dk PRIVMSG #lisp :kreuter: ya, (debug 3) is useful anyway, so I don't mind that :)" ":_8david!n=user@port-83-236-3-70.dynamic.qsc.de PRIVMSG #lisp :So I'd like a library (let's call it DOCSTRING-PARSER) that collects definitions and their docstrings into an in-memory format." ":mathrick!n=mathrick@users177.kollegienet.dk PRIVMSG #lisp :ACTION notices he wandered into an interesting discussion" ":Xach!n=xach@207.5.178.18 PRIVMSG #lisp :_8david: i think i *would* try to take advantage of parts of a system like that." ":mathrick!n=mathrick@users177.kollegienet.dk PRIVMSG #lisp :I always disliked magic docstrings, precisely because they are hacks and thus completely fail to combine" ":_8david!n=user@port-83-236-3-70.dynamic.qsc.de PRIVMSG #lisp :It could include two syntax parsers out-of-the-box: SBCL-style as a default and atdoc-style as an option. (I wouldn't really make those little syntax parsers into their own asdf systems, I think, because this kind of code is usually pretty short. But I could be wrong about that.)." ":_8david!n=user@port-83-236-3-70.dynamic.qsc.de PRIVMSG #lisp :As an in-memory format, I was thinking about a sexp representation the way many like their HTML stuff. Something like (:p \"first paragraph\" (:a with-a-link))" ":willb!n=wibenton@h69-129-204-3.mdsnwi.broadband.dynamic.tds.net QUIT :\"Leaving\"" ":x6j8x_!n=x6j8x@tmo-100-153.customers.d1-online.com JOIN :#lisp" ":_8david!n=user@port-83-236-3-70.dynamic.qsc.de PRIVMSG #lisp :In any case, the generation of output should be pluggable. A simple texinfo output solution could be taken from the texinfo-docstrings project. My XSLT-based thing would be essentially atdoc, but probably under a new name." ":hugopt!n=hugo@unaffiliated/hugo JOIN :#lisp" ":dthomp!n=dat@71.237.217.129 JOIN :#lisp" ":hugopt!n=hugo@unaffiliated/hugo NICK :hugo" ":tritchey_!n=tritchey@c-98-226-113-211.hsd1.in.comcast.net JOIN :#lisp" ":appletizer!i=user@82-46-30-39.cable.ubr04.hawk.blueyonder.co.uk JOIN :#lisp" ":|Soulman|!n=kvirc@132.80-202-239.nextgentel.com JOIN :#lisp" ":x6j8x!n=x6j8x@tmo-100-153.customers.d1-online.com QUIT :Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)" ":_8david!n=user@port-83-236-3-70.dynamic.qsc.de PRIVMSG #lisp :It shouldn't be too hard give atdoc an Ediware-like look anyway, but I'm guessing that the \"ton of dependencies\" might still bother some." ":me-so-stupid!n=semka@77.236.84.166 QUIT :\"Leaving\"" ":cmm!n=cmm@bzq-79-182-117-83.red.bezeqint.net PRIVMSG #lisp :some tons of dependencies are not like other tons of dependencies" ":locklace!i=locklace@gateway/tor/x-6ffe886e1dcc5fa2 PRIVMSG #lisp :well, it's not really a showstopper if it's a great package, i was just sort of caught off guard by how much infra was needed to do something that i considered fairly simple..." ":segv_!n=mb@p4FC1E474.dip.t-dialin.net QUIT :Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)" ":cmm!n=cmm@bzq-79-182-117-83.red.bezeqint.net PRIVMSG #lisp :(I wouldn't consider a ton of dependencies problematic the whole ton is covered by clbuild, for instance)" ":cmm!n=cmm@bzq-79-182-117-83.red.bezeqint.net PRIVMSG #lisp :s/the/if the/" ":krumholt!n=krumholt@port-92-202-28-17.dynamic.qsc.de JOIN :#lisp" ":jtoy!n=jtoy@121.32.233.171 JOIN :#lisp" ":segv_!n=mb@p4FC1EE78.dip.t-dialin.net JOIN :#lisp" ":_8david!n=user@port-83-236-3-70.dynamic.qsc.de PRIVMSG #lisp :the whole ton of atdoc dependencies is nearly entirely due to Xuriella XSLT, I think, which is in clbuild, yes." ":dthomp!n=dat@71.237.217.129 QUIT :Read error: 60 (Operation timed out)" ":hjpark!n=user@jaram.hanyang.ac.kr JOIN :#lisp" ":locklace!i=locklace@gateway/tor/x-6ffe886e1dcc5fa2 PRIVMSG #lisp :also i really like the way the ZS3 page is organised, it clearly tells you the situation with dependencies and advises you how to get things working as simply as possible" ":Xach!n=xach@207.5.178.18 PRIVMSG #lisp :locklace: I really struggled with that. It's a little fragile." ":Xach!n=xach@207.5.178.18 PRIVMSG #lisp :there's no telling whether, in the future, one of the major dependencies shuffles, adds, or eliminates minor dependencies." ":hjpark!n=user@jaram.hanyang.ac.kr QUIT :Remote closed the connection" ":Chronona1t!n=bjorn@195.20.207.210 JOIN :#lisp" ":locklace!i=locklace@gateway/tor/x-6ffe886e1dcc5fa2 PRIVMSG #lisp :(of course it is also easier to swallow a dependency set like that for a larger application. code->doc generators are more in the \"tools\" category and people usually expect it to be quite simple to get one and try it out)" ":Xach!n=xach@207.5.178.18 PRIVMSG #lisp :hmm, i think i forgot a dependency, too." ":Xach!n=xach@207.5.178.18 PRIVMSG #lisp :i did, i did forget usocket." ":locklace!i=locklace@gateway/tor/x-6ffe886e1dcc5fa2 PRIVMSG #lisp :Xach: yeah, the problem is fundamentally the whole package management system issue, but i think you've explained things in the most straightforward possible way given what there is to work with today" ":Chrononaut!n=bjorn@195.20.207.210 QUIT :Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)" ":Xach!n=xach@207.5.178.18 PRIVMSG #lisp :glad to hear it, that's what i was shooting for." ":rsynnott!i=rsynnott@spoon.netsoc.tcd.ie PRIVMSG #lisp :does ECL just produce C code and presumably some sort of GC, or is a compiler needed to run the results as well?" ":locklace!i=locklace@gateway/tor/x-6ffe886e1dcc5fa2 PRIVMSG #lisp :i had to manually follow the atdoc dependency chain for a few levels before deciding it wasn't worth the time :)" ":nikodemus!n=nikodemu@cs27013130.pp.htv.fi PRIVMSG #lisp :i think i'd prefer instances for the in-memory format, since it makes writing output generators nicer, imo" ":Xach!n=xach@207.5.178.18 PRIVMSG #lisp :locklace: that's when i usually check to see if asdf-install will work ok." ":cmm!n=cmm@bzq-79-182-117-83.red.bezeqint.net PRIVMSG #lisp :you can get a \"statically-linked\" exe using ecl, yes" ":nikodemus!n=nikodemu@cs27013130.pp.htv.fi PRIVMSG #lisp :(defmethod write-document ((part enumerated-list) stream) ...)" ":envi^laptop!n=envi@220.121.234.156 JOIN :#lisp" ":envi^laptop!n=envi@220.121.234.156 QUIT :Read error: 54 (Connection reset by peer)" ":locklace!i=locklace@gateway/tor/x-6ffe886e1dcc5fa2 PRIVMSG #lisp :yah, i think asdf-install should be the focus and the preferred supported setup mechanism until there is a complete replacement" ":Xach!n=xach@207.5.178.18 PRIVMSG #lisp :prefer the hell out of it." ":cracki!n=cracki@137.226.231.203 JOIN :#lisp" ":_8david!n=user@port-83-236-3-70.dynamic.qsc.de PRIVMSG #lisp :nikodemus: that would be fine with me, too. CLOSy is good." ":locklace!i=locklace@gateway/tor/x-6ffe886e1dcc5fa2 PRIVMSG #lisp :i don't think things like clbuild should be considered alternatives or advised to users as the right way to get a package" ":sellout!n=greg@guest-fw.dc4.itasoftware.com PRIVMSG #lisp :locklace: why not?" ":kreuter!n=kreuter@pool-96-252-14-107.bstnma.fios.verizon.net PRIVMSG #lisp :can any of the bots be configured to hold these discussions for us?" ":Xach!n=xach@207.5.178.18 PRIVMSG #lisp :ACTION doesn't care much what people suggest, as long as they are willing to support their suggestion " ":locklace!i=locklace@gateway/tor/x-6ffe886e1dcc5fa2 PRIVMSG #lisp :kreuter: ok, i'll be quiet now :)" ":vy!n=user@213.139.194.86 QUIT :Remote closed the connection" ":kreuter!n=kreuter@pool-96-252-14-107.bstnma.fios.verizon.net PRIVMSG #lisp :locklace: I'm pretty sure we have this discussion at least every day." ":bombshelter13!n=bombshel@net2.senecac.on.ca JOIN :#lisp" ":_8david!n=user@port-83-236-3-70.dynamic.qsc.de PRIVMSG #lisp :nikodemus: you're aware of Luis' texinfo-docstrings git repository, right? IIUC, it currently writes texinfo out directly. If someone had the time to refactor it into (a) parsing into CLOS instances and (b) a separate texinfo generation step, that would already be very helpful, I think." ":vy!n=user@213.139.194.86 JOIN :#lisp" ":creddy!n=CrazyEdd@wrongplanet/CrazyEddy JOIN :#lisp" ":lemoinem!n=swoog@modemcable125.83-81-70.mc.videotron.ca PART #lisp :" ":tritchey!n=tritchey@c-98-226-113-211.hsd1.in.comcast.net QUIT :Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)" ":cods!n=cods@rsbac/developer/cods QUIT :Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)" ":locklace!i=locklace@gateway/tor/x-6ffe886e1dcc5fa2 PRIVMSG #lisp :Xach: so you produced the docs on the ZS3 page manually?" ":Xach!n=xach@207.5.178.18 PRIVMSG #lisp :locklace: i wrote a lot of structured prose and marked it up with a lot of emacs shortcuts." ":sellout!n=greg@guest-fw.dc4.itasoftware.com PRIVMSG #lisp :ACTION apparently hasn't been watching the channel enough." ":Soulman!n=kvirc@132.80-202-239.nextgentel.com QUIT :Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)" ":sellout!n=greg@guest-fw.dc4.itasoftware.com PRIVMSG #lisp :Xach: You missed me stuttering in front of the lisp meeting. Fare and dcrawford conspired to make me talk about OOPSLA." ":Xach!n=xach@207.5.178.18 PRIVMSG #lisp :nice" ":sellout!n=greg@guest-fw.dc4.itasoftware.com PRIVMSG #lisp :Xach: Probably not for anyone. I'm not sure I managed to convey information. I blacked out ... next thing I remember, I'm eating a meatball sandwich." ":Soulman!n=kvirc@132.80-202-239.nextgentel.com JOIN :#lisp" ":pixel5!n=pixel@copei.de JOIN :#lisp" ":chandler!n=chandler@opendarwin/developer/chandler PRIVMSG #lisp :minion: chant to kreuter" ":minion!n=minion@208.72.159.207 PRIVMSG #lisp :kreuter: MORE ASDF" ":pixel5!n=pixel@copei.de QUIT :Client Quit" ":pixel5!n=pixel@copei.de JOIN :#lisp" ":kreuter!n=kreuter@pool-96-252-14-107.bstnma.fios.verizon.net PRIVMSG #lisp :huh?" ":chandler!n=chandler@opendarwin/developer/chandler PRIVMSG #lisp :that was supposed to come out MORE ASDF-INSTALL-DICUSSIONS" ":kreuter!n=kreuter@pool-96-252-14-107.bstnma.fios.verizon.net PRIVMSG #lisp :oh" ":kreuter!n=kreuter@pool-96-252-14-107.bstnma.fios.verizon.net PRIVMSG #lisp :okay then" ":locklace!i=locklace@gateway/tor/x-6ffe886e1dcc5fa2 PRIVMSG #lisp :minion: what does ASDF stand for?" ":minion!n=minion@208.72.159.207 PRIVMSG #lisp :Acetamidine Shoddily Depravation Flub" ":kreuter!n=kreuter@pool-96-252-14-107.bstnma.fios.verizon.net PRIVMSG #lisp :sellout: you were fine." ":tic!n=tic@c83-249-197-248.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #lisp :another system definition facility" ":locklace!i=locklace@gateway/tor/x-6ffe886e1dcc5fa2 PRIVMSG #lisp :tic: i thought it needed updating, i like minion's version" ":tic!n=tic@c83-249-197-248.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #lisp :Didn't see you asked minion. Sorry." ":Chronona1t!n=bjorn@195.20.207.210 QUIT :Read error: 113 (No route to host)" ":Soulman!n=kvirc@132.80-202-239.nextgentel.com QUIT :Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)" ":Soulman!n=kvirc@132.80-202-239.nextgentel.com JOIN :#lisp" ":willb!n=wibenton@wireless119.cs.wisc.edu JOIN :#lisp" ":willb!n=wibenton@wireless119.cs.wisc.edu QUIT :Client Quit" ":kreuter!n=kreuter@pool-96-252-14-107.bstnma.fios.verizon.net PRIVMSG #lisp :Xach: would you like an argument according to which no initarg can be a valid initialization argument to MAKE-CONDITION?" ":creddy!n=CrazyEdd@wrongplanet/CrazyEddy QUIT :Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)" ":|Soulman|!n=kvirc@132.80-202-239.nextgentel.com QUIT :Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)" ":cracki!n=cracki@137.226.231.203 QUIT :\"The funniest things in my life are truth and absurdity.\"" ":willb!n=wibenton@wireless119.cs.wisc.edu JOIN :#lisp" ":Xach!n=xach@207.5.178.18 PRIVMSG #lisp :hah" ":Xach!n=xach@207.5.178.18 PRIVMSG #lisp :kreuter: sure." ":Xach!n=xach@207.5.178.18 PRIVMSG #lisp :sbcl can lead the charge for conformance" ":Xach!n=xach@207.5.178.18 PRIVMSG #lisp :unconditional success!" ":cmm!n=cmm@bzq-79-182-117-83.red.bezeqint.net PRIVMSG #lisp :if this were a radio channel, namespace and package installation discussions would be static" ":cmm!n=cmm@bzq-79-182-117-83.red.bezeqint.net PRIVMSG #lisp :interactive static!" ":kreuter!n=kreuter@pool-96-252-14-107.bstnma.fios.verizon.net PRIVMSG #lisp :so, 7.1.2 says that there are two means for declaring initialization arguments valid: being an :initarg in a DEFCLASS, or being an argument in a method of an enumerated set of CLOS functions." ":kreuter!n=kreuter@pool-96-252-14-107.bstnma.fios.verizon.net PRIVMSG #lisp :DEFINE-CONDITION ain't DEFCLASS, and MAKE-CONDITION need not invoke those CLOS functions." ":kreuter!n=kreuter@pool-96-252-14-107.bstnma.fios.verizon.net PRIVMSG #lisp :ergo, no-go." ":jso!n=user@host-9-143-107-208.midco.net QUIT :\"ERC Version 5.3 (IRC client for Emacs)\"" ":kreuter!n=kreuter@pool-96-252-14-107.bstnma.fios.verizon.net PRIVMSG #lisp :(I'm about to post something about this to comp.lang.lisp, to see if anybody cares.)" ":Xach!n=xach@207.5.178.18 PRIVMSG #lisp :ACTION cares" ":kreuter!n=kreuter@pool-96-252-14-107.bstnma.fios.verizon.net PRIVMSG #lisp :I think this is just some sloppiness on X3J13's part." ":kreuter!n=kreuter@pool-96-252-14-107.bstnma.fios.verizon.net PRIVMSG #lisp :in particular, you can blame Dave Moon." ":creddy!n=CrazyEdd@wrongplanet/CrazyEddy JOIN :#lisp" ":sellout!n=greg@guest-fw.dc4.itasoftware.com PRIVMSG #lisp :_That's_ why he's been hiding all this time!" ":kreuter!n=kreuter@pool-96-252-14-107.bstnma.fios.verizon.net PRIVMSG #lisp ::)" ":ccl-logbot!n=ccl-logb@master.clozure.com JOIN :#lisp" ":simmons.freenode.net 333 ccl-logbot #lisp luis 1225309657" ":simmons.freenode.net 353 ccl-logbot = #lisp :ccl-logbot creddy willb Soulman pixel5 vy bombshelter13 segv_ jtoy krumholt appletizer tritchey_ hugo x6j8x_ lnxz pinterface pdeb deximer Nshag tayssir dlowe sellout jewel H4ns nikodemus pchrist Jasko b4|hraban bertskert envi^home topo cemerick matley xinming pjb vasa benny hkBst reaver__ silenius _deepfire jao ejs ignas Bzek djinni` ths dash_ trebor_win tst___ NoorDextor abeaumont eevar2 splittist mishok13 jdz kiuma attila_lendvai l_a_m " ":simmons.freenode.net 353 ccl-logbot = #lisp :replor_ thom_logn ecraven VityokOrgUa boyscared seelenquell_ mikezor_ ivansto tiesje Modius ace4016 slyrus_ photon2 eno ahaas bpt prip wchogg srcerer adicarlo manic12 S11001001 dnm dmiles_afk kleppari gjvc PissedNumlock cmm cmalune eevar Wombat1 cmeme stassats` beach mdxi xjrn REPLeffect jlouis jeremiah scode Bucciarati mornfall specbot thijso kmkaplan jrockway sbok Cel Tristam esden Maghnus Patzy mgr sabetts djkthx eirik puddingpimp JuanDaugherty " ":simmons.freenode.net 353 ccl-logbot = #lisp :Liempt holycow nurv101 Tordek ia pitui konr daniel yango larstobi pchrist|univ araujo ivarref e271 kidd2 jmcphers lucca Cryovat tarbo envi^office kpreid gigamonk` alexsuraci isomer proq abend a-s joga defn hugod jollygood_______ herbieB pok guenther__ l4ndfo p8m Guest53748 nowhere_man froog spiderbyte aking V-ille wgl mathrick merlincorey tessier Xof spiaggia knobo cky t schme huangjs ``Erik thedonvaughn mogunus bedlam matthew` felipe Partyzant " ":simmons.freenode.net 353 ccl-logbot = #lisp :ineiros gloaming rlpowell kreuter olejorgenb hsaliak brickhazel mcxx slash_ lnostdal nullwork_ nullwork myrkraverk intrados rdd Khisanth Zhivago jsimonss sykopomp locklace fihi09 vcgomes _8david hefner borism nyef ianmcorvidae r0bby arbscht turbo24prg bascule m4thrick Ifur phadthai drewc azuk slyrus johs bougyman sjbach tltstc chii Fractal Fade dostoyevsky jamesjb rumbleca dublpaws Xach andrerav maskd esden_ _3b mtd fnordus albino zbigniew " ":simmons.freenode.net 353 ccl-logbot = #lisp :lisppaste maxote Eno_ mqt bohanlon esden`away bunz mvilleneuve z0d tic faheem clog dcrawford foom bfein Adrinael SUNWjoejaxx andrewy jkantz jsnell michaelw xian pragma_ technik jolby chandler dfox Balooga adeht plutonas rsynnott emma Ash qebab rey_ pkhuong Aisling antifuchs gz Paraselene_ delYsid bdowning spacebat rread bob_f froydnj Soulman__ dto keithr _CitizenKane_ retupmoca xan Draggor Thas Riastradh joshe minion erg agemo xristos authentic " ":simmons.freenode.net 353 ccl-logbot = #lisp :wlr yahooooo kuwabara luis nasloc__ DrForr " ":Modius!n=Modius@ppp-70-244-122-30.dsl.austtx.swbell.net QUIT :\"I'm big in Japan\"" ":cods!n=cods@rsbac/developer/cods JOIN :#lisp" ":splittist!n=splittis@213.235.9.122 PRIVMSG #lisp :kreuter: to be slightly serious, while 7.1.2 talks about how the user can declare inititialization arguments to be valid, it doesn't say that the only valid init.args. are those so declared." ":kreuter!n=kreuter@pool-96-252-14-107.bstnma.fios.verizon.net PRIVMSG #lisp :splittist: I think that depends on how you interpret \"There are two means for declaring initialization arguments valid.\"" ":Xof!n=crhodes@dunstaple.doc.gold.ac.uk PRIVMSG #lisp :that depends on what the meaning of \"is\" is" ":splittist!n=splittis@213.235.9.122 PRIVMSG #lisp :kreuter: how else does one read it than a statement about 'declaring'?" ":ejs!n=eugen@80.91.178.218 QUIT :Remote closed the connection" ":splittist!n=splittis@213.235.9.122 PRIVMSG #lisp :s/than/than as/" ":kreuter!n=kreuter@pool-96-252-14-107.bstnma.fios.verizon.net PRIVMSG #lisp :oh, sorry, I thought you were saying something about \"there are two\" not meaning \"there are exactly two\"." ":bertskert!n=mor_och_@c83-252-190-193.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #lisp :should I use (setq) to assign a new value to a parameter i a function? or defvar/defparameter/setf?" ":qbg!n=qbg@rn084084.morris.umn.edu JOIN :#lisp" ":jajcloz!n=jaj@209-6-216-149.c3-0.smr-ubr3.sbo-smr.ma.cable.rcn.com JOIN :#lisp" ":Xach!n=xach@207.5.178.18 PRIVMSG #lisp :bertskert: setq and setf will work. defvar/defparameter are wrong. i prefer setf." ":persi!n=user@ec2-72-44-44-74.z-2.compute-1.amazonaws.com JOIN :#lisp" ":bertskert!n=mor_och_@c83-252-190-193.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #lisp :xach, thanks!" ":Xach!n=xach@207.5.178.18 PRIVMSG #lisp :bertskert: in general, i prefer to use setf everywhere, even where setq would work." ":envi^home!n=envi@220.121.234.156 QUIT :Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)" ":schme!n=marcus@c83-254-190-108.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #lisp :tic: Is there a good vim tutorial to be found somewhere?" ":Xach!n=xach@207.5.178.18 PRIVMSG #lisp :well, not \"everywhere\", but in places appropriate for setf, and also places where setq will also be allowed." ":splittist!n=splittis@213.235.9.122 PRIVMSG #lisp :I suppose one could name all one's functions (setf ), whether they set a place or not... [expects to be corrected]" ":Xof!n=crhodes@dunstaple.doc.gold.ac.uk PRIVMSG #lisp :no, that's right" ":tic!n=tic@c83-249-197-248.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #lisp :schme, not so much tutors as cheat sets, I guess. It's not very much to learn once you get the basics. Try 'vimtutor' though!" ":Xof!n=crhodes@dunstaple.doc.gold.ac.uk PRIVMSG #lisp :bonus points for having the in the keyword package" ":schme!n=marcus@c83-254-190-108.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #lisp :tic: Ok. Thanks." ":tic!n=tic@c83-249-197-248.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #lisp :schme, you _are_ embracing the light!" ":z0d!n=z0d@unaffiliated/z0d QUIT :\"Lost terminal\"" ":kreuter!n=kreuter@pool-96-252-14-107.bstnma.fios.verizon.net PRIVMSG #lisp :splittist: 7.1.6 says that INITIALIZE-INSTANCE signals an error if any initialization argument has not been declared valid. 7.2.2 says the analogous thing for UPDATE-INSTANCE-FOR-DIFFERENT-CLASS, and 7.3 says it for REINITIALIZE-INSTANCE." ":envi^home!n=envi@220.121.234.156 JOIN :#lisp" ":schme!n=marcus@c83-254-190-108.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #lisp :tic: Not quite. ;)" ":splittist!n=splittis@213.235.9.122 PRIVMSG #lisp :kreuter: yes? Isn't your point about MAKE-CONDITION?" ":kreuter!n=kreuter@pool-96-252-14-107.bstnma.fios.verizon.net PRIVMSG #lisp :okay." ":kreuter!n=kreuter@pool-96-252-14-107.bstnma.fios.verizon.net PRIVMSG #lisp :Xach: Clisp is wrong, then." ":kreuter!n=kreuter@pool-96-252-14-107.bstnma.fios.verizon.net PRIVMSG #lisp ::)" ":kreuter!n=kreuter@pool-96-252-14-107.bstnma.fios.verizon.net PRIVMSG #lisp :thanks, splittist" ":splittist!n=splittis@213.235.9.122 PRIVMSG #lisp :kreuter: I'm not sure what I've done, but I'll lap up any praise coming my way (:" ":kreuter!n=kreuter@pool-96-252-14-107.bstnma.fios.verizon.net PRIVMSG #lisp :I'm joking." ":kreuter!n=kreuter@pool-96-252-14-107.bstnma.fios.verizon.net PRIVMSG #lisp :if it's conforming for the condition system to be implemented via CLOS, then it's probably conforming for MAKE-CONDITION to error because MAKE-INSTANCE must error." ":kreuter!n=kreuter@pool-96-252-14-107.bstnma.fios.verizon.net PRIVMSG #lisp :but if it's conforming for the condition system to be implemented without CLOS, then it's probably conforming for MAKE-CONDITION not to error, since as splittist points out, the spec doesn't say anything about validity checking outside of CLOS." ":binarycodes!n=sujoy@59.93.242.5 JOIN :#lisp" ":kreuter!n=kreuter@pool-96-252-14-107.bstnma.fios.verizon.net PRIVMSG #lisp :Xach: how about if SBCL errors 50% of the time? :)" ":tic!n=tic@c83-249-197-248.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #lisp :schme, hush!" ":sellout!n=greg@guest-fw.dc4.itasoftware.com PRIVMSG #lisp :So I can clearly not choose the wine in front of me!" ":sellout!n=greg@guest-fw.dc4.itasoftware.com PRIVMSG #lisp :Truly, you have a dizzying intellect." ":splittist!n=splittis@213.235.9.122 PRIVMSG #lisp :kreuter: makes sense to me." ":schme!n=marcus@c83-254-190-108.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #lisp :tic: I have other plans with checking it out ;)" ":Super!n=al@2.2.8.b.0.7.4.0.1.0.0.2.ip6.arpa JOIN :#lisp" ":splittist!n=splittis@213.235.9.122 PRIVMSG #lisp :What does \"Exceptional Situations: None.\" mean, again? (I haven't done much [CL]HS language lawyering.)" ":creddy!n=CrazyEdd@wrongplanet/CrazyEddy QUIT :Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)" ":kreuter!n=kreuter@pool-96-252-14-107.bstnma.fios.verizon.net PRIVMSG #lisp :splittist: that's a point of contention." ":mib_c4atm6vk!i=c142c881@gateway/web/ajax/mibbit.com/x-bb94dfd06e43fb2f JOIN :#lisp" ":splittist!n=splittis@213.235.9.122 PRIVMSG #lisp :kreuter: good (:" ":z0d!n=z0d@unaffiliated/z0d JOIN :#Lisp" ":epoch!n=K-I-S-S@p3m/member/epoch JOIN :#lisp" ":qbg!n=qbg@rn084084.morris.umn.edu QUIT :Remote closed the connection" ":tic!n=tic@c83-249-197-248.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #lisp :schme, tell me more, tell me more!" ":tic!n=tic@c83-249-197-248.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #lisp :schme, (was it love at first sight?)" ":chandler!n=chandler@opendarwin/developer/chandler PRIVMSG #lisp :sellout: It's a good thing I've spent the past few years developing an immunity to nasal demons, then." ":creddy!n=CrazyEdd@wrongplanet/CrazyEddy JOIN :#lisp" ":krumholt!n=krumholt@port-92-202-28-17.dynamic.qsc.de PRIVMSG #lisp :hi i am using sbcl and drakma to retrieve websites. i then write them to a file. is there a way to ignore unreadable or unprintable characters or does sbcl support unicode?" ":mib_c4atm6vk!i=c142c881@gateway/web/ajax/mibbit.com/x-bb94dfd06e43fb2f PRIVMSG #lisp :supports unicode" ":mikezor_!n=mikael@c-a388e253.04-404-7570701.cust.bredbandsbolaget.se NICK :mikezor" ":kreuter!n=kreuter@pool-96-252-14-107.bstnma.fios.verizon.net PRIVMSG #lisp :krumholt: yes and yes." ":krumholt!n=krumholt@port-92-202-28-17.dynamic.qsc.de PRIVMSG #lisp :kreuter, how can i ignore unreadable chars?" ":mib_c4atm6vk!i=c142c881@gateway/web/ajax/mibbit.com/x-bb94dfd06e43fb2f PRIVMSG #lisp :As of version 0.8.17 SBCL features Unicode support" ":Jacob_H!n=jacob@92.4.94.15 JOIN :#lisp" ":mib_c4atm6vk!i=c142c881@gateway/web/ajax/mibbit.com/x-bb94dfd06e43fb2f PRIVMSG #lisp :unreadable chars?" ":reaver__!n=reaver@212.88.117.162 QUIT :Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)" ":H4ns!n=Hans@p57BB8E32.dip0.t-ipconnect.de PRIVMSG #lisp :krumholt: just OPEN the files with :EXTERNAL-FORMAT :UTF-8" ":krumholt!n=krumholt@port-92-202-28-17.dynamic.qsc.de PRIVMSG #lisp :yes my programm crashes with the error the character with code 8250 cannot be encoded." ":Xof!n=crhodes@dunstaple.doc.gold.ac.uk PRIVMSG #lisp :when you say \"crashes\", do you mean \"presents you with a debugger including lots of recovery options\"?" ":mib_c4atm6vk!i=c142c881@gateway/web/ajax/mibbit.com/x-bb94dfd06e43fb2f PRIVMSG #lisp :lol" ":jdz!n=jdz@85.254.248.11 PRIVMSG #lisp :krumholt: (code-char 8250) sure works in SBCL" ":H4ns!n=Hans@p57BB8E32.dip0.t-ipconnect.de PRIVMSG #lisp :Xof: which is a crash to anyone but a lisp programmer." ":mib_c4atm6vk!i=c142c881@gateway/web/ajax/mibbit.com/x-bb94dfd06e43fb2f PRIVMSG #lisp :?" ":krumholt!n=krumholt@port-92-202-28-17.dynamic.qsc.de PRIVMSG #lisp :Xof, yes" ":mib_c4atm6vk!i=c142c881@gateway/web/ajax/mibbit.com/x-bb94dfd06e43fb2f PRIVMSG #lisp :nopes.. things like Visual C++ also allows you to break in to code during runtime" ":krumholt!n=krumholt@port-92-202-28-17.dynamic.qsc.de PRIVMSG #lisp :Xof, obviously i know it;s not a crash but i can't deliver it to a customer presenting him with a debugger" ":Xach!n=xach@207.5.178.18 PRIVMSG #lisp :Will you list #lisp in the support documentation, too?" ":nikodemus!n=nikodemu@cs27013130.pp.htv.fi PRIVMSG #lisp :what H4ns said re :EXTERNAL-FORMAT" ":tic!n=tic@c83-249-197-248.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #lisp :Is it still not a crash even if you have no usable restarts?" ":Xof!n=crhodes@dunstaple.doc.gold.ac.uk PRIVMSG #lisp :krumholt: ok, I'll teach you how not to give it to a customer for, say, 10% of your fee" ":krumholt!n=krumholt@port-92-202-28-17.dynamic.qsc.de PRIVMSG #lisp :Xach, probably :)" ":binarycodes!n=sujoy@59.93.242.5 QUIT :\"WeeChat 0.2.6\"" ":daniel_!i=daniel@unaffiliated/daniel JOIN :#lisp" ":Xach!n=xach@207.5.178.18 PRIVMSG #lisp :krumholt: Do you understand characters, character sets, and internal vs. external representations?" ":Xof!n=crhodes@dunstaple.doc.gold.ac.uk PRIVMSG #lisp :bah, I am being undercut" ":krumholt!n=krumholt@port-92-202-28-17.dynamic.qsc.de PRIVMSG #lisp :Xach, yes i think so" ":splittist!n=splittis@213.235.9.122 PRIVMSG #lisp :Xach: harming the Xof industry since 1452GMT" ":Xof!n=crhodes@dunstaple.doc.gold.ac.uk PRIVMSG #lisp :these people, helping others for no consideration! It will make Kent Pitman weep" ":Xach!n=xach@207.5.178.18 PRIVMSG #lisp :krumholt: the sbcl error is telling you that you have chosen an external representation that does not support a conversion from the value in your internal representation" ":Xach!n=xach@207.5.178.18 PRIVMSG #lisp :krumholt: you should choose a different external representation" ":Xach!n=xach@207.5.178.18 PRIVMSG #lisp :you can do that when you open the output stream" ":Xach!n=xach@207.5.178.18 PRIVMSG #lisp :another option is to use one of those helpful restarts" ":tritchey_!n=tritchey@c-98-226-113-211.hsd1.in.comcast.net QUIT :" ":kreuter!n=kreuter@pool-96-252-14-107.bstnma.fios.verizon.net PRIVMSG #lisp :ACTION is increasingly confused by Xof." ":Xach!n=xach@207.5.178.18 PRIVMSG #lisp :ACTION is increasingly confused by a paper about length-limited huffman coding" ":krumholt!n=krumholt@port-92-202-28-17.dynamic.qsc.de PRIVMSG #lisp :thanks everyone" ":chandler!n=chandler@opendarwin/developer/chandler PRIVMSG #lisp :ACTION is increasingly confused by the amount of increasing confusion in the channel" ":derekv!n=derek@noogenesis.resnet.mtu.edu JOIN :#lisp" ":mib_c4atm6vk!i=c142c881@gateway/web/ajax/mibbit.com/x-bb94dfd06e43fb2f PRIVMSG #lisp :one thing - krumholt asked how to disable the repl.." ":mib_c4atm6vk!i=c142c881@gateway/web/ajax/mibbit.com/x-bb94dfd06e43fb2f PRIVMSG #lisp :*maybe-avoid-debugger* t" ":mib_c4atm6vk!i=c142c881@gateway/web/ajax/mibbit.com/x-bb94dfd06e43fb2f PRIVMSG #lisp :?" ":kreuter!n=kreuter@pool-96-252-14-107.bstnma.fios.verizon.net PRIVMSG #lisp :nikodemus: does 1.0.21.38 build for you on Win32? (just asking; I haven't got a working windows host to test on)" ":Xach!n=xach@207.5.178.18 PRIVMSG #lisp :there's cl:*debugger-hook* and sb-ext:*invoke-debugger-hook*" ":mib_c4atm6vk!i=c142c881@gateway/web/ajax/mibbit.com/x-bb94dfd06e43fb2f PRIVMSG #lisp :ah.. and then handle the hook yourself" ":_8david!n=user@port-83-236-3-70.dynamic.qsc.de PRIVMSG #lisp :krumholt: the piece of the puzzle you might be missing is that you can invoke restarts automatically in a handler" ":_8david!n=user@port-83-236-3-70.dynamic.qsc.de PRIVMSG #lisp :(handler-bind ((sb-int:stream-decoding-error (lambda (c) (invoke-restart 'sb-int:attempt-resync)))) ...)" ":ecraven!n=nex@140.78.42.104 QUIT :\"bbl\"" ":_8david!n=user@port-83-236-3-70.dynamic.qsc.de PRIVMSG #lisp :but that's for input, of course. For output, see the suggestions above." ":mib_c4atm6vk!i=c142c881@gateway/web/ajax/mibbit.com/x-bb94dfd06e43fb2f PRIVMSG #lisp :anyone here tried puppylinux? specifically try and run sbcl/cmu inside it?" ":krumholt!n=krumholt@port-92-202-28-17.dynamic.qsc.de PRIVMSG #lisp :yes thanks i got that with the restarts. i think my problem is not reading the files with the correct encoding." ":Xach!n=xach@207.5.178.18 PRIVMSG #lisp :krumholt: files in the wild can be pretty annoying to convert to characters." ":mib_c4atm6vk!i=c142c881@gateway/web/ajax/mibbit.com/x-bb94dfd06e43fb2f PRIVMSG #lisp :@krumholt : yup. H4ns's solution should work for you. have a try" ":mib_c4atm6vk!i=c142c881@gateway/web/ajax/mibbit.com/x-bb94dfd06e43fb2f PRIVMSG #lisp :@Xach : what would you suggest then? it often does happen that input stream gets corrupted.. what then? open everything in binmode?" ":nikodemus!n=nikodemu@cs27013130.pp.htv.fi PRIVMSG #lisp :kreuter: it was reported to build -- i don't have a win32 to build on either" ":x6j8x_!n=x6j8x@tmo-100-153.customers.d1-online.com QUIT :Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)" ":kreuter!n=kreuter@pool-96-252-14-107.bstnma.fios.verizon.net PRIVMSG #lisp :ok" ":Xach!n=xach@207.5.178.18 PRIVMSG #lisp :mib_c4atm6vk: I don't have any suggestions, just observations." ":tritchey!n=tritchey@c-98-226-113-211.hsd1.in.comcast.net JOIN :#lisp" ":krumholt!n=krumholt@port-92-202-28-17.dynamic.qsc.de PRIVMSG #lisp :i think i will open everything in utf-8 some files will then be incorrectly displayed as a string but at least all files should be readable that way" ":nikodemus!n=nikodemu@cs27013130.pp.htv.fi PRIVMSG #lisp :if you're snarfing random data, using binary io is the way to go" ":Xach!n=xach@207.5.178.18 PRIVMSG #lisp :Many people do not understand characters, character sets, internal representations, and encodings. Many files have misleading metadata." ":Odin-!n=sbkhh@s121-302.gardur.hi.is JOIN :#lisp" ":Odin-!n=sbkhh@s121-302.gardur.hi.is QUIT :Client Quit" ":_8david!n=user@port-83-236-3-70.dynamic.qsc.de PRIVMSG #lisp :krumholt: wrong" ":H4ns!n=Hans@p57BB8E32.dip0.t-ipconnect.de PRIVMSG #lisp :krumholt: you told us that you're reading stuff through drakma - if that works (i.e. if the web site does not send you non-decodable data) and you got a string back, you will be able to write it to a file in utf-8 encoding." ":happycodemonkey!n=carriear@147.226.197.240 JOIN :#lisp" ":Odin-!n=sbkhh@s121-302.gardur.hi.is JOIN :#lisp" ":Xach!n=xach@207.5.178.18 PRIVMSG #lisp :ACTION is reminded of http://www.cafepress.com/nucleartacos.26721820" ":krumholt!n=krumholt@port-92-202-28-17.dynamic.qsc.de PRIVMSG #lisp :H4ns, i am able to write it in utf-8 in to a file but some chars are wrong for example Ä will not be correct in the resulting file" ":kreuter!n=kreuter@pool-96-252-14-107.bstnma.fios.verizon.net PRIVMSG #lisp :Xach: and many websites contain cut-n-pasted slop that can't all be decoded according to one external-format." ":seelenquell__!n=seelenqu@pD9E44447.dip.t-dialin.net JOIN :#lisp" ":tritchey!n=tritchey@c-98-226-113-211.hsd1.in.comcast.net QUIT :Client Quit" ":H4ns!n=Hans@p57BB8E32.dip0.t-ipconnect.de PRIVMSG #lisp :krumholt: no. you are just not displaying it correctly." ":sohail!n=Sohail@unaffiliated/sohail JOIN :#lisp" ":daniel!i=daniel@unaffiliated/daniel QUIT :Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)" ":nikodemus!n=nikodemu@cs27013130.pp.htv.fi PRIVMSG #lisp :implementing utf-8b, or whatever it is called, would be neat" ":mib_c4atm6vk!i=c142c881@gateway/web/ajax/mibbit.com/x-bb94dfd06e43fb2f PRIVMSG #lisp :http://www.cafepress.com/nucleartacos.26721820 was way cool! lol" ":krumholt!n=krumholt@port-92-202-28-17.dynamic.qsc.de PRIVMSG #lisp :H4ns, hm the same page in firefox before and after download woll look different" ":kreuter!n=kreuter@pool-96-252-14-107.bstnma.fios.verizon.net PRIVMSG #lisp :nikodemus: hear, hear!" ":H4ns!n=Hans@p57BB8E32.dip0.t-ipconnect.de PRIVMSG #lisp :krumholt: firefox does not know the encoding of your file, and propably defaults to latin-1" ":kreuter!n=kreuter@pool-96-252-14-107.bstnma.fios.verizon.net PRIVMSG #lisp :firefox also does a good job of guessing how to handle malformed slop." ":nikodemus!n=nikodemu@cs27013130.pp.htv.fi PRIVMSG #lisp :or alternatively you are *reading* it from the web in the wrong format" ":krumholt!n=krumholt@port-92-202-28-17.dynamic.qsc.de PRIVMSG #lisp :H4ns, but its a html file after all? it was a html file before and its a html file after that the format should be in the file or am i mistaken?" ":mib_c4atm6vk!i=c142c881@gateway/web/ajax/mibbit.com/x-bb94dfd06e43fb2f PRIVMSG #lisp :yes" ":jdz!n=jdz@85.254.248.11 QUIT :\"Somebody rebooted me\"" ":H4ns!n=Hans@p57BB8E32.dip0.t-ipconnect.de PRIVMSG #lisp :krumholt: yes, you are" ":mib_c4atm6vk!i=c142c881@gateway/web/ajax/mibbit.com/x-bb94dfd06e43fb2f PRIVMSG #lisp :you need to specify the encoding in meta" ":bombshelter13!n=bombshel@net2.senecac.on.ca QUIT :No route to host" ":H4ns!n=Hans@p57BB8E32.dip0.t-ipconnect.de PRIVMSG #lisp :krumholt: in the http request, the encoding is transported in the content-type header. the file does not have such a header, so firefox needs to guess." ":billc!n=user@S0106001b63f442be.vn.shawcable.net JOIN :#lisp" ":billc!n=user@S0106001b63f442be.vn.shawcable.net PART #lisp :\"ERC Version 5.2 (IRC client for Emacs)\"" ":krumholt!n=krumholt@port-92-202-28-17.dynamic.qsc.de PRIVMSG #lisp :H4ns, many many thanks. so i should read the header from drakma and then write the file in the encoding send in the header right?" ":Xof!n=crhodes@dunstaple.doc.gold.ac.uk PRIVMSG #lisp :nikodemus: so would implementing something with windows line endings" ":nikodemus!n=nikodemu@cs27013130.pp.htv.fi PRIVMSG #lisp :hearhear" ":qbg!n=qbg@rn084084.morris.umn.edu JOIN :#lisp" ":Xof!n=crhodes@dunstaple.doc.gold.ac.uk PRIVMSG #lisp :maybe we could set up a pledge drive" ":H4ns!n=Hans@p57BB8E32.dip0.t-ipconnect.de PRIVMSG #lisp :krumholt: i can't give you any good advice what the best external format for your application is." ":kreuter!n=kreuter@pool-96-252-14-107.bstnma.fios.verizon.net PRIVMSG #lisp :I can: use binary IO." ":Chrononaut!n=bjorn@195.20.207.210 JOIN :#lisp" ":H4ns!n=Hans@p57BB8E32.dip0.t-ipconnect.de PRIVMSG #lisp :kreuter: how does that help?" ":Xach!n=xach@207.5.178.18 PRIVMSG #lisp :ACTION thinks that's a stretch" ":nikodemus!n=nikodemu@cs27013130.pp.htv.fi PRIVMSG #lisp :can drakma do :element-type '(unsigned-byte 8)? is so, using that is the easiest way to be sure you don't end up with transcoding errors" ":H4ns!n=Hans@p57BB8E32.dip0.t-ipconnect.de PRIVMSG #lisp :it's silly. :)" ":nikodemus!n=nikodemu@cs27013130.pp.htv.fi PRIVMSG #lisp :s/is so/if so/" ":lemonodor!n=lemonodo@adsl-76-214-15-172.dsl.lsan03.sbcglobal.net JOIN :#lisp" ":H4ns!n=Hans@p57BB8E32.dip0.t-ipconnect.de PRIVMSG #lisp :nikodemus: sure" ":kreuter!n=kreuter@pool-96-252-14-107.bstnma.fios.verizon.net PRIVMSG #lisp :H4ns: it avoids the assumption that random stuff the web is validly encoded characters, which nothing other than a CL character stream expects stuff to be." ":nikodemus!n=nikodemu@cs27013130.pp.htv.fi PRIVMSG #lisp :then he at least has the correct content, and can play all sorts of \"guess the encoding\" games on it" ":H4ns!n=Hans@p57BB8E32.dip0.t-ipconnect.de PRIVMSG #lisp :*shrug*" ":nikodemus!n=nikodemu@cs27013130.pp.htv.fi PRIVMSG #lisp :well, latin1 works too..." ":H4ns!n=Hans@p57BB8E32.dip0.t-ipconnect.de PRIVMSG #lisp :that is why i said \"i can't give good advice\"." ":Chrononaut!n=bjorn@195.20.207.210 QUIT :Operation timed out" ":chandler!n=chandler@opendarwin/developer/chandler PRIVMSG #lisp :the easiest way to do that being to to read it in as latin1 until you hit an encoding header" ":chandler!n=chandler@opendarwin/developer/chandler PRIVMSG #lisp :either an actual header or a meta http-equiv" ":acrid!n=mckay@reverse.control4.com JOIN :#lisp" ":Chrononaut!n=bjorn@195.20.207.210 JOIN :#lisp" ":H4ns!n=Hans@p57BB8E32.dip0.t-ipconnect.de PRIVMSG #lisp :that is easy, assuming that your host has latin1 as the standard encoding." ":qbg!n=qbg@rn084084.morris.umn.edu QUIT :" ":qbg!n=qbg@rn084084.morris.umn.edu JOIN :#lisp" ":Chrononaut!n=bjorn@195.20.207.210 QUIT :Read error: 60 (Operation timed out)" ":seelenquell_!n=seelenqu@pD9E47023.dip.t-dialin.net QUIT :Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)" ":edon!n=edon@82.114.94.4 JOIN :#lisp" ":tritchey!n=tritchey@c-98-226-113-211.hsd1.in.comcast.net JOIN :#lisp" ":postamar!n=postamar@x-132-204-243-129.xtpr.umontreal.ca JOIN :#lisp" ":Chrononaut!n=bjorn@195.20.207.210 JOIN :#lisp" ":urnick!n=uruser@igwe16.vub.ac.be JOIN :#lisp" ":urnick!n=uruser@igwe16.vub.ac.be QUIT :Client Quit" ":nikodemus!n=nikodemu@cs27013130.pp.htv.fi PRIVMSG #lisp :sb-impl::indenting-stream appears unused" ":nikodemus!n=nikodemu@cs27013130.pp.htv.fi PRIVMSG #lisp :i wonder if anyone would miss it..." ":jtoy!n=jtoy@121.32.233.171 QUIT :" ":postamar!n=postamar@x-132-204-243-129.xtpr.umontreal.ca PART #lisp :" ":postamar!n=postamar@x-132-204-243-129.xtpr.umontreal.ca JOIN :#lisp" ":Xach!n=xach@207.5.178.18 PRIVMSG #lisp :How many hours have you personally wasted by mathematical typos in papers?" ":Chrononaut!n=bjorn@195.20.207.210 QUIT :Read error: 60 (Operation timed out)" ":Xof!n=crhodes@dunstaple.doc.gold.ac.uk PRIVMSG #lisp :quite a lot" ":mib_c4atm6vk!i=c142c881@gateway/web/ajax/mibbit.com/x-bb94dfd06e43fb2f PRIVMSG #lisp :many" ":mib_c4atm6vk!i=c142c881@gateway/web/ajax/mibbit.com/x-bb94dfd06e43fb2f PRIVMSG #lisp :yes" ":mib_c4atm6vk!i=c142c881@gateway/web/ajax/mibbit.com/x-bb94dfd06e43fb2f PRIVMSG #lisp :I am too stupid to figure out things on my own and usually just follow what on the paper" ":Xach!n=xach@207.5.178.18 PRIVMSG #lisp :I have been staring at this paper and making charts and diagrams and the like, and the problem turns out to be \"...\" where \"1 - ...\" is meant" ":nikodemus!n=nikodemu@cs27013130.pp.htv.fi PRIVMSG #lisp :not nearly as many as by undefined symbols used in equations..." ":mib_c4atm6vk!i=c142c881@gateway/web/ajax/mibbit.com/x-bb94dfd06e43fb2f PRIVMSG #lisp :in the end errors turn out like the PERL interpreter - when I finally figure out something was wrong.. I am too far from the source of error ;-)" ":urnick!n=uruser@igwe16.vub.ac.be JOIN :#lisp" ":mib_c4atm6vk!i=c142c881@gateway/web/ajax/mibbit.com/x-bb94dfd06e43fb2f PRIVMSG #lisp :is the paper public? can we have a okk ?" ":Xof!n=crhodes@dunstaple.doc.gold.ac.uk PRIVMSG #lisp :I don't like to break this to you, but papers are a social construct: they are no more authoritative or correct than the process that creates them" ":mib_c4atm6vk!i=c142c881@gateway/web/ajax/mibbit.com/x-bb94dfd06e43fb2f PRIVMSG #lisp :s/okk/look" ":Xach!n=xach@207.5.178.18 PRIVMSG #lisp :http://portal.acm.org/citation.cfm?id=79147.79150" ":mib_c4atm6vk!i=c142c881@gateway/web/ajax/mibbit.com/x-bb94dfd06e43fb2f PRIVMSG #lisp :damn.. an acm linky :'(" ":Xach!n=xach@207.5.178.18 PRIVMSG #lisp :mib_c4atm6vk: full pdf available, if not from there, elsewehere." ":mib_c4atm6vk!i=c142c881@gateway/web/ajax/mibbit.com/x-bb94dfd06e43fb2f PRIVMSG #lisp :hey xach.. if you have an acm account.. can you get a few papers for me?" ":Xach!n=xach@207.5.178.18 PRIVMSG #lisp :I don't and can't." ":nikodemus!n=nikodemu@cs27013130.pp.htv.fi PRIVMSG #lisp :\"wtf? would it have been too hard to add say what you mean by ? it's not exactly googlable, even if your thesis advisor uses it the same way you do...\"" ":z0d!n=z0d@unaffiliated/z0d PRIVMSG #lisp :hey Xach , if you have a credit card, could you buy me some stuff?" ":Xach!n=xach@207.5.178.18 PRIVMSG #lisp :z0d: now, now. some papers behind the acm firewall have generous redistribution terms, but just aren't available elsewhere." ":urnick!n=uruser@igwe16.vub.ac.be QUIT :Client Quit" ":Xach!n=xach@207.5.178.18 PRIVMSG #lisp :ACTION gets one small step closer to improving salza2 with dynamic huffman trees" ":slyrus_!n=slyrus@adsl-68-121-172-169.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net PRIVMSG #lisp :Xof: speaking of math, do you have some post on the web somewhere about how to do modular arithmetic in lisp?" ":mib_c4atm6vk!i=c142c881@gateway/web/ajax/mibbit.com/x-bb94dfd06e43fb2f PRIVMSG #lisp :McIntire's Common Lisp Modular Arithmetic Library" ":Xof!n=crhodes@dunstaple.doc.gold.ac.uk PRIVMSG #lisp :http://jcsu.jesus.cam.ac.uk/~csr21/papers/modular/modular.pdf" ":mcxx!n=mcxx@213.151.89.55 PRIVMSG #lisp :I need to chronologically compare timestamps which are strings (as returned be postmodern) - is there some function or library?" ":Xof!n=crhodes@dunstaple.doc.gold.ac.uk PRIVMSG #lisp :slyrus_: I don't know if that's what you meant" ":mib_c4atm6vk!i=c142c881@gateway/web/ajax/mibbit.com/x-bb94dfd06e43fb2f PRIVMSG #lisp :yup" ":antifuchs!n=asf@baker.boinkor.net PRIVMSG #lisp :mcxx: doesn't postmodern convert to universal-time?" ":antifuchs!n=asf@baker.boinkor.net PRIVMSG #lisp :mcxx: if not, maybe it offers functions to do that conversion for you... integers are probably way easier to compare (:" ":slyrus_!n=slyrus@adsl-68-121-172-169.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net PRIVMSG #lisp :Xof: that's what I was thinking of. thanks!" ":Xach!n=xach@207.5.178.18 PRIVMSG #lisp :mcxx: if they are ISO-8601 timestamps with the same time zone, you can compare them with string< and friends." ":mcxx!n=mcxx@213.151.89.55 PRIVMSG #lisp :antifuchs: ah, you're right, there's something in the simple-date library" ":Xach!n=xach@207.5.178.18 PRIVMSG #lisp :mcxx: what format are the strings, out of curiosity?" ":antifuchs!n=asf@baker.boinkor.net PRIVMSG #lisp :great (:" ":lemoinem!n=swoog@x-132-204-240-247.xtpr.umontreal.ca JOIN :#lisp" ":splittist!n=splittis@213.235.9.122 PRIVMSG #lisp :slyrus: implementing Schneir's Seive in CL? (:" ":slyrus_!n=slyrus@adsl-68-121-172-169.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net PRIVMSG #lisp :splittist: horizontal differencing for tiff images" ":mcxx!n=mcxx@213.151.89.55 PRIVMSG #lisp :though it seems there's some problem with it, will investigate" ":Super!n=al@2.2.8.b.0.7.4.0.1.0.0.2.ip6.arpa QUIT :Remote closed the connection" ":topo!n=topo@200.37.161.41 QUIT :Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)" ":mib_c4atm6vk!i=c142c881@gateway/web/ajax/mibbit.com/x-bb94dfd06e43fb2f PRIVMSG #lisp :@ : http://forums.microsoft.com/MSDN/ShowPost.aspx?PostID=3555380&SiteID=1" ":qbg!n=qbg@rn084084.morris.umn.edu QUIT :Remote closed the connection" ":pjb!n=t@67.Red-81-37-36.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net QUIT :Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)" ":mcxx!n=mcxx@213.151.89.55 PRIVMSG #lisp :Xach: sorry, missed your question, the string format is \"2008-10-30 15:31:33.596412+00\"" ":Xach!n=xach@207.5.178.18 PRIVMSG #lisp :mcxx: you can use string comparisons for that." ":Xach!n=xach@207.5.178.18 PRIVMSG #lisp :i think you might want to stop at the . or shortly after." ":attila_lendvai!n=ati@catv-89-133-170-239.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #lisp :mcxx: get the latest local-time repo and call (local-time:set-local-time-cl-postgres-readers). then postmodern will return local-time instances" ":mib_c4atm6vk!i=c142c881@gateway/web/ajax/mibbit.com/x-bb94dfd06e43fb2f PRIVMSG #lisp :use *natural sort*" ":envi^home!n=envi@220.121.234.156 QUIT :\"Leaving\"" ":Xach!n=xach@207.5.178.18 PRIVMSG #lisp :ACTION gets a tingling younderian sensation" ":yrlnry!n=mjd@treebase-demo.cis.upenn.edu JOIN :#lisp" ":yrlnry!n=mjd@treebase-demo.cis.upenn.edu PRIVMSG #lisp :Who's the guy who invented Common Lisp's \"format\" feature? His name is Dan something, but I forget." ":Xach!n=xach@207.5.178.18 PRIVMSG #lisp :Daniel Weinreb" ":Xach!n=xach@207.5.178.18 PRIVMSG #lisp :We heard about your exchange." ":neurogeek_!n=neurogee@201.208.73.206 JOIN :#lisp" ":Xach!n=xach@207.5.178.18 PRIVMSG #lisp :ACTION giggled" ":mib_c4atm6vk!i=c142c881@gateway/web/ajax/mibbit.com/x-bb94dfd06e43fb2f PRIVMSG #lisp :lol..Dan something" ":mib_c4atm6vk!i=c142c881@gateway/web/ajax/mibbit.com/x-bb94dfd06e43fb2f PRIVMSG #lisp :;-)" ":yrlnry!n=mjd@treebase-demo.cis.upenn.edu PRIVMSG #lisp :Thanks!" ":yrlnry!n=mjd@treebase-demo.cis.upenn.edu PRIVMSG #lisp :Which exchange?" ":mib_c4atm6vk!i=c142c881@gateway/web/ajax/mibbit.com/x-bb94dfd06e43fb2f PRIVMSG #lisp :exchange?" ":Xach!n=xach@207.5.178.18 PRIVMSG #lisp :yrlnry: the oospla one with dan." ":yrlnry!n=mjd@treebase-demo.cis.upenn.edu PRIVMSG #lisp :\\The one where he asked if it was doing an automatic deconstruction and I said \"Yes, it's doing DESTRUCTURING-BIND\"?" ":vy!n=user@213.139.194.86 QUIT :Remote closed the connection" ":sellout!n=greg@guest-fw.dc4.itasoftware.com PRIVMSG #lisp :yrlnry: The one where you said something about Perl regexps and FORMAT, and then Dan said \"I wrote FORMAT\"" ":yrlnry!n=mjd@treebase-demo.cis.upenn.edu PRIVMSG #lisp :Oh, that exchange!" ":mib_c4atm6vk!i=c142c881@gateway/web/ajax/mibbit.com/x-bb94dfd06e43fb2f PRIVMSG #lisp :details!" ":epoch!n=K-I-S-S@p3m/member/epoch QUIT :\"  \"" ":mib_c4atm6vk!i=c142c881@gateway/web/ajax/mibbit.com/x-bb94dfd06e43fb2f PRIVMSG #lisp :more :-)" ":Xach!n=xach@207.5.178.18 PRIVMSG #lisp :mib_c4atm6vk: Check the logs." ":Xach!n=xach@207.5.178.18 PRIVMSG #lisp :minion, logs" ":minion!n=minion@208.72.159.207 PRIVMSG #lisp :logs: #lisp logs are available at http://ccl.clozure.com/irc-logs/lisp/ ; older logs may be available at http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/lisp/ (down as of 2008/09/24)" ":yrlnry!n=mjd@treebase-demo.cis.upenn.edu PRIVMSG #lisp :And then I thanked him for inventing the perfect response to Smug Lisp Weenies who criticize the Perl regex syntax for being horrible." ":lnxz!n=joachim@bjo1-1x-dhcp208.studby.uio.no QUIT :Read error: 60 (Operation timed out)" ":mib_c4atm6vk!i=c142c881@gateway/web/ajax/mibbit.com/x-bb94dfd06e43fb2f PRIVMSG #lisp :yrlnry's book on FP in PERL rox" ":sellout!n=greg@guest-fw.dc4.itasoftware.com PRIVMSG #lisp :yrlnry: We have Perl regexes now, too ;)" ":mib_c4atm6vk!i=c142c881@gateway/web/ajax/mibbit.com/x-bb94dfd06e43fb2f PRIVMSG #lisp :he he" ":mib_c4atm6vk!i=c142c881@gateway/web/ajax/mibbit.com/x-bb94dfd06e43fb2f PRIVMSG #lisp :minion is a bot?" ":Xach!n=xach@207.5.178.18 PRIVMSG #lisp :mib_c4atm6vk: minion is a bot." ":MHOOO!n=nah@6-108.vpn.RWTH-Aachen.DE JOIN :#lisp" ":mcxx!n=mcxx@213.151.89.55 PRIVMSG #lisp :ah, problem solved - as written in the docs, when loading simple-date after postmodern, it associates readers and writters for the appropriate data types, so now I can work with the timestamp class defined in the library, which is OK for me" ":mib_c4atm6vk!i=c142c881@gateway/web/ajax/mibbit.com/x-bb94dfd06e43fb2f PRIVMSG #lisp :thanks Xach" ":attila_lendvai!n=ati@catv-89-133-170-239.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #lisp :i tend to steer clear of complex format strings even after two years of lisping. but just recently wrote one recently in a print-object that prints an indented tree..." ":attila_lendvai!n=ati@catv-89-133-170-239.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #lisp :mcxx: fyi, local-time is scheduled to replace simple-date. it's just missing one last feature: a partial timestamp object to represent things like a date..." ":yrlnry!n=mjd@treebase-demo.cis.upenn.edu PRIVMSG #lisp :sellout was right. I was a bit taken aback." ":yrlnry!n=mjd@treebase-demo.cis.upenn.edu PRIVMSG #lisp :Thanks for reminding me what his name was." ":mcxx!n=mcxx@213.151.89.55 PRIVMSG #lisp :but can I somehow define, that simple-date has to be loaded after postmodern? is it sufficient that :simple-date will be later in the defpackage than :postmodern?" ":mib_c4atm6vk!i=c142c881@gateway/web/ajax/mibbit.com/x-bb94dfd06e43fb2f PRIVMSG #lisp :how can someone forget dan's name?" ":inetic!n=inetic@chello082119124030.chello.sk JOIN :#lisp" ":mib_c4atm6vk!i=c142c881@gateway/web/ajax/mibbit.com/x-bb94dfd06e43fb2f PRIVMSG #lisp ::-O" ":mcxx!n=mcxx@213.151.89.55 PRIVMSG #lisp :attila_lendvai: hmmm, ok, I'll look at local-time" ":Xach!n=xach@207.5.178.18 PRIVMSG #lisp :mib_c4atm6vk: Please don't write *everything* that pops into your head." ":sellout!n=greg@guest-fw.dc4.itasoftware.com PRIVMSG #lisp :mib_c4atm6vk: yrlnry isn't exactly a daily lisper." ":attila_lendvai!n=ati@catv-89-133-170-239.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #lisp :mcxx: not a big deal if you are after some short hack, but i'd go with local-time for anything lasting" ":yrlnry!n=mjd@treebase-demo.cis.upenn.edu PRIVMSG #lisp :I am quite capable of forgetting nearly anything." ":eevar2!n=jalla@106.80-203-27.nextgentel.com QUIT :\"This computer has gone to sleep\"" ":mib_c4atm6vk!i=c142c881@gateway/web/ajax/mibbit.com/x-bb94dfd06e43fb2f PRIVMSG #lisp :apologies. that oospla is on youtube?" ":yrlnry!n=mjd@treebase-demo.cis.upenn.edu PRIVMSG #lisp :I don't know. But I do know that they are going to make all the talks available online, synchronized with the slides, eventually." ":mcxx!n=mcxx@213.151.89.55 PRIVMSG #lisp :attila_lendvai: I'm working on a long-term project, so it's probably a better idea to use local-time" ":cracki!n=cracki@41-077.eduroam.RWTH-Aachen.DE JOIN :#lisp" ":yrlnry!n=mjd@treebase-demo.cis.upenn.edu PRIVMSG #lisp :Ooh. \"Alan Kay bashing Edsger Dijkstra in 1997 OOPSLA Keynote\"" ":inetic!n=inetic@chello082119124030.chello.sk PRIVMSG #lisp :hi guys, is there some sort of a command to the \"format\" function that would print a string n times? something like (format t \"~n~(hello~)\" 3) and it would print the string hello three times (of course I made up the stuff inside the quotes)" ":mib_c4atm6vk!i=c142c881@gateway/web/ajax/mibbit.com/x-bb94dfd06e43fb2f PRIVMSG #lisp :I heard a lot of cool stuff happened there.. seems even MS came with F# or something.. saw Joe's video.. wanted to mail dan for video linky but he has only the ilc id which he does not check often" ":mib_c4atm6vk!i=c142c881@gateway/web/ajax/mibbit.com/x-bb94dfd06e43fb2f PRIVMSG #lisp :@inetic : loop" ":mib_c4atm6vk!i=c142c881@gateway/web/ajax/mibbit.com/x-bb94dfd06e43fb2f PRIVMSG #lisp :lambda" ":H4ns!n=Hans@p57BB8E32.dip0.t-ipconnect.de PRIVMSG #lisp :clhs ~T" ":specbot!n=specbot@208.72.159.207 PRIVMSG #lisp :http://www.lispworks.com/reference/HyperSpec/Body/22_cfa.htm" ":Xach!n=xach@207.5.178.18 PRIVMSG #lisp :inetic: not built-in to format" ":inetic!n=inetic@chello082119124030.chello.sk PRIVMSG #lisp :mib_c4atm6vk: thanks, I know I could make it with loop or lambda, I was just curious (since the format function allready has plenty of thinks that ease this kind of tasks)" ":inetic!n=inetic@chello082119124030.chello.sk PRIVMSG #lisp :Xach, thanks" ":mib_c4atm6vk!i=c142c881@gateway/web/ajax/mibbit.com/x-bb94dfd06e43fb2f PRIVMSG #lisp :there was a reason: http://cs-www.cs.yale.edu/homes/dvm/format-stinks.html" ":mib_c4atm6vk!i=c142c881@gateway/web/ajax/mibbit.com/x-bb94dfd06e43fb2f PRIVMSG #lisp ::-)" ":yrlnry!n=mjd@treebase-demo.cis.upenn.edu PRIVMSG #lisp :I dunno if it stinks. It's kind of appalling in some ways." ":yrlnry!n=mjd@treebase-demo.cis.upenn.edu PRIVMSG #lisp :I admire it, actually." ":yrlnry!n=mjd@treebase-demo.cis.upenn.edu PRIVMSG #lisp :That's one of the sections in CLTL that I reread for fun." ":milanj!n=milan@77.46.248.122 JOIN :#lisp" ":mib_c4atm6vk!i=c142c881@gateway/web/ajax/mibbit.com/x-bb94dfd06e43fb2f PRIVMSG #lisp :ha ha.. in perl you would do print \"hello\" x $n" ":inetic!n=inetic@chello082119124030.chello.sk PRIVMSG #lisp ::-) I read it like a week ago, the article might have some good ideas but I believe that guy takes it too personally :-)" ":mib_c4atm6vk!i=c142c881@gateway/web/ajax/mibbit.com/x-bb94dfd06e43fb2f PRIVMSG #lisp :?" ":mib_c4atm6vk!i=c142c881@gateway/web/ajax/mibbit.com/x-bb94dfd06e43fb2f PRIVMSG #lisp :mjd.. was I wrong?" ":c|mell!n=cmell@v113243.ppp.asahi-net.or.jp JOIN :#lisp" ":yrlnry!n=mjd@treebase-demo.cis.upenn.edu PRIVMSG #lisp :wrong about what?" ":mib_c4atm6vk!i=c142c881@gateway/web/ajax/mibbit.com/x-bb94dfd06e43fb2f PRIVMSG #lisp :print \"hello\" x $n -> \"format\" function that would print a string n times?" ":mib_c4atm6vk!i=c142c881@gateway/web/ajax/mibbit.com/x-bb94dfd06e43fb2f PRIVMSG #lisp :in PERL that is" ":ia!n=ia@89.169.165.188 QUIT :Success" ":yrlnry!n=mjd@treebase-demo.cis.upenn.edu PRIVMSG #lisp :Well, sort of. $a x $b does build a string that has $a repeated $b times." ":Chrononaut!n=bjorn@195.20.207.210 JOIN :#lisp" ":yrlnry!n=mjd@treebase-demo.cis.upenn.edu PRIVMSG #lisp :I'm not sure I'd want to compare it with format. I think the Perl \"pack\" facility is a lot more analogous to format." ":mib_c4atm6vk!i=c142c881@gateway/web/ajax/mibbit.com/x-bb94dfd06e43fb2f PRIVMSG #lisp :you had code to compile PERL to lisp right?" ":yrlnry!n=mjd@treebase-demo.cis.upenn.edu PRIVMSG #lisp :Not me." ":ia!n=ia@89.169.165.188 JOIN :#lisp" ":mib_c4atm6vk!i=c142c881@gateway/web/ajax/mibbit.com/x-bb94dfd06e43fb2f PRIVMSG #lisp ::-x" ":inetic!n=inetic@chello082119124030.chello.sk PRIVMSG #lisp :actualy there might be a better way of doing what I want to achieve, basically I would like to indent a text I generate on the fly and the repeating thing I was asking about was to meant to do this" ":mib_c4atm6vk!i=c142c881@gateway/web/ajax/mibbit.com/x-bb94dfd06e43fb2f PRIVMSG #lisp :oo" ":yrlnry!n=mjd@treebase-demo.cis.upenn.edu PRIVMSG #lisp :Doesn't format have some ~J escape that right-justifies text?" ":inetic!n=inetic@chello082119124030.chello.sk PRIVMSG #lisp :yrlnry, don't know, haven't read the full spec of format function, gonna check it out, thanks" ":yrlnry!n=mjd@treebase-demo.cis.upenn.edu PRIVMSG #lisp :Holy shit, I was joking, but it's true." ":Xach!n=xach@207.5.178.18 PRIVMSG #lisp :inetic: ~T" ":slyrus_!n=slyrus@adsl-68-121-172-169.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net QUIT :Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)" ":Xach!n=xach@207.5.178.18 PRIVMSG #lisp :H4ns must have had his psychic-debugging hat on." ":H4ns!n=Hans@p57BB8E32.dip0.t-ipconnect.de PRIVMSG #lisp ::D" ":inetic!n=inetic@chello082119124030.chello.sk PRIVMSG #lisp :Xach, many thanks that seems to be just it" ":chandler!n=chandler@opendarwin/developer/chandler PRIVMSG #lisp :H4ns: hey, give that back." ":vasa!n=vasa@mm-15-88-84-93.dynamic.pppoe.mgts.by QUIT :\"I am not vasya, i am vasa\"" ":creddy!n=CrazyEdd@wrongplanet/CrazyEddy QUIT :Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)" ":dnm!n=dnm@c-68-49-46-251.hsd1.va.comcast.net QUIT :" ":yrlnry!n=mjd@treebase-demo.cis.upenn.edu PRIVMSG #lisp :This Drew McDermott article about format asks and answers the obvious question about format." ":mib_c4atm6vk!i=c142c881@gateway/web/ajax/mibbit.com/x-bb94dfd06e43fb2f PRIVMSG #lisp :yup" ":prxq!n=mommer@Ya614.y.pppool.de JOIN :#lisp" ":creddy!n=CrazyEdd@wrongplanet/CrazyEddy JOIN :#lisp" ":mib_c4atm6vk!i=c142c881@gateway/web/ajax/mibbit.com/x-bb94dfd06e43fb2f PRIVMSG #lisp :@Xach : http://xach.livejournal.com/193855.html - but there is *n8* free lisp for windows (leaving out clisp)" ":LiamH!n=none@common-lisp.net JOIN :#lisp" ":kiuma!n=kiuma@83-103-59-156.ip.fastwebnet.it QUIT :\"Bye bye ppl\"" ":mib_c4atm6vk!i=c142c881@gateway/web/ajax/mibbit.com/x-bb94dfd06e43fb2f PRIVMSG #lisp :s/n8/no" ":mishok13!n=gdmfsob@dm.sonopia.com QUIT :Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)" ":cracki!n=cracki@41-077.eduroam.RWTH-Aachen.DE QUIT :Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)" ":krumholt!n=krumholt@port-92-202-28-17.dynamic.qsc.de PRIVMSG #lisp :can i create a keyword from a string? i wanna call a function like (foo :mykeyword (some form)). currently (some form) evaluates to a string." ":sellout!n=greg@guest-fw.dc4.itasoftware.com PRIVMSG #lisp :mib_c4atm6vk: SBCL?" ":proq!n=user@unaffiliated/proqesi PRIVMSG #lisp :mib_c4atm6vk: sbcl is coming along for windows" ":sellout!n=greg@guest-fw.dc4.itasoftware.com PRIVMSG #lisp :SCL?" ":sellout!n=greg@guest-fw.dc4.itasoftware.com PRIVMSG #lisp :(free as in beer)" ":sellout!n=greg@guest-fw.dc4.itasoftware.com PRIVMSG #lisp :(so, nm)" ":mib_c4atm6vk!i=c142c881@gateway/web/ajax/mibbit.com/x-bb94dfd06e43fb2f PRIVMSG #lisp :sbcl!" ":splittist!n=splittis@213.235.9.122 PRIVMSG #lisp :ccl" ":H4ns!n=Hans@p57BB8E32.dip0.t-ipconnect.de PRIVMSG #lisp :krumholt: you certainly can, see find-symbol or intern" ":sellout!n=greg@guest-fw.dc4.itasoftware.com PRIVMSG #lisp :splittist: ccl is what started this." ":mib_c4atm6vk!i=c142c881@gateway/web/ajax/mibbit.com/x-bb94dfd06e43fb2f PRIVMSG #lisp :clozure has lots of issues.. but better than sbcl.. but still too much of issues on windows" ":H4ns!n=Hans@p57BB8E32.dip0.t-ipconnect.de PRIVMSG #lisp :krumholt: also see symbol-string, experiment and read documentation before claiming that they don't work." ":splittist!n=splittis@213.235.9.122 PRIVMSG #lisp :sellout: Oh. I take that as a sign." ":sellout!n=greg@guest-fw.dc4.itasoftware.com PRIVMSG #lisp :mib_c4atm6vk: Yeah, the CCL port is still alpha." ":splittist!n=splittis@213.235.9.122 QUIT :\"Signing off\"" ":sellout!n=greg@guest-fw.dc4.itasoftware.com PRIVMSG #lisp :(or beta?) I can't keep up with platforms I don't use." ":mib_c4atm6vk!i=c142c881@gateway/web/ajax/mibbit.com/x-bb94dfd06e43fb2f PRIVMSG #lisp :*everything* lisp associated with windows is alpha" ":H4ns!n=Hans@p57BB8E32.dip0.t-ipconnect.de PRIVMSG #lisp :mib_c4atm6vk: ?" ":sellout!n=greg@guest-fw.dc4.itasoftware.com PRIVMSG #lisp :mib_c4atm6vk: Lispworks is nice on Windows." ":mib_c4atm6vk!i=c142c881@gateway/web/ajax/mibbit.com/x-bb94dfd06e43fb2f PRIVMSG #lisp :lisp => you loose if you use windows ?" ":mib_c4atm6vk!i=c142c881@gateway/web/ajax/mibbit.com/x-bb94dfd06e43fb2f PRIVMSG #lisp :ah.. but what about the nice limitations?" ":H4ns!n=Hans@p57BB8E32.dip0.t-ipconnect.de PRIVMSG #lisp :mib_c4atm6vk: allegro also works great on windows." ":sellout!n=greg@guest-fw.dc4.itasoftware.com PRIVMSG #lisp :And makes nice applications: http://www.inspiration.com/InspireData" ":mib_c4atm6vk!i=c142c881@gateway/web/ajax/mibbit.com/x-bb94dfd06e43fb2f PRIVMSG #lisp :@H4ns : agree with Lispworks and allegro" ":mib_c4atm6vk!i=c142c881@gateway/web/ajax/mibbit.com/x-bb94dfd06e43fb2f PRIVMSG #lisp :but they are either too expensive or go out of they way to not let you use slime" ":sellout!n=greg@guest-fw.dc4.itasoftware.com PRIVMSG #lisp :mib_c4atm6vk: True, LW does make slime hard." ":xristos!n=x@dns.suspicious.org PRIVMSG #lisp :allegro works fine with slime" ":sellout!n=greg@guest-fw.dc4.itasoftware.com PRIVMSG #lisp :(the free version does, not the pay version)" ":ths_!n=ths@p549AF97F.dip.t-dialin.net JOIN :#lisp" ":derekv!n=derek@noogenesis.resnet.mtu.edu QUIT :Remote closed the connection" ":mib_c4atm6vk!i=c142c881@gateway/web/ajax/mibbit.com/x-bb94dfd06e43fb2f PRIVMSG #lisp :@sellout : the free version of allgero is badly crippled" ":mib_c4atm6vk!i=c142c881@gateway/web/ajax/mibbit.com/x-bb94dfd06e43fb2f PRIVMSG #lisp :and the full version is TIGHTLY interagted with their IDE :'(" ":H4ns!n=Hans@p57BB8E32.dip0.t-ipconnect.de PRIVMSG #lisp :mib_c4atm6vk: no." ":mib_c4atm6vk!i=c142c881@gateway/web/ajax/mibbit.com/x-bb94dfd06e43fb2f PRIVMSG #lisp :The way I see it - use Linux if you wanna do anything lisp.. what do you guys think?" ":xristos!n=x@dns.suspicious.org PRIVMSG #lisp :i use osx" ":mib_c4atm6vk!i=c142c881@gateway/web/ajax/mibbit.com/x-bb94dfd06e43fb2f PRIVMSG #lisp :@H4ns.. do let me know where I am wrong" ":H4ns!n=Hans@p57BB8E32.dip0.t-ipconnect.de PRIVMSG #lisp :mib_c4atm6vk: the real issue with allegro is the licensing. otherwise it is just fine." ":mib_c4atm6vk!i=c142c881@gateway/web/ajax/mibbit.com/x-bb94dfd06e43fb2f PRIVMSG #lisp :call me mib.." ":mib_c4atm6vk!i=c142c881@gateway/web/ajax/mibbit.com/x-bb94dfd06e43fb2f PRIVMSG #lisp :allegro is obscene with the paid version .. 5000+ !! :-O" ":H4ns!n=Hans@p57BB8E32.dip0.t-ipconnect.de PRIVMSG #lisp :mib_c4atm6vk: i don't use linux. windows and freebsd here." ":neurogeek_!n=neurogee@201.208.73.206 QUIT :Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)" ":Xof!n=crhodes@dunstaple.doc.gold.ac.uk PRIVMSG #lisp :if I wanted to hear tedious discussions about proprietary lisps, I'd be on some other network" ":Xof!n=crhodes@dunstaple.doc.gold.ac.uk PRIVMSG #lisp :please move such discussions elsewhere" ":_8david!n=user@port-83-236-3-70.dynamic.qsc.de PRIVMSG #lisp :proq: really? who's working on it?" ":ignas!n=ignas@office.pov.lt QUIT :Read error: 113 (No route to host)" ":mib_c4atm6vk!i=c142c881@gateway/web/ajax/mibbit.com/x-bb94dfd06e43fb2f PRIVMSG #lisp :@Xof : I agree with your view.. but not all customers use lisp.. and buying a commercial license for a niche product is a tough thing" ":mib_c4atm6vk!i=c142c881@gateway/web/ajax/mibbit.com/x-bb94dfd06e43fb2f PRIVMSG #lisp :getting lisp to work on AIX/windows is pain.. even" ":H4ns!n=Hans@p57BB8E32.dip0.t-ipconnect.de PRIVMSG #lisp :mib_c4atm6vk: if you want free lisp, use a free os. if you want commercial os, use commercial lisp. it is really that easy." ":beach!n=user@ABordeaux-158-1-73-156.w90-60.abo.wanadoo.fr PRIVMSG #lisp :mib_c4atm6vk: Your nick is new, but you seem very familiar. Have you been here before with a different nick?" ":Riastradh!n=rias@pool-141-154-225-78.bos.east.verizon.net PRIVMSG #lisp :I don't use Linux..." ":H4ns!n=Hans@p57BB8E32.dip0.t-ipconnect.de PRIVMSG #lisp :Riastradh: neither do i" ":davazp!n=user@77.Red-83-54-164.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net JOIN :#lisp" ":Chrononaut!n=bjorn@195.20.207.210 QUIT :Read error: 60 (Operation timed out)" ":mib_c4atm6vk!i=c142c881@gateway/web/ajax/mibbit.com/x-bb94dfd06e43fb2f PRIVMSG #lisp :@H4ns.. yes you have logic in that" ":enn!i=eli@ahab.flyoverblues.com JOIN :#lisp" ":mib_c4atm6vk!i=c142c881@gateway/web/ajax/mibbit.com/x-bb94dfd06e43fb2f PRIVMSG #lisp :@beach: any names you have at mind?" ":mib_c4atm6vk!i=c142c881@gateway/web/ajax/mibbit.com/x-bb94dfd06e43fb2f PRIVMSG #lisp :@Riastradh : what you use on windows?" ":beach!n=user@ABordeaux-158-1-73-156.w90-60.abo.wanadoo.fr PRIVMSG #lisp :mib_c4atm6vk: I take that to be a \"yes\"." ":ths!n=ths@p549AEF4B.dip.t-dialin.net QUIT :Nick collision from services." ":ths_!n=ths@p549AF97F.dip.t-dialin.net NICK :ths" ":MHOOO!n=nah@6-108.vpn.RWTH-Aachen.DE QUIT :Read error: 113 (No route to host)" ":topo!n=topo@200.37.161.41 JOIN :#lisp" ":Jacob_H!n=jacob@92.4.94.15 QUIT :\"Leaving\"" ":MHOOO!n=nah@6-202.vpn.RWTH-Aachen.DE JOIN :#lisp" ":Yuuhi!n=user@p5483BB53.dip.t-dialin.net JOIN :#lisp" ":benny!n=benny@i577A0084.versanet.de QUIT :Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)" ":jfrancis!n=jfrancis@72.14.224.1 JOIN :#lisp" ":Krystof!i=csr21@howells.doc.gold.ac.uk JOIN :#lisp" ":proq!n=user@unaffiliated/proqesi PRIVMSG #lisp :mib_c4atm6vk: not all *customers* use lisp? what exactly are you selling?" ":mib_c4atm6vk!i=c142c881@gateway/web/ajax/mibbit.com/x-bb94dfd06e43fb2f PRIVMSG #lisp :nothing yet.. but a product developed in lisp would be hard to port to any other \"mainstream\" language.. python maybe,, but oh well" ":jao!n=user@74.Red-80-24-4.staticIP.rima-tde.net QUIT :Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)" ":mib_c4atm6vk!i=c142c881@gateway/web/ajax/mibbit.com/x-bb94dfd06e43fb2f PRIVMSG #lisp :way I see it.. develop things in lisp if you are goign to provide a serivec.. not products that will be run on far away computers outside you reach" ":nikodemus`!n=nikodemu@cs27013130.pp.htv.fi JOIN :#lisp" ":H4ns!n=Hans@p57BB8E32.dip0.t-ipconnect.de PRIVMSG #lisp :mib_c4atm6vk: because....?" ":tayssir!n=user@streamtech.xs4all.nl QUIT :Read error: 113 (No route to host)" ":_8david!n=user@port-83-236-3-70.dynamic.qsc.de PRIVMSG #lisp :does mibbit.com still mean gavino, or do we have other mibbit.com users there days?" ":mib_c4atm6vk!i=c142c881@gateway/web/ajax/mibbit.com/x-bb94dfd06e43fb2f PRIVMSG #lisp :who is gavino?" ":H4ns!n=Hans@p57BB8E32.dip0.t-ipconnect.de PRIVMSG #lisp :*blush* i fed the troll, time to go home!" ":mib_c4atm6vk!i=c142c881@gateway/web/ajax/mibbit.com/x-bb94dfd06e43fb2f PRIVMSG #lisp :I will just shut up" ":H4ns!n=Hans@p57BB8E32.dip0.t-ipconnect.de QUIT :\"Leaving.\"" ":amnesiac!n=amnesiac@p3m/member/Amnesiac JOIN :#lisp" ":mcxx!n=mcxx@213.151.89.55 PRIVMSG #lisp :attila_lendvai: you are the maintainer of local-time?" ":beach!n=user@ABordeaux-158-1-73-156.w90-60.abo.wanadoo.fr PRIVMSG #lisp :_8david: there are others" ":Chrononaut!n=bjorn@195.20.207.210 JOIN :#lisp" ":antgreen!n=green@nat/redhat/x-7f1fbe5f492f7e37 JOIN :#lisp" ":ace4016!i=ace4016@cpe-76-168-248-118.socal.res.rr.com QUIT :\"When there's nothing left to burn, you have to set yourself on fire.\"" ":nikodemus!n=nikodemu@cs27013130.pp.htv.fi QUIT :Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)" ":mib_c4atm6vk!i=c142c881@gateway/web/ajax/mibbit.com/x-bb94dfd06e43fb2f PRIVMSG #lisp :I am sorry I trolled. I did not realize it would turn into one but it did, so I will just leave." ":dlowe!n=dlowe@ita4fw1.itasoftware.com PRIVMSG #lisp :mcxx: attila is the primary contributor. technically, I'm the maintainer" ":alley_cat!i=AlleyCat@sourcemage/elder/alleycat JOIN :#lisp" ":gigamonkey!n=user@adsl-99-169-83-0.dsl.pltn13.sbcglobal.net JOIN :#lisp" ":attila_lendvai!n=ati@catv-89-133-170-239.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #lisp :mcxx: well, i'd say i'm *a* primary contributor, but dlowe is running the whole thing" ":gigamonkey!n=user@adsl-99-169-83-0.dsl.pltn13.sbcglobal.net PRIVMSG #lisp :Any numerical analysts in the house?" ":beach!n=user@ABordeaux-158-1-73-156.w90-60.abo.wanadoo.fr PRIVMSG #lisp :gigamonkey: you know the rule: don't ask meta-questions, just ask your question." ":mcxx!n=mcxx@213.151.89.55 PRIVMSG #lisp :dlowe: so you can probably edit the website - the 'darcs get http://www.common-lisp.net/project/local-time/darcs/local-time' is not working, you have to drop 'www.' to make it work, just to let you know" ":dlowe!n=dlowe@ita4fw1.itasoftware.com PRIVMSG #lisp :mcxx: oops. thanks!" ":appletizer!i=user@82-46-30-39.cable.ubr04.hawk.blueyonder.co.uk QUIT :Remote closed the connection" ":dlowe!n=dlowe@ita4fw1.itasoftware.com PRIVMSG #lisp :mcxx: all fixed" ":mcxx!n=mcxx@213.151.89.55 PRIVMSG #lisp ::)" ":lisppaste!n=lisppast@208.72.159.207 PRIVMSG #lisp :gigamonkey pasted \"Help me with some floating point foo?\" at http://paste.lisp.org/display/69451" ":gigamonkey!n=user@adsl-99-169-83-0.dsl.pltn13.sbcglobal.net PRIVMSG #lisp :sorry beach." ":amnesiac!n=amnesiac@p3m/member/Amnesiac PRIVMSG #lisp :gigamonkey, are you trying to hose the voting system!!!?" ":amnesiac!n=amnesiac@p3m/member/Amnesiac PRIVMSG #lisp ::P" ":gigamonkey!n=user@adsl-99-169-83-0.dsl.pltn13.sbcglobal.net PRIVMSG #lisp :amnesiac: I'm trying to speed this up a bit (http://www.gigamonkeys.com/election/election.xul, Firefox 3 only)" ":Adamant!n=Adamant@c-98-244-152-196.hsd1.ga.comcast.net JOIN :#lisp" ":Xof!n=crhodes@dunstaple.doc.gold.ac.uk PRIVMSG #lisp :without thinking about it too hard, and without reading your code, I'd suggest adding logarithms of probabilities rather than multiplying probabilities" ":Xof!n=crhodes@dunstaple.doc.gold.ac.uk PRIVMSG #lisp :when you add probabilities together, be sure to start with the smallest" ":Xof!n=crhodes@dunstaple.doc.gold.ac.uk PRIVMSG #lisp :but basically, what you are likely to be observing is that floating-point addition isn't associative: a + (b + c) does not always equal (a + b) + c" ":gigamonkey!n=user@adsl-99-169-83-0.dsl.pltn13.sbcglobal.net PRIVMSG #lisp :Xof: Hmmm. Good idea." ":Xof!n=crhodes@dunstaple.doc.gold.ac.uk PRIVMSG #lisp :so, instead of maintaining the state (no pun intended) as just the sum of accumulated probabilities, maintain the full list and add it (in the right order, smallest first) each time you need it" ":gigamonkey!n=user@adsl-99-169-83-0.dsl.pltn13.sbcglobal.net PRIVMSG #lisp :full list of what?" ":mib_c4atm6vk!i=c142c881@gateway/web/ajax/mibbit.com/x-bb94dfd06e43fb2f PRIVMSG #lisp :probabliies vs state" ":schasi!n=schasi@p54A2457A.dip.t-dialin.net JOIN :#lisp" ":Xof!n=crhodes@dunstaple.doc.gold.ac.uk PRIVMSG #lisp :instead of having your current state as a number, which you can remove and add states to (if you see what I mean), have the state of your calculation be a hash table or similar" ":schasi!n=schasi@p54A2457A.dip.t-dialin.net QUIT :Client Quit" ":mib_c4atm6vk!i=c142c881@gateway/web/ajax/mibbit.com/x-bb94dfd06e43fb2f PRIVMSG #lisp :OT - I know gigamonkey is Pascal, who is Xof? He's good!" ":silenius!n=jl@yian-ho03.nir.cronon.net PRIVMSG #lisp :oO" ":mib_c4atm6vk!i=c142c881@gateway/web/ajax/mibbit.com/x-bb94dfd06e43fb2f PRIVMSG #lisp :yes.. state can be key of the hash" ":Xof!n=crhodes@dunstaple.doc.gold.ac.uk PRIVMSG #lisp :how do you feel, gigamonkey, at being misidentified? Better or worse than not being famous at all?" ":jsnell!n=jsnell@vasara.proghammer.com PRIVMSG #lisp :Xof is obviously losing his touch" ":mib_c4atm6vk!i=c142c881@gateway/web/ajax/mibbit.com/x-bb94dfd06e43fb2f PRIVMSG #lisp :oh no.. I am wrong again" ":gigamonkey!n=user@adsl-99-169-83-0.dsl.pltn13.sbcglobal.net PRIVMSG #lisp :Xof: somehow, I'll survive." ":mib_c4atm6vk!i=c142c881@gateway/web/ajax/mibbit.com/x-bb94dfd06e43fb2f PRIVMSG #lisp ::'(" ":mib_c4atm6vk!i=c142c881@gateway/web/ajax/mibbit.com/x-bb94dfd06e43fb2f PRIVMSG #lisp :no serisouly.. how is who?" ":mib_c4atm6vk!i=c142c881@gateway/web/ajax/mibbit.com/x-bb94dfd06e43fb2f PRIVMSG #lisp :google is failing me .. please" ":mib_c4atm6vk!i=c142c881@gateway/web/ajax/mibbit.com/x-bb94dfd06e43fb2f PRIVMSG #lisp :I am serious" ":Xach!n=xach@207.5.178.18 PRIVMSG #lisp :That's a tall request coming from \"mib_\"" ":ahaas!n=ahaas@c-76-17-41-185.hsd1.ga.comcast.net PRIVMSG #lisp :mib_c4atm6vk: Didn't you promise to be quiet?" ":mib_c4atm6vk!i=c142c881@gateway/web/ajax/mibbit.com/x-bb94dfd06e43fb2f PRIVMSG #lisp :yes.. but the suspense is killing me" ":mib_c4atm6vk!i=c142c881@gateway/web/ajax/mibbit.com/x-bb94dfd06e43fb2f PRIVMSG #lisp :plz" ":Xach!n=xach@207.5.178.18 PRIVMSG #lisp :mib_c4atm6vk: Go away." ":gigamonkey!n=user@adsl-99-169-83-0.dsl.pltn13.sbcglobal.net PRIVMSG #lisp :Xof: you mean each element of the ev-probabilities array?" ":mib_c4atm6vk!i=c142c881@gateway/web/ajax/mibbit.com/x-bb94dfd06e43fb2f PRIVMSG #lisp :promise.. but after the names" ":ChanServ!ChanServ@services. MODE #lisp +o Xach " ":gigamonkey!n=user@adsl-99-169-83-0.dsl.pltn13.sbcglobal.net PRIVMSG #lisp :mib_c4atm6vk: add .com to my nick" ":Xach!n=xach@207.5.178.18 KICK #lisp mib_c4atm6vk :No, really." ":gigamonkey!n=user@adsl-99-169-83-0.dsl.pltn13.sbcglobal.net PRIVMSG #lisp :er, add s.com to my nick" ":silenius!n=jl@yian-ho03.nir.cronon.net PRIVMSG #lisp :merci bien" ":yrlnry!n=mjd@treebase-demo.cis.upenn.edu QUIT :\"Bye\"" ":Xof!n=crhodes@dunstaple.doc.gold.ac.uk PRIVMSG #lisp :maybe I'd better read your code and think a bit" ":Jacob_H!n=jacob@92.4.94.15 JOIN :#lisp" ":Xach!n=xach@207.5.178.18 MODE #lisp -o Xach " ":Xof!n=crhodes@dunstaple.doc.gold.ac.uk PRIVMSG #lisp :gigamonkey: yes, I think that is what I mean" ":dialtone!n=dialtone@adsl-99-136-101-166.dsl.pltn13.sbcglobal.net JOIN :#lisp" ":BrianRice!n=briantri@207.224.31.206 JOIN :#lisp" ":schme!n=marcus@c83-254-190-108.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #lisp :Where do I find information on the :text-editor type of panes?" ":lisppaste!n=lisppast@208.72.159.207 PRIVMSG #lisp :gigamonkey annotated #69451 with \"The basic problem -- I think\" at http://paste.lisp.org/display/69451#1" ":pstickne!n=pstickne@c-71-236-177-238.hsd1.wa.comcast.net JOIN :#lisp" ":Odin-!n=sbkhh@s121-302.gardur.hi.is QUIT :" ":replor_!n=replor@ntkngw375028.kngw.nt.ftth.ppp.infoweb.ne.jp QUIT :Read error: 113 (No route to host)" ":schme!n=marcus@c83-254-190-108.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #lisp :well maybe text-editor-gadget.lisp" ":lemonodor!n=lemonodo@adsl-76-214-15-172.dsl.lsan03.sbcglobal.net QUIT :" ":slyrus_!n=slyrus@dsl092-019-253.sfo1.dsl.speakeasy.net JOIN :#lisp" ":MHOOO!n=nah@6-202.vpn.RWTH-Aachen.DE QUIT :Read error: 113 (No route to host)" ":lisppaste!n=lisppast@208.72.159.207 PRIVMSG #lisp :mathrick pasted \"SLIME compilation failure with SBCL 1.0.21\" at http://paste.lisp.org/display/69453" ":mathrick!n=mathrick@users177.kollegienet.dk PRIVMSG #lisp :anyone familiar with the above error?" ":mathrick!n=mathrick@users177.kollegienet.dk PRIVMSG #lisp :I just upgraded from SBCL .18 to .21 and it dies thusly" ":stassats`!n=stassats@wikipedia/stassats PRIVMSG #lisp :the error is not familiar to me, but it's common to update sbcl and slime simultaneously, so try slime from cvs" ":novaburst!i=nova@sourcemage/mage/novaburst JOIN :#lisp" ":antgreen!n=green@nat/redhat/x-7f1fbe5f492f7e37 QUIT :Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)" ":Fare!n=Fare@ita4fw1.itasoftware.com JOIN :#lisp" ":mathrick!n=mathrick@users177.kollegienet.dk PRIVMSG #lisp :stassats`: yeah, that was my next bet" ":asdf25!n=asdf25@pool-96-255-79-39.washdc.fios.verizon.net JOIN :#lisp" ":matley!n=matley@matley.imati.cnr.it QUIT :Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)" ":mathrick!n=mathrick@users177.kollegienet.dk PRIVMSG #lisp :although I dislike updating slime, it has the nasty, nasty habit of introducing bucketloads of regressions :\\" ":gigamonk`!n=user@adsl-99-169-83-0.dsl.pltn13.sbcglobal.net QUIT :Remote closed the connection" ":gigamonk`!n=user@adsl-99-169-83-0.dsl.pltn13.sbcglobal.net JOIN :#lisp" ":Fare!n=Fare@ita4fw1.itasoftware.com PRIVMSG #lisp :hum." ":Fare!n=Fare@ita4fw1.itasoftware.com PRIVMSG #lisp :I just released cl-launch 2.09" ":stassats`!n=stassats@wikipedia/stassats PRIVMSG #lisp :i remember that recent sbcl brought some incompatibility" ":Fare!n=Fare@ita4fw1.itasoftware.com PRIVMSG #lisp :I punted on ECL, but I believe ECL will work once they fix a bug on their side." ":pjb!n=t@intergruas.easynet.es JOIN :#lisp" ":Fare!n=Fare@ita4fw1.itasoftware.com PRIVMSG #lisp :cl-launch is the ultimate programming horror. After that, anything looks simple and robust." ":mathrick!n=mathrick@users177.kollegienet.dk PRIVMSG #lisp :heh" ":mathrick!n=mathrick@users177.kollegienet.dk PRIVMSG #lisp :ACTION throws some STL at Fare" ":Fare!n=Fare@ita4fw1.itasoftware.com PRIVMSG #lisp :ACTION dodges with linker failures and shells dying with memory erros." ":cmm!n=cmm@bzq-79-182-117-83.red.bezeqint.net PRIVMSG #lisp :ACTION is an innocent bystander, but dies under the weight of a hundred unscutable compiler diagnostics" ":Fare!n=Fare@ita4fw1.itasoftware.com PRIVMSG #lisp :cmm: you mean, your compilers actually issue DIAGNOSTICS?" ":Fare!n=Fare@ita4fw1.itasoftware.com PRIVMSG #lisp :that's way too modern." ":Jacob_H!n=jacob@92.4.94.15 QUIT :\"Leaving\"" ":cmm!n=cmm@bzq-79-182-117-83.red.bezeqint.net PRIVMSG #lisp :Fare: I guess they mean to" ":tic!n=tic@c83-249-197-248.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #lisp :Good evening." ":tic!n=tic@c83-249-197-248.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #lisp :the C++ compilers I have to write code for can't handle fancy stuff like exceptions or templates. take that!" ":cmm!n=cmm@bzq-79-182-117-83.red.bezeqint.net PRIVMSG #lisp :Fare: jokes aside, being defeated by the cleverness of your own code is Not Fun. my sympathies" ":kreuter!n=kreuter@pool-96-252-14-107.bstnma.fios.verizon.net PRIVMSG #lisp :hm. duplicate nikodemus mail again again." ":Fare!n=Fare@ita4fw1.itasoftware.com PRIVMSG #lisp :cmm: before I die, I want to be defeated by the cleverness of code written by code I wrote." ":tic!n=tic@c83-249-197-248.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #lisp ::)" ":cmm!n=cmm@bzq-79-182-117-83.red.bezeqint.net PRIVMSG #lisp :heh" ":mathrick!n=mathrick@users177.kollegienet.dk PRIVMSG #lisp :GHHHHHRRRRRRRRRRR" ":mathrick!n=mathrick@users177.kollegienet.dk PRIVMSG #lisp :http://paste.lisp.org/display/69287 still fails" ":mathrick!n=mathrick@users177.kollegienet.dk PRIVMSG #lisp :I can't step into FOO" ":mathrick!n=mathrick@users177.kollegienet.dk PRIVMSG #lisp :ie. calling (bar) works, it breaks correctly, I can step through BAR, but as soon as I want to go into FOO invocation, it says \"evaluation aborted\" and that's it" ":mathrick!n=mathrick@users177.kollegienet.dk PRIVMSG #lisp :any ideas?" ":mathrick!n=mathrick@users177.kollegienet.dk PRIVMSG #lisp :I upgraded SBCL in hopes it'd help, but to no avail :(" ":mulligan!n=user@e178048050.adsl.alicedsl.de JOIN :#lisp" ":mrsolo!n=mrsolo@nat/yahoo/x-050c807ceb73c9f7 JOIN :#lisp" ":gigamonk`!n=user@adsl-99-169-83-0.dsl.pltn13.sbcglobal.net PRIVMSG #lisp :Xof: so if I'm summing logs of probabilities rather than multiplying probabilities, is there some standard way of dealing with probabilities of 0?" ":Xof!n=crhodes@dunstaple.doc.gold.ac.uk PRIVMSG #lisp :I think you're basically right; the problem is one of (a + b) - b not equalling a + (b - b)" ":gigamonk`!n=user@adsl-99-169-83-0.dsl.pltn13.sbcglobal.net PRIVMSG #lisp :Actually my theory was the initial error came from the division. So it's (a + b) - b' not equal to a + (b - b) where b' is very slightly off from b." ":Xof!n=crhodes@dunstaple.doc.gold.ac.uk PRIVMSG #lisp :I don't see why the division should be blamed more than the multiplication" ":gigamonk`!n=user@adsl-99-169-83-0.dsl.pltn13.sbcglobal.net PRIVMSG #lisp :Yeah, I don't know." ":Xof!n=crhodes@dunstaple.doc.gold.ac.uk PRIVMSG #lisp :but anyway, yes" ":lemonodor!n=lemonodo@66.43.112.62 JOIN :#lisp" ":besiria!n=user@ppp083212085103.dsl.uom.gr JOIN :#lisp" ":gigamonk`!n=user@adsl-99-169-83-0.dsl.pltn13.sbcglobal.net PRIVMSG #lisp :Okay, I really must stop playing with this and go do real work. If you have any ideas, feel free to memo or email me. Thanks for your help." ":Xof!n=crhodes@dunstaple.doc.gold.ac.uk PRIVMSG #lisp :this question is interesting, in a kind of \"I wish I had time to spend working out an answer\" kind of way" ":Xof!n=crhodes@dunstaple.doc.gold.ac.uk PRIVMSG #lisp :oh, you too? Shame :-)" ":gigamonk`!n=user@adsl-99-169-83-0.dsl.pltn13.sbcglobal.net PRIVMSG #lisp :heh." ":gigamonk`!n=user@adsl-99-169-83-0.dsl.pltn13.sbcglobal.net PRIVMSG #lisp :Later." ":gigamonk`!n=user@adsl-99-169-83-0.dsl.pltn13.sbcglobal.net QUIT :\"ERC Version 5.3 (IRC client for Emacs)\"" ":silenius!n=jl@yian-ho03.nir.cronon.net QUIT :Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)" ":ciscbrain!n=eugen@softhouse.is.ew.ro JOIN :#lisp" ":sykopomp|class!n=user@unaffiliated/sykopomp JOIN :#lisp" ":Krystof!i=csr21@howells.doc.gold.ac.uk QUIT :Read error: 60 (Operation timed out)" ":josemanuel!n=josemanu@102.1.222.87.dynamic.jazztel.es JOIN :#lisp" ":sykopomp|class!n=user@unaffiliated/sykopomp QUIT :Remote closed the connection" ":pjb!n=t@intergruas.easynet.es QUIT :Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)" ":schme_!n=marcus@c83-254-190-108.bredband.comhem.se JOIN :#lisp" ":schme!n=marcus@c83-254-190-108.bredband.comhem.se QUIT :Read error: 60 (Operation timed out)" ":abeaumont!n=abeaumon@30.pool85-49-182.dynamic.orange.es QUIT :Remote closed the connection" ":cracki!n=cracki@sglty.kawo2.RWTH-Aachen.DE JOIN :#lisp" ":ThomasI!n=thomas@unaffiliated/thomasi JOIN :#lisp" ":lemonodor_!n=lemonodo@66.43.112.62 JOIN :#lisp" ":ug!n=merlin@67.159.169.138 JOIN :#lisp" ":gigamonk`!n=user@adsl-99-169-83-0.dsl.pltn13.sbcglobal.net JOIN :#lisp" ":x6j8x!n=x6j8x@77.21.43.186 JOIN :#lisp" ":gigamonk`!n=user@adsl-99-169-83-0.dsl.pltn13.sbcglobal.net PRIVMSG #lisp :Heh, this may be old news but I just discovered Pragmatic Programmers is putting out a book on Clojure." ":gigamonk`!n=user@adsl-99-169-83-0.dsl.pltn13.sbcglobal.net PRIVMSG #lisp :http://pragprog.com/titles/shcloj/programming-clojure" ":antifuchs!n=asf@baker.boinkor.net PRIVMSG #lisp : sweet" ":ahaas!n=ahaas@c-76-17-41-185.hsd1.ga.comcast.net QUIT :\"leaving\"" ":gigamonk`!n=user@adsl-99-169-83-0.dsl.pltn13.sbcglobal.net PRIVMSG #lisp :ACTION sheds a small tear over no longer having the youngest, sexiest Lisp book on the block" ":ahaas!n=ahaas@c-76-17-41-185.hsd1.ga.comcast.net JOIN :#lisp" ":Ash!i=aaron@facestab.org PRIVMSG #lisp :nice" ":ug!n=merlin@67.159.169.138 PRIVMSG #lisp :nice nice" ":ug!n=merlin@67.159.169.138 PRIVMSG #lisp :gigamonk`: but yours is the bestest :P" ":mdxi!n=mdxi@li11-97.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #lisp :Lisp RELOADED" ":mdxi!n=mdxi@li11-97.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #lisp :like the metallica album!" ":gigamonk`!n=user@adsl-99-169-83-0.dsl.pltn13.sbcglobal.net PRIVMSG #lisp :thanks " ":jgracin!n=jgracin@82.193.208.195 JOIN :#lisp" ":ug!n=merlin@67.159.169.138 PRIVMSG #lisp :I have a pipe dream that maybe with things like Clojure out there and gaining acceptance maybe some day we can work on a new Common Lisp standard that addresses the needs and issues of today (and maybe some of tomorrow) - like that missing networking section, for example" ":Bzek!n=SK_sj@mcc-dyn-17-237.kosnet.ru QUIT :\"LOVE.\"" ":``Erik!i=erik@c-68-54-174-162.hsd1.md.comcast.net QUIT :Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)" ":adeht!n=death@nessers.org PRIVMSG #lisp :sigh" ":Xach!n=xach@207.5.178.18 PRIVMSG #lisp :is it 2:30 already?" ":rpg!n=rpg@75.146.46.193 JOIN :#lisp" ":antifuchs!n=asf@baker.boinkor.net PRIVMSG #lisp :still thursday, so still no pessimism allowed" ":rpg!n=rpg@75.146.46.193 NICK :Guest90565" ":benny!n=benny@i577A0084.versanet.de JOIN :#lisp" ":pjb!n=t@67.Red-81-37-36.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net JOIN :#lisp" ":Guest90565!n=rpg@75.146.46.193 NICK :rpg" ":antgreen!n=green@nat/redhat/x-abb9c0ac14ef8808 JOIN :#lisp" ":H4ns!n=hans@p57A0FE9C.dip.t-dialin.net JOIN :#lisp" ":lemonodor!n=lemonodo@66.43.112.62 QUIT :Read error: 113 (No route to host)" ":attila_lendvai!n=ati@catv-89-133-170-239.catv.broadband.hu QUIT :Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)" ":tic!n=tic@c83-249-197-248.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #lisp :pessimisms only on fridays, antifuchs?" ":tic!n=tic@c83-249-197-248.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #lisp :s/-s/s" ":antifuchs!n=asf@baker.boinkor.net PRIVMSG #lisp :every other day" ":tic!n=tic@c83-249-197-248.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #lisp :meh. s/ms//" ":tic!n=tic@c83-249-197-248.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #lisp :OK" ":sellout!n=greg@guest-fw.dc4.itasoftware.com PRIVMSG #lisp :Yesterday and tomorrow, but never today." ":tic!n=tic@c83-249-197-248.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #lisp :I see." ":tic!n=tic@c83-249-197-248.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #lisp :That's a good rule to live by." ":mathrick!n=mathrick@users177.kollegienet.dk PRIVMSG #lisp :ug: CL+ would be a good thing to have" ":stassats`!n=stassats@wikipedia/stassats PRIVMSG #lisp :we have cl:+ already" ":tic!n=tic@c83-249-197-248.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #lisp :networking shouldn't be part of the specs..." ":Odin-!n=sbkhh@s121-302.gardur.hi.is JOIN :#lisp" ":mathrick!n=mathrick@users177.kollegienet.dk PRIVMSG #lisp :stassats`: but that's a different thing" ":mathrick!n=mathrick@users177.kollegienet.dk PRIVMSG #lisp :tic: I actually wasn't thinking about networking, there are other things I'd like to see" ":stassats`!n=stassats@wikipedia/stassats PRIVMSG #lisp :mathrick: slightly" ":mathrick!n=mathrick@users177.kollegienet.dk PRIVMSG #lisp :although I guess at that point everyone agrees that having the next CL would be a good thing" ":mathrick!n=mathrick@users177.kollegienet.dk PRIVMSG #lisp :(that doesn't necessarily imply that there is a clear idea as to how to get there, though)" ":kreuter!n=kreuter@pool-96-252-14-107.bstnma.fios.verizon.net PRIVMSG #lisp :I don't think I agree with that." ":tic!n=tic@c83-249-197-248.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #lisp :kreuter, having a next CL or not knowing how to get there?" ":kreuter!n=kreuter@pool-96-252-14-107.bstnma.fios.verizon.net PRIVMSG #lisp :not without knowing what a \"next CL\" is supposed to be." ":kreuter!n=kreuter@pool-96-252-14-107.bstnma.fios.verizon.net PRIVMSG #lisp :having a next Lisp, sure." ":mathrick!n=mathrick@users177.kollegienet.dk PRIVMSG #lisp :and I'd really like that Lisp to be a CL" ":mathrick!n=mathrick@users177.kollegienet.dk PRIVMSG #lisp :I'm not too content with Clojure dropping multi-paradigmity for instance" ":hugo!n=hugo@unaffiliated/hugo QUIT :Remote closed the connection" ":ug!n=merlin@67.159.169.138 PRIVMSG #lisp :kreuter: I think the point is, at least as I read Gabriel, the current Common Lisp is not the only Common Lisp and if we work on new Lisps then eventually we should come together with a new Common Lisp" ":tic!n=tic@c83-249-197-248.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #lisp :ug, in what way is CL not the only CL?" ":sellout!n=greg@guest-fw.dc4.itasoftware.com PRIVMSG #lisp :mathrick: Yeah, well you get into lots of fun tradeoffs with concurrency." ":mathrick!n=mathrick@users177.kollegienet.dk PRIVMSG #lisp :kreuter: but knowing what \"next CL\" is falls into \"no clear idea\" I mentioned" ":ug!n=merlin@67.159.169.138 PRIVMSG #lisp :tic: it's a quote, maybe misattributed" ":lemonodor_!n=lemonodo@66.43.112.62 QUIT :Read error: 113 (No route to host)" ":stassats`!n=stassats@wikipedia/stassats PRIVMSG #lisp :mop should be part of the spec, and gray-streams" ":kreuter!n=kreuter@pool-96-252-14-107.bstnma.fios.verizon.net PRIVMSG #lisp :it is a misquote." ":mathrick!n=mathrick@users177.kollegienet.dk PRIVMSG #lisp :stassats`: YES!" ":kreuter!n=kreuter@pool-96-252-14-107.bstnma.fios.verizon.net PRIVMSG #lisp :I don't agree about gray streams." ":tic!n=tic@c83-249-197-248.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #lisp :kreuter, why so?" ":mathrick!n=mathrick@users177.kollegienet.dk PRIVMSG #lisp :s/gray/extensible/" ":tic!n=tic@c83-249-197-248.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #lisp :(possibly s/gray streams/extensible streams)" ":kreuter!n=kreuter@pool-96-252-14-107.bstnma.fios.verizon.net PRIVMSG #lisp :right, that's why :)" ":mathrick!n=mathrick@users177.kollegienet.dk PRIVMSG #lisp :tic: gray streams are not flawless" ":ug!n=merlin@67.159.169.138 PRIVMSG #lisp :tic: why are you against networking in the spec?" ":tic!n=tic@c83-249-197-248.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #lisp :ug, define \"networking\"." ":mathrick!n=mathrick@users177.kollegienet.dk PRIVMSG #lisp :ug: because \"networking\" is impossible to define" ":silenius!n=jl@e178050166.adsl.alicedsl.de JOIN :#lisp" ":tic!n=tic@c83-249-197-248.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #lisp :Let him answer. :)" ":ug!n=merlin@67.159.169.138 PRIVMSG #lisp :tic: an interface from one networked system to another - I don't care that it follows a socket model so long as it can be implemented and work with sockets" ":ug!n=merlin@67.159.169.138 PRIVMSG #lisp :sockets are just the immediate need" ":tic!n=tic@c83-249-197-248.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #lisp :ug, what in Common Lisp does currently stop you from doing that, using FFI?" ":mathrick!n=mathrick@users177.kollegienet.dk PRIVMSG #lisp :well, exactly" ":ug!n=merlin@67.159.169.138 PRIVMSG #lisp :it would be nice, though surely improbably impossible, to have a well specified interface to a networking stack as part of a standard" ":kreuter!n=kreuter@pool-96-252-14-107.bstnma.fios.verizon.net PRIVMSG #lisp :mathrick: in the absence of agreement to ground rules like \"conforming programs of ANSI Common Lisp 1994 are conforming programs of \\\"next CL\\\"\", I don't know what to think about calling something a \"next CL\"." ":ug!n=merlin@67.159.169.138 PRIVMSG #lisp :i've never thought about using FFI to use networking functions in something else..." ":tic!n=tic@c83-249-197-248.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #lisp :ug, what would it do? does it have to be networking? or could it be abstracted to a kind of multi-user-aware Lisp, if it's the \"communication between systems\" you want?" ":bashyal!n=bashyal@v-209-98-139-195.mn.visi.com JOIN :#lisp" ":asdf25!n=asdf25@pool-96-255-79-39.washdc.fios.verizon.net QUIT :\"Leaving\"" ":mathrick!n=mathrick@users177.kollegienet.dk PRIVMSG #lisp :kreuter: oh, but I thought it being _a_ CL would imply compatibility, sorry if that was unclear" ":tic!n=tic@c83-249-197-248.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #lisp :mathrick, but if it's compatible with CL, it's a superset, and thus implemetnable on top of CL, no?" ":ug!n=merlin@67.159.169.138 PRIVMSG #lisp :tic: I don't know but that is a good thought provoking question :). I would wager that anything abstracted enough to allow a multi-user-aware Lisp would probably also allow me to do simple networking too" ":sellout!n=greg@guest-fw.dc4.itasoftware.com PRIVMSG #lisp :tic: So then you think FFI should be part of the \"next\" spec?" ":kreuter!n=kreuter@pool-96-252-14-107.bstnma.fios.verizon.net PRIVMSG #lisp :mathrick: well, some folks disagree about whether that's even a prerequisite." ":mathrick!n=mathrick@users177.kollegienet.dk PRIVMSG #lisp :tic: of course" ":mathrick!n=mathrick@users177.kollegienet.dk PRIVMSG #lisp :tic: but the value of CL is in the \"C\" part" ":tic!n=tic@c83-249-197-248.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #lisp :sellout, I have no opinion. I'm just playing the devil's advocate." ":ehu!i=52aa21ad@gateway/web/ajax/mibbit.com/x-a8b76e292fc2294e JOIN :#lisp" ":tic!n=tic@c83-249-197-248.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #lisp :ug, right. so maybe you don't want networking in the spec, after-all?" ":ehu!i=52aa21ad@gateway/web/ajax/mibbit.com/x-a8b76e292fc2294e QUIT :Client Quit" ":mathrick!n=mathrick@users177.kollegienet.dk PRIVMSG #lisp :having FFI is tempting, but then, what would it be defined to call out to?" ":BrianRice!n=briantri@207.224.31.206 QUIT :Read error: 60 (Operation timed out)" ":ug!n=merlin@67.159.169.138 PRIVMSG #lisp :lol, maybe. I mentioned it as it is an oft-mentioned oversight. Doesn't mean we haven't worked around it (isn't usocket in the topic?), but some specified interface to a networking stack would certainly help with adoption for some people (which you may or may not care about)" ":mathrick!n=mathrick@users177.kollegienet.dk PRIVMSG #lisp :I'd rather see MOP being everywhere, standardised advice functionality, user-extensible sequences" ":stassats`!n=stassats@wikipedia/stassats PRIVMSG #lisp :language should survive through time, and tying to one particular network or parallelism/concurrency model isn't good" ":cmalune!n=cmalune@bb-87-81-97-91.ukonline.co.uk QUIT :" ":Xach!n=xach@207.5.178.18 PRIVMSG #lisp :ACTION upcases ß" ":mathrick!n=mathrick@users177.kollegienet.dk PRIVMSG #lisp :SS" ":kreuter!n=kreuter@pool-96-252-14-107.bstnma.fios.verizon.net PRIVMSG #lisp :Xach: next you're going to tell us you've squared the circle." ":antifuchs!n=asf@baker.boinkor.net PRIVMSG #lisp :ISTR that according to the new unicode, it should be ß in the upper case, as well." ":epoch!n=K-I-S-S@p3m/member/epoch JOIN :#lisp" ":kreuter!n=kreuter@pool-96-252-14-107.bstnma.fios.verizon.net PRIVMSG #lisp :I thought it was one glyph that happened to look like SS" ":sellout!n=greg@guest-fw.dc4.itasoftware.com PRIVMSG #lisp :kreuter: Nope" ":sellout!n=greg@guest-fw.dc4.itasoftware.com PRIVMSG #lisp :It changes the length of the string :)" ":antifuchs!n=asf@baker.boinkor.net PRIVMSG #lisp :SZ ligature" ":mathrick!n=mathrick@users177.kollegienet.dk PRIVMSG #lisp :antifuchs: indeed, python upcases ß to ß" ":mathrick!n=mathrick@users177.kollegienet.dk PRIVMSG #lisp :but that's not correct according to german rules" ":kreuter!n=kreuter@pool-96-252-14-107.bstnma.fios.verizon.net PRIVMSG #lisp :sellout: \"length of the string\" has zero meaning in our brave new world." ":mathrick!n=mathrick@users177.kollegienet.dk PRIVMSG #lisp :upper case of ß is SS" ":sellout!n=greg@guest-fw.dc4.itasoftware.com PRIVMSG #lisp :antifuchs: Wait, what?" ":antifuchs!n=asf@baker.boinkor.net PRIVMSG #lisp :mathrick: it might be in a newer revision of german" ":kreuter!n=kreuter@pool-96-252-14-107.bstnma.fios.verizon.net PRIVMSG #lisp :quick! fix german so that Unicode isn't broken!" ":antifuchs!n=asf@baker.boinkor.net PRIVMSG #lisp :I do recall reading something to that effect" ":mathrick!n=mathrick@users177.kollegienet.dk PRIVMSG #lisp :heh, but German has a notoriously slow release cycle" ":ug!n=merlin@67.159.169.138 PRIVMSG #lisp :also, mathrick, when I was speaking I was not talking about a superset or compatibility of current CL. I was talking about NEXT CL. Which may or may not be compatible with current CL (most likely, not, I would think). The discussion we're having now about WHAT to put in it is exactly what would make it different." ":ug!n=merlin@67.159.169.138 PRIVMSG #lisp :A different CL for a different time" ":antifuchs!n=asf@baker.boinkor.net PRIVMSG #lisp :mathrick: not in the last few years it didn't (:" ":tic!n=tic@c83-249-197-248.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #lisp :ug, you fail to provide me with a compelling argument as to why networking/sockets has to be mandatory by an implementation. You have to separate what constitutes the language and what is utilites. There is nothing stopping anyone from providing the kitchen sink with Lisp compilers." ":kreuter!n=kreuter@pool-96-252-14-107.bstnma.fios.verizon.net PRIVMSG #lisp :mathrick: see what I mean about ground rules? ;)" ":sellout!n=greg@guest-fw.dc4.itasoftware.com PRIVMSG #lisp :kreuter: Really? Maybe I'm wrong, but I'd assume that even linguists have a concept of string length ... might be fuzzy, though." ":mathrick!n=mathrick@users177.kollegienet.dk PRIVMSG #lisp :antifuchs: really? Did you have anything besides the new ortography?" ":happycodemonkey!n=carriear@147.226.197.240 QUIT :" ":antifuchs!n=asf@baker.boinkor.net PRIVMSG #lisp :mathrick: well, that, but there were a few point-releases of that in rapid seqence (:" ":mathrick!n=mathrick@users177.kollegienet.dk PRIVMSG #lisp :ug: one of the ground rules in working on CL was to keep as much compatibility as possible" ":sellout!n=greg@guest-fw.dc4.itasoftware.com PRIVMSG #lisp :They did change the usage of ß already, didn't they?" ":mathrick!n=mathrick@users177.kollegienet.dk PRIVMSG #lisp :I see absolutely no reason to throw that away if you insist on calling it CL still" ":Xach!n=xach@207.5.178.18 PRIVMSG #lisp :ACTION is glad to have done this service for the channel" ":sellout!n=greg@guest-fw.dc4.itasoftware.com PRIVMSG #lisp :\"they\" == germany" ":kreuter!n=kreuter@pool-96-252-14-107.bstnma.fios.verizon.net PRIVMSG #lisp :Xach: what service?" ":Xach!n=xach@207.5.178.18 PRIVMSG #lisp :dißtraction" ":sellout!n=greg@guest-fw.dc4.itasoftware.com PRIVMSG #lisp :Germans should just have to type \"s\" and let the display system insert the ligature." ":kreuter!n=kreuter@pool-96-252-14-107.bstnma.fios.verizon.net PRIVMSG #lisp :ouch" ":mathrick!n=mathrick@users177.kollegienet.dk PRIVMSG #lisp :ßervice" ":mathrick!n=mathrick@users177.kollegienet.dk PRIVMSG #lisp :(that is even more ouch)" ":antifuchs!n=asf@baker.boinkor.net PRIVMSG #lisp :sellout: hahaha" ":antifuchs!n=asf@baker.boinkor.net PRIVMSG #lisp :sellout: splendid idea" ":ug!n=merlin@67.159.169.138 PRIVMSG #lisp :tic: well, where are we stopping with utilities? I am not sure there needs to be a LOT of networking-related interfaces in the language CORE, but I do think the language standard should accurately specify the low level utility functions built on whatever low level builtins as part of the language. Kinda like it already is for some languages/implementations (core language with more language features built in terms of it)" ":antifuchs!n=asf@baker.boinkor.net PRIVMSG #lisp :hm, I can't find a reference now, but I have a distinct memory of a change to that effect. will keep looking." ":beach!n=user@ABordeaux-158-1-73-156.w90-60.abo.wanadoo.fr PRIVMSG #lisp :Languages evolve much faster than one might think. I don't notice it in the place where I live, but in places I visit ever two years or so." ":ug!n=merlin@67.159.169.138 PRIVMSG #lisp :tic: again the only reason I really mentioned networking is because it is often mentioned and having it well specified would mean that managers could like it more :P" ":mathrick!n=mathrick@users177.kollegienet.dk PRIVMSG #lisp :ug: have you ever looked at CL paths subsystem?" ":stassats`!n=stassats@wikipedia/stassats QUIT :Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)" ":tic!n=tic@c83-249-197-248.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #lisp :Yeah. Imagine the PATHNAMES of networking. *shrug*" ":rpg!n=rpg@75.146.46.193 PRIVMSG #lisp :Is there by any chance a with-timeout type macro in SBCL? It's alluded to in the manual, but not actually documented there?" ":mathrick!n=mathrick@users177.kollegienet.dk PRIVMSG #lisp :ug: that's what happens when you take \"whatever lowlevel functionality there is\" and build a highlevel abstraction to work with any of it" ":ug!n=merlin@67.159.169.138 PRIVMSG #lisp :mathrick: no, I have not looked at paths subsystem" ":rme!n=rme@pool-70-104-127-61.chi.dsl-w.verizon.net JOIN :#lisp" ":sellout!n=greg@guest-fw.dc4.itasoftware.com PRIVMSG #lisp :Upcasing \"ß\" is much less problematic than downcasing \"SS\". Even if you know it's german, you still need to know if it follows a long or short vowel, or a dipthong." ":mathrick!n=mathrick@users177.kollegienet.dk PRIVMSG #lisp :ug: http://www.ai.mit.edu/projects/iiip/doc/CommonLISP/HyperSpec/Body/sec_19-2.html" ":mathrick!n=mathrick@users177.kollegienet.dk PRIVMSG #lisp :have fun" ":happycodemonkey!n=carriear@147.226.197.240 JOIN :#lisp" ":ug!n=merlin@67.159.169.138 PRIVMSG #lisp :mathrick: re keeping as much compatability as possible, didn't the maclisp guys get the better end of the compatability stick?" ":stassats`!n=stassats@ppp78-37-184-20.pppoe.avangarddsl.ru JOIN :#lisp" ":antifuchs!n=asf@baker.boinkor.net PRIVMSG #lisp :german reference for the upper-case ß thing: http://www.focus.de/wissen/bildung/neuer-buchstabe_aid_57103.html (apparently, not official yet)" ":Riastradh!n=rias@pool-141-154-225-78.bos.east.verizon.net PRIVMSG #lisp :Alternatively, take a look at BSD sockets. That's something else that happened when someone took `whatever low-level functionality there is' and built a high-level abstraction to work with any of it." ":pdeb!n=user@li37-218.members.linode.com QUIT :Remote closed the connection" ":pixel5!n=pixel@copei.de QUIT :\"Lost terminal\"" ":mathrick!n=mathrick@users177.kollegienet.dk PRIVMSG #lisp :antifuchs: eww" ":mathrick!n=mathrick@users177.kollegienet.dk PRIVMSG #lisp :ug: so?" ":tltstc`!n=nine@192.207.69.1 JOIN :#lisp" ":ug!n=merlin@67.159.169.138 PRIVMSG #lisp :mathrick: lol" ":mathrick!n=mathrick@users177.kollegienet.dk PRIVMSG #lisp :the next CL would have the advantage of only working with one Lisp dialect" ":stassats`!n=stassats@wikipedia/stassats PRIVMSG #lisp :rpg: sb-ext:with-timeout" ":mathrick!n=mathrick@users177.kollegienet.dk PRIVMSG #lisp :throwing away the compatibility in this case would be inexcusable" ":rpg!n=rpg@75.146.46.193 PRIVMSG #lisp :stassats`: Is there doc for it --- it doesn't seem to be in the manual." ":bombshelter13!n=bombshel@net1.senecac.on.ca JOIN :#lisp" ":ug!n=merlin@67.159.169.138 PRIVMSG #lisp :mathrick: that is a good point, indeed" ":stassats`!n=stassats@wikipedia/stassats PRIVMSG #lisp :rpg: it has docstring" ":nikodemus`!n=nikodemu@cs27013130.pp.htv.fi QUIT :Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)" ":ivan4th!n=ivan4th@smtp.igrade.ru JOIN :#lisp" ":Xach!n=xach@207.5.178.18 PRIVMSG #lisp :ACTION withdraws all his previous comments about typos in papers" ":happycodemonkey!n=carriear@147.226.197.240 QUIT :" ":rpg!n=rpg@75.146.46.193 PRIVMSG #lisp :stassats`: You wouldn't by any chance know where it was defined, would you?" ":rpg!n=rpg@75.146.46.193 PRIVMSG #lisp :stassats`: I.e., in what piece of the sbcl source?" ":ivan4th!n=ivan4th@smtp.igrade.ru PRIVMSG #lisp :hi. Yesterday after changing my machine to dual core one I've noticed reproducible spinlock deadlocks in my app running under SBCL 1.0.21 in src/pcl/dfun.lisp, with SBCL internals in the call trace starting from CACHE-MISS-VALUES IIRC. I decided to hunt them down today, but today they won't show up... Did anyone encounter something like this?" ":Xach!n=xach@207.5.178.18 PRIVMSG #lisp :ivan4th: i haven't seen that on my dual core system" ":Xach!n=xach@207.5.178.18 PRIVMSG #lisp :rpg: src/code/timer.lisp" ":Xach!n=xach@207.5.178.18 PRIVMSG #lisp :rpg: is your M-. busted? :)" ":stassats`!n=stassats@wikipedia/stassats PRIVMSG #lisp :rpg: use M-." ":beach!n=user@ABordeaux-158-1-73-156.w90-60.abo.wanadoo.fr PRIVMSG #lisp :antifuchs: nice!" ":Xach!n=xach@207.5.178.18 PRIVMSG #lisp :ACTION wonders about adding docstrings to l1sp.org" ":mathrick!n=mathrick@users177.kollegienet.dk PRIVMSG #lisp :ivan4th: never seen that" ":rpg!n=rpg@75.146.46.193 PRIVMSG #lisp :I don't have a source checkout --- pulled a binary. So for quick access, was jumping to sourceforge. Trying to paper over the ACL/SBCL with-timeout differences." ":gigamonk`!n=user@adsl-99-169-83-0.dsl.pltn13.sbcglobal.net PRIVMSG #lisp :If I write a file in SBCL with with-open-file (... :direction :output :if-exists :supersede) is there some reason the file's timestamp wouldn't change?" ":antifuchs!n=asf@baker.boinkor.net PRIVMSG #lisp :Xach: and # reader dispatch!" ":ivan4th!n=ivan4th@smtp.igrade.ru PRIVMSG #lisp :Xach: :( maybe it was between *effective-method-cache* and some generic function locks, but I'm not quite familiar with this code. It worries me a lot but I cannot reproduce it anymore :(" ":kreuter!n=kreuter@pool-96-252-14-107.bstnma.fios.verizon.net PRIVMSG #lisp :gigamonk`: which timestamp?" ":Xach!n=xach@207.5.178.18 PRIVMSG #lisp :antifuchs: yes, yes" ":gigamonk`!n=user@adsl-99-169-83-0.dsl.pltn13.sbcglobal.net PRIVMSG #lisp :the one reported by ls -l" ":kreuter!n=kreuter@pool-96-252-14-107.bstnma.fios.verizon.net PRIVMSG #lisp :hm" ":rpg!n=rpg@75.146.46.193 PRIVMSG #lisp :Well, heck. The sourceforge CVS viewer is busted. So much for my shortcut." ":kreuter!n=kreuter@pool-96-252-14-107.bstnma.fios.verizon.net PRIVMSG #lisp :posix stat" ":specbot!n=specbot@208.72.159.207 PRIVMSG #lisp :http://www.opengroup.org/onlinepubs/007908799/xsh/stat.html" ":adeht!n=death@nessers.org PRIVMSG #lisp :Xach: btw I noticed that in your zs3 example code you declare-ignore specializer parameters" ":gigamonk`!n=user@adsl-99-169-83-0.dsl.pltn13.sbcglobal.net PRIVMSG #lisp :Or more to the point, whatever one Apache uses to answer If-Modified-Since questions." ":adeht!n=death@nessers.org PRIVMSG #lisp :(specialized)" ":antifuchs!n=asf@baker.boinkor.net PRIVMSG #lisp :Xach: very very easy with window.location.hash (:" ":kreuter!n=kreuter@pool-96-252-14-107.bstnma.fios.verizon.net PRIVMSG #lisp :gigamonk`: did you actually write anything into the file?" ":Xach!n=xach@207.5.178.18 PRIVMSG #lisp :adeht: i did that because some lisps complain loudly about unused parameters in method bodies. is it a bad idea?" ":ivan4th!n=ivan4th@smtp.igrade.ru QUIT :Remote closed the connection" ":Xach!n=xach@207.5.178.18 PRIVMSG #lisp :antifuchs: ok, smart guy, what should i do about CL:/ ?" ":gigamonk`!n=user@adsl-99-169-83-0.dsl.pltn13.sbcglobal.net PRIVMSG #lisp :kreuter: yes." ":pstickne!n=pstickne@c-71-236-177-238.hsd1.wa.comcast.net QUIT :Remote closed the connection" ":mathrick!n=mathrick@users177.kollegienet.dk PRIVMSG #lisp :antifuchs: æh?" ":ivan4th!n=ivan4th@smtp.igrade.ru JOIN :#lisp" ":antifuchs!n=asf@baker.boinkor.net PRIVMSG #lisp :Xach: hah" ":antifuchs!n=asf@baker.boinkor.net PRIVMSG #lisp :Xach: tricky /-:" ":Xach!n=xach@207.5.178.18 PRIVMSG #lisp :ACTION has no ideas on that one :(" ":kreuter!n=kreuter@pool-96-252-14-107.bstnma.fios.verizon.net PRIVMSG #lisp :gigamonk`: POSIX sayeth that the mtime and ctime get updated only by write." ":kreuter!n=kreuter@pool-96-252-14-107.bstnma.fios.verizon.net PRIVMSG #lisp :hrm." ":kreuter!n=kreuter@pool-96-252-14-107.bstnma.fios.verizon.net PRIVMSG #lisp :are you maybe using NFS?" ":lemonodor!n=lemonodo@66.43.112.62 JOIN :#lisp" ":Xach!n=xach@207.5.178.18 PRIVMSG #lisp :actually, i had some ideas but they were all unsatisfying" ":antifuchs!n=asf@baker.boinkor.net PRIVMSG #lisp :Xach: make the cl:/ path go to the / page (:" ":kiuma!n=kiuma@81-208-106-75.ip.fastwebnet.it JOIN :#lisp" ":antifuchs!n=asf@baker.boinkor.net PRIVMSG #lisp :I mean, the \"cl:\" directory. or something (:" ":gigamonk`!n=user@adsl-99-169-83-0.dsl.pltn13.sbcglobal.net PRIVMSG #lisp :hmmm, maybe Apache is doing it right. Maybe ls -l doesn't show what I think it does." ":Xach!n=xach@207.5.178.18 PRIVMSG #lisp :http://l1sp.org/cl/cl:/?" ":adeht!n=death@nessers.org PRIVMSG #lisp :Xach: I think it is.. I can't remember if it had unspecified or undefined behavior, but the standard makes it clear that defmethod refers to these parameters and that ignore in that case specifies that the defmethod shouldn't refer to them" ":gigamonk`!n=user@adsl-99-169-83-0.dsl.pltn13.sbcglobal.net PRIVMSG #lisp :Bah, now ls -l is showing the timestamp changing." ":antifuchs!n=asf@baker.boinkor.net PRIVMSG #lisp :Xach: better than nothing" ":happycodemonkey!n=carriear@147.226.197.240 JOIN :#lisp" ":adeht!n=death@nessers.org PRIVMSG #lisp :Xach: these implementations should be fixed, imo.. I suppose the safe workaround is to declare ignorable" ":Xach!n=xach@207.5.178.18 PRIVMSG #lisp :gigamonk`: by a very small floating point value?" ":Xach!n=xach@207.5.178.18 PRIVMSG #lisp :adeht: ok, thanks for the info" ":gigamonk`!n=user@adsl-99-169-83-0.dsl.pltn13.sbcglobal.net PRIVMSG #lisp :Xach: :-PPP" ":kreuter!n=kreuter@pool-96-252-14-107.bstnma.fios.verizon.net PRIVMSG #lisp :gigamonk`: ls -l is supposed to show the mtime." ":gigamonk`!n=user@adsl-99-169-83-0.dsl.pltn13.sbcglobal.net PRIVMSG #lisp :which should be changing, right?" ":antifuchs!n=asf@baker.boinkor.net PRIVMSG #lisp :Xach: the more interesting problem is cl:// and cl:///" ":kreuter!n=kreuter@pool-96-252-14-107.bstnma.fios.verizon.net PRIVMSG #lisp :yes." ":antifuchs!n=asf@baker.boinkor.net PRIVMSG #lisp :and for that, there doesn't seem to be a good solution /-:" ":gigamonk`!n=user@adsl-99-169-83-0.dsl.pltn13.sbcglobal.net PRIVMSG #lisp :And presumably is the one Apache would use for If-Modified-Since" ":antifuchs!n=asf@baker.boinkor.net PRIVMSG #lisp :well, you could use the hash in the url... but that's not doubleplusgood, either" ":kreuter!n=kreuter@pool-96-252-14-107.bstnma.fios.verizon.net PRIVMSG #lisp :gigamonk`: are you on a network file system, or Windows?" ":kiuma!n=kiuma@81-208-106-75.ip.fastwebnet.it PRIVMSG #lisp :hello lispers" ":gigamonk`!n=user@adsl-99-169-83-0.dsl.pltn13.sbcglobal.net PRIVMSG #lisp :my tech.coop VPS" ":gigamonk`!n=user@adsl-99-169-83-0.dsl.pltn13.sbcglobal.net PRIVMSG #lisp :Not Windows. Don't know if that counts as a network file system." ":kreuter!n=kreuter@pool-96-252-14-107.bstnma.fios.verizon.net PRIVMSG #lisp :I think some NFS setups may occasionally get confused about timestamps." ":Xach!n=xach@207.5.178.18 PRIVMSG #lisp :antifuchs: maybe i can specify an encoding scheme like http://l1sp.org/cl/(/)(/)(/)" ":kiuma!n=kiuma@81-208-106-75.ip.fastwebnet.it QUIT :Client Quit" ":gigamonk`!n=user@adsl-99-169-83-0.dsl.pltn13.sbcglobal.net PRIVMSG #lisp :Is there an easy way to tell if I'm using NFS?" ":antifuchs!n=asf@baker.boinkor.net PRIVMSG #lisp :haha" ":kreuter!n=kreuter@pool-96-252-14-107.bstnma.fios.verizon.net PRIVMSG #lisp :run 'mount' and eyeball the output" ":antifuchs!n=asf@baker.boinkor.net PRIVMSG #lisp :gigamonk`: \"df .\" in the directory where you are should show you the mount point" ":bakkdoor!n=bakkdoor@xdsl-92-252-22-56.dip.osnanet.de JOIN :#lisp" ":kreuter!n=kreuter@pool-96-252-14-107.bstnma.fios.verizon.net PRIVMSG #lisp :I can't imagine that Apache would use anything other than the mtime for this problem" ":antifuchs!n=asf@baker.boinkor.net PRIVMSG #lisp :(mount is unreliable because there are tricks that will result in misinterpretation /-:)" ":gigamonk`!n=user@adsl-99-169-83-0.dsl.pltn13.sbcglobal.net PRIVMSG #lisp :Okay, maybe I was just confused before. After watching closely for a while everything seems to be working more or less as I expect." ":antifuchs!n=asf@baker.boinkor.net PRIVMSG #lisp :(I have horror stories to tell)" ":gigamonk`!n=user@adsl-99-169-83-0.dsl.pltn13.sbcglobal.net PRIVMSG #lisp :There's a tiny lag between the file being written and ls -l reflecting the new timestamp but that's the only oddity." ":kreuter!n=kreuter@pool-96-252-14-107.bstnma.fios.verizon.net PRIVMSG #lisp :gigamonk`: in any case, I can't think of a way that whatever you're seeing could be SBCL's fault." ":davazp!n=user@77.Red-83-54-164.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net QUIT :Remote closed the connection" ":kreuter!n=kreuter@pool-96-252-14-107.bstnma.fios.verizon.net PRIVMSG #lisp :well, modulo some mumbojumbo about aborting closes not superseding things." ":gigamonk`!n=user@adsl-99-169-83-0.dsl.pltn13.sbcglobal.net PRIVMSG #lisp :kreuter: I think I was chasing a phantom. Thanks for helping me regain my sanity." ":antgreen!n=green@nat/redhat/x-abb9c0ac14ef8808 QUIT :Read error: 60 (Operation timed out)" ":kreuter!n=kreuter@pool-96-252-14-107.bstnma.fios.verizon.net PRIVMSG #lisp :if you end up with some extra sanity, I could sure use it..." ":schoppenhauer!n=css@unaffiliated/schoppenhauer JOIN :#lisp" ":kreuter!n=kreuter@pool-96-252-14-107.bstnma.fios.verizon.net PRIVMSG #lisp :howcome the SLIME repl saves swank:set-default-directory into the history, but not package-change operations?" ":antifuchs!n=asf@baker.boinkor.net PRIVMSG #lisp :it used to do this" ":antifuchs!n=asf@baker.boinkor.net PRIVMSG #lisp :(I have a version that still does (-:)" ":kreuter!n=kreuter@pool-96-252-14-107.bstnma.fios.verizon.net PRIVMSG #lisp :gah. I must be cursed." ":mathrick!n=mathrick@users177.kollegienet.dk PRIVMSG #lisp :kreuter: welcome to the club" ":froog_!n=david@87.192.28.247 JOIN :#lisp" ":antifuchs!n=asf@baker.boinkor.net PRIVMSG #lisp :they don't look pretty, mind" ":Modius!n=Modius@ppp-70-244-122-30.dsl.austtx.swbell.net JOIN :#lisp" ":ivan4th!n=ivan4th@smtp.igrade.ru PRIVMSG #lisp :got that deadlock in SBCL again! will look at thread stacks now" ":b4|hraban!n=b4@0brg.xs4all.nl QUIT :Remote closed the connection" ":ivan4th!n=ivan4th@smtp.igrade.ru PRIVMSG #lisp :some are in MAKE-WRAPPER-INTERNAL <- FORCE-CACHE-FLUSHES, some in %CHECK-INTERRUPTS <- GET-SPINLOCK, some in (FLET WITHOUT-INTERRUPTS-BODY-[CALL-WITH-SPINLOCK]448) <- CALL-WITH-SPINLOCK" ":edon!n=edon@albalug/edon QUIT :Connection timed out" ":elurin!n=user@81.213.203.109 JOIN :#lisp" ":dlowe!n=dlowe@ita4fw1.itasoftware.com PRIVMSG #lisp :ivan4th: how many threads are we talking here?" ":ivan4th!n=ivan4th@smtp.igrade.ru PRIVMSG #lisp :11 deadlocked threads" ":Fare!n=Fare@ita4fw1.itasoftware.com PRIVMSG #lisp :kreuter, what filesystem are you having problems with?" ":vixey!n=witch@amcant.demon.co.uk JOIN :#Lisp" ":brill!n=brill@0x503e0b40.hrnxx2.dynamic.dsl.tele.dk JOIN :#lisp" ":dlowe!n=dlowe@ita4fw1.itasoftware.com PRIVMSG #lisp :ivan4th: it would be great if you could send representative backtraces to the sbcl-devel list" ":bertskert!n=mor_och_@c83-252-190-193.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #lisp :Do you know any big open-office related channel at freenode?" ":kreuter!n=kreuter@pool-96-252-14-107.bstnma.fios.verizon.net PRIVMSG #lisp :Fare: huh?" ":Fare!n=Fare@ita4fw1.itasoftware.com PRIVMSG #lisp :nah, sorry, misreading as usual" ":ivan4th!n=ivan4th@smtp.igrade.ru PRIVMSG #lisp :dlowe: ok, I will post them there, also, here is one" ":lisppaste!n=lisppast@208.72.159.207 PRIVMSG #lisp :ivan4th pasted \"backtrace from deadlocked thread\" at http://paste.lisp.org/display/69463" ":kreuter!n=kreuter@pool-96-252-14-107.bstnma.fios.verizon.net PRIVMSG #lisp :Fare: gigamonk` thought he was seeing file timestamps not get updated after a (with-open-file (... :if-exists :supersede) ...)." ":kreuter!n=kreuter@pool-96-252-14-107.bstnma.fios.verizon.net PRIVMSG #lisp :okay" ":Fare!n=Fare@ita4fw1.itasoftware.com PRIVMSG #lisp :reminds me that my emacs seems to have occasional freezes that seem to be related to timestamps." ":Fare!n=Fare@ita4fw1.itasoftware.com PRIVMSG #lisp :(and when it recovers, it thinks the file on disk is newer than what emacs just wrote before freezing)" ":antgreen!n=green@nat/redhat/x-e9408203c80d2379 JOIN :#lisp" ":topo!n=topo@200.37.161.41 QUIT :Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)" ":gigamonk`!n=user@adsl-99-169-83-0.dsl.pltn13.sbcglobal.net QUIT :\"Power going down to whole block.\"" ":ivan4th!n=ivan4th@smtp.igrade.ru PRIVMSG #lisp :dlowe: seems like it freezes on *pcl-lock* there" ":bertskert!n=mor_och_@c83-252-190-193.bredband.comhem.se PART #lisp :" ":cmm!n=cmm@bzq-79-182-117-83.red.bezeqint.net PRIVMSG #lisp :I get that all the time when working with files that are served through SMB" ":froog!n=david@87.192.28.247 QUIT :Connection timed out" ":tcr!n=tcr@host145.natpool.mwn.de JOIN :#lisp" ":NoorDextor!n=NoorDext@unaffiliated/noordextor QUIT :\"go Canada!\"" ":dlowe!n=dlowe@ita4fw1.itasoftware.com PRIVMSG #lisp :ivan4th: pcl seems to be grouchy about a cffi foreign string being invalidated. wonder how that happened" ":happycodemonkey!n=carriear@147.226.197.240 QUIT :" ":robot_jesus!n=csanders@hoovers-241.hoovers.com JOIN :#lisp" ":ivan4th!n=ivan4th@smtp.igrade.ru PRIVMSG #lisp :well CFFI func that was called was defined as (defcfun \"modbus_init_tcp\" :void (mb-param :pointer) (ip-address :string) (port :int))" ":lisppaste!n=lisppast@208.72.159.207 PRIVMSG #lisp :ivan4th pasted \"macroexpansion of cffi function definiton\" at http://paste.lisp.org/display/69464" ":ivan4th!n=ivan4th@smtp.igrade.ru PRIVMSG #lisp :(these are my bindings for libmodbus, I'm going to get rid of them and write my own trivial modbus impl, but not sure whether this will help)" ":dlowe!n=dlowe@ita4fw1.itasoftware.com PRIVMSG #lisp :ivan4th: yes, but presumably the cffi foreign string class wasn't changed while your program was running" ":gigamonkey!n=user@adsl-99-169-83-0.dsl.pltn13.sbcglobal.net QUIT :Read error: 54 (Connection reset by peer)" ":ivan4th!n=ivan4th@smtp.igrade.ru PRIVMSG #lisp :dlowe: I don't know PCL internals at all, but maybe this is because that class isn't used at all before these threads start?" ":Krystof!n=csr21@84-51-132-95.christ977.adsl.metronet.co.uk JOIN :#lisp" ":lyte!n=lyte@unaffiliated/neerolyte JOIN :#lisp" ":fe[nl]ix!n=algidus@217.202.207.196 JOIN :#lisp" ":puchacz!n=puchacz@87-194-5-99.bethere.co.uk JOIN :#lisp" ":schoppenhauer!n=css@unaffiliated/schoppenhauer QUIT :Remote closed the connection" ":lyte!n=lyte@unaffiliated/neerolyte QUIT :Remote closed the connection" ":lyte!n=lyte@unaffiliated/neerolyte JOIN :#lisp" ":jao!n=user@186.Red-81-32-186.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net JOIN :#lisp" ":tcr!n=tcr@host145.natpool.mwn.de QUIT :\"Leaving.\"" ":bashyal!n=bashyal@v-209-98-139-195.mn.visi.com QUIT :" ":Krystof!n=csr21@84-51-132-95.christ977.adsl.metronet.co.uk QUIT :Read error: 113 (No route to host)" ":lyte!n=lyte@unaffiliated/neerolyte QUIT :\"Ex-Chat\"" ":Krystof!n=csr21@84-51-132-95.christ977.adsl.metronet.co.uk JOIN :#lisp" ":prip!n=_prip@host197-197-dynamic.17-79-r.retail.telecomitalia.it QUIT :Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)" ":topo!n=topo@200.37.161.41 JOIN :#lisp" ":pjb!n=t@67.Red-81-37-36.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net PART #lisp :\"ERC Version 5.2 (IRC client for Emacs)\"" ":happycodemonkey!n=carriear@147.226.197.240 JOIN :#lisp" ":ivan4th!n=ivan4th@smtp.igrade.ru PRIVMSG #lisp :(posted my problem to sbcl-devel)" ":silenius!n=jl@e178050166.adsl.alicedsl.de QUIT :Read error: 113 (No route to host)" ":frito!n=keith@host81-146-40-55.btremoteinternet-dsl.bt.net JOIN :#lisp" ":silenius!n=jl@e178050166.adsl.alicedsl.de JOIN :#lisp" ":lyte!n=lyte@unaffiliated/neerolyte JOIN :#lisp" ":trebor_win!n=none_ask@mail.dki.tu-darmstadt.de PART #lisp :\"ERC Version 5.2 (IRC client for Emacs)\"" ":lyte!n=lyte@unaffiliated/neerolyte QUIT :Remote closed the connection" ":lyte!n=lyte@unaffiliated/neerolyte JOIN :#lisp" ":lemoinem!n=swoog@x-132-204-240-247.xtpr.umontreal.ca QUIT :\"Leaving.\"" ":lyte!n=lyte@unaffiliated/neerolyte QUIT :Remote closed the connection" ":schoppenhauer!n=css@unaffiliated/schoppenhauer JOIN :#lisp" ":schoppenhauer!n=css@unaffiliated/schoppenhauer QUIT :Remote closed the connection" ":novaburst!i=nova@sourcemage/mage/novaburst QUIT :\"leaving\"" ":prip!n=_prip@host197-197-dynamic.17-79-r.retail.telecomitalia.it JOIN :#lisp" ":jgracin!n=jgracin@82.193.208.195 QUIT :Remote closed the connection" ":prip!n=_prip@host197-197-dynamic.17-79-r.retail.telecomitalia.it QUIT :Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)" ":bombshelter13!n=bombshel@net1.senecac.on.ca QUIT :Read error: 60 (Operation timed out)" ":slyrus_!n=slyrus@dsl092-019-253.sfo1.dsl.speakeasy.net PRIVMSG #lisp :yay. ch-image *.{jpg,tiff} -> *.{jpg,png} now works without ffi" ":silenius!n=jl@e178050166.adsl.alicedsl.de QUIT :Remote closed the connection" ":happycodemonkey!n=carriear@147.226.197.240 QUIT :" ":H4ns1!n=hans@p57A0DC82.dip.t-dialin.net JOIN :#lisp" ":antgreen!n=green@nat/redhat/x-e9408203c80d2379 PART #lisp :" ":rich_holygoat!n=rnewman@nat01.service.sv2.tellme.com JOIN :#lisp" ":slyrus_!n=slyrus@dsl092-019-253.sfo1.dsl.speakeasy.net PRIVMSG #lisp :Xach: is zpng going to support reading pngs, or do you have suggestions for another library that does?" ":prip!n=_prip@host245-134-dynamic.42-79-r.retail.telecomitalia.it JOIN :#lisp" ":sellout!n=greg@guest-fw.dc4.itasoftware.com QUIT :" ":photon2!n=photon@unaffiliated/photon NICK :photon" ":Jasko!n=tjasko@209.74.44.225 QUIT :Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)" ":dlowe!n=dlowe@ita4fw1.itasoftware.com QUIT :\"*poof*\"" ":housel!n=housel@mccarthy.opendylan.org JOIN :#lisp" ":jfrancis!n=jfrancis@72.14.224.1 QUIT :Remote closed the connection" ":rpg!n=rpg@75.146.46.193 QUIT :\"Leaving...\"" ":robot_jesus!n=csanders@hoovers-241.hoovers.com QUIT :Remote closed the connection" ":H4ns!n=hans@p57A0FE9C.dip.t-dialin.net QUIT :Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)" ":Jasko!n=tjasko@c-98-235-21-22.hsd1.pa.comcast.net JOIN :#lisp" ":Nshag!i=user@Mix-Orleans-105-3-32.w193-250.abo.wanadoo.fr QUIT :\"Quitte\"" ":happycodemonkey!n=carriear@147.226.197.240 JOIN :#lisp" ":kpreid!n=kpreid@cpe-67-242-12-135.twcny.res.rr.com QUIT :" ":willb!n=wibenton@wireless119.cs.wisc.edu QUIT :Read error: 60 (Operation timed out)" ":kpreid!n=kpreid@cpe-67-242-12-135.twcny.res.rr.com JOIN :#lisp" ":Xach!n=xach@207.5.178.18 PRIVMSG #lisp :slyrus_: png-read by ramarren" ":disumu!n=disumu@p57A24191.dip.t-dialin.net JOIN :#lisp" ":AshyIsMe!n=User@202.176.4.21 JOIN :#lisp" ":ivan4th!n=ivan4th@smtp.igrade.ru QUIT :\"rcirc on GNU Emacs 23.0.60.1\"" ":deximer!n=deximer@168.203.117.66 QUIT :\"Leaving\"" ":happycodemonkey!n=carriear@147.226.197.240 QUIT :" ":davazp!n=user@77.Red-83-54-164.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net JOIN :#lisp" ":hefner!n=hefner@c-68-50-101-139.hsd1.md.comcast.net PRIVMSG #lisp :Fare: it would be interesting if your clock had just been changed by NTP, and the file really was in the future" ":mulligan!n=user@e178048050.adsl.alicedsl.de QUIT :Read error: 60 (Operation timed out)" ":hefner!n=hefner@c-68-50-101-139.hsd1.md.comcast.net PRIVMSG #lisp :Unrelatedly, when I unsuspend my laptop, firefox goes into a frenzy processing all the javascript timer events that should've occured while it was sleeping. Perhaps something similar happens to emacs if you set the clock forward." ":wgl!n=wgl@216.145.227.9 PRIVMSG #lisp :Anyone have an issue recently or currently with clbuild? I am trying to do an update, and get stopped at cl-weblocks." ":Xach!n=xach@207.5.178.18 PRIVMSG #lisp :wgl: i'm not sure, but i think weblocks recently moved to a different location and a new maintainer" ":rlpowell!n=rlpowell@chain.digitalkingdom.org PRIVMSG #lisp :Indeed." ":rlpowell!n=rlpowell@chain.digitalkingdom.org PRIVMSG #lisp :THere's a thread on the mailing list about it; http://groups.google.com/group/weblocks/browse_thread/thread/af8b9367fdd87de7#" ":frito!n=keith@host81-146-40-55.btremoteinternet-dsl.bt.net QUIT :\"Ex-Chat\"" ":rlpowell!n=rlpowell@chain.digitalkingdom.org PRIVMSG #lisp :Weblocks still isn't as easy to set up or use as they'd like, but it's totally worth it, IMO." ":rlpowell!n=rlpowell@chain.digitalkingdom.org PRIVMSG #lisp :http://teddyb.org/rlp/tiki-index.php?page=Learning+About+Weblocks -- I've been writing up my learning experiences. :)" ":wgl!n=wgl@216.145.227.9 PRIVMSG #lisp :xach: So in the interest of getting the rest of the clbuild going, I will try to skip it." ":rlpowell!n=rlpowell@chain.digitalkingdom.org PRIVMSG #lisp :wgl: The thread I linked to above shows you how to fix it, I think, but yeah, skip it if you're trying to get something else." ":gloaming!n=steve@c-76-113-7-71.hsd1.nm.comcast.net QUIT :Read error: 60 (Operation timed out)" ":l4ndfo!n=l4ndfo@catv-89-132-93-183.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #lisp :hi, does anyone use tinaa for creating documentation?" ":l4ndfo!n=l4ndfo@catv-89-132-93-183.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #lisp :if so with which lisp implementation?" ":chandler!n=chandler@opendarwin/developer/chandler PRIVMSG #lisp :kreuter: is today SBCL release day, or did that get pushed back?" ":kreuter!n=kreuter@pool-96-252-14-107.bstnma.fios.verizon.net PRIVMSG #lisp :I'm doing it now." ":chandler!n=chandler@opendarwin/developer/chandler PRIVMSG #lisp :Great. I'm itching to upload new builds for the various Darwin architectures." ":kreuter!n=kreuter@pool-96-252-14-107.bstnma.fios.verizon.net PRIVMSG #lisp :okay, gimme a few minutes." ":kreuter!n=kreuter@pool-96-252-14-107.bstnma.fios.verizon.net PRIVMSG #lisp :xbjess" ":kreuter!n=kreuter@pool-96-252-14-107.bstnma.fios.verizon.net PRIVMSG #lisp :erg" ":antifuchs!n=asf@baker.boinkor.net PRIVMSG #lisp :I see a new password in your future (:" ":chandler!n=chandler@opendarwin/developer/chandler PRIVMSG #lisp :please tell me that wasn't a password..." ":kreuter!n=kreuter@pool-96-252-14-107.bstnma.fios.verizon.net PRIVMSG #lisp :no, a failed C-x b" ":antifuchs!n=asf@baker.boinkor.net PRIVMSG #lisp :(:" ":chandler!n=chandler@opendarwin/developer/chandler PRIVMSG #lisp :aha :-)" ":Fare!n=Fare@ita4fw1.itasoftware.com PRIVMSG #lisp :I see a jessica in your present, then." ":kreuter!n=kreuter@pool-96-252-14-107.bstnma.fios.verizon.net PRIVMSG #lisp :something like that." ":kreuter!n=kreuter@pool-96-252-14-107.bstnma.fios.verizon.net PRIVMSG #lisp :just one of the many distractions in the way of sbcl-1.0.22." ":kreuter!n=kreuter@pool-96-252-14-107.bstnma.fios.verizon.net PRIVMSG #lisp :chandler: committed and tagged." ":chandler!n=chandler@opendarwin/developer/chandler PRIVMSG #lisp :Thanks!" ":kreuter!n=kreuter@pool-96-252-14-107.bstnma.fios.verizon.net PRIVMSG #lisp :and now, the horror of the sourceforge release page.." ":fe[nl]ix!n=algidus@217.202.207.196 QUIT :\"Valete!\"" ":kwertii!n=kwertii@c-71-202-121-102.hsd1.ca.comcast.net JOIN :#lisp" ":locklace!i=locklace@gateway/tor/x-6ffe886e1dcc5fa2 PRIVMSG #lisp :any exciting new things in this month's sbcl?" ":Fare!n=Fare@ita4fw1.itasoftware.com PRIVMSG #lisp :locklace, as far as I'm concerned, it's the standalone executable" ":kreuter!n=kreuter@pool-96-252-14-107.bstnma.fios.verizon.net PRIVMSG #lisp :--script?" ":Fare!n=Fare@ita4fw1.itasoftware.com PRIVMSG #lisp :no, :save-runtime-options t" ":slyrus_!n=slyrus@dsl092-019-253.sfo1.dsl.speakeasy.net QUIT :Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)" ":Fare!n=Fare@ita4fw1.itasoftware.com PRIVMSG #lisp :I just release cl-launch 2.09 earlier today. I should make an announcement..." ":kreuter!n=kreuter@pool-96-252-14-107.bstnma.fios.verizon.net PRIVMSG #lisp :oh, I wasn't asking about the saved runtime options, I was saying that --script might be new and exciting." ":locklace!i=locklace@gateway/tor/x-6ffe886e1dcc5fa2 PRIVMSG #lisp :Fare: cool, cl-launch looks useful" ":locklace!i=locklace@gateway/tor/x-6ffe886e1dcc5fa2 PRIVMSG #lisp :kreuter: that sounds useful too" ":gloaming!n=steve@c-76-113-7-71.hsd1.nm.comcast.net JOIN :#lisp" ":sykopomp!n=user@unaffiliated/sykopomp PRIVMSG #lisp :Fare: do you know what the date for the next lisp meeting will be? I know it's really early to be asking, but I'm pretty bummed about not being able to make it on Monday :-\\" ":bombshelter13!n=bombshel@209-161-229-68.dsl.look.ca JOIN :#lisp" ":AshyIsMe!n=User@202.176.4.21 QUIT :\"Leaving\"" ":H4ns1!n=hans@p57A0DC82.dip.t-dialin.net QUIT :\"Leaving.\"" ":fph!i=joe@adsl-75-14-202-212.dsl.renocs.sbcglobal.net JOIN :#lisp" ":hkBst!n=hkBst@gentoo/developer/hkbst QUIT :Remote closed the connection" ":kreuter!n=kreuter@pool-96-252-14-107.bstnma.fios.verizon.net PRIVMSG #lisp :chandler: would you mind updating the website page? I have to run, and am clumsy about it." ":rpg!n=rpg@216.243.156.16.real-time.com JOIN :#lisp" ":jewel!n=jewel@dsl-242-171-245.telkomadsl.co.za QUIT :No route to host" ":chandler!n=chandler@opendarwin/developer/chandler PRIVMSG #lisp :kreuter: No problem. Has the source code made it through the release system of doom?" ":kreuter!n=kreuter@pool-96-252-14-107.bstnma.fios.verizon.net PRIVMSG #lisp :I think it has" ":kreuter!n=kreuter@pool-96-252-14-107.bstnma.fios.verizon.net PRIVMSG #lisp :thanks, later." ":postamar!n=postamar@x-132-204-243-129.xtpr.umontreal.ca QUIT :" ":stassats`!n=stassats@wikipedia/stassats TOPIC #lisp :Common Lisp, the #1=(programmable . #1#) programming language: , . common-lisp.net back in service, please email problems to admin@common-lisp.net. New: SBCL 1.0.22, CFFI 0.10.3, series 2.2.10, trivial-garbage 0.17, usocket 0.4.0, ABCL 0.0.11" ":sellout!n=greg@c-24-128-50-176.hsd1.ma.comcast.net JOIN :#lisp" ":cmm!n=cmm@bzq-79-182-117-83.red.bezeqint.net QUIT :Remote closed the connection" ":cmm!n=cmm@bzq-79-182-117-83.red.bezeqint.net JOIN :#lisp" ":sellout!n=greg@c-24-128-50-176.hsd1.ma.comcast.net QUIT :Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)" ":sellout!n=greg@c-24-128-50-176.hsd1.ma.comcast.net JOIN :#lisp" ":konr`!n=user@201.82.228.185 JOIN :#lisp" ":puchacz!n=puchacz@87-194-5-99.bethere.co.uk QUIT :Remote closed the connection" ":sellout!n=greg@c-24-128-50-176.hsd1.ma.comcast.net QUIT :Client Quit" ":sellout!n=greg@c-24-128-50-176.hsd1.ma.comcast.net JOIN :#lisp" ":konr``!n=user@201.82.228.185 JOIN :#lisp" ":davazp!n=user@77.Red-83-54-164.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net QUIT :Remote closed the connection" ":alley_cat!i=AlleyCat@sourcemage/elder/alleycat QUIT :\"Ex-Chat\"" ":mulligan!n=user@e178048050.adsl.alicedsl.de JOIN :#lisp" ":Fare!n=Fare@ita4fw1.itasoftware.com QUIT :\"Leaving\"" ":Yuuhi!n=user@p5483BB53.dip.t-dialin.net QUIT :\"ERC Version 5.3 (IRC client for Emacs)\"" ":Athas!n=athas@0x50a157d6.alb2nxx15.dynamic.dsl.tele.dk JOIN :#lisp" ":acrid!n=mckay@reverse.control4.com QUIT :\"Leaving.\"" ":brill!n=brill@0x503e0b40.hrnxx2.dynamic.dsl.tele.dk QUIT :\"Lost terminal\"" ":josemanuel!n=josemanu@102.1.222.87.dynamic.jazztel.es QUIT :\"Saliendo\"" ":wgl!n=wgl@216.145.227.9 PRIVMSG #lisp :ACTION Still can't get clbuild success. Now something about cl-ppcre and cffi-tests." ":konr!n=user@201.82.228.185 QUIT :Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)" ":philip!n=philip@Zaa48.z.pppool.de JOIN :#lisp" ":cemerick!n=la_mer@75.147.38.122 QUIT :" ":konr`!n=user@201.82.228.185 QUIT :Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)" ":philip!n=philip@Zaa48.z.pppool.de QUIT :SendQ exceeded" ":philip!n=philip@Zaa48.z.pppool.de JOIN :#lisp" ":chandler!n=chandler@opendarwin/developer/chandler PRIVMSG #lisp :so, is the darwin x86-64 port really still experimental?" ":chandler!n=chandler@opendarwin/developer/chandler PRIVMSG #lisp :it works as well as the x86 port at this point, so I'm strongly inclined to take off the \"in progress\" modifier" ":chandler!n=chandler@opendarwin/developer/chandler PRIVMSG #lisp :ACTION decides to beg forgiveness if necessary in this case" ":philip!n=philip@Zaa48.z.pppool.de QUIT :Client Quit" ":ths_!n=ths@X5f28.x.pppool.de JOIN :#lisp" ":ths!n=ths@p549AF97F.dip.t-dialin.net QUIT :Read error: 113 (No route to host)" ":ciscbrain!n=eugen@softhouse.is.ew.ro QUIT :Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)" ":gigamonkey!n=user@adsl-99-184-207-175.dsl.pltn13.sbcglobal.net JOIN :#lisp" ":gigamonkey!n=user@adsl-99-184-207-175.dsl.pltn13.sbcglobal.net PRIVMSG #lisp :Xof: herep" ":qbg!n=qbg@rn084084.morris.umn.edu JOIN :#lisp" ":mulligan!n=user@e178048050.adsl.alicedsl.de QUIT :Remote closed the connection" ":abeaumont!n=abeaumon@30.pool85-49-182.dynamic.orange.es JOIN :#lisp" ":mulligan!n=user@e178048050.adsl.alicedsl.de JOIN :#lisp" ":milanj!n=milan@77.46.248.122 QUIT :\"This computer has gone to sleep\"" ":willb!n=wibenton@h69-129-204-3.mdsnwi.broadband.dynamic.tds.net JOIN :#lisp" ":vcgomes!n=vcgomes@li17-238.members.linode.com NICK :vcgomes[away]" ":``Erik!i=erik@c-68-54-174-162.hsd1.md.comcast.net JOIN :#lisp" ":LiamH!n=none@common-lisp.net QUIT :\"Leaving.\"" ":thom_logn!n=thom@pool-96-229-99-100.lsanca.dsl-w.verizon.net QUIT :\"Leaving\"" ":kidd!n=kidd@193.152.210.172 JOIN :#lisp" ":willb!n=wibenton@h69-129-204-3.mdsnwi.broadband.dynamic.tds.net QUIT :\"Leaving\"" ":milanj!n=milan@77.46.248.122 JOIN :#lisp" ":mulligan!n=user@e178048050.adsl.alicedsl.de QUIT :Remote closed the connection" ":gloaming!n=steve@c-76-113-7-71.hsd1.nm.comcast.net QUIT :Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)" ":jtoy!n=jtoy@121.32.233.171 JOIN :#lisp" ":yangsx!n=yangsx@218.247.244.25 JOIN :#lisp" ":syamajala!n=syamajal@140.232.178.248 JOIN :#lisp" ":fusss!n=chatzill@pool-72-66-40-106.washdc.east.verizon.net JOIN :#lisp" ":fusss!n=chatzill@pool-72-66-40-106.washdc.east.verizon.net PRIVMSG #lisp :hot digity daaaym, self-built sbcl borks at (require :sb-bsd-socket) ==> don't know how to require sb-bsd-sockets" ":fusss!n=chatzill@pool-72-66-40-106.washdc.east.verizon.net PRIVMSG #lisp :it has ASDF built in, other than that it's pretty vanilla core" ":arbscht!n=arbscht@unaffiliated/arbscht PRIVMSG #lisp :perhaps you want (require :sb-bsd-sockets)?" ":milanj!n=milan@77.46.248.122 QUIT :\"This computer has gone to sleep\"" ":fusss!n=chatzill@pool-72-66-40-106.washdc.east.verizon.net PRIVMSG #lisp :i'm not the one doing the requiring, but SWANK" ":xjrn!n=jim@c-69-181-213-99.hsd1.ca.comcast.net QUIT :Read error: 54 (Connection reset by peer)" ":Sinden!n=Sinden@nickweinhold.demon.co.uk JOIN :#lisp" ":fusss!n=chatzill@pool-72-66-40-106.washdc.east.verizon.net PRIVMSG #lisp :i find it weird to do asdf-load bsd-sockets and sb-grovel before i can use swank, when official sbcl binary can do the same without manual intervention" ":xjrn!n=jim@c-69-181-213-99.hsd1.ca.comcast.net JOIN :#lisp" ":amnesiac!n=amnesiac@p3m/member/Amnesiac QUIT :\"Leaving\"" ":stassats`!n=stassats@wikipedia/stassats PRIVMSG #lisp :my sbcl binary can do it too. have you properly set SBCL_HOME?" ":fusss!n=chatzill@pool-72-66-40-106.washdc.east.verizon.net PRIVMSG #lisp :another thing i tried to do was handler-bind TRY-RECOMPILE failed-load restart to have sbcl try by recompiling first. but many different conditions are thrown around, like FAILED-COMPILE, and that is not nice to intercept" ":rich_holygoat!n=rnewman@pdpc/supporter/student/rich-holygoat QUIT :" ":bpt!n=bpt@cpe-071-070-209-067.nc.res.rr.com QUIT :Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)" ":fusss!n=chatzill@pool-72-66-40-106.washdc.east.verizon.net PRIVMSG #lisp :hmmm, never had to set that. I just do \"sh install.sh\" as root." ":attila_lendvai!n=ati@catv-89-133-170-239.catv.broadband.hu JOIN :#lisp" ":bpt!n=bpt@cpe-071-070-209-067.nc.res.rr.com JOIN :#lisp" ":fusss!n=chatzill@pool-72-66-40-106.washdc.east.verizon.net PRIVMSG #lisp :find /usr/local/lib/sbcl -iname *.fasl -exec rm -rf {} \\; proved easier than messing with weird ASDF/SBCL debugger restarts ;-)" ":myrkraverk`!n=johann@157-157-188-30.dsl.dynamic.simnet.is JOIN :#lisp" ":chandler!n=chandler@opendarwin/developer/chandler PRIVMSG #lisp :fusss: you're probably doing things wrong"